Travel Technology - I'm disappointed in my Lenovo T61p

As I've mentioned in another thread, I've had problems with this new laptop, basically since I unpacked it and began to set it up, and Lenovo customer support has been disappointing, to say the least.

First, it was the ThinkVantage Access software causing connection problems and slow shutdowns. Had to uninstall it.

Then I had a couple of weird shutdown problems, the last of which was resolved (I hope) by upgrading the power management driver.

I still have slow boots (if I rush it, it gets very flaky) which seem to be related to the SQL server software, and have had to run the internet connection repair wizard 3 times in the last couple of days to get a connection at startup.

The case seems like a really junky plastic and the frame on the left side of the screen seems a bit loose (good thing I'm not actually planning to travel with it).

As for the keyboard, it actually slopes slightly to the rear! Who's brilliant idea was that? Someone wanting to increase the sales of docking stations, I guess.

And customer service? They were helpful the 2 times I called when I couldn't get it to shutdown properly, but for the other software probs, the response was basically "either reinstall the OS or use our fee-based CS".

I only went with Lenovo because I didn't want VISTA, didn't want Dell, and couldn't find anyone else who would sell me the power and memory I wanted with WinXP.

But my old HP Pavillion is looking mighty good to me at this point (and it was a lot less expensive:().

I know that many people had complaint about the Access Connection program and I had my problems with it at times. But it is installed on 10+ Thinkpads in my extended family and it is also on every Thinkpads we have in the office.

Have you run the System Update utility already? Do you have the Atheros wireless card or intel card? Which encryption method are you using? Have you tried an USB or PCNCIA NIC to identify whether you have a hardware problem?

I have a T60 in similar plastic and I hadn't notices what you described.

The only issue for me is the new lid switch that may take a 2nd closing to go to sleep which never happened with previous Thinkpads.

As for the keyboard, it actually slopes slightly to the rear! Who's brilliant idea was that? Someone wanting to increase the sales of docking stations, I guess.
Are you serious? I was thinking about buying one of these for my mom, but that is pretty bad...

Are you serious? I was thinking about buying one of these for my mom, but that is pretty bad...
I kid you not. I've put a couple of little non-stick pads under the rear feet to prop it up a little.

I know that many people had complaint about the Access Connection program and I had my problems with it at times. But it is installed on 10+ Thinkpads in my extended family and it is also on every Thinkpads we have in the office.
I know that it seems to work fine for many people, but from what I read, when it's trouble, it's big trouble. I was having connection problems every boot and ridiculously slow shutdowns (5-10 minutes each time). Uninstalling it made a big difference.

Have you run the System Update utility already?
No.

Do you have the Atheros wireless card or intel card?
Intel

Which encryption method are you using? Have you tried an USB or PCNCIA NIC to identify whether you have a hardware problem?.
Haven't a clue what you're talking about. I'm afraid you've gotten the (mis)impression that I have some tech savvy.

I have a T60 in similar plastic and I hadn't notices what you described.

The only issue for me is the new lid switch that may take a 2nd closing to go to sleep which never happened with previous Thinkpads.
Your case must fit together better than mine.

IBM Thinkpads used to be tops. Lenovo has been a clear, consistent slide downhill in quality and in customer service.

I bought Thinkpads and paid a bit more - well a lot more sometimes - for the peace of mind that came with having a machine that was not thrown together and that - if anything did go wrong - the customer service was stupendous.

Now it's junk and chaos. This is my last Thinkpad. I will no doubt be on this board asking who - if anyone makes reliable and well supported machines sometime in the next year.

Bottom line: stay away from Lenovo!

I have a T61 that I'm happy with for the most part. A couple of thoughts regarding some of the problems people have brought up:

Wireless/Software: My opinion is that you need to install a clean version of XP. As in not from Lenovo. Then add the needed drivers. Unfortunately all manufacturers install a ton of extra software that is unnecessary and wastes resources. Regarding the wireless card, make sure all of your drivers are fully updated. With new cards, every driver release may help.

Keyboard: I do not have this problem. Are you sure that the keyboard is all the way in? When I've taken apart my laptop I've often struggled to get the keyboard all the way in so that the case would close. If not, Lenovo should replace it for you.

Support: Haven't had to deal with them, though will soon since my fan is acting up and being noisy. I'm not surprised at their answer - there is very little they can do. Reinstalling XP is the easiest and fastest way to fix 99% of Windows problems. This is actually what caused me to switch over to Linux.

