MilesBuzz! - MORTGAGES+rent+whatevah=miles thru BofA! (PIN)

OK, I thought people in here KNEW about this one... I got the following email today and have replied as follows. Read it all and be sure to call THE BANK OF AMERICA (I call it BofA) for a debit card that does it all! (yes, PIN + signature-based):

*****
> Hello,
> I saw your response to my posting about paying your motgage
> with
> your credit card. In your response you mentioned that you
> purchase money
> orders w/debit card? How does this get you miles? Does your
> debit card w/BOA
> offer flyer miles? Do you have a link to BOA site where it
> explains more
> about what you do? Thanks!
*****

MY REPLY IS:

There are whole threads on this one avail in old late summer
frequentflier forum postings. That forum, the FFF, is the other
forum I used to go to. They do not have as much security as the
flyer talk one so I moved over, but if you check in there all
the info is in there... but the subjct is well worn thin.
They'll fry ya alive...

BUT yes, bascially this is the only DEBIT card that lets you get
miles. I set my BofA up over the phone, I set up direct deposit
from work, I ordered their CHECK CARD and checking acct, and set
it up to be partners with Alaska Airlines, and I was sure to
write everything down as the entire set up porcess takes several
week to solidify with the bank and the airline, etc. They mail
you things, a PIN, a card, info, etc. Keep everything.

Then when I got the card and activated it (you need to do one
ATM transaction to do this because BofA is very security
consious) I then made a large deposit and then YES< everythig I
charged (except cash back and ATM and checks written) is like
this, but they DO add up:

$2=1mile.

BUT when paying the mortgage, for which I never got ANY miles
previous, it is worth it...

The Post office ONLY lets you use PIN to get money orders. I use
THIS card and get money orders as high as $1000 each when I go.
You can take out $2500 a day on this card so I get 2 money
orders (no sense in paying fees for the thir one if it is
smalller) and then I put them in another bank where I either
write checks from or... transfer them BACK into BofA! Yes, this
will get you more miles (if you dont mind waiting to see your
money move around) but it is WISE TO NOT just redeposit the same
money orders you just got out...rather, DO US another bank to
transfer or write checks back to yourself into it!)

On this card you can get miles using signature or PIN based, but
yes, in the PO, you can only use PIN for the money orders. They
costs $1.25 each so you are looking at $5 per 1000 miles at the
2:1 rate, BUT I also do many other things with this card... I
pay big bills, bought a ski pass, paid car stuff, etc. So all
these online and normal charges also are miles.

At the end of the month--about a week later, they send a whole
batch (which is half of what I spent, rounded off) to Alaska
Airlines. So if I spent $6450 in the month, and the bank
statement dates are different than airlines cut off dates, then
I would see a 3225 mile increase in the acct.

You also (at least when I set it up in August) get 3000 miles
for setting up this CHECH CARD which does cost $30 a year, but
that is the only fee. You need to have dirfect deposit set up
thru work or something. If you do not have it, I think there are
online services out there that will do it for you but you need
to find them. I dunno if there is a fee if you do not have DD.

You also get more miles for setting up the alaska acct and
chosing e statements.

I then signed up for Sprint and will get 11k more. I use idine
in there too. AND, why Alaska Airlines???

They are partners with AMERICAN, NORTHWEST and a few other
things (check them: www.alaskaairlines.com) (http://www.alaskaairlines.com)) and so when you
finally reach award, you can use the cert on the partners! I
will go to Hawaii on AA when i get to 35k. I have 19 in there
now--since AUG!

For me, there is no local Bank Of America. I am out of state.
BUT the acct was opened in Maryland (when I set it up over the
phone, they picked that for me). I use the acct for big thing
but have my local banks to do things in life with too. You can
also do MAIL deposits to bank of america but I notice these take
up to a week to post the $$$ to your acct online.

I now transfer money from one bank (a local one) into ING Direct
(which earns 2.75%, and I can refer yo to this bank and we both
get something for that, if you want) and then from ING to BofA
which takes a bit less time.

Basically, make it so the things you do can get you miles but
are not overly costly or inconvenient. I work near 3 banks
andone major PO, and so it is OK. I am not rich but can manage
my money well so can wait a bit for things to "spin thru" as I
call it, from one bank to another or by mail, etc. I now know
the post office staff real well and they always joke that I need
"the usual" which is money orders for miles!

I pay the rent and mortgage with it in 2 places. Though half the
miles, it is worth it! Like I said, I set it up in Aug and am at
19k now!
You need to be very patient whenever on hold with bank of
america.

this works and is all legal. Just dont abuse it and the
marketers who set it up will keep it up!

You could also get this SAME deal but with a US AIRWAYS Check
Card instead, but I think you get a bit less set up miles. I
like the Alaska one because you get more partners it seems, but
now that US AIR will soon let you use your award certs when you
reach the levels) on UAL, it is even better!

Lastly, there IS one more PIN card that gets you miles; Chase.
BUT it is with COntinental and has a 12500 mile limit per year
which is not good. This one is 100,000! Go with BofA and take
the time to set it up!

Good luck!



------------------
If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!

You better check the Alaska site again. If you us AS miles to fly AA or HA to Hawaii it will take 40K miles, not 35K. I do congratulate you on your ingenuity however.

<<They are partners with AMERICAN, NORTHWEST and a few other
things (check them: www.alaskaairlines.com) (http://www.alaskaairlines.com)) and so when you
finally reach award, you can use the cert on the partners! I
will go to Hawaii on AA when i get to 35k. I have 19 in there
now--since AUG!>>

Very interesting and I will probably open an account later this week. But living in Austin, I know very little about US Air, America West, or Alaskian Air. Which of these programs is the most flexible for awards on other airlines, etc.?

This one wiith Bank of America has been good to me for quite a while, thanks.

As partners with AA (which, to answer one person's question, is, in my opinion, the easiest to redeem miles awards on) the Hawaii award level is what I strive for so I can use it to fly ON AA. If they do indeed need me to have 40k in there as opposed to 35k which AA needs, for example, then so be it--I will just have to keep buying money orders or charging stuff as I have been doing for the past 3 months. I think at my rate (I already have 19k miles in 3months and that is good even though it is 2:1) I should get the miles soon...

I planned to try to redeem for NEXT year anyhow so I have time.

So I would recommend everybody check this out, call the bank and even if you are out of state, like me, it can be done. Hey, if anything, money you put in this bank willbe harder to get out unless you buy something (big) like a large charge, bill or money order, so in a sense, it is like a savings acct for you! Money not spent is money saved. It takes time to set it up and a bit of admin work on your side, but then, like me, you can go get money orders and pay bills with them or, like I do, put them into another checking acct and write your checks from there--or maybe revolve it back thru for more points!

Good luck!
I hope everybody earns. I did by learning this one in forum talk, so now I share with you all.

------------------
If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!

MarathonMan, I'm not sure what card you have but I have the Bank of America Alaska Airlines check card and I DO NOT earn miles based on PIN based purchases, only signature purchases. Any time I go to Safeway and select debit and have to enter a PIN, I dont get miles. However, if I choose credit and sign the piece of paper I do get credit. This is the same card that earns 1 mile for every 2 dollars purchased.

djefvert,

Unless they made a huge mistake to you, OR you set this up say, before some offer came to be (I heard about this in the late summer, set up AK airlines and THEN set up the BofA and got my green visa card in the mail which IS a DEBIT and CAN get miles using PIN too) then yes, you should get miles too!

