Diners Club Club Rewards - Discover agrees to acquire Diner's Club International

http://http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=a484eBOE2kq8&refer=home

I wonder if this means that when this finalized we can no longer use DC at merchants that currently take MasterCard. :td::td:

Who cares about acceptance, I can get an affinty card anywhere. What about my 400K points??

Discover is buying the Diners Club network not the card issuing businesses...

Discover said Diners Club licensees in North America and globally are not included in the acquisition and added it will not issue cards or extend consumer credit in international markets as a result of the deal.

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/discover-snaps-up-diners-club/story.aspx?guid=%7BBEBC176E-7DE8-4603-B324-6BBC4552F779%7D&dist=hplatest

Citigroup will remain a long-term issuer on the Diners Club network.

http://www.reuters.com/article/bankingFinancial/idUSN0746582520080407

On a first thought I thought it could be a good thing
I've been really happy with Discover's customer service (I'd say comparable to AMEX), though the low credit line really turns me off

I guess it doesn't matter if they only buy the network ...

I'm not 100% clear on what this means for cardholders. Maybe someone with better knowledge of the credit system could explain?

From what I can gather...North American DC/MC holders will be able to use their DC/MC at merchants who accept Discover (although really, do any merchants accept Discover but not MC?)

I think the real benefit will be for ex-North America DC holders, who don't have the co-branded DC/MC. Their acceptance seems to be quite limited in North America, but they will soon (in 3 years) be able to use their DC at Discover merchants. Do I have this all wrong?

My interpretation is that Discover needs acceptance outside of North America. This deal gives Discover a readymade network which, within three years, will accept Discover interchangeably with Diners without requiring Discover to issue cards worldwide. As a by-product of this arrangement visitors to the USA would also be able to use Diners Club at merchants who accept Discover.

I don't see anything here that would alter Citi's deal with Mastercard. Diners Club cards issued by Citi in North America should continue to be processed by Mastercard's network, not by Discover's network. Citi's contract with Mastercard is, no doubt, for a finite period and Discover (or VISA, or even American Express) might bid for it in the future. However, I don't see Citi doing anything which would give Diners less acceptance than American Express because it's the corporate side of Diners which appears to drive the decision making.

Could this also mean DC will be accepted in China without FOREX fees?

As long as I continue to get this card for free with Citigold and they keep offering primary cdw I dont care what happens...

Like a couple people pointed out, Discover is only purchasing the Diners Club Network, which means Citi will continue to issue Diners Club cards both here and abroad (Citi issues cards in a variety of countries, not just the U.S.).

Discover said it would take 2-3 years before they can integrate the two networks. Perhaps this is because of the contract between Diners Club and MasterCard is locked in for another couple years?

Remember, currently Diners Club cards are processed on the MasterCard network in the U.S. and Canada and the Diners Club network outside the U.S. U.S. cards have the MasterCard logo on the front, and foreign ones have the MasterCard logo on the back (with fine print saying U.S. & Canada only for MasterCard). If you try to use your U.S. Diners Club card at a MasterCard merchant overseas who does not accept Diners Club, your card will be declined. The merchant must accept Diners Club, because outside of U.S. and Canada your card is not processed on the MasterCard network.

Technically there is no Diners Club network in the U.S. anymore, it only exists outside the U.S. This will actually make it easier for Discover Network to integrate with Diners Club Network.

My guess is that when the networks are integrated, Citi will reissue their cards on the newly combined Diners Club/Discover Network. And since Discover Network already is accepted by most (but not all) merchants in the U.S., and your card already uses the Diners Club network overseas (as opposed to the MasterCard network), you will see little decline in acceptance in the U.S. and no decline in acceptance overseas. Acceptance in Canada would probably be effected the most. You will probably see the Discover logo where the MasterCard logo currently is (on the front on U.S. cards and on the back or possibly front of overseas cards).

