Hilton HHonors - Waikoloa - A conversation with the GM on Gold/Diamond treatment

Was planning a vacation stay at a Hilton Waikoloa next weekend. After reading many of the negative postings about declining treatment for gold/diamond members, and also some specific negatives about Waikoloa in particular, I had decided to give another property a try. As recommended by FT members, I did submit feedback on my reason for cancelling to the reservations desk, requesting the comments be forwarded to the GM Debi Bishop. I also mentioned the negative feedback on flyertalk as a key driver of my decision. I fully expected my comments would go into customer service black hole and I’d be on my way to the Starwood property.

Instead, I got a personal e-mail response from the GM, expressing concern for the situation and she offered to talk to me personally. On the phone she indicated she’d read the FT comments and was concerned about the situation. She listened to my input, and offered that if I would reconsider my stay at Waikoloa she would arrange to meet and would be interested in feedback on how they could better serve the HHonors status members.

I will post back after my stay next week.

Good for you. ^

I would be happy for you to carry a copy of my fax and email (sent twice to them) to which I received zero response.

If you'd be willing to do that, feel free to PM me your email address.

Good to hear, particularly since I received no response to my email explaining why I was cancelling.

I suspect between their poor reputation lately, the weak economy, and the VOG, they might have quite a few empty rooms. I know I took them off my list for a February Hawaii visit.

I'm very surprised to read that you got a personal response from the GM. My husband and I have stayed at this property 4 times, most recently in April. After every stay, I've emailed the Diamond VIP desk with the same complaints related to poor service.
You're probably thinking why we've bothered to go back after experiencing poor service. This is a beautiful property; we enjoy the Big Island more than any other island, and love to golf. Not to mention, I've used my VIP reward and points for every stay.
Every year the service seems to continue to decline. Most recently, I read on tripadvisor, that the executive lounge is closed due to cutbacks.

It's a real shame that this property doesn't do more for their most loyal members.
Here is a list of some of the issues I experienced with no resolution or response from management:
-Pool Cabana's - Used to be free. This year, they have the nerve to charge $125 to rent. They were empty everyday we were there
-One stay, self park was free for Diamond VIP's, the next I was charged
-Had a message at the spa, price in the room flyer was different than I was charged. Was told by the management that housekeeping was supposed to remove the in-room flyer as the rates had changed. The price difference was over $50.
-I love this one, basic HH even for silver is daily delivery of the USA today or local paper. Was told, not at this property.

I hope that your comments to the GM result in change. I too encourage management to read the reviews on flyertalk and tripadvisor.
I love this property and will probably go back, but they need to step it up if they want to attract people in this economy.

I'm very surprised to read that you got a personal response from the GM. My husband and I have stayed at this property 4 times, most recently in April. After every stay, I've emailed the Diamond VIP desk with the same complaints related to poor service.
You're probably thinking why we've bothered to go back after experiencing poor service. This is a beautiful property; we enjoy the Big Island more than any other island, and love to golf. Not to mention, I've used my VIP reward and points for every stay.
Every year the service seems to continue to decline. Most recently, I read on tripadvisor, that the executive lounge is closed due to cutbacks.

It's a real shame that this property doesn't do more for their most loyal members.
Here is a list of some of the issues I experienced with no resolution or response from management:
-Pool Cabana's - Used to be free. This year, they have the nerve to charge $125 to rent. They were empty everyday we were there
-One stay, self park was free for Diamond VIP's, the next I was charged
-Had a message at the spa, price in the room flyer was different than I was charged. Was told by the management that housekeeping was supposed to remove the in-room flyer as the rates had changed. The price difference was over $50.
-I love this one, basic HH even for silver is daily delivery of the USA today or local paper. Was told, not at this property.

I hope that your comments to the GM result in change. I too encourage management to read the reviews on flyertalk and tripadvisor.
I love this property and will probably go back, but they need to step it up if they want to attract people in this economy.

If your stays at this Hotel has been free stays , then you are NOT a Loyal customer of this particuliar hotel, so why should they go the extra yard when you havent given them a dime Room wise?

FWIW I didn't consider the HWV as a property on my last two trips to Kona in the past two years. Instead I spent a week at the Marriott across the street (didn't like that either) and then a week at the Sheraton (my new Kona home). My decision, like many of my stay choices were highly influenced by the comments I read here.

Good for you. ^

I would be happy for you to carry a copy of my fax and email (sent twice to them) to which I received zero response.

If you'd be willing to do that, feel free to PM me your email address.

what happened?
I remember when I was ripped off royally by the hotel staff.
Thousands in Room Service charges and boxes I had sent fed ex to the hotel stolen. The hotel did finally pay for stolen things and remove the bogus charges months later.
I still would never stay here again

I mentioned at check in the recent comments online about the hotel and the check in agent was quite surprised.

This property is gorgeous, and in nice condition. Every staff member I have spoken to has been very friendly and helpful.

Occupancy is 35 to 40% right now according to several staff members. The place is empty.

As a Gold we were given a Lagoon tower room overlooking the lagoon and the breakfast coupons. Breakfast is very weak. Only children's cereals, a muffin or two, juice, banana and coffee. When I called about the internet I was informed that My Way indicated room upgrade and free breakfast.

You would think with occupancy this low, they could easily upgrade their best customers and give you free continental breakfast and internet or free parking.

This is nothing more than belt tightening by an individual GM. I will be back for the property and location, but it feels a little too tight fisted for Golds and Diamonds.

I'd be glad to talk to the GM if she has an interest.

...This property is gorgeous, and in nice condition. Every staff member I have spoken to has been very friendly and helpful.

That's certainly always been my experience. I find that the folks who tend to come in with a "mainland attitude" are the ones who don't find this to be the case.

I wonder if anyone has the free time to try a website: SaveHiltonWaikoloa or somesuch?

The HHV tried the same cheap breakfast thing for Gold/Diamonds for awhile after the incredibly wonderful Assistant Manager Joshua _____ left, but quickly returned the ability for Gold/Diamonds to use the breakfast coupons for the full continental buffet (no one plate nonsense, although they tried for a little while).

And to address what someone said upstream, most folks who do reward stays at the HWV end up spending a lot of money on the property anyway. The cost-to-the-hotel of the room is only a small factor compared to restaurant charges, Dolphin Encounter, Luau, etc., etc.

Thanks for taking the time to go to bat for the rest of us, Ed ONeill!! We appreciate it.

Are you willing to take a laundry list of negative changes to the GM for the rest of us? If so, could you add that self parking used to be free, but now costs $15/night. Why? The HWV is not in an urban market.

Thanks.

Hmmm, not good. I stayed at this property several years ago, and received great treatment as a priceline guest (of all things). I'm planning on returning next year as a Gold on an award stay, but it sounds like I'd do better to save my points for elsewhere. I guess I'll watch this thread.

I can only add that we wanted to go this January ,but after reading all the reports posted , decided on Cancun instead & got a great deal on price. Would not want to travel that far & be disappointed.

Will be very interesting to see the results , even more so in the current climate

If your stays at this Hotel has been free stays , then you are NOT a Loyal customer of this particuliar hotel, so why should they go the extra yard when you havent given them a dime Room wise?

I've used reward points for each of my stays. That covered 6 of our 10 nights, so I have payed out of pocket. If your implying that honoring basic VIP Benefits such as providing the daily paper, and having inaccurate prices on spa services because the housekeeping refuses to change the in-room flyer is going the extra yard, your standards must be very low.

I've used reward points for each of my stays. That covered 6 of our 10 nights, so I have payed out of pocket. If your implying that honoring basic VIP Benefits such as providing the daily paper, and having inaccurate prices on spa services because the housekeeping refuses to change the in-room flyer is going the extra yard, your standards must be very low.

what I was inferring was, numerous times people accure their pts from various means other then staying at a Hotel or a particuliar hotel. Yet when it comes to cashing out their pts they want to at the best Hotel (so do I) yet expect to be treated like a Loyal customer, while they never dropped much $$ at taht hotel. Sort of like I want to use my miles to get to Australia but AA or CO doesnt fly to SYD so I fly whomever does, and then complain about the service on that Carrier and how Ive flown them before and wont again. Of cause I never purchased a tkt on them but used my miles from an Alliance partner.

there are certain Hotels that get inudated with Golds/Diamonds cashing in for free stays but they hardly ever see any room rev from these people. I know some owners from non-Hil hotels that Deflagged themselves this past yr for that reason. they were inudated with free stays yet hardly got any biz for paid stays, and those who were staying for free almost always sent in complaints about how the Hotel treated them

The HHW and HHV are 2 among a few Hotels that get a high number of award stays, and rightly so, but the Hotel is simply trying to reduce its loss. I stayed at the HHW enjoyed it and w/o a lounge and having to pay for parking I would go back. I dont blame the Hotel, they can make their decissions and I will make mine

at least this Hotel is a True Resort, all too many Hotels claim to be resorts due to their location and are far from it , yet Elites dont get their benefits cause its called a resort. Heck Planet Hollywood in Vegas (SPG) now charges a resort fee for everything that is supposed to be given free to the top elites

I did have paid stays already at the HWV and they don't treat you better or wose based on whether its an award stay or not. I think the discussion about Award vs Paid stay is mute for this property. They nickel and dime you regardless how they are paid.
I can understand that the hotel tries to save money or find some additional revenue in a hard economic situation. Now the question is whether they have enough one time visitors that just don't know any better and won't return anyway or is the majority of their business repeat visitors ?
Also I saw some conferences there a while ago and for the participants its all on the company's dime anyway, so a couple extra dollars won't matter to them.
Personally if I am on vacation I rather pay a little more and have a good breakfast included and also don't like to pay other fees like parking or having chairs on the beach.
My best vacation was on Lizard Island in Australia where close to everything (alcohol was extra) including usage of boats was included, you didn't need to worry about how much this or that might cost especially since they really had a captive audience.

Just returned yesterday from a 10 nights award stay. Loved the stay and will likely return.

HWV has low occupancy rates for sure though there were more people during the weekends (my guess is 30% mid-week, 50-60% weekends). Hardly anyone was staying in the Palace Tower (virtually no boat or train stop activity at the Palace tower). It also seemed like half the guest were Japanese tourists and honeymooners. Given the low occupancy rates, I was surprised that the front desk refused to upgrade me to the Lagoon Tower (which others have reported and was suggested in my email confirmation). The hotel wanted $30 more per night which I declined. Instead I was given a garden view room in the Ocean Tower that I still liked. However, given all of the empty rooms, why not give a Gold at least an ocean view?

Got breakfast coupons for each night. You get coffee, juice, fruit and a choice of either oatmeal, hot cakes, pastries, cereal and one other item I am leaving out. We did not upgrade to a buffet for $19 per person. We rotated between pastries and hot cakes. Breakfast was pretty good and not as bad as some have commented. We only ate next to the Lagoon pool and tried the Lobby bar (no Hawaiian music). We liked both and prices were reasonable. Service was generally pretty good.

King's and Queen's shopping areas were dead. There is a shuttle that ferries people back and forth from the lower lobby for $1. The only busy place seems to be the Macaroni Grill that just opened at Queen's. Stopped by the Marriott next door to see if it was worth staying during our next trip. Had a brief conversation with one of the workers. He said that the Marriott and the entire area was "dead" and that he had no hope that things would turn around even for Christmas.

I mentioned at check in the recent comments online about the hotel and the check in agent was quite surprised.

This property is gorgeous, and in nice condition. Every staff member I have spoken to has been very friendly and helpful.

Occupancy is 35 to 40% right now according to several staff members. The place is empty.

As a Gold we were given a Lagoon tower room overlooking the lagoon and the breakfast coupons. Breakfast is very weak. Only children's cereals, a muffin or two, juice, banana and coffee. When I called about the internet I was informed that My Way indicated room upgrade and free breakfast.

You would think with occupancy this low, they could easily upgrade their best customers and give you free continental breakfast and internet or free parking.

This is nothing more than belt tightening by an individual GM. I will be back for the property and location, but it feels a little too tight fisted for Golds and Diamonds.

I'd be glad to talk to the GM if she has an interest.

Ingy - just returned from the HWV yesterday. While browsing the lagoon shops, I saw a sign for a room at ground level that said only for our Gold and Diamond guests. The area behind looked to be stocked like a hampton inn breakfast buffet. Just wondering if that is what you got or if you received the breakfast vouchers.

Just returned yesterday from a 10 nights award stay. Loved the stay and will likely return.

HWV has low occupancy rates for sure though there were more people during the weekends (my guess is 30% mid-week, 50-60% weekends). Hardly anyone was staying in the Palace Tower (virtually no boat or train stop activity at the Palace tower). It also seemed like half the guest were Japanese tourists and honeymooners. Given the low occupancy rates, I was surprised that the front desk refused to upgrade me to the Lagoon Tower (which others have reported and was suggested in my email confirmation). The hotel wanted $30 more per night which I declined. Instead I was given a garden view room in the Ocean Tower that I still liked. However, given all of the empty rooms, why not give a Gold at least an ocean view?

