Starwood Preferred Guest - Executive club lounge-Gold / Plt

I am a HHonnors Diamond member and Starwood gold preferred member.

I do a lot of travel to Asia and have been looking at hotel options. I stay now at the Conrad in HK and on my last stay split it between there and the Sheraton HK and Towers,

I experience with Asia upgrades and treatment has been mixed in the last few years. Sometime I book the Executive club lounge when available knowing a gold will not usually get upgraded to it.

I find even room upgrades have been tight. Once in TPE got upgraded to Executive floor and told I did not get the benefit just the room. Another property does not even give gold much at all.

Then the HK Sheraton on this trip. I asked if as a gold there was any chance of an upgrade to the Executive club lounge (Towers Lounge) and told none gets this. I understood that Platinum gets access provided it is not at room capacity. This hotel said no this is a different product and not part of the main hotel so even as a Platinum you must book to get this.

I want to know if this is true throughout Starwood? If so it seems to be a significant negative in the program.

Then the HK Sheraton on this trip. I asked if as a gold there was any chance of an upgrade to the Executive club lounge (Towers Lounge) and told none gets this. I understood that Platinum gets access provided it is not at room capacity. This hotel said no this is a different product and not part of the main hotel so even as a Platinum you must book to get this.

I want to know if this is true throughout Starwood? If so it seems to be a significant negative in the program.

No. Towers is positioned as a separate 'hotel within hotel' and Plat upgrades at the Sheton HK do not get placed into Towers rooms/lounge.

No. Towers is positioned as a separate 'hotel within hotel' and Plat upgrades at the Sheton HK do not get placed into Towers rooms/lounge.

Thank you for the correction. This is what the Hotel said but SPG said this is not right? So the confusion.

I assume you have been to this hotel, How do they justify calling this a separate product? It did not look any better and the lounge seemed just so so compared to others I have seen. My feeling was it was just the top two floors which seems a way to avoid an upgrade then.

Many spg hotels in Asia also have this "hotel within hotel" concept as well. It's very confusing and misleading. One other example is the Sheraton Beijing Great Wall. They have an "elite" executive lounge and it's only for people who book the "elite" rooms. Apparently, they don't consider all Platinum members as "elite". The real problem is not even Platinum Concierge staff know the difference. I once booked a hotel at Great Wall and got upgraded to a Junior Suite. I called SPG Platinum Concierge to see if I can get an Elite room instead (which is much more contemporary looking). They told me the Elite room is actually cheaper than the Junior suite I got and told me there is no reason why the hotel won't let me get an Elite room. I hung up the phone and talked to the hotel manager what SPG told me. The hotel manager wouldn't budge and won't call the Plat Concierge (she said it's my responsibility to call them again, she could't call SPG Platinum Concierge directly). I was so frustrated and gave up and I swear I will never go back. I think there are two things SPG can do:

1. Include this information in the system to let their SPG Plat Concierge know which hotels have this "hotel within hotel" arrangement.
2. Publish on these hotels' websites to let Platinum members know that they won't be able to get upgraded to the tower or elite rooms.

...2. Publish on these hotels' websites to let Platinum members know that they won't be able to get upgraded to the tower or elite rooms.

We've already done that, but apparently some Platinum members and Platinum Concierges don't read the Terms and Conditions. :)

a. Upgrades to the best room at Participating Properties at time of check-in, based upon room availability for your entire stay, including Select Standard Suites. Specialty Suites such as, but not limited to, premium view, Presidential, Honeymoon, and multiple bedroom suites are excluded. Best rooms are identified by each property and may not include upgraded Towers level accommodations unless Towers level accommodations are booked originally. The upgrade benefit is available for one room for the personal use of the Member only, regardless of the number of additional rooms purchased by the Member.

d. Access to the Club Level when staying at Sheraton hotels or access to the Executive Level when staying at Westin hotels, even when not staying on the Club Level or Executive Level floor(s). At Sheraton properties, access to the Club Level does not mean access to the Towers Level, even if there is no Club Level in the hotel and there is a Club Level in the Towers. Access to Towers Level is determined by each individual property. These benefits are limited to the member and one guest IF that guest is in the same room as the member. Lounge access is not available if a lounge is at maximum capacity or if a lounge is closed for any reason.

Honestly...I don't how much clearer it can be.