And I am sure that the combined Discover/Diners Club would give Discover more leverage to get merchants to accept their cards, plus, depending on what payment processor you use, processing Discover Network cards is the same discount rate as processing Visa or MasterCard, which eliminates the cost objection some merchants have. In fact all new merchants who sign up for a merchant account with the biggest payment processors automatically accept Discover Network when they apply to accept Visa and MasterCard, and get one statement and the same discount rate for all three card types. Discover is being very aggressive about getting its acceptance to be as universal as MasterCard and Visa, and eliminating the barriers and excuses merchants have for not accepting Discover Network.

Speaking of international acceptance, Discover Network has alliances with JCB in Japan and China UnionPay in China. Discover Network is actually the most widely accepted foreign card in China (and perhaps Japan) as a result. Depending on the terms of those alliance agreements, Diners Club cards could be accepted in China and Japan because of these alliances. Citi may still charge you exchange rate fees, but that is the policy of the issuer, not the network. Remember, Discover only bought the network. Your terms with your issuer (i.e. Citi in the U.S.) will not change.

(Excerpt from http://blog.morepossibilities.info/?p=94 - Reprinted with permission.)

I see that citi.com did not waste any time removing the Diners Club card from their list of credit/charge cards on their web site. Also, within the carbmembers diners web site (dinersclubus.com) there is no news posted yet about the Discover buy-out.

...citi.com did not waste any time removing the Diners Club card from their list of credit/charge cards on their web site.

Diners has never been listed on http://citicards.com .

It's still on the main Citibank site...

http://www.citibank.com/us/citibusiness/dinersclub.htm

Indeed there is no reason Citi should remove Diners because they sold the Diners Club transaction processing network, not their card issuing business.

Weird. I spent 30 minutes writing a response explaining the Discover Network and Diners Club situation, and it got deleted. :confused:

Could this also mean DC will be accepted in China without FOREX fees?
My original answer to this question got deleted, so I will answer it again. Discover purchased the Diners Club network, and Citi will still be issuing your cards. The fees would probably be the same, because the issuer of the card is charging you the fees, not the network.

My interpretation is that Discover needs acceptance outside of North America. This deal gives Discover a readymade network which, within three years, will accept Discover interchangeably with Diners without requiring Discover to issue cards worldwide. As a by-product of this arrangement visitors to the USA would also be able to use Diners Club at merchants who accept Discover.

I don't see anything here that would alter Citi's deal with Mastercard. Diners Club cards issued by Citi in North America should continue to be processed by Mastercard's network, not by Discover's network. Citi's contract with Mastercard is, no doubt, for a finite period and Discover (or VISA, or even American Express) might bid for it in the future. However, I don't see Citi doing anything which would give Diners less acceptance than American Express because it's the corporate side of Diners which appears to drive the decision making.
Most likely it will revert to the combined Diners Club/Discover Network once the contract with MasterCard is up. Acceptance in the U.S. may decline a bit (going from MasterCard to Discover Network), but Discover Network is already accepted by most merchants in the U.S. so there won't be a huge difference. And MasterCard only handles the U.S. and Canada transactions, outside North America the Diners Club network actually handles the transactions, so acceptance outside North America would be unchanged. Canada, on the other hand, probably would see the biggest decline in acceptance unless Discover / Diners Club aggressively recruits Canadian merchants in the next 2 years.

I'm not 100% clear on what this means for cardholders. Maybe someone with better knowledge of the credit system could explain?

From what I can gather...North American DC/MC holders will be able to use their DC/MC at merchants who accept Discover (although really, do any merchants accept Discover but not MC?)

I think the real benefit will be for ex-North America DC holders, who don't have the co-branded DC/MC. Their acceptance seems to be quite limited in North America, but they will soon (in 3 years) be able to use their DC at Discover merchants. Do I have this all wrong?
Yes. Actually, non-North American Diners Club cardholders and North American Diners Club cardholders are in the same boat. Currently, in the U.S. & Canada ALL Diners Club transactions are handled on the MasterCard Network, regardless of where the Diners Club card is issued. Essentially Citi closed the Diners Club Network in U.S. and Canada and hired MasterCard to run the network in North America. Outside North America, the Diners Club Network is still intact and thriving. In fact, despite the fact that your card has a MasterCard logo on the front, if you try to use it overseas at a merchant that ONLY accepted MasterCard but not Diners Club, your card will be declined. As I said, outside the U.S. your card uses the Diners Club Network exclusively.