Got breakfast coupons for each night. You get coffee, juice, fruit and a choice of either oatmeal, hot cakes, pastries, cereal and one other item I am leaving out. We did not upgrade to a buffet for $19 per person. We rotated between pastries and hot cakes. Breakfast was pretty good and not as bad as some have commented. We only ate next to the Lagoon pool and tried the Lobby bar (no Hawaiian music). We liked both and prices were reasonable. Service was generally pretty good.

King's and Queen's shopping areas were dead. There is a shuttle that ferries people back and forth from the lower lobby for $1. The only busy place seems to be the Macaroni Grill that just opened at Queen's. Stopped by the Marriott next door to see if it was worth staying during our next trip. Had a brief conversation with one of the workers. He said that the Marriott and the entire area was "dead" and that he had no hope that things would turn around even for Christmas.

This is a very good and thorough review... perhaps it belongs in the main HWV thread instead. Or perhaps both threads should be consolidated; this one seems to veering off into a secondary thread on the same subject.

If your stays at this Hotel has been free stays , then you are NOT a Loyal customer of this particuliar hotel, so why should they go the extra yard when you havent given them a dime Room wise?

So what? They are part of the Hilton chain. The HHonors program rules lead me to believe that by being a loyal/frequent customer at Hilton properties I will receive benefits during future stays at Hilton properties regardless of my past record of stays at that particular property. If the hotel does not like the rules of the programme they are a part of they should leave the Hilton chain and start their own programme.

If your stays at this Hotel has been free stays , then you are NOT a Loyal customer of this particuliar hotel, so why should they go the extra yard when you havent given them a dime Room wise?

I don't understand and/or agree with this argument.

If you're a loyal customer to Hilton you should be treated as such by EVERY Hotel that is part of the chain. That's the WHOLE point of the loyalty program. If the loyalty program was specific-hilton based, it's NOT a Hilton HHonors rewards program, it would be called the HWV rewards program.

Rewards programs are population-based programs. You spend your money somewhere and take your reward wherever you want (could be the same, could be different). Others spend their money in other places and take their rewards elsewhere. Across the entire HHonors rewards program membership pool, the paid stays are generally spread out across the entire chain, as well as the rewards stays and everything evens out. If the HWV has some sort of excessive burden of rewards stays per paid stays relative to the rest of the program, then they should complain to corporate if they are bearing more than their cost burden for the entire HHonors program.

Members who have EARNED into the HHonors program are entitled to claim benefits. It's a simple concept.

If your stays at this Hotel has been free stays , then you are NOT a Loyal customer of this particuliar hotel, so why should they go the extra yard when you havent given them a dime Room wise?
I don't think this is true. AFAIK, Hotels are reimbursed by HHonors for award stays, so they do receive actual cash compensation. That's why they require an award certificate when checking in.

Correct. We recently had an "insider" post the method used to calculate how Hilton corporate pays franchisees for each award stay. In the end they get very close to the average rate, so by no means are these stays "free".

In addition, I tend to spend a lot more at the hotel on my award stays, simply because I am saving money on the hotel room. In the end, I think the property comes out even or better for the award stays.

Being loyal to a single property like HWV would be quite difficult. There really isn't any business being conducted in Waikoloa and even if you went to Hawaii 1x per year, you would likely choose the big Island only once every three years.

Gosh I love FT - wonderful that this much discussion can be generated in barely a day.

I concur that if there are items of this thread that belong in the main Waikoloa thread then mods please feel free to merge. However, that thread is pretty long and I didn't want this recent activity to get burried at the bottom there.

I did hear back from the GM and it's looking like we'll likely meet on Friday.

Yes, I am planning to share comments from this discussion. Feel free to post here, or PM me with the info if you prefer.

Yes, I am planning to share comments from this discussion. Feel free to post here, or PM me with the info if you prefer.

Ed,

I wish you well in your upcoming meeting. I strongly recommend that you make a study of the Gold elite benefits prior to your meeting as it is my view that the hotel is living up to the letter of their obligations under the program:

http://hhonors1.hilton.com/en_US/hh/about/gold.do

None of us like change and I think that the hotel could make some compromises regarding elite recognition along the lines of the Conrad Maldives



Conrad Maldives Benefits:

Due to the very special nature of the accommodations at the Conrad Maldives we are unable to offer upgraded accommodations. However, we are delighted to offer Diamond VIPs a choice of either VIP Package 1 or 2, during your stay:

VIP Package 1

* Daily breakfast for member and one guest in either Atoll Market or Vilu restaurant
* One bottle of wine*
* One half-day excursion for member and one guest (a choice of Mandhoo Island Tour, Dhoni Sunset Cruise, or Snorkeling Safari)
* Deluxe fruit basket upon arrival

VIP Package 2

* Daily happy hour beverages* (Vilu or Rangali Bar)
* One bottle of wine*
* One half-day excursion for member and one guest (a choice of Mandhoo Island Tour, Dhoni Sunset Cruise, or Snorkeling Safari).
* Conrad branded merchandise upon departure



The important thing for me is to know what to expect so that I can make an informed decision.

None of us like change and I think that the hotel could make some compromises regarding elite recognition along the lines of the Conrad Maldives


Haven't we been there?

The Conrad Maldives gives ZERO elite recognition and is very bad example. Their pseudo elite packages are included on the "paid" stay, although Hilton reimburses them $450/night for award stays.

Haven't we been there?

The Conrad Maldives gives ZERO elite recognition and is very bad example. Their pseudo elite packages are included on the "paid" stay, although Hilton reimburses them $450/night for award stays.

All I am suggesting is that the hotel let us know what to expect.

At least with the Conrad Maldives, an elite knows precisely what to expect and can make s decision to either go there, or go somewhere else.

I don't think this is true. AFAIK, Hotels are reimbursed by HHonors for award stays, so they do receive actual cash compensation. That's why they require an award certificate when checking in.

Ive received many a statement under my door or simply saw how many pts I got (divide by 10 for Rate the Hotel got) and numerous times it was well below $100 while the cheapest rate was over $250when I booked it as an award stay

My main thought is theres a difference between what a Hotel Must give us as Elite Benefits and what they were doing. Also nickel and diming usually is done to all, eg having to pay for self-parking at the HWV. many hotels are also either closing up their lounges or severly limiting the hrs and what they are giving.

[QUOTE=Bondiboy;10880213}The important thing for me is to know what to expect so that I can make an informed decision.[/QUOTE]

I agree completely. I said as much in my original phone call with Ms. Bishop.

If they are generally interested in increasing their business from Gold/Diamond patrons, then they have several examples from the popular properties discussed in the HHonors forum. Adopting those standards and communicating that with the community would undoubtedly increase interest.

I stayed there for the 10+ time this summer and had three rooms. We spent over $3,000 by eating in the hotel etc. It appears numerous people check in bootleg their beverages (as I did) then eat elsewhere. I appreciate the free stay, so I believe I need to spend some money there and we do. I have found that by the time you tip the valet cars people, drive a car at $4 a gallon, it makes little since to leave the hotel to save $10-$15 on dinner at least in the hotel, I get more points for it. My wife and I have always thought they should just require $100 per day in charges. If you stay 7 nights you have a guarantee of $700 you owe. Throw a meal every other day, a round of golf, maybe a shirt at the shops, couple of cold brews and how easy it would be to get there. I appreciate what Hilton has done for me eventhough they have raised those awards from 100,000 to 175,000 and eliminated numerous bonuses, I still have accumulated several million points, so it's a two way street. I have given them business and they have provided my family with some beautiful vacations at no cost. Ask what you can do for your Hotel program, and not what your hotel program can do for you. Isn't that what JFK said?

I stayed there for the 10+ time this summer and had three rooms. We spent over $3,000 by eating in the hotel etc. It appears numerous people check in bootleg their beverages (as I did) then eat elsewhere. I appreciate the free stay, so I believe I need to spend some money there and we do. I have found that by the time you tip the valet cars people, drive a car at $4 a gallon, it makes little since to leave the hotel to save $10-$15 on dinner at least in the hotel, I get more points for it. My wife and I have always thought they should just require $100 per day in charges. If you stay 7 nights you have a guarantee of $700 you owe. Throw a meal every other day, a round of golf, maybe a shirt at the shops, couple of cold brews and how easy it would be to get there. I appreciate what Hilton has done for me eventhough they have raised those awards from 100,000 to 175,000 and eliminated numerous bonuses, I still have accumulated several million points, so it's a two way street. I have given them business and they have provided my family with some beautiful vacations at no cost. Ask what you can do for your Hotel program, and not what your hotel program can do for you. Isn't that what JFK said?

You have got to be kidding me :td:

Besides that, how could you spend 3,000 in food at the hotel restaurants when a plethora of far better local dining establishments could make use of your spend?

Why not just send the hotel a $1,000 check every month for the hell of it?

Your stay wasn't free - you used points, which are a currency because you earned them by spending elsewhere. The hotel is reimbursed for the room cost. No one got anything for free, but it sounds like you wasted a lot of money.

BocaStephen, you probably won't see this for awhile as you must be driving to Washington seeking a bailout as it appears your one that the world owes you, for merely existing. I noticed your handle says Platinum Starwood and Gold Hilton for whatever that's worth. It appears your done with Hilton, so it's your wish to trash the chain. We all stay for different reasons. I have previously been a Platinum Starwood but had to give it up as to lack of properties in smaller cities. Still doesn't mean, I felt the need to trash them. I stayed at the Maui Westin last August and will be at the Sheraton Westin in July on points. As to 8 people spending $3,000 at Waikoloa, I'm not sure it's your place to decide why I should spend my money at the hotel or off property. We did a lot more than eat there. We did 1 or 2 Red Sail activities, golf etc. I Red Sail cruise alone I think was $500. The hotels are paid a nominal amount of points,The Hampton Inn in Branson gets $14 a night per award stay. That barely pays the maid service. Some chains pay on average roomrate. If these stories are right and the hotel is getting $250 a night and is 40 percent full then the average is $125. take all the flight crews, all the airplane package tours and I doubt the hotel gets much remimbursment. Then people like you go there and expect free rooms, free breakfast and you plan to eat off property and not spend a dime there, and you wonder why they get tired of freeloaders like you!

I recently stayed 15 nights (Oct 31-Nov 15) at the HWV for work. I should (and will, at some point) comment with more depth, but I've never gotten myself to sit down and do it.

First, I think this thread should be merged into the general HWV thread. It is a long one, but ever since this spiralled away from the Original Poster's e-mail, it covers nothing that the updates in the HWV thread don't offer.

If the "insider" thread was true, in-demand HH reward places such as HWV are in a hard spot, in that the amount of their compensation from Hilton derives from their average occupancy rate. The HWV is too huge to get to the 90%(?) threshold in a market such as this, so it gets a smaller return per room, while it has a disproportionate amount of awards guests. Not that I'm knocking it; I'd go back for points, too.

My quick hits: The frontline staff is great all over; the grounds are lovely; had I experienced the benefits before they were taken away, I would have missed them now; they should probably close entire floors at this time.

BocaStephen, you probably won't see this for awhile as you must be driving to Washington seeking a bailout as it appears your one that the world owes you, for merely existing. I noticed your handle says Platinum Starwood and Gold Hilton for whatever that's worth. It appears your done with Hilton, so it's your wish to trash the chain. We all stay for different reasons. I have previously been a Platinum Starwood but had to give it up as to lack of properties in smaller cities. Still doesn't mean, I felt the need to trash them. I stayed at the Maui Westin last August and will be at the Sheraton Westin in July on points. As to 8 people spending $3,000 at Waikoloa, I'm not sure it's your place to decide why I should spend my money at the hotel or off property. We did a lot more than eat there. We did 1 or 2 Red Sail activities, golf etc. I Red Sail cruise alone I think was $500. The hotels are paid a nominal amount of points,The Hampton Inn in Branson gets $14 a night per award stay. That barely pays the maid service. Some chains pay on average roomrate. If these stories are right and the hotel is getting $250 a night and is 40 percent full then the average is $125. take all the flight crews, all the airplane package tours and I doubt the hotel gets much remimbursment. Then people like you go there and expect free rooms, free breakfast and you plan to eat off property and not spend a dime there, and you wonder why they get tired of freeloaders like you!

I'm not trashing anything - I've stayed at HWV quite a few times under its previous management. I've had great experiences at many other Hilton properties as well. My beef is with Hilton/Hhonors policy towards Golds - as mentioned before, they hand out Gold status to anyone with a pulse, then complain there are too many and cut back the benefits. A stupid business decision.

