Hilton HHonors - Rant: Tired of incompetent Hilton marketing

I am really tired of incompetent Hilton marketing guys. They are gambling away so much trust of their most loyal customers in the Hilton brand by their latest scam promotions and incompetent marketing of these promotions. No doubt: Hilton offered and still offers great rates and these rates and discounts are frequently by far better than the rates deals of their competitors. The January sale was a great thing and currently there are some great offers out there.

However, Hilton feels a need to offer promotions similar to the promotions of their competitors. However, they are obviously not able to offer a good and understandable promotion. I remember a statement on this board saying that Hilton appears to be the only brand being able to offer a promotion that makes to customer being cheated. Very true.

So what is currently on the market:

SPG: Every two stays earns one free night. Every Starwood paid hotel stays at any property are eligible for earning promotion credit. No limits.

IHG (still to come): Stay any 2 nights, Get 1 FREE night. You can earn up to 4 free nights. Members will earn free nights instead of base and Elite points/miles. Register online before booking your next stay.

Hilton: Triple Miles unless you book one of the 106 rates (not published) and maybe more that don't qualify, unless you are enrolled in another promotion incl. hotel promotions like the current Conrad promotion and incl. promotions they acitvely market like the 1000-points-per-night promotion, unless they consider the rate or the hotel as non eligible and unless you do not fail to argue with Agents in any of the Hilton Customer Care centers.

I had discussions with Hilton agents and they came with different interpreations, different readings of the rules and could not find a common denominator. Is a prepaid rate eligible? Is a prepaid rate with breakfast eligible? Is the best available rate with breakfast eligible? I am so tired about this and THEY completely fail to make clear rules: Result: I failed to book Hilton but booked my upcoming stays for the next two months with SPG.

Full stop.

Hilton might have meant it well, but they failed to deliver.

+1 ... nothing more to be said :td: ... actually I would like to add one or two thoughts. Regarding the participating hotels I do have to admit that it was very clear from the beginning which hotels do participate and which do not. Even 4 weeks before these both promos have been launched, Hamptoninnsider advised everybody here that each hotel has opt in / must opt out by a certain date. It is much different with Hiltons rate plan story. No such ineligible rates ever showed up somewhere! Nobody would or will ever be able to know if her/his rate plan is eligible for the +1,000 points per night promo at the time of making a reservation.

At this moment I wonder what happened to Hamptoninnsider!? Never heard back from him.

Also I would be interested if Hilton still monitors this board as *wood does. Unfortunately Mr. Adam Burke logged into his account last January. Way too long! I'm in touch with several FTers about these missing points / miles. You won't believe how many different stories are being told by Hilton CSR about one and the same simple question... Why did I not receive my promo points / miles?!

You forgot to mention that Hilton promotions are for participating hotels only. A quick look at the list revealed that a lot of the hotels are not participating.

The SPG One(night)4Two(stays) promotion is simple and straight forward without fine prints.

...the 1000-points-per-night promotion... Hilton might have meant it well, but they failed to deliver. It's amazing how many properties are NOT participating in the 1000-points promo... it's almost like they shouldn't have bothered, because it's making as many people mad as happy.

You forgot to mention that Hilton promotions are for participating hotels only. A quick look at the list revealed that a lot of the hotels are not participating.

The SPG One(night)4Two(stays) promotion is simple and straight forward without fine prints.

But, you must earn your stay at a Participating hotel; and you can only redeem your stay at a participating hotel.

But, you must earn your stay at a Participating hotel; and you can only redeem your stay at a participating hotel.

Yes, every hotel participating in the SPG program participates in the promo and there are a few exceptions (cat. 7 and a few clearly mentioned cat. 6) that are not good for redemption.

But, you must earn your stay at a Participating hotel; and you can only redeem your stay at a participating hotel.

You can earn your free stay at any paid hotel stay within SPG. For redemption, the so called "participating hotel" is any Cat. 1 to 6 SPG hotels excluding all Suite property where it requires 2 times the normal starpoints redemption for an award. There is only about 2 or 3 of such exceptions. In other words, pretty much 99% of all SPG hotels are redeemable and most of exclusions are Category 7 and there are only a handful of them.

This year I am focussing on SPG Plat re-qualification first and then on my HH DIA re-quali.
The SPG promos are just too good to miss.
The 3.000 BMI miles promo went south for me too. The stupid hotel credited miles to LH instead of BMI ....

