Travel Technology - Cingular vs T-Mobile

Your experience: Who has better coverage traveling within USA?

My experience is 2 years with TMobile after 5 with Cingular. I travel a lot and mostly by air to larger urban areas where I then stay in that larger urban area. I've never not had coverage with TMobile. I love just about everything about their company, coverage, phones, and plans. I just wish they had rollover minutes.

Other than that, I'm a huge fan. Just my experience...

I have had T-Mobile for years (since before they were "VoiceStream"), and I would disagree on the coverage. If you're in major cities, coverage is usually good. Outside of cities, in suburban and rural areas, T-Mobile's coverage is by far the worst of the carriers. I put up with it because I wanted GSM (lots of international travel), but have started switching the rest of my family over to Cingular, where the coverage is much better, though prices are higher.

I am otherwise satisfied with T-Mobile, but if you do not live in an urban area I would try out the coverage before signing up (try to find someone with a T-Mobile phone).

T-Mobile's coverage is pretty good. I've had them for ~5 years. They definitely don't have as good coverage in areas without many people, but since I almost never go to such places that's not an issue for me. Their international calling and roaming rates are a LOT better than Cingular's and Cingular makes you pay extra for an international calling plan. Also, T-Mobile will sign you up for a one year plan. Cingular almost always insists on two year plans.

Within US, I like the quality of T-Mobile. Cingular signals are often strong, but
the voice call quality is generally not as good.

I've used Cingular for 3 years, and although I've looked at T-Mobile, I keep finding Cingular better for my needs.

The things that I like about Cingular include:

Nationwide roaming (without fees) -- It is very freeing not to have to be concerned about roaming charges, especially with college kids in the family. (I recently was in a seminar in a hotel, and while I had great coverage, an associate with Verizon could only get costly roaming unless he went to the lobby.)

Good rural coverage which helps when traveling in the US.

Rollover minutes.

Unlimited mobile-to-mobile (Cingular & AT&T), including now messages.

I travel to Europe once or twice a year (for about 2 weeks each) and I've always used Cingular's int'l roaming. It's been more cost effective for me.

FWIW, here's what I do when in Europe: Turn off voice mail since it's twice the cost per minute to retrieve, as are most inbound calls from the US. So I typically don't answer and inbound call but I return the call right away (since caller ID works). I also rely on text messaging from associates in the US -- much cheaper and you don' t have to be awake. At night, I leave the phone on with the ringer off so I can tell who has called.

Now if only they had a decent calling plan from here to Canada.

AT&T (the new Cingular) has plans with unlimited calling to anyone with an AT&T landline, in addition to AT&T/Cingular mobile, but there are no rollover minutes.

Cingular makes you pay extra for an international calling plan.

This is not true; you can get international roaming without a plan, but you have to ask for it (they won't offer). The per-minute rates are higher, but comparable to T-Mobile's non-"World Class" rates.

This is not true; you can get international roaming without a plan, but you have to ask for it (they won't offer). The per-minute rates are higher, but comparable to T-Mobile's non-"World Class" rates.

Will Cingular allow international roaming on a pay as you go plan? I have Cingular just for international use, but I started with a relatively inexpensive 2year plan. Once that plan lapses, can I go to some type of pay as you go plan??

I had Cingular for 2 years and T-Mobile for 5 years. I much prefer T-Mobile -- from their phone plans to their service. The coverage is adequate, although even in places like Raleigh-Durham, NC there is no "native" T-Mobile coverage (they route me through SunCom, which is spotty). I haven't been to SFO in a while, but I remember having trouble at the SFO airport... it would always put me on the Cingular network for some reason. That was a couple years ago.

i've been w/ T-MO for about 5 yrs, alot better than sprint (guess anyone is right), great customer service, good phones, good coverage. Have 3 lines with them now

I've been with AT&T -> Cingular -> AT&T since 2001, and have had no problems at all. I'm currently on a BlackBerry, and have had exactly 0 dropped calls, or quality issues.