Sincerely,


William R. Sanders
Customer Service Coordinator
Starwood Preferred Services

guest.forum@starwoodhotels.com

William ( AKA: Starwood Lurker,)

First I want to thank you and SPG for having an official voice here on Flyertalk. This helps clear up customer issues that might otherwise not be properly addressed.

Let me clarify my situation and highlight were I think there might be an issue to be reviewed.

While I am only SPG Gold member I am a top tier in another program. I have been considering for two years qualify for SPG Platinum but wanted to understand the product and program better. My experiences in the last 12 months has not always been favorable. This is in part due to miss-leading information and now possible a major loop hole in the program.

I am sure you intent of SPG is not to frustrate guests or allow information to be unclear. However as I will show below this is what is happening. IT is supported by others experience as well. The fact seems to be hotels creating an artificial difference to exclude a valuable benefit. This is not I am sure the intent of Starwood. However in my one example how does a guest justify paying $ 100.00USD more for a tower room that is unsold to get access to the lounge? The rooms are the same. It is just the top two floors of the hotel? This is what your loyalty should earn you if available.


We've already done that, but apparently some Platinum members and Platinum Concierges don't read the Terms and Conditions. :)

The following is directly from the SPG site under benefits/Platinum. This is what I think most people read or see or hear.


Member Benefits
Preferred Guest
Gold Preferred Guest
Platinum Preferred Guest
Compare Programs
Terms And Conditions
Join Now
Platinum Preferred Guest®
Stay 25 times (or 50 nights) a year, and achieve Platinum status. Enjoy personalized attention and unparalleled rewards at an extraordinary collection of hotels and resorts worldwide as well as the following enhancements:
Our Best Room: You'll automatically be upgraded to our best available guest room at check-in. Best room varies by property and includes select standard suite.
Platinum Concierge: No other program offers such highly personalized service as our Platinum Concierge(SM). Call to make reservations and request upgrades, redeem awards, book opera tickets and baby sitters, or get information on local restaurants and sights.
Complimentary Access: Enjoy complimentary access to the hotel gym and Executive and Club Level floors at Le Méridien®, Westin® and Sheraton® Hotels & Resorts.
Welcome Gift Upon Arrival: Complimentary welcome gift.
Platinum members receive guaranteed room availability with 72+ hour notice of arrival and 4 pm late check out.*


See how Starwood Preferred Guest® compares to other frequent guest programs.

* Platinum members are eligible for late check-out up to 4pm, except at resorts and convention locations, where it is based upon availability. Platinum members receive guaranteed room availability at Regular (RACK) rates when booking 72+ hours prior to 3pm hotel time, day of arrival. Black-out dates may apply to this benefit.


Honestly...I don't how much clearer it can be.

I think the best answer is that is is part of a thirty some page T and C document. Most guest and it seems many SPG staff are not up to date on these details. Some significant points should be on the other page to avaoind this with guests.

Terms & Conditions

These Terms and Conditions govern the Starwood Preferred Guest® Program (the "Program") operated by or on behalf of Starwood Hotels & Resorts Worldwide, Inc. ("Starwood Hotels" or "we") and our relationship with members of the Program ("Members" or "you"). Membership in the Program (“Membership”) is subject to these Terms and Conditions, which supersede all previous loyalty program rules and/or conditions. By using your Membership card or your Membership number to earn or redeem Starpoints®, you agree that:

(a) you have read, understood and accepted these Terms and Conditions;

(b) you are eligible for Membership; and

(c) you consent to Starwood Hotels processing data that is personal to you, and disclosing such data to third parties, in accordance with our privacy statement.

The purpose of the Program is to reward our frequent guests. As described below, Members will receive a Membership card and will earn “Starpoints”, the currency of the Program, for each Eligible Stay at a Participating Property. You can redeem your Starpoints for "Awards" from time-to-time. In addition, you can earn different Membership tiers, depending on the nature and frequency of your stays.

For a list of references to the section where capitalized terms used in these Terms & Conditions are defined, please see Appendix A.