Your post is way off base. The reimbursement comes from Hilton for rooms sold for awards. Unlike SPG, where we're not subject to redemption restrictions, a Hilton property can restrict access to free rooms if it wants to offer more rooms for sale.

The reimbursement amount is between the property and Hhonors - it's not our job to make up the difference you personally perceive exists.

If you want to throw your money away by giving it to the hotel for absolutely no valid reason, then have fun - but to suggest we should all be stuck with a $100/day charge for our free room is beyond ludicrous. We already paid for those rooms by spending at other properties, or other channels to earn points.

If the HWV is unhappy with its participation in Hhonors and feels it's getting the shaft, they can leave the program and seek their fortunes independently or with another program.

A big :td: for suggesting that anyone who redeems a free room and doesn't voluntarily dump cash at the hotel to make up for it is a free-loader. I guess you feel the hotel is a qualified charity of some sort.

I'm not trashing anything - I've stayed at HWV quite a few times under its previous management. I've had great experiences at many other Hilton properties as well. My beef is with Hilton/Hhonors policy towards Golds - as mentioned before, they hand out Gold status to anyone with a pulse, then complain there are too many and cut back the benefits. A stupid business decision.

Your post is way off base. The reimbursement comes from Hilton for rooms sold for awards. Unlike SPG, where we're not subject to redemption restrictions, a Hilton property can restrict access to free rooms if it wants to offer more rooms for sale.

The reimbursement amount is between the property and Hhonors - it's not our job to make up the difference you personally perceive exists.

If you want to throw your money away by giving it to the hotel for absolutely no valid reason, then have fun - but to suggest we should all be stuck with a $100/day charge for our free room is beyond ludicrous. We already paid for those rooms by spending at other properties, or other channels to earn points.

If the HWV is unhappy with its participation in Hhonors and feels it's getting the shaft, they can leave the program and seek their fortunes independently or with another program.

A big :td: for suggesting that anyone who redeems a free room and doesn't voluntarily dump cash at the hotel to make up for it is a free-loader. I guess you feel the hotel is a qualified charity of some sort.

I can't agree more.

The Hampton Inn in Branson gets $14 a night per award stay.Obviously the management of the Hampton Inn in Branson made a choice to affiliate with Hilton based on a sound financial analysis; and if he/she is not cash flowing at $14 a night in a low COL "city" like Branson, then he/she needs to re-evaluate. One thing he/she should not do is whine about how he/she is "only getting" stuff from Hilton.

To clarify, I would have no problem being charged $600 ($100 a night) for a 175,000 award. You can spend it all in one day if you wish. The people are great there, the scenary is outstanding, the pools are the best in Hawaii, it is a far cry from being called a Holiday Inn or Hampton Inn. Compare it to the Grand Wailea and they charge 80,000 a night if I went there on their six night award two rooms would be 720,000 points. I guess we just disagree which is OK. I just believe the Provision Company Restaurant that some waitors date back to the Hyatt is great especially outside. My wife and kids love Imari's good food and great entertainment. The hotel is trying, they just replaced the tram. Please remember this hotel built by Peter Heminger, as was the Grand Wailea, the Westin Kaui (now the Marriott) the Hyatt Maui, were suppose to be very high end properties. It was to have a 85% occupancy with a rate of $280 twenty years ago. Most of these hotels were built in the 80's with a booming Japanese economy they poured money into these ventures. Their economy tanked and Hilton got the hotel for 15 cents on the dollar. In the end we all get to enjoy these hotels with our points because of their misfortune. I am sure at $280 a night twenty years ago or in todays terms $500 a night they could provide all the ammenities some people believe they are entitiled to. I am grateful to live in this country and have the opportunity to visit the Hawaii islands.

I'm not trashing anything - I've stayed at HWV quite a few times under its previous management. I've had great experiences at many other Hilton properties as well. My beef is with Hilton/Hhonors policy towards Golds - as mentioned before, they hand out Gold status to anyone with a pulse, then complain there are too many and cut back the benefits. A stupid business decision.

Your post is way off base. The reimbursement comes from Hilton for rooms sold for awards. Unlike SPG, where we're not subject to redemption restrictions, a Hilton property can restrict access to free rooms if it wants to offer more rooms for sale.

The reimbursement amount is between the property and Hhonors - it's not our job to make up the difference you personally perceive exists.

If you want to throw your money away by giving it to the hotel for absolutely no valid reason, then have fun - but to suggest we should all be stuck with a $100/day charge for our free room is beyond ludicrous. We already paid for those rooms by spending at other properties, or other channels to earn points.

If the HWV is unhappy with its participation in Hhonors and feels it's getting the shaft, they can leave the program and seek their fortunes independently or with another program.

A big :td: for suggesting that anyone who redeems a free room and doesn't voluntarily dump cash at the hotel to make up for it is a free-loader. I guess you feel the hotel is a qualified charity of some sort.


I don't like to post replies that don't add anything, but I just have to say how much I agree w/bocastephen.

When I read the suggestion to "require" people using awards to spend $100 per day, I thought to myself, "are you serious?" Just like bocastephen did in his first reply--he took the words right out of my mouth. Then I thought, "hum....perhaps this guy works for them..." I don't know, but I never heard of something so ridiculous in my life.

People (me included) go off site to eat because WE DON'T WANT TO SPEND THE ENTIRE TIME AT ANY HOTEL. It reminds me of people that are on cruises and will rush back to the ship to eat lunch (because in their minds, it is already paid for), instead of enjoying a lunch on the island/country they are in. We love exploring...we get cars everywhere we go and drive to places that many folks wouldn't even consider. We don't NOT eat at the hotel to avoid the cost, but rather, we venture out to enjoy the island. Depending on the length of the stay, guests will try a restauant or two on site, but to require a minimum amount of money for guests to spend would just be so ridiculous.

Dawn

My wife and I checked in to the HWV on 12/7. As a Diamond member we originally sent a request via email 1 month ago to the generic email address, info@hiltonwaikoloavillage.com and received no reply.....

Upon checkin, we were assigned a room on the ground floor of the Lagoon tower. We received our continental breakfast coupons....which say for Gold and Diamond members. I called down to find out the difference on how Golds and Diamonds are treated. Apparently, Diamonds receive preference on upgrades as the only difference. With the occupancy level at what it is right now I am disgusted with my lack of upgrade.

Service here is poor and no follow up from anyone on the condition of our room or stay so far. Do I feel like a well treated top tier level Diamond? -- No way at all.

Otherwise, the property and facilities are great.

Our first night was at the ResortQuest Kona by the Sea....hands down a better place IMHO and much better service -

I would gladly spend my $100.00 a day on the property if it meant to keep one of the best properties in hawaii open and operating at a high level. Do you think its fair that people eat their breakfast, lunch and dinner and concierge and then complain when they close the room. Its a two way street, business and consumer. When consumer takes unfair advantage, bad things happen. Support the resort. Still dreamin.

When consumer takes unfair advantage, bad things happen.

What does that mean? Nobody is squatting at the resort or doing anything "unfair". If you don't pay lots of money out of pocket to a hotel...you're taking advantage of the resort?

I'm just wondering if you guys all think when you book a mileage award on an airline, should you also be loading up on extra baggage fees and lots of drinks, etc...to make up for the fact that you're flying "for free" on an award flight? Maybe tip the pilot and crew a few hundred bucks as well.

Can you guys just spend LOTS of extra money at the resort, since you seem willing and able, so the rest of us don't have to. I'm certainly not spending more than I would otherwise, just because my hotel was an award stay. That's complete and utter nonsense.

To clarify, I would have no problem being charged $600 ($100 a night) for a 175,000 award.

I would. I've been travelling professionally for almost four years, and 175K points is about 2 years' of travel, including HH credit-card bonuses. Some folks can pick that up much quicker, but most folks will never sniff 175,000 points in ten years.

To take a high amount of points and then say, "It's not enough, please add cash equivalent to almost half your room rate," for a reward that's specifically designated for those properties, that's crazy.

Waikoloa Dreaming, I think you're suggesting that customers are eating the concierge. I do not approve of that sort of behavior, although Diamonds should have the occasional instance of cannibalism overlooked.

My wife and I checked in to the HWV on 12/7. As a Diamond member we originally sent a request via email 1 month ago to the generic email address, info@hiltonwaikoloavillage.com and received no reply.....

Upon checkin, we were assigned a room on the ground floor of the Lagoon tower. We received our continental breakfast coupons....which say for Gold and Diamond members. I called down to find out the difference on how Golds and Diamonds are treated. Apparently, Diamonds receive preference on upgrades as the only difference. With the occupancy level at what it is right now I am disgusted with my lack of upgrade.

Service here is poor and no follow up from anyone on the condition of our room or stay so far. Do I feel like a well treated top tier level Diamond? -- No way at all.

Otherwise, the property and facilities are great.

Our first night was at the ResortQuest Kona by the Sea....hands down a better place IMHO and much better service -

Still no call that an upgrade is available......nor any follow up as to how our stay is.....

Expectations......as a Diamond, don't expect much, that way you will not be disappointed.

To clarify, I would have no problem being charged $600 ($100 a night) for a 175,000 award.
This is completely, utterly insane. To suggest that one should be required to spend $600 do redeem an award stay is absolutely insulting. Where do you think these points come from? WE EARN THEM.

You are free to drop a check at the front desk when you check in, but please do not include any other HHonors members in this pathology.

... The hotels are paid a nominal amount of points,The Hampton Inn in Branson gets $14 a night per award stay. That barely pays the maid service. Some chains pay on average roomrate. If these stories are right and the hotel is getting $250 a night and is 40 percent full then the average is $125. ...Hampton's get a minimum of $15 plus tax according to this post:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/10211822-post3.html


The HWV would get a minimum of $30.

If in any month the average number of rooms occupied on award stays exceeds 1.8% of the available rooms, the Property receives 90% of their average annual daily rate.

(Interesting part of that thread is that the property pays HHonors 5% of revenue bookings of HHonors members).

(Interesting part of that thread is that the property pays HHonors 5% of revenue bookings of HHonors members).


Could this be the equivalent of the commission paid to travel agents and third party booking services such as Expedia?

I guess that someone has to pay for the awards, Diamond Desk, etc.

Hampton's get a minimum of $15 plus tax according to this post:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/10211822-post3.html


The HWV would get a minimum of $30.

If in any month the average number of rooms occupied on award stays exceeds 1.8% of the available rooms, the Property receives 90% of their annualized annual daily rate.

(Interesting part of that thread is that the property pays HHonors 5% of revenue bookings of HHonors members).

Very interesting from that post:

For months in which the number of reward rooms taken as a percentage of available rooms exceeds 1.8%, you will receive 90% of your [current year] annualized ADR plus tax for all reward nights taken above the 1.8% threshold (with the exception of rewards taken on sellout nights). On nights when your occupied revenue rooms occupancy is at or above 96.0%, you will receive 90% of that day’s gross ADR plus tax for all HHonors rewards taken that night regardless of whether you are above or below the 1.8% threshold. For a new property, your forecasted ADR will be used.

What is the minimum reimbursement (base rate) for each brand?
$15 for Hampton, Scandic and Hilton Garden Inn
$20 for Doubletree, Embassy and Homewood
$30 for Hilton (worldwide) and Conrad

So my read is that for any month where award rooms exceed 1.8% of available rooms the HWV recieves 90% of their average room rate for every award room above the 1.8% threshold. So once that threshold is crossed, the HWV starts to make decent money on award rooms.

It seems to me a reasonable assumption that the HWV will exceed 1.8% award occupancy pretty regularly (maybe all the time). In that light, having an "excess" of award customers can be a good thing. Given the tough times in the hotel biz and in Hawaii in particular this means that HWV should be actively encouraging award stays and boosting award benefits to try to bring in more award customers.

Ed, if you're willing to go to this level of detail (and if the Hotel is willing to go there with you) perhaps you can discuss award occupancy levels with them?

This is completely, utterly insane. To suggest that one should be required to spend $600 do redeem an award stay is absolutely insulting. Where do you think these points come from? WE EARN THEM.

You are free to drop a check at the front desk when you check in, but please do not include any other HHonors members in this pathology.

agreed.anybody earning multiple six figure points is entitled to any opportunity to get some payback without guilt or obligation.They are not "free" as seasoned travellers spending this much time away know all too well

[QUOTE=JonathanIT;10900909]This is completely, utterly insane. To suggest that one should be required to spend $600 do redeem an award stay is absolutely insulting.

