Hilton HHonors - Hilton must be fat cats

:cool:
well spg has their stay 3 times get 2 nights plus their yet TBA special 4th Q promo^^

hyatt has FFN again-always fab^

where is hiltons promo??
gee they must have their hotels full-NOT try this for a great sydney deal

http://www.hiltonpremiumclub.com/offers/$175%20syd%20Voucher%20sept.htm

Hilton hasn't had anything for ages and one can believe that this has to do something with the new ownership structure. However, to my observation hotels are very well booked at least in the business centres and it does not appear unlikely that they took the decision not to use any promos for the sake of giving business travellers more points for hotels that are very well booked anyway.

Y'aw jes wanna join up 'eir Hilton Racin' Team: Gol' for faw nahts! ;)

(Expect to get your card 16-18 months after joining. I've tried multiple specials for Sydney and have NEVER been able to get a night on one of the special rates. ;))

I do get quite a few Hawaii offers, but they are mostly $$$ off or targetted properties rather than a system-wide promo. I did notice that some properties have had double points/miles going on for a while. O'Hare comes to mind, but then I have not seen it at any other hotel I stayed... so, I very much agree - very few incentives offered.

Well, lets face it Hilton has changed its marketing strategy.

They seem to be making an effort to ensure that the HH program is carried out at all hotels World-Wide (which I think is a very good thing). This would ensure consistency across the brand and increase the loyalty of those that stay at their hotels.

Getting "free" points is nice but lets face it nothing is really ever free.....Hilton seems to be aiming at loyalty due to services consistently provided (ie value for the money) versus other programs offering more points.

The comment another poster made is also true from my perspective....Hilton Hotels seem fairly full to me....perhaps they have increased their marketing efforts to attract business functions/meetings/events? Anyway, its a business decision and I think everyone is aware of the recent approach.....

The HH properties seem no fuller or less fuller than the nearby competition but but the prices are almost higher and the bennies are less. I have not stayed at a HH prop in months and months. My average nightly cost is 20%-30% less at SPG, Hyatt, Choice and Marriott props and overall I have accumulated 5 free nights in various other hotel programs where-as it would not equal even 1 free night at HH props. Blackstone is really screwing those HH loyalists.

MisterNice

They seem to be making an effort to ensure that the HH program is carried out at all hotels World-Wide (which I think is a very good thing). This would ensure consistency across the brand and increase the loyalty of those that stay at their hotels.


The least benefits carried out chainwide? Doesn't sound appealing for me.

Although I have more than 300+ hotel nights this year, it seems that I might drop to Gold next year with Hilton.

The problem is that IC RA, SPG PLT, Hyatt DIA and to even some extend Marriott PLT offer me far better promotional opportunities. IC RA/SPG PLT benefits are too way beyond whatever Hilton gives out to Diamonds.

Although I have more than 300+ hotel nights this year, it seems that I might drop to Gold next year with Hilton.

.

I am puzzled!

If you spend 300+ nights in Hotels, why on earth would you worry about promotions that would earn you extra (albeit) free nights.

For the first time in years I am not participating in Hyatt FFN promotion because I have been away from home so much this year that I just can't face any extra (even vacation) nights in hotels.

If you spend 300+ nights in Hotels, why on earth would you worry about promotions that would earn you extra (albeit) free nights.

For the first time in years I am not participating in Hyatt FFN promotion because I have been away from home so much this year that I just can't face any extra (even vacation) nights in hotels.

If I can recall right we went through this same question last year?

The reason why I do care about the free nights is that I take extensive vacations. Just finished i.e. my 3 months summer vacation (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10307330&postcount=19). My total vacation time, not counting in long weekends here in the US, is about four and a half months.

So I earn here in the US and burn in Europe and some rather expensive locations in Asia.

My goal with Hyatt's FFN this year is 20+ FFN's that I will burn in Europe/Asia in February during my winter vacation.

Hilton hasn't had anything for ages and one can believe that this has to do something with the new ownership structure. However, to my observation hotels are very well booked at least in the business centres and it does not appear unlikely that they took the decision not to use any promos for the sake of giving business travellers more points for hotels that are very well booked anyway. That is my thinking also.

