Alaska - Alaska This Summer?

Hi everyone! We are thinking of a 10-12 day Alaska trip this summer. Because of other committments, there are only narrow time windows when we might be able to travel

June 28 - July 8
July 28 - August 10
August 10 - August 23

Birding will be a prime focus of the trip but not all of it (And I will be posting in birding forums for advice also)

I am wondering though on tips on weather, travel costs etc. The latter two are MOST convenient for us but I am suspecting the first time period might have clearer weather, etc. Is there a huge different between any of these dates on weather, views/clear skies, availability, etc?

We are not cruise fans so we were thiking about flying to ANC, renting and going up towards Denali NP, Fairbanks, maybe along the peninsula south of Anchorage, and another flight for a few days somewhere more remote (Nome?)

Any thoughts? Thanks!

Statistically, the earlier part of the summer is clearer, but weather is very unpredictable up here. Still, it's mostly true that once in the latter half of July, weather starts to go downhill pretty rapidly. By fair time (mid/end August), clear skies are a thing of the past, although the giant vegetables (~100-pound cabbages, etc.) are worth seeing if you pick the third set of dates.

Sounds like your plan is valid. 10-12 days is about perfect--I hate trying to see people cram a 5-7 day itinerary in.

There has been lots of discussion in older (hidden) threads about what to see and do in Alaska, so rather than spend an hour re-typing it, I'll see if I can dig up some links to threads with good info. You might want to search through some of the older threads and see if anything worthwhile comes up, too.

Try this post, which links to what I consider to be some of the threads with the best discussion on what to see/do:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?p=8165779#post8165779

There have been several threads since that post with good information, too.

Of course, feel free to post any more questions and we'll try to help you plan it out!

Statistically, the earlier part of the summer is clearer, but weather is very unpredictable up here. Still, it's mostly true that once in the latter half of July, weather starts to go downhill pretty rapidly. By fair time (mid/end August), clear skies are a thing of the past, although the giant vegetables (~100-pound cabbages, etc.) are worth seeing if you pick the third set of dates.


For Fairbanks, at least, I agree with this entirely. The earlier the better, really. The only exception I can think of is during a year of bad forest fires. In that case a little later in the summer, once the rain shows up, could offer for clearer skies. But fires tend to be hard to predict.

For Fairbanks, at least, I agree with this entirely. The earlier the better, really. The only exception I can think of is during a year of bad forest fires. In that case a little later in the summer, once the rain shows up, could offer for clearer skies. But fires tend to be hard to predict.


Thanks for all the help! I am sure I will come up with more questions. I am hearing that weather wise (and scenery will be a big part of our trip) that if we can swing it, that June 28 - July 8 time frame is better for us. It sounds like the weather difference in August is more than I thought (being a 'rainy season')

It also sounds like the Kenai Peninsula is a must. Is it worth a boat ride to see the glaciers at the NP, or can you see a lot of that from land. How bad is the wave action - I am not good with open seas and motion sickness!! :)

Thanks for all the help! I am sure I will come up with more questions. I am hearing that weather wise (and scenery will be a big part of our trip) that if we can swing it, that June 28 - July 8 time frame is better for us. It sounds like the weather difference in August is more than I thought (being a 'rainy season')

It also sounds like the Kenai Peninsula is a must. Is it worth a boat ride to see the glaciers at the NP, or can you see a lot of that from land. How bad is the wave action - I am not good with open seas and motion sickness!! :)
You're correct with the analysis on the weather.

The Kenai is definitely a must, too. McKinley is huge and majestic, but the Kenai puts you right up close to the mountains and water.

The 26 Glacier Cruise out of Whittier is good for those with motion sickness (it's a high-speed catamaran on the smooth water of Prince William Sound). The bigger boats in Seward probably aren't too bad if you take a motion sickness pill, but definitely avoid the smaller boats (e.g. the Mariah small boat tours) out of Seward.

You can see Exit Glacier from land or Portage Glacier from a smaller (and smooth) lake, but the majority of glaciers are tidewater glaciers and must be seen from boats either out of Whittier or Seward.

Hi everyone... well it ended up that our trip dates are August 11-24, the other date ranges were not feasable. Here is the route we are going to try and do.

Anchorage - Glenn Hwy - Valdez - Richardson Hwy - Denali Hwy - (maybe Tok / Yukon Border) - Fairbanks - Denali NP - Parks Hwy - Anchorage - Kenai Pen

I have a question on fishing. My father in law would like to fish a few times. I do not think bringing his own equipment is that feasible. Is renting of such equipment feasible, or is using guides the best option. Anyone have specific locations and reccomendations given the above route?
Thanks!

Hi everyone... well it ended up that our trip dates are August 11-24, the other date ranges were not feasable. Here is the route we are going to try and do.