I realize I am in the minority with this. Just about every member of my team has switched carriers over the years due to quality issues, but I've been happy.

FWIW, Mrs. Sqwert has a Motor Razr through Cingular and is on an a plan that gives her local, national, and international calls (450 anytime, 1000 night and weekend minutes) with no long distance to Canada, Mexico and the US for $59.99 a month - rollover included. She doesn't even seem to get charged for roaming when in Canada.

It's not a published plan, you have to ask for it - the code on her bill is NAM450R1KNW

Will Cingular allow international roaming on a pay as you go plan? I have Cingular just for international use, but I started with a relatively inexpensive 2year plan. Once that plan lapses, can I go to some type of pay as you go plan??

I roam internationally using Cingular with no international calling plan. I had to call and ask them to enable international roaming, which was tough when I was a new subscriber (they wanted a longer payment history - international roaming can get expensive and they're actually paying another carrier for the minutes that you use). The per-minute rates are quite high, but as others have mentioned text messages aren't terribly expensive (still much more than getting a local sim, but with my cingular sim everyone can reach me) if you limit the number that you send.

A litte bit about my domestic experiences with Cingular - I live in Manhattan and find that the quality of their network isn't great. My phones (I have tried several) always show a good signal but poor sound quality and dropped calls are common (even when the phone thinks it has a great signal). I moved here last summer from Boston. I was very happy with Cingular up there but now I am counting the days until my contract with them expires.

Now if only they had a decent calling plan from here to Canada.

I agree with your list and you've given me some ideas for utilizing our phone a little more efficiently when abroad. ^

In return, I'll share this outfit (and I'm sure there are others) that we've used for a couple of years now after seeing their ad in UA's Hemispheres mag:

http://www.gorillamobile.com/

Other than the odd time that people on the receiving end can't hear us, it's very cost-effective. :)

Cheers,
Fredd

Now if only they had a decent calling plan from here to Canada.

I use Cingular, and pay $9.99/month for free long distance to Canada, as well as free roaming while in Canada. I think Mexico might be included as well, but I've never been there. I'm not sure if this option is still offered; I have had it for over 3 years. I think it shows up on the statements as "North America Package."

I use Cingular, and pay $9.99/month for free long distance to Canada, as well as free roaming while in Canada. I think Mexico might be included as well, but I've never been there. I'm not sure if this option is still offered; I have had it for over 3 years. I think it shows up on the statements as "North America Package."

Free roaming? Alas no - it's currently $.59 a minute and I hope you can maintain your "grandfathered" plan:

Cingular® Canada™ $3.99 per month
With Cingular Canada, get our lowest rates when you travel to or call Canada.*
Call 1-866-CINGULAR to sign up now.
59¢ per minute while roaming in Canada
19¢ per minute when calling from the U.S.
*Outside this destination, standard rates apply.

http://tinyurl.com/29z8gf

[QUOTE=Fredd;7466361]Free roaming? Alas no - it's currently $.59 a minute and I hope you can maintain your "grandfathered" plan:
QUOTE]

The fine print of my wife's plan indicates the same charge for roaming, however they have never charged it.... Mrs. Sqwert is actually in Canada as I type this, and I just checked her online bill.... sure enough, no roaming charges.

I'm takin' it !

The fine print of my wife's plan indicates the same charge for roaming, however they have never charged it.... Mrs. Sqwert is actually in Canada as I type this, and I just checked her online bill.... sure enough, no roaming charges.

I'm takin' it !

Cool! :)

I'm tempted to sign up for the Canada plan to find out if it works for me. Right now when in Canada I think roaming works out to about $.80 a minute all in, which is okay for the odd quick call but certainly beyond my budget for conversations of any length.