Here in fact, is a copy/paste of everything in my acct. The last few thou have yet to post but will shortly! I have gotten the sign up bonus, the dining, sprint use and monthly stuff and much debit activity. You can see that I spent 11 grand last month to get over 5k miles posted. I did not paste in the earliest AK postings like the set up for e-summaries, etc.

Assuming you did evrything right, you may wanna contact the airline!
*****

Current Balance: 16,726

Activity Date Activity Type Flight Miles Total Posted
10/31/2002 Debit Card
0001 4,920

10/14/2002 Sprint Bonus
S02 1,000

9/30/2002 Debit Card
0001 5,013

9/26/2002 Sprint Usage
4501 20

9/5/2002 Mileage Plan Dining
0001 150

8/31/2002 Debit Card
0001 623

8/31/2002 Debit Card
DEBRECEN TO 0002 0 3,000


FormName: MPActivityDetail

Thanks Marathon Man - this is brand new information for me.

I currently charge everything I can to the SPG AMEX and AA Citibank MC, get AA miles by banking at BankDirect (and turn over bonds every other month) - but I had reconciled myself to not being able to earn miles on 2 things - my home owner's association fees and my car payments.

So I'll look into this BoA debit card.

Question: If you're able to get money orders - could you get them to pay off your mileage earning credit cards - in essence earn 1.5 miles for every dollar spent? Is that true? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by sk3 (edited 11-11-2002).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Marathon Man:
The Post office ONLY lets you use PIN to get money orders. I use
THIS card and get money orders as high as $1000 each when I go.
You can take out $2500 a day on this card so I get 2 money
orders (no sense in paying fees for the thir one if it is
smalller) and then I put them in another bank where I either
write checks from or... transfer them BACK into BofA! Yes, this
will get you more miles (if you dont mind waiting to see your
money move around) but it is WISE TO NOT just redeposit the same
money orders you just got out...rather, DO US another bank to
transfer or write checks back to yourself into it!)
</font>

Is there fee for USPS money order?

------------------
ValueConsumer.com (http://www.valueconsumer.com) Home of Tripple Dipping Online Shopping

yes.

a money order is cash. use it to pay anything! It is cash.

now, as I said, I tend to put them into another local checking acct and THEN write checks to all other things. For me, therefore, this money is "miled" once it has gone from BofA to money order at PO, to checking acct, to bills. I use checks to pay things though because it is easier to track them!

IF you want, why not SEND in more money to your BofA by mail or into an ATM by doing this:

With PIN, get money order, put it into whatever checking acct you write bills from, and use that acct to send money back to BofA.

It is best NOT to just send the same money orders back to BofA that you just got out, because though you legally can, it'll make the mile marketers be wary....

Since I DO use the card for alot of big things, I cause no alarm.

Good luck!

DH,

the fee for a $1000 money order is $1.25. Any post office that has not yet phased in the recently set up $1000 ones will still only have max $700. They SHOULD charge you for only one of them if, for example, you buy 3 700s for 2100... SO, if I go get 2000 in money orders, I am looking at $2.50 fees. All told, there is a cost, but then again, what is the cost of a ticket to hawaii? AND I AM using the card in other ways to earn em too.

You can also buy money orders at Walmart and Albertson's (the department store, I think, not the grocery store chain)for less than half the price at the P.O.

It is absolutely essential that we do not abuse this system. Do not, repeat, DO NOT deposit the money orders into your B of A checking account. I have reports from two people who had their B of A accounts summarily closed for doing this.

This technique is not on my web site. I do not want to see it so overly used that whoever is losing money on it figures this out and cancels the program. So please, be careful (at least until I get my maximum number of miles...).

------------------
The Personal Travel Experience of Gary Steiger (http://home.earthlink.net/~pgary/TravelFrame.html) - including how to get free frequent flyer miles on the web.

good tip gary on the walmart MOs. Did not know this. I too MUST STRESS that people should always use the money orders for things as themselves or, if they have to put money back into BofA, to PLEASE do something like put money in by writing a regular check to BofA from another one of your own accts, and NOT by redepositing those money orders.
Sure, banks will take them of course, but BofA will start to think you are just trying to scam the whole miles thing!

So, use another checking acct or something in order to get money INTO BofA (asside from your DD, etc)

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by pgary:
You can also buy money orders at Walmart and Albertson's (the department store, I think, not the grocery store chain)for less than half the price at the P.O.

It is absolutely essential that we do not abuse this system. Do not, repeat, DO NOT deposit the money orders into your B of A checking account. I have reports from two people who had their B of A accounts summarily closed for doing this.

This technique is not on my web site. I do not want to see it so overly used that whoever is losing money on it figures this out and cancels the program. So please, be careful (at least until I get my maximum number of miles...).

</font>

How can you keep the best tips only to yourself??? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/mad.gif This is the biggest can of worm I have heard of - much bigger than the saving bonds as bonds hold the money for 4-5 months. This thread is going to get very crowded soon!

Are you going to tell us more here? Or should we all drive to Wal*Mart to find out ourselves? Come on, feed us information - for we are all hungry for miles!!!

[This message has been edited by FT wannabe (edited 11-11-2002).]

I've read a similar plan with Chase / Continental, but never pursued because no Chase banks in L.A.
I do, though, have a checking account with B of A (little used), and Wells Fargo (used a bunch).
So what you're saying is if I line up at the Post Office for 100 consecutive weekdays (20 weeks without any holidays), buy two $1,000 money orders at $1.25 each, then go to the Wells Fargo ATM and deposit the $2,000 in money orders there, and then run off to Bank of America and deposit a $2,000 check from my Wells Fargo account there, at the end of 20 weeks of constantly doing this I should have 100,000 Alaska Airlines miles for a total cost of $280 ($250 for money orders and $30 for the annual fee for the B of A / Alaska Airlines debit card). Of course I would have to add in there any extra costs for traveling to the Post Office and two banks each day, although living in the San Fernando Valley (Northridge) the total distance between all three of these locations on Reseda Blvd is only about a mile. That along with leaving an extra few thousand dollars in the checking account at all times, to allow for delays in crediting deposits and also to avoid service charges.
So that leads to another question. How much in transaction fees can B of A earn on debit card (PIN) transactions, to offset what they have to buy the miles for from Alaska Airlines? Just using a rough estimate that the miles might cost one cent a piece (I have no idea what the exact amount is), a $1,000 PIN transaction would have to earn Bank of America $5.00 to break even on the 500 miles you earn. I don't think they even make 50 cents on a PIN transaction, so how can they continue to do this? Annual fees and any extra business still won't offset all of this.

MarathonMan, I can assure you I have the same Green Alaskaair Bank of America..but I am not getting credit for PIN based transactions. I'm showing the same sort of activity you posted above in my Alaskaair account info, but its only for CREDIT based (signature) purchases. I will try what you mentioned for a money order, but if its like any other pin based activity it will not work.

3 things:

1) NO ONE is trying to keep anything from anyone in here but the key is that we all sort of self-police ourselves from not sharing everything all the time with everyone. For example, I could call bank of america and tell them I plan to do nothing but simply take the same $1000 out of my acct and redeposit it to get miles and do nothing else. As a bank, they might tell me I am weird, but as a marketer of mile partner programs, they would think I was a scammer, bringing no business to the bank or the airline. So, it is better for us to share within forums and with close people or those who we can be sure will keep it cool. I think this forum people will do that. Besides, people here offer great tips so this was mine.

2) not every program or deal is for everyone. I could have opened a chase but dont live near those banks. This is true for BofA but the amount of miles on partners I will use is too great to pass up. Besides, I think they are gonna buy FLEET bank which is huge where I live. Would be nice. Some programs or older accts you may have with Bank of America MAY NOT work. YOu may need to call the bank or close it and re open or open another one?