Quality: Coming from an old Sony notebook, I was amazed at how well constructed the Lenovo case is. Maybe previous thinkpads were better, but they couldn't have been by much. I've had absolutely no issues thus far and its been strong and sturdy. Actually, I'm happier with plastic, because its cheaper, not as easy to dent or smudge, and lighter. And I like that there's an internal roll cage. I've dropped my laptop up to a food on a thinly carpeted floor and its kept running.

Regarding other laptop brands, there are none that are any better and equivalently priced/cheaper than Lenovo. Before I bought the T61, I considered Apple and Dell (which were the only two that I saw any recommendations for). The Macbook Pro is nice, but its much more expensive. The Macbook might be nice, but it feels like a toy that'll break any second. As for Dell, the D630 was very similar but more expensive and not as well built in my opinion. I don't think the situation has changed much.

I have had 610, t20, t21, t30, t40, t41, x60s, t61

TO be honest they have been pretty consistennt from a hw perspective. I remember the t21, the whole top of the keyboard would lift up when you opened the lid. On the t30, several pieces of casing fell off. On the x60x, the IR window fell out on the first day.

The T61 is similar. I have a lovely feature when I have to open and the close the lid twice to get the screen to work. Randomly resets etc.

I am not including SW as our company gets its own image pre-loaded, and that it absolute sh!te. But I am used to that by now so 9min start ups and shut down hangs ups are just par for the course.

I dont think Thinkpads have ever been head and shoulder above the rest in any capacity.

IBM Thinkpads used to be tops. Lenovo has been a clear, consistent slide downhill in quality and in customer service.

I bought Thinkpads and paid a bit more - well a lot more sometimes - for the peace of mind that came with having a machine that was not thrown together and that - if anything did go wrong - the customer service was stupendous.

Now it's junk and chaos. This is my last Thinkpad. I will no doubt be on this board asking who - if anyone makes reliable and well supported machines sometime in the next year.

Bottom line: stay away from Lenovo!

It's been 2 years since I bought the HP laptop, but I've been quite satisfied with it. I've had a few software conflicts, but they were caused either by MS updates or buggy software from my French ISP.

I would have bought another HP if I could have gotten one with XP rather than Vista.

I can't say that HP tech support if fabulous, but it compares favorably with what I've run into with Lenovo, and HP has much more useful information on its website than Lenovo.

Lenovo seems to be geared up solely for corporate customers who can supply their own IT support.

I have a T61 that I'm happy with for the most part. A couple of thoughts regarding some of the problems people have brought up:

Wireless/Software: My opinion is that you need to install a clean version of XP. As in not from Lenovo.
Unfortunately, that is not a possibility for me.

Then add the needed drivers. Unfortunately all manufacturers install a ton of extra software that is unnecessary and wastes resources. Regarding the wireless card, make sure all of your drivers are fully updated. With new cards, every driver release may help.
I'll check on that.

Keyboard: I do not have this problem. Are you sure that the keyboard is all the way in? When I've taken apart my laptop I've often struggled to get the keyboard all the way in so that the case would close. If not, Lenovo should replace it for you.
It appears to be all the way in, and I have no trouble opening and closing the case.

Support: Haven't had to deal with them, though will soon since my fan is acting up and being noisy. I'm not surprised at their answer - there is very little they can do. Reinstalling XP is the easiest and fastest way to fix 99% of Windows problems. This is actually what caused me to switch over to Linux.
Well, I still have that as an option, although I will be limited to a reinstall using whatever Lenovo has stuck on my computer for that purpose. They don't ship with installation CDs.

Quality: Coming from an old Sony notebook, I was amazed at how well constructed the Lenovo case is. Maybe previous thinkpads were better, but they couldn't have been by much. I've had absolutely no issues thus far and its been strong and sturdy. Actually, I'm happier with plastic, because its cheaper, not as easy to dent or smudge, and lighter. And I like that there's an internal roll cage. I've dropped my laptop up to a food on a thinly carpeted floor and its kept running.