1. GENERAL MEMBERSHIP RULES
2. MEMBERSHIP ELIGIBILITY
3. CANCELLATION OR TERMINATION OF MEMBERSHIP
4. MEMBERSHIP TIERS
A. PREFERRED GUEST: MEMBERSHIP AND BENEFITS
B. GOLD PREFERRED GUEST: MEMBERSHIP AND BENEFITS
C. PLATINUM PREFERRED GUEST: MEMBERSHIP AND BENEFITS
5. EARNING STARPOINTS FROM HOTELS
6. EARNING STARPOINTS FROM STARWOOD VACATION OWNERSHIP PROPERTIES
7. EARNING STARPOINTS WITH PROGRAM AFFILIATES
8. USE OF STARPOINTS: AWARD REDEMPTION GENERAL TERMS
9. USE OF STARPOINTS: HOTEL AWARDS
10. USE OF STARPOINTS: MERCHANDISE AND OTHER AWARDS
11. USE OF STARPOINTS: TRANSFERRING STARPOINTS
12. USE OF STARPOINTS: CHARITABLE DONATIONS
13. ADDITIONAL BENEFITS AVAILABLE FOR OWNERS
14. COMMUNICATIONS
15. STATEMENTS, ERRORS AND RETROACTIVE CLAIMS
16. QUESTIONS
17. APPENDIX I

......

C. PLATINUM PREFERRED GUEST: MEMBERSHIP AND BENEFITS


4C.1. You will earn Platinum Preferred Guest status if you record a minimum of 25 Eligible Stays or 50 Eligible Nights in any calendar year at Participating Properties (“Platinum Minimum Requirement”).

4C.2. The qualifying period for Platinum Preferred Guest membership ("Platinum Membership") is from January 1st through December 31st of each year. Platinum Membership status will commence when a Member meets the Platinum Minimum Requirement in any calendar year and will continue through the remainder of the qualifying year and the next succeeding calendar year. If, in the next succeeding calendar year, the Platinum Member again meets the Platinum Minimum Requirements, then, the Platinum Member will receive a 12-month renewal of their Platinum Membership.

4C.3. If a Platinum Member does not meet the Platinum Minimum Requirements in any subsequent year, the Member will be downgraded to the Gold Preferred Guest level and must meet the Gold Minimum Requirement to maintain that level of Membership.

4C.4. Members of airline crews staying at crew rates and certain pre-specified local negotiated rates are not eligible to receive in-hotel Platinum level benefits and these stays will not count as Eligible Nights when calculating the Platinum Minimum Requirement.

4C.5. In addition to all the benefits of Gold Preferred Guest Membership, Platinum Preferred Guests also receive the following benefits:

a. Upgrades to the best room at Participating Properties at time of check-in, based upon room availability for your entire stay, including Select Standard Suites. Specialty Suites such as, but not limited to, premium view, Presidential, Honeymoon, and multiple bedroom suites are excluded. Best rooms are identified by each property and may not include upgraded Towers level accommodations unless Towers level accommodations are booked originally. The upgrade benefit is available for one room for the personal use of the Member only, regardless of the number of additional rooms purchased by the Member.

My biggest point is SPG line says they follow the benefits off the SPG site. The above statement comes from a 30 some page T and C document. How many employees read and know this and does SPG really expect the guests to read and understand all these items? Should they not include an important item like item 4C5 a.? This is a significant exclusion and not listed on the main web site. This is why people might say it is not clear.

I hope my comets can help clear this up from all prospectives. It is in the interest of SPG and the guest.

I would hope that SPG would consider eliminating this distinction. I find it a significant drawback to a great program other wise as far as I can see.

...How many employees read and know this and does SPG really expect the guests to read and understand all these items? Should they not include an important item like item 4C5 a.? This is a significant exclusion and not listed on the main web site. This is why people might say it is not clear.

Thanks. We expect everyone...members and employees...to read and understand the Terms and Conditions of Membership. These are the rules by which the program operates and, as a member, you agree to abide by them. The first page you cited is an overview of Platinum member benefits, but by no means is a comprehensive tome on the subject. Frankly, there just isn't enough space to place what you are suggesting, and other important information, on one web page.

I hope my comets can help clear this up from all prospectives. It is in the interest of SPG and the guest.

I agree that it is important to hear our members' perspectives on a given subject and I appreciate the time you've taken to do so. I will pass them along to the powers that be, but that does not necessarily mean that any changes will be made to the Platinum benefit overview page.

I would hope that SPG would consider eliminating this distinction. I find it a significant drawback to a great program other wise as far as I can see.