After three pages of this topic, It appears you aren't seeing the hints! I didn't say pay an additional $600. I suggested it would be a credit against your charges. You can spend that however you like, golf, Dolphin Quest, Restaurant whatever. It appears 90% of you disagree. So I come to the conclusion that 90% of you posters don't spend any money there. And others say the hotel gets $30 a night for these awards. It also appears that if your not willing to give them any money that you also demand breakfast. So luckly for the thousands of other people who do go there, and are spending money they would easily use up their credit. You wonder why the hotel is cutting back on the freebies? It appears most of these posters treat the hotel as some homeless shelter or some foodline.

...After three pages of this topic, It appears you aren't seeing the hints! I didn't say pay an additional $600. I suggested it would be a credit against your charges. You can spend that however you like, golf, Dolphin Quest, Restaurant whatever. It appears 90% of you disagree. So I come to the conclusion that 90% of you posters don't spend any money there. And others say the hotel gets $30 a night for these awards. It also appears that if your not willing to give them any money that you also demand breakfast. So luckly for the thousands of other people who do go there, and are spending money they would easily use up their credit. You wonder why the hotel is cutting back on the freebies? It appears most of these posters treat the hotel as some homeless shelter or some foodline.

Why this property? What about other Hiltons? How about Hampton Inns - they only get $15, but still offer everyone a free breakfast. I don't think HGI gets much more, but I can get a free breakfast there and probably eat my $15 worth.

You can't say HWV is a special class and deserves some sort of user fee for award stays and then tell every other hotel in the Hhonors system "sorry, not for you".

And others say the hotel gets $30 a night for these awards. It also appears that if your not willing to give them any money that you also demand breakfast. So luckly for the thousands of other people who do go there, and are spending money they would easily use up their credit. You wonder why the hotel is cutting back on the freebies? It appears most of these posters treat the hotel as some homeless shelter or some foodline.

Except that once the hotel reaches a 1.8% reward occupancy level they get much more than $30 per night per room. In the case of HWV its probably closer to $250 per night based on the typical room rates available on line.

[QUOTE=milesrus;10901918]


You can't say HWV is a special class and deserves some sort of user fee for award stays and then tell every other hotel in the Hhonors system "sorry, not for you".

Boca you do have a valid point on this. I do know as a Diamond with Hilton and a Platinum at Marriott there are differences. At resort Marriotts they offer no breakfast. Every Marriott I stayed at in the last four months had scrambled eggs etc on the Concergiege floor. The Renaissance had a chef. When I have stayed at Rancho Las Palmas, JW Marriott Desert Springs, Marriott London, Vienna, Marriott Kaui, Marriott Maui, none of these had any kind of breakfast. I stayed at the Westin Maui, Sheraton Maui and they also didn't have a breakfast. I am partial, I love Waikoloa and hope it doesn't get downgraded any further so I am rooting for them.

After three pages of this topic, It appears you aren't seeing the hints! I didn't say pay an additional $600. I suggested it would be a credit against your charges. You can spend that however you like, golf, Dolphin Quest, Restaurant whatever. It appears 90% of you disagree.

There is nothing in these posts that insinuates anything of the sort. Your insinuation, whether credit or not, is that people should be OBLIGATED to at least have $600 in charges, or $100 per night. Whether or not people end up spending that much is inconsequential - and I would guess it probably happens a good deal of the time. However, there is not, and should not, be any requirement of the such...and implying so...is asinine. It is contrary to the entire concept of the rewards system. Clearly that concept is foreign to you.

Awaiting Ed's report back..............

A large portion of Hilton Hotels Corp hotel marketing is promotion of the hotel loyalty program HHonors. The brand loyalty by the customer needs to be recognized by any participating member hotel of HHonors regardless if the hotel is a major resort or an airport stopover hotel.

The hotel loyalty contract between the company and the guest is a reciprocal arrangement whereby the company receives repeat business across the hotel chain's brands and the guest sticks with the brand as a loyal customer with the knowledge that loyalty will have applicable benefits across the hotel system.

Whether or not the loyal HHonors member has spent any money at the hotel for a hotel stay using points is irrelevant. The loyal HHonors member has been consistently paying the parent company Hilton through stays at participating HHonors hotels. It is up to HHonors to provide adequate financial compensation to the hotel for the award stay.

Awaiting Ed's report back..............

Very Strange.

Ed started this thread and he said on the other Waikoloa thread on Monday that he just got back and had a suite. Why no report.....you did start this thread Ed?

Just back from 7 days at Hilton Waikoloa with 3 rooms and were shocked at how the service has gone downhill. Despite Silver VIP status, we had to argue with the manager to get into the Lagoon Tower which we had requested. He finally waived the $30 a day per room charge but gave us rooftop view rooms.

Our next 8 days at Hapuna Beach Resort were much more pleasant. Also no daily parking charge.

No more stays at Hilton Waikoloa.

I hate to sound rude, but Silver VIPs are a dime a dozen and this status doesn't really mean much in the Hilton world. Silver does not entitle you to any type of room upgrade, nor should it. Now if you had reserved that specific room type, that's a different story, but there's no reason to just grant a request to an upgraded room. I think your expectations for special treatment were a bit off.

BTW, I just stayed there for 4 days and did not get charged for parking, so I guess YMMV.

I hate to sound rude, but Silver VIPs are a dime a dozen and this status doesn't really mean much in the Hilton world. Silver does not entitle you to any type of room upgrade, nor should it. Now if you had reserved that specific room type, that's a different story, but there's no reason to just grant a request to an upgraded room. I think your expectations for special treatment were a bit off.

BTW, I just stayed there for 4 days and did not get charged for parking, so I guess YMMV.

SixString is correct. Upgrades are for Gold and Diamond per the T&Cs.

These are the benfits for Silver:

Silver VIP Membership

Point Bonuses
Earn a 15% bonus on all HHonors Base points credited while you are a Silver VIP member.

Complimentary Health Club Privileges
Enjoy complimentary access to the health club or fitness center during your stay, at hotel owned and operated facilities.

VIP Only Rewards
HHonors Silver VIPs may choose from an exclusive selection of rewards at special VIP-only points levels.

Benefits when staying at Waldorf=Astoria Collection™ hotels:
At the Arizona Biltmore Resort & Spa, La Quinta Resort & Club, and the Grand Wailea Resort Hotel & Spa, Blue members will receive two bottles of water per stay.
At The Waldorf=Astoria® hotel in New York City, Silver members will receive two bottles of water per stay and also a USA Today® newspaper or local paper delivered to their room each weekday.
At the Qasr Al Sharq, Silver members will receive two complimentary bottles of imported water.

__________________________________________________ ____________

It's not until you get to Gold do you get upgrade benefits:

Gold VIP Membership

Point Bonuses
Earn a 25% bonus on all HHonors Base points credited while you are a Gold VIP.

Gold VIP On-Property Benefits†My Way On-Property VIP benefits welcome Gold VIPs at Hilton Family Hotels worldwide hotels. Choose from high-speed internet access, space-available room upgrades, and other great options. Your choices at each brand are listed below.

My point was missed. The big item was the decline in service no matter what room you might be in.

2nd, I am not hung up on Silver Status. I noted it to say I at least had some status.

If a hotel has very low occupancy, why not give a customer (with or without status) an upgraded room? It costs the hotel nothing and may well bring the customer back and have the customer recommend the property to friends. Just good business practice.

My point was missed. The big item was the decline in service no matter what room you might be in.

2nd, I am not hung up on Silver Status. I noted it to say I at least had some status.

If a hotel has very low occupancy, why not give a customer (with or without status) an upgraded room? It costs the hotel nothing and may well bring the customer back and have the customer recommend the property to friends. Just good business practice.


I would guess that it has something to do with the desire to protect/guard the status/prestige of their premium product.

You could use the same argument for the first class cabin on an aircraft.

If anyone can get upgraded without paying the extra, why on earth would those who do pay for the extra service do so. Upgrading anyone would just devalue the product.

Giving available upgrades to those with elite status in the hotel/airline reward programs on a "space available" basis is a good compromise that makes business sense.

My point was missed. The big item was the decline in service no matter what room you might be in.

2nd, I am not hung up on Silver Status. I noted it to say I at least had some status.

If a hotel has very low occupancy, why not give a customer (with or without status) an upgraded room? It costs the hotel nothing and may well bring the customer back and have the customer recommend the property to friends. Just good business practice.

I understand what you're saying about decline in service.

However, I don't think anyone considers silver to be "elite". It might be called that...but all you need to do to get Silver is to apply for the HHonors Amex CC.

Where are you?................

Where are you?................

I'm guessing he got what he wanted but was told not to talk about it on the forums.

We called the hotel today to check up on the lounge situation and they said a breakfast area had been set up in the Lagoon Tower for Gold and Diamond members. They said it was a Continental breakfast with cereal and fruit and pastries with coffee and juice. It sounded similar to the offerings at the old Gold Lounge in the Palace Tower. Maybe they felt this was more cost effective than giving out breakfast coupons? In any case it falls short of expectations.

I'm guessing he got what he wanted but was told not to talk about it on the forums.

We know he's been back over a week and we know he got upgraded to a suite as he posted that elsewhere. It is strange to promise a full report and then just go dark on us.

We called the hotel today to check up on the lounge situation and they said a breakfast area had been set up in the Lagoon Tower for Gold and Diamond members. They said it was a Continental breakfast with cereal and fruit and pastries with coffee and juice. It sounded similar to the offerings at the old Gold Lounge in the Palace Tower. Maybe they felt this was more cost effective than giving out breakfast coupons? In any case it falls short of expectations.


Unfortunately things like this happens all too often where someone asks for help and says they will get back and let us know what transpired, only to set off into the sunset not to be heard from ever again. Yep those 1 post wonders

I can understand if the OP agreed not to discuss anything and thusly accepted their personal bribe and went on their way. What they should have done was posted back here , that yes they met and spoke and had a great time, but that they agreed not to make public anything and thusly wont be. That would solve reporting back to FT (although not what we would have wanted it to be), and at the same time adhereing to whatever if anything they agreed not to do.

We know he's been back over a week and we know he got upgraded to a suite as he posted that elsewhere. It is strange to promise a full report and then just go dark on us.

Strange and frustrating, but not necessarily unexpected, especially given his fairly low post count.

Strange and frustrating, but not necessarily unexpected, especially given his fairly low post count.

.... and the holidays and all. Let's see get those Christmas Cards done or come here .... (I guess I came here)

Freinds just got back and said it wasn't what they expected. As a Diamond going in Feb. I just canceled my points stay. BTW I just got a Starwood Plt. status upgrade based on HH stays. I am tired of 150 nights/year and no upgrades and service!

This is good timing, just got back like 5 weeks ago and was not happy.

We went on points and check in, ok we get a room in the Ocean tower, and some Gold/Diamond breakfast coupons for a place in the Lagoon tower. First morning this is a bit of a trek to get to the Lagoon tower or wait the 15 minutes for the tram, we get to the Gold/Diamond breakfast place its a joke a few small danish's and some juice and coffee, thats it, and to top it off some Hilton person tried to sell us a timeshare. I find out after the second trip, that I can use my voucher in the restaurant in the Ocean tower, but still I do think this is BS after reading what people have said about the lounge before it was closed. I ask for a manager I get some young kid that was polite and said let me see what I can do, took my cell number and room number...and I got NOTHING. I would of liked a call.

I write the Diamond desk about this and my experiences there and 3 weeks after sending I get some kid not sure who he was, not a manger, asking me what I can do to come back, I tell him how about a better choice or a hot breakfast and he says "Ok, well thanks for staying with us"

Customer service gone to hell.

This is good timing, just got back like 5 weeks ago and was not happy.


Really, I hope you're not basing your entire stay experience on the fact that the breakfast wasn't up to par.

It seems to me that some people are too busy getting hung up on the little things to appreciate the big picture.

Really, I hope you're not basing your entire stay experience on the fact that the breakfast wasn't up to par.

It seems to me that some people are too busy getting hung up on the little things to appreciate the big picture.

It's the little things which make up the big picture. If someone is looking for a resort where they can stay onsite for most of the trip (a total waste IMHO on the Big Island), there are nicer Prince resorts up the road, and the rather fashionable Four Seasons down the road. Another great experience is available at the Kona Village Resort.

If someone is looking for a place to sleep, wash up, store clothes, etc., the Sheraton Keahou offers a far more affordable and definitely more convenient location.

So - this property operates in a very competitive environment during declining occupancy rates. It's a tough squeeze to be in, but dumbing down the product and pickpocketing the customer for fees is not the way to go when so many other options are available.

Today's award stay might be tomorrow's revenue stay - right now, it appears that most savvy Hhonors members are noticing the 'dumb-down' in progress and resenting such things as the parking charges. The breakfast change is not likely a make-or-break decision maker for most people, but it could be the cherry on the sundae when someone is deciding which resort is likely to offer a nicer experience or appreciate their business. It appears that HWV is no longer really interested in appreciating anyone's business, which is a decision made at their peril.

