MilesBuzz! - International Only, 1st Class Only

What is the best airline FF program for someone who wants to fly FC or BE International only.

For example: I fly Delta now and I have found the best way is to get to PM level so that I get 6 1-way PMUs. This costs me approximately $8000 and 80000 miles (UGs) for the year - 5 R/T in M class.

What do you suggest?

An important question is.... which destinations do you frequent?

I fly to Rome, London, Manchester, Nice, Venice, Paris Santiago, Chile but would add Australia if Delta flew there.

OK, since you seem to always fly paid premium cabin fares, there are some great FFPs out there for you. Now... how do you feel about having to connect through hub cities to get to you final destinations?

Off hand, it seems like you could do very well with a BA account and/or a LH account. Can you give us an estimate of how many flight miles you usually log in during a normal calendar year?

Bottom line is... if you are a F fare purchasor, then you are well off just getting one ff account from one carrier of each of the major alliances and concentrating all your alliance flights on one single program. Then, you just elect your flight patterns according to your preference/convenience.

You seem to be fixated on Delta, and there you have SkyTeam. One down, two to go. I would get a StarAlliance account, there M&More from LH would be my choice. Finally, get a BA account to cover OneWorld. That should be about it... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

I have concentrated on Delta b/c I lived in the South and it was easily the most convenient but the program is not what it once was. And I now live in LAS.

I fly about 7 times a year. say 5 paid, 2 award. this= 68k actual paid miles = 100k MQM = 136k Sky M
I do not buy F tickets but M ie lowest price upgradeable on Delta - I don't know what that is on other carriers or if you even need to be at a particular fare level to upgrade.

M fares cost me about $1600 per. F fares are much, much more.
I will happily fly thru hubs to save $.

Isn't there a problem with splitting the miles in that I wont get bonus miles u/l I'm in an Elite category.

Sorry I'm not familiar with StarAlliance, what is that?

Does this help?

Edit...

[This message has been edited by auh2o (edited Jan 24, 2004).]

Hey Gaucho, Why do you recommend joining the Star Alliance through Lufthanzsa rather than through United? I fly LH almost as much as United, but just assumed that since I am based in the USA, United would be a better choice. Please explain your preferrence for LH. And thanks for the idea...with your response, I';ll explore it!
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Gaucho100K:
OK, since you seem to always fly paid premium cabin fares, there are some great FFPs out there for you. Now... how do you feel about having to connect through hub cities to get to you final destinations?

Off hand, it seems like you could do very well with a BA account and/or a LH account. Can you give us an estimate of how many flight miles you usually log in during a normal calendar year?

Bottom line is... if you are a F fare purchasor, then you are well off just getting one ff account from one carrier of each of the major alliances and concentrating all your alliance flights on one single program. Then, you just elect your flight patterns according to your preference/convenience.

You seem to be fixated on Delta, and there you have SkyTeam. One down, two to go. I would get a StarAlliance account, there M&More from LH would be my choice. Finally, get a BA account to cover OneWorld. That should be about it... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif</font>

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Gaucho100K:
I would get a StarAlliance account, there M&More from LH would be my choice. Finally, get a BA account to cover OneWorld. That should be about it... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif</font>

forget my question about Star Alliance. I googled it.

It looks like you really want an airline/alliance that allows upgrades to Buisness/First Class from Economy class. Two good choices are:

1. American Airlines / Oneworld : Allows upgrades from any economy fare to Buisness class, and provides its top elites 8 free VIP's (one way internal upgrades)per year and you get 8 extra ones the first time you qualify. The downside is that you need 100,000 miles of travel in discount economy to qualify for top elite level and you don't get free lounge access unless traveling the same day on an international trip. Additional one way upgrades to Europe are 25,000 miles.

2. British Airways/ Oneworld: Allows upgrades from Economy+ only (which typically will cost you what M-fare costs on Delta, though on sale they go about $400 above discount economy), but you only need 25,000 miles to upgrade a roundtip to Europe to Buisness Class. Few free upgrades for elites, but you get free lounge access even if you are just silver elite traveling on a US domestic trip and their Buisness class has flat beds.

3. KLM : The only airline other than American that allows upgrades from discount economy fares, is KLM, but you need a non-US mailing address to join their FF program. If you become top elite (75K miles) you get free upgrades on Northwest US flights and free lounge access in Northwest and KLM lounges even if you are not traveling. No free international upgrades, but one way upgrades to Europe are just 20,000 miles.

[This message has been edited by ananthar (edited Jan 24, 2004).]

American Airlines allows mileage upgrades from any published coach fare to business class on international routes. This would save you some cash versus DL because you could buy the lower fares. The tradeoff is that AA requires more miles to upgrade (50,000 roundtrip), and its business class seats are not quite as comfortable as DL's. To my knowledge the only "free" international upgrades on AA require Executive Platinum status (100,000 miles or points per calendar year), and I believe this earns eight oneway upgrades.

dennis

Instead of buying M fares, buy I fares on DL or Z fares on Air France. These a discounted business class tickets, they cost a few hundred dollars more than M class, but you don't need to burn miles on upgrades (or have to worry about clearing upgrades), and you get double MQM's (so fewer trips are needed to reach platinum -- you can hit 100K MQMs in as few as 4 RT's to Europe from the west coast.).

You need to buy your tickets 50 days in advance and stay at least 7 days in order to get this fare.

Yes that's a good idea. However they are not always available. And they are not available on all routes. I have found a $700 difference from M class (Europe) and you must stay a week. I looked for them to Rome next month - no luck. They are available for France.