Regarding other laptop brands, there are none that are any better and equivalently priced/cheaper than Lenovo. Before I bought the T61, I considered Apple and Dell (which were the only two that I saw any recommendations for). The Macbook Pro is nice, but its much more expensive. The Macbook might be nice, but it feels like a toy that'll break any second. As for Dell, the D630 was very similar but more expensive and not as well built in my opinion. I don't think the situation has changed much.
I could have gotten an HP with equivalent processor, RAM, etc., for about the same price, and would have if they had been shipping anything with XP. (Note: I think they were shipping Compaqs with XP, but I didn't want a Compaq. I thought Lenovo quality would be higher.:()

I was having all sorts of trouble with the T61 for a few weeks. Our IT folks had installed a corporate image on it. I was doing the system updates on a daily basis and regularly it was downloading 100s of MBs of drivers and the like.

The solution in the end was to reinstall the original Lenovo XP image that came with the machine. Since then I've had almost no trouble.

I was having all sorts of trouble with the T61 for a few weeks. Our IT folks had installed a corporate image on it. I was doing the system updates on a daily basis and regularly it was downloading 100s of MBs of drivers and the like.

The solution in the end was to reinstall the original Lenovo XP image that came with the machine. Since then I've had almost no trouble.
It may come to that for me. That's one reason why I've postponed installing my PhotoShop and architectural software on the new laptop.

I'm going in early April for 2 1/2 months in Europe and will not take the Lenovo with me. As I have quite a lot to do in the next 7 weeks, I'll probably just limp along as is until I go, and decide about the reinstall when I return in June.

Well, I still have that as an option, although I will be limited to a reinstall using whatever Lenovo has stuck on my computer for that purpose. They don't ship with installation CDs.



You should be able to get the install CDs from Lenovo, I believe for about $35.00. I suppose it will replicate everything that it came installed with, but you may have some choices.

Most business laptop users I know still rate the ThinkPad as tops to almost all others and I still do. We are talking the TXX series here. Access Connections has been enhanced almost to the point of being unusable. I uninstalled it and go exclusively with the nice reliable Windows connection program. One can easily make their own set of the TP operating system at no cost. Follow the easy directions in the ThinkAdvantage program. An occasional scan/removal for crap and a defrag helps mucho in my start and run speeds.

MisterNice

I really like my x61 but the ThinkAdvantage stuff is kind of a pain, particularly the wireless. I haven't uninstalled it yet, mostly so as to not have to deal with the hassle, but they could improve that bit I think.

I have a Thinkpad, T60p I think, and my next notebook is going to be a Macbook running windows. They're just plain better.

Most business laptop users I know still rate the ThinkPad as tops to almost all others and I still do. We are talking the TXX series here. Access Connections has been enhanced almost to the point of being unusable. I uninstalled it and go exclusively with the nice reliable Windows connection program.
That's what I did, too. What I haven't done since uninstalling Access Connections, and probably should do, is to delete my old internet connections and set up a new one now that I have only the Windows connection program installed.

One can easily make their own set of the TP operating system at no cost. Follow the easy directions in the ThinkAdvantage program. An occasional scan/removal for crap and a defrag helps mucho in my start and run speeds.

MisterNice
I think I will make a set of CDs. I'm not comfortable having my only restoration files on the hard drive.

Most business laptop users I know still rate the ThinkPad as tops to almost all others and I still do. We are talking the TXX series here. Access Connections has been enhanced almost to the point of being unusable. I uninstalled it and go exclusively with the nice reliable Windows connection program. One can easily make their own set of the TP operating system at no cost. Follow the easy directions in the ThinkAdvantage program. An occasional scan/removal for crap and a defrag helps mucho in my start and run speeds.

MisterNice

Interesting that Lenovo's are still considered the top of the line.

About making the back up disks, yes, you can do that. My thought was that I don't want to find out that I made an error or that the procedure failed somehow at the very time I need to do the re-install. So, I paid the $35.00.

You should be able to get the install CDs from Lenovo, I believe for about $35.00. I suppose it will replicate everything that it came installed with, but you may have some choices.

Well, whether I make or buy them, they'll probably come with a lot of junk, but at least this time I'll know to immediately dump the Access Connections software. And then the next thing I'll dump is Norton.

Other things that I'd consider dumping (haven't yet done so) are the Office Business Manager software and the MS SQL server. I just wish I could figure out for sure which, if any, of the SQL server software that I could safely dump. Those seem to figure prominently in the Event Viewer errors.

Regarding SQL Server:
Why is this running in the first place? Seems like a horrible waste of resources on a laptop.

