Cathay Pacific Asia Miles - CX switch aircraft SO often on me!

Rant! -

This is flight number FIVE with CX in which they have once again substituted the old F for the scheduled new.
I specifically booked again on a particular date (TPE-NRT) to get the new F and they've whammied us again. This is becoming VERY aggravating! Switched 1 month out. Why can't they SORT IT OUT by now. Interesting that it has always been from new to old and not the reverse.

Rant over.

Don't take it personally. They do it to everyone, and have done since time immemorial. Their mindset is that it's more important to get the flight out on time, so if that means subbing an aircraft in, so be it. And to be brutally honest, the vast majority of passengers would probably agree with them.

I wish they would accelerate their retrofitting programme so these "in-fleet" swaps become less of an occurrence, though.

I'm assuming you were switched out from the 74A into either the 744 or 74J as this is the most common swap of the new into the old equipment. Yeah I know it sucks but until CX has 100% fully configured it's 747s into the new interiors, you are always at risk of getting swapped into the old product whenever you fly on any of the 747 routes.

I guess I have been lucky so far in being 3 out of 3 for the 74A where when I made the original booking, the 74A was listed on my itinerary and remained so when I boarded the flight. I've gotten it on CX255 (Dec 2007), CX870 (Aug 2008), and CX879 (Aug 2008). I've got two more flights currently listed as the 74A for next month (CX251/250). Let's see how those play out.

But if you really want to solidify yourself in getting the new F for these couple of months, I would suggest booking yourself on the long haul route served by the 77A such as JFK and YYZ. And by this winter LAX will also get the 77A (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=857864).

Rant! -

This is flight number FIVE with CX in which they have once again substituted the old F for the scheduled new.
I specifically booked again on a particular date (TPE-NRT) to get the new F and they've whammied us again. This is becoming VERY aggravating! Switched 1 month out. Why can't they SORT IT OUT by now. Interesting that it has always been from new to old and not the reverse.

Rant over.

if it such a problem for I suggest you check out the private jets from TPE they are cheaper than you think

Thanks for the replies!:)

I've got two more flights currently listed as the 74A for next month (CX251/250). Let's see how those play out.

Good luck - hope you keep the 74A. I was dudded last night with CX251 turning into the 74J. Of course, the next flight was a 74A and full.

I'm completely fed up with CX switching as well - they did it to me recently on a LHR flight and phoned to see which seat I wanted on the old config - so I had all day the get worked up about it

I didn't take it well and fired off a letter - why they switch and also questioned why still haven't completed upgrading Regional planes. I finished off by saying that we have a choice and my money follows comfort - SQ, ANA, VS/BA. Its a real shame as CX crew are really great but if Management think that is enough they're wrong - with me a least

I haven't got and don't expect a reply but I'm fed up with CX taking us for granted

A long time ago I purchased two return first class tickets CDG-HKG-SYD for me and my lovelywife to celebrate our 30th wedding aniversary. Booked in A class, departing in a couple of days.
I checked regularly on internet and the CDG-HKG was scheduled as 74A and HKG-SYD as A333. Last week (we depart in a couple of days) I got an email advising me that 74A had been switched to 744 and that 333 had been switched to 333B with no F. They asked me about new seats. I called CX in Paris and said that I was not happy to pay the huge price of A for two and end up flying half the longhauls in biz. I asked to replace my tickets by tickets in D class (biz) and thereby save over US$6000. To be fair, the guys at CX were available (although not apologetic) and called me back promptly. But they said that they could only issue full fare J class tickets because D was now full on both CDG-HKG and HKG-SYD (only one D seat available, not two). I argued that when I bought the tickets there was plenty of D availability, as well as attractive options on other airlines, but that a couple of days before departure I was trapped. I argued that this was their responsability and that they should free one D seat, or that they should give me some discount on my First calss fare. Despite long arguments, they refused to do anything. I understand that CX in Paris has little to do with the ac changes, but I am dispointed that they are so insensitive.

