JetBlue TrueBlue - preemptive meltdown in progress...

Stay tuned. The snow hasn't even started yet and the boards are all red and 1-800-JETBLUE's already hanging up on all callers.

Due to WX/WIND and VOLUME, there is a Traffic Management Program in effect for traffic arriving John F Kennedy International Airport, New York, NY (JFK). This is causing some arriving flights to be delayed an average of 1 hour and 3 minutes. To see if you may be affected, select your departure airport and check "Delays by Destination".

There is your reason. Nothing that jetBlue can do about a ground stop.

Due to WEATHER/LOW CIGS, departure traffic destined to Newark International Airport, Newark, NJ (EWR) is currently experiencing delays averaging 3 hours and 17 minutes.

Due to WEATHER/WIND, departure traffic destined to La Guardia Airport, New York, NY (LGA) is currently experiencing delays averaging 44 minutes.

Due to WEATHER/CEILINGS, departure traffic destined to Philadelphia International Airport, Philadelphia, PA (PHL) is currently experiencing delays averaging 57 minutes

Looks like EWR is in the same boat.

Bashers...I'll save your troubles this time around:

JetBlueFA, it is YOUR fault and jetBlue's fault! How dare they cancel my flight in bad weather! How dare they follow FAA guidelines! This is terrible! Every other airline controls the weather...why can't jetBlue get it right!?

Maybe now some of you will see how stupid the above italicized lines really sound. JetBlue is doing their best in a bad situation - and the PR today advised customers of the waived change fees associated with this storm.

Weather is weather and at least jetBlue has their act together after the 2/14 meltdown. Best of luck to all those traveling this weekend...

B6 86 CXLed today, was told when I finally got through that it's cancelled tomorrow too "but the website hasn't updated yet." Wierd that 498's still running (but everything BOS-JFK is cancelled anyhow).

Weather is weather, but tomorrow night's redeye is already cxl'ed? Poor recovery time at outstations is the real problem w/ smaller carriers (SEA-based, I see this all the time with AS). I hope B6 can grow their way out of this problem.

Edit: not bashing, though I am annoyed at having to redial for an hour, then hold for another hour to cancel my trip entirely rather than bump it by a day - and also that tomorrow's cancellation still hasn't made it onto the website. Quite happy that they were willing to refund the full ticket price to my credit card.

Redeye flights where cancelled this evening so they wouldn't be hogging the gates come the morning if the weather was worse than forcasted. The weather forcasts have changed several times in the last hour. Last month we didn't cancel just because the weather forcast changes several times and look what happened. Now with the redeyes cancelled this evening we have planes and crews on the west coast ready to go if the weather isn't as bad. Flight 86 is still scheduled to run on time this evening 03/16. We are booked at or near capacity for the next few weeks, and the travel advisory has been posted since 8am this morning warning people. That means several thousand people calling our reservation center and trying to rebook, reschedule, or cancel trips. With no real alternative plans of travel or agents are prolly taking longer with customers to figure out how to get them where they need to go. With NYC getting hit with another possible severe winter storm preemptive cancellations is the way to go before we run into the meltdown that happened a few weeks ago. I'm sorry that your flight was cancelled and you've been on hold for a while but this is hardly a preemptive meltdown. We are doing what we see fit to protect the operation and the customers should the weather be as bad as previously forcasted or worse.

So far 131 flights have been cancelled. 95% of those flights have load factors well above 85%. 90% of the cancelled flights are in and out of the JFK airport in preperation for the ice pellets that are now in the forcast along with the 4-8 inches of snow that is predicted.

Is there any way to see flight info besides the website (I've been trying to load the Status page for 40 minutes now) or calling (I do not dare unless I *have* to)?

Edited: Nevermind - called using the automated system. Forgot about those! Doesn't give a picture of the whole day on one's route like the web, but it works ;-)

could you give out the automated number. Web site says "server too busy" when I try to look online and 800-JETBLUE basically tells you to call back later... cannot reach anyone.

I have been a consistent Jetblue fan....UNTIL NOW

You would THINK after such gross incompetency of Valentine's Day that they would be able to handle call flows and would have beefed up website capabilities.

My father is on Flight 505. He made the choice to go so ultimately the responsibility is with him but he's stuck on the plane and I can't find any information regarding the status of the flight. And he's ok with being stuck on the plane because he's comfortable. I'm the one ticked off. :D So that right there is a good thing. I just hope he keeps comfortable.

1-800-JETBLUE apologizes for not taking calls, tells you to call back later, and then hangs up. In addition, the Jetblue online tracking service isn't working. This is pathetic. I love their leather seats and satellite TV but they are worthless to me when the airline refuses to communicate with the public. This is their choice. :td:

Ack! That's not good... I had actually called 1-800-JETBLUE and pressed 1.