Regarding XP:
You might want to take a look at this guide:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=188992
if you haven't seen it already.

Regarding HP:
I knew someone a few years ago whose HP laptop case literally melted around the power connector due to some faulty wiring inside the laptop. I don't plan on buying HP's anytime soon.

Regarding Macs:
As I said, they look nice, but the build quality of the Macbook isn't that good compared to the T61 and the Macbook Pro is too expensive.

I've had a couple of bad experiences with HP and even Sony.

I think you're much better off with the premium Asian brands (e.g. Fujitsu-Siemens, Toshiba, NEC, Samsung) as opposed to the (relatively) cut-price stuff from the likes of HP, Dell, Lenovo and (even worse) Acer.

Regarding SQL Server:
Why is this running in the first place? Seems like a horrible waste of resources on a laptop.
My understanding is that it's installed along with MS Office. Don't know if that's a Lenovo quirk or one of MS's. I certainly didn't ask for it.

Regarding XP:
You might want to take a look at this guide:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=188992
if you haven't seen it already.
Thanks for that link. I hadn't seen it and it looks quite interesting.

You should be able to get the install CDs from Lenovo, I believe for about $35.00. I suppose it will replicate everything that it came installed with, but you may have some choices.

Heck, you can get the install CDs for free. All you have to do is tell Lenovo that your burned backup won't install properly. As long as you're within warranty, they'll send restore disks out gratis.

Sorry to hear about the T61p problems from the OP. I have aT60p that's working great. I do recommend that you push that blue button - ThinkVantage - choose Maintenance, then Update My System. That will correct any driver issues that may be causing shutdown problems and other assorted issues.

My understanding is that it's installed along with MS Office. Don't know if that's a Lenovo quirk or one of MS's. I certainly didn't ask for it.

In 1999 or 2000 I saw Larry Ellison speak. He was laughing at how in order to run a Burger King you needed an on-site MS SQL Server instead of simply having stuff running remote over a network. Now it seems that in order to keep track of your contact email address everyone is expected to have a DBA in tow. Aren't we making progress?

...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SJUAMMF View Post
Which encryption method are you using? Have you tried an USB or PCNCIA NIC to identify whether you have a hardware problem?.

Haven't a clue what you're talking about. I'm afraid you've gotten the (mis)impression that I have some tech savvy.
...

You may have a card problem. Try a different NIC.

Well, whether I make or buy them, they'll probably come with a lot of junk, but at least this time I'll know to immediately dump the Access Connections software. And then the next thing I'll dump is Norton.
...

Dump Norton and use Trendmicro. May be Norton is your problem. I use Trendmicro at home and in the office.

Oh, by all means dump Norton. I am also not a technical person, but I know that Norton has caused me all kinds of problems and never solved a one. Perhaps I had it installed all wrong, but it was just like pouring molasseses into my machines - s-l-o-w!

My understanding is that it's installed along with MS Office. Don't know if that's a Lenovo quirk or one of MS's. I certainly didn't ask for it.

If you're running Office 2007 (I still use 2000 when I need office), then I wouldn't be surprised. Try going into Add/Remove programs and removing parts of office (like SQL server and anything else you don't need). Office (at least 2000) can be made to run well, but a lot of the stuff MS includes is junk.


I've had a couple of bad experiences with HP and even Sony.

I think you're much better off with the premium Asian brands (e.g. Fujitsu-Siemens, Toshiba, NEC, Samsung) as opposed to the (relatively) cut-price stuff from the likes of HP, Dell, Lenovo and (even worse) Acer.

I refuse to buy Sony laptops anymore. A laptop I had (Sony FX-220) had to be sent for service 6 times because the power connector kept breaking. On top of that, the case would break on its own due to bad design.

In 1999 or 2000 I saw Larry Ellison speak. He was laughing at how in order to run a Burger King you needed an on-site MS SQL Server instead of simply having stuff running remote over a network. Now it seems that in order to keep track of your contact email address everyone is expected to have a DBA in tow. Aren't we making progress?

Well, its simple. Obviously running a DB server is faster. Its kind of like saying you can have coffee ready instantly any time you want, but the coffee maker takes up a whole room of your house. If you drink coffee once a day, this is horrible. For a coffee shop, it might be good.

The other problem is that SQL server is not even a lightweight DB and just eats up resources. It should never be on a desktop unless you're a developer.