Free roaming? Alas no - it's currently $.59 a minute and I hope you can maintain your "grandfathered" plan:

Cingular® Canada™ $3.99 per month
With Cingular Canada, get our lowest rates when you travel to or call Canada.*
Call 1-866-CINGULAR to sign up now.
59¢ per minute while roaming in Canada
19¢ per minute when calling from the U.S.
*Outside this destination, standard rates apply.

http://tinyurl.com/29z8gf

I think the plan that you are referring to here is different than what I am paying for. I signed a 2 year contract in 2003 with ATT Wireless. I am still on the same plan, with the same old ATT SIM card, and haven't signed another contract since. I buy my new phones overseas, primarily in Hong Kong where I can buy newer models than what is being offered with new contracts here in the US.

Before posting, I should have verified whether the same kind of add-on service is currently being offered. I just assumed so, because several of my friends seem to have the same thing.

The Pros of each:

Cingular:
Better nationwide coverage in more rural areas and smaller cities/towns
Rollover Minutes (usable up to 1 year)
Better nationwide coverage for wireless data plans (Edge and HSDPA)
Large selection of phones including many new ones like the iPhone
Walkie Talkie (PTT) Service available in USA on select phones

T-Mobile:
Good coverage if you remain in larger cities and on interstate highways
More anytime minutes for the money (ie individual voice plans)
No extra monthly charge to add Int'l roaming
1 year contract available
Some claim better voice call quality


Based on recent experience who drops more calls: Cingular or T-Mobile?

My experience as a TMO customer over the past several years is that their coverage is great in major US cities and along the interstates, but once you get out there in rural America they're pretty useless. I've seen folks with Cingular have much better luck when I'm dead in the water.

Your experience: Who has better coverage traveling within USA?
for me, cingular has better coverage -- particularly the beaches in California, and suburbs in fairfield county.

My experience as a TMO customer over the past several years is that their coverage is great in major US cities and along the interstates, but once you get out there in rural America they're pretty useless. I've seen folks with Cingular have much better luck when I'm dead in the water.

This reminds me of "you pay what you get".

Very happy with T-mobile. Yes, coverage outside major cities can be spotty, but when it comes to the choice of plans and their customer service I wouldn't pick anything else.

I do get annoyed that they still don't have any 3G though... EDGE is getting painfully slow.

The Pros of each:

Cingular:
Better nationwide coverage in more rural areas and smaller cities/towns
Rollover Minutes (usable up to 1 year)
Better nationwide coverage for wireless data plans (Edge and HSDPA)
Large selection of phones including many new ones like the iPhone
Walkie Talkie (PTT) Service available in USA on select phones

T-Mobile:
Good coverage if you remain in larger cities and on interstate highways
More anytime minutes for the money (ie individual voice plans)
No extra monthly charge to add Int'l roaming
1 year contract available
Some claim better voice call quality


Based on recent experience who drops more calls: Cingular or T-Mobile?

Excellent summary. I would add:

Customer service: T-mobile
Unlock phone: T-mobile (unless Cingular/ATT has relaxed their policy)
Coverage when in subways, trains and tunnels: Cingular

Just a point that Cingular will sell you a SIM if you have an unlocked phone and want a 'pay as you go' plan. I think I paid about $100 for about 1200 minutes good for a year. They gave me a SIM which I inserted into my R520M and it worked like a charm.
Cingular was the only carrier with a decent signal in an area I am building a house on in Florida (about 50 miles north of Tampa). Even my current company (which I like a lot), Verizon, had no usable signal.

I am a current Cingular customer in a Rural area and am doing a test switch to TMo this week.

I have been very happy with my Cingular service for the last 4 years, but I have not been happy with Cingular pricing and customer service. To get anything done with Cingular you have to threaten to drop them and then be transferred to the retention department, only then do you get someone that can and will resolve your issue.

I have used a TMO sim in my phone and had the same quality service as Cingular. With TMO's recent roaming agreements I don't think coverage will be an issue any longer.