3) I do not know why the same acct I have would NOT work. I have been doing PINS like the money order or even some things like getting gas and saying, "Yeah, sure, PIN or credit--it does not matter" and have had no trouble. You have to call the bank. You have to maybe start a new acct. It is a Visa. It is tied to the AK airlines acct. It has direct deposit attached to it. I made sure to have PINS included. When did you open this acct of yours? That may matter but we hope not!

Could be a glitch... If it turns out to be, once all is fixed, you may have to write a crafty letter asking for retroactive mileage activity to be posted!

Walmart: that was new to me. I guess there are a lot of places to get cheap money orders. My experience is that you better not lose it though! The tracking systems for these are not as good as with your own personal checks, which is why I put the money orders I get into the bank right away! AND NOT the BofA. That is what may "flag" it for those who set this up.

Yes, there is a lot of steps to do. I happen to work next to a po and a few banks! You can also do MAIL DEPOSITS or, as I said, transfer the money online into a savings acct with ING DIrect, which I can refer you to if you want, and then we both get $ for this... and THEN, from ING online to BofA!

This would reduce the steps to ONE: getting the money orders from wherever you find them, PO or otherwise!

Good luck.

I just checked with my bank, U.S. Bank (well, it is not "MY" bank, but you know what I mean). he he

They said if I go to the post office or a store, be it grocery, Wal-Mart, etc. and get a money order by using my credit card it is considered a cash advance and the interest will be applied from the moment I make the transaction.

If I use a pin or just swipe the card.

I want to figure out how to get points when paying my rent each month!!!! Points on the car payment would be nice too.

MeWantMoreMiles

Here are the terms for BofA Alaska Airlines Check Card.

Features and benefits
Earns miles.2 Every purchase you make with your card (including many monthly bills and everyday expenses) will earn you one Mileage Plan Mile for every two dollars in purchases.


Earns miles dollar for dollar. You'll earn one Mileage Plan Mile for every dollar in purchases of Alaska Airlines/Horizon Air tickets and vacation packages.


Earns bonus miles. To get you started, you'll receive 3,000 bonus miles upon making your first purchase with your new card.


Travel discount coupon.3 You'll receive a special travel discount coupon with up to $75 in savings on published round-trip fares of over $400 when you open an Alaska Airlines Visa Check Card account.


Earns anniversary bonus miles. You'll get 1,000 anniversary bonus miles each year for keeping your Alaska Airlines Visa Check Card and an active checking account.


Provides travel accident insurance. Travel purchases made on the card will cover you for $250,000 in common carrier Travel Accident Insurance.


Tracks your spending. We list purchases in detail on your monthly checking account statement.


Tracks your miles. Your Mileage Plan Miles will be listed on your Alaska Airlines Mileage Plan statement along with miles earned on your Alaska Airlines Visa credit card or recent miles flown on Alaska Airlines.


Photo Security. Your photo and signature can be embossed on your card, giving you added protection against theft.
How it works
Works like a check. Your Alaska Airlines Visa Check Card works like a "plastic check" and can be used at any merchant that accepts Visa. Instead of adding your purchase to a credit card balance, the amount is automatically deducted from your checking account.


Provides ATM access. Access your account at more than 14,000 Bank of America ATM machines and over 500,000 PLUS and Visa ATMs around the world. You can withdraw cash, transfer funds or make deposits.
Cost
Alaska Airlines Visa Check Card has a low annual fee of $30.

Need a checking account?
Learn about Bank of America checking accounts.

Apply now.
Terms and conditions

1 Card will be made available to Oregon customers in the future.
2 Earns miles on online and offline purchases. Does not earn miles for pure ATM transactions, over the counter cash transactions or on "cash back" amounts at point of sale.
3 Some restrictions apply. See back of coupon for details

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by MeWantMoreMiles:
I just checked with my bank, U.S. Bank (well, it is not "MY" bank, but you know what I mean). he he

They said if I go to the post office or a store, be it grocery, Wal-Mart, etc. and get a money order by using my credit card it is considered a cash advance and the interest will be applied from the moment I make the transaction.

If I use a pin or just swipe the card.

I want to figure out how to get points when paying my rent each month!!!! Points on the car payment would be nice too.

MeWantMoreMiles

</font>
Why interest on debit card purchases?

Marathon man,you will be a hero in the FT community if this works!!! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Absolutely ingenious!


[This message has been edited by bertie_jeeves (edited 11-11-2002).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by MeWantMoreMiles:
I just checked with my bank, U.S. Bank (well, it is not "MY" bank, but you know what I mean). he he

They said if I go to the post office or a store, be it grocery, Wal-Mart, etc. and get a money order by using my credit card it is considered a cash advance and the interest will be applied from the moment I make the transaction.

If I use a pin or just swipe the card.

I want to figure out how to get points when paying my rent each month!!!! Points on the car payment would be nice too.

MeWantMoreMiles

</font>

That kind of doesn't sound right. Using the same logic, if you used your debit card with PIN code to take cash out of your checking account at your bank's ATM, that would then be treated as a cash advance.
You might want to double-check.

In reeding more on this one from people, I noticed a few concerns/questions.

1) Some, in their quest for a means, have asked to just be able to pay the rent and get FF miles...
2) others asked WHY DEBIT and all this about that?
3) Something about cashback and ATM...

1) the thing is, to pay rent or mortgage, of which I currently have both (owning one condo in the mts and living in a city for work and miles stuff) One normally needs to write checks or give a landlord, usually a person or very small business, a check or something. BUT you cannot get miles writing checks.... hold that thought.

2) you can use money orders BUT all will find out that in the post office, though you can use a credit card to buy things, you CANNOT use one to buy a money order! In fact, that is true everywhere a money order is sold.

You have to buy it with.... DEBIT!

BUT, who and what gets you miles with DEBIT?
BANK OF AMERICA !

3) no, cash advances, cash back (like when you buy something and they ask you if you want cash back) and ATM does NOT get you miles. Nor does writing checks (so, I have this BofA acct, but a TON of never to be used checks... well, I used one or two and hey, that makes me look more genuine anyway.

I appreciate those who think me a hero, but I did not win the marathon (sure was feeling that way when I finished my first one though--you should all do one if you have not already!) and yet, I learned of this in the summer with others and am simply sharing it with all here. But thanks! I can at least try to help people set it up.

However, it is imperative that people do not abuse this thing. How could they do this?
Well, open the bank acct to get miles, sure, BUT also be sure to open it to have a bank acct. Use it like one. Use it to buy gas, or dinner or do whatever you bank for. Not JUST to get miles. Oh sure, you may decide that this bank is JUST for paying rent or mortgage, etc, and so that is fine, but if THEY think you are JUST getting this thing going to earn free miles, they will say, "OK, yeah, youcan do that but it was not for that. It was to generate business, etc."

Like idine, who wants people to eat at places, you get the miles, but not as the MAIN GOAL. Oh, to us it is, but they have to think it is NOT. That's all I (or Pgary) is saying. Like running distances, one needs to want the goal and be psyched over it, but also pace one's self a ton. WHen you set up the bank acct, remember that banks have their slow or involved rules and go into it knowing that. Know that in the end, you'll get the miles but be thorough and keep records on the banking as normal. Then when the stuff you do winds down to becoming second nature again, you will once and while check that airline statement around the first week of a month and see a cool deposit of Debitcard miles posted.