Y'aw jes wanna join up 'eir Hilton Racin' Team: Gol' for faw nahts! ;)

(Expect to get your card 16-18 months after joining. I've tried multiple specials for Sydney and have NEVER been able to get a night on one of the special rates. ;))

The SYD Hilton is a terrible place. Tiny rooms ...
Better to stay at the Westin there.

The HH properties seem no fuller or less fuller than the nearby competition but but the prices are almost higher and the bennies are less. I have not stayed at a HH prop in months and months. My average nightly cost is 20%-30% less at SPG, Hyatt, Choice and Marriott props and overall I have accumulated 5 free nights in various other hotel programs where-as it would not equal even 1 free night at HH props. Blackstone is really screwing those HH loyalists.

MisterNice

Greetings
Appreciate the feedback
I don't happen to agree with some of your statements
Have seen high rates and low room rates across all brands in or out of the Hilton family of hotels.
I let the market, brands and program dictate my final decisions by a wide group of variables besides price alone though a very important factor without question.
IMO it is also way to early to make unfair statements about what the folks at Hilton/Blackstone do but screwing clients is not something any rational traveler could easily justify in a program that allows double dipping and has many other desirable options
Including a generous credit card bonus and discount for multi-night redemptions in their better properties all for using the co branded Amex among others.Sure many of us would like to see less targeted promos.......

But the most important thing that this great sometimes under appreciated program brings to the table is 100% brand assurance and guest satisfaction when you stay in any of their hotels
Something I would kill for in a handful of the more popular over rated programs.
Which at the end of the day means with Hilton you are getting exactly what you pay for or more.
Although we all love generous promotions buying in trust from a highly responsible travel partner means my investment in their hotels and program guarantee me the best investment in any program I can do business with.

And that is from someone who has earned over ten million hotel points in Hyatt Gold Passport, SPG, Priority Club,Hilton and others combined. Let’s give Blackstone and the powers that be a chance to see how they do over the next few years.
The best may be yet to come though nothing is certain
They have already as I am sure you know increased award redemption for most members brilliantly with the more recent lifting of capacity controls and blackout dates on standard rooms.

Years ago I measured everything in point and mile earnings promotionally today I would say trust and getting great value are first or tied equally with promotional return. So it is in the total relationship for this traveler when it really comes down to the finish line. Some hotels deliver some don’t and I can say that about every brand I stay in. In the end we all vote with our wallets and feet where our own personal needs are best met.

Hilton delivers for me more often then not across a wide spectrum of programs to choose from out there.
I am holding out hope that more opportunities from a solid program are yet to come.My two cents :)
Cheers

777 GLOBAL MILE HOUND, GREAT COMMENTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!
I am so glad that a Hilton loyalist is standing up and giving Hilton credit where credit is due. I see SPG loyalist defending that program even when it is ridiculous to do so.
Hilton is one of the great hotel chains (not the greatest maybe but in the mix).
My two cents!

The HH properties seem no fuller or less fuller than the nearby competition but but the prices are almost higher and the bennies are less. I have not stayed at a HH prop in months and months. My average nightly cost is 20%-30% less at SPG, Hyatt, Choice and Marriott props and overall I have accumulated 5 free nights in various other hotel programs where-as it would not equal even 1 free night at HH props. Blackstone is really screwing those HH loyalists.

MisterNice

I agree. When a person has a choice of where to stay, the choice very well may be to spend the night with the chain offering the best value.

Here's an admittedly simplistic example......anyone can stay two nights at Hilton and get some points out of the deal. If you're elite, you'll also get breakfast and, likely, an upgrade. If you instead stay two nights at Hyatt, you'll also get some points (plus other benefits as elite), but you'll also get a free night's stay.

All things being equal in the above scenario (i.e., I recognize Hyatt has far fewer properties), can you blame someone for choosing Hyatt? Alternatively, once FFN ends, can you blame that same person for choosing Hilton?

Hilton may choose to never offer another systemwide promotion. It's not a likely scenario, but it's their right. Customers have their own choices to make, however, and it very well may be to a competitor.

