skrosvik
Mar 6, 09, 6:57 am
Egyptair will start serving Oslo once a week (Fridays) from September 2009. ^ Let's hope for some cheap IC biz-fares:D
Other Middle East and Africa Frequent Flyer Programs - Egyptair launches Oslo route
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directorguy_
Mar 7, 09, 7:09 am
What aircraft will be used? My guess is a 737 or A320.
I bet C class will be REAL cheap. I can't see MS competing effectively with LH and partners especially when offering one frequency.
I'm really surprised CAI-OSL is being started, it's going to be a low-yield unsuccessful route. Routes like OSL should've been covered by codeshares and interlines with their *A partners in Europe. It's like going back to square one, when in the early 2000s MS continued to serve unpopular, low-yield, low-frequency destinations and wasn't making any money. Had this been 4x weekly, I would have given CAI-OSL the benefit of the doubt. But 1x weekly? Seriously?
I bet C class will be REAL cheap. I can't see MS competing effectively with LH and partners especially when offering one frequency.
I'm really surprised CAI-OSL is being started, it's going to be a low-yield unsuccessful route. Routes like OSL should've been covered by codeshares and interlines with their *A partners in Europe. It's like going back to square one, when in the early 2000s MS continued to serve unpopular, low-yield, low-frequency destinations and wasn't making any money. Had this been 4x weekly, I would have given CAI-OSL the benefit of the doubt. But 1x weekly? Seriously?
IAN-UK
Mar 8, 09, 11:09 am
Routes like OSL should've been covered by codeshares ....
.... Had this been 4x weekly, I would have given CAI-OSL the benefit of the doubt. But 1x weekly? Seriously?
^ to the codeshares - that's the idea of alliances...
If it's only once a week it could be a (mainly) charter deal taking the fun-loving Norge to the sunshine.
.... Had this been 4x weekly, I would have given CAI-OSL the benefit of the doubt. But 1x weekly? Seriously?
^ to the codeshares - that's the idea of alliances...
If it's only once a week it could be a (mainly) charter deal taking the fun-loving Norge to the sunshine.
jiml1126
Mar 8, 09, 5:48 pm
OSL current served through codeshare with Austrian
GK
Mar 9, 09, 3:56 am
i think there is a rivalry between MS and TK.. the latter has so many services, and maybe the Egyptians are keen to emulate.
We have a sporadic service between BCN/MAD and CAI and it is always packed out in Business.
We have a sporadic service between BCN/MAD and CAI and it is always packed out in Business.
skrosvik
Mar 10, 09, 7:42 pm
Yeap, they stated in their press release that they expect this once-a-week service to be a tourist/charter route.
They also said that they will expand this service if it proves to be successful, hehe. But I have the same doubts as others. If they manage to make a "semi-hub" like TK, I guess they could make it - but the Norwegian market is very limited, CAI is a horrible airport, and TK is better than MS.
Either way, this is great news for me, IF I can get those cheap biz tickets to Asia:)
They will use a A320 on this route.
They also said that they will expand this service if it proves to be successful, hehe. But I have the same doubts as others. If they manage to make a "semi-hub" like TK, I guess they could make it - but the Norwegian market is very limited, CAI is a horrible airport, and TK is better than MS.
Either way, this is great news for me, IF I can get those cheap biz tickets to Asia:)
They will use a A320 on this route.
directorguy_
Mar 11, 09, 3:41 pm
Yeap, they stated in their press release that they expect this once-a-week service to be a tourist/charter route.
They also said that they will expand this service if it proves to be successful, hehe. But I have the same doubts as others. If they manage to make a "semi-hub" like TK, I guess they could make it - but the Norwegian market is very limited, CAI is a horrible airport, and TK is better than MS.
Either way, this is great news for me, IF I can get those cheap biz tickets to Asia:)
They will use a A320 on this route.