Today's award stay might be tomorrow's revenue stay....

Exactly right. Our first stay several years ago at the HWV was an award stay. That led to a dozen or so revenue stays.

I tell him how about a better choice or a hot breakfast and he says "Ok, well thanks for staying with us"

Customer service gone to hell.

Ever since when was a "Hot Breakfast" an expectation of having Gold/Diamond status? It never ceases to amaze me how many people expect this from HH and then get indignant that there are no free hot options available.

Ever since when was a "Hot Breakfast" an expectation of having Gold/Diamond status? It never ceases to amaze me how many people expect this from HH and then get indignant that there are no free hot options available.

I personally don't really expect anything, BUT I have earned Diamond status and would simply like to know what that status MAY offer at a particular property.

My family did have the opportunity to enjoy a fantastic "award" week at HWV a few years ago - I knew exactly what to expect with regards to the perks of being a diamond at the time.

Those perks have obviously changed recently - again, I don't have a huge issue with it - just let me know the facts & I'll book my revenue & award nights accordingly.

Really, I hope you're not basing your entire stay experience on the fact that the breakfast wasn't up to par.

It seems to me that some people are too busy getting hung up on the little things to appreciate the big picture.

I agree with what you're saying - to a point.

If the only reason someone has decided not to go to HWV, or anywhere else, is because they're not getting a free breakfast - or a free full buffet (hot, cooked) breakfast - which isn't really a stated benefit, then it's not necessarily the best argument to make.

But having said that, sometimes expectations from some hotels lead to higher expectations at others, and certainly when a hotel actively disregards the HHonors status policy, it frustrates many LOYAL HHonors members who go out of their way to be loyal and accumulate/earn points to take advantage of the benefits. There are many Hilton hotels outside of the US that far exceed the official stated benefits - IMHO. By doing so they generate a lot of good will and loyalty among HHonors members.

Also, while a full breakfast buffet might not be a stated benefit and isn't something to criticize the hotel for (for not providing to elite members)...it may be something that entices an HHonors member who is on the fence to stay there, over another hotel. I will oftentimes go out of my way to stay at a nice Hilton in Asia if I think that I'm getting extra benefit from staying there - like at the Conrad Hong Kong - because they treat their guests so well. If I knew I wasn't getting any additional benefit for staying at a Hilton, I might go on Expedia and see if I could get a better deal by just paying for a room somewhere else. It's all about weighing the choices and doing a cost-benefit analysis. Nickel and diming loyal customers hurts the hotel in a cost-benefit analysis for many people.

OTOH, I'm not too big on HWV anyways...and would much rather stay at HHV. But, many have liked HWV in the past based, in part, on their level of service, etc... I think that's what this thread is all about.

But having said that, sometimes expectations from some hotels lead to higher expectations at others, and certainly when a hotel actively disregards the HHonors status policy, it frustrates many LOYAL HHonors members who go out of their way to be loyal and accumulate/earn points to take advantage of the benefits.


It really does boil down to expectations. If you set the bar high based on previous experience, then I could see how the recent changes would be a real downer. My first stay here was just a few weeks ago, so I didn't really know how things were during better times. All I was really hoping for was a nice view from my room, which I got. Being a Diamond for only the past 2+ years, any freebie I can get is just gravy to me.

I just think it's a bit crazy when I read that people are canceling stays just because they read a few posts about the lounge being closed or the breakfast not being so great anymore. Some people get far too fired up over the breakfast.

But I agree, things could be better. It makes little sense that I get a much better breakfast at a Hilton Garden Inn than at HWV. It unfortunately sounds much like an airline mentality in trying to offer less service for the same or even more money. I am very interested to see how this hotel fares during this slow economy. I can't imagine the costs involved in maintaining this huge property and it really wouldn't surprise me if further cuts are on the way if occupancy rates don't improve.

Still waiting for Ed's report on his meeting with the GM. Does anyone know if it actually occurred?

I just think it's a bit crazy when I read that people are canceling stays just because they read a few posts about the lounge being closed or the breakfast not being so great anymore. Some people get far too fired up over the breakfast.

A big Amen here! when comparing Europe or Hong Kong stays, these are probably business stays at $250-$400 a night. How many people are at Waikoloa for business? How many people are paying those rates? A solution to all the freeloaders, is move the points up to the Grand Wailea level, at 80,000 a night or 480,000 for a six night stay and give them a monster breakfast. Personally I'll take the 175,000 points for six nights and save 300,000 points and get nothing. Notice how there is no Wailea complaints, because none of the breakfast babies are willing to fork out the points needed for that resort. I will be doing it in July.

Still waiting for Ed's report on his meeting with the GM. Does anyone know if it actually occurred?


Appearing to be a big looser as no responce to our request. Whine Whine Whine then goes dark on us! Probably feels bad about trashing the resort gets the skinny, post elsewhere I got a suite. Hummmmm maybe squeled his way there. I have been there 10 plus times and only once have I gotten a suite

I just think it's a bit crazy when I read that people are canceling stays just because they read a few posts about the lounge being closed or the breakfast not being so great anymore. Some people get far too fired up over the breakfast.

Personally I'll take the 175,000 points for six nights and save 300,000 points and get nothing. Notice how there is no Wailea complaints, because none of the breakfast babies are willing to fork out the points needed for that resort. I will be doing it in July.

Meh. I can see where they're coming from. A lot of folks were used to a previous standard that's not being delivered anymore.

I liked the current plated breakfast choices at the Palm Terrace (good and filling) and have no complaints with them or the paid upgrade to the uber-buffet. I'm not a frequent Hilton-or-higher-tier traveller, so I don't get much exposure to the Executive Lounge. It's not a loss to me, but I respect that it's a loss to some. The nickel-and-diming extras and raised rates without any value gains to the customers is my concern, and I don't think any shaming on your part is going to help their bottom line.

However, I do understand that's what some people had before, and it's those people who are posting in this thread. Calling folks "babies" is a lame appeal.

Congrats on the Wailea stay. To make a trip like that, you're in rare air that most people will never come close to. I've just blown 235,000 points on the Conrad Tokyo, and that's almost my "life savings" with Hilton HHonors.

Appearing to be a big looser as no responce to our request. Whine Whine Whine then goes dark on us! Probably feels bad about trashing the resort gets the skinny, post elsewhere I got a suite. Hummmmm maybe squeled his way there. I have been there 10 plus times and only once have I gotten a suite

In fact, I sent Ed a PM the other day to see what happened. Ed has visited FT since I sent the PM but he has not bothered to respond.

A solution to all the freeloaders, is move the points up to the Grand Wailea level, at 80,000 a night or 480,000 for a six night stay and give them a monster breakfast. Personally I'll take the 175,000 points for six nights and save 300,000 points and get nothing. Notice how there is no Wailea complaints, because none of the breakfast babies are willing to fork out the points needed for that resort. I will be doing it in July.

You still appear to not understand the whole HHonors points system. I'm fairly certain that Hilton decides the number of points, not the hotel. As has been posted multiple times already, the hotel is paid a percentage of the room rate based on occupancy, etc... They are NOT paid based on number of points.

Given that, as far as a hotel is concerned, they then wouldn't mind having point reductions for award stays, because it means that their property will then achieve higher occupancy (especially at HWV where occupancy is apparently not very high) and actually get paid for rooms instead of them being empty. It would be a net financial gain. Raising the points level for redemption is a net financial loss for the hotel, unless they have high ocupancy rates and will fill their rooms regardless of award stays, and from what I've read HWV is NOT in this category.

I would assume that Hilton sets the redemption level to match how much they have to fork out to the hotel in compensation for the awards room - since the compensation is based on room rates and occupancy.

I re-read this thread and noticed that Ed told us that when he contacted the GM, the GM said he also monitors this thread and was aware of complaints. One has to wonder why the GM isn't giving us a report since he obviously knows that we want one.

In fact, I sent Ed a PM the other day to see what happened. Ed has visited FT since I sent the PM but he has not bothered to respond.

I re-read this thread and noticed that Ed told us that when he contacted the GM, the GM said he also monitors this thread and was aware of complaints. One has to wonder why the GM isn't giving us a report since he obviously knows that we want one.

If she is, I can certainly say that I appreciated the letter they sent me. But, offering me an upgrade is not going to make me overlook the lack of a lounge and the decline in service. I am staying at the HHV next month!

If she is, I can certainly say that I appreciated the letter they sent me. But, offering me an upgrade is not going to make me overlook the lack of a lounge and the decline in service. I am staying at the HHV next month!


whoa, no way is the HHV anywhere near the HWV. Not in any fashion, Id take the HWV and The Big Island over Oahu and The HHV any time!

Dont expect much in the way of breakfasts either at the HHV and to me the HHV is simply an amusement park in the middle of a City.

So if the HWV is out stay elsewhere OK wont be a Hilton, but the BI is a much better place to be then Oahu anyday

Now as my next trip and last were basically MRs HNL will do. But if its strictly a vacation or spending time with ones SO, any Island other then Oahu wins hands down

So if the HWV is out stay elsewhere OK wont be a Hilton, but the BI is a much better place to be then Oahu anyday

Now as my next trip and last were basically MRs HNL will do. But if its strictly a vacation or spending time with ones SO, any Island other then Oahu wins hands down

Depends on what you are looking for. I much prefer the Alii tower at the HHV to the HWV now. It used to be different. Breakfast on their oceanfront terrace is pretty sweet... and non-plated, at least as of October.

Next time I am going to the Big Island I will not stay at a Hilton property, I guess.

whoa, no way is the HHV anywhere near the HWV. Not in any fashion, Id take the HWV and The Big Island over Oahu and The HHV any time!

Dont expect much in the way of breakfasts either at the HHV and to me the HHV is simply an amusement park in the middle of a City.

So if the HWV is out stay elsewhere OK wont be a Hilton, but the BI is a much better place to be then Oahu anyday

Now as my next trip and last were basically MRs HNL will do. But if its strictly a vacation or spending time with ones SO, any Island other then Oahu wins hands down

Clearly you are in the majority, based on number of posts here on FT, but there is definitely a strong minority on FT who disagrees with you (me included). The only reason my wife and I would go back to the Big Island would be for Volcanoes Natl. Park, and if/when we do so, we likely will NOT stay at HWV, to avoid the 2+ hour drive each way to get there.

For beaches, between BI and Oahu - not counting other islands, we'll take Oahu anyday of the week, and twice on Sundays.

Oahu is a lot like So. Cal. (where I live) in that there are lots of different things you can do all within an hour or so drive - hiking, swimming on some of the world's best beaches, horse back riding at Kailua Ranch (famous lanscapes in many movies), tourist stuff - such as Pearl Harbor, the Punch Bowl Cemetary, Dole Plantation, etc...shopping (my wife likes to do that - can't say I care very much for that), lots of restaurant choices... Can't say the same for BI - at least for things I would do. Of course...YMMV!!!

BTW...since this thread seems to really be the same as the main HWV thread, especially since we're not really getting any informative info re: the GM of HWV...I think the mods should merge this thread back with the HWV thread so that all the info will be in one place.

I see Ed has not taken the time to let us know what has been resolved. Hmmm.

When this Gold member called the hotel directly to ask for a room in the Lagoon Tower I was told that they would put the request in my reservation, but could not guarantee it, since that was the most requested building. I believe it, since the Lagoon Tower is the closest to the whirlpools, big pool complex, Dolphin Quest, AND is the shortest walk to the parking lot.

I say the above, because in this thread one Diamond member complained about being in the Lagoon Tower, while another Silver member complained about not getting a free upgrade to that same building.

I've been a Hilton Diamond member for many years. I just stayed at the HWV a few days ago and was upgraded to an overview room in the Lagoon Tower. I was given the free Continental Breakfast voucher for use in the Gold/Diamond breakfast area adjacent to the Lagoon Tower. I was appalled by the skimpy selections that were available. Also, nobody was there to clean the tables as 80% of the tables were dirty even though the place was empty (we went at 9:30am). I was very disappointed that this property acts like it doesn't appreciate the business the Gold/Diamond members give Hilton.

Last year when I was there, I was given a voucher for a full buffet breakfast. It's a beautiful property but the overall service and quality are lacking.

I was appalled by the skimpy selections that were available.

