Online Travel Booking and Bidding Agencies - Will priceline help if your airline goes Chap 11?

Well, I just booked a priceline non-refundable car reservation for my "upcoming" trip to GSO on Skybus. Whoops -- no more Skybus. So I'm not going to be able to use that reservation.

I'm a long-time and generally satisfied Priceline customer, but my experience with their customer service is abysmal. Basically, they have no customer service, so I doubt they'll by sympathetic to my plight. But I have seen priceline give refunds for things like hurricanes, so I guess you never know.

Has anyone had any experience with this one, like perhaps in the recent Aloha and ATA bankruptcies?

Thanks.

They gave me a refund on a hotel when I pointed out that the hotel was undergoing a full renovation and even had to close for 3 days to work out the HVAC systems. In my experience -- you need to complain a few times via email -- then they send you an "appointment" to speak to with a customer service specialist. When you then ring the same priceline customer service number someone actually answers quickly. Post speaking to the specialist, you usually have to wait for 2-3 days to get a decision from their gods. The decision is then passed back via email.

In my case -- a great outcome -- but not such a simple process.

Can't you just dispute the charge with your CC company?

Will the credit card company even consider such a dispute? After all, the rental car company is still there ready to honor the reservation, so you can't say that the service won't be provided.

When the Monte Carlo hotel caught fire a couple of months ago and closed for renovations/safety inspection, Priceline gave me a full refund for my reservation at the Monte Carlo.

I'd be surprised if you encountered resistance on this.

Will the credit card company even consider such a dispute? After all, the rental car company is still there ready to honor the reservation, so you can't say that the service won't be provided.

If your carrier stopped supplying service, then priceline will be unable to fulfill their order. No goods can be delivered. The contract (sale) is with priceline so it doesn't matter the financial status of the carrier, just that priceline is unable to deliver what they sold.

If your carrier stopped supplying service, then priceline will be unable to fulfill their order. No goods can be delivered. The contract (sale) is with priceline so it doesn't matter the financial status of the carrier, just that priceline is unable to deliver what they sold.

I think you misunderstood my situation. I didn't buy the Skybus ticket from priceline. I bought a "non-refundable" car rental for my Skybus trip from them. I think Priceline would be well within their legal right to say "sorry, the airline bankruptcy is your problem, our bidding services are non-refundable."

That is certainly their typical response to such issues. That said, they have given refunds when natural disasters prevented (or made difficult) travel to certain regions even when the hotels (for example) were still open. I guess I'll see if they have a heart or not.

It will probably be a stretch to get them to cancel due to a "bankruptcy"... especially since other airlines are honoring the tickets.

Have you called to see about getting rebooked on another airline with the ticket? Not sure of the procedure... but the news is reporting people are being accomodated on other airlines.

I know Priceline has been very lenient on natural disasters... but I am not sure they would consider this in that league.

Good luck... and let us know how it goes.

William

It will probably be a stretch to get them to cancel due to a "bankruptcy"... especially since other airlines are honoring the tickets.

Other airlines are "honoring" Skybus tickets (for a fee) for only the next week or so. I'm beyond that window, so unfortunately I'm out-of-luck on that front.

Kind of a shame: because of the "uncertainty" of Skybus' operations (I didn't think they'd actually go out of business this fast), I was reluctant to make a non-refundable car reservation. But the price differential was huge: $10 instead of $35 for a weekend rate. And I assumed that priceline's rate would increase given that demand for cars was apparently strong (no doubt because GSO was seeing a lot more weekend visitors than they ever had before due to the cheapo fares!).

When airlines in Canada went bankrupt, the credit card companies refunded all payments, whether direct or via an agency. Since these are international policies, it would seem to take care of the case.

The responses to this thread might be more useful if most of the posters read more than the the thread title.

To the OP, I agree that PL would be within their rights to say no, but it wouldn't hurt to ask. Either way, it sounds like you got a good rate and won't be out too much if they don't show any mercy.

Not quite the same but PL gave me a refund on a airport hotel (at my destination) when my flight was cancelled (do to weather).

