Other Credit Card Programs - Companion card(s) to AMEX

I have -

- AMEX Gold Rewards Plus - $150 annual fee, balance paid in full every month, $2400/month average

- AMEX Gold Business - $75 annual fee, balance paid in full every month, $1000/month average – I’m a business owner and like the ability to separate expenses onto separate business and personal cards.

- Member Rewards enabled on both accounts – 229K points currently

Travel Profile – I’m really only interested in travel miles. My wife and I hate fancy hotels/resorts/cruises etc and our idea of a real upscale vacation is Petite St Vincent where there are no phones, TV, people, . . . We fly to China two or three times a year and we recently “rewarded” ourselves with a five day hike of the Napali coast of Kauai. Get the idea? Our reward cards need to get us there – that’s all.

I had a Quicken Visa through Citi for over ten years but Citi transferred it to Chase a couple of months ago and the first month with Chase was so bad I cancelled it and now need a companion card to my AMEX for those times when only Mastercard or Visa is accepted.

As I’ve studied my options I've narrowed the most obvious strategy down to the following –

1. Get AMEX Starwood Preferred Guest (SPG) personal and corporate cards to replace my existing AMEX cards, let the AMEX Member Reward (MR) points on my current AMEX cards dwindle away and then cancel them. The annual fees for the AMEX SPGs are only $45 (first year free) and the Starpoints seem to be much more flexible than MR points and effectively earn 1.25 miles per $ spent.

2. As a companion card – and that’s what this post is actually about, get a –

a. personal Citi PremierPass Elite Mastercard - $75 annual fee, 2 points per $ spent, fixed awards,

- - or a

b. DinersClub Mastercard - $95 first year annual fee (possibility of retention bonuses thereafter), 1 point per $ spent, excellent transfer to airline mileage programs

and maybe get a

3. Capital One card for their free currency conversions – either the -

a. Capital One No Hassle Miles Rewards card – no annual fee, 1.25 miles per $ spent

- - or the

b. Capital One No Hassle Miles Ultra for Professionals Mastercard - $39 annual fee, 2 miles per $ spent

What do the frequent flyers out there think of my overall plan? Any advice on which of the companion card options I should select?

Also, I've thought about getting two companion cards instead of one – a Mastercard and a Visa. All of these companion card options are Mastercard except Capital One No Hassle Miles Rewards cards which can be either Visa or Mastercard. The problem is that Capital One won’t tell me which one it will be until I’ve applied and the card has been issued. Maybe someone out there knows more about this than what Cap One has told me?

Gosh it's great having a forum like this. Thanks in advance for helping me think this through.

I have -

- AMEX Gold Rewards Plus - $150 annual fee, balance paid in full every month, $2400/month average

- AMEX Gold Business - $75 annual fee, balance paid in full every month, $1000/month average – I’m a business owner and like the ability to separate expenses onto separate business and personal cards.

- Member Rewards enabled on both accounts – 229K points currently

Travel Profile – I’m really only interested in travel miles. My wife and I hate fancy hotels/resorts/cruises etc and our idea of a real upscale vacation is Petite St Vincent where there are no phones, TV, people, . . . We fly to China two or three times a year and we recently “rewarded” ourselves with a five day hike of the Napali coast of Kauai. Get the idea? Our reward cards need to get us there – that’s all.

I had a Quicken Visa through Citi for over ten years but Citi transferred it to Chase a couple of months ago and the first month with Chase was so bad I cancelled it and now need a companion card to my AMEX for those times when only Mastercard or Visa is accepted.

As I’ve studied my options I've narrowed the most obvious strategy down to the following –

1. Get AMEX Starwood Preferred Guest (SPG) personal and corporate cards to replace my existing AMEX cards, let the AMEX Member Reward (MR) points on my current AMEX cards dwindle away and then cancel them. The annual fees for the AMEX SPGs are only $45 (first year free) and the Starpoints seem to be much more flexible than MR points and effectively earn 1.25 miles per $ spent.

2. As a companion card – and that’s what this post is actually about, get a –

a. personal Citi PremierPass Elite Mastercard - $75 annual fee, 2 points per $ spent, fixed awards,

- - or a

b. DinersClub Mastercard - $95 first year annual fee (possibility of retention bonuses thereafter), 1 point per $ spent, excellent transfer to airline mileage programs

and maybe get a

3. Capital One card for their free currency conversions – either the -

a. Capital One No Hassle Miles Rewards card – no annual fee, 1.25 miles per $ spent

- - or the

b. Capital One No Hassle Miles Ultra for Professionals Mastercard - $39 annual fee, 2 miles per $ spent

What do the frequent flyers out there think of my overall plan? Any advice on which of the companion card options I should select?

Also, I've thought about getting two companion cards instead of one – a Mastercard and a Visa. All of these companion card options are Mastercard except Capital One No Hassle Miles Rewards cards which can be either Visa or Mastercard. The problem is that Capital One won’t tell me which one it will be until I’ve applied and the card has been issued. Maybe someone out there knows more about this than what Cap One has told me?