Anchorage - Glenn Hwy - Valdez - Richardson Hwy - Denali Hwy - (maybe Tok / Yukon Border) - Fairbanks - Denali NP - Parks Hwy - Anchorage - Kenai Pen

I have a question on fishing. My father in law would like to fish a few times. I do not think bringing his own equipment is that feasible. Is renting of such equipment feasible, or is using guides the best option. Anyone have specific locations and reccomendations given the above route?
Thanks!Check with your rental car company re the Denali Highway. Most won't allow their vehicles on the road.

http://www.sewardak.org/news-events/derby/salmonderby.htm

Check with your rental car company re the Denali Highway. Most won't allow their vehicles on the road.

http://www.sewardak.org/news-events/derby/salmonderby.htm

Correct. Just got back from Alaska, take a private tour bus through Denali NPP or the Parks Bus. Either one is well worth it, although on the private buses, you won't be able to get off and on at various stops throughout the park at your leisure.

We did the 12 hour tour and it was absolutely fantastic. ^ ^

Correct. Just got back from Alaska, take a private tour bus through Denali NPP or the Parks Bus. Either one is well worth it, although on the private buses, you won't be able to get off and on at various stops throughout the park at your leisure.

We did the 12 hour tour and it was absolutely fantastic. ^ ^

I checked my online agreement and did not see anything about banning certain road types. Perhaps since it is a Jeep Grand Cherokee they are more lenient. I certainly will call and confirm though!

Initial research seems to suggest good charter fishing near Copper River (Glenallen), and also near Kenai. I think with some of the prices... we will be only chartering once! (Unless we can come up with some cheaper fishing options at other places). Any other places rent equipment for short periods?

That "online agreement" is simply a reservation, not a contract between you and the rental agency. The T&C normally listed on a reservation are mostly pertaining to the reservation itself (i.e. financial information, no-show policies, age restrictions, etc.). The T&C of the actual rental contract, which usually takes up several folds of a rental jacket or the entire back of a rental contract, are separate--those are the ones that deal with things like damage to the car, prohibited uses of the vehicle, who is authorized to drive the vehicle, etc.

All of the national chain-affiliated rental agencies in Anchorage (Hertz, Alamo National, Budget, Avis, Dollar Thrifty, and Enterprise) prohibit driving on unpaved and unmaintained roads. This includes the Denali Highway, as well as the Dalton, Dempster, Elliott, Steese (north of Chatanika), Taylor, and Top Of The World Highways. They do not discriminate by vehicle types--ALL are prohibited from driving these roads.

Of course, "prohibited" is a relative term--it's not like the rental agency is going to stalk you down and take away your keys halfway between Cantwell and Paxson. However, know that not only would any coverage you purchase from the rental agency is voided on these roads, there is a chance that any coverage you have that extends to the car (your own car insurance, if that extends, and any credit card coverage) may be voided as well, since you are technically violating the rental agreement. Additionally, you may be responsible for some (or all) of the towing charges for things which would normally be covered under roadside assistance (such as mechanical breakdowns). Also, be aware that, while the Denali is a very scenic road, it's also a very lonely road, and if something does happen, there is no cell service and it could be awhile before someone comes across you. Take lots of extra water and food. It's also a good thing to have the Grand Cherokee, as it's got a full-size spare (which will perform much better than a donut spare on that long of a dirt or gravel road). If you end up with another SUV (I never trust the actual car types listed online--they are samples only), you'll want to make sure it comes with a full-size spare.

Having said all of this, though, several years ago, my grandfather and I successfully took a 1984 Toyota Tercel with no spare provisions (save for a few slices of bread and peanut butter and jelly) and no real emergency supplies across the highway without incident, so I don't mean to completely scare you out of doing it... :)

Regardless of your route, make sure you get a copy of The Milepost (http://themilepost.com)!

Having said all of this, though, several years ago, my grandfather and I successfully took a 1984 Toyota Tercel with no spare provisions (save for a few slices of bread and peanut butter and jelly) and no real emergency supplies across the highway without incident, so I don't mean to completely scare you out of doing it... :)Cool. My crossings of the Denali included a 1977 Volkswagen Rabbit (couple/three times) and a 1983 Renault Fuego. Provisions in the Fuego trip included fishing tackle and some blueberries picked roadside around 50 miles in from Cantwell (said picking aborted when my picking pal announced there was a sow brownie around 200 yards away. Oops, time to get in the motor.) Crap car on a crap road, what a genius move. :rolleyes:

Correct. Just got back from Alaska, take a private tour bus through Denali NPP or the Parks Bus. Either one is well worth it, although on the private buses, you won't be able to get off and on at various stops throughout the park at your leisure.