I had discussions with Hilton agents and they came with different interpreations, different readings of the rules and could not find a common denominator. Is a prepaid rate eligible? Is a prepaid rate with breakfast eligible? Is the best available rate with breakfast eligible? I am so tired about this and THEY completely fail to make clear rules: Result: I failed to book Hilton but booked my upcoming stays for the next two months with SPG.

Full stop.

Hilton might have meant it well, but they failed to deliver.

I think you wasted way too much time on this, not that I blame you for your effort, really, it was nice try. And I also agree with you that the T&C, including the 106 ineligible rates, were not clearly published and communicated with customers. The blame rests squarely on HHonors, no disupte there. That said, the way I see it is to milk this promotion, it really isn't as complicated as it sounds.

1) We do have the written response of HHonors Loyalty Supervior (in Glasgow)'s e-mail who clearly and definitively spelled out the ineligible rates and there are 106 of them. So we do know what to avoid and HHonors cannot go back and claim otherwise.

2) All we have to do, going forward, is to avoid those ineligible rates, that's it and that's all.

3) Maybe this somewhat a pain but when you think about it, not really, all you have to do before hitting the "book room" button is to hover over "Details" or "Rate" and it tells you what the SRP ID is. It doesn't really add any more time to your booking process - it's not like you need to research for an hour everytime you make a booking.

The Hilton promo vs. the SPG promo, IMO, HH is much superior. For example, I plan to attend the SPG Vegas VIP weekend in early May and at the same time, I also decided to extend my stay a little so that I can take advantage of the HHonors Triple BMI miles + 1,000 point/night promotion at a rate of only $45 USD, which is only about €34. For a sample stay of 2 nights at that rate, I get 6,300 BD miles + 7,975 HH points. Since I have only been to Vegas only once before and only for two days, I am not doing this purely as a maid run but being to enjoy a short vacation so the free breakfast, gym and room upgrades are also nice to have. Compared to SPG, the free weekend just doesn't seem particulary attractive.

The SPG promos are just too good to miss.


I found that people often got carried away with the excitement of being able to redeem a Category 6 hotel for free that they applied unrealistic assumptions and grossly inflated valuation to assess the value of such an award. At the same time, they tend to ignore the higher cost and associated expense that comes with it, even if you already have some Category 6 hotel award stays booked using points and this promotion would save you 20K points directly. For example, a potential use of such an award could be a Category 6 hotel in NYC during the summer period. But if you check the rates of NYC hotels on in summer weekends, they are a lot lower than what they are now. But in the process of obtaining such "free weekend", you will likely end up paying more money than you should have and those costs are often not accounted for. For people who don't care about status, it seems the HH promos are so much superior, provided you are willing to deal with the hassle of this latest fiasco.

I found that people often got carried away with the excitement of being able to redeem a Category 6 hotel for free that they applied unrealistic assumptions and grossly inflated valuation to assess the value of such an award. At the same time, they tend to ignore the higher cost and associated expense that comes with it, even if you already have some Category 6 hotel award stays booked using points and this promotion would save you 20K points directly. For example, a potential use of such an award could be a Category 6 hotel in NYC during the summer period. But if you check the rates of NYC hotels on in summer weekends, they are a lot lower than what they are now. But in the process of obtaining such "free weekend", you will likely end up paying more money than you should have and those costs are often not accounted for. For people who don't care about status, it seems the HH promos are so much superior, provided you are willing to deal with the hassle of this latest fiasco.

I will be using my free weekends in BKK. Either at the Sheraton Grande or the Westin. I am in BKK a lot anyway, so this gives me free nights which are worth about 4.000 - 5.000 baht a night.

Both are not cat 6 hotels and I have no intention of going out of my way simply to stay at an SPG cat 6 hotel.

For me the SPG promos usually work very well!

HHonors Triple BMI miles + 1,000 point/night promotion at a rate of only $45 USD, which is only about €34.

According to an email from a guy called John with the job title of "Senior Lead Agent" the two promos do not go together. Furthermore, they do not go together with other promo rates. So - enjoy this superior promotion.... :)

I am simply not willing to enter into any such discussions. It took me quite long to get my triple bmi miles with a certain prepaid rate and reading this John's language, they now start to try to argue with legal language. And my time is too expensive to get involved into such discussions. I still have a bunch of Hilton stays booked (inter alia on the January sales rate). I wonder what will be the outcome of this....