I am currently on a Cingular family plan with 4 phones, all phones are unlocked and quad band. I expect to save about $50 a month switching from Cingular to TMo. A key cost savings will be TMo's unlimted text messaging at $20 a month for a family plan - my kids do more texting than talking.

To get anything done with Cingular you have to threaten to drop them and then be transferred to the retention department, only then do you get someone that can and will resolve your issue.

It's sad when business behave like this. Cingular needs to be more responsive to its customer's needs, and not irritate them before they will do something.

I left AT&T because their customer service was awful. Voicestream/T-Mobile, on the other hand, is amazing. T-Mobile's coverage decent in Denver, but there's about a 1-mile (diameter) dead spot in the southern 'burbs--and I think my parents are right in the middle of it. On the flip side, I get a signal up in Blackhawk/Central City where most companies don't.

I used Cingular for several years before moving to T-Mobile...I'm much happier with Tmo. The biggest unmentioned benefit is that I can understand the bills. When I was with Cingular, my bill would vacillate monthly in ways totally unrelated to my usage patterns...I could never figure it out. As well, for those of us that travel frequently, Tmo offers some great EDGE/WIFI data plans...I pay $30 per month for unlimited edge/push-email and wifi at Starbucks/ACs/CRCs/RCCs/US Clubs/many airports/Borders/etc.

I like TMobile's customer service a lot. The only downside is TMobile has no coverage on Vail mountain! Makes it a bit hard to coordinate with friends when you are running late for lunch at Two Elk.

I once drove for several days from SF to Seattle and had excellent coverage the entire way.

As mentioned above, and a couple other places in this thread, T-mobile has great customer service. I have no experience with Cingular, but they completely blow away Sprint's, for example.

I like TMobile's customer service a lot. The only downside is TMobile has no coverage on Vail mountain! Makes it a bit hard to coordinate with friends when you are running late for lunch at Two Elk.

I once drove for several days from SF to Seattle and had excellent coverage the entire way.
Are you saying you had no signal at all on the Mountain or you were roaming with TMo while on the mountain?

Let's face it, GSM coverage in the USA outside of metropolitan areas and Interstate highways is spotty, but getting better. That is the price we pay to have a broader selection of phones and world-wide compatibility.

I like TMobile's customer service a lot. The only downside is TMobile has no coverage on Vail mountain! Makes it a bit hard to coordinate with friends when you are running late for lunch at Two Elk.

Really? I've gotten receiption (usually 1 bar) when on the front-side of the mountain. Once I hit the back bowls, I didn't. Then again, I would never answer the phone while skiing the back bowls. :)

We've used Cingular and before that AT&T (and of course now AT&T again). Service wise, we have used it all over the US and it is virtually never without a signal.

Let's face it, GSM coverage in the USA outside of metropolitan areas and Interstate highways is spotty, but getting better. That is the price we pay to have a broader selection of phones and world-wide compatibility.[/QUOTE]

Yes, GSM has a larger selection of phones because approx. 3/4 of all cellular phones used worldwide are GSM.

T-Mobile: Buy it for its customer service and price
Cingular: Buy it for better nationwide coverage.

As mentioned above, and a couple other places in this thread, T-mobile has great customer service. I have no experience with Cingular, but they completely blow away Sprint's, for example.


The worst thing about Cingular is their CS. The front-line CS people must get no training at all. Nothing takes less than an hour to resolve.

Anyone have differing experiences with both providers sending and receiving SMS / Text Messages? Is one more reliable than the other?

I've had mostly dependable service with T-Mobile while roaming outside the US, though occasionally seem to have a mystery message that is never received...

With Cingular I had roaming coverage available on board Princess Cruises while out at sea in the Atlantic. In all ports in Carribean and South America, always roaming coverage available. The coverage is there, but the cost gets expensive.

I had a Cingular TDMA phone for 6 years and loved the coverage, no roaming anywhere.

Relucatantly I switched over to a Cingular GSM phone last year and have been pleasantly surprised by the coverage. However, I rarely travel off the beaten path.

