Alaska - Denali help

Okay, here I am with even more questions. Thanks again for your help! ;)

1. I just found out that the bus to Wonder Lake doesn't start until June 8 and we are planning to leave Denali on June 7. Are we missing out on a lot since we can get only as far as Fish Creek. Do you know how long the bus ride would be (round-trip) from Teklanika to Wonder Lake? (Note we've got our 2 year old in tow.)
2. I just read that Savage River campground is more scenic than Teklanika. Should I spend one night at Savage River and then 3 nights at Teklanika?
THANK YOU!:D

Paging East West!

Man I must have had EastWest on the brain last night.
I of course meant Seat 2a.

The buses to Wonder Lake only start on June 8 if the road is clear and open and doesn't need major repairs after the winter.

Wonder lake is nice (in my opinion) but that is a very, very long time on a bus with a small child who doesn't care!

In Alaska you always have to have Plan B and Plan C as weather, road conditions and who knows what can happen.

Back in the days when we could drive ourselves on the park road, I drove to Wonder Lake and it still took a long time. Can't remember how many hours. Long.....long. Slow driving. Bump, bump!

I'd prefer to spend my time at Polychrome Pass! Heaven on Earth.

I want you to have a wonderful time! Memories for a lifetime!

Study that MILEPOST!

In 2006, Mrs runarut and I went to Denali and stayed at the Denali Backcountry Lodge. Denali Backcountry Lodge is at the end of the park road. Of course you can't drive your own vehicle that far into the park. The bus ride on the lodge's bus takes from 5 to 6 hours. They stop quite a bit to look at wildlife and other sites.

As I recall, Wonder Lake is not all that far from the lodge. I would estimate that without stopping to look at stuff along the way, the bus ride would be 4 or more hours each way.

I agree with oldpenny16 - a child is just not going to be keen on spending that much time riding a bus. Plus you have the added benefit of motion sickness. The roads are pretty bumpy and the bus suspensions are rough. Bring motion discomfort (barf) bags.

Paging East West!

Man I must have had EastWest on the brain last night.
I of course meant Seat 2a.

Someone might want to send a PM to Seat 2A. Last time I talked with him, he had been out of the state and off FT for awhile with sporadic Internet access, and if he still is, he probably won't notice this thread.

It sounded like he was planning on coming back up not too long after I talked with him, so he may be home, but I haven't seen him on FT in awhile...

Edit: er, I should have looked first. I just haven't been hanging out in the same rooms as he has--he's been over in the Trip Reports and Travel Photography forums. But he looks to be back and at it!

I have ridden the Denali shuttle buses maybe 6-8 times and would like to offer some thoughts. Teklanika to Wonder Lake is going to be about 8-9 hours. On what is essentially a school bus. It is not terribly comfortable. You are not allowed to stand up. The buses are normally packed full, so that will be you, your wife and your 2 year old in a firm, relatively narrow bus seat.

If your toddler is potty trained, s/he will expect/need to go when s/he needs to go, which is not possible on the bus. There are rest stops maybe every 1.5-2 hours, but otherwise, if you ask the driver to stop for a potty break you are on your own until the next bus comes along that has room for you, which can be a while. I actually saw this happen once, a family with a preschooler who HAD to go. They were very upset that the driver wouldn't wait for them, and I saw them two days later in the park visitor center, where they were still complaining about having had a 2+hour wait for a bus which had room for them.

If your toddler is not potty trained, you will be changing diapers in a narrow seat on your lap on a school bus crammed full of people with no facilities. Not pretty.

Also, the bus stops frequently when there is wildlife to see - the windows come down for photos and everyone is extremely quiet so as to not alarm the animal - honestly, everyone becomes dead silent. If your 2 year old is chattering, fussing or crying, you are going to see a lot of very unhappy people, and that unhappiness if going to be directed at you, particularly if it scares off the one grizzly bear they have seen in their once-in-a-lifetime vacation for which they have saved their entire career.

I have and love kids, but truly I would think long and hard before doing that bus trek with a toddler, I fear it would be a set-up for her to have trouble. My youngest (age 5) did her first bus trip with us from Teklanika this past summer, but we turned around at Fish Creek, which was just about right for her to tolerate and still be a pleasant companion. She (and my older kids) slept most of the way back.