Those tourist/charter flights must be low, low yield. Surely Happy Sun Air with its lovely 200-seat 737s should be serving CAI from OSL?
In Business Class, the only people who are going to use that cabin are pax willing to pay the least amount.
In order to make the Asian connections work, the flight needs to leave CAI at 0900 or so (with the 0500+ arrivals from Asia feeding the flight), and be back at CAI by 1900-2000 in time for the departures to Asia and the Middle East.
CAI isn't a terrible place, I've seen worse. Anyway, T3 should be online by September anyway. Not that price elastic folk should be complaining anyway :p
One A320 per week isn't a big deal, but I'd have thought they'd use the A320 on an additional frequency somewhere within Africa (growth there is always good), or bump, say, DUS from 4x to 5x weekly flights. Strategically, ARN or CPH are the more traditional entry points to that part of the world, although OSL doesn't have much longhaul traffic (if any) so competition there could be less.
They also said that they will expand this service if it proves to be successful, hehe. But I have the same doubts as others. If they manage to make a "semi-hub" like TK, I guess they could make it - but the Norwegian market is very limited, CAI is a horrible airport, and TK is better than MS.
Either way, this is great news for me, IF I can get those cheap biz tickets to Asia:)
They will use a A320 on this route.
Those tourist/charter flights must be low, low yield. Surely Happy Sun Air with its lovely 200-seat 737s should be serving CAI from OSL?
In Business Class, the only people who are going to use that cabin are pax willing to pay the least amount.
In order to make the Asian connections work, the flight needs to leave CAI at 0900 or so (with the 0500+ arrivals from Asia feeding the flight), and be back at CAI by 1900-2000 in time for the departures to Asia and the Middle East.
CAI isn't a terrible place, I've seen worse. Anyway, T3 should be online by September anyway. Not that price elastic folk should be complaining anyway :p
One A320 per week isn't a big deal, but I'd have thought they'd use the A320 on an additional frequency somewhere within Africa (growth there is always good), or bump, say, DUS from 4x to 5x weekly flights. Strategically, ARN or CPH are the more traditional entry points to that part of the world, although OSL doesn't have much longhaul traffic (if any) so competition there could be less.
Cedar Jet
Mar 11, 09, 9:50 pm
The aimless joys of being government subsidised:rolleyes:
CJ:p
CJ:p
skrosvik
Mar 16, 09, 6:11 am
From my point of view doing transfers at Cairo is a horrible experience! But the low prices justify it:) Can't wait till the new terminal opens. Have it been postphoned again? To September???
Either way, this is interesting news for me:) Looking forward to see how it turn out to be.
Either way, this is interesting news for me:) Looking forward to see how it turn out to be.
Vyker
May 4, 09, 11:49 am
I thought I should address some issues in this thread
Egyptair will start serving Oslo once a week (Fridays) from September 2009. ^ Let's hope for some cheap IC biz-fares:D
This will be a charter flight, so no C/J fares will be available (i.e. no seat only sales). The flights will in fact start 02OCT09 with flight numbers MS3000/3001.
The 1x weekly Friday flight will route CAI-OSL-CPH-CAI with the following times (all times in local):
STD CAI: 13:45
STA OSL: 18:15
STD OSL: 19:15
STA CPH: 20:30
STD CPH: 21:30
STA CAI: 03:00
What aircraft will be used? My guess is a 737 or A320.
B738 from 02OCT09 then A321 from 30OCT09 until 26MAR10.
I bet C class will be REAL cheap. I can't see MS competing effectively with LH and partners especially when offering one frequency.
This will be a charter flight and not a scheduled service. All seats are sold to Karnak and a Scandinavian tour operator. The purpose of this flight is not to connect to the Cairo hub or compete with LH or Star partners on the Oslo/Copenhagen market.
I'm really surprised CAI-OSL is being started, it's going to be a low-yield unsuccessful route.