We did the 12 hour tour and it was absolutely fantastic. ^ ^

Umm, for the sake of clarity, the Denali Hwy is different than the Denali National Park Road (aka McKinley Park Rd.) The Park road has the busses. Denali Hwy is a mostly gravel road from Cantwell to Paxson. Did it in "99" with a regular rental car and just avoided the potholes. Fabulous scenery.

Umm, for the sake of clarity, the Denali Hwy is different than the Denali National Park Road (aka McKinley Park Rd.) The Park road has the busses. Denali Hwy is a mostly gravel road from Cantwell to Paxson. Did it in "99" with a regular rental car and just avoided the potholes. Fabulous scenery.

And the Park road is different than the Parks Hwy.

Sheesh, I can see how confusing Alaska's named highways can be for visitors...

Unfortunately, when one of them asks how to get to Highway 3 north, I stare at them blankly...

Umm, for the sake of clarity, the Denali Hwy is different than the Denali National Park Road (aka McKinley Park Rd.) The Park road has the busses. Denali Hwy is a mostly gravel road from Cantwell to Paxson. Did it in "99" with a regular rental car and just avoided the potholes. Fabulous scenery.

Excellent point. I completely overlooked that and was in fact confusing the Denali Highway with the Parks Highway.

Umm, for the sake of clarity, the Denali Hwy is different than the Denali National Park Road (aka McKinley Park Rd.) The Park road has the busses. Denali Hwy is a mostly gravel road from Cantwell to Paxson. Did it in "99" with a regular rental car and just avoided the potholes. Fabulous scenery.


The question becomes.... do we think the ANC Rental car places have advanced to have those onboard hidden GPS units to track where the vehicle has been driven?

:)

Anchorage? Heh heh heh...to the ANC car rental agencies, computer systems are newfangled equipment. I don't even think they know what GPS is... :P

Anchorage? Heh heh heh...to the ANC car rental agencies, computer systems are newfangled equipment. I don't even think they know what GPS is... :P
That is good to know!!! ;)

You are in Alaska the last frontier. They took a look and smell at my rental and told me where I had driven the rental. I might be joking a little about smelling the car but they really can tell and you do not need a broken windshield for them to know.

You are in Alaska the last frontier. They took a look and smell at my rental and told me where I had driven the rental. I might be joking a little about smelling the car but they really can tell and you do not need a broken windshield for them to know.

This is a good point. How "rustic" is the Denali Hwy. I have been on some pretty crazy roads with rentals (The road to the Pryor Horse Range in northern Wyoming - anyone been on that crazy road, that took 3 hrs to go 7 miles? ;) I wonder if I violated that rental agreement. Being a birder, sometimes we end up on some back roads..... I have taken cars to the car wash near the end of the rental to make them loook better, but a chipped windshield would be harder to hide!

I imagine that (Denali) would be the worst road we would go on - is it THAT bad?

Well, it's not that bad. Like I said, we did it in a 1984 Tercel with no problems. Honestly, a broken windshield is less of a problem on that highway than on the Glenn or the Parks (since there will be no cars ahead of you to spin a rock up). Just take it easy so you don't completely kill the suspension.

Speaking of the suspension, the McCarthy Road is by far the worst highway I've driven on in the state. It took 3 hours to go the 60 or so miles, and when we came back onto the paved highway, the car rode like a boat for the entire trip home (shocks were shot). The Denali is tame in comparison.

I drove out to Spiral Jetty on the Great Salt Lake--it's accessed by a 15-mile dirt road from Golden Spike NHS. It took about an hour to traverse it--I was doing 55 on some stretches, but toward the end, I was quite literally doing about 5mph. Was glad I had a Chevy Trailbazer...I'm sure the rental agency wasn't as glad as I was...

That "online agreement" is simply a reservation, not a contract between you and the rental agency. The T&C normally listed on a reservation are mostly pertaining to the reservation itself (i.e. financial information, no-show policies, age restrictions, etc.). The T&C of the actual rental contract, which usually takes up several folds of a rental jacket or the entire back of a rental contract, are separate--those are the ones that deal with things like damage to the car, prohibited uses of the vehicle, who is authorized to drive the vehicle, etc.

All of the national chain-affiliated rental agencies in Anchorage (Hertz, Alamo National, Budget, Avis, Dollar Thrifty, and Enterprise) prohibit driving on unpaved and unmaintained roads. This includes the Denali Highway, as well as the Dalton, Dempster, Elliott, Steese (north of Chatanika), Taylor, and Top Of The World Highways. They do not discriminate by vehicle types--ALL are prohibited from driving these roads.

Of course, "prohibited" is a relative term--it's not like the rental agency is going to stalk you down and take away your keys halfway between Cantwell and Paxson.

Note that a couple of the major rental car companies out of ANC are getting lazy/slimey on their contract inserts and are simply listing the Steese and Elliott highways as "prohibited" vs the unpaved sections. I wonder if they'd refuse to assist and cover someone if they broke down on the Steese Expressway in "downtown" Fairbanks ...