Hey, I am no expert or hero but a bit of self constraint will take you well beyond that of a wildman (unless you are those surfers in that Hawaii ED contest where they ride huge waves! BUT there are still those who think that just me telling about this could hurt it. I dunno.

and as for checks... and swiping cards,

now that you got your money orders, which were a PURCHASE and not "just like a check" then you will get miles. What they mean is that swiping your card does in fact deduct the money right away and so you need to have it in there, just like when you write a check. So you are gonna do a Debit purchase. (Have you ever noticed that there is a bit of lag time when you say to do it as Credit as opposed to debit? Credit seesm to take $ from the bank a bit slower but you stil need it in there, unlike your interest sucking MC or visa.

There is a difference between swiping the card to make a debit or credit purchase and Debitting cash or ATM or writing a check.
Yes it gets confuising, but think of it this way:

ANYTHING that uses your BofA CARD number to reference the bank and take your money is a PURCHASE on the card. ANY PURCHASE on that card is miles!

To buy a Postal money order, though a DEBIT transaction, is a PURCHASE. To buy some Xmass gifts on line is a purchase, etc.

Anything that references the checking acct number is not gonna give you miles.

So I have card number XXXX-XXXX-XXXX-XXXX
and I have checking actt number 000-000-000 and they are linked but different.

If i take cash or use ATM or write a check or even do some online transfers, they are from the checking acct.

If I swipe the card for PURCHASE, it is from the card number.

...so, remember wehn I said "hold that thought" in the prev post? ...you now just "bought" that postal or Walmart money order... Fill it out to give to the landlord as rent, or put it in your other bank and write him a check!

You just got miles to pay the rent.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by pgary:
This technique is not on my web site. I do not want to see it so overly used that whoever is losing money on it figures this out and cancels the program. So please, be careful (at least until I get my maximum number of miles...).

</font>

Funny.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by FT wannabe:
[B] How can you keep the best tips only to yourself??? B]</font>

This tip was throroughly discussed by others and me on the FrequentFlierForum several months ago. It was originally introduced by Seth there. Many people there asked me to not put it on my site, and asked everyone to stop talking about it, because too much exposure will surely ruin it. So, please just be happy that you know about it, and know that you could have known about it sooner by reading the other forum, which is where I post my ideas and comments almost daily.

In order to limit internet exposure to this idea, I would hope that instead of asking questions here, everyone would simply go to the other forum and do a search on Alaska for the last 6 months or so. The address is http://frequentflier.com/cgi-local/index.cgi

------------------
The Personal Travel Experience of Gary Steiger (http://home.earthlink.net/~pgary/TravelFrame.html) - including how to get free frequent flyer miles on the web.

he IS right...

But Gary,
You would send them to a place of evil? I have heard recent stories from a few who use both forums that much anger cometh from the site of which you speak...

I left long ago. I wont go back. I only come here and try to have fun without problems. It has worked so far.

If someone felt like getting even more carried away, realize you can also use money orders to pay credit card bills, including bills for mileage earning credit cards.

So, for example, anything you can purchase via a credit card you buy using a mileage earning *credit* card as the many credit cards earn one mile per $ spent. Then when that credit card bill comes due, you can pay the credit card using a money order purchased using the mileage earning *debit* card.

So in summary, you can effectively earn 1.5 AS miles per $ spent using a combination of (say) the Alaska Airlines/BofA Credit Card for purchases and the Alaska Airlines/BofA Debit Card.

And anyone who doesn't accept credit or debit purchases (such as many landlords) can be paid using money orders bought using the debit card, earning an effective 0.5 miles per $ minus money order costs.

The mind boggles.

This is a great way to attract unwanted attention from the Feds for money laundering. You will fit the classic profile of a money launderer, and under the Patriot Act both the Post Office and the bank are REQUIRED to file a suspicious activity report on you. I wouldn't imagine it would take long for those reports to trip a threshold and trigger an investigation. You will then be on the hook to justify where you obtained every dollar you "laundered" through this scheme. I imagine you would be exonerated in the end since you did nothing illegal, but I wouldn't think being the target of an anti-terrorism investigation would be much fun and most people probably don't keep good enough records to avoid a lengthy investigation. Think about it.

...and all this from just trying to milk a few legal miles. I AM sorry (to people like Gary too) that I ever brought it all up. I should not have. In fact, I am gonna take a short trip anyhow in the next day and so I will take off for a while and come back soon.

This forum is fun and so thanks for the tips thus far. In fact my first post asked about transferring United miles to HHilton and they HAVE already gone IN!
Now we have enough for a room on that short trip! I will use my miles earning card to pay for things there.

see you soon!
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Sorry, pgary. I was not trying to point finger at you. But your logic (and some others on the Hilton thread) on sharing any information is simply flawed. There, the central discussion is always on whether to share hotel promotional codes and the consenses is really bi-standard. For those who don't know the code, they constantly ask for the code. For some people, once they know the code, they just urge everyone to quiet down. Such a selfish ideology.

The flaw part of the whole story is that once the scheme leaks to a public forum like flyertalk, it is not a secret anymore. There are prying eyes from the airlines, hotels, and credit cards companies who read these discussion constantly.

So there should really be two types of people on FlyerTalk. 1) Those who know and want to share info without reserve; 2) Those who accidentally find out on their own just keep the secret to themselves.

Just think if you can't keep the secret yourself, how can you expect the ones who got the "secret" from you to keep it as a "secret" for you.

OK. my question will this work with Citibank /AAdvantage debit card as well????

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by flyer1974:
OK. my question will this work with Citibank /AAdvantage debit card as well????</font>

From what I read somewhere in the cyberspace, Citibank debit cards won't work for this scheme... you may want to find out yourself. But Citibank has its own laundering scheme known as C2it... (hey, this is not a secret at all!!!)

Jusdt a modest suggestion: Without relying too much on what's posted on this and the other board, look at the airlines' sites to familiarize yourself with what is offered for financial partners and then decide whether you want to, say, open a BofA account and get a Alaska Airlines debit card. If the answer is yes, go ahead and see whether indeed you get ff miles for purchasing money orders with PIN. If the answer is yes, so much the better, if no, just close the account unless you want another seldom used account cluttering your financial affairs. I would not worry too much about a federal investigation. The Feds have bigger fish to fry. Marathon Man, have a nice trip.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by FT wannabe:
Such a selfish ideology.</font>

And then use this board to publicize your own website so that you can garner referral bonuses. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by logicpurveyor:
[B]The Feds have bigger fish to fry. B]</font>

I think the Feds would consider someone who appears to be "laundering" $200,000 over a period of 3 months a "big fish". The Sept. 11th crowd appears to have gotten by on about that much.

