MilesBuzz! - *A FFP: LH or UA - which one?

Okay, here's some background:

Me and Miss Sosmart fly out of NYC - we're both making it to NW plat this year.

Because of the quality of the *A network and its attractive RTW possibilities for future travel, we've decided to make *Gold status this year. (I'm also a little worried about the whole NW/CO/DL + AF/KL thing).

So, we're taking a really long trip

10K in UA Discount Y

12K in LH Discount Y

22K in paid F on various * carriers.


Originally, I was going to put it all into our LH accounts (no status at this time). The above totals, with another flight added in, would give us both Sen status for 2 years.

Domestically, we don't fly too many transcons (only 2 this year), rather mostly short flights to the Midwest.

Internationally, we fly almost exclusively to Europe.


So, which program is best for us? I understand that with the above mileage totals, I can get 1P on UA, and Sen on LH. Senator looks better on paper, but is there an inherent benefit to belonging to the "home airline's" program in this case? (Especially considering LH's financial strength and UA's lack thereof...)

Any advice would be much appreciated.

[This message has been edited by notsosmart (edited 10-06-2003).]

If you have enough for both carriers, its wise to spread it arouund, although you may want to consider having one Star program and one program from the 1W alliance.

If I had to choose only one program between the two you mention, I would go for LH, especially considering you do some paid F travel.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Gaucho100K:
If you have enough for both carriers, its wise to spread it arouund, although you may want to consider having one Star program and one program from the 1W alliance.

If I had to choose only one program between the two you mention, I would go for LH, especially considering you do some paid F travel.</font>

Well, the paid F travel is not going to be a regular thing...

Thanks for the opinion though. I am leaning towards LH.

Anyone else?

only if you would be able to reach 1K with UA (and then getting the SWU and the HK49 vouchers) would I prefer Mileage Plus. But since it seems you would be 'stuck' with Premier Executive, I would prefer LH Senator too (not the least advantage there: status validity is 2 and not only one year).

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Rudi:
only if you would be able to reach 1K with UA (and then getting the SWU and the HK49 vouchers) would I prefer Mileage Plus. But since it seems you would be 'stuck' with Premier Executive, I would prefer LH Senator too (not the least advantage there: status validity is 2 and not only one year).</font>

Yeah - 1K would be nice. Unfortunately, because UA is stingy with COS bonuses, there is no way in he|| that I'd make it. LH, on the others hand, will gladly give me a ton of miles for the paid F flights I'll take on OZ and SQ.

OTOH, I've been lurking on the LH board for a while, and I am a little put-off by the stories of arrogance on the part of LH staff, as well as its extremely poor coach product, and even poorer upgrade possibilities.

Decisions, decisions...

Never had an upgrade problem on LH. I have had to adjust travel by a day or two for award tix.

I can't think of any economy class that is a great product.

If you look at cost of international upgrade (60K miles) compared to cost of award C (80K miles), the answer is obvious.

I suggest the pertinent points are

(A) do you think you will fly international economy on LH? - You could still go on UA if that mattered and get the miles on LH. The only risk is who gets E+ seating?

(B) what is the difference between SEN and your status on UA, or how does UA treat *Gold?

Or, what do you need UA to do for you that *Gold will not get done?

Have to agree 100% that I have never had a problem redeeming miles through my LH M&M account. I have redeemed LH miles for flights within N. America on UA, to Europe and also for Upgrades and I have never had to alter my flight schedule to do so! If every airline was as good about this as LH, it would make my life easier. I usually end up calling LH for awards after I have tried redeeming FF miles on other airlines first. CO is infamous for not having any Standard Awards so I call LH and get on UA.

As for the "attitude" of the LH staff. One thing we need to keep in mind is that this is just the nature of most Germans. (I know being 50% German and having grown-up and lived there!) Germans have never been known for their "kiss butt" fake attitude.

Finally, I feel the Economy product on LH is in line with most other carriers. Alot of UA people complain that there is no E+ seating but this is also not offered on other carriers.

Overall, I think LH M&M is a great program! Earning miles is easy with all the class bonuses and the redemption is great. I have looked at changing to UA or other programs as well, but I think LH is the best around.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by christianj: (excerpt)
Have to agree 100% that I have never had a problem redeeming miles through my LH M&M account. I have redeemed LH miles for flights within N. America on UA, </font>


Thanks for this feedback. that is my one doubt about M&M - how easy to redeem on UA intra-US flights, can dates be changed etc. Have you changed dates on UA-only US roundtrips via M&M? how many times can you change, what are the rules, costs, etc?