A long time ago I purchased two return first class tickets CDG-HKG-SYD for me and my lovelywife to celebrate our 30th wedding aniversary. Booked in A class, departing in a couple of days.
I checked regularly on internet and the CDG-HKG was scheduled as 74A and HKG-SYD as A333. Last week (we depart in a couple of days) I got an email advising me that 74A had been switched to 744 and that 333 had been switched to 333B with no F. They asked me about new seats. I called CX in Paris and said that I was not happy to pay the huge price of A for two and end up flying half the longhauls in biz. I asked to replace my tickets by tickets in D class (biz) and thereby save over US$6000. To be fair, the guys at CX were available (although not apologetic) and called me back promptly. But they said that they could only issue full fare J class tickets because D was now full on both CDG-HKG and HKG-SYD (only one D seat available, not two). I argued that when I bought the tickets there was plenty of D availability, as well as attractive options on other airlines, but that a couple of days before departure I was trapped. I argued that this was their responsability and that they should free one D seat, or that they should give me some discount on my First calss fare. Despite long arguments, they refused to do anything. I understand that CX in Paris has little to do with the ac changes, but I am dispointed that they are so insensitive.

That really stinks, it's not even like you're being unreasonable...do you have status on CX?

That really stinks, it's not even like you're being unreasonable...do you have status on CX?

No, I am BA emerald. But they could check that I generated big revenues to CX in the past couple of years (mostly in F).

No, I am BA emerald. But they could check that I generated big revenues to CX in the past couple of years (mostly in F).

I don't really know what to say, unfortunately I'm not optimistic. I really think as a customer - and one who clearly gives revenue to CX - they're just screwing you and doing it because they can. Really sucks.

1) Find another airline and go that way

2) File a chargeback with the credit card company and dispute the charge from CX on the grounds that they could not deliver the product that you paid for.

Well did you ask CX what is the downgrade compensation from F to J on the HKG-SYD leg?

They should be able to release the 1 D class seat for you if J is still open.

Christep: CX is perfectly willing to reimburse my tickets; it is fully refundable anyway. But I cannot find an attractive alternative two adys before departure. There were many great ones two months ago when I purchased my tickets.

Iheartny1: I did ask for compensation but they refused. Their point is that they would have to reprice the ticket as two tickets: one RT CDG-HKG in First and one RT HKG-SYD in biz, and the total amount of the two tickets is higher than what i paid for on a RT CDG-SYD. I got nowhere with them and do not wish to lose a huge amount of time in legal argument, unless there are some precedents that I could use.

I understand that CX in Paris has little to do with the ac changes, but I am dispointed that they are so insensitive.

Have you tried talking to someone at CX in Hong Kong? I'm wondering if they would be more open to compensation/opening seats up for you.

Christep: CX is perfectly willing to reimburse my tickets; it is fully refundable anyway. But I cannot find an attractive alternative two adys before departure. There were many great ones two months ago when I purchased my tickets.

Iheartny1: I did ask for compensation but they refused. Their point is that they would have to reprice the ticket as two tickets: one RT CDG-HKG in First and one RT HKG-SYD in biz, and the total amount of the two tickets is higher than what i paid for on a RT CDG-SYD. I got nowhere with them and do not wish to lose a huge amount of time in legal argument, unless there are some precedents that I could use.

I think CX CDG is really stuffing you around. I saw in CUPID before and there is a clear matrix listing out the compensation amounts for downgrades from F to J and J to Y for all city pairs in the CX network. This is the base comepensation and then I assume the local station manager can give out further compensation.

I saw the amounts and it is pretty fair and they normally throw in things such as upgrade certs, lounge admission pass etc.. It is basically a UDB compensation.

There is no way if I am you will leave this and just get a refund. No offence but french people are generally not as flexible. I suggest you call CX in HKG and sort this out. CX HKG can open seats and sort out compensation faster than in CDG.

I think CX CDG is really stuffing you around. I saw in CUPID before and there is a clear matrix listing out the compensation amounts for downgrades from F to J and J to Y for all city pairs in the CX network. This is the base comepensation and then I assume the local station manager can give out further compensation.

I saw the amounts and it is pretty fair and they normally throw in things such as upgrade certs, lounge admission pass etc.. It is basically a UDB compensation.