Anyway, we've just finished yet another trip up the Dalton to Atigun Pass and back. The vehicle: a rented Ford subcompact :)

Anyway, we've just finished yet another trip up the Dalton to Atigun Pass and back. The vehicle: a rented Ford subcompact :)

I just the Antigun Pass on the show, "Tougher In Alaska." Must have been beautiful at this time of the year. On the show, it was winter and that road looks absolutely treacherous.

Sorry I missed this earlier, but if birding is a focus, you'll need to get far out of Anchorage, especially in August. Anchorage has some beautiful walks and nice greenspace, but you'll be sick of magpies by the time you're a mile from the airport and you're already sick of mallards. Around town, you can get red-necked grebes and a couple other things, if you're lucky, at Westchester lagoon, and there are sometimes eagles by the beaver dam at the Eagle River Nature Center. The Kenai Fjords glacier tour, out of Seward, made for the best day I had, with several nice pelagics (though I'm not good enough to tell them all apart, and on the tour boat you're on your own for birds).

Denali was good for the willow ptarmigan and the gyrfalcon (but good looks at both). Great trip with opportunities to use good bins, but not abundant birding.

The good stuff is on the northern breeding grounds, which is a Major Trip. You should look at a trip to one of the northern towns (if I recall, Nome caters to birders some). The best destination in Alaska is the Pribilofs, which is very costly, and carries a high risk of multi-day fog delays in August. However, that's where you're going to see real variety and the possibility of Bering Sea accidentals; I didn't get to go (with a toddler), but I've heard it's amazing. There's a native corporation that operates an all-inclusive tour that last summer was about $1600 for 3 days.

and there are sometimes eagles by the beaver dam at the Eagle River Nature Center.

There is a Eagles nest at the north end of Anchorage International, a bit to the west of earthquake park almost underneath the approach path of the runway.

There is a Eagles nest at the north end of Anchorage International, a bit to the west of earthquake park almost underneath the approach path of the runway.
I appreciate that tip...I'm not a birder, but I do have plans during my upcoming trip to take a few hours to hike (and do a little Geocaching (http://www.geocaching.com) along) the Tony Knowles Trail from downtown, thru EQ Park, and then out to Point Woronzof. I will be on the lookout for that. As I'm not a birder, I'm kinda dumb about these things: Can you offer an even more specific place to start looking for it?

Sorry I missed this earlier, but if birding is a focus, you'll need to get far out of Anchorage, especially in August. Anchorage has some beautiful walks and nice greenspace, but you'll be sick of magpies by the time you're a mile from the airport and you're already sick of mallards. Around town, you can get red-necked grebes and a couple other things, if you're lucky, at Westchester lagoon, and there are sometimes eagles by the beaver dam at the Eagle River Nature Center. The Kenai Fjords glacier tour, out of Seward, made for the best day I had, with several nice pelagics (though I'm not good enough to tell them all apart, and on the tour boat you're on your own for birds).

Denali was good for the willow ptarmigan and the gyrfalcon (but good looks at both). Great trip with opportunities to use good bins, but not abundant birding.

The good stuff is on the northern breeding grounds, which is a Major Trip. You should look at a trip to one of the northern towns (if I recall, Nome caters to birders some). The best destination in Alaska is the Pribilofs, which is very costly, and carries a high risk of multi-day fog delays in August. However, that's where you're going to see real variety and the possibility of Bering Sea accidentals; I didn't get to go (with a toddler), but I've heard it's amazing. There's a native corporation that operates an all-inclusive tour that last summer was about $1600 for 3 days.


Thanks for the info! Unfortuntely I don't think we will make it to the Aleutians or the Far North this time - definitely ideas for future trips, though!
I have heard similar about Anchorage, not to spend too much time in the city. I did read a post recently about a Surfbird that is easy to spot in the ANC city limits right now but he might be gone by then. Our birding itinerary could be

Hatcher Pass / Glenn Hwy - Alpine areas and Glacier, also Eagle River Nature Center for eagles and salmon watching.
Denali Highway - excellent for a number of birds (jaeger, smith's longspur etc)
Fairbanks - ABO Bird Banding
Denali NP - Gyrfalcon, Ptarmigan, others?
Homer - Kachemak Bay tours
Seward - Kenai Fjords

Do you have any specifics on the Kenai Pen. on places to bird? Which tour did you use for the Fjords? We are not sure which one to choose? Are there any that you know of that cater to birders? The one in Kachemack Bay does I am told (Karl Stofus).

Another reason for our trip is fishing... for my father-in-law. We would love to do some salmon fishing with a guide, but have not decided on Copper River vs. Kenai (two places I have heard a lot about). Leaning now towards Kenai... anyone have experience with fishing charters down there (or at Copper) to reccomend one?