It won't hurt to ask.

$10, this is all about $10? You could have earn't that twice over in the time we've spent talking about it;)

Seriously, it's worth a fire and forget email. But expect to write the cash off.

$10, this is all about $10? You could have earn't that twice over in the time we've spent talking about it;)

Seriously, it's worth a fire and forget email. But expect to write the cash off.

It's for more than 1 night. :) And I've got a $30 hotel, too. I'd be out about 85 bucks. Enough that I'd be annoyed to see the charges on my credit card.

Send PL an email, via the customer service link on their wesite. Provide your Skybus flight number, confirmation number and tell them there are no alternate airlines that fly that route. All bets are off if there are alternate airlines but you don't like the fare.

Post back and let us know the answer.

Send PL an email, via the customer service link on their wesite. Provide your Skybus flight number, confirmation number and tell them there are no alternate airlines that fly that route. All bets are off if there are alternate airlines but you don't like the fare. Post back and let us know the answer.

PL is under no legal, contractual or other, even moral, obligation to makea refund, and I'm not sure why in good conscience you're even claiming one. They didn't convince you to decide to travel and purchase an airline ticket, and had no part in your choice of airline. They simply sold you a car rental which you chose to buy, and which they and their contractual partner remain obligated and ready to deliver.

Be happy your losses are minimal, and that you haven't had to spend a night sleeping in an airport or had to go through substantial gymnastics and overload your near-maxed credit cards to find airline seats from Hawaii home to East Pudd'n Junction for your spouse, La Maxima, and your eight troublesome rugrats and ankle biters, all sunburned (and repeatedly demanding food) from a lost week on a beach crowded with peddlers, tourists and sand fleas.

Just think....Maybe Skybus will convert their now vacant HQ into a resort hotel, and offer discounts to holders of unused tickets for a vacation in Columbus, OOH, the CanCun of the Heartland, instead of Waikiki...

Why are you lecturing me? I'm not the OP. It's a shame you didn't bother reading the entire thread before making your rude post. The OP asked if PL would issue a refund. I suggested he directly ask PL.

Pl is free to make an exception or not. Do you work for PL? If not your opinion has little value.

Companies make exceptions, for goodwill, all the time. PL has made exceptions for weather issues, sickness etc. The best way for the OP to get his answer is to contact PL. Obviously I wouldn't expect a refund, through PL, if PL still had to pay the supplier.

Your speculation that Skybus might convert their HQ to some kind of hotel sounds pretty stupid, but that's just my opinion.

edited to add:

The rental agencies in some of the small airports Skybus served had to extend their hours to accommodate Skybus flights. It's entirely possibly the rental agency won't even be open if the OPs flight was a night flight. I'd continue to check the rental companies hours if PL initially says no. A rental agency isn't going to remain open if there aren't any incoming flights scheduled, they can use a drop box to accomodate outgoing flights. I think even Mr. Oliver would concede a refund is in order if the rental agency won't be open at the time of the OPs pick up reservation.




PL is under no legal, contractual or other, even moral, obligation to makea refund, and I'm not sure why in good conscience you're even claiming one. They didn't convince you to decide to travel and purchase an airline ticket, and had no part in your choice of airline. They simply sold you a car rental which you chose to buy, and which they and their contractual partner remain obligated and ready to deliver.

Be happy your losses are minimal, and that you haven't had to spend a night sleeping in an airport or had to go through substantial gymnastics and overload your near-maxed credit cards to find airline seats from Hawaii home to East Pudd'n Junction for your spouse, La Maxima, and your eight troublesome rugrats and ankle biters, all sunburned (and repeatedly demanding food) from a lost week on a beach crowded with peddlers, tourists and sand fleas.

Just think....Maybe Skybus will convert their now vacant HQ into a resort hotel, and offer discounts to holders of unused tickets for a vacation in Columbus, OOH, the CanCun of the Heartland, instead of Waikiki...

Why are you lecturing me? I'm not the OP. It's a shame you didn't bother reading the entire thread before making your rude post. The OP asked if PL would issue a refund. I suggested he directly ask PL. .