You can make PM on 4 r/ts but they will cost $3000 more than 5 'M' class. Approx

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by marilyn35406:
Yes that's a good idea. However they are not always available. And they are not available on all routes. I have found a $700 difference from M class (Europe) and you must stay a week. I looked for them to Rome next month - no luck. They are available for France.

You can make PM on 4 r/ts but they will cost $3000 more than 5 'M' class. Approx</font>

You also need to figure in the cost of the miles you use for upgrades, and the extra miles you receive for class-of-service bonuses. Depending on what value you give a mile, the costs could balance or shift.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by travelthinker:
Hey Gaucho, Why do you recommend joining the Star Alliance through Lufthanzsa rather than through United? I fly LH almost as much as United, but just assumed that since I am based in the USA, United would be a better choice. Please explain your preferrence for LH. And thanks for the idea...with your response, I';ll explore it!
</font>

Mileage Plus is not a bad program. In the end its all about your flying patterns and what fares you pay. If you pay business and first fares, then M&More is the better program because of the bonuses offered once you hit Senator status, not to mention that the premium product on LH is light years ahead of what UA will offer.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Gaucho100K:
...once you hit Senator status, not to mention that the premium product on LH is light years ahead of what UA will offer.</font>

I know LH's FC is better but do you think LH's Business Class is better than UA's?

I fly both LH and UA a lot.

In F, the service, food, and wines are significantly better on LH. The seats, however, are a LOT better on UA. You just cannot compare a suite on UA to a 2x2 seat, albeit lay flat, on LH. LH seats are ok if traveling with someone you know and want to sit next to, otherwise, forget it. That's not first class. It's a business class product.

In business, right now, United comes out ahead. The seats are much better on UA and the food/beverages are only a little better on LH. However, LH is introducing a new, lay flat, business class product. What is funny is that it looks just like the first class product, and there are no announced plans to upgrade the F seats. When that seat is available, LH will be ahead of UA.

UA lounges are far better than even the First Class/Senator lounges on LH, which are pathetic. Ground handling on LH is non-existent. Boarding, particularly in Germany, is a free for all (think April 30, 1975 in Saigon).

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by geo1005:
I know LH's FC is better but do you think LH's Business Class is better than UA's?
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Yes, there is no doubt in my mind that the LH product is better. The only category that UA is slightly ahead of LH is the seat department, but, this advantage will fade soon as LH continues to upgrade its C product with the new business class. If you compare the top of the line UA C product to the new LH Business Class, its a blowout in favor of the German product.

I agree with Gaucho100K. LH flys to FRA from ATL, and from there a direct flight to anywhere in Europe you need to go.

With BA, you may have a LGW - LHR transfer issue for connecting flights.

The triple miles for paid F and double miles for paid C are hard to beat.

United also gives 6 upgrades a year to 100,000 mile flyers good on all routes on all but the lowest international booking fares (W fares and above international). The new changes in UA Mileage Plus allow bonus EQMs for higher fare economy tickets. UA and the Star Alliance network will get you to all those places you mentioned.

There are good arguments for both Star Alliance and One World. On UA's side the upgrades can be used on UA and on standby basis with LH. On AA's side they give 8 upgrades per year and less restrictions on booking codes. One disadvantage for AA is no mileage accrual for flying British Airways across the Atlantic and that is a real disadvantage at times for someone who frequents Europe. On the other side, UA now allows Mileage Plus elite members to receive their mileage bonus when flying Lufthansa flights which means more miles on European flights when connecting to LH for flights to Nice and such.

E-mail me if you really want to develop a detailed analysis of the best frequent flyer program based on your travel preferences. I have similar traveling preferences (upgraded international 6 to 8 times a year), but I achieve it at a much lower cost.


[This message has been edited by satori (edited Jan 26, 2004).]

In the Star forum you will find Blondebomer's Star Alliance comparison chart which was recently updated. Look at his good work! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

LH http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/thumbsup.gif http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/thumbsup.gif http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/thumbsup.gif

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by satori:
United also gives 6 upgrades a year to 100,000 mile flyers good on all routes on all but the lowest international booking fares (W fares and above international). The new changes in UA Mileage Plus allow bonus EQMs for higher fare economy tickets. UA and the Star Alliance network will get you to all those places you mentioned.

There are good arguments for both Star Alliance and One World. On UA's side the upgrades can be used on UA and on standby basis with LH. On AA's side they give 8 upgrades per year and less restrictions on booking codes. One disadvantage for AA is no mileage accrual for flying British Airways across the Atlantic and that is a real disadvantage at times for someone who frequents Europe. On the other side, UA now allows Mileage Plus elite members to receive their mileage bonus when flying Lufthansa flights which means more miles on European flights when connecting to LH for flights to Nice and such.

E-mail me if you really want to develop a detailed analysis of the best frequent flyer program based on your travel preferences. I have similar traveling preferences (upgraded international 6 to 8 times a year), but I achieve it at a much lower cost.
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I dont disagree with what is posted above, but in my personal view, its not only how many times you can upgrade, but also what sort of premium product you are being offered. If the central issue is NOT flying in coach, regardless of what quality of C and F (if available) one gets, then perhaps UA is a feasible choice.

In any event, lets not forget that even if one chooses to park mileage to LH, if you really want to suffer the pain on UA you can still use your mileage to purchase your penance. Just make sure to document your transaction and have the proper docs to proove your flights, perhaps you will get this credited against a probable temporary stay in Purgatory...? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

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Gaucho100K