Dump Norton and use Trendmicro. May be Norton is your problem. I use Trendmicro at home and in the office.
I dumped Norton and Access Connections way back in January. Never even activated Norton. I've had experience with Norton in the past on other computers.

I dumped Norton and Access Connections way back in January. Never even activated Norton. I've had experience with Norton in the past on other computers.

Dump ALL the included crap spam non-TP programs and totally remove them from the TP. As I remember a few install themselves to some extent.

MisterNice

About making the back up disks, yes, you can do that. My thought was that I don't want to find out that I made an error or that the procedure failed somehow at the very time I need to do the re-install. So, I paid the $35.00.
I'm inclined to agree with you, but the tech service guy I asked about buying CDs insisted that I didn't need them (because of the reinstall stuff on the HD) and he wouldn't sell them to me!

Of course, he was quite eager to pass me over to the fee-based tech support folks (at $99/incident).


You see what I mean about Lenovo's customer service?

...the tech service guy I asked about buying CDs insisted that I didn't need them (because of the reinstall stuff on the HD) and he wouldn't sell them to me!

I wonder what they tell people whose hard drive has failed. Or want to upgrade the HDD.

If manufacturers are going to put the recovery files on the hard drive, ISTM that the least they can do is provide a means of burning it to optical.

I wonder what they tell people whose hard drive has failed. Or want to upgrade the HDD.

If manufacturers are going to put the recovery files on the hard drive, ISTM that the least they can do is provide a means of burning it to optical.
You can burn it to CDs and/or DVDs. I think Teacher49 made the suggestion about buying them because he's grasped how techno-challenged I am.
And the website says that they sell them. I just didn't see any way to order them.

I'm inclined to agree with you, but the tech service guy I asked about buying CDs insisted that I didn't need them (because of the reinstall stuff on the HD) and he wouldn't sell them to me!

Of course, he was quite eager to pass me over to the fee-based tech support folks (at $99/incident).


You see what I mean about Lenovo's customer service?

You don't have to tell me about Lenovo customer service. It took me at least 12 phone calls and hours to get them to properly handle a warranty replacement for my AC/DC power supply.

At first they told it was fine, the part is being shipped. Then a week later they call to tell me, no, I bought the machine from IBM but I bought the AC/DC unit from Lenovo (or perhaps it was the reverse). In any case both were part of the same order. Then they had no way to document my purchase without waiting another several days to get the invoice from the other organization. I had the invoice on my computer and forwarded it.

Then they shipped to my home in SFO even though I was very, very clear that I was working in Chicago for the month.

Then they send the "brick" but not part that goes into the airplane power port. It seems that the part number when you buy it new gets you both plus a neato carry case. When you order replacement, that part gets you only the brick ...

And on and on and on. And I mean on and on ...

To add insult to injury months later they send me a bill for the original broken part. No one in all those hours said anything about shipping back the part that did not work. I had tossed it as the old IBM had advised me to do a couple of times.

I am not likely to buy from them again.

I wonder what they tell people whose hard drive has failed. Or want to upgrade the HDD. They tell them "we'll ship out a new recovery DVD for free. Which OS?" At least, that's what they told me.

For the OP: Call again, open a new case number and tell them your recovery partition isn't working. It appears that "hang up, call again" works for other places than the UA ICC. :D :D :D

BTW, I believe that it's IBM providing the tech support still, not Lenovo.

They tell them "we'll ship out a new recovery DVD for free. Which OS?" At least, that's what they told me.

For the OP: Call again, open a new case number and tell them your recovery partition isn't working. It appears that "hang up, call again" works for other places than the UA ICC. :D :D :D

BTW, I believe that it's IBM providing the tech support still, not Lenovo.

You may well be right, but I think they answer the phone as "Lenovo".

Wireless/Software: My opinion is that you need to install a clean version of XP. As in not from Lenovo. Then add the needed drivers.

Support: Haven't had to deal with them, though will soon since my fan is acting up and being noisy. I'm not surprised at their answer - there is very little they can do. Reinstalling XP is the easiest and fastest way to fix 99% of Windows problems. This is actually what caused me to switch over to Linux.



