Air New Zealand Air Points - Moving to NZ: Is Airpoints the Best Choice?

I originally posted this in the Star Alliance forum, but the only reply so far suggested I would get a better response here...

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So I am relocating my family from Texas to New Zealand in January. I'm Platinum on AAdvantage (and have lifetime AA Gold status in case I don't fly oneWorld so much once I move).

I'm about to make a few business class trips to NZ and I'm wanting to boost my non-existent status on a *A FFP. But which one?

My #1 desire is to get free/cheap upgrades between NZ/Australia and North America.

My #2 goal is to get status - having no status sucks in seat allocation, boarding, bumping, etc. you know what I mean.

I figure once I'm in NZ my work will pay for 5-10 trips each year within NZ most likely on Air NZ, and a few trips across the Tasman to Australia on whoever is cheapest - Qantas or Air NZ, and most likely economy. I'll also probably pay for 1-2 trips per year in business class out of my own pocket to the US and/or Asia.

So given my #1 and #2 goals - is Air NZ the right choice? What I need to know is if Air NZ gives preferential access to Airpoints members for upgrades, or if other *A members can get upgrades just as easily, coz if that's true then my business class flying might make another *A FFP a better choice.

I'm expecting to stay in NZ for five years and then return to the U.S. I wish there was an easier way to get lifetime status like AAmerican on a *A carrier. :(

Please advise... Thanks!! :)

Sounds like United is the best choice for you (but to maximise your benefits you'll need to fly via SYD/MEL to get to/from USA). UA has million mile lifetime status (equivalent to lifetime PLT on AA) but this is based only on UA metal.

Once UA rejoins the *A-wide mileage upgrade scheme you'll be able to use UA miles to upgrade on NZ flights - although availability is extremely limited especially on flights to/from USA.

NZ airpoints may be a bad choice as cheap economy fares earn little or nothing, and status is really geared to full economy and business fares.

I would agree with you Kiwi Flyer - the big issue with Air NZ is the lack of Airpoints for economy flights, and there can be quite a price difference to get the fare that gives you Airbucks.

That being said, however, as an American who pretty much lives permanently in NZ, I still stick with the program, as I tend to pay for my J class flights typically 3 times a year between AKL and LAX. One thing I will say is that if you pay for premium fares, it's pretty fast to get to Star Alliance Gold status, at least it seems that way, compared to how many miles/segments you need to rack up to get similar with the US-based programs. I could be wrong on this, however...

Another trick I use, by the way, when I'm doing some work in the US (and thus earning USD), is to book my round-trip flights starting from AKL, but use a US credit card to pay. They didn't used to let me do this, but lately I've had no problem. For example, if I outright buy a J class ticket at $7,500 NZD, it works out to around $5,500 USD. But if I try to buy the same ticket starting from LAX, it's priced at $7,500 USD! So you can see, it's a way to shave a bit off the ticket price.

At any rate, I've waffled back and forth about UA versus AirNZ and still tend to prefer the latter. Just watch out for Air NZ's evil tendency to drop earned Airpoints Dollars if you happen to connect from LAX/SFO on a UA or *shudder* US Airways flight - especially in J class!

Domestically, Air NZ has the lion's share of routes, but Qantas and now Pacific Blue (Virgin) are competing on some of the bigger routes (AKL, CHC, WLG primarily). The fares can be unpredictable and widely different at times, at least in my own limited experience. I used to be a loyal Qantas FF member, but jumped ship as soon as the new Business Premier seats came out - as I travel alone mostly, it was hugely nicer than paying so much to sit next to someone I didn't know.

Enjoy your time in NZ - it's a beautiful country and I think highly of the people down here! :)

Once UA rejoins the *A-wide mileage upgrade scheme you'll be able to use UA miles to upgrade on NZ flights - although availability is extremely limited especially on flights to/from USA.


Do you think they ever will re-join ?

I am NZ based, and decided to go for *G with BMI, if you are flying paid C with NZ, you will get to gold very quickly. You won't be able to upgrade with NZ, but you can book cash&miles in C with them. The BD *G will also get you in to lounges in the US, but no E+ on UA.

Another good point about BMI in NZ is that if you earn miles on internal flights (cheap ones earn none) you will get 600 miles per sector, so by way of example, UA gives me 93 miles from AKL-WRE, BMI gives me 600.

Might be worth taking a look in the BMI forum for more details.

tht

I've thought long and hard about this reply.......

You are saying that your travel will be:

1) employer-funded economy Trans-Tasman - which won't generate many points on any airline.

2) self-funded business class to the USA and Hong Kong or Shanghai.


You say that what you want is status and upgrades....

OK, here is my recommendation.

1) Make Air NZ Airpoints your primary program and attempt to make all Tasman travel on Air NZ flights.

2) Book one of your long-haul trips in Business Premier each year, and the second in Premium Economy. That will get you up to NZ Gold, and give you two free Upgrades from Premium Economy to Business Premier, which covers your second return trip. (DON'T book Economy, as Economy to BP one way uses up both free upgrades.