Significant drawback? I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. The last time I checked I think there were less than 30 hotels worldwide where you might find this distinction and not all of them take advantage of it. I understand that this might be an issue for some, however, so I'm willing to pass along your comments to the powers that be.

Best regards,

William R. Sanders
Online Guest Feedback Coordinator
Starwood Hotels & Resorts Worldwide

guest.forum@starwoodhotels.com

We've already done that, but apparently some Platinum members and Platinum Concierges don't read the Terms and Conditions. :)

a. Upgrades to the best room at Participating Properties at time of check-in, based upon room availability for your entire stay, including Select Standard Suites. Specialty Suites such as, but not limited to, premium view, Presidential, Honeymoon, and multiple bedroom suites are excluded. Best rooms are identified by each property and may not include upgraded Towers level accommodations unless Towers level accommodations are booked originally. The upgrade benefit is available for one room for the personal use of the Member only, regardless of the number of additional rooms purchased by the Member.

d. Access to the Club Level when staying at Sheraton hotels or access to the Executive Level when staying at Westin hotels, even when not staying on the Club Level or Executive Level floor(s). At Sheraton properties, access to the Club Level does not mean access to the Towers Level, even if there is no Club Level in the hotel and there is a Club Level in the Towers. Access to Towers Level is determined by each individual property. These benefits are limited to the member and one guest IF that guest is in the same room as the member. Lounge access is not available if a lounge is at maximum capacity or if a lounge is closed for any reason.

Honestly...I don't how much clearer it can be.

Sincerely,


William R. Sanders
Customer Service Coordinator
Starwood Preferred Services

guest.forum@starwoodhotels.com


I'm quite familiar with SPG T&C. The problem here is: 1) some hotels don't use the word "Tower", instead they use some obscure misleading code like "Elite" rooms. How in the mundane world would I know that Elite rooms are Tower rooms? 2) if your Platinum Concierge staff won't even know which hotels have this "hotel within hotel" concept, why would a lowly plat member like me know otherwise?? ;)

Let me just give you one example. The following is the Guest Room description on one of your Sheraton hotel's website:

"Our 827 well-appointed guest rooms, Executive Floors, and suites feature luxurious furnishings and amenities with spacious, renovated, 34-square meter deluxe king and twin bedrooms. Services include internet access, voicemail, cable news, and English newspapers."

When a "normal" person (aka me, I hope) reads this, I would interpret "Executive Floors" as SPG floors. As it turns out, Executive floors referred here by this specific Sheraton hotel are actually where the "Elite" (aka Towers) rooms are located. Platinum members are not allowed access. I stayed at many Westin hotels before and many use the same term "Executive Floors" where I, as a SPG Plat member, was upgraded to and had access to the Executive Floor Lounge. How would I (or even your Plat Concierge Associates) know these Executive Floors are "Tower" Floors and Plat members have no access unless they pay extra? I guess one of the issues here is using the "Tower" term consistently across your hotel brands.

... I guess one of the issues here is using the "Tower" term consistently across your hotel brands.

And this is probably something that can be fixed...but I would have to know the name of the hotel. The room description for the Sheraton Hong Kong...the only example given so far...says Towers in the room description.

Best regards,

William R. Sanders
Online Guest Feedback Coordinator
Starwood Hotels & Resorts Worldwide

guest.forum@starwoodhotels.com

And this is probably something that can be fixed...but I would have to know the name of the hotel. The room description for the Sheraton Hong Kong...the only example given so far...says Towers in the room description.

ktjan is referring to The Great Wall Sheraton Hotel Beijing. AFAIK, there is no use of the word "Towers" on this hotel's website or in the reservations. The only mention of the "Executive Lounge" that I can find is on the Special Offers (http://specialoffers.starwoodhotels.com/sheraton_beijing/SO.htm?IM=PP_LHN_SOP_US_SI_175&) page for an offer that includes "access to our newly renovated Executive Lounge, featuring daily breakfast and afternoon tea and cocktails, and boasting spectacular views of Beijing."