For what it's worth, I'll second (or 3rd?) the suggestion to wipe clean and reinstall. I did this, and it helped a lot. Also, the link to the guide over at notebookreview* is a great suggestion. There's a lot of chaos on those boards, but there are a few gems and the guide is one of them. I agree, ditch access connections. At least in Vista, windows' handling of wireless is sufficient.

I have a T61, and it's my first IBM/Lenovo. I think it's generally accepted that the build quality is declining, and I only hope I got in before it falls off too much. I'm relatively pleased with my laptop in most respects, but I can see how older versions were even more solid. Re-seating your keyboard might help; I had to re-seat my wrist rest panel because it had some weird 'give' to it. I know, the user shouldn't have to do these things, but sometimes its unavoidable (UA is coming to mind here as well... :D).

I've had hit and miss interactions with support, and the hang up and call back is a great (if unfortunate) suggestion.

* If you run into any snags, feel free to PM me. No guarantees I can help, but I've done the process twice now.

BTW, I believe that it's IBM providing the tech support still, not Lenovo.

The story I was told was that my machine was supported by IBM and that they had to have authorization from Lenovo to replace the AC/DC power supply since they had it as an after market purchase - even though I placed the order on the web site at the same time as buying the ThinkPad. BTW, it is an R60 now 10 or 11 months old.

Still it was IBM that provided the "support" - excruciating!

Here's my take on Lenovo.

(READ: I have a X61 not a T61p so if you don't want to read this...)

After 5 yrs, that's right FIVE years of using a Dell (!!!) Latitude C610, and having no major problems whatsoever except cosmetic, I decided to take the leap and buy a Lenovo X61. At the time, not many choices were very attractive. Asus was too weird (no latch when lid comes down), HP was too horrific (too many stories from my friends) and Sony, yeah right (too overpriced).

Now I did consider upgrading to another Dell (specifically Inspiron 1420) but friends told me otherwise, saying that my 5 yr old C610 was a diamond in the rough.

Take into consideration that I also transistioned from Windows 2000 (C610) straight to Vista (X61).

What's my verdict on X61? TERRIFIC! So far, no problems whatsoever. I love how I can take this notebook wherever and how it is also much quieter than a Dell. Now granted, because of this attribute, the area where I rest my right hand on the notebook gets quite warm at times but that's something to get used to. I had an IT guy uninstall most of the IBM software that comes with the computer, although I left the wireless part still on the system.

I've made one call to Lenovo service. Terrific. Not outsourced, fairly young lady, no accent. She was to the point, told me how much an additional notebook battery cost and told me about some offers online. Brilliant.

[start of rant]

Now I'm sorry but I seriously dislike any Japanese PC maker, whether it's Fujitsu, Sony, Toshiba. My wife has had a Sony VAIO SZ whatever for quite some time and it's been at the repair shop more than it's been with her. 4 service calls, one motherboard replacement, one keyboard replacement, one overpriced piece of junk. I've held the VAIO in my hands and I swear I could probably break it. It's ridiculous. I just think that you stick with Japanese technology such as TVs, DVD players and such but for computers, stay away from the Japanese like a bad cold and leave it to the others.

[/end of rant]

Now I'm sorry but I seriously dislike any Japanese PC maker, whether it's Fujitsu, Sony, Toshiba.
Whoa, hold the prejudice.

It sounds like your gripes are against Sony and has nothing to do with other makers. I will agree with you on Sony. They have positioned themselves to be a lifestyle brand, much like that fruit company. ;) Their products are designed to be shiny and packed full of features to attract buyers. While Vaios are not designed for the torture that is business travel, it can work for some people with a little more TLC.

There is a notebook more solidly built and durable than ThinkPads, and it's Panasonic. The fully rugged ToughBooks are renowned for their durability, and the semi-rugged business notebooks are no slouch either. They have full magnesium alloy chassis that can withstand 100kg of weight on it. In contrast, only ThinkPads' frame is mag alloy and the panels are carbon fibre reinforced plastic. Panasonic notebooks are also known for its long battery life. The 12" ultraportable CF-T7 can run for up to 10 hours under JEITA testing specs, all this while weighing under 1.2kg or 2.65lb. One time in the Shin-Osaka shinkansen waiting room, I observed the vast majority of the oyaji businessmen were using Panasonic notebooks.

Regrettably, Panasonic does not advertise in the states, or it would be more popular. The Japanese electronics makers still have this mentality that their products will sell on their merits alone.