3) If you can get up to Gold Elite, you'll score an extra 2 free annual upgrades- and GE ones are transferable - but make sure you then fall back to Gold before getting back up to GE, otherwise if you stay GE you only get the 2.

If you use BMI you'll never get free upgrades, and if you use United Mileage Plus you will, but you'll have to route via Sydney and fly on their dire aircraft.

[QUOTE=Caractacus;8591047]I originally posted this in the Star Alliance forum, but the only reply so far suggested I would get a better response here...

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So I am relocating my family from Texas to New Zealand in January. I'm Platinum on AAdvantage (and have lifetime AA Gold status in case I don't fly oneWorld so much once I move).
QUOTE]

Not sure if NZ do it, but sound like you might want to get your :-:A status rolling with a status match. BMI may do this, but not sure about NZ, UA should do a once in a lifetime one.

Agree with DCF, if it's upgrades you want NZ, I just misread that because I always think in terms of free tickets rather than upgrades.

Which ever way you choose to go, I thing is clear, you are in for a treat flying with NZ in any class (compared to the US carriers). The flip side of this is that flights can be busy / sold out in C, so you may not be able to use your upgrades, unless they confirm at the time of booking? (I deffer to other on this).

tht

The flip side of this is that flights can be busy / sold out in C, so you may not be able to use your upgrades, unless they confirm at the time of booking? (I deffer to other on this).

tht

Depends on the upgrade method and status.

Using airbucks you can get confirmable upgrades (subject to availability) at the time of request. These cost a lot.

Using airbucks you can also request standby upgrades. These may or may not confirm immediately, after some time, or never.

Using status evouchers upgrades are standby, and processed by status. Gold Elite up to 12 months (so can confirm immediately but won't necessarily do so), Gold shorter period and Silver shorter again. These seem to have higher priority than airbucks standby upgrades, which makes sense given the evouchers expire.

Using *A miles upgrades are standby only. I don't know but suspect these have lowest priority of the lot.

I have to say that I were in the OP's position I would stick with QF (and not bother with *A) and continue crediting to AA. I don't believe that with the amount of travel contemplated and upgrade availability being what it is converting to NZ would be worthwhile

I think, although I am biased, UA would be the next best option. B fares from NZ on UA to the US are much the same as premium economy on NZ. B fares cost only 15K to upgrade to C from SYD/MEL to the US. Once you make 1P (premier exec) with the 100% RDM bonus you would earn about 15K each way. Only downside is that you'd have to fly in E trans-tasman (the flight is relatively short) and you would not be able to upgrade to Asia

Jeff

If you are going to make NZ*G within 3 months, you can purchase Koru Club membership and they will refund your fee when you get to NZ*G. That would solve any problems you might have when travelling Domestically around New Zealand or in cheapiee's to Australia.

3) If you can get up to Gold Elite, you'll score an extra 2 free annual upgrades- and GE ones are transferable - but make sure you then fall back to Gold before getting back up to GE, otherwise if you stay GE you only get the 2.I have always wondered if you made a habit of this whether they would stop dropping you back to G?

Depends on the upgrade method and status.

Using airbucks you can get confirmable upgrades (subject to availability) at the time of request. These cost a lot.

Using airbucks you can also request standby upgrades. These may or may not confirm immediately, after some time, or never.

Using status evouchers upgrades are standby, and processed by status. Gold Elite up to 12 months (so can confirm immediately but won't necessarily do so), Gold shorter period and Silver shorter again. These seem to have higher priority than airbucks standby upgrades, which makes sense given the evouchers expire.

Using *A miles upgrades are standby only. I don't know but suspect these have lowest priority of the lot.

Hence my preference to collect miles, and buy confirmed awards in C when I want to fly up front... And its looking like I may hit another 55k with BMI this year (I did 55k to hit *G), which will mean 625% of flown, if I fly in F, so a TG LHR-AKL-LHR, may be worthwhile if a good offer comes up... That will pretty much net me 2 x C class cash&miles return on NZ... subject to finding a seat.....

tht

OT but is TG F LHR-AKL even cheaper than AKL-LHR? :eek:

I think, although I am biased, UA would be the next best option. B fares from NZ on UA to the US are much the same as premium economy on NZ. B fares cost only 15K to upgrade to C from SYD/MEL to the US. Once you make 1P (premier exec) with the 100% RDM bonus you would earn about 15K each way. Only downside is that you'd have to fly in E trans-tasman (the flight is relatively short) and you would not be able to upgrade to Asia

I can think of another, fairly serious, downside: you'd be flying UA not NZ :D

I can think of another, fairly serious, downside: you'd be flying UA not NZ :D

My last biz class far on UA included a seat that would not recline properly, no audio on the headset despite several replacements, and a meal that was worse than anything I have ever been offered in cattle class on ANZ or AC.
So I would also recommend going with ANZ. Also as someone else pointed out, *A upgrades are the last to be considered by ANZ if at all from what my friends on AC and UA tell me.