I was lambasting the OP, not you, although given the obvious sense-of-humor-impairment and absence of any visible irony meter from which you seem to suffer, I can understand your emotional over-wroughtedness.

You did paste a big label in the midst of your forehead when you placed some seriousness in the my strained attempt at humor by suggesting the conversion of the Skybus HQ to a resort.

Then there's the issue of the hour of arrival at an airport....(another flimsy attempt to rescue your self from outright buffonery)

I was lambasting the OP, not you, although given the obvious sense-of-humor-impairment and absence of any visible irony meter from which you seem to suffer, I can understand your emotional over-wroughtedness.

Is it just me, or are these posts a bit bizarre? :p

Seriously, in the more than a week since this has happened (Aloha first), has nobody had a direct experience with priceline -- like a prepaid Hawaiian resort stay? I tried calling priceline, but they wouldn't answer the phone. From prior experience, I'm afraid of their India email response (or non-response) team, but I guess that's the next step.

The following is from Pricelines website in regards to rental cars.
"Our rental car partners monitor flight information and will attempt to accommodate you if your flight is delayed or cancelled. Here's what you need to know:


Delayed or Cancelled and Rescheduled Flights:
Priceline's rental car partners will hold your reservation up to 24 hours after your scheduled pick-up time if your flight is delayed or cancelled and rescheduled.

Rental days are calculated on a 24-hour clock, but that clock doesn't begin ticking until you pick up your car - so if you arrive late due to delayed or rescheduled flights, the rental car company will automatically extend your rental by the same amount of time.


Cancelled/Not Rescheduled Flights:
If your flight is cancelled but not rescheduled, please call our Customer Service Department at the toll-free number listed on your Priceline Rental Car itinerary. Be sure to have your airline name and flight number ready when you call.

To get a copy of your itinerary, just come back to our homepage at www.priceline.com and select "Rental Cars" from the "Check Your Request" drop-down menu at the top right-hand corner of the page. You receipt and full itinerary will be right there for you to print."

Oh and if you were scheduled on one of the bankrupt airlines ...below is the policy for air fares purchased via priceline.

"In the event that your airline declares bankruptcy or goes out of business, don't worry -- you have the same rights as other ticketed passengers. According to the Aviation and Transportation Security Act, other airlines are required to assist passengers stranded by airlines that go bankrupt.

For your airline's specific policy, we advise you to contact your airline directly. If you are unable to contact your carrier, or they are unable assist you, please send us an e-mail."

Is it just me, or are these posts a bit bizarre?

No,it's me as well. I also would like the "combative" posters to reconsider their posts and possibly edit. Just my style, but when possible I'd prefer voluntary alternatives before I make a moderating move. The posters have been here at FT long enough to see what I mean. Thanks.

Thanks, FrankFlyer. That language could be helpful to me in my dealings with priceline.

Like the others, i say give it a go, nothing to lose

but $85, cmon hardly the end of the world. I've heard of people who have lost over a grand in priceline hotel accomodation because their circumstances changed at the last minute.

Like the others, i say give it a go, nothing to lose

but $85, cmon hardly the end of the world. I've heard of people who have lost over a grand in priceline hotel accomodation because their circumstances changed at the last minute.

$85 is, well it's $85. For some of us that might represent an hour's or so work, for others it might represent a few hours; for some kid in high school or college (where school is their full time "job") it might represent an entire weekend's wages at their part time job. Personally, I don't care how long it takes me to earn $85, if I were out that amount and thought there was a chance I was entitled to get it back I'd sure as heck try. Now there is only so much time I'd put into attempting to get that $85 back, but only I know when I've reached that point (and at this point I don't know where it would happen).

To the OP, I don't know if PL will allow you to cancel your reservation, but it can't hurt to try adn get the $ refunded

Oh and if you were scheduled on one of the bankrupt airlines ...below is the policy for air fares purchased via priceline.