I will be using my free weekends in BKK. Either at the Sheraton Grande or the Westin. I am in BKK a lot anyway, so this gives me free nights which are worth about 4.000 - 5.000 baht a night.

Both are not cat 6 hotels and I have no intention of going out of my way simply to stay at an SPG cat 6 hotel.

For me the SPG promos usually work very well!

Agreed - this is simply a discount on stays you do anyway. I will have same concept in Berlin and Vienna.

Well, you all should have done what a bunch of us did. It's not points focused, but it offers a fast-pass to top-tier status. You see, we invested a lot of time and effort into a Hilton game that promised Diamond status to the Top 1,000 participants. I knew I wouldn't finish in the Top 7, which got the biggest prizes, but the Top 1,000 is pretty easy. You silly fools, spending all of your time worrying about points.

This Diamond game is a lock. A guarantee. Unlike points, where there is so much flexibility in the rules, I'm absolutely, positively sure that nothing could go wrong with the Hilton Advance Your World game. They're locking up my loyalty as we speak.

Come to think of it, I haven't checked on my game in a while. I'd better go check on that now...

Mike

According to an email from a guy called John with the job title of "Senior Lead Agent" the two promos do not go together. Furthermore, they do not go together with other promo rates. So - enjoy this superior promotion.... :)

Haha, do you listen to the new-policy-on-the-go everytime you call BD ICC too? I don't. What I care about is hard evidences and here are my witnesses:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/11611865-post19.html

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/11630254-post48.html

With two witnesses reporting yes, it's combinable and they in fact got both, I think you call tell "John" to go take a hike and be thankful he isn't the one coding these promos into HHonors system.

BTW, the $45 rate isn't even prepaid, it's AAA rate and SRP ID for it is: AA. This is a plain vanilla regular rate, not a "special" or "package" rate and it is also not part of the list of the 106 ineligible rates.

I am almost sensing sour grapes from you but maybe I get it wrong but thanks, I think we'll be just fine after having thoroughly researched the issue and carefully concluded it would be safe to book this non prepaid rate.

I am simply not willing to enter into any such discussions. It took me quite long to get my triple bmi miles with a certain prepaid rate and reading this John's language, they now start to try to argue with legal language. And my time is too expensive to get involved into such discussions. I still have a bunch of Hilton stays booked (inter alia on the January sales rate). I wonder what will be the outcome of this....

It looks like your rate was listed as one of those 106 ineligible rates. That really sucks and I agree you should have gotten the Triple Miles. But put it this way, due to your efforts, many FTers are now safely navigating around the "HHonors trap rates" and thus avoiding the hassle of having to argue with those people. So your effort is not in vain really even though you have now decided to give up on this promotion and dare I say, you did the public a great deal of service. ^

Well, you all should have done what a bunch of us did. It's not points focused, but it offers a fast-pass to top-tier status. You see, we invested a lot of time and effort into a Hilton game that promised Diamond status to the Top 1,000 participants. I knew I wouldn't finish in the Top 7, which got the biggest prizes, but the Top 1,000 is pretty easy. You silly fools, spending all of your time worrying about points.

This Diamond game is a lock. A guarantee. Unlike points, where there is so much flexibility in the rules, I'm absolutely, positively sure that nothing could go wrong with the Hilton Advance Your World game. They're locking up my loyalty as we speak.

Come to think of it, I haven't checked on my game in a while. I'd better go check on that now...

Mike

uh...that game was cancelled. I think your "lock on Diamond" was broken long time ago... And besides, none of those German posters were eligible to participate anyway. Don't shoot the messenger please...

It looks like your rate was listed as one of those 106 ineligible rates. That really sucks and I agree you should have gotten the Triple Miles. But put it this way, due to your efforts, many FTers are now safely navigating around the "HHonors trap rates" and thus avoiding the hassle of having to argue with those people. So your effort is not in vain really even though you have now decided to give up on this promotion and dare I say, you did the public a great deal of service. ^

It would have been great if this rate had been on the list. It was not. What I did, I beat them with their own T&C and this worked pretty well....

uh...that game was cancelled. I think your "lock on Diamond" was broken long time ago... And besides, none of those German posters were eligible to participate anyway. Don't shoot the messenger please...