Sounds much worse than the plated breakfast! Opening up a diamond/gold continental breakfast area with very little selection is no replacement for the lounge. Actually, I thought the plated breakfast sounded ok from the descriptions provided. Anyway, I do love the HWV and will live with whatever they provide during my upcoming stay in March

I have been a diamond for several years and have stayed at HWV four times in the last 6. The last time was November when at that time I swore to my wife that we will never return. This was not a point stay. I paid for three rooms (family vacation) and dropped several thousand in the spa and around the resort. Folks, the service sucks. The employees spent more time complaining about the management and their issues then they did actually servicing the customers. I'm not breakfast nut, so I really didn't care about the lack of selection in the Diamond Lounge, or coupons or the like. The folks working the desks are rude, do not extend any thank you's or even smile half the time. The wait staff (you would think that they would be nice since they work for tips) had personalities of gnats. The property was stunning...8 years ago when I first set foot on it. Rooms needed updating, walls needed painting and the staff needs to get back to the "Aloha Spirit" that was witnessed years before. Aloha Spirit is about making people feel like O'Hana (Family), not about the freebee's. I don't hunt for the freebees, I just want a good level of service for my family as payback for the 150 nights I'm not home a year. There are serveral other fine resorts in the Hilton Family, I'm now committed to trying those out versus HWV. I have even talked co-workers out of staying there and staying at Sheraton or skipping the Big Island altogether.

There are serveral other fine resorts in the Hilton Family, I'm now committed to trying those out versus HWV. I have even talked co-workers out of staying there and staying at Sheraton or skipping the Big Island altogether.

This maybe heresy, but next time you may consider staying at the HGVC Waikoloa. The place is new, the units are spacious (great for families who are not thrilled with the prospect of renting two rooms), and the full ktichen can allow guests to cut down on their food costs. We stayed there for six nights in July and loved it. The downside of the HGVC was that it did not offer Diamonds much in the way of benefits, but it sounds like HWV is doing its level best to reduce the benefits it provides to Diamonds to match the HGVC Waikoloa!

I think that guests should not focus their ire on the HWV. I think the focus should be placed squarely on the Blackstone Group. From both personal experience and from what I have read on the FT boards, it appears the Diamond/Gold experience has been severely degraded at several Hilton properties (Back Bay, Rome Cavalieri, Lac Leamy, HWV) since Blackstone bought Hilton in the summer of 2007. It would fit with the private equity modus operendi which is to reduce expenses (including expenses lavished on those pesky guests) to beyond the bone, and then sell the property when there are no more expenses left to cut.

I've been vacationing at the HWV for years ...often returning multiple times a year. My last visit was in September during their Wheel of Fortune tapings... and before the recent cutbacks (i.e.: elimination of the Ocean Tower lounge.)

As it relates to breakfast though, I was there when they discontinued the breakfast passes to the Palm Terrace...and people were up in arms then. That's when they opened up the Gold Lounge in the Palace Tower and kept the Diamonds in the Ocean Tower.

In the time since the Palm Terrace passes went away (7-8 yrs?), the breakfast has never been anything to write home about --your usual mix of carbs, with an occasional island item mixed in (i.e.: macadamia nut mini-muffins.) The breakfast offerings have remained the same all these years at all lounges ...right up to my September visit.

And personally, if you're going to get a few carbs (or a small piece of fruit or two) get in the way of an overall vacation experience, so be it. I would often not use the lounges while I was there. Usually I'd sleep through the lounge hours... or I'd venture someplace else for a more substantial offering. To me, the Diamond Lounge was just some place I could grab a soda or a cookie or a few muffins or piece of fruit if I hit the time right. Otherwise, it's no biggie if it's there or not.

I just don't understand the uproar over people missing out on the "breakfast." HHonors doesn't owe you a hot, four-course breakfast... and it sounds like this property is giving what it has over the last handful of years, albeit not in the old lounge rooms. There are other HHonors places that do over-deliver on the under-promise of a basic continental breakfast, and three cheers to those places. But to say HWV needs to meet those same false expectations is silly.

If you're going to Hawaii and your vacation will be totally ruined by not having a few pieces of watermelon and a mini-muffin available to you each morning, I strong suggest you not go to Hawaii. Your mindset is just not in sync with the islands. On the other hand, if you have bare-bones expectations and look to be delighted by anything that comes your way, then Aloha! and welcome to Hawaii.

Now my $0.02 is based solely on the brewing breakfast debate here. Comments about lack of service levels, outdated rooms, and overall non-Aloha spirited employees should factor into your consideration set of whether or not you stay here though. And if those things are indeed suffering, you should go elsewhere. But if your only gripe is about how big your complimentary continental breakfast is, you need to re-examine your priorities.

And personally, if you're going to get a few carbs (or a small piece of fruit or two) get in the way of an overall vacation experience, so be it. I would often not use the lounges while I was there. Usually I'd sleep through the lounge hours... or I'd venture someplace else for a more substantial offering. To me, the Diamond Lounge was just some place I could grab a soda or a cookie or a few muffins or piece of fruit if I hit the time right. Otherwise, it's no biggie if it's there or not....

If you're going to Hawaii and your vacation will be totally ruined by not having a few pieces of watermelon and a mini-muffin available to you each morning, I strong suggest you not go to Hawaii. Your mindset is just not in sync with the islands. On the other hand, if you have bare-bones expectations and look to be delighted by anything that comes your way, then Aloha! and welcome to Hawaii.

Speaking of aloha spirit.... :(

While you are welcome to your own particular kind of vacationing style at this or any property, I think to be so dismissive of these concerns is misplaced.

I'm actually more concerned with the other end of the day in re the Diamond Lounge. On most of our stays, we spent our money (often at the resort itself and its restaurants) on lunch. The pupus offered at dinner time could easily make a meal and that is what we most often did.

So this change represents a serious devaluation -- and rate hike -- from what had been the case.

Now, I would not want to be running a tourist-based business in Hawai`i right now; I particularly would not want to do so on the Kohala Coast. The vog and the recession have had terrible consequences.

But I continue to think this diminution of Diamond benefits is short-sighted on the HWV's (or Blackstone's) part. As noted by me and others, a reward stay often leads to paid stays (more than a dozen for us), and alienating Hilton's best customers is not the way I would do it.

But, regardless, folks "do" their vacations differently and for many of us this change is a substantial and unwelcome one, and I think "talking stink" about those who feel this way is misplaced and not very akamai.

I think that guests should not focus their ire on the HWV. I think the focus should be placed squarely on the Blackstone Group. From both personal experience and from what I have read on the FT boards, it appears the Diamond/Gold experience has been severely degraded at several Hilton properties (Back Bay, Rome Cavalieri, Lac Leamy, HWV) since Blackstone bought Hilton in the summer of 2007. It would fit with the private equity modus operendi which is to reduce expenses (including expenses lavished on those pesky guests) to beyond the bone, and then sell the property when there are no more expenses left to cut.

You got that right. Private Equity answers only to themselves, generally has no long term interest, and will do 'whatever it takes' to suck out value before peddling whatever's left.

Add to that the current economy and the realization of how tough it would be to peddle a hotel company anytime in the next several years and you have a really bad recipe. Blackstone probably overpaid(relative to today's value), so that means they have to 'work' the company even more than they originally thought to 'enhance' value.

When Hilton was taken private by BS, I wondered how long it would take for things to start falling apart. Unfortunately for Hilton fans, it didn't take long.

I think a lot of what frequent hotel types have experienced over the years is likely on the way out, cuz the family connections(Hilton, Pritzker, Marriott) will be less involved going forward, and the tight, computer enabled monitoring of every $.01, combined with typical corporate mgmt. all leads to a lessening of all the goodies we like.

Dead? Not yet, but I don't look for much goodness in the next few years.

If your stays at this Hotel has been free stays , then you are NOT a Loyal customer of this particuliar hotel, so why should they go the extra yard when you havent given them a dime Room wise?

Hilton Corporate SHOULD care that a frequent Hilton guest is pissed, period, regardless. As I've said in airline forums, even if someone's in a seat (or room) on an upgrade, or paid with miles (or points), they most certainly have earned that, by repeated business to the overall corporation and should be treated accordingly. Treatment should be consistent across the board.

You got that right. Private Equity answers only to themselves, generally has no long term interest, and will do 'whatever it takes' to suck out value before peddling whatever's left.

Add to that the current economy and the realization of how tough it would be to peddle a hotel company anytime in the next several years and you have a really bad recipe. Blackstone probably overpaid(relative to today's value), so that means they have to 'work' the company even more than they originally thought to 'enhance' value.

When Hilton was taken private by BS, I wondered how long it would take for things to start falling apart. Unfortunately for Hilton fans, it didn't take long.

I think a lot of what frequent hotel types have experienced over the years is likely on the way out, cuz the family connections(Hilton, Pritzker, Marriott) will be less involved going forward, and the tight, computer enabled monitoring of every $.01, combined with typical corporate mgmt. all leads to a lessening of all the goodies we like.

Dead? Not yet, but I don't look for much goodness in the next few years.

It just KILLS me that corporations, and their f**king bean counters can't see the forest for the trees. Make customers happy, and you'll enjoy the results. Don't, and you'll pay the price. YOU CAN'T CUT YOUR WAY TO SUCCESS.

I have been a diamond for several years and have stayed at HWV four times in the last 6. The last time was November when at that time I swore to my wife that we will never return. This was not a point stay. I paid for three rooms (family vacation) and dropped several thousand in the spa and around the resort. Folks, the service sucks. The employees spent more time complaining about the management and their issues then they did actually servicing the customers.

I'm not breakfast nut, so I really didn't care about the lack of selection in the Diamond Lounge, or coupons or the like. The folks working the desks are rude, do not extend any thank you's or even smile half the time. The wait staff (you would think that they would be nice since they work for tips) had personalities of gnats.

That bites. I had great staff at both breakfast locations -- the kind I would have to shoo away. The buffet staff were trying to plan my entire stay's activities at the expense of not bussing tables (a trade-off, but not a bad one). The Palm Terrace staff were quick and eerily friendly.

The desk staff was very helpful to all my requests, especially stowing my engagement ring in a safety-deposit box. The Orchid Cafe staff were kind, the gallery staff were friendly, and the tennis shop clerk was kind and really talkative, as no one was playing tennis in November. Housekeeping was quickly responsive and helped with my odd requests ("Help! I'm packing and I need an extra cardboard box to use for checked luggage!").

My only complaint were with the scattered or unstaffed concierge desks (non HGVC-stations), who seemed out of the loop at policy changes and the outsourced business office who disappeared for 40-minute stretches.

I wish some things would change, but the frontline staff were great troopers during November 2008.

This maybe heresy, but next time you may consider staying at the HGVC Waikoloa. The place is new, the units are spacious (great for families who are not thrilled with the prospect of renting two rooms), and the full ktichen can allow guests to cut down on their food costs. We stayed there for six nights in July and loved it. The downside of the HGVC was that it did not offer Diamonds much in the way of benefits, but it sounds like HWV is doing its level best to reduce the benefits it provides to Diamonds to match the HGVC Waikoloa!

I wonder if the HGVC is providing too much competition for the Waikoloa Village and hurting its bottom line...

That bites. I had great staff at both breakfast locations -- the kind I would have to shoo away. The buffet staff were trying to plan my entire stay's activities at the expense of not bussing tables (a trade-off, but not a bad one). The Palm Terrace staff were quick and eerily friendly.


I kind of got the feeling that they were really understaffed at the Palm Terrace breakfast. Service was far too slow. And after really thinking about it, I was wondering if these plated breakfasts are at fault? In the past, these servers didn't have to do much for golds/diamonds besides refilling coffee and clearing plates since they'd all just help themselves to the buffet. Now servers have to take orders and put together meals for all these elites. Now servers have to go in the kitchen and wait for toast, wait for pancakes, etc etc. All these things take extra time, but if the size of the staff remains constant or is even reduced, then the customers will suffer the consequences.

Just finished a 7 night stay at the Waikoloa and wanted to update the breakfast situation. Two breakfast coupons are provided per night for HHonors members. There are no longer plated breakfast choices, instead you go to the buffet area and can have your choice of all the cold items plus hot oatmeal. Frankly the cold item selections were more than adequate including bagels, breads,cheeses, lox, deli meats, cereals, muffins, fruit, juice, and coffee. There was no problem using 4 coupons (since we were a family of 4), so we were able to all eat together for half the mornings. The only caution is to make sure to avoid the busy hours (8:30 AM and later) as service was stressed and items were not replenished quickly enough in the buffet.

We love staying at HWV and the breakfast situation would probably not have dampened our spirits very much anyways, however I felt that what is now being provided is a suitable compromise.

The property was very quiet in the few days before Christmas, seemed half empty. It did pick up Christmas Day and the few days afterwards that we were there.

That's a least some improvement!

Which restaurant is the buffet?

Just finished a 7 night stay at the Waikoloa and wanted to update the breakfast situation. Two breakfast coupons are provided per night for HHonors members. There are no longer plated breakfast choices, instead you go to the buffet area and can have your choice of all the cold items plus hot oatmeal. Frankly the cold item selections were more than adequate including bagels, breads,cheeses, lox, deli meats, cereals, muffins, fruit, juice, and coffee.