Most likely Discover Network would take over handling the network in North America as soon as the MasterCard agreement expires.

In fact, despite the fact that your card has a MasterCard logo on the front, if you try to use it overseas at a merchant that ONLY accepted MasterCard but not Diners Club, your card will be declined.

Citation for this assertion, please. I am certain that I have used my Diners Club card since the changeover to the MasterCard logo outside the US and Canada. I admit I cannot attest to whether all the merchants accepted MasterCard and not Diners Club.

My understanding was that non-North American Diners Club cards were not usable on the MasterCard network (but usable on the Diners Club International network), while North American Diners Club cards were available anywhere in the world MasterCard was accepted. The NA Diners Club cards start with a "5" and "look" like a MasterCard, while the non-NA Diners Club cards start with a "3" and "look" like an (old) Diners Club card.

...despite the fact that your card has a MasterCard logo on the front, if you try to use it overseas at a merchant that ONLY accepted MasterCard but not Diners Club, your card will be declined..

Your card may have been declined, but there was some other reason. North American issued Diners Club cards are Mastercards, they comply with the Mastercard numbering standard, the first numeral is "5" and they are 16 digits. Cards processed on the Diners network begin with "36" and are only 14 digits.

BTW, the message you posted yesterday was not deleted. There appears to have been a database corruption. The message was listed on this page...

http://flyertalk.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=390

...but did not appear in the thread.

My understanding was that non-North American Diners Club cards were not usable on the MasterCard network .

Diners Club cards issued outside North America do still have "36" series 14 digit account numbers, but they also have a Mastercard logo on the reverse and can be accepted by Mastercard merchants in Canada and USA. Elsewhere they are accepted only by Diners Club merchants.

http://www.mastercard.com/us/merchant/solutions_resources/dinersclub.html

Diners Club Cards which are issued outside of the U.S. have a 14-digit account number, and a BIN beginning with "36" can be accepted just like any MasterCard credit transaction by implementing a POS/terminal adjustment.

Most likely it will revert to the combined Diners Club/Discover Network once the contract with MasterCard is up. Acceptance in the U.S. may decline a bit (going from MasterCard to Discover Network), but Discover Network is already accepted by most merchants in the U.S. so there won't be a huge difference.
I disagree. The huge difference is that it will no longer be practical to use the DC for the iDine/RN restaurant miles program of your choice.

Right now, you can use DC MC for whichever program you prefer (since DC discontinued its own annoying discount program with the same partner), and it works pretty much at every restaurant, since (in my experience) they all take MC and all give miles for MC. However, if you carry an Amex or Discover for dining, you have to hassle through checking the website for each restaurant before you dine, because the dining program doesn't autamitically give miles for Amex or Discover even if the restaurant takes the card! So it's not enough to determine at the restaurant which cards it accepts.

So only a Visa or MC is essentially hassle-free with iDine/RN.

My (european) Diners has the traditional 14 digits number starting with 36.

The MasterCard logo is on the reverse side together with the text : "In US/Canada this Diners Club Card is accepted at MasterCard locations" .

In Europe the card accepted only on the Diners Club network.

What I read in the press about the Discover deal means, that Discover cards should be accepted in the future on the Diners network. I don't think that Discover will be offered in Europe, there is not really a market for it.

Most likely Discover Network would take over handling the network in North America as soon as the MasterCard agreement expires.

Have you read anything in a press release, or elsewhere, to support this? I think that if there were an agreement between Citi and Discover to process North American charges beginning in 201x it would be mentioned, and would have materially changed the value of the sale.