Been with Cingular for three years - coverage seems comparable to GSM coverage in Europe (I recently moved from O2UK to VodafoneUK) and spend my time between US & Europe.

Always better coverage in major cities/towns and along the major road networks.

To avoid heavy roaming charges I use call divert and VOIP. I get my per minute roaming down to 10c per minute and never miss a call.

I have TMO (personal) and Cingular (business). Within the past year or so, I've noticed that TMO coverage has significantly improved. At this point I'd say if I hit a dead spot it's usually dead for both. The few times one works and not the other, it's been about 50/50. TMO customer service and pricing is far superior to Cingular. Assuming coverage where you need it, I'd go with TMO hands down. They have a really good coverage map on their site, btw - should show you exactly where you'd have issues.

T-mobile actually roams on Cingular (or whatever 850/1900Mhz network is available) in areas where they have no coverage. They're quite stringent about the coverage boundaries so in places where coverage overlaps you won't be able to use Cingular. I was astonished at how granular they can make the ability to roam... down to the cellsite.

If you're going into the boonies, you *really* need an 850 capable handset. In most areas, you don't need one, but even when driving long distances... it's necessary to ensure coverage in as many places as possible.

T-mobile actually roams on Cingular (or whatever 850/1900Mhz network is available) in areas where they have no coverage. They're quite stringent about the coverage boundaries so in places where coverage overlaps you won't be able to use Cingular. I was astonished at how granular they can make the ability to roam... down to the cellsite.

If you're going into the boonies, you *really* need an 850 capable handset. In most areas, you don't need one, but even when driving long distances... it's necessary to ensure coverage in as many places as possible.

Bottom Line: T-Mobile for price, customer service, and coverage that includes Cingular coverage. Now what if you don't find a T-Mobile phone you like? Buy one somewhere else that is unlocked?

Bottom Line: T-Mobile for price, customer service, and coverage that includes Cingular coverage. Now what if you don't find a T-Mobile phone you like? Buy one somewhere else that is unlocked?

I have a Blackberry 8100 (pearl) through tmobile and have been quite happy with it. I've been with them since 2000, back in the voicestream days and their coverage seems to get better every year. One thing to note though, is that they are terrible in getting software updates out on their phones. The new blackberry OS has been out for months on the Cingular 8100, but nothing for tmobile.

Bottom Line: T-Mobile for price, customer service, and coverage that includes Cingular coverage. Now what if you don't find a T-Mobile phone you like? Buy one somewhere else that is unlocked?

Yep... that's what I do. I haven't used a T-mo branded handset since they were voicestream.

At this point I'd say if I hit a dead spot it's usually dead for both.

TMO user since day of Omnipoint.... ^

But one place they're still behind is Grand Central Station, NY. Everybody w/ Verizon or Cingular gets signal on the main platform and even tunnel at times. I've actually tested with a second phone using international SIM/nbr from various Asian countries, and although nothing with TMO, my second phone gets Cingular signal.

Calling Cingular (now ATT) customer service is like calling the cable company. You are on hold for 30 or more minutes only to then be transferred repeatedly and disconnected. I switched to TMobile 6 months ago and the difference is like night and day. TMobile is also saving me 20% over Cingular ATT particularly with their "My Faves" program. I will never go back to Cingular ATT.

Calling Cingular (now ATT) customer service is like calling the cable company. You are on hold for 30 or more minutes only to then be transferred repeatedly and disconnected. I switched to TMobile 6 months ago and the difference is like night and day. TMobile is also saving me 20% over Cingular ATT particularly with their "My Faves" program. I will never go back to Cingular ATT.

I agree that TMobile is a better value than Cingular. Cingular at the moment has better international data packages than TMobile. I wish Tmobile would copy them, or better yet, adopt the roaming packages they are currently rolling out in Europe.

I have been with TMo for a little over 1 month. I am VERY pleased with TMo. The customer service is outstanding and my cost is significantly lower than Cingular.