There is no way if I am you will leave this and just get a refund. No offence but french people are generally not as flexible. I suggest you call CX in HKG and sort this out. CX HKG can open seats and sort out compensation faster than in CDG.

Thank you for the advice IHEARTNY1, I will call HK. Should I just use the main reservation number?
Also, would you mind explaining CUPID & UDB?
Merci

Since you are flying from CDG you should be protected under the european rules. An involuntary downgrade should get you 75% of the ticket price.

Thank you for the advice IHEARTNY1, I will call HK. Should I just use the main reservation number?
Also, would you mind explaining CUPID & UDB?
Merci

CUPID is CX's own reservation system

UDB = Unvol denied boarding.

If you are booked/paid/confirmed in F Class and they can't give you F Class then it can be argued that ir is UDB and you may also be subject to the European protection laws on UDB. However it depends when the airline notify you (I think there are some lime limits as well) But it seems you only havea few days and it may be reasonable to still pursue this.

I think you should call CX reservation in HKG and tell them you have a F Class reservation and explain the situation. Unfortuantely there are no premium hotlines for non MPOs but I d find the reservations/ticketing staff in HKG are pretty switched on.

It just doesn't make sense that they can downgrade you without giving compensation.

Lets say you still take the F Class (despite it is old F Class) from CDG-HKG. The HKG-SYD should definitely be compensated.

Since you are flying from CDG you should be protected under the european rules. An involuntary downgrade should get you 75% of the ticket price.Ah yes - that should cover it. I certainly wouldn't give up on this. Cathay has a duty to honour the contract they made or compensate accordingly.

Brunos,

Hope you get something something back. It is totally unacceptable to have paid for a level of cabin product for the whole trip at the time of transaction and end up having an inferior cabin class for a good portion. It's no different that ordering a full peperoni cheese pizza and the peperoni only ends up on one half while the other half is just plain cheese.

Just keep fighting!

Please let us know how it turns out. I fly CX very seldom but am amazed that this is happening.. :td:

Since you are flying from CDG you should be protected under the european rules. An involuntary downgrade should get you 75% of the ticket price.More here:

European Commission Regulation 261/2004 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Commission_Regulation_261/2004#Upgrades_and_downgrades)


and the actual regs:


REGULATION (EC) No 261/2004 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL (http://europa.eu/eur-lex/pri/en/oj/dat/2004/l_046/l_04620040217en00010007.pdf)

Thanks all for the advice. I just called CX HKG (took a long wait). The charming lady listened , put me on hold and came back to me saying that this matter had to be handled by CX Paris as they issued the ticket. I am totally overworked before departing, so I guess I will simply fax a complaint letter to the CEO in France and in Hong Kong. What irritates me is that I think that I was unusually reasonable in my request (I did not ask for compensation, simply switching to a biz D class ticket).

even as a DM I haven't received any reply to my comments/complaints sent to them either on-board or on their website, a month or two ago...I even called MPO after a month or so and repeated all my comments/complaints to the supervisor (a clear list of total 7 items I think) and he promised to have the relevant departments call me back PLUS email me back - so far after another 2-3 weeks I haven't heard anything. their whole service mentality is breaking down and I am completely disappointed. I am now just flying them when I have no real choice for HKG-PVG/PEK - otherwise, I have been taking my business completely elsewhere already. I guess they don't quite care my small revenue of only maybe half a million HKD a year.

tedhl, you are not the only one. I have sent several emails to them in the past 8 months and all have fallen on deaf ears. I too have also tried to follow up on some of them by calling MPO and despite the promises of this and that, I still have not gotten anything back from them. :td:

It's been a while since I last flew coach class with CX (last one was Jan 2007) but I have a Diamond member friend who mainly flies in the back of the cabin and he has told me that in more than 10 sectors he has taken with CX in economy so far this year, not once was he greeted by the ISM nor by any other member of the cabin crews.