I just the Antigun Pass on the show, "Tougher In Alaska." Must have been beautiful at this time of the year. On the show, it was winter and that road looks absolutely treacherous.

I just got back last week after 2.5 weeks in Alaska, including a trip all the way up the Dalton. We took two days up and two days back. It was gorgeous on the way up (not a cloud in the sky and lots of animals), but rained much of the trip back south, including across Atigun Pass. I certainly held on to the steering wheel more tightly, but was fine as long as I drove slowly. More of a concern were the two or three sections of road that had just been graded, and turned to a thin layer of slippery mud in the rain. For me, it was a matter of going slow in the correct places, and giving the trucks a wide berth.

BTW - we rented from a company in Fairbanks that specializes in rentals to go up the Dalton. It was more expensive, but worth it.

riftime

I just got back last week after 2.5 weeks in Alaska, including a trip all the way up the Dalton. We took two days up and two days back. It was gorgeous on the way up (not a cloud in the sky and lots of animals), but rained much of the trip back south, including across Atigun Pass. I certainly held on to the steering wheel more tightly, but was fine as long as I drove slowly. More of a concern were the two or three sections of road that had just been graded, and turned to a thin layer of slippery mud in the rain. For me, it was a matter of going slow in the correct places, and giving the trucks a wide berth.

BTW - we rented from a company in Fairbanks that specializes in rentals to go up the Dalton. It was more expensive, but worth it.

riftime
I've seen brochures for that company (they do things like outfit the vehicles with two full-size spare tires and emergency supplies, I think), but I cannot for the life of me remember the company's name. Would you mind sharing that bit of information?

I've seen brochures for that company (they do things like outfit the vehicles with two full-size spare tires and emergency supplies, I think), but I cannot for the life of me remember the company's name. Would you mind sharing that bit of information?

Here is the company we rented from:
http://arctic-outfitters.com/index.htm

Indeed, we got two mounted and inflated spare tires, plus a good sized tool kit. That took up about half the trunk of the Taurus. Still managed to get two small suitcases and a rollerbag in, though (there were four of us). There is a CB radio, too, which was helpful with all the truck traffic. We rented from June 13-18, so two days were at the $149 per day, and the other four days were $169 per day. I also got the sense that their mechanics do a very good job of keeping the cars in good working order. The tires that were mounted on the front were brand new; the agent said they swap out tires well before the end of a "normal" life.

There is one other company that rents vehicles for trips up the Dalton:
http://www.paratours.net
The main reason we did not choose them was for our time period, they only had pickup trucks available, and no way to enclose suitcases while driving in such a dusty environment. If we could have gotten an SUV from them, we might have gone with them. But I really liked Arctic Outfitters.

We enjoyed it a lot, and had better peace of mind knowing we were renting a car better equipped for such a trip. :cool:

riftime

Do you think border guards check rental policies? I would love to take a 'side diversion' down the Alaska Highway so we could say we were in the Yukon!! (I know crazy...) It looks like the border is actually before the customs station so we might be good there? Is there anything interesting to do near the Canadian border on the Alaskan highway?

Here is the company we rented from:
http://arctic-outfitters.com/index.htm

Indeed, we got two mounted and inflated spare tires, plus a good sized tool kit. That took up about half the trunk of the Taurus. Still managed to get two small suitcases and a rollerbag in, though (there were four of us). There is a CB radio, too, which was helpful with all the truck traffic. We rented from June 13-18, so two days were at the $149 per day, and the other four days were $169 per day. I also got the sense that their mechanics do a very good job of keeping the cars in good working order. The tires that were mounted on the front were brand new; the agent said they swap out tires well before the end of a "normal" life.

There is one other company that rents vehicles for trips up the Dalton:
http://www.paratours.net
The main reason we did not choose them was for our time period, they only had pickup trucks available, and no way to enclose suitcases while driving in such a dusty environment. If we could have gotten an SUV from them, we might have gone with them. But I really liked Arctic Outfitters.

We enjoyed it a lot, and had better peace of mind knowing we were renting a car better equipped for such a trip. :cool:

riftime

I don't think the border guards specifically check the rental terms and conditions. Canadian border patrol guards will NOT let a Canadian citizen into Canada in an American rental car, though (they don't want Canadians crossing the border to take advantage of low[er]-tax American rental cars, I guess). But if you're not Canadian, you should probably be fine.

At the very least (if they do give you grief), if all you want to do is say you've been to the Yukon, you can leave the car behind and just walk across, take a picture, and then walk back.