Please bear in mind charter and scheduled operations are entirely different. The target markets for each are quite seperate. EgyptAir is not responsible for selling the seats on this flight but the tour operator is who pays EgyptAir in advance to operate the service. This is an opportunity for the airline to increase aircraft utilisation (when the aircraft is otherwise idle), generate incremental revenue improvements and gain exposure in the Scandinavian market.
Routes like OSL should've been covered by codeshares and interlines with their *A partners in Europe.
Since 2004 EgyptAir have code shared with Austrian Airlines on routes to Copenhagen, Stockholm and Oslo. This remains unchanged. Expect to see further cooperations with other Star partners in this market.
It's like going back to square one, when in the early 2000s MS continued to serve unpopular, low-yield, low-frequency destinations and wasn't making any money. Had this been 4x weekly, I would have given CAI-OSL the benefit of the doubt. But 1x weekly? Seriously?
The airline is not reverting to this strategy. As with other scheduled airlines, operating charter flights is a means of increasing revenue. Charter programmes are almost always a profit making mechanism (if managed correctly) since an airline is paid by a tour operator to operate a flight, and therefore the burden is on the tour operator to actually sell the seats. In other words if MS operate this flight with 0 passengers it will not be a loss since the tour operator has already paid the cost as dictated by EgyptAir.
In Europe MS have operated the following charter routes; CAI-PFO, SSH-VRN, CAI-SKG, CAI-AYT, etc.
This is by no means unique to EgyptAir, and you'll find many European 'legacy' carriers operating charter flights during the summer (resorts in the Med, etc) and winter (ski, etc).
i think there is a rivalry between MS and TK.. the latter has so many services, and maybe the Egyptians are keen to emulate.
There is certainly an overlap in the networks of both MS and TK, however since 2002 MS have indicated that a pillar of their future strategy is to operate a hub in CAI which is (slowly) beginning to take shape.
We have a sporadic service between BCN/MAD and CAI and it is always packed out in Business.
I'm not sure what you mean by sporadic. MAD is operated daily and BCN is operated 4x weekly (a 5th frequency is added from 22AUG09).
Yeap, they stated in their press release that they expect this once-a-week service to be a tourist/charter route.
Correct this is purely a charter flight.
They also said that they will expand this service if it proves to be successful, hehe. But I have the same doubts as others. If they manage to make a "semi-hub" like TK, I guess they could make it - but the Norwegian market is very limited, CAI is a horrible airport, and TK is better than MS.
This move will allow the airline to gauge the Danish and Norwegian markets at no risk.
With regards to CAI, I understand that CAI was not the best of airport to transit through but the facilities were never designed with this segment in mind. The fact the terminals are handling far more passengers than they were designed for further burdened the facility. However with the new T3 you can expect to see a much improved transit product with MCT reduced from 90 to 45 minutes.
As for EgyptAir itself, there is a concerted effort to improve from within. Unfortunately the lack of capital means that it is a gradual process. Expect to see changes in the inflight product soon with the introduction with the 8 new B777-300ER. For example the latest B737-800s have been delivered with enlarged C cabins to cater for premium demand.
Either way, this is great news for me, IF I can get those cheap biz tickets to Asia
Unfortunately that won't be possible with this charter flight. All seats are sold to tour companies.
They will use a A320 on this route.
B738 from 02OCT09 then A321 from 30OCT09 until 26MAR10.
Those tourist/charter flights must be low, low yield. Surely Happy Sun Air with its lovely 200-seat 737s should be serving CAI from OSL?
Not neccessarily low yield and remember it is a good way of improving utilisation if aircraft are otherwise sitting on the ground.
In order to make the Asian connections work, the flight needs to leave CAI at 0900 or so (with the 0500+ arrivals from Asia feeding the flight), and be back at CAI by 1900-2000 in time for the departures to Asia and the Middle East.
Is this was a scheduled service targetting onward connection opportunities then yes but this is a charter flight solely targetting the leisure market between OSL/CPH and CAI.