I live in what most would consider the boonies and with some minor exceptions have not had any issues with coverage. I have noticed that my phone roams more than it did with Cingular, but my plan covers it so I don't care. I also get much better coverage at my home, especially in my basement.

What I really wish the carriers would start offer service plans that allow you to select your desired services from a menu within a price range.

I love my Cingular but I have heard very mixed reviews from others. A big difference is the level of customer service you get based on what kind of customer you are. It's kind of like when you call the airline and you get either the Plat desk of the no status desk and what they will do for you.

I get great customer service but some people haven't gotten what they wanted. I have been with them for like 5 years, have 4 lines and my bill is like $175 a month (2 blackberry plans, 2 text messaging plans, 4 voice lines, lots of minutes)

I opened an account with T-Mobile in January. While I've had a few technical issues, most if not all of them have been caused by the local partner (Dobson). T-Mobile has been very helpful every time, even when it's not their fault. I'm roaming in ANC, and they're aware of that and don't mind at all. I pay $55/mo. for myFaves, 300 anytime minutes and free n/w, and it works perfectly for me. I also have free roaming anywhere in the US. It's been a great experience for me.

After 5 years w/ Sprint, 1 year w/ Verizon (hate them with a passion), 1 year w/ T-Mobile - I am now with Cingular. I travel to very rural spots and have found that Cingular works much better for me than T-Mobile did.

CDMA has it's advantages as well so I kept my Sprint plan going as a backup. (3 phones - $60/month for all three)

For me: Cingular > T-Mobile.

I'm a gadget freak as well and the fact that the iPhone will be on Cingular is a plus for me as well.

Hi,

How do you turn off your voicemail?

Thanks,


I've used Cingular for 3 years, and although I've looked at T-Mobile, I keep finding Cingular better for my needs.

The things that I like about Cingular include:

Nationwide roaming (without fees) -- It is very freeing not to have to be concerned about roaming charges, especially with college kids in the family. (I recently was in a seminar in a hotel, and while I had great coverage, an associate with Verizon could only get costly roaming unless he went to the lobby.)

Good rural coverage which helps when traveling in the US.

Rollover minutes.

Unlimited mobile-to-mobile (Cingular & AT&T), including now messages.

I travel to Europe once or twice a year (for about 2 weeks each) and I've always used Cingular's int'l roaming. It's been more cost effective for me.

FWIW, here's what I do when in Europe: Turn off voice mail since it's twice the cost per minute to retrieve, as are most inbound calls from the US. So I typically don't answer and inbound call but I return the call right away (since caller ID works). I also rely on text messaging from associates in the US -- much cheaper and you don' t have to be awake. At night, I leave the phone on with the ringer off so I can tell who has called.

Now if only they had a decent calling plan from here to Canada.

AT&T (the new Cingular) has plans with unlimited calling to anyone with an AT&T landline, in addition to AT&T/Cingular mobile, but there are no rollover minutes.

FWIW, here's what I do when in Europe: Turn off voice mail since it's twice the cost per minute to retrieve, as are most inbound calls from the US.

Are you sure about this? I'm a new Cingular customer and have looked at the website and talked to quite a few customer service people about the per minute charges while abroad and no one has mentioned that most inbound calls from the U.S. are twice the stated per minute charge. I have seen where it is stated that retrieving voicemail while abroad is twice the per minute charge but not inbound calls.

Are you sure about this? I'm a new Cingular customer and have looked at the website and talked to quite a few customer service people about the per minute charges while abroad and no one has mentioned that most inbound calls from the U.S. are twice the stated per minute charge. I have seen where it is stated that retrieving voicemail while abroad is twice the per minute charge but not inbound calls.

I was hit with this fee in 2004 when I was in Tanzania. I turned my phone off most of the time, but turned it on once a day simply to see if there were voicemails. Every deposited voicemail was build at e.g. an international call to Tanzania and a conditional call forward back home. Even when the phone was off.