Citation for this assertion, please. I am certain that I have used my Diners Club card since the changeover to the MasterCard logo outside the US and Canada. I admit I cannot attest to whether all the merchants accepted MasterCard and not Diners Club.

My understanding was that non-North American Diners Club cards were not usable on the MasterCard network (but usable on the Diners Club International network), while North American Diners Club cards were available anywhere in the world MasterCard was accepted. The NA Diners Club cards start with a "5" and "look" like a MasterCard, while the non-NA Diners Club cards start with a "3" and "look" like an (old) Diners Club card.
http://www.mastercard.com/us/wce/PDF/10108_MasterCard_DCA_Acquirer_Release.pdf

You are right. I misread their press release. Diners Club cards starting with a 5 (which are issued in the U.S. and Canada) use the MasterCard Network everywhere, where Diners Club cards starting with a 3 use the Diners Club Network outside U.S. and Canada, and MasterCard only in U.S. and Canada.

Thanks for pointing that out. :)

My (european) Diners has the traditional 14 digits number starting with 36.

The MasterCard logo is on the reverse side together with the text : "In US/Canada this Diners Club Card is accepted at MasterCard locations" .

In Europe the card accepted only on the Diners Club network.

What I read in the press about the Discover deal means, that Discover cards should be accepted in the future on the Diners network. I don't think that Discover will be offered in Europe, there is not really a market for it.
They intend on combining the network so that Discover Network Cards work on the Diners Club Network and Diners Club cards work on the Discover Network. So, most likely, the European cards would see the Discover Network logo on the back instead of the MasterCard logo. Citi's Diners Club MasterCard is a different story. Depends on what the agreement between Discover and Citi is; Citi's Diners Club could stay as a MasterCard, or perhaps after they combine the network, only new cards would be issued on the Discover/Diners Club combined network and existing Diners Club MasterCards staying as MasterCards. The press releases are silent on that issue. But it should be noted that Citi already issues MasterCard, Visa and American Express Cards, so issuing on Discover Network would not be out of the question. They are not a one network shop like some banks.

As far as Europe goes, with the combined network, they could offer both, with Diners Club being the T&E product, and Discover Network for general purpose cards. But Discover has already stated that it intends on keeping the highly valuable Diners Club name overseas, and also states it will not issue Diners Club cards nor extend credit overseas. It could allow franchisees to issue Discover Network cards in Europe like it does in the U.S. and Latin America, without stepping on the toes of the existing Diners Club franchises.

We will have to wait and see what Discover does. They have not revealed that part of their plans yet.

Have you read anything in a press release, or elsewhere, to support this? I think that if there were an agreement between Citi and Discover to process North American charges beginning in 201x it would be mentioned, and would have materially changed the value of the sale.
This is just a guess based on Discover aggressively trying to get other banks to issue Discover Network cards, and the fact that Citi already issues MasterCard, Visa, Diners Club AND American Express cards. Citi is not a one network shop like some banks, so they would not be adverse to issuing Discover Network cards if the terms were right.

If Discover did not ask for that, then I would be very surprised. They may still be negotiating that part of the deal. Notice there is no mention of it in any of the press releases.

The only slight mention is that it said that Citi will continue to be a long term issuer on the Diners Club Network. But this is ambiguous since Citi already issues cards overseas on the Diners Club Network, and this does not specify what happens to the U.S. and Canadian Diners Club MasterCards.

Possible outcomes:

Citi's Diners Club MasterCards stay as MasterCard
Existing Citi Diners Club MasterCards stay MasterCards, but new Citi Diners Club Cards are on the combined Discover Network/Diners Club Network
Citi issues two versions allowing customers to pick (i.e. Diners Club Discover Network & Diners Club MasterCard)
Citi Diners Club Cards are reissued on the combined Discover Network/Diners Club Network

Discover would obviously be pushing for #4, with #2 as a second choice.

I am pretty certain that the overseas Diners Club Network (which Discover Network is purchasing) will align with Discover Network rather than MasterCard regardless of what happens to Citi's Diners Club MasterCard.