I've made one call to Lenovo service. Terrific. Not outsourced, fairly young lady, no accent.


So you spoke to a woman in China and in Chinese?

I'm not satisfied with my Lenovo purchase ! I admit I bought the cheapest one available because it was meant for interims use but anyways...

I ordered online a western style keyboard which was not delivered. I called in and claimed it. They said they dont offer these modifications. After I checked I saw she was right the option wasnt there anymore. I know what I klicked on though :o

The reciept I got says as well regular keyboard. Well not serious but that was part one.

Then I have to say the unit is far too slow. Not slow in the meaning of it takes a little longer sometimes ! The system freezes. A comp specialist said it's because Vista requires that much RAM (and I checked the task manager, often the CPU works with 100% as well). No idea if that is true but how can they sell a product that is not equipped for the software it comes with? They should put more RAM in it and make it more expensive in the 1st place. I can't know what I need in my Laptop !

It's on ebay right now and I will consider a Mac next week. Even though you pay alot for the name, many of my friends have a macbook and none of them has a problem.

Now I'm sorry but I seriously dislike any Japanese PC maker, whether it's Fujitsu, Sony, Toshiba. My wife has had a Sony VAIO SZ whatever for quite some time and it's been at the repair shop more than it's been with her...

As already noted, Sony aren't really a PC maker.

The engineering used by Panasonic, as well as NEC, Fujitsu and Toshiba is a lot more serious than designs by the likes of Lenovo and Dell.

So you spoke to a woman in China and in Chinese?

What I meant to say was the 800 IBM toll free number I could call in the United States and I spoke to the lady in English. Yeah I just noticed my slight error that could've made you think that. But I don't see what all the fuss is about. I guess I should make a few more calls when I mistakenly drop this notebook on the ground and do see for myself what all the fuss is about :eek:.

There is a notebook more solidly built and durable than ThinkPads, and it's Panasonic. The fully rugged ToughBooks are renowned for their durability, and the semi-rugged business notebooks are no slouch either. They have full magnesium alloy chassis that can withstand 100kg of weight on it. In contrast, only ThinkPads' frame is mag alloy and the panels are carbon fibre reinforced plastic. Panasonic notebooks are also known for its long battery life. The 12" ultraportable CF-T7 can run for up to 10 hours under JEITA testing specs, all this while weighing under 1.2kg or 2.65lb. One time in the Shin-Osaka shinkansen waiting room, I observed the vast majority of the oyaji businessmen were using Panasonic notebooks.

Regrettably, Panasonic does not advertise in the states, or it would be more popular. The Japanese electronics makers still have this mentality that their products will sell on their merits alone.

You will notice that I did not include Panasonic when I was going off on my original post. Then again when I said Japanese PC maker, it would be assumed Panasonic was included. One of my clients uses a ToughBook and I think it's very well designed. He even dropped it on the pavement outside his apartment, booted it up and it was as if nothing had happened.

When this current X61 nears the end of its life, I was going to drop it straight on the pavement to see if this Thinkvantage Protection is just a bunch of a baloney or if it works. Most of you know what it is probably but it detects shocks, etc. shuts off the hard drive when it detects, etc.

You will notice that I did not include Panasonic when I was going off on my original post.
IMO, each of the computer makers have a niche. Panasonic's niche is fully and semi-ruggedized notebooks, and it happens to align with your priorities.

Fujitsu's niche is tablet pc. They were making pen computers way before the Tablet PC idea materialized in Bill Gates' mind. The Stylistic is still the benchmark for tablets. Of the non-tablet laptops, I had S and P series come across my desk, and both are very impressively made.

Toshiba... How the mighty has fallen. If you wanted the best laptop in the mid to late 90's, it was a toss up between Tecra 700CDT and ThinkPad 760. Their quality took a huge hit during the cost-cutting in the early part of this decade and still has not recovered. Toshiba releases interesting machines like Protege R500 and Libretto once in a while, but generally it is hit-or-miss.

I don't have extended hands-on experience with NEC, Sharp and the handful of the smaller makers so I can't comment on them.

Fujitsu's niche is tablet pc. They were making pen computers way before the Tablet PC idea materialized in Bill Gates' mind. The Stylistic is still the benchmark for tablets. Of the non-tablet laptops, I had S and P series come across my desk, and both are very impressively made.

Fujitsu-Siemens products are also seriously well-assembled.