Following your kind advices, I kept pushing and spent part of night drafting a nice complain leter to CX CEO in Paris that I faxed. This morning I got a nice call from the head of reservation in Paris (nice english lady). After a couple of iterations between her and the CEO (I guess also english), they offered me a couple of options as compensation. Not great but decent. I will report the final outcome once I fly tomorrow.
If it works out, I will not hold grudge against CX for the bad treatment I initially received from the French staff (would the English be more service-oriented than the French?).

Following your kind advices, I kept pushing and spent part of night drafting a nice complain leter to CX CEO in Paris that I faxed. This morning I got a nice call from the head of reservation in Paris (nice english lady). After a couple of iterations between her and the CEO (I guess also english), they offered me a couple of options as compensation. Not great but decent. I will report the final outcome once I fly tomorrow.
If it works out, I will not hold grudge against CX for the bad treatment I initially received from the French staff (would the English be more service-oriented than the French?).

It turned out that CX charged me for the C fare on CDG-HKG-SYD (a saving of €1200) with a free upgrade from C to F on CDG-HKG; I kept the F class ticket on the return SYD-CDG, but in compensation for the unvolontary downgrade on the SYD-HKG leg they gave me a one-leg upgrade voucher. A decent offer alltogether. it almost did not work out when they substituted at the last minute a 74A to the 744 for CDG-HKG (as there were 3 F seats less), but luckily we got the last two seats. Besides the decent deal, the CX people have been delightful once I wrote to the CEO. Quite happy with them.

It turned out that CX charged me for the C fare on CDG-HKG-SYD (a saving of €1200) with a free upgrade from C to F on CDG-HKG; I kept the F class ticket on the return SYD-CDG, but in compensation for the unvolontary downgrade on the SYD-HKG leg they gave me a one-leg upgrade voucher. A decent offer alltogether. it almost did not work out when they substituted at the last minute a 74A to the 744 for CDG-HKG (as there were 3 F seats less), but luckily we got the last two seats. Besides the decent deal, the CX people have been delightful once I wrote to the CEO. Quite happy with them.

Interesting and insightful story. Hopefully this can continue.

it almost did not work out when they substituted at the last minute a 74A to the 744 for CDG-HKG (as there were 3 F seats less), but luckily we got the last two seats.

Not very often you hear stories about disappointment (although luckily it all went right in this case) about switching from a 744 to a 74A... :)

Not very often you hear stories about disappointment (although luckily it all went right in this case) about switching from a 744 to a 74A... :)

Indeed!
I was so anxious that I did not sleep the night before the flight as there was only one F seat left (that would had gone to my lovely wife), but one pax cancelled and we had a wonderful flight in the new suite, excellent service, indiana jones and rest. These new F seats are really great and private.
Except for the Krug, JW blue and a decent lynch-Bages 1998, the other wines were disapointing (the special wine was a young portuguese wine of no taste) and food so-so. BTW, they also substituted a 74A for a scheduled 744 at the last minute the day before.

Are all of the SFO HKG nonstops now the 74A? (new business)...?

Thanks

No...

Are all of the SFO HKG nonstops now the 74A? (new business)...?

Thanks
See here: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=671110&page=24

So this is my first time on CX, and I can understand the frustration. I am currently sitting in the F section of the lounge in MNL, not having gotten my BP yet as the transfer desk couldn't provide one until 3PM. When I log into my e-mail account I get a mail from my ticketing agent that CX has changed the class of service for my ticket...
When checking I see the 74A has been substituted for a 2-class A330. Probably the old business class to boot.
The lounge staff probably aren't aware of this, but when I go down to get my BP soon I wondering if they will offer any compensation for downgrading me involuntarily from F to J? Is not the longest flight so I won't make a fuss, but I must admit it's dissapointing.

In August 08 I was flying HKG-LHR hoping to experience teh new long haul product after connection from Auckland, plane was subsituted, really annoying! And air-con was broken very bad.

Sometimes the switch works in your favour. I have just come back from LHR-HKG-AKL AKL-HKG-LHR and the return AKL-HKG sector was showing old product until 48 hours out when it switched to 74A, giving us all 4 sectors in new F, which was absolutely excellent despite an 8 hour tech delay on the way out.

BC