Since they already stated that after the networks are combined, Diners Club will work on the Discover Network, essentially Diners Club cards beginning with a 3 will become Discover Network cards where there is a Discover Network. It would be awkward to have non-North American Diners Club cards work on both MasterCard and Discover Networks in the U.S. & Canada, since most merchants accept both. I don't see how they would have overseas Diners Club cards working on the Diners Club Network, and Discover Network AND MasterCard Network. The MasterCard Network would be redundant, especially in the U.S.

Diners Club cards in Australia do not have the Mastercard logo on the back. Nevertheless, some North American merchants and Websites accept Australian Diners Club cards as Mastercards, but others don't.

Diners Club cards in Australia do not have the Mastercard logo on the back. Nevertheless, some North American merchants and Websites accept Australian Diners Club cards as Mastercards, but others don't.
I think they are having a similar problem as the JCB / Discover Network alliance, which is, in some cases, the merchant (or his processor) must update the terminals to accept the cards. Not all merchants or processors have updated their portion of the network.

http://www.citibank.com.hk/global_docs/diners_home_eng/diners_master_index.htm

I called to Discover, they told me something. Is that correct?

1, Citi continue to issue Diners Club.
2, Diners Club international network (merchant and ATM) combine with Disocver.
3, All discover can be used in the new network.
4, North American Diners Club continue to use Mastercard network.
5, Other Diners Club cards (36) can be used in the new network.
6, In North America, discover network would accept Diners Club cards (36)

There are a number of mechants in the US currently who still put Diners Club logos on their doors/lobby desks/wherever. What does this mean today? Are they simply ones who've updated their terminals and take any DC )with an MC on front or back or nowhere) from anywhere in the world and process it as an MC (no matter which digits it starts with)? Is Diners Club still issuing logos for the US, or are all these leftover? (And it not just logos, it's stuff like hotel guides when listing accepted cards.)

The reason I ask is because there are some merchants who accept Diners but not Discover, and then of course plenty other merchants who accept Discover but not Diners except via MC.

I called to Discover, they told me something. Is that correct?

1, Citi continue to issue Diners Club.
2, Diners Club international network (merchant and ATM) combine with Disocver.
3, All discover can be used in the new network.
4, North American Diners Club continue to use Mastercard network.
5, Other Diners Club cards (36) can be used in the new network.
6, In North America, discover network would accept Diners Club cards (36)
Sounds like you got it straight from the horse's mouth. :)

To corroborate, I found an article that confirms that Citi's North American cards will continue to be MasterCard, while everyone else will use the new combined Diners Club/Discover Network once it is complete.

http://www.digitaltransactions.net/newsstory.cfm?newsid=1730

There are a number of merchants in the US currently who still put Diners Club logos on their doors/lobby desks/wherever. What does this mean today? Are they simply ones who've updated their terminals and take any DC )with an MC on front or back or nowhere) from anywhere in the world and process it as an MC (no matter which digits it starts with)? Is Diners Club still issuing logos for the US, or are all these leftover? (And it not just logos, it's stuff like hotel guides when listing accepted cards.)

The reason I ask is because there are some merchants who accept Diners but not Discover, and then of course plenty other merchants who accept Discover but not Diners except via MC.
Technically there is no Diners Club Network at all in North America currently. All Diners Club cards (foreign and domestic) are processed as MasterCards in the U.S. and Canada. Once Diners Club/Discover network combine their networks, there once again would be a separate network for Diners Club (that apparently only non-North American Diners Club and Discover Network cards will use).

The logos are either a holdover from when it was a separate network, or from savvy merchants who want to attract Diners Club cardholders, knowing that they will work at their establishments since they accept MasterCard (applies to U.S. and Canada only, of course).

To increase business from international customers (i.e. tourists), merchants would be wise to display Diners Club, JCB and China UnionPay stickers, even though in North America MasterCard processes Diners Club currently, and similarly Discover Network processes JCB in the U.S. and China UnionPay networkwide, since people tend to look for the logo on their card, rather than what network it has an Alliance with (which they may not even know about).