"In the event that your airline declares bankruptcy or goes out of business, don't worry -- you have the same rights as other ticketed passengers. According to the Aviation and Transportation Security Act, other airlines are required to assist passengers stranded by airlines that go bankrupt.

For your airline's specific policy, we advise you to contact your airline directly. If you are unable to contact your carrier, or they are unable assist you, please send us an e-mail."

I saw that advice at http://www.priceline.com/customerservice/faq/searchsolution.asp?session_key=420011AC5C0011AC200 804121917385459a0135465&plf=pcln Unfortunately, Priceline may be giving some out-of-date advice there. See http://www.asta.org/News/PRDetail.cfm?ItemNumber=3645 which says in part:

Section 145 of the Aviation and Transportation Security Act, which required the airlines to accommodate affected passengers on a space available basis, expired on Nov. 30, 2006.

Also see http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=9513559&postcount=46

If your carrier stopped supplying service, then priceline will be unable to fulfill their order. No goods can be delivered. The contract (sale) is with priceline so it doesn't matter the financial status of the carrier, just that priceline is unable to deliver what they sold.

This is exactly what I thought, but Priceline is not giving me a refund for my 3 tickets on ATA. I called them and they told me I would need to dispute the charges with my bank. My bank is saying since I used a debit card and this is not a fraudulent change, it cannot be disputed, so I am just SOL and out over $1000, which is almost a month's wages for me. This is a huge financial hit for our family.

This is exactly what I thought, but Priceline is not giving me a refund for my 3 tickets on ATA. I called them and they told me I would need to dispute the charges with my bank. My bank is saying since I used a debit card and this is not a fraudulent change, it cannot be disputed, so I am just SOL and out over $1000, which is almost a month's wages for me. This is a huge financial hit for our family.

thats the problem with using a Debit Card its not a CC and is treated just as if you paid Ca$h. So you can get in line with all the other Creditors, but since you paid PL you might be declined.

Whats really bad on PLs part is from past experience they pay for the charges using their CC. So whats the problem with their CS dept putting a Dispute in for any person who made a purchase w/o using their own CC such as with sm above who used a DC and not a CC.Sure it will be a very long wait to get teh $$ back but at least it can be had.

Unless PL will do that anyway and keep the $$$ for themselves.

Of cause if PL paid via any other means such as their own DC or check or wire transfer, then I understand why they told sm what they did. But Im sure they too will go after whatever $$ they paid and werent used as yet.

Thanks, FrankFlyer. That language could be helpful to me in my dealings with priceline.


any word yet?

I would have thought that PL would have said as long as the Vendor you won the res with is open for Biz, its your problem how to get there.

Sort of but unlike I have a client that goes O/O/B or didnt renew our contract so now no need at all to go to XYZ, PL really couldnt care less, they will hold me to everything as long as the vendors are still operating.

Now if the res was with Avis and Avis shuts down thats a slam dunk you get a refund. what if there arent any other cars available for any $$$ and youre not staying in town but have a 4 hr drive ahead of you. The res with PL was for the flight and not the car, well as long as AA is still flying into GSO, I highly doubt PL will say OK Avis is O/O/B and you cant get ahold of a car so yea we'll cancel and refund you your airfare. I kinda have a feeling they say take a cab or a bus or train.

If it was Me Id go thru the motions with PLs CS to get a refund but I wouldnt expect that I would be successful at that.

thats the problem with using a Debit Card its not a CC and is treated just as if you paid Ca$h. So you can get in line with all the other Creditors, but since you paid PL you might be declined.

Whats really bad on PLs part is from past experience they pay for the charges using their CC. So whats the problem with their CS dept putting a Dispute in for any person who made a purchase w/o using their own CC such as with sm above who used a DC and not a CC.Sure it will be a very long wait to get teh $$ back but at least it can be had.

Unless PL will do that anyway and keep the $$$ for themselves.

Of cause if PL paid via any other means such as their own DC or check or wire transfer, then I understand why they told sm what they did. But Im sure they too will go after whatever $$ they paid and werent used as yet.