777 GLOBAL MILE HOUND, GREAT COMMENTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!
I am so glad that a Hilton loyalist is standing up and giving Hilton credit where credit is due. I see SPG loyalist defending that program even when it is ridiculous to do so.
Hilton is one of the great hotel chains (not the greatest maybe but in the mix).
My two cents!

Thanks for the post and kind words of support
Your observations and those of my own mirrror each other.
Well said.
Can not blame someone staying at a Hyatt with this new systemwide promotion.Its a blockbuster
Hyatt certainly has a fantastic promotion right now with every two stays (Faster Free Nights is back) equaling a free night plus the usual earnings and any point bonuses.

That said see what happens should you have a problem at a Hyatt Hotel
You are at the mercy of the property to resolve it ( to their credit many are very good to be fair in solving concerns when they arise)or trying to resolve through Hyatt Consumer Affairs.
There was a time when Hyatt was as good as Hilton.No longer in my experience and observation of others
Its hit or miss or for lack of better words sometimes at your own risk

Once again I will put my money on any Hilton family of hotels property.
Guest Assistance will make it right if the property doesn't first.

The reason why I do care about the free nights is that I take extensive vacations. Just finished i.e. my 3 months summer vacation (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10307330&postcount=19). My total vacation time, not counting in long weekends here in the US, is about four and a half months.

So I earn here in the US and burn in Europe and some rather expensive locations in Asia.

You must be an accountant. 300+ paid nights using programs, long weekend with free stays and four and a half months vacations - you invented to year with at least 500 days. I could realy need that, it would increase our revenue substantially :D

You must be an accountant. 300+ paid nights using programs, long weekend with free stays and four and a half months vacations - you invented to year with at least 500 days. I could realy need that, it would increase our revenue substantially :D

Not really. This year I haven't actually used that many free nights. I could go through my records but it must be less than 20 or so.

Stays here (in the US) are normally too cheap to waste points. I only use points when it makes sense i.e. last year I used more than 700K+ PC points for $6500 in Any Hotel Any Time GC's.

This year I have only spent less than a week at my residence.

Wow - Lots of FT heavyweights on this thread... but I'll weigh in with my opinion anyway ;).

I wish I could say that I receive more consistant service from Hilton vs. Starwood, Hyatt or Marriott but my own experience doesn't support that conclusion. I wish I could say that the Diamond Desk is better, more accomodating or more thorough than the SPG Platinum desk, but again that isn't the case in my experience. I wish I could say that Hilton Hotels are superior to similarly priced Starwood or Hyatt offerings, but in the markets I visit (99% U.S. and Canada) that also isn't the case.

At the end of the day, what I have is 61 nights YTD spent at Starwood with total earnings of 190k Starpoints (3.2k per night average with no credit card contribution), and 9 nights with Hilton for 18k in YTD point accumulation (2k per night on average) and 5k in Airline miles. Seven of the Hilton nights were as a lowly Silver member, but had I been Diamond the entire time I still would not have earned an equivalent number HH Points as Starpoints with SPG. I value SPG points 3 times higher than equivalent HH points, so my YTD earnings are 3-4x higher with SPG than with Hilton.

The difference? Lots of ongoing, stackable and highly rewarding promotions with SPG. No promotions with Hilton for more than two years running. The gulf will widen further this fall with Starwood's Q4 promotion unless Hilton does something brilliant (not holding my breath).

For FT members who can overlook the lack of competitive promotions and value HH service over other chains, more power to you. If I also experienced bad or inconsistant service elsewhere and great service with Hilton, I would probably make a similar choice. For the HH faithful, I suspect that it gets a little tiring to read yet another thread digging at Hilton for their lack of promotions, but this is FT after all! ;)

SG

First... does anyone remember when last year's Q4 HHonors 2x Points promo was announced? I did very well with that promo.

Secondly, as much I really want to try other programs, and have the opportunity to due to status match (Hyatt Diamond through 2010) and other status promos (Mariott Gold through AirFrance) I really can't bring myself to.