Call Cingular before you leave and have them turn your voicemail off.

Stu

Hi,

How do you turn off your voicemail?

Thanks,

Disable call forwarding.

I was hit with this fee in 2004 when I was in Tanzania. I turned my phone off most of the time, but turned it on once a day simply to see if there were voicemails. Every deposited voicemail was build at e.g. an international call to Tanzania and a conditional call forward back home. Even when the phone was off.

Call Cingular before you leave and have them turn your voicemail off.

Stu

Thanks Dubai Stu, and I will certainly do that! What I was confused about however is the statement by DBruce49 where he says "as are most inbound calls from the United States". I am taking that to mean that any call from the U.S. that I answer while I am in Europe will cost me twice the per minute charge as stated on Cingular's website, i.e. the stated charge for incoming calls from the U.S. while I am in France is 1.29 per minute but it will be twice that amount according to him. It looks like he is talking about both incoming calls that one answers and also calls that go to voicemail. I'm probably not reading it correctly and he just means calls going to voicemail but I just wanted to clarify and at this stage of my life I seem to need clarification more often! ;)

I was hit with this fee in 2004 when I was in Tanzania. I turned my phone off most of the time, but turned it on once a day simply to see if there were voicemails. Every deposited voicemail was build at e.g. an international call to Tanzania and a conditional call forward back home. Even when the phone was off.

Call Cingular before you leave and have them turn your voicemail off.

Stu

And here's a clear case of where Cingular is wrong and is ripping people off. The *only* time you should be charged this way is if your phone is on and rings, and the call is then redirected back to your VM.

When your phone is off, the call is never sent abroad. Once it stops updating the Visitor Location Register, after 5-30 minutes, calls go straight to voicemail and never go international.

I certainly don't pay such bills on T-mo. Also, you needn't keep the phone off to avoid the voicemail charges. Simply set the phone up to unconditionally divert all calls to voicemail and you won't be charged. If people need you, have them text you.

Again, the ONLY time you should receive such bills is if your phone rings and the call is subsequently diverted to voicemail. It's not necessary to answer in this case. But if the phone is truly off, you shouldn't be charged. Nor do you need to go without voicemail!

Thanks Dubai Stu, and I will certainly do that! What I was confused about however is the statement by DBruce49 where he says "as are most inbound calls from the United States". I am taking that to mean that any call from the U.S. that I answer while I am in Europe will cost me twice the per minute charge as stated on Cingular's website, i.e. the stated charge for incoming calls from the U.S. while I am in France is 1.29 per minute but it will be twice that amount according to him. It looks like he is talking about both incoming calls that one answers and also calls that go to voicemail. I'm probably not reading it correctly and he just means calls going to voicemail but I just wanted to clarify and at this stage of my life I seem to need clarification more often! ;)

It's only if you have an incoming call that is subsequently diverted to voicemail. If this happens, from a cost standpoint you'd be better served to hit send, and then quickly hang up on the call if you can't talk!

It is not Cingular it is the roaming carrier. They don't release the phone from the system when it is switched off. As a matter of fact, at this year's Gitex (the Middle East's largest tech show), they were actively demonstrating technology aimed at enhancing roaming revenue by increasing the time your phone remains registered on the roaming network and using a software trick that would slow your phone down on registering on a competing carrier.

Under this approach, if you landed at Frankfurt, powered your phone back up for one call to tell your wife that you made your connection, and then shut it down and boarded at plane to the US, you'd be paying these roaming rates until you powered your phone back up in the US.

As annoying as it is, you need to either disable your voicemail or hardforward (e.g. not conditional) all calls to voicemail. If you let the system send it to voicemail if you don't answer, you will hugely increase your roaming bill.

This is another reason why I use a roaming SIM when traveling. They have written a special algorithm to send calls to voicemail that is not dependent on a conditional call forward.