One A320 per week isn't a big deal, but I'd have thought they'd use the A320 on an additional frequency somewhere within Africa (growth there is always good), or bump, say, DUS from 4x to 5x weekly flights. Strategically, ARN or CPH are the more traditional entry points to that part of the world, although OSL doesn't have much longhaul traffic (if any) so competition there could be less.
EgyptAir are planning to increase frequency and upgrade capacity on several European flights this year. In addition to the increase that occured at the start of the season LHR, LIS and DME all get new frequencies later this summer. This will continue into the Winter with, for example, BUD increasing from 4 to 7x weekly and FRA being upgraded from B738 to A330. Expect more announcements over the next few months.
And you are correct about Africa. In fact according to MS CEO, Africa traffic this year is 41% higher than the same period last year. If you exclude Libya which has seen tremendous growth this year (note the recently started ALY-TIP and ALY-BEN routes which were launched at short notice to meet the high demand), then Africa has still grown by an impressive 23% this year. Expect to see more frequencies and destination increases this winter. For example KRT will increase from 14 to 17x weekly flights putting it in the same league as JED and KWI in having more than 2x daily flights.
The aimless joys of being government subsidised
Though it is a public company, EgyptAir is not funded or subsidised by the government. EgyptAir Holding Company reported profits from 2003/2004 and EgyptAir Airlines since 2005/2006.
Egyptair will start serving Oslo once a week (Fridays) from September 2009. ^ Let's hope for some cheap IC biz-fares:D
This will be a charter flight, so no C/J fares will be available (i.e. no seat only sales). The flights will in fact start 02OCT09 with flight numbers MS3000/3001.
The 1x weekly Friday flight will route CAI-OSL-CPH-CAI with the following times (all times in local):
STD CAI: 13:45
STA OSL: 18:15
STD OSL: 19:15
STA CPH: 20:30
STD CPH: 21:30
STA CAI: 03:00
What aircraft will be used? My guess is a 737 or A320.
B738 from 02OCT09 then A321 from 30OCT09 until 26MAR10.
I bet C class will be REAL cheap. I can't see MS competing effectively with LH and partners especially when offering one frequency.
This will be a charter flight and not a scheduled service. All seats are sold to Karnak and a Scandinavian tour operator. The purpose of this flight is not to connect to the Cairo hub or compete with LH or Star partners on the Oslo/Copenhagen market.
I'm really surprised CAI-OSL is being started, it's going to be a low-yield unsuccessful route.
Please bear in mind charter and scheduled operations are entirely different. The target markets for each are quite seperate. EgyptAir is not responsible for selling the seats on this flight but the tour operator is who pays EgyptAir in advance to operate the service. This is an opportunity for the airline to increase aircraft utilisation (when the aircraft is otherwise idle), generate incremental revenue improvements and gain exposure in the Scandinavian market.
Routes like OSL should've been covered by codeshares and interlines with their *A partners in Europe.
Since 2004 EgyptAir have code shared with Austrian Airlines on routes to Copenhagen, Stockholm and Oslo. This remains unchanged. Expect to see further cooperations with other Star partners in this market.
It's like going back to square one, when in the early 2000s MS continued to serve unpopular, low-yield, low-frequency destinations and wasn't making any money. Had this been 4x weekly, I would have given CAI-OSL the benefit of the doubt. But 1x weekly? Seriously?
The airline is not reverting to this strategy. As with other scheduled airlines, operating charter flights is a means of increasing revenue. Charter programmes are almost always a profit making mechanism (if managed correctly) since an airline is paid by a tour operator to operate a flight, and therefore the burden is on the tour operator to actually sell the seats. In other words if MS operate this flight with 0 passengers it will not be a loss since the tour operator has already paid the cost as dictated by EgyptAir.
In Europe MS have operated the following charter routes; CAI-PFO, SSH-VRN, CAI-SKG, CAI-AYT, etc.