I think full-service Hyatt properties have far better service than equivalent Hiltons and I really love the Hyatt Place properties, but they aren't located everywhere I go and are usually 20-30% more expensive. I'll likely pick up a couple of nights through FFN but not much otherwise. Diamond club is the one program I would love to switch to but the number/price of properties don't fit my needs.

Every limited-service or extended-stay type Marriott I've stayed has been long overdue for renovation, especially Courtyard properties. Their website also doesn't seem to be the easiest to use. Marriott properties seem to show up in the cities I travel to, but not enough to facilitate mattress hopping.

I'll admit I haven't given SPG a fair chance, but mainly due to the # of midscale properties. If an Aloft or Element suddenly appeared in every city I traveled to it might be an easy switch to make, but until then, not so much.

The one program that would probably be able to replace HHonors with an adequate number of midscale properties to earn/maintain points/status along with higher-end properties to spend/enjoy points/status in would be Priority Club. They also have some great promos. That said, their elite perks aren't the best (outside of RA) and 50 nights a year paid in Holiday Inns really doesn't sound too appealing. I'll take a Hampton over a Holiday Inn any day.

I use paid business stays in midscale properties to earn status and points to enjoy/spend for leisure travel in higher-end properties. For this, HHonors still seems to be the best strike between # of properties and elite benefits. Promos are harder to come across but they do exist. Double-dip and the generous fixed-miles offering from BMI allows me to quickly earn nights AND flights purely from hotel stays.

I guess it's the balance that keeps me in HHonors... I wish the Hyatt Diamond club program would work in the cities I travel to... I could make the Priority Club program work but their midscale properties don't appeal to me... SPG's midscale properties are nearly non-existent... and most Marriott properties I've stayed in are long overdue for renovation. These reasons may not all apply to everyone, but they quickly explain why the balance HHonors offers keeps me around, even with the promos that are widely available elsewhere.

The one program that would probably be able to replace HHonors with an adequate number of midscale properties to earn/maintain points/status along with higher-end properties to spend/enjoy points/status in would be Priority Club. They also have some great promos. That said, their elite perks aren't the best (outside of RA) and 50 nights a year paid in Holiday Inns really doesn't sound too appealing. I'll take a Hampton over a Holiday Inn any day.
.

Actually you don't have to stay 50 nights to get Plat status in Priority Club. You can get it by earning 60K points in a year and ALL earnings count - promotions included. They have a huge rack of promotions which are often stackable as shown in one of the more famous threads: IC Master Promo thred
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=771210 Its very very easy to rack of a lot of points and get status very rapidly. Further still, their redemption options are also often discounted and extremely flexible - including gift cards useable at other hotels.

That said though to be totally fair IHG properties are extremely un-even - especially traditional Holiday Inns. HIs are often rather old and run-down - I tend to avoid them. HI Express properties are pretty close to par with Hamptons though and I've seen a much higher upgrade rate than with Hilton. I strongly suspect that the premium of the program will wane over time as they upgrade and/or dispose of the older HI locations but for right now they are hungry and willing to earn your business.

Hilton, on the other hand, seems to be getting indifferent. They basically cut us 'cold turkey' from promos. Further still there is a lot of evidence that they are having issues with Franchisees that essentially thumb their nose at the program. There are Hilton properties that won't award points, won't take award stays, selectively apply benefits, and so on. I don't see that with IHG or the other programs. There are indications that they are even hostile to this very forum. I can only hope they change course sometime soon as I'll be seriously reconsidering how I allocate my business next year. Between the lack of promos, the changes in the earning calendar, and the snooty properties the value proposition of Hhonnors is not what it used to be.

It really depends how you define value proposition.
Just promotions/point earnings?
For me it is value of that point currency the ability to earn it, the ability to redeem it when and where I want it.
The choice of quality consistent properties at all price spectrums and the ability to recover from bad stay experiences in one program with a wide ranging excellent collection of hotels.
If I have a rotten stay and earn a bit more points and lose my investment in that stay I have not earned any value at all whatever program I earn with.
I've simply lost all value and my hard earned dollars No matter what I earn in program currency.Then there is the memory of the bad stay
Which is why it so important for all hotel companies to stand by guest satisfaction.Something the HH and PC folks do reasonably well