My back won't let me ride the Denali shuttle buses any more. I'm spoiled as years ago we were allowed to drive in all the way to Wonder Lake on one weekend a year if you had Alaska plates and driver's license.

Hey Now!

I stumbled across this while looking for Amtrak stuff - I'm not a regular here else I would have responded to your questions faster. Many other posters did a nice job tho...

Anyway, I drive busses at Denali. In particular, I drive those busses out to Wonder Lake. So, to your questions from a driver's perspective:


1. I just found out that the bus to Wonder Lake doesn't start until June 8 and we are planning to leave Denali on June 7. Are we missing out on a lot since we can get only as far as Fish Creek? Do you know how long the bus ride would be (round-trip) from Teklanika to Wonder Lake? (Note we've got our 2 year old in tow.)

2. I just read that Savage River campground is more scenic than Teklanika. Should I spend one night at Savage River and then 3 nights at Teklanika?
THANK YOU!

On a sunny day, I think the road out to Wonder Lake is, well, wonderful. There's alot less traffic out there (All those dusty tour busses only go as far as Stony Dome at mile 62) and the views of the Alaska Range are stunning. However, if it's cloudy/rainy, you're not missing anything and simply subjecting yourself to three more hours on the bus.

Regardless, it's a LONNNNNNG day out to Wonder Lake and back. And that's from an adult perspective. Imagine how long it would be for a two year old!

Teklanika Campground to Wonder Lake would be about 8.5 to 9 hours roundtrip.

I do think Savage River is the prettiest of the three car accessible campgrounds. It's also the smallest, which is a big plus in my book. It's like 33 sites vs. about 56 for Tek and well over one hundred for Riley Creek. Savage River Campground is also on the pavement, so if you want to drive 10 miles out for a late night pizza or something, that option is there for you. I'd recommend at least a night there. Have a great trip and maybe I'll see you on the road!

Here's a bonus! I just came across this video of a shuttle bus ride in Denali Park (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAlTfny6Z14).

P.S. Also, people have sometimes asked if they can "request" drivers at Denali, be it me or another driver. Reservations sells the shuttle and tour busses by time, not driver. Especially tours - some of the drivers don't even know they'll be working the next day but thanks to operational needs, they are. There are 130 of us and given scheduling, bid seniority, days off, etc., nobody in res. knows who's driving what.

Seat2a for all you do! I know that you have to handle a lot on those buses: the good and the bad and sometimes have sick passengers.

When I'm dead and gone, you may find me ghosting around Polychrome Pass.

I think my late Dad told us that the Park Road was put in during the summers of 1956 and 1957. Does that sound right?

When I'm dead and gone, you may find me ghosting around Polychrome Pass (http://public.fotki.com/Seat2A/denali_national_park/polychromepass2.html).

I think my late Dad told us that the Park Road was put in during the summers of 1956 and 1957. Does that sound right?

The Park Road (From the railroad depot to Kantishna) was built between 1923 and 1938. I think your Dad was referring to the Denali Highway (Alaska Hwy 8) which links Paxson on the Richardson Highway to Cantwell on the Parks Highway.

Seat 2a, thank you so much!

I sat down one morning and watched that view until the day was gone.

You've made my day!

I'm sure you are correct about which road Dad was referring to. I remember when we drove into the Park to Wonder Lake and camped there to wake up in snow in the morning. We'd stayed up late watching the Northern Lights. I swear we could hear them.

The road was closed behind us as we worked our way back out. A trip that took many hours.

We stopped at Polychrome Pass and Mother said 'the last rose of Summer'. We all knew that was true. Another Winter coming.

It's been 20+ years since I back-packed in Denali, but I seem to recall we could get on and off the bus at anytime. So if we wanted to do a day hike, we could hop on the bus, disembark at an interesting spot, hike for the day, return to the road and hitch a ride to a spot nearest our campsite.

If you can still do that, perhaps you could do short hikes with your toddler, then go back to the road, grab the next bus and let your little one nap if possible, then do another hike elsewhere. I know with my little one, we can't plan too much. We pretty much play it by ear and this keeps everyone happy!:):)

Just a thought.:):)