Do you think it is enough to cover Denali NP in one day? I have heard some say because it is hard to get to do much because of the restricted access, without going into back country (which we are not equipped to do). Trying to fit everything into a schedule such as this

Aug 11-12 Soldotna (salmon fishing)
Aug 13 Sheep Mountain Lodge
Aug 14-15 Tangle River / Denali Hwy
Aug 16 Fairbanks
Aug 17-18 Denali Area
Aug 19-20 (for Aug 20 boat trip Homer)
Aug 21-23 Seward
Aug 24 to ANC to fly home 10pm

As you can see that is quite a drive from Denali to Homer. We have the fishing booked early but the trip is currently arranged to have the Kenai stuff at the end. I could 1. Try and rearrange the whole trip, or if starting on 17th we could spend all day at Denali there, then the AM 18th, before cutting thiat trip in half, and staying somewhere around Anchorage on the 18th or just north, that could cut the longish drive in half. What does everyone think, is that enough time to experience Denali?

In a word: 'no'. You are not figuring the sort of roads you have in Alaska. They are not interstate highways with controlled access and plenty of room for passing slower traffic. Often you are on a 2 lane road and stuck with the average speeds. A wreck, a moose in the road or just bad luck.....you wait.

I have sat on the road to Homer stopped by fog. I mean stopped. Road closed! As in officially closed due to the danger. I have sat on the road to and from Denali in stopped traffic or extremely slow traffic when a bunch of RV's got into convoys (not legal by the way) and decided to amble. If the state fair is on.........

jackal loves to drive and to do a lot fast. I'll leave it to him to study your schedule.

Hehe, oldpenny16 knows me too well. :)

I'd have to take another look at your schedule when I'm a little more awake (I've been up for 33 hours but am the proud owner of a new black 16GB iPhone 3G), but I'm not sure it's completely unmanageable. Ambitious yes, but not impossible. Maybe.

Do you think it is enough to cover Denali NP in one day? I have heard some say because it is hard to get to do much because of the restricted access, without going into back country (which we are not equipped to do). Trying to fit everything into a schedule such as this

Aug 11-12 Soldotna (salmon fishing)
Aug 13 Sheep Mountain Lodge
Aug 14-15 Tangle River / Denali Hwy
Aug 16 Fairbanks
Aug 17-18 Denali Area
Aug 19-20 (for Aug 20 boat trip Homer)
Aug 21-23 Seward
Aug 24 to ANC to fly home 10pm

As you can see that is quite a drive from Denali to Homer. We have the fishing booked early but the trip is currently arranged to have the Kenai stuff at the end. I could 1. Try and rearrange the whole trip, or if starting on 17th we could spend all day at Denali there, then the AM 18th, before cutting thiat trip in half, and staying somewhere around Anchorage on the 18th or just north, that could cut the longish drive in half. What does everyone think, is that enough time to experience Denali?

That's a lot in "back and forth" and lost time on the highway. I would suggest doing the southern end at one time, and the northern the other.

Anchorage, Soldotna, Seward & Homer early, then head up to Denali and Fairbanks. I would prefer to have at least two days in Denali, especially if the one day you're there it's crummy weather. I'd keep my plans re: Fairbanks flexible and punt if another day in Denali is desired.

That's a lot in "back and forth" and lost time on the highway. I would suggest doing the southern end at one time, and the northern the other.

Anchorage, Soldotna, Seward & Homer early, then head up to Denali and Fairbanks. I would prefer to have at least two days in Denali, especially if the one day you're there it's crummy weather. I'd keep my plans re: Fairbanks flexible and punt if another day in Denali is desired.

I'd tend to agree. Also, your plans near the end - don't forget that Homer to Seward is not an insubstantial drive. And personally, I'd bag Fairbanks unless you have some real burning desire to go, or special thing/person to see, as it adds a lot of travel time taken from Denali.

Do you think it is enough to cover Denali NP in one day? I have heard some say because it is hard to get to do much because of the restricted access, without going into back country (which we are not equipped to do).

Regarding Denali NP, what is your plan to see and experience it? They have shuttles and tours which really are pretty much full days. The restricted access people talk about is that you cannot drive your personal auto into Denali beyond something like the 15 mile marker on the road INSIDE the park. Beyond that point, you must take one of the ARAMARK tours or the Wonder Lake Shuttle. It is well worth it to go deeper inside the park as there is very little to generally see that first 15 miles or so. The wildlife we saw was much deeper in, but also very viewable from the road/bus.

So you really don't need to be equipped to go into the back country, only willing to pony up the money for one of the tours. BTW, do not buy from any vendor other than the ARAMARK folks. They have a web site where you can buy online . . . waiting until you're there may result in sold-out conditions.

If you want more info on the tours offered, we did the Wildnerness Tour (DO NOT RECOMMEND) and the Wonder Lake Shuttle (HIGHLY RECOMMENDED). When we do Denali again, we'll probably do the shuttle on two consecutive days. I have written about our experiences on both of these options over at www.igougo.com. You can access my journals through the link in my sig here.