As mentioned in a post within this thread, Chase also has a debit card which allows the purchase of money orders at the Post Office and in return, one earns Continental miles. Last year, I considered this debit card to pay my mortgage by buying money orders, but after looking into the fees, which were nominal, the amount of work involved turned me off on this idea. Since there are no Chase branches in California, I would have to mail in my deposits, wait for them to post, then buy the money orders. If I didn't have a minimum balance, I would get dinged with a penalty.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by raffy:
As mentioned in a post within this thread, Chase also has a debit card which allows the purchase of money orders at the Post Office and in return, one earns Continental miles. Last year, I considered this debit card to pay my mortgage by buying money orders, but after looking into the fees, which were nominal, the amount of work involved turned me off on this idea. Since there are no Chase branches in California, I would have to mail in my deposits, wait for them to post, then buy the money orders. If I didn't have a minimum balance, I would get dinged with a penalty.</font>

This is the difference between doing this, when compared to the C2IT thing. C2IT you can just sit at your computer and do the dastardly deed of transfering money for no purpose other than earning AA miles.
The B of A thing requires you to actually go to places: The post office and line-up for a money order (lines can be long at times) or another place to buy them, and then to your bank(s) to deposit/transfer money back in order to start the process again.
For a hypothetical, lets say you buy a $1,000 money order each time you do this. This will cost you $1.25. You get 500 Alaska frequent flyer miles. And lets say a frequent flyer mile is worth a penny (it can be more or less than this, depending on how it's redeemed). So for all your trouble, you netted $3.75 for all this work, and this doesn't count the value of your time, transportation costs, etc., doing this. Would one be better off just saving $5.00 each time in a savings account for travel, rather than running around doing this? That's hard to say. But given from what I can tell, most people on this board seemed to be at least upper-middle class, and thus I can't see them running around every evening after work doing this. Maybe once in a while to top an account off, and to say "I did it," but there may be easier ways to earn a free ticket. For me, if I work one day of overtime, I could probably earn enough money for an average discount airline ticket. That would sure be easier for me than running around for months doing this.
That said, I am as guilty as others in doing some airline mile "money laundering" once in a while.
Anyway, that's my two-cents worth again.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by burgerwars:
But given from what I can tell, most people on this board seemed to be at least upper-middle class, and thus I can't see them running around every evening after work doing this...
</font>

I agree with you but I think you just miss the point. Most of the people on these forums can afford annual vacation out of their pockets without blinking their eyes. However, most of us treat the miles and points as a game. Figuring in all the time and expenses, the money order thing simply doesn't sound intriging at all. However, it is the feeling that we out-smarted the big company that is keeping us doing these things. I can immediately think of the Kellogg's AA mileage as an example. People actually go out to buy all the cereal box, cut out the cert, and maybe donate the cereal to the food bank. And then they need to send in the certificates.

Another example maybe the online advertisements program like mypoints. I don't think people actually care how many months of clicking before they can redeem their points...

That is a lot of work for a few miles - but apparently there are enough "sick" people who are doing these "crazy" things to keep these programs alive. Or maybe life is just too boring...

[This message has been edited by FT wannabe (edited 11-12-2002).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by flyer1974:
OK. my question will this work with Citibank /AAdvantage debit card as well????</font>

Citibank only allows the miles when credit card option is selected. However, BofA states point of sale earns the miles.

BofA link -
http://www.bankofamerica.com/checkcard/index.cfm?template=jump_page.cfm&product=alaskaair

CitiBank link -
http://web.da-us.citibank.com/cgi-bin/citifi/scripts/smart_deals/land_pages/sd_landing_template.jsp?BV_UseBVCookie=yes&BS_Id=SD110a&M=S

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ValueConsumer.com (http://www.valueconsumer.com) Home of Tripple Dipping Online Shopping

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Sig:
This is a great way to attract unwanted attention from the Feds for money laundering. You will fit the classic profile of a money launderer, and under the Patriot Act both the Post Office and the bank are REQUIRED to file a suspicious activity report on you. I wouldn't imagine it would take long for those reports to trip a threshold and trigger an investigation. You will then be on the hook to justify where you obtained every dollar you "laundered" through this scheme. I imagine you would be exonerated in the end since you did nothing illegal, but I wouldn't think being the target of an anti-terrorism investigation would be much fun and most people probably don't keep good enough records to avoid a lengthy investigation. Think about it.</font>

Ditto.

Simply not worth the risk.

Its not as if the miles are "free". merely a good deal at .5 cents. Further do you know what the lines at the post office are like.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by burgerwars:
This is the difference between doing this, when compared to the C2IT thing. C2IT you can just sit at your computer and do the dastardly deed of transfering money for no purpose other than earning AA miles.
The B of A thing requires you to actually go to places: The post office and line-up for a money order (lines can be long at times) or another place to buy them, and then to your bank(s) to deposit/transfer money back in order to start the process again.
For a hypothetical, lets say you buy a $1,000 money order each time you do this. This will cost you $1.25. You get 500 Alaska frequent flyer miles. And lets say a frequent flyer mile is worth a penny (it can be more or less than this, depending on how it's redeemed). So for all your trouble, you netted $3.75 for all this work, and this doesn't count the value of your time, transportation costs, etc., doing this. Would one be better off just saving $5.00 each time in a savings account for travel, rather than running around doing this? That's hard to say. But given from what I can tell, most people on this board seemed to be at least upper-middle class, and thus I can't see them running around every evening after work doing this. Maybe once in a while to top an account off, and to say "I did it," but there may be easier ways to earn a free ticket. For me, if I work one day of overtime, I could probably earn enough money for an average discount airline ticket. That would sure be easier for me than running around for months doing this.
That said, I am as guilty as others in doing some airline mile "money laundering" once in a while.
Anyway, that's my two-cents worth again.

</font>

Exactly.

I'm glad to see that there are some reasonable level headed minds on this board.

well said in one sense, but not in another, but all classes aside (and regardless of it, I think that should never matter anyway, IMHO) I happen to work next to both a PO and two major banks so as I once said before, it is worth it for some and maybe not for others. I have to pay certain large bills and rent or mortgages anyway, AND I have to mail many things. In the morning, the PO I go to, which happens to be the bottom floor of a federal court house, has nobody in line really and I have come to know the staff who are rather nice people. I do mail a lot overseas too so it is great to have their help. So, when i go in and buy money orders to pay bills and then walk to the office next door, put them in my bank there and head to the office, I am doing nothing inconvenient at all. If it such that people's visiting the "working class" of the PO is considered a waste of pennies, then that is just a bit "uppity" for my blood. In the end, sure, I did some set up work to GET this card and GET the things going, but until it becomes harder to do it than not, I will probably continue. In the end, yes, I will have a free ticket, which is not so bad no matter what class one says they come from, if there is/should be such a thing!

So, hopefully, if something works for you and you can share it with people, then great. If not, then there should be no need to put it down, which that message KINDA did, I think.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif


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If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!

Did I read a post on this topic correctly? Most members on this forum are upper middle class and do the ff mileage hunting merely as a "sick" hobby? Well, ladies and gentlemen, this poster is a poorly compensated part-time adjunct philosophy instructor with perhaps a "sick" hobby but positively not upper middle-class. I appreciate all the posts alerting me to ff mileage opportunities. I just wish the emphasis were more on these opportunities, rather than questions about countries visited, membership in how many programs, perceived rude behavior, etc. But then I don't have to read those posts.

Marathon -- I hope you have not been scared off by some replies and are still following up with this post - great topic. Quick question (for you or anyone else). Just so I am clear -- I currently direct deposit my paycheck into my checking account, then pay bills, etc. from that account. Am I reading this strategy correct by thinking that I can keep my current checking account, set up a new BofA checking account and check card, change my direct deposit to go straight into my BofA account, then, by purchasing a few money orders, take the money out of BofA and into my current checking account, and then go about paying all my bills, etc. from that account as I normally do? If so, this is not merely a way to get miles for things I currently don't get miles for (e.g., mortgage payments) -- this is a way to receive miles on my entire paycheck! (The only sacrifice being the lag time for the money to get back to my current checking account). Amazing.

Fly Chicago, you are right.
In fact most places who do direct deposit let you split it up if you wish among more than one bank, so for me, I put like $20 into one old checking acct from my work pay in order to keep it from having any fees (some banks like to give you NO fees if you have a DD coming in monthly) and I put the rest of my pay into BofA.