Perhaps SPG thinks that this is not a "Towers" issue at all. Instead, it's a "Club" vs "Executive" issue. SPG benefits at Sheraton are for the Club Lounge. SPG benefits at Westins are for the Executive Lounge. So if a Sheraton has an "Executive Lounge," that's not included in the SPG T&Cs? :rolleyes:

I disagree that the SPG T&Cs cover this adequately. This should not be a guessing game for customers or CSRs.

ktjan is referring to The Great Wall Sheraton Hotel Beijing. AFAIK, there is no use of the word "Towers" on this hotel's website or in the reservations. The only mention of the "Executive Lounge" that I can find is on the Special Offers (http://specialoffers.starwoodhotels.com/sheraton_beijing/SO.htm?IM=PP_LHN_SOP_US_SI_175&) page for an offer that includes "access to our newly renovated Executive Lounge, featuring daily breakfast and afternoon tea and cocktails, and boasting spectacular views of Beijing."

Perhaps SPG thinks that this is not a "Towers" issue at all. Instead, it's a "Club" vs "Executive" issue. SPG benefits at Sheraton are for the Club Lounge. SPG benefits at Westins are for the Executive Lounge. So if a Sheraton has an "Executive Lounge," that's not included in the SPG T&Cs? :rolleyes:

I disagree that the SPG T&Cs cover this adequately. This should not be a guessing game for customers or CSRs.

yup, that's the hotel I was referring to. They use "exotic" terms for tower rooms and tower lounge such as "Elite" rooms and "Executive" lounge. I think SPG hotels should be consistent with the terminology they use to describe their rooms and lounges. The funny thing is that the Plat Concierge Associate kept telling me that there is no reason why they won't get you an Elite room upgrade, especially when the Elite room rate is lower than the Junior Suite I was offered (I'm assuming he referred to the rack rate).

yup, that's the hotel I was referring to....

The Elite rooms at this hotel are on a butlered floor, which would make them ineligible for Platinum complimentary upgrades. I can discuss adding that to the T&C's with the powers that be, but we've discussed butlered floors not being in the upgrade pool previously here at Flyertalk.

Sincerely,


William R. Sanders
Customer Service Coordinator
Starwood Preferred Services

guest.forum@starwoodhotels.com

The Elite rooms at this hotel are on a butlered floor, which would make them ineligible for Platinum complimentary upgrades. I can discuss adding that to the T&C's with the powers that be, but we've discussed butlered floors not being in the upgrade pool previously here at Flyertalk.

Sincerely,


William R. Sanders
Customer Service Coordinator
Starwood Preferred Services

guest.forum@starwoodhotels.com

Yup that would definitely help. I understand that plat upgrades do not include those on the butlered floors. We just need to know what types of rooms at what hotels are on the butlered floors.

The Elite rooms at this hotel are on a butlered floor, which would make them ineligible for Platinum complimentary upgrades. I can discuss adding that to the T&C's with the powers that be, but we've discussed butlered floors not being in the upgrade pool previously here at Flyertalk.

Sincerely,


William R. Sanders
Customer Service Coordinator
Starwood Preferred Services

guest.forum@starwoodhotels.com

As only a Gold I must say these exclusions are frustrating to a prospective Platinum member. More specific, I would suggest like other programs these exclusions if they need to be made in the first place be on the benefits page. I know it has been stated that there is not enough room. I respectfully disagree. this can be done with a few worlds. (Butler and Towers rooms not included.)

I do not feel anyone should have to search the 34 pages T and C's for such significant details.

I feel this is just good customer service. Not an issue of who might be right or wrong on the issue.

Once again, I would feel even if this is a limited number of hotels this policy should be reviewed. All these upgrades are based on availability at the time of check in. Why not offer it to your best customers? There is little to no real cost to the hotel if it is not sold! The goodwill is of far more value.

As a final note these issue would not need to even be discussed. Just offer intangible good will. What is the real value of that?
:)

We've already done that, but apparently some Platinum members and Platinum Concierges don't read the Terms and Conditions. :)



Honestly...I don't how much clearer it can be.

Sincerely,


William R. Sanders
Customer Service Coordinator
Starwood Preferred Services

guest.forum@starwoodhotels.com

I think the op's point is that the names of the offending/less desirable properties be published. It will obviously be looked at as some kind of shame list but it is only fair to us consumers.It will also encourage properties/future spg properties to not do such a thing. Its disgusting and makes any spg platinum member less inclined to use spg. I do not agree with adding more terms to the conditions. I'm not sure why towers room,non spg participating room categories are allowed to be booked on spg.com. If the management contract were to state that spg earns revenue from only rooms in spg categories, im sure spg would be against the towers concept altogether.and that is the point. why is spg supporting the towers /hotel within hotel concept?