Gosh it's great having a forum like this. Thanks in advance for helping me think this through.

I think that you have your thoughts together...a few more thoughts:

(a) I agree with SPG AMEX over AMEX Green/Gold.
(b) Diners vs. Citi Premier Pass really depends upon several factors:
- Diners earns unlimited points per year; Citi Premier Pass is limited
- Diners has great program flexibility if you are actually looking for miles for upgrades
- Citi Thank You (i.e. the Citi Premier Pass rewards program) has so many ways to earn points, e.g. Citi bank account, other Citi cards
- Many people get several Citi cards for the initial bonus points
(c) Capital One's no forex transaction fee is a good deal. However, many people do not like their customer service. Also, they can be stingy on credit limits.

WELCOME TO FT!!

I'm in agreement with everything stated above, except that SPG biz card is better than Amex Gold biz card. The gold biz card offered now by AMEX has an annual fee of $125 so it may be different than the one you have. The gold biz card we have earns 5k bonus points after $20k spend and another 20k bonus points after $50k spend - so in effect after $50k spend we have 75k MR points which is 1.5 points per $ (SPG as you stated only gives you up to 1.25 points per $ and that's if you transfer to an airline). So if you have this deal with your current AMEX Gold biz card and you meet the spend requirements I wouldn't be so quick to change. Don't get me wrong, I still think SPG AMEX is a great product, but if you meet the above requirements the gold biz card is still better for you.

WELCOME TO FT!!

I'm in agreement with everything stated above, except that SPG biz card is better than Amex Gold biz card. The gold biz card offered now by AMEX has an annual fee of $125 so it may be different than the one you have. The gold biz card we have earns 5k bonus points after $20k spend and another 20k bonus points after $50k spend - so in effect after $50k spend we have 75k MR points which is 1.5 points per $ (SPG as you stated only gives you up to 1.25 points per $ and that's if you transfer to an airline). So if you have this deal with your current AMEX Gold biz card and you meet the spend requirements I wouldn't be so quick to change. Don't get me wrong, I still think SPG AMEX is a great product, but if you meet the above requirements the gold biz card is still better for you.


I think that its a bit trickier than your comments above. The AMEX spend bonuses are awarded based upon annual spending at $5k and $50k. There is no additional bonus beyond $50k. The SPG bonuses are awarded on transfers, not annual spending. You can carry over the 5,000 mile transfer bonus benefit from year to year. Therefore, if you spend less than $50k you will earn more points/miles with SPG AMEX. If you spend more than $100k per year, you will make more points/miles with SPG AMEX.

Once again, I agree. (Correction to your post: bonuses on amex gold are awarded at $20k and $50k - not $5k and $50k.) But, that's why each person needs to evaluate which card works best for them based on their annual spend. Someone who spends between $50k and, let's say, $80-$90k would still be better off with the gold card than spg. Definitely, if you spend under $50k or beyond $100k you should stick to spg. As the saying goes "to each their own".

(b) Diners vs. Citi Premier Pass really depends upon several factors:
- Diners earns unlimited points per year; Citi Premier Pass is limited
- Diners has great program flexibility if you are actually looking for miles for upgrades
- Citi Thank You (i.e. the Citi Premier Pass rewards program) has so many ways to earn points, e.g. Citi bank account, other Citi cards
- Many people get several Citi cards for the initial bonus points
Still not sure what to do for the companion card. Our interest is getting there by air and upgrades are not important to us. We're in Dallas - AA's hub - but haven't had any trouble transferring MR points to Mexicana and then booking AA travel with them. For China we use United or AA or one of their code shares. We are not interested in opening a bunch of accounts or playing the Citi upfront point games - we can do that aside from this decision.

Does either Citi PremierPass Elite Mastercard or DinersClub Mastercard standout over the over when considered this way?

Someone who spends between $50k and, let's say, $80-$90k would still be better off with the gold card than spg. Definitely, if you spend under $50k or beyond $100k you should stick to spg. As the saying goes "to each their own".Thanks FriedB but that's too tricky for this decision. We may want to do something like that on the side (with an extra card) to maximize our points but for this decision we are looking for a primary AMEX and I guess it looks like SPG should be the one.

Still not sure what to do for the companion card. Our interest is getting there by air and upgrades are not important to us. We're in Dallas - AA's hub - but haven't had any trouble transferring MR points to Mexicana and then booking AA travel with them. For China we use United or AA or one of their code shares. We are not interested in opening a bunch of accounts or playing the Citi upfront point games - we can do that aside from this decision.

Does either Citi PremierPass Elite Mastercard or DinersClub Mastercard standout over the over when considered this way?

SPG transfers to AA at 1:1 or 20,000:25,000. SPG transfers to United at 1:2. That is not very advantageous.

Diners Club transfers to AA at 1:1, but Diners does not transfer to United.

Looks like you picked SPG AMEX as your primary card.