No, I was joking. Just carrying on the rant about how nothing seems to be going right this year. That's why I was carrying on about how absolutely, positively sure I was that nothing could go wrong with that promo. Sorry if it didn't come through on the web. ;)

Mike

Um, aren't promotions supposed to be privileges? Just because a competitor holds one, doesn't mean HH has to make one. Keep in mind Hilton is for-profit, not for the benefit of points-scroungers like all of us here at FT. They don't make promos to maximize our pt balances, rather to get more business.

Just my view...

Um, aren't promotions supposed to be privileges? Just because a competitor holds one, doesn't mean HH has to make one. Keep in mind Hilton is for-profit, not for the benefit of points-scroungers like all of us here at FT. They don't make promos to maximize our pt balances, rather to get more business.

Just my view...

Promotions are part of the business, certainly not "privileges". All chains need them because hotels are half empty currently due to economy.

Hilton shall do what it want's, however they shall do it properly. Offering promotions with a lot of fineprint is certainly not good business. Offering and advertising promotions without any fineprints but hidden, arbitrary and inconsistent rules is nothing is bad business, it is unfair competiotion and will cause the customers not only to lose fun to lose cofindence and trust.

+1. whoever plans these promos and the T&Cs need to be seriously re-educated or better replaced with someone competent.

I just found out my corporate rate wasn't eligible by writing to the helpdesk, not only that, but when they looked into the bookings, they must have found something wrong as the hotel stay now has "todays" date, but my balance has just dropped 1000 points.

I never had a stay with SPG that didn't get the bonus based on the corporate rate.

Its either double base points or it isn't. Where are the terms and conditions that say what is or isn't an included rate. They post the hotel list early enough so you can figure out where to stay, so how am I to know if my rate qualifies or not? I can't let my mouse hover over anything when the company travel agent books the hotel.

I am currently gold, due to some big trips coming up, will get to Diamond due to base points spent in the next couple of months ready for a family holiday at the end of the year where Diamond will be important, then maybe move.

What's the point of picking Hilton over others if my corporate rate never gets included as part of the bonus schemes. I have to have some reward for all those nights away to share with my family.

Hilton shall do what it want's, however they shall do it properly. Offering promotions with a lot of fineprint is certainly not good business. Offering and advertising promotions without any fineprints but hidden, arbitrary and inconsistent rules is nothing is bad business, it is unfair competiotion and will cause the customers not only to lose fun to lose cofindence and trust.

True, if all folks found out the small print disqualifies this and that, they will get mad = bad business sense. And while it makes sense to at least to what competitors are doing, I probably was more speaking to the sense of entitlement at FT sometimes where Hilton owes it to us to make their promos better, or we can whine whine whine.

FT is about finding out what they do offer, taking advantage of it (legally), and using our clout to make HH more friendly for us.

Again my two cents.

As an example, here's my most recent stay (the Service Center Adjustment was for the missing AMEX online booking bonus). Combine these points with the 9x earning on the Surpass card, and it's probably comparable to other programs.

SERVICE CENTER ADJUSTMENT 500
AMEX CO BRAND 1ST 8 STAY BONUS - 2,500
Q2 BONUS POINTS OFFER - 4,000
Base Points - 3,499
DIAMOND VIP BONUS - 50% 2009 - 1,749
MYWAY PREFERENCES BONUS OPTION - 1,000
National Car Rental Bonus - 250
SOUTHWEST AIRLINES DOUBLE DIP

I am really tired of incompetent Hilton marketing guys. They are gambling away so much trust of their most loyal customers in the Hilton brand by their latest scam promotions and incompetent marketing of these promotions.


It’s not just those loyal member’s trust that Hilton is gambling with but that of us newer ones. I’ve only been an HH member for around two months after I found a cheap rate and thought I’d join up. I was delighted to receive an invitation for the triple miles offer, I’ve booked another stay and am planning two more. I also registered for the 1,000 bonus points offer thinking that they might not be combined.

I’ve now found from these forums that not only is there confusion over the two promotions running together but also that there are a large number of exclusions. My bookings are mainly on the basic AP cheapest rate so I’m wondering if they will be eligible for either offer. I had thought about trying to check this out but it all seems so confusing. I think I’ll just wait to see what I get after my stay next weekend.

I’m looking to book something in Edinburgh for the middle of May and due to the confusion around these offers I might switch to IHG, although that property is not so convenient.

Hilton must be aware of the confusion they are creating and I would have expected some sort of announcement, or at least an acknowledgement, to have been posted on the website or e-mailed to members.