This is by no means unique to EgyptAir, and you'll find many European 'legacy' carriers operating charter flights during the summer (resorts in the Med, etc) and winter (ski, etc).
i think there is a rivalry between MS and TK.. the latter has so many services, and maybe the Egyptians are keen to emulate.
There is certainly an overlap in the networks of both MS and TK, however since 2002 MS have indicated that a pillar of their future strategy is to operate a hub in CAI which is (slowly) beginning to take shape.
We have a sporadic service between BCN/MAD and CAI and it is always packed out in Business.
I'm not sure what you mean by sporadic. MAD is operated daily and BCN is operated 4x weekly (a 5th frequency is added from 22AUG09).
Yeap, they stated in their press release that they expect this once-a-week service to be a tourist/charter route.
Correct this is purely a charter flight.
They also said that they will expand this service if it proves to be successful, hehe. But I have the same doubts as others. If they manage to make a "semi-hub" like TK, I guess they could make it - but the Norwegian market is very limited, CAI is a horrible airport, and TK is better than MS.
This move will allow the airline to gauge the Danish and Norwegian markets at no risk.
With regards to CAI, I understand that CAI was not the best of airport to transit through but the facilities were never designed with this segment in mind. The fact the terminals are handling far more passengers than they were designed for further burdened the facility. However with the new T3 you can expect to see a much improved transit product with MCT reduced from 90 to 45 minutes.
As for EgyptAir itself, there is a concerted effort to improve from within. Unfortunately the lack of capital means that it is a gradual process. Expect to see changes in the inflight product soon with the introduction with the 8 new B777-300ER. For example the latest B737-800s have been delivered with enlarged C cabins to cater for premium demand.
Either way, this is great news for me, IF I can get those cheap biz tickets to Asia
Unfortunately that won't be possible with this charter flight. All seats are sold to tour companies.
They will use a A320 on this route.
B738 from 02OCT09 then A321 from 30OCT09 until 26MAR10.
Those tourist/charter flights must be low, low yield. Surely Happy Sun Air with its lovely 200-seat 737s should be serving CAI from OSL?
Not neccessarily low yield and remember it is a good way of improving utilisation if aircraft are otherwise sitting on the ground.
In order to make the Asian connections work, the flight needs to leave CAI at 0900 or so (with the 0500+ arrivals from Asia feeding the flight), and be back at CAI by 1900-2000 in time for the departures to Asia and the Middle East.
Is this was a scheduled service targetting onward connection opportunities then yes but this is a charter flight solely targetting the leisure market between OSL/CPH and CAI.
One A320 per week isn't a big deal, but I'd have thought they'd use the A320 on an additional frequency somewhere within Africa (growth there is always good), or bump, say, DUS from 4x to 5x weekly flights. Strategically, ARN or CPH are the more traditional entry points to that part of the world, although OSL doesn't have much longhaul traffic (if any) so competition there could be less.
EgyptAir are planning to increase frequency and upgrade capacity on several European flights this year. In addition to the increase that occured at the start of the season LHR, LIS and DME all get new frequencies later this summer. This will continue into the Winter with, for example, BUD increasing from 4 to 7x weekly and FRA being upgraded from B738 to A330. Expect more announcements over the next few months.
And you are correct about Africa. In fact according to MS CEO, Africa traffic this year is 41% higher than the same period last year. If you exclude Libya which has seen tremendous growth this year (note the recently started ALY-TIP and ALY-BEN routes which were launched at short notice to meet the high demand), then Africa has still grown by an impressive 23% this year. Expect to see more frequencies and destination increases this winter. For example KRT will increase from 14 to 17x weekly flights putting it in the same league as JED and KWI in having more than 2x daily flights.
The aimless joys of being government subsidised
Though it is a public company, EgyptAir is not funded or subsidised by the government. EgyptAir Holding Company reported profits from 2003/2004 and EgyptAir Airlines since 2005/2006.