Try a Citibank card for your MC/Visa. Research the redemption for international flights. I am quite pleased with domestic redemption:

(1) Earn > 1 pt per $
(2) Redeem for a ticket on many different airlines
(3) Earn airline miles for the flight
(4) Flights can be upgraded with airline

If you like the Citi ThankYou program consider making it your primary card. You can also get a Citi AMEX Platinum which earn 3-5 points per $ for 2 years.

SPG transfers to United at 1:2. That is not very advantageous.

Diners Club transfers to AA at 1:1, but Diners does not transfer to United.I'm aware that United has become FF unfriendly as of late, but does any card offer a better deal with United?Try a Citibank card for your MC/Visa. Research the redemption for international flights. I am quite pleased with domestic redemption:

(1) Earn > 1 pt per $
(2) Redeem for a ticket on many different airlines
(3) Earn airline miles for the flight
(4) Flights can be upgraded with airlineGreat advice - thank you for taking the time to bring me up-to-date. I'll definitely research the international redemption rates since that's where most of our tickets are for. Concerning the domestic redemption rates - are they generally equivalent to the respective airline mileage programs with regard to the $$ spent to get a ticket, or better, or worse in your experience?

If you like the Citi ThankYou program consider making it your primary card. You can also get a Citi AMEX Platinum which earn 3-5 points per $ for 2 years.That's an interesting option because the inability to transfer points or miles between a primary SPG AMEX and a companion Citi PremierPass card bothers me.

I know this may not be the proper forum for this question - but how does the Citi AMEX compare to the SPG AMEX?

That's an interesting option because the inability to transfer points or miles between a primary SPG AMEX and a companion Citi PremierPass card bothers me.

I know this may not be the proper forum for this question - but how does the Citi AMEX compare to the SPG AMEX?


So...I am not sure that it matters. My point is that Citi is a good candidate for a primary card:

1. For 20,000 points + taxes get a $400 domestic ticket very few restrictions
2. For 100 points per $ get any plane ticket
3. Earn 2+ points per $ on some cards
4. Point earning can be limited on all Citi ThankYou cards (except Chairman)

There are many Citi AMEX cards, if you mean Citi Platinum AMEX:

- $125 per year; first year waived
- Priority Pass membership - 3 free visits for the card holder each year; guests or additional visits are $27 each
- Free membership in Citi Identify monitor (a credit monitoring service)
- 3 pts per $ (5 pts for grocery/drug/gas) for the first 2 years; then 1 pt per $

If you will use the benefits, the card is worth it.

So...I am not sure that it matters. My point is that Citi is a good candidate for a primary card: . . . If you will use the benefits, the card is worth it.Thanks for staying with me on this - I've had my AMEX MR card for 35 years and my Quicken VISA for over ten (until they just transferred it to Chase and I cancelled it.) So I'm probably over thinking this decision.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned in this thread is that my AMEX MembershipReward card is a a charge card and the AMEX SPG and Citi AMEX cards are credit cards. If you always pay your balance (which I do) I guess they seem to be the same but from a credit perspective they are quite different.

Regarding the redemption of ThankYou points, I can't find anything that will allow me to see the TY travel rewards. I'd like to see how many points are required for international tickets for instance - but it seems I've got to already have a Citi TY card to get to that information. "Get a card and then (and only then) we'll allow you to see the benefits" - kind of pisses me off.

Is that right? Or is there some other way to access the TY travel info?

Here's the link where you can view the rewards chart for thank you network. You do not need to have a CITI card to see it.

https://www.thankyou.com/helpTopic.jspx?itemId=10012&topic=Travel%2BRewards

Scroll down until you see the chart. There are also other helpful Q & A's that may be helpful to you, such as the type of accounts/cards you need to have for fixed redemptions - easiest (and fee free) way is to link an Expedia.com account to your TY account. If you have any of the other cards/accounts you don't need to do this.

BTW, SPG points transfer to United and CO at a 2:1 ratio, not 1:2. Meaning that 2 SPG points = 1 United mile not the other way around, which is what was probably meant to be said to begin with. Your points are greatly devalued if you choose to transfer to one of these two mileage programs.

I'm aware that United has become FF unfriendly as of late, but does any card offer a better deal with United?

I believe CHASE offers a United Mileage Plus Visa card with a signup bonus as wells as points per $ spent. I'm not familiar with this card, but if you do a search you'll find plenty of info on it.

Consider the Chase Professional card with cashback. It gives 3% at restaurants, office supply, home improvement and gas stations - 1% everywhere else. It also came with a nice 18 month 0% on purchases (not sure if that is still alive).

Going with cash back on your secondary card means you won't have to worry about a few orphan points that never add up to enough to spend. Every time you hit 5000 points you can redeem them for a $50 statement credit.

Consider the Chase Professional card with cashback.I appreciate the advice Tev, but I'm really after the miles. (And I really don't like Chase - their customer service stinks in my opinion - both Citi and AMEX are far better.)

Here's the link where you can view the rewards chart for thank you network. You do not need to have a CITI card to see it.

https://www.thankyou.com/helpTopic.jspx?itemId=10012&topic=Travel%2BRewards
Thanks FB, that was exactly what I was looking for.