Then yes, I take these large sums of money out as money orders (and DID just discover that yes, they are only like .50 cents or less at WALMART for the $700 ones, which is nicer than the P.O.'s prices!) and I use this paycheck money to pay bills and such.

I actually do take the money orders, put them into my other older checking acct (the non-miles, older one) which is next to my office and then write those checks to pay bills as normal. So, the money I am spending and the bills I am paying with checks was "mile'd" by me first!

Today I just also MAILED in another check I got from some side work I do other than my Full time job. I put that PAY into the BofA mailer and though things take time (I am out of state for BofA) when the check gets there, I can get more money orders from this money too. It eventually does add up. I have 20k on Alaska Air since Aug! I have just been going about this stuff as normal and the only extra step is buying money orders for fees that will come out to FAR less than the cost of say, a RT ticket to Hawaii from BOS!

good luck and keep at it!
no problem asking me either. It's all legit anyway!


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If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!

Such a delicious topic!

From what I understand so far, if I can buy MOs cheaper at Walmart, can I not just buy some Walmart gift cards with my mileage-earning CCs and use them to pay for the MOs? The advantage would be that I can pay with whatever CC I choose to use.

Thereafter I will deposit the MOs into the checking account from which I write the mortgage check.

Anyone see problem with this?

[This message has been edited by ChaseTheMiles (edited 11-20-2002).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ChaseTheMiles:
can I not just buy some Walmart gift cards with my mileage-earning CCs and use them to pay for the MOs?</font>

The only problem is whether Walmart will let you use the gift card to buy money order. I believe the answer would be NO, but someone else please confirm that.

I was planning to go to a walmart this weekend to try the MO thing there (was doing it at the PO with great success but had not yet known about the Walmart ones and so now they have a new customer, I guess)/

As I mentioned in another forum, I will, if I am going this weekend, be the guy to try this and ask about gift cards too!
Would be great but I doubt it will be possible.

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If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by FT wannabe:
The only problem is whether Walmart will let you use the gift card to buy money order. I believe the answer would be NO, but someone else please confirm that.</font>

Unless you have a Wal-Mart that doesn't know/care about policy, they won't let you. Money orders are cash/debit only.

Mike

Nako (Mike) you are right. In my call to Walmart last night after posting, I not only found that at least that store will not allow DEBIT for MO's, it will also not allow gift cards to buy them either. Maybe some stores allow debit but it does seem to make sense that a gift card would never be useable for these things.

I think it has to do with laws or rules outside the store. Something dealing with banks and money orders.

Now, WHAT WOULD be cool to find out (just to try it) is to see if the PO sells gift cards they might allow you to use AND better yet, a bank!

Can you get a 'gift certificate' for any bank and if so, since it IS a bank, would THEY allow it? THAT might be worth looking into also... But then, this IS getting to be very much a tangent, eh? I'm game.

And what else would a mortgage company take as payment? Maybe we can buy that with a card.

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If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!

Thanks for the answer on Walmart. Too bad, but it was worth asking. I guess it's time for me to finally get a Debit Card.

i confirm that about walmart. i asked the lady in customer service she said they only accept cash and debit cards as payment for money orders.

Thanks Marathon. So, a quick recap of all I've learned from this thread and other similar ones, to make sure I choose the option that works best for me:

1) The object is to find a DEBIT card that gives miles for both PIN and signature based transactions, because money orders cannot be purchased anywhere with credit card.

2) The best (or only) debit card achieving this goal is the Bank of America card. There is a Chase CO debit card, but the miles you can earn per year is capped at 12,500, while the BofA card allows up to 100K/year. Citibank's C2It is not a good option and will frequently close the account if it looks like strictly mileage generating activity is occurring.

3) Of the BofA debit cards (of which there are 3 -- Alaska, USAir, America West), the Alaska card is best because of its redeeming options with several airlines, including AA and British Airways.

Is all of the above correct?

If I currently pool the majority of my miles with UA (hold the UA Visa), would the USAir card be a wiser choice, assuming redemption with UA is around the corner (any timeline on this?)? Are all things equal between the Alaska and USAir BofA card other than the respective airlines' redemption possibilities?

Once again, thank you all for the excellent info.

others have given great info too so I am not the only one but thanks.

You are correct on all things about the card and its ways. I like the AK one because I can redeem on AA.

I like AA redemption the best in the industry because, despite having miles on other carriers, AA seems to have the SEATS when I want to use miles and THAT is the key these days!

Everybody is giving miles away but who can you use them with? Maybe that helps sway ya.

I like US/UAL partnership but when I called USAIR yesterday to ask these same "WHEN?" questions, they said "sometime soon --the beginning of next year..." and knew nothing more. This puts me off a bit because, knowing that it sure takes time to redeem an award seat, if I find out next year, I maybe cannot use my award til even LATER in that year. Thus, flying on them using a partner is kinda out for my plans right now. I have 2 US AIR awards already and was going to see if I could use them to fly on UAL to Aspen, a rather pricey ticket if you buy one, so well worth the 20-25k that should be required. But like I say, they dunno the rules and IF's and BUT's yet so neither do I!

When I once tried to fly there from BOS on DL awards, they would not let me use the code share flights in Colorado.

So, partnerships have their limitations and so then would AK and AA but at least AA is very consistent for redemption!

As for the person who asked about walmart MO's, I have found that SOME will NOT accept debit cards to buy them and some will. The one I was gonna visit will not. I can still look.

good luck! get miles!
I have http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

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If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!

which checking account af bofa is the best to use if you don't live in a state served by them and you don't want to pay a monthly fee? can i simply fund the bofa account by setting that account up as a payee on my current citibank checking account?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by broadwayblue:
which checking account af bofa is the best to use if you don't live in a state served by them and you don't want to pay a monthly fee? can i simply fund the bofa account by setting that account up as a payee on my current citibank checking account?</font>

As a resident of MASS, I am out of state but use Direct Deposit, mail deposits and transfers to put money INTO BofA via ING Direct.com

The BofA I have is that Alaska Airlines Visa Check card which cost me $30 a year to have so that is a low cost considering.

I have a local checking acct. I use ING to transfer money into it, then ING to BofA. It comes in as a deposit days later and I can get the cash or do whatever.

So yes, that works. Set up INGdirect.com
But before you do, check PGary's site for offers that may give you a bonus or some referral $ for signing up.

http://home.earthlink.net/~pgary/MilesFrame.html

Go to his Finance section to find INGDirect.
Read what it says there. He did not ask me to do this. I am telling you this because this is where a few people I know learned about that bank and its bonusses. Sharing is good. You can do the referral or not. You can do it for him or not. If you wish to do it for me, send me the email once you read the info there.

Either way, if you want an easy online way to put money INTO an out of state bank, this ING is it. They are a savings bank (international-Dutch/US, etc.) that currently yeilds 2.8% and that is also nice to know for when your money is transferring in and out!

Good luck. I hope this more-than-enough information was helpful!

As for BofA, I once had a problem where my direct deposit did not go through from my workplace. Work offered to wire it in. This imposes a fee on the RECEIVER'S end in some banks, like BofA. The fee was 410. Bummer. Work would not reimburse me. I called the bank and explained the situation. The CS person there looked at my records and said that since I was a good customer (it was only my 3rd month) they would waive the fee. Any bank that waives fees or even tries to is great for me!
You have to wait on hold a long time with them but they are fine otherwise so who cares. When do you think I get all the time to write this stuff?

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif
MM



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If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!

correction:
wire fee was $10. I forgot to hit the shift key...