According to the press releases, it will take 2-3 years to combine the Diners Club/Discover Network networks, so until then your Diners Club card (regardless of origin) is still processed as a MasterCard in North America.

It has been stated that after they combine the networks, Diners Club cards starting with a 3 will be processed on the combined Diners Club/Discover Network, and those starting with a 5 will work on the MasterCard network. Citi will continue issuing Diners Club MasterCards "indefinitely" according to a recent statement.

So, Diners Clubs card starting with a 3 will be processed as a Discover Network card in North America starting in about 2-3 years. It is unclear if MasterCard will be used as a second network that could be used if Discover Network is not accepted. This is possible, as they already do it on ATM cards (i.e. if the primary ATM network of Pulse, Star or NYCE is not available, then use another network like Cirrus or Visa's Plus network as a backup.). Not sure if that is currently possible with credit cards, but they have 2-3 years to figure that out if they decide to go that route.

Sounds like a Citi Diners Club Discover Network card is not out of the question.

"[Discover chief executive David] Nelms said branding issues would be sorted out as Discover integrates its network with Diners Club’s. Under Discover’s franchise ownership, a Citibank-issued Diners Club card potentially could carry the logos of Citi, MasterCard, Discover, Diners Club and the Discover-owned Pulse EFT network."

Citi Diners Club MasterCards not effected by the deal... "indefinitely."

"[Citi's U.S. and Canada] Diners Club cards carry the MasterCard logo, giving them wide utility domestically and internationally. That arrangement will continue indefinitely, a Citibank spokesperson tells Digital Transactions News. “North America is not impacted by this transaction at all,” the spokesperson says. In a release, Discover said, “Citi will remain a significant long-term issuer on the Diners Club network as part of the transaction.”"

http://www.digitaltransactions.net/newsstory.cfm?newsid=1730

Within 2-3 years, Discover card can be used in Diners Club network and China Unionpay network. I am afraid they will charge 3% foreign exchange......

Within 2-3 years, Discover card can be used in Diners Club network and China Unionpay network. I am afraid they will charge 3% foreign exchange......
Actually, your Discover Network card can be used in China now; that deal is already done. Starting November 8, 2006, Discover Network cards can be used in China anywhere China UnionPay is accepted, making Discover Network the most widely accepted non-Chinese card in China.

http://pressroom.discovercard.com/data/articles/2006/11/08/200611101046330.shtml

Also, the foreign exchange fees will be determined by the issuer, not the network. So, if your card is a Diners Club card issued by Citi, Citi determines the foreign exchange fee. If your Diners Club card is issued by Emirates Bank Group, then Emirates Bank Group determines the fee. If your Discover Network card is issued by Discover Bank, Discover Bank determines the fee. If your Discover Network card is issued by HSBC, then HSBC determines the fee.

Examples:
Citi issued Diners Club: Citi determines fee.
Emirates Bank Group issued Diners Club, Emirates Bank Group determines fee.
Discover Bank issued Discover Network card, Discover Bank determines fee.
HSBC issued Discover Network card, HSBC determines fee.

Discover's acquisition of the Diners Club Network will not effect fees the card issuer charges, and does not effect who issues the cards.

In reply to an email inquiry Diners Club (USA) confirmed what is stated in the various press releases. "Diners cards will continue to be accepted at all MasterCard locations. Citi will continue to be your service provider without interruption and continues to own the Diners Club credit cards."

I concur with DivMiler's & Mia's posts above. When I was in Australia in 2007, I used my US-issued DC without a problem. One merchant started to hand it back to me, saying, 'We don't accept DC--Wait a minute. I'm confused. Your card also says MC.' I explained that DC had merged into MC in the USA & asked her to try it in her machine. It worked--processed as MC.

One merchant started to hand it back to me, saying, 'We don't accept DC--Wait a minute. I'm confused. Your card also says MC.' I explained that DC had merged into MC in the USA & asked her to try it in her machine. It worked--processed as MC.
I've gotten in the habit of usually handing the card to merchants with my hand on the DC end and the MC showing, so that's the first thing they see.