Have a great time!
Von

Thanks for the link to your write ups on IgoUgo.

Thanks for the link to your write ups on IgoUgo.
I second that! Will have to take a deeper look sometime, but it looks like an extensive collection!

Is the Wilderness Tour the one that uses the green old school buses?

The ARAMARK park shuttles use the old brown buses and are literally shuttles (you can get on or get off at will). There are some very similar green buses, though, that I thought were run by the same operator but were different (and more expensive). Any idea what those are? (It's been more than 10 years since I did the Denali bus ride...)

http://www.igougo.com/images/p220136-Denali_National_Park-Wonder_Lake_Shuttle_Bus.jpg

Here is a photo of the Wonder Lake Shuttle we did with ARAMARK in July 06.

I can't remember if the Tundra Wilderness bus was green or brown (I seem to recall brown however) . . . it was also a school bus type vehicle but had a set up for hot and cold drinking water out of the back of the bus. Someone recently posted somewhere that they now have viewing screens to see wildlife, but I don't know about that personally.

I think all of the tour vehicles operating in Denali NP are operated by ARAMARK, although some of the other tour companies do sell tickets for a marked up price. Princess Cruises was the biggest one back in 2006 with tickets marked up some 20% as I recall.

As for my Alaska/Denali travel journals, you will find them at the bottom of the list there.

Hmm. Maybe the shuttles are green and the wilderness buses are brown. (Maybe I had them backwards.) I think they're both old converted school buses, though.

What happens on the Tundra Wilderness bus?

Hmm. Maybe the shuttles are green and the wilderness buses are brown. (Maybe I had them backwards.) I think they're both old converted school buses, though.

What happens on the Tundra Wilderness bus?

The Tundra Wildnerness bus tour was more a tour with guided narration than the Wonder Lake Shuttle, although our shuttle driver was very informative and was as much a guide as the woman we had the next day on the Wilderness Tour.

Back in 2006 the buses did not have the screens that they are now promoting on the ARAMARK site about this tour. Apparently the buses have been equipped to shoot shoot video which is viewable on these screens. After the tour, you can buy the video which has some footage from your tour too. (Sounds to me like just another way to make money off the tourists!)

The hot/cold water equipment at the rear of the bus is pretty spiffy as you can fix something to warm to drink (hot cocoa, cider, tea, etc).

One of the things we disliked most about the Wilderness Tour is that it's cut short by about two hours if the mountain (Denali) isn't in view. Many of our animal sightings the day before on the Wonder Lake Shuttle was beyond the point where the Wilderness Tour bus turn around.

Considering the steep price difference, we just didn't think it was worth the money.

Von: Thanks for your link to igougo.com. That is a cool site, and your posts were great to read!

Here is an update - the bird guide in Homer can take us the 22nd, so now we can take that 2nd day in Denali after all..... We'll stay around Denali 8/17 and 8/18, drive halfway on 8/19, and then to Homer on 8/20. Our boat tour there (these tours are supposed to be great: http://www.xyz.net/~bay/Birding%20Trips.html)
will be on 8/21, with 8/22 as a backup. The Mariah Kenai Fjord boat tour in Seward would be 8/23. Hopefully we won't need a backup as 8/24 is the drive back to ANC to go home.

Fairbanks: The reason we're going is to see bird banding at the Alaska Bird Observatory at Creamer's Field (this looks like a cool place to visit also). It is kind of risky cause this is a ways out of the way, and if the weather is wrong it will be a dud. Maybe at that point we could cancel and head south, I hope not though, cause we're hoping to see that!

Denali: Glad we are spending the two days now. I was picturing more regular buses where we could get on and off easily on a regular basis ,like Zion NP in Utah. There are some nice tundra areas a ways into the park that are good for birding (Gyrfalcon is our target!). We'll do the bus that Von suggested I gues and then spend time there also the second day. We also got a tip that the road into Petersville (sp?) south of the park can offer even better views of Mt. McKinley - if it is clear, of course, if we have time on our way to ANC. Looking for lodging for the two days, around Healy now.

I have to be careful about wanting to drive long distances, I am an "extra miler" and have visited every county in the 48 states of the US (some of us geographers are crazy that way). Never been to AK or HI so these will be new counties (boroughs) for me. (http://www.extramilerclub.org/). luckily this time my wife and in-laws are with me to prevent me from being even more crazy and driving over the Yukon border to get that province under my belt!



Hmm. Maybe the shuttles are green and the wilderness buses are brown. (Maybe I had them backwards.) I think they're both old converted school buses, though.

What happens on the Tundra Wilderness bus?

The road to Petersville is interesting. Many years ago lots of land were given out in the Alaska land lottery. There are some good views of Denali (in fine weather) but there is a point where the road ends in a ruined bridge. The MILEPOST should have that information. Beyond the ruined bridge is where the land was given away. Hiked in there once and won't do it again.