It is not Cingular it is the roaming carrier. They don't release the phone from the system when it is switched off. As a matter of fact, at this year's Gitex (the Middle East's largest tech show), they were actively demonstrating technology aimed at enhancing roaming revenue by increasing the time your phone remains registered on the roaming network and using a software trick that would slow your phone down on registering on a competing carrier.

Under this approach, if you landed at Frankfurt, powered your phone back up for one call to tell your wife that you made your connection, and then shut it down and boarded at plane to the US, you'd be paying these roaming rates until you powered your phone back up in the US.

As annoying as it is, you need to either disable your voicemail or hardforward (e.g. not conditional) all calls to voicemail. If you let the system send it to voicemail if you don't answer, you will hugely increase your roaming bill.

This is another reason why I use a roaming SIM when traveling. They have written a special algorithm to send calls to voicemail that is not dependent on a conditional call forward.


I see. That makes sense. If the VLR keeps reporting you as active even though you aren't, you will indeed stay registered until you show up elsewhere and calls will come through. An unconditional divert seems as the best way to go considering you can set those while roaming at no charge. One just has to remember to do it!

Something different but with the same goal (roaming revenue) happened to me quite some time ago. I've always wondered how it was possible.

Back in ancient history, I was in Prague using an Omnipoint SIM in a Motorola L7089 (should give you an idea of how long ago this was!) For some reason, if the phone registered on Radiomobil, I no longer could see Eurotel in network scans! The reverse was not true. The same thing happened with a Nokia 6150 I was carrying as well. The only way to get Eurotel back was to carry the phone into the metro, set manual network select, and manually select Eurotel upon exiting.

To this day, I have no idea how they did it nor have I ever seen anything like it anywhere else. I suppose it could've been a bug but I always believed it was a way to keep roamers locked in.

What SIM do you use for roaming? I have a post-paid HKCSL SIM that I keep for visits to places where T-Mo charges $4.99/minute but would rather use something better. I've had it for forever so simply haven't gotten rid of it out of inertia.

I'm now back on the board and I'll try to explain the "double minute" situation that people were questioning. This happened initially on my first trip overseas with Cingular. I phoned Cingular after receiving a huge bill upon my return. The CS person agreed that it was not spelled out, even in the fine print, but was evidently happening is that when someone in the US calls me while I'm in Europe, Cingular has no control as to which European networks the call is routed on. If it is routed on a network with which Cingular does not have a preferential agreement, Cingular has to pay a higher fee and hence charges me the other carrier's fee plus its own roaming fee. I think that in some cases the fees from the other carrier didn't appear with the Cingular roaming one. The bills were a mess (and still are). As I was a new customer, the CS gave me a credit for 1/2 the charges and gave me 300 bonus minutes per month (which I still have).

As for turning off my voice mail, I believe I've always called Cingular.

I'm heading over in two weeks, and will be doing the same but in addition, I now have a SkypeOut account which I'll use on my ultraportable which has built in WiFi (and Bluetooth for my headset). The cost is 2.1 cents per minute, plus a 3.9 cent setup, for calling most industrialized countries -- from anywhere in the world with an internet connection. Note that when calling European cell phones, there is a still charge of something like 20 cents a minute no matter what phone you are using to call.

Just came across this article in Information Week (http://informationweek.com/mobility/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=199601588).

title: Telecom Leads In Race To The Bottom Of Customer Service

bottom line, all the telecom companies suck in customer service. take your pick.

However, there were some occasional bright spots -- in wireless service, for instance. AT&T's Cingular operation, after finally digesting the former AT&T Wireless operation and making other improvements, was up 8% to 68 in the survey. (for comparison, the nationwide average for all industries is 75.2%, so rather than saying they've improved, I'd say they just got less bad).

My experience with my tmobile phone has been the pits for coverage anywhere but the most urban of locales. On the other hand, my Cingular phone has almost as good coverage as my Verizon phone did.