Unfortunately, we can't get a credit card with a high enough limit to purchase all 3 airline tickets. I had tried to get the limit on my CC raised and couldn't. We only had the debit card, so we had no choice.

I am sure Priceline will be disputing their charges and getting their money back. I can't see a business not doing that, but I don't expect any of that to come back my way, even though I am the one that paid for it and they made money off my sale.

I am not done with this and I am still trying to get my money back. As I said, this is a huge hit for us. This was the first and last time I will ever use Priceline if this is how they handle their customers.

Check with your bank. Some banks are processing "charge backs" for their customers that used a MC or V logoed debit card. In this case you're really asking for a refund for money you paid PL and PL isn't bankrupt.

Some suggestions for future use:
1) See if you can get a temporary increase in your credit limit, maybe make a payment before you book the tickets.
2) See if you can give a friend or relative cash and have them use their credit card.
3) Consider travel insurnace, make sure the policy covers financial default and your carrier isn't on the "no coverage" list.

I'd follow up with PL and a possible complaint with the BBB. I'm not saying PL should have to fund the refund but neither should PL be able pocket a refund from the airline.



Unfortunately, we can't get a credit card with a high enough limit to purchase all 3 airline tickets. I had tried to get the limit on my CC raised and couldn't. We only had the debit card, so we had no choice.

I am sure Priceline will be disputing their charges and getting their money back. I can't see a business not doing that, but I don't expect any of that to come back my way, even though I am the one that paid for it and they made money off my sale.

I am not done with this and I am still trying to get my money back. As I said, this is a huge hit for us. This was the first and last time I will ever use Priceline if this is how they handle their customers.

Check with your bank. Some banks are processing "charge backs" for their customers that used a MC or V logoed debit card. In this case you're really asking for a refund for money you paid PL and PL isn't bankrupt.

Some suggestions for future use:
1) See if you can get a temporary increase in your credit limit, maybe make a payment before you book the tickets.
2) See if you can give a friend or relative cash and have them use their credit card.
3) Consider travel insurnace, make sure the policy covers financial default and your carrier isn't on the "no coverage" list.

I'd follow up with PL and a possible complaint with the BBB. I'm not saying PL should have to fund the refund but neither should PL be able pocket a refund from the airline.


Thank you for the tips for next time, although I really hope that won't be anytime soon.

I am definitely going to continue to pursue this in hopes of getting my money back. I have thought about filing with the BBB, but wanted to wait and see if I couldn't get this resolved on my own first.

I ended up calling my bank's 1-800 number again this morning and talked to someone that was much more helpful. I think the first guy really didn't know what he was doing as he had to stop several times during the call to ask someone else questions and the local branch manager wouldn't even hear us out. But the lady today was very helpful and is sending me dispute forms to fill out and she seems to think I will be able to get my money back. So there may still be hope. I will remain optimistic at this point.

I will just say this has been a learning experience for me as I rarely fly, but I know I will definitely do things differently next time.

You might mention the fact that PL told you to file a dispute. PL may have decided it's easier to say yes to the chargebacks then it would be to take the time to go through their records and process refunds.

Unfortunately, we can't get a credit card with a high enough limit to purchase all 3 airline tickets. I had tried to get the limit on my CC raised and couldn't. We only had the debit card, so we had no choice.

I am sure Priceline will be disputing their charges and getting their money back. I can't see a business not doing that, but I don't expect any of that to come back my way, even though I am the one that paid for it and they made money off my sale.

I am not done with this and I am still trying to get my money back. As I said, this is a huge hit for us. This was the first and last time I will ever use Priceline if this is how they handle their customers.

Surfmonkey, here is something that may help you in the future.

I recommended this to my brother who has a small limit credit card and it has worked.

If you were using a debit card for the ticket, then you obviously had the cash.

Assuming you know you are going to make a major purchase, like $1500... and you only have a $500 limit on your card.... overpay your card by $1000... that will give you a -$500 balance.... in other words, a $1500 buffer to charge.... worked wonders for them.