I've gotten in the habit of usually handing the card to merchants with my hand on the DC end and the MC showing, so that's the first thing they see.

I usually do it the other way, so they think I'm a big deal - often when I'm buying leather-bound books and mahogany bookshelves. :D

My DC issued in Denmark, has on the back both a Mastercard logo for use in North America and a Cirrus logo for use in any ATM around the world who has this logo. As the say "know you can use your DC in any ATM from a small Greek island to a big city weekend break". But I can not use it in shops accepting Cirrus. Confused? :)
Is it the issuer that deside that I can use my DC in Cirrus ATMs or will it be changed? Cirrus is a part of Mastercard ?:confused:

My DC issued in Denmark, has on the back both a Mastercard logo for use in North America and a Cirrus logo for use in any ATM around the world who has this logo. As the say "know you can use your DC in any ATM from a small Greek island to a big city weekend break". But I can not use it in shops accepting Cirrus. Confused? :)
Is it the issuer that deside that I can use my DC in Cirrus ATMs or will it be changed? Cirrus is a part of Mastercard ?:confused:
I am not sure about other countries, but in the U.S., no shops accept Cirrus. Cirrus is strictly an ATM network.

In the U.S. here is how it works:
MasterCard = Signature Credit or Debit at Point of Sale (POS)
Maestro = PIN Debit or PIN Cash Advance at Point of Sale (POS)
Cirrus = Cash from an ATM (PIN required.)
All are owned by MasterCard, but MasterCard, Maestro and Cirrus are different types of card networks.

In other countries, it may be different. But that is how it works in the U.S.

So if your card is not a Maestro card, it cannot be accepted at a shop that only accepts PIN-based cards.

Well I must admit I have not seen any Cirrus logo in any shops, but thaks for the explanation.

Today I got my new combined danish SAS/Diners Card, gone is the Mastercard logo for use in NA and the Cirrus logo. Instead there is on the back the Discover and pulse logo. Even if I dont use my Diners often in ATM's it is sad to see the Cirrus has gone. It has always been a great backup, accepted anywhere from small islands to big cities. Now I have to search for the Diners logo on ATM's. Let me give you an example, before the agreement with Cirrus, there was only one bank in Denmark who accepted Diners, suddenly with the Cirrus arrangement all banks accepted Diners.
An other example 10 years ago only Bangkok Bank accepted Diners, then in the last years almost all banks in Thailand accepted Diners because of the Cirrus logo.
BTW I have never seen a pulse logo outside the US, so if I am not travelling there what can I use it for. A big step down for Diners.

Today I got my new combined danish SAS/Diners Card, gone is the Mastercard logo for use in NA and the Cirrus logo. Instead there is on the back the Discover and pulse logo. Even if I dont use my Diners often in ATM's it is sad to see the Cirrus has gone. It has always been a great backup, accepted anywhere from small islands to big cities. Now I have to search for the Diners logo on ATM's. Let me give you an example, before the agreement with Cirrus, there was only one bank in Denmark who accepted Diners, suddenly with the Cirrus arrangement all banks accepted Diners.
An other example 10 years ago only Bangkok Bank accepted Diners, then in the last years almost all banks in Thailand accepted Diners because of the Cirrus logo.
BTW I have never seen a pulse logo outside the US, so if I am not travelling there what can I use it for. A big step down for Diners.

I am surprised they took Cirrus ATM network off without putting PLUS or something (roughly, I like Cirrus more) equivalent on. Are you sure it no longer works - have you tried it?

It can work without being printed on the card; perhaps to allow for regional customization while still printing cards that look the same over many countries to save money.

The ATM locator for pulse network is here: https://www.pulsenetwork.com/public/consumers/pulse-atm-locator.html

but they are only in the US. Again, I'd be surprised if there is no international ATM network as it would be a large step down for US customers (I am a former one) as well.