While i prefer UA E+ over LH Y, i'm not so beholden to UA MP itself and have considered shifting (or recommending others to shift based on their travel patterns).

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by uastarflyer:
[B]
Thanks for this feedback. that is my one doubt about M&M - how easy to redeem on UA intra-US flights, can dates be changed etc. Have you changed dates on UA-only US roundtrips via M&M? how many times can you change, what are the rules, costs, etc? B]</font>

I am not sure how easy or hard it is to make changes to award reservations but here is an example of an award reservation I have on UA using my LH M&M points:

Was trying to make a reservation for 2 people to go from BWI to PSP over Halloween this year. Did the standard thing an called CO first since I somehow need to use the miles I have with them. After finding out that CO didn't have ANYTHING awailable as usual close to the times I wanted to travel I called LH M&M line. Asked for the exact dates I wanted and she confirmed that the flights were available at 25k a piece through DEN. Flight and Layover times were great! She even reserved isle seats for me. Once I got the tickets from LH, I called UA to see if I could get E+ seats. (I had neglected to ask LH representative for specific E+ rows during the reservation.) UA rep. looked up my M&M account and saw that I had Star Alliance Silver status and she changed the seats to E+ seats without a problem. Worked out great as usual. I assume that LH would have booked the E+ seats for me as well if I had only asked them to do so.

Overall things can't get any easier! I have never had to change tickets/flights on an award reservation so someone else will have to answer that part of your question for you.

christianj, thanks for the specific explanation. it sounds like i can make the recommendation of M&M to a U.S. based flyer that will be flying extensively internationally on LH but would want leisure awards for internal-US travel.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by uastarflyer:

christianj, thanks for the specific explanation. it sounds like i can make the recommendation of M&M to a U.S. based flyer that will be flying extensively internationally on LH but would want leisure awards for internal-US travel.</font>

I would if anyone asked me! That is basically the boat I am in. US resident with frequent full fare Business Class travel to Europe on LH or *A airlines.

I then use the points for all types of award reservations including flights in N. America on UA ...... soon on US as well!

Also keep in mind that, with LH SEN status, you would be able to access the UA RCC domestically. That's a nice benefit.

I would echo others that you should go for LH SEN status. Particularly with paid F flights! SEN's can reserve EconomyPlus seats on United, which are (IMO) more suitable for trans-atlantic flights than LH economy.

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"There are those who travel, and those who travel well."

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by JohnnyP:
Also keep in mind that, with LH SEN status, you would be able to access the UA RCC domestically. That's a nice benefit.
</font>

Are you certain of that?

I thought that *was* a nice benefit, but no more. LH SENs only get access to domestic RCCs if their domestic segment is part of an itinerary that includes international travel (i.e. the same as UA PE non RCC card holders).

When flying and earning miles on LH, don't forget they still have a 1000 mi. min.! Nice feature for any short hops.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Quokka:
Are you certain of that?

I thought that *was* a nice benefit, but no more. LH SENs only get access to domestic RCCs if their domestic segment is part of an itinerary that includes international travel (i.e. the same as UA PE non RCC card holders).

</font>

At least in Spetember there was no problem with access (in 7 different locations) - even on arrival without another boarding pass - albeight asking nicely.

It was rumoured earlier in the year that this was to be cut - however for the majority it does not seem to be forced.

Cheers

Thomas

As an infrequent flyer (leisure traveler) I am bothered by the fact that LH mile expire 3 years from the date that you receive them, but w/UA they never expire as long as you have activity in your account every 3 years.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Quokka:
Are you certain of that?</font>

The RCC did clamp down on *G members traveling in the US on itineraries not part of an "international" trip... however, after a month on that tune, they backed out of the new policy.



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"There are those who travel, and those who travel well."

I thought that *was* a nice benefit, but no more. LH SENs only get access to domestic RCCs if their domestic segment is part of an itinerary that includes international travel (i.e. the same as UA PE non RCC card holders).

They (UA) tried to do that for about two months, but had to step back. No it is entry again on UA domestic flight segments for all StarGold status holders except their own.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by loomis:
As an infrequent flyer (leisure traveler) I am bothered by the fact that LH mile expire 3 years from the date that you receive them, but w/UA they never expire as long as you have activity in your account every 3 years.</font>