Now they have cancelled 215 flights!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070316/ap_on_bi_ge/jetblue_cancellations

I have always enjoyed my jetBlue flights but I will avoid them during winter months for now on. I need to fly on an airline that is capable of handling operational glitches better than they do.

I got the website to show status on the route I'm trying to fly - if this helps anyone. This is as of 9:55am EDT

From New York City, NY (JFK) To Tampa, FL (TPA) Nonstop Flights (7) Connecting Flights (0)
Departure Arrival
Flight
number Status Airport Scheduled departure Actual [Estimated] departure Airport Scheduled arrival Actual [Estimated]
arrival
63 ARRIVED JFK 6:00AM
Mar 16 6:02AM
Mar 16 TPA 8:54AM
Mar 16 9:34AM
Mar 16
61 CANCELLED JFK 8:10AM
Mar 16 8:10AM
Mar 16 TPA 11:17AM
Mar 16 [11:17 AM]
Mar 16
65 CANCELLED JFK 10:45AM
Mar 16 10:45AM
Mar 16 TPA 1:38PM
Mar 16 [1:38 PM]
Mar 16
53 ON TIME JFK 1:10PM
Mar 16 [1:10 PM]
Mar 16 TPA 4:04PM
Mar 16 [4:04 PM]
Mar 16
861 CANCELLED JFK 2:10PM
Mar 16 2:10PM
Mar 16 TPA 5:06PM
Mar 16 [5:06 PM]
Mar 16
21 CANCELLED JFK 4:55PM
Mar 16 4:55PM
Mar 16 TPA 7:57PM
Mar 16 [7:57 PM]
Mar 16
29 ON TIME JFK 8:45PM
Mar 16 [8:45 PM]
Mar 16 TPA 12:06AM
Mar 17 [12:06 AM]
Mar 17

1-800-JETBLUE apologizes for not taking calls, tells you to call back later, and then hangs up. In addition, the Jetblue online tracking service isn't working. This is pathetic. I love their leather seats and satellite TV but they are worthless to me when the airline refuses to communicate with the public. This is their choice. :td:

The telephone problem really is disappointing. They've had over a month to get their act together, but I guess are too cheap to invest in a real phone system.

Anyway, if you try the international number sometimes you'll get through (but greeted with an hour hold time).

B6 is really a disappointing airline when it comes to irregular ops.

You would THINK after such gross incompetency of Valentine's Day that they would be able to handle call flows and would have beefed up website capabilities.

Beefing up an airline website involves a great deal of development and testing. There is a lot of complex programming behind a website that serves as the front end for something as complex as an airline reservations/flight operations database, and only an incompetent fool would try to rush something like that out in the couple of weeks that have elapsed since the infamous meltdown that happened recently.

I've never worked on an airline database, but I can imagine there are few if any that are more complicated.

I do work in Software Quality Assurance and I can tell you that the consequences of a failed software update can be catastrophic. The Canada Revenue Agency, our equivalent of the IRS, just this week brought its databases back up after 10 days out of action because of a software update gone bad, right in the middle of tax season. (Fortunately I don't work there.) Imagine the consequences for an airline system.

Don't know anything about call handling systems for their phones, but I suspect that can't be revamped in a couple of weeks either.

Not knocking you Analise, just saying that sort of work has to be approached carefully and cannot be rushed.

Beefing up an airline website involves a great deal of development and testing. There is a lot of complex programming behind a website that serves as the front end for something as complex as an airline reservations/flight operations database, and only an incompetent fool would try to rush something like that out in the couple of weeks that have elapsed since the infamous meltdown that happened recently.

I've never worked on an airline database, but I can imagine there are few if any that are more complicated.

I do work in Software Quality Assurance and I can tell you that the consequences of a failed software update can be catastrophic. The Canada Revenue Agency, our equivalent of the IRS, just this week brought its databases back up after 10 days out of action because of a software update gone bad, right in the middle of tax season. Imagine the consequences for an airline system.

Don't know anything about call handling systems for their phones, but I suspect that can't be revamped in a couple of weeks either.

Not knocking you Analise, just saying that sort of work has to be approached carefully and cannot be rushed.

That might all be true, but they could have hired a few more folks to answer the phones, no?

I do work in Software Quality Assurance and I can tell you that the consequences of a failed software update can be catastrophic. The Canada Revenue Agency, our equivalent of the IRS, just this week brought its databases back up after 10 days out of action because of a software update gone bad, right in the middle of tax season. Imagine the consequences for an airline system.

But this should not be a software upgrade. Pure hardware as in more and faster. I don't know if they are using Sun / MS / *nix / whatever. 30 days is tight but if they wanted to they could have. Hell I've seen bigger stuff go from paper to production in 14 days. However, there was no budget limit.

-Dave

I am trying to get BOS-MCO and was rebooked on the 345pm. I know that for some reason the 10am was cancelled (no snow or wind here yet). I have not been able to get on the website or through to automated