I am a huge Priority Club fan for its excellent point opportunities
However when you strip the Royal Ambassador tier away which will likely happen for many one day (self included) the emperor is naked on too many levels.
That said for me it’s HH #1
SPG # 2 and Hyatt #3 PC in at # 4.
Hyatt has declined in recent years with declining customer service on many levels however at least they are still in the US and based in Omaha. Stay certificates and point redemption rooms are still winning combination for the informed insiders on how to achieve extraordinary value. Especially with Faster Free Nights

As I remain RA currently I put PC up there tied for number one
However I rarely step foot out of an InterContinental hotel where as with the Hilton family of brands you will find me in a wide variety of their typically consistent brands/properties that serve my purpose. They have some great folks behind the scenes and it appears luxury and other new new brands will likely be added under the Hilton Umbrella
Staying tuned for now to see what comes down the point and mile trail
So far still good unlike the airline programs where I have cut back on except those programs that deliver their promise in a fair and reasonable way.
Cheers

The HH properties seem no fuller or less fuller than the nearby competition

If Hilton removed system wide promo's and maintain the same occupancy - would you say that's a bad business decision?

but the prices are almost higher and the bennies are less.

Yes, in some instances rates are higher, but on average I still find Hilton competitive on rate.

Yes, less bennies - and we're free to hop for better bennies elsewhere, but once bennies are fulfilled then what do we base our stays on?

Blackstone is really screwing those HH loyalists.

Not sure where this came from. Promotions are not a God-given right or an ongoing published benefit. If/when Hilton/Blackstone starts changing published benefits (HHonors redemption, perks, etc) then that's a different issue.

If Hilton removed system wide promo's and maintain the same occupancy - would you say that's a bad business decision?

Yes, in some instances rates are higher, but on average I still find Hilton competitive on rate. Yes, less bennies - and we're free to hop for better bennies elsewhere, but once bennies are fulfilled then what do we base our stays on?

Not sure where this came from. Promotions are not a God-given right or an ongoing published benefit. If/when Hilton/Blackstone starts changing published benefits (HHonors redemption, perks, etc) then that's a different issue.

For HH their earnings will probable increase initially, but certainly decrease longer term. Many travelers do compare pricing including other bennies such as points, free breakfasts, free internet etc. Other people keep doing same-old, same-old. Since the first of the this year HH pricing has zoomed and promos are basically zilch. I have stayed at the HH competition hotels over 90% of the time at a bottom line savings of at least 40%. Their free nights are easier to attain, easier to use and I dont need to show a printed cert. The HH free breakfast is nice but many others have it too or can be had at a nearby restaurant for $6 or less. The bottled water is worth 40 cents/bottle max and I toss the crappy 1/2 oz snacks. At a Marriott CY outside DC a code for being a member of their loyalty program knocked about 50% off the room price saving about $80/night. HH has no similar code. etc etc etc

MisterNice

ps: I am HH Diamond for years and years with over 1M HH points and travel 50% of the time both for business and pleasure on my dime and company dime

The reason why I do care about the free nights is that I take extensive vacations. Just finished i.e. my 3 months summer vacation (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10307330&postcount=19). My total vacation time, not counting in long weekends here in the US, is about four and a half months.


Darn! I want your job. 4.5 months of vacation a year - sounds awesome. I'm jealous :)

I have stayed at the HH competition hotels over 90% of the time at a bottom line savings of at least 40%.

Wow, 40% is a huge differential.

Even if HHonors had comparable bennies would that sway your stay decision with a 40% differential? Even if Hilton had FFN, that might be hard to justify.
(I haven't seen that kind of rate gap - rather I usually see Marriott as the rate leader - but by 20% or so. The rate gap will probably vary market-by-market, and not applicable for special rates that 50% or more customers don't know about or don't qualify for.)

I like and tend to move with bennies, but it's possible that Hilton may only have only a minority of customers/travelers/revenue that are swayed by bennies as many customers may value other published benefits more (free weekend breakfast, HHonors award availability, HHonors point values, coverage, etc). If that's the case, then offering broad based promotions are very expensive ways to keep a minority of customers/travelers/revenue.