Thank you for your post.

I think the op's point is that the names of the offending/less desirable properties be published. It will obviously be looked at as some kind of shame list but it is only fair to us consumers.It will also encourage properties/future spg properties to not do such a thing. Its disgusting and makes any spg platinum member less inclined to use spg. I do not agree with adding more terms to the conditions. I'm not sure why towers room,non spg participating room categories are allowed to be booked on spg.com. If the management contract were to state that spg earns revenue from only rooms in spg categories, im sure spg would be against the towers concept altogether.and that is the point. why is spg supporting the towers /hotel within hotel concept?

Here is my idea to clarify this issue. I am not in favor but feel it is more fair the reading or adding more to the long T and C pages.

The following is directly from the SPG site under benefits/Platinum. This is what I think most people read or see or hear.

Member Benefits

Platinum Preferred Guest®

Stay 25 times (or 50 nights) a year, and achieve Platinum status. Enjoy personalized attention and unparalleled rewards at an extraordinary collection of hotels and resorts worldwide as well as the following enhancements:
Our Best Room: You'll automatically be upgraded to our best available guest room at check-in. Best room varies by property and includes select standard suite.

Platinum Concierge: No other program offers such highly personalized service as our Platinum Concierge(SM). Call to make reservations and request upgrades, redeem awards, book opera tickets and baby sitters, or get information on local restaurants and sights.
Complimentary Access: Enjoy complimentary access to the hotel gym and Executive and Club Level floors at Le Méridien®, Westin® and Sheraton® Hotels & Resorts.

Welcome Gift Upon Arrival: Complimentary welcome gift.
Platinum members receive guaranteed room availability with 72+ hour notice of arrival and 4 pm late check out.*

* Platinum members are eligible for late check-out up to 4pm, except at resorts and convention locations, where it is based upon availability. Platinum members receive guaranteed room availability at Regular (RACK) rates when booking 72+ hours prior to 3pm hotel time, day of arrival. Black-out dates may apply to this benefit.

They have all this outlined on the benefits overview page. I feel this is what most SPG and guest follow. They are not fully aware of every detail in the T and C's. While we all need to follow them they should bot be used in a reward program as a sort of gotcha.

Why not add a few word like this:

(Butler and Towers rooms not included.)

It can not be that difficult and would eliminate some confusion like it or not!

If they feel they need to create hotels with in hotels. Personally I feel it is a bad idea and not truly guest friendly. If it exists at all it should be a very high end properties and with a very significant difference. In my one example the difference was minimal and does not speak well to the program.

My only goal is for everyone to better understand the program and rules. Then we all can make our own choices.

...My only goal is for everyone to better understand the program and rules. Then we all can make our own choices.

I think I already said I would discuss this with the powers that be...and I have; however, it is not going on the Platinum benefit overview page if it happens at all. It will be going in the T&C's under Platinum benefits, which is not 34 pages worth of information, but maybe a page and a half. ;)

But you, and everyone else, should know in advance that I don't have the power to make this happen. If I did the T&C's would be hundreds of pages in length by now. :)

Best regards,

William R. Sanders
Online Guest Feedback Coordinator
Starwood Hotels & Resorts Worldwide

guest.forum@starwoodhotels.com

If they feel they need to create hotels with in hotels. Personally I feel it is a bad idea and not truly guest friendly. If it exists at all it should be a very high end properties and with a very significant difference. In my one example the difference was minimal and does not speak well to the program.

My only goal is for everyone to better understand the program and rules. Then we all can make our own choices.

If you have to choose between keep existing t & c and just 'educating" members or improving the physical provision of benefits, ie blacklisting the offending properties or discouraging properties form having seperate hotel within hotel.

can the mod open a poll to decide what Fters prefer, to keep the hotel within hotel concept or go without it altogether?

honestly, I don't mind if spg has any hotel-within-hotel properties, they just have to list such concept on their individual hotels' websites. Once I know these are non-upgradable Tower, Elite, Bulter or whatever-name specialty rooms, I won't even bother asking for an upgrade upon check-in and feel frustrated if I don't get such upgrade.