I can think of another, fairly serious, downside: you'd be flying UA not NZ :D

OT: I am fine with US (P.S and International 777's) however I would agree that avoiding 12 hours in Y with no Avod, and a poor seat are a good idea. On the other had since the OP is looking for UG's SWU (confirmed at the time of booking assuming he can get to 1K) and a much higher chance of other UG's clearing are worth considering. But would you want to risk 12 hours even in E+ on the 747.... :confused:

In my book, NZ now have the best long haul Y product I have flow, SQ is getting a little tired now. With the New Canada flight you will also have 3 options of entry / connection point for getting to the North-side.

Back OT: It is my read of the OP thou that he wants to know where to credit miles, for status and UG's not decide which airline to fly on...

tht

Wow – thanks VERY much to all of you for your sage advice. Here is my feedback on comments so far:

Sounds like United is the best choice for you (but to maximise your benefits you'll need to fly via SYD/MEL to get to/from USA). UA has million mile lifetime status (equivalent to lifetime PLT on AA) but this is based only on UA metal.tht later echoes my feeling on this - I don't want a FFP that is constructed in a way that requires me to stick to mainly just one of the *A carriers. That doesn't disqualify UA's FFP overall, it just means that their million mile lifetime status benefit is not tenable.

Using *A miles upgrades are standby only. I don't know but suspect these have lowest priority of the lot.To me this is a key issue, and it weighs in AirNZ's favor (favour? :p).

I have to say that I were in the OP's position I would stick with QF (and not bother with *A) and continue crediting to AA.This is a fair point, but I know I will be travelling on AirNZ a fair amount and the thought of not having status is concerning. (I have a young family, and getting home is a priority to me, preferably in sound mind.) Also, when I want to get awards it's helpful to have miles in two alliances - my wife and I have a combined >650k miles in AAdvantage right now, so there's no rush to add more.

Hence my preference to collect miles, and buy confirmed awards in C when I want to fly up front... subject to finding a seat...tht's posts have made me look further into BMI. It's true I was thinking in terms of upgrades rather than awards, as my experience with AAdvantage over the past ten years or more has been that awards in business class between North America and NZ/Aus are increasingly difficult to obtain each year. If the issue of availability can be overcome then BMI has four attractive features over Airpoints:
(1) Generous earning rules - e.g. business class on most *A airlines gets 100% bonus that counts towards status
(2) The possibility of getting a status match for my AAdvantage Platinum
(3) A low annual threshold to maintain *G
(4) If I keep *G for ten years then I get it for life (of Diamond Plus or me, whichever is shortest ;))
The key issue is availability of transpacific awards. I have been reading this thread (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=531029) about successful redemptions; I may post in the BMI forum to see if others have been unsuccessful in getting transpacific business class awards.

Further comments are very appreciated. I am flying in J on Air Canada from HNL to SYD then C on Air NZ to AKL this Saturday, so I need to decide soon which it will be. At this stage I’m seriously thinking BMI if they comp me *G, otherwise AirNZ…

No need to choose yet, just sign up for all the FF programmes before you fly, and don't give a number when you fly, keep your BP's and eticket, then send in both for retro credit when you decided, the only downside to this plan is that Air NZ charge a fee to sign up.

Other key points with BMI were:

- US lounge access
- One way awards (including a free stopover)
- Cash and Miles

However note on the 10 years for life time *G that LH may exercise a call option on BD at some point, and may choose to merge DC with Miles and More (lots of threads about this on DC board).

I have found seats when needed NZ-AU, other than that have only made award bookings NZ-UK (via Asia), my next one is a one way AKL-HKG-LHR which I managed to find for the 23rd or December to get home for xmas.

A really useful tool for all *A award availability is the ANA one (you need to sign up with them, to access it)

tht

Bear in mind that on Airpoints you earn status pretty fast if you actually pay for premium classes on NZ. From your original post it sounded like you will do that a certain amount so it could well work for you. Then again, bmi sounds like quite a good option as well.

Personally, AC works well for me because I like:
1) easy to attain *G status
2) 500 mile minimums for NZ short hops
3) well-priced awards (much better than NZ)

It helps that I have an airpoints earning credit card so I do have a bit of a stash of Airpoints to use for shorthaul upgrades on NZ - I have a great record of these clearing, and you can request upgrades using your airpoints while still crediting the flights to another FFP.

Whatever you decide, happy flying (and hopefully earning) :)

My last biz class far on UA included a seat that would not recline properly, no audio on the headset despite several replacements, and a meal that was worse than anything I have ever been offered in cattle class on ANZ or AC.
So I would also recommend going with ANZ. Also as someone else pointed out, *A upgrades are the last to be considered by ANZ if at all from what my friends on AC and UA tell me.

Encouraging Kanada goose. I am doing ORD - LHR and a lot of flying around the US on UA in J in three weeks