That's actually a nice change in that they added protein items to the breakfast. Assuming this was in the Palm Terrace restaurant, how did they keep it separate from the remainder of the Ginormous Breakfast Buffet?

Just finished a 7 night stay at the Waikoloa and wanted to update the breakfast situation. Two breakfast coupons are provided per night for HHonors members. There are no longer plated breakfast choices, instead you go to the buffet area and can have your choice of all the cold items plus hot oatmeal. Frankly the cold item selections were more than adequate including bagels, breads,cheeses, lox, deli meats, cereals, muffins, fruit, juice, and coffee. There was no problem using 4 coupons (since we were a family of 4), so we were able to all eat together for half the mornings. The only caution is to make sure to avoid the busy hours (8:30 AM and later) as service was stressed and items were not replenished quickly enough in the buffet.

We love staying at HWV and the breakfast situation would probably not have dampened our spirits very much anyways, however I felt that what is now being provided is a suitable compromise.

The property was very quiet in the few days before Christmas, seemed half empty. It did pick up Christmas Day and the few days afterwards that we were there.

This new BK offering is EXACTLY what the Hilton Hawaiian Village does. For some HH members travelling to multiple islands it may be refreshing to see some consistency between these two hotels.

If your stays at this Hotel has been free stays , then you are NOT a Loyal customer of this particuliar hotel, so why should they go the extra yard when you havent given them a dime Room wise?


Presumably the property receives some sort of money from Hilton Honors for each night of an award stay. They receive even more during a "Diamond Force" stay.

I have had several stays at HHV and HWV, though in each case it was more than a year ago. My last Hilton stay in Hawaii was Jan 2007 at the Kauai property - a very quaint place and not very special compared to the Hyatt and Marriott properties on the same island. However our experience with the hotel staff and guest experience at Kauaii was quite pleasant and I would not mind returning for a points redemption, even at the ALON2 level. (Just be aware, it is neither a HWV nor a HHV value for points, in terms of the grand hotel experience with swimmable beach etc)

I have stayed enough nights for "double diamond" status if there were such a thing, this year - plus as much as $10,000 a month on my hilton Amex. When I stay somewhere with points I certainly feel like I've earned that stay and should be treated as well or better than a cash customer for the same nights.

I always cringe when I read about people with millions of points in their accounts. I encourage you to burn your points as you earn them, having no more than a year's worth on hand - you don't know what changes will be made to these programs and in my 10 years of business travel, I have noticed the redemption level and services received go down rather than up.

I agree that the "giving away gold to anyone with a pulse" is a big part of the problem. Gold should be earned. Give away silver if you need to give away something.

That's actually a nice change in that they added protein items to the breakfast. Assuming this was in the Palm Terrace restaurant, how did they keep it separate from the remainder of the Ginormous Breakfast Buffet?

It was the Palm terrace and the separation is enforced by the server. If they see that you took any hot items then they will charge you for an upgrade to the hot buffet.

Gosh I love FT - wonderful that this much discussion can be generated in barely a day.

I concur that if there are items of this thread that belong in the main Waikoloa thread then mods please feel free to merge. However, that thread is pretty long and I didn't want this recent activity to get burried at the bottom there.

I did hear back from the GM and it's looking like we'll likely meet on Friday.

Yes, I am planning to share comments from this discussion. Feel free to post here, or PM me with the info if you prefer.

Happy new year to all.

Ed -
The holidays are about past us so perhaps you'll have time to give us an update. Naturally, your comments above don't require a response but you've certainly piqued the interest of quite a few folks (myself included).

108 posts & >8000 views since Dec. 8th puts HWV and a conversation with the GM topic right square on the front burner.

If I recall correctly, you mentioned that the GM was monitoring this thread - although the thread weaved around a bit, hopefully the GM understands the significance of those numbers in the FT community alone!!

I personally hope you will respond. Again, Happy new year to all.

I would agree with Nitro, I am traveling in February to Kona and Hilo and looking to book and seeing everyone's comments on this property I just can't pull the trigger yet. Look forward to the report Ed.

Just finished a 7 night stay at the Waikoloa and wanted to update the breakfast situation. Two breakfast coupons are provided per night for HHonors members. There are no longer plated breakfast choices, instead you go to the buffet area and can have your choice of all the cold items plus hot oatmeal. Frankly the cold item selections were more than adequate including bagels, breads,cheeses, lox, deli meats, cereals, muffins, fruit, juice, and coffee. There was no problem using 4 coupons (since we were a family of 4), so we were able to all eat together for half the mornings.

Does anyone recall what the charge would be for kids at this buffet if you paid for them (so you didn't have to "waste" a coupon on them)? I've stayed in many Hiltons where kids eat free for breakfast, but I'm guessing that's NOT the case for this location. I also recall that F&B prices at Waikoloa can be extremely high. Thanks.

No, kids don't eat BK for free at HWV. At least, it was not free for my 4 YO in mid-December anyways.

I can't remember what the price of the kid's buffet was though.

Does anyone recall what the charge would be for kids at this buffet if you paid for them (so you didn't have to "waste" a coupon on them)? I've stayed in many Hiltons where kids eat free for breakfast, but I'm guessing that's NOT the case for this location. I also recall that F&B prices at Waikoloa can be extremely high. Thanks.

I had stayed at the HWV on points for 5 striaght years, with my last stay there being Nov 07. I had to go back to my post from Nov 07 to remember what the kids buffet cost. It was around $14 at that time. For the first 4 years of stays we had access to the Gold Lounge. The last stay in Nov 07 they gave us 4 breakfast vouchers for a family of 4 for each day of our stay. The voucher covered the kids for the full breakfast buffet (hot and cold), but only gave the adults a small plate of pastries and coffee/juice (not access to the cold buffet) or $14 credit toward other menu items. So it sounds like the current offer is better than what we recieved at that time assuming you can get 4 vouchers per day for a family of 4. We did miss the lounge, but it was because of the attendants and not the food. I agree that Diamonds are missing out on more if there are no longer evening Appetizers. From a breakfast perspective I could stop at Costco and buy a tray of muffins, bagels, pineapple, cereal, milk and coffee and replace what we ate in the lounge for the week for less than $25, so I don’t see the closing of the lounge as a large cost impact from a Gold perspective.

I maintain gold status by charging $20K plus per year on my HH AMEX. I have very few stays per year at HH Hotels, but am able to earn enough points for a week stay at a HH in a little over a year of spending. I have migrated most of my Hotel stays to Hyatt due to the quality of their hotels for reward redemption and the fact that Hilton points are easy to earn via credit card and Hyatt points can only be earned by staying in Hotels.

We have always received excellent service at the HWV and they have always been very accommodating to our room requests. It is disappointing to hear that service may have been declining over the last year or two.

Why not a 6 straight year? We decided to cash in my hard earned Hyatt points for a week at the Grand Hyatt Kauai recently. Using points we were able to upgrade to Regency club access. The lounge had a good breakfast selection (no hot items, but did include champagne), evening appetizers including full open bar and late night dessert and dessert cocktails. Hyatt Diamonds get complimentary access and if I were to be judging treatment of Diamond status on the lounges, Hyatt wins hands down. Would I pay for this access, no way. Room rates at this property (off season) were $450 per night and north of $800 per night (plus tax) if you wanted lounge access (also guaranteed an ocean view room, but the same room as the $450 per night rooms).

When I have paid for rooms at the HWV, rooms were normally in the $225- $250 per night range. I think the HWV resort is a very good value for those kinds of room rates compared to other properties in Hawaii. Also tough to complain when you are staying at this resort for free just for running your purchases through a cc. I am hopeful service will improve and we may return for a 6th stay but am considering burning 300K points for 6 nights at the Grand Wailea next year. Do I think that the GW is worth almost twice as many points as the HWV? Probably not, but am interested to see.

i'm thinking ed works at the hwv.

I had stayed at the HWV on points for 5 striaght years, with my last stay there being Nov 07. I had to go back to my post from Nov 07 to remember what the kids buffet cost. It was around $14 at that time. For the first 4 years of stays we had access to the Gold Lounge. The last stay in Nov 07 they gave us 4 breakfast vouchers for a family of 4 for each day of our stay. The voucher covered the kids for the full breakfast buffet (hot and cold), but only gave the adults a small plate of pastries and coffee/juice (not access to the cold buffet) or $14 credit toward other menu items. So it sounds like the current offer is better than what we recieved at that time assuming you can get 4 vouchers per day for a family of 4.

But you won't get 4 vouchers per day for a family of 4: you'd only get 2 vouchers, right? Which would leave you with having to pay the cost for the children, which the previous poster remembers as being $14 per kid.

That's obviously a lot for a children's breakfast, but if you've got 2 kids and 2 adults, I guess you can look at it as paying $7 per person, which is still a pretty good deal at a luxury hotel. The alternative would seem to be to save the vouchers and have everyone eat a free breakfast every other day.

The alternative would seem to be to save the vouchers and have everyone eat a free breakfast every other day.

Most of the time the vouchers are dated and their use is limited to the dates on them. I guess it would depend upon what you can get away with.

no offense to this poster in particular, but does anyone else wonder why we see erosion in the HHonors program when this sort of "customer" is able to stay at the HWV on points and get "gold" benefits based primarily on use of a credit card?

free gold = free-loaders


I had stayed at the HWV on points for 5 striaght years, with my last stay there being Nov 07.
... From a breakfast perspective I could stop at Costco and buy a tray of muffins, bagels, pineapple, cereal, milk and coffee and replace what we ate in the lounge for the week for less than $25, so I don’t see the closing of the lounge as a large cost impact from a Gold perspective.

I maintain gold status by charging $20K plus per year on my HH AMEX. I have very few stays per year at HH Hotels, but am able to earn enough points for a week stay at a HH in a little over a year of spending. I have migrated most of my Hotel stays to Hyatt due to the quality of their hotels for reward redemption and the fact that Hilton points are easy to earn via credit card and Hyatt points can only be earned by staying in Hotels.
...

no offense to this poster in particular, but does anyone else wonder why we see erosion in the HHonors program when this sort of "customer" is able to stay at the HWV on points and get "gold" benefits based primarily on use of a credit card?

free gold = free-loaders

It's all a game, my friend. The hotels find it profitable to sell their points -- so they encourage it.

Frequent flyer benefits are usually more about playing the game wisely than being a "mega traveller." In my mind, if a guy/gal can get gold by smartly playing the credit card game, he deserves the benefits just as much as the guy who had "x" number of stays. And, I would submit, that's pretty much the core of the flyertalk spirit.

It's all a game, my friend. The hotels find it profitable to sell their points -- so they encourage it.

Frequent flyer benefits are usually more about playing the game wisely than being a "mega traveller." In my mind, if a guy/gal can get gold by smartly playing the credit card game, he deserves the benefits just as much as the guy who had "x" number of stays. And, I would submit, that's pretty much the core of the flyertalk spirit.Exactly, I only fly a few times a year, but with my reward card I get enough points to fmake those trips for free.

I was hoping to stay at HWV this year, but with all these negative comments I'll look for alternatives. This is a real shame, I've stayed at HWV for the past 4 years and always got great rooms in the Lagoon Tower and had breakfast in the Ocean Tower (Diamond Lounge). Any good Starwood or Hyatt properties in the area?

Judging by the non-response from ED, it looks as if the benefits he received outweighed his principles.

Hmmm. I just booked for February for 6 days. Revenue stay. HHD. So, Should I call and tell them what we all read here and pick up where Ed left off? Or just check in, ask for manager and then report back. I stay in Oahu at the Doubletree every two/three months and they are great 90% upgrade rate.....at least I can see what the manager has to say. Regardless of upgrades and comps to keep me from posting, I already get that in Oahu, so....care for a report? I am all ears being new to FT but certainly not to travelling.

it looks like Ed did reply, he posted his response to a another thread.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/hilton-hhonors/509302-hilton-waikoloa-village-37.html#post10913977

I concur with other recent posts that the property remains in excellent shape. Despite whatever cutbacks may be necessary in other areas to stay viable, they continue to maintain the property to high standards.

They also have rennovated a number of their suites. The one I had was exceptional - every bit the equal to the executive suite I had earlier this month at the Conrad Chicago. You can tell these updated rooms by the dark rattan furniture on the lanai.

it looks like Ed did reply, he posted his response to a another thread.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/hilton-hhonors/509302-hilton-waikoloa-village-37.html#post10913977

Check out post #24 on page 2 (of this thread).

A lot of us flyertalkers were more interested in Ed's statement regarding his conversation with the GM than his accommodations for that particular trip. Again, reading that post, Ed started a new thread specifically to not have the information "buried" in HWV thread you've referenced.

Originally Posted by Ed ONeill
I concur with other recent posts that the property remains in excellent shape. Despite whatever cutbacks may be necessary in other areas to stay viable, they continue to maintain the property to high standards.