I am looking for another checking account and have been reading these threads. In my own searching I also found this article on Pin vs. Signature:

http://www.colloquy.com/online/current_issue/v10i4/v10i4debmain.asp

Just additional info.

BSL

Registering for Colloquy is free I suggest it as it is for loyalty marketing professionals....


Winning the Debit Card
Tug of War

Both a cost-saving vehicle for banks and a convenience for consumers, debit cards are an ideal acquisition and retention vehicle, and a perfect appetizer to a broader, deeper relationship with consumers. Recognizing this opportunity, banks have turned to loyalty to differentiate their debit products and to "educate" consumers about the benefits of signature over PIN. But are they going about loyalty in the right way? And are they thinking far enough ahead?

It's a scenario common in today's retail world. Mr. Consumer takes his cart full of purchases to the checkout lane at Mega-Mart. While the cashier rings them up, Mr. Consumer waits patiently, trying to avoid succumbing to the impulse-buy enticements of the candy display.

Then it comes time to pony up. Mr. Consumer confidently produces his Behemoth Bank Visa Check Card to pay for his purchases. Although he was reluctant to use the debit card at first, he's since come around; it's much easier to bust out the plastic than it is to carry around a check book, and the ability to get extra cash at the checkout lane saves him trips to the ATM. Even better, Visa's backing enables him to pay for hotel stays and rental cars without racking up finance charges on his credit card. What's not to love?

Then comes the fatal question. The cashier fixes her steely gaze upon our hapless consumer and asks, "Will that be credit or debit, sir?"

Uh-oh. Nobody said there would be a quiz.

Suddenly the glaring spotlight is fixed inexorably upon our hero.Credit or debit? What's the difference? Should he punch in his PIN or sign for the purchase? Why is he being forced to make this decision? Is one option better than the other? Does one option cost more than the other? And most importantly for our purposes, how do the consequences of this decision affect Mr. Consumer's relationship with his bank?

Login in for more...

[This message has been edited by BSL (edited 12-12-2002).]

In my experience, mortgages with miles are more expensive than straight mortgages...the premium is more than the value of the miles.

My brother is a "big deal" mortgage broker.

If you want to compare, contact him at: clifford@slatermgt.com.

This is a plug for my brother...but I truly think you'll find the cost difference exceeds the miles value -- for most people. Maybe there are some programs where there isn't such a difference...

Let me know…as I intend to refinance a 5/1 ARM jumbo for the second time this year, if he can get me below 5%.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Marathon Man:
As a resident of MASS, I am out of state but use Direct Deposit, mail deposits and transfers to put money INTO BofA via ING Direct.com

The BofA I have is that Alaska Airlines Visa Check card which cost me $30 a year to have so that is a low cost considering.

I have a local checking acct. I use ING to transfer money into it, then ING to BofA. It comes in as a deposit days later and I can get the cash or do whatever.

So yes, that works. Set up INGdirect.com
But before you do, check PGary's site for offers that may give you a bonus or some referral $ for signing up.

http://home.earthlink.net/~pgary/MilesFrame.html

Go to his Finance section to find INGDirect.
Read what it says there. He did not ask me to do this. I am telling you this because this is where a few people I know learned about that bank and its bonusses. Sharing is good. You can do the referral or not. You can do it for him or not. If you wish to do it for me, send me the email once you read the info there.

Either way, if you want an easy online way to put money INTO an out of state bank, this ING is it. They are a savings bank (international-Dutch/US, etc.) that currently yeilds 2.8% and that is also nice to know for when your money is transferring in and out!

Good luck. I hope this more-than-enough information was helpful!

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif
MM
</font>

thanks for all the info! is there a reason i couldn't just use my local checking account (citibank in NY) to tranfer funds to my new bofa account when it runs low? i'm not sure i understand why i need the ING account.

i thought i could just use my free citibank online bill pay to transfer the funds to bofa. then use the alaska card to buy the money orders, putting that money back in my citibank account and transferring the money over to bofa again. start cycle over again. will this not work?

I just dont know of any other bank except for ING that allows you to "transfer" to another bank. ING becomes the 2nd step in a 3-way connector for this, but if Citi lets you then try it.

I may be mistaken but I would think that you cannot "pay" another bank using online bill paying tools in this way though... You can pay yourself but not the bank for this purpose. BUT if bill paying online lets you do it much like writing a check to one's self, then maybe you can. (Just as if one were to mail in a deposit from one bank to another and wrote it to self, it would go in.)

As for the "cycle thing" I would be more inclinded to certainly USE the BofA account as well, and not just spin-cycle thru it for miles alone. Cycle away, if your banking does require having to move money from one bank to another a lot, but Who knows if, how, or why that may raise a flag or 3 in the mile world... (I have no idea if it does)

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Marathon Man:
I just dont know of any other bank except for ING that allows you to "transfer" to another bank. </font>

Both my Fidelity Money Market fund and my PaineWebber account allow such transfers. Maybe your broker does or money market fund doe, too.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by writetorich:
Its not as if the miles are "free". merely a good deal at .5 cents.</font>

The cost is $2.50 per 1000 miles, or .25 cents a mile. Cheaper if you use Walmart.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by pgary:
The cost is $2.50 per 1000 miles, or .25 cents a mile. Cheaper if you use Walmart.</font>


so a free coach ticket (25k miles) is only $62.50. or a first class ticket (40k) is $100. that seems like a pretty hot deal.

i forgot that there is a $30 annual fee for the check card...but if you just earn 500 miles a week you can still get a free ticket for under $100 each year.


[This message has been edited by broadwayblue (edited 12-14-2002).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by burgerwars:
This is the difference between doing this, when compared to the C2IT thing. C2IT you can just sit at your computer and do the dastardly deed of transfering money for no purpose other than earning AA miles.
The B of A thing requires you to actually go to places: The post office and line-up for a money order (lines can be long at times) or another place to buy them, and then to your bank(s) to deposit/transfer money back in order to start the process again.
For a hypothetical, lets say you buy a $1,000 money order each time you do this. This will cost you $1.25. You get 500 Alaska frequent flyer miles. And lets say a frequent flyer mile is worth a penny (it can be more or less than this, depending on how it's redeemed). So for all your trouble, you netted $3.75 for all this work, and this doesn't count the value of your time, transportation costs, etc., doing this. Would one be better off just saving $5.00 each time in a savings account for travel, rather than running around doing this? That's hard to say. But given from what I can tell, most people on this board seemed to be at least upper-middle class, and thus I can't see them running around every evening after work doing this. Maybe once in a while to top an account off, and to say "I did it," but there may be easier ways to earn a free ticket. For me, if I work one day of overtime, I could probably earn enough money for an average discount airline ticket. That would sure be easier for me than running around for months doing this.
That said, I am as guilty as others in doing some airline mile "money laundering" once in a while.
Anyway, that's my two-cents worth again.

</font>

I'm not referring to the c2it product, Chase has the same type of debit card as BofA.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by raffy:
Last year, I considered this debit card to pay my mortgage by buying money orders, but after looking into the fees, which were nominal, the amount of work involved turned me off on this idea. Since there are no Chase branches in California, I would have to mail in my deposits, wait for them to post, then buy the money orders. If I didn't have a minimum balance, I would get dinged with a penalty.</font>

If this is your concern, the C2IT maybe the solution for you. I mean, using C2IT the service, rather than just laundering money to get AA miles. You can transfer money between checking accounts from different banks electronically. The service is free between US banks. And it is offered by Citibank, which has a market cap bigger than the entire airline industry combined. You can go to C2IT.com website and learn more about their service.

Miles for XMASS cookies anyone?...

I went into my same local Post Office in the fine city of Boston this morning and asked for "the usual" from a staff member who works there. Bobbi has become a friend of mine in the past few months because of all of this miles stuff and so that is a great bonus. We always talk about funny customer service issues while I am there and she has a few "regulars" like me who she is happy to see in the PO. Today, she gave me a nice box of home-made XMASS cookies when I used my card and that aint a bad perk just for swiping a debit card to get a few FF miles! So you see, it pays off in many ways to go postal! check it out:

********* To view Jeff F's 2 pictures at Shutterfly, simply go to:

http://www.shutterfly.com/osi.jsp?i=67b0de21b30d0ce28479

(If you can't click on this link, try copying and pasting it into your web browser.) *********

When I deposited the money order into my other bank down the street, I went to the teller this time instead of the ATM. I gave him a cookie and that teller happened to notice that I marked the deposit as CASH, thinking this is what a money order is.

He told me that banks do not consider money orders as CASH. They are as good as cash but the are more like paid, secured checks that post faster to a bank account.

So, when you buy your money orders, you are not buying cash over the counter! Good to know.

And less to worry about. It is a purchased PRODUCT, just like buying something online or in a store with the debit card.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gifMM

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If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by broadwayblue:

i forgot that there is a $30 annual fee for the check card</font>

Yes, but for first use you receive 3000 miles worth more than $30 ($60 to me).

Hello:

Is there any difference between the 2
debits cards (Americawest and Alaska)
offered by BOFA, in terms of awarding
miles to signature/pin based purchases?

I am deciding which debit card to get.
I want to fly to India from North
America. AmericaWest gives me a
business class ticket on british Airways
for 100k Americawest miles.

Alaska is charging 140k alaska airmiles
for the same.

Why is there such a big discrepancy,
am I missing something?

(I plan to use the debit card to
make mortgage payments every month.)

thank you very much for your help.

just checking to see if everyone is still receiving there miles?

I've heard they discontinued giving miles for money order purchases. Does anyone have any info to the contrary?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by hhonorman:
I've heard they discontinued giving miles for money order purchases. Does anyone have any info to the contrary? </font>

I wonder how they would know if the transaction was for a mo or if it were several rolls of postage stamps. I too would be curious to know if BofA has indeed stopped issuing miles for MO purchases.

It looks like the fun may be ending...I stopped receiving miles on MO transactions after early December.

[This message has been edited by mschaefer (edited 01-16-2003).]

Any news on this from anybody?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by mschaefer:
It looks like the fun may be ending...I stopped receiving miles on MO transactions after early December.

[This message has been edited by mschaefer (edited 01-16-2003).]</font>

Anyone else this is happening to? I was thinking of getting the B of A / Alaska Airlines debit card for this purpose, but if this is so, I won't bother.
But I also would like to know how B of A would know your purchase was for a money order or stamps? Both, I assumed, were run through as the same sort of debit transaction. Could one combine a purchase of one postage stamp with a $1,000 money order, so the purchase won't be a 100% money order transaction, to get around this?

My understanding is that all purchases have specific codes that allow BofA to know what it is. It is not visible on your receipt but gets electronically sent back to BofA to their database. In that case, MO's are picked out and excluded by software from earning miles, however, you would earn miles on your other purchases. The real fight is to get BofA to realize that MO should be acceptable forms of charge. Since they do make money from mechants that sell MO's

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Ken in Phx:
My understanding is that all purchases have specific codes that allow BofA to know what it is. It is not visible on your receipt but gets electronically sent back to BofA to their database. In that case, MO's are picked out and excluded by software from earning miles, however, you would earn miles on your other purchases. The real fight is to get BofA to realize that MO should be acceptable forms of charge. Since they do make money from mechants that sell MO's</font>

Exactly PHX. And more importantly, I have never received anything from BofA saying MOs would NOT earn miles - it would be a real crock if they just unilaterally started excluding MO purchases without any notification. Anybody receive any type of notification from BofA along these lines?



[This message has been edited by FlyChicago (edited 01-29-2003).]

I have not received any notification from BofA regarding any policy shift. I have been receiving my miles as scheduled (approx. 2k-3k month) for my debit card usage. The last posting for miles was 12/31/02 and they posted normally. I'll be sure to let everyone know how January's posting comes out.

I recv'd my miles from the M.O.'s I purchased. They posted on the 9th of January.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by nako:
Unless you have a Wal-Mart that doesn't know/care about policy, they won't let you. Money orders are cash/debit only.

Mike</font>

How about treaveler check?

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I just checked my account and noticed that I was only credited with miles for the purchase of money orders from Wal Mart and not the Post Office.
Has this happened to anyone else?

I did not get miles for money orders bought
at USPS. I got miles for signature based
transactions.
When I called BOFA they said,
they will not give miles for money orders
at all. They said they give miles only
for signature based purchases, not
PIN based purchases.

Its very confusing! People here say that
they got miles for PIN based purchases,
but BOFA strongly claims they never gave
miles for PIN based purchases?I called
them numerous times, same answer!

How do we get the last word on this
subject? anyone has any ideas?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by skiner:
I just checked my account and noticed that I was only credited with miles for the purchase of money orders from Wal Mart and not the Post Office.
Has this happened to anyone else?</font>


walmart seems to have a flaky policy as
far as money orders with check cards
is concerned. sometimes they do , sometimes
they dont accept atm cards!

I opened a c2it account and linked it to my Citi AAdvantage credit card. When I click on "Transfer", I only see c2it account as the "Source" so I cannot transfer from AAdvantage Credit Card (to earn the miles) to c2it. Did they just disable transfering from CC to c2it recently?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by jeffwebz:
I opened a c2it account and linked it to my Citi AAdvantage credit card. When I click on "Transfer", I only see c2it account as the "Source" so I cannot transfer from AAdvantage Credit Card (to earn the miles) to c2it. Did they just disable transfering from CC to c2it recently?</font>

I think you already answered your question in another post, but yes, they no longer allow transfers from credit cards into a c2it account. This happened some months ago.

Ok..this huge link is getting me really confusede. can anybody explain in a single consice post as to what the procedure is ith respect to :
1.Getting Money Orders thru Debit card
2.Putting them back into your checking/whatever account
3.Is that it? Does it mean I get miles for just this transaction? (whether PIN based/signature based)?
PLEASE explain...!!
Thanks guys..:-)

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by nbarve:
PLEASE explain...!!
Thanks guys..:-)</font>

it's over. BofA changed the rules this year.



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"Remember, no matter where you go, there you are", Buckaroo Bonzai

I know BofA changed their rule but is Chase/Co changed their rule too? Do I get miles with MO purchase? Also is it free to transfer money from one bank to another? Is it abosolutely free for both sender and receiver? thanks for your help !

Chase does not give miles for PIN transactions.

I just checked their website. I think they do though.... or am i misunderstanding?

From Chase's website

Customers can earn up to 80,000 miles per year including bonus miles.

It's an ATM/debit card that enables you to earn one (1) OnePass® mile for every two ($2) dollars spent on purchases made with the card, excluding ATM withdrawals. Miles are not earned on the cash back portion of Point of Sales (POS) transactions.

Where does it mention PIN purchases?

Do all of my transactions earn points?
All purchases made with your Chase Banking Card enable you to earn Chase Leisure Rewards points. This includes purchases that require your secret code and purchases that require your signature. You do not earn points for ATM withdrawals, or on the cash back portion of Point of Sale (POS) transactions.

well this is for Chase Leisure Rewards points. so same thing for continental? I dont know...because they really didnt mention it.