William

There are two things going on here -- credit card vs. debit card, and Priceline's opaque (name your own price) vs. non-opaque ("regular") bookings.

For the regular bookings, Priceline acts as a travel agent. Although they take the billing information, the actual payment is processed by and goes directly to the airline. Priceline never had your money. On your statement, the charge usually shows the airline name, not Priceline. Legally, they're off the hook, and they're unlikely to just give you a thousand bucks that they don't have to.

The name your own price bookings are different, in that you pay Priceline directly. Those are the cases where you can expect to get a refund from Priceline if the service isn't delivered. However, they're under no obligation to refund services where they were willing to provide it but you didn't use it (like a hotel room which you couldn't use because your flight got canceled). It's hard enough to get a refund when you actually qualify; don't hold your breath for a courtesy refund if your other travel plans fall through.

That's what you're giving up in exchange for the cheap Priceline name your own price -- there's no net if something goes wrong.

As for the credit cards, Federal law says a credit card has to give you a refund if you don't get the goods/services you've purchased. There are restrictions regarding where the charge happened (in the same state or within 100 miles of your home) but virtually all cards waive this requirement. There's also a restriction of reporting it within 60 days of getting the statement with the charge, but that's often waived too. The law also says you don't have to pay the "remaining" balance, but most cards will refund the full price, even if you've paid some/all.

This rule does NOT apply to debit cards, even if they were processed as a Visa or M/C transaction. Although most banks have extended the same lost/stolen protections to debit cards that apply to credit cards, they haven't extended the "special rule for credit card purchases" to debit cards. You're in the same situation as paying cash or check. You can file as a creditor, but don't expect to get much back.

If you don't have a high enough credit limit, there are a couple of routes. You can try just asking -- call your card and say you want to buy some airline tickets, can they help you out?

Prepaying is an option, but there are a couple of gotchas. If it's a new card, paying a big amount ahead then charging airline tickets could be seen as money laundering. Some cards don't count a credit balance as part of your credit limit, so if you have a $2000 limit and a $500 credit balance, they may still only let you charge $2000 and not $2500.

Do you have any friends or relatives that can do it for you if you give them the cash?

Somewhat to my surprise, Priceline gave me a full credit for both my hotel and car rental "name your own price" reservations. I sent them an email and they gave me a number to call. I called and the agent gave me the credit card refund.

I've been critical of priceline's customer service before -- their customer service has often seemed like a caricature of that fictional "we'll-always-say-no" credit card company. But here's a situation where they really didn't owe me a refund -- Skybus going out of business wasn't really "their problem." But they did the right thing (I'm sure their travel suppliers would have WANTED them to issue the refund against their accounts), and treated me like a human being. Props to them.

At the same time, I'm a bit dismayed to hear Surfmonkey's story. The debit card "loophole" is something few people would understand. Is there no legal protection a customer is owed from his travel agent -- like if a travel agent sells you a tour package and the tour operator goes out of business, you're just out-of-luck? I thought that travel agents carried insurance for this kind of thing.

Regardless, I would think escalating the matter up through the priceline food chain MIGHT work. I know I've escalated an issue in the past (I didn't get any satisfaction, but at least someone intelligent considered my claim). Here, these circumstances BEG for someone at priceline to do something. The story is just so sad -- surfmonkey deserves some help.

I am surprised at the refunds; I do agree, good for them.

As for travel providers failing to deliver, the Priceline terms say Further, to the extent permitted by law, the Covered Parties accept no responsibilities for any damage and/or delay due to Provider cancellations, shortages, sickness, pilferage, labor disputes, bankruptcy, machinery breakdown, quarantine, government restraints, weather, terrorism or causes beyond the Covered Parties' control.Travel agent liability is generally limited to errors and omissions, not failures in the providers they sell for.

There have been cases where an agent has been found liable if they've "recommended" a provider, but that may be tough to stick against Priceline, since they're just listing the ones available and letting you pick one.

Another option to the credit card is travel insurance, but be sure it covers bankruptcy and doesn't exclude your provider. If you can't get insurance for your provider, you should probably think twice about using it.