They also have rennovated a number of their suites. The one I had was exceptional - every bit the equal to the executive suite I had earlier this month at the Conrad Chicago. You can tell these updated rooms by the dark rattan furniture on the lanai.

I guess Ed got what he wanted in exchange for agreeing not to discuss anything. If you notice his profile, he is a HH Gold. How many golds get renovated suites at HWV?

It was a nice investment for the manager...

Good catch.

It was a nice investment for the manager...

Or a nice play by Ed...

snipwe get to the Gold/Diamond breakfast place its a joke a few small danish's and some juice and coffee, thats it, and to top it off some Hilton person tried to sell us a timeshare.

Ever since when was a "Hot Breakfast" an expectation of having Gold/Diamond status? It never ceases to amaze me how many people expect this from HH and then get indignant that there are no free hot options available.There's an awful lot of space between just "a few small danish's and some juice and coffee" and a hot breakfast. I've had plenty of very enjoyable cold buffets, where there was nice fruit, smoked salmon, cheese, etc. Especially in Hawaii, some tropical fruit is appreciated.

There are many Hilton hotels outside of the US that far exceed the official stated benefits - IMHO. By doing so they generate a lot of good will and loyalty among HHonors members.

Also, while a full breakfast buffet might not be a stated benefit and isn't something to criticize the hotel for (for not providing to elite members)...it may be something that entices an HHonors member who is on the fence to stay there, over another hotel. I will oftentimes go out of my way to stay at a nice Hilton in Asia if I think that I'm getting extra benefit from staying there - like at the Conrad Hong Kong - because they treat their guests so well. If I knew I wasn't getting any additional benefit for staying at a Hilton, I might go on Expedia and see if I could get a better deal by just paying for a room somewhere else. Indeed! I go out of my way to stay at the Conrad Hong Kong because we always have such an enjoyable time. We even add a couple of days in HKG to trips wherever we can because it's such a nice place to stay. And so far I've never stayed there on business, so it's always my choice and my dime (or points -- sometimes we pay and sometimes we redeem).

A big Amen here! when comparing Europe or Hong Kong stays, these are probably business stays at $250-$400 a night.I've always stayed on my own dime. Even on business trips, HKG has always been a personal stop-over choice and I pay.

I just don't understand the uproar over people missing out on the "breakfast." HHonors doesn't owe you a hot, four-course breakfast [snip]

If you're going to Hawaii and your vacation will be totally ruined by not having a few pieces of watermelon and a mini-muffin available to you each morning, I strong suggest you not go to Hawaii.I think this is unfair. A nice breakfast makes people feel good. IMHO, it can be nice without being hot. Personally, I almost never eat eggs, and I never eat sausage or bacon or any of the other hot greasy meats. When smoked salmon or other fish is offered, it's a terrific option and one I enjoy a lot.

When I look at the fall 2009 prices at HWV, I see you can get it for around $170 including 2 free breakfast buffet. Seems pretty good price to me and also you don't have to worry about the breakfast benefits any more.

WJ

booked the lowest priced room available - garden view.

When I checked in had been upgraded to an ocean view King in the Ocean Tower.

Nice sized room with a nice view.

The tram was running but we walked nonetheless.
The tram was out of service the rest of our stay. Had one staff member say that they were repairing the tram and were actually going to do some replacement. I did see persons working on the tram so believe that the staff member was correct. Boats were running.

We were given coupons for the continental breakfast in the Palm Terrace. I actually thought the continental spread was very extensive. A wide-variety of fresh fruit, lots of breakfast pastries, plus cereal (hot oatmeal also) yogurt, salmon, capers, a variety of cheeses, tomatoes, cucumbers, etc. Juices and coffee. We had plenty to eat and I did not feel it was a come-down. I do remember the executive lounge spread and this was similar (actually may be more extensive).

They are apparently charging for parking, however the entire time I was there, the exit gate was broken (had been for some time I was told) so you just drive through without having to operate it with the room key which is the only way they would have to track use.

I have stayed here a number of times in the past, and it did appear that there were fewer people here than I remember. I am sure that occupancy is down. There were two conferences that overlapped my stay, so that helped occupancy. Plus there was some shooting of a VH1 reality show about dating that was being shot on premises (isn't reality TV an oxymoron?). I assume cast and crew were staying on premises, so all of that helped revenue.

By and large the stay was similar to that I have experienced in the past. I did not sense service being down and the property appears in similar shape to the last time I was here 2 or 3 years ago.

I did notice that the bar was very empty each time we went in for a nightcap. Did not eat at any of the on-site restaurants (other than breakfast in the Palm), as I have never been much impressed with them anyway. The Italian restaurant was closed the entire time were were there. Not sure about Kamuela Provision as we never got over there, but the only places open between the lobby and Ocean Tower were Kirin, the Chinese place and Imari, the Japanese place. Boat landing pavilion was also open.

I also noticed that returning later at night there was plenty of parking in the lot. In the past that has not always been the case. I can remember really having to ferret out a spot because the lot had been so full. No more.

New addition to the area since I was last here, is the Queens Market, accross from the old Kings Market. A wonderful grocery (offshoot of the ABC stores) that has a deli, good selection of wines and beer and groceries. We had some take out sushi which was quite good. I noticed many people walking to their rooms at the Hilton with grocery bags from there. People clearly loading up for snacks or more in their rooms.

There are also a couple of new restaurants there. We ate at one, Sansei, which was quite good. Hostess told us that they do an early-bird special on Sundays and Mondays, and people line up for it. We did not take advantage as that is not our style.

denis in denver - thank you very much for the nice review. I wish I could spare the time away right now, sounds like a great experience.

was there any problem with this "vog" volcanic smog situation?

When I look at the fall 2009 prices at HWV, I see you can get it for around $170 including 2 free breakfast buffet. Seems pretty good price to me and also you don't have to worry about the breakfast benefits any more.

WJ

No kidding? That is below my threshold for what I will burn points for anyway, so I would definitely choose to pay for the room as opposed to using a GLONP!

Great information....man, I guess their occupancy rate must be down. I don't think I've seen a rate that low.

Dawn

Two years ago the government rate was $150, last year it was up to $180/night. Since the closure of the executive lounge and the reports of vog we have decided to try Kauai instead of the big Island this year.

was there any problem with this "vog" volcanic smog situation?

No.

When I look at the fall 2009 prices at HWV, I see you can get it for around $170 including 2 free breakfast buffet. Seems pretty good price to me and also you don't have to worry about the breakfast benefits any more.



Found a rate like this in early May of $174.30 including breakfast buffet for two. Required a deposit of 30% and a 90 day advance booking. Since the normal pay in full advance purchase rate for the same dates was $186 with no breakfast this seemed to be a real no brainer type bargain. Did a bit of searching since this rate was not available for some dates in May.

WJ

When I look at the fall 2009 prices at HWV, I see you can get it for around $170 including 2 free breakfast buffet. Seems pretty good price to me and also you don't have to worry about the breakfast benefits any more.

WJ

Also same rate in July 09, 174usd inc 2 breakfasts. 30% deposit

Just wanted to bump this thread back to the the top as I have just returned from a week at the HWV.

I was upgraded to a suite in the Ocean Tower which was very satisfactory. They are providing free continental breakfast coupons for gold and diamond members which I wasn't impressed with at first but the spread in the Palm Terrace won me over as it was easy to find different food to try each day, all of which was excellent. The service at the Terrace was either excellent or terrible, depending on your server that day. Employee morale seemed low throughout the hotel which was undoubtedly due to the recent cutbacks at the hotel. The parking gates appeared to be fixed however I was not charged for parking by using my room key to get in and out of the lot. $15 a day for self park and $21 for valet. I never had trouble finding a spot but if you get in late it can be a long walk. Both the tram and the boats were running during my stay.

I didn't eat at the hotel restaurants (aside from the pizza place in the Lagoon tower, very reasonable Btw) but the prices didn't seem too outrageous from what I saw from a brief perusal of some of their menus. The convenience stores throughout the hotel had good selection but the prices were very high. I bought two six packs of beer the first night, total $49. Needless to say I bought the rest of my room alcohol from the gourmet market up the street (take the shuttle from the lower lobby, $1 each way).

I also did the hotel Luau and would highly recommend it. The show wasn't the best that I have seen but the food was excellent. Also I would recommend the Ali'i seating (an extra $26) as that covers all your drinks and you get great seats and are waited on. Also the sunset cruise through Ocean Sports at the hotel is a great way to spend an afternoon (free drinks! and the food wasn't bad either).

All in all while the employee service wasn't up to what I would consider Diamond standards the many amenities offered by the hotel definitely help to make up for it. Along the original lines of this thread I would like to see more benefits offered to Diamond members as they seemed to be the same for Gold or Diamond. They need to reopen the concierge lounge and perhaps do some employee customer service training. Overall I am left with a generally positive impression of the hotel but not an overwhelmingly one

You would think with occupancy this low, they could easily upgrade their best customers and give you free continental breakfast and internet or free parking.

You would think. Apparently they like to fleece their best customers like DL does.


Expectations......as a Diamond, don't expect much, that way you will not be disappointed.
While this is good advice, it seems sad it has come to this. While many have articulated their thoughts on over-expectations, over-entitlement, etc yada yada yada...it goes without saying that the purpose of Diamond is to recognize the best customers and reward their loyalty with benefits. Seems to me that this hotel is not doing this well. It should be the GM, and then Blackstone who should be held ultimately responsible. This doesn't excuse staff's poor CS etc. If my boss sucks, that doesn't give me the right to treat my customers poorly.

With the occupancy level at what it is right now I am disgusted with my lack of upgrade.

Funny they are going against the grain. With hotels worldwide suffering from vacancy, the majority of them are giving out more perks to attract customers. Either all of them are plain foolish, or Hilton hasn't gotten the point.

We called the hotel today to check up on the lounge situation and they said a breakfast area had been set up in the Lagoon Tower for Gold and Diamond members. They said it was a Continental breakfast with cereal and fruit and pastries with coffee and juice. It sounded similar to the offerings at the old Gold Lounge in the Palace Tower. Maybe they felt this was more cost effective than giving out breakfast coupons? In any case it falls short of expectations.
Wonder how it will change the next 10 months (before my TENTATIVE stay).


I write the Diamond desk about this and my experiences there and 3 weeks after sending I get some kid not sure who he was, not a manger, asking me what I can do to come back, I tell him how about a better choice or a hot breakfast and he says "Ok, well thanks for staying with us"

Customer service gone to hell.
I would have expected the DD to do better. One time I flamed the Hilton Beijing for a bad stay. I got someone from the DD, and CS Mgr from Hilton Beijing who both apologized and contacted me directly. While I don't think we should expect this every time, I would expect them to take feedback more seriously.

Hilton Corporate SHOULD care that a frequent Hilton guest is pissed, period, regardless. As I've said in airline forums, even if someone's in a seat (or room) on an upgrade, or paid with miles (or points), they most certainly have earned that, by repeated business to the overall corporation and should be treated accordingly. Treatment should be consistent across the board.
+1. Isn't that what being in a service industry is all about? And consistency is what we all crave for. It's lack of consistency that creates upset expectations.


I always cringe when I read about people with millions of points in their accounts. I encourage you to burn your points as you earn them, having no more than a year's worth on hand - you don't know what changes will be made to these programs and in my 10 years of business travel, I have noticed the redemption level and services received go down rather than up.

I agree that the "giving away gold to anyone with a pulse" is a big part of the problem. Gold should be earned. Give away silver if you need to give away something.
Good advice on burning. I'm in that mode now. All elite levels should be earned. I don't mind status matches or challenges, I do mind the spend $$$ and get Diamond. But that's the world we live in now.


I was upgraded to a suite in the Ocean Tower which was very satisfactory. They are providing free continental breakfast coupons for gold and diamond members which I wasn't impressed with at first but the spread in the Palm Terrace won me over as it was easy to find different food to try each day, all of which was excellent. The service at the Terrace was either excellent or terrible, depending on your server that day. Employee morale seemed low throughout the hotel which was undoubtedly due to the recent cutbacks at the hotel. The parking gates appeared to be fixed however I was not charged for parking by using my room key to get in and out of the lot. $15 a day for self park and $21 for valet. I never had trouble finding a spot but if you get in late it can be a long walk. Both the tram and the boats were running during my stay.

Thanks for the TR. Glad to hear one positive comment on the food. I hope mgmt addresses the employee morale issue. Did the $15 just not show up on your folio? Did you ask about it?

The parking was never applied to my folio. I fully expected it to when I checked out but it never showed up and I didnt inquire.

The parking was never applied to my folio. I fully expected it to when I checked out but it never showed up and I didnt inquire.

Sounds like you might have gotten lucky. You never know though. Thanks for the update.