Have you got Potter Marsh south of Anchorage on your list? It can be very good for birds and other wild life.

Do have a great time!

Thanks for the tips!! Potter Marsh is on the agenda, I have heard elsewhere that this is a must stop, and I think it is right on Turnagin Arm on the way to the Kenai. There is a place called Goose Lake in ANC I also have to check, which has Pacific Loons.

I heard good things about the Petersville road from other birders, and also there is supposed to be a great restaurant there, near the end by that bridge. I have to find my notes!

If anyone is interested in a very good specific Alaska birding book, by the way, check this one:
http://americanbirding.org/pubs/siteguides/ak.html

Dr. West has a 2008 edition due out any day now. I have e-mailed him personally several times and he has had some great suggestions! He's a former AK resident/birder who now lives in AZ....

The road to Petersville is interesting. Many years ago lots of land were given out in the Alaska land lottery. There are some good views of Denali (in fine weather) but there is a point where the road ends in a ruined bridge. The MILEPOST should have that information. Beyond the ruined bridge is where the land was given away. Hiked in there once and won't do it again.

Have you got Potter Marsh south of Anchorage on your list? It can be very good for birds and other wild life.

Do have a great time!

Potter Marsh is down a bit from ANC on Alaska !. Not far at all. Watch out for bears and moose!

Most tourists drive along Turnagain Arm as fast as possible (or sleep on the trains and tour buses) and miss it all.

Sad!

They think that just because it is close to Anchorage and a well traveled road that nothing is there to see.

Potter Marsh is down a bit from ANC on Alaska !. Not far at all. Watch out for bears and moose!

Most tourists drive along Turnagain Arm as fast as possible (or sleep on the trains and tour buses) and miss it all.

Sad!

They think that just because it is close to Anchorage and a well traveled road that nothing is there to see.

Potter's Marsh is in ANC.They just opened up some great new upgrades.
When I think about it the ANC borough is a birders paradise,with all the area between Eklutna and Portage.

Most tourists drive along Turnagain Arm as fast as possible (or sleep on the trains and tour buses) and miss it all.

Sad!

They think that just because it is close to Anchorage and a well traveled road that nothing is there to see.

Not this tourist! We absolutely loved that drive along Turnagain Arm and we stopped wherever there was a stop to take in the spectacular views. Anybody who drives on that road as fast as they can is, well, I guess there's no other way to say it; an idiot. :D

I heard good things about the Petersville road from other birders, and also there is supposed to be a great restaurant there, near the end by that bridge. I have to find my notes!

Great restaurant?? The only restaurant I can think of is the Forks Roadhouse and it's ok, not great. (I guess you could call it the best around for miles though)

The Petersville Road is reasonably good up til the Forks, but it's often a mess beyond there. There can be huge rutted, eroded sections up and down the hills that require considerable care and flooded sections in the low lying areas that require either fording them or simply turning back.

I enjoy the road and the area, but then again I have no qualms about taking a compact rental car through fords or on a road with 18" deep ruts.

Here's a brief writeup on the road:

http://www.alaskavisit.com/static/index.cfm?contentID=90

Most tourists drive along Turnagain Arm as fast as possible (or sleep on the trains and tour buses) and miss it all.

Sad!

They think that just because it is close to Anchorage and a well traveled road that nothing is there to see. Also while it's a very busy road and less than 20 miles from Anchorage, it's one of easiest and most accessible places in Alaska to spot Dall Sheep.

Also while it's a very busy road and less than 20 miles from Anchorage, it's one of easiest and most accessible places in Alaska to spot Dall Sheep.

Not just spot them, but get somewhat up close and personal with them. At one of the turnouts there were over 10 of them along the hillside. Another day there was just two in the same area, but one stood there for at least 10 or 15 minutes, walking around and stuff, but pretty much posing for the cameras. We were the first to stop, and as with most places in Alaska when one tourist stops with a camera, other will follow.

After we had our fill of picture taking, we left to give up our spot to someone else. By that time the turn out was full and a small back up was happening out on the highway. That is the biggest thing about viewing, stopping and photographing the wildlife that you have to be aware of, the impact on the traffic . . . especially if people are speeding through there and tourists are slowing down, turning off, or worse yet, stopping ON the highway to see animals.

A similar situation happened when we were leaving Soldotna and folks were pulling off on the shoulder to "see something". We weren't sure what, but darn it, we were going to stop too. It was a great show, a moose in a deep marsh eating. He would dunk his head deep into the water, and about 30 seconds later, come up with a mouth full of grassy "stuff" from the bottom. It was very cool to watch and photograph, but clearly the locals weren't happy as they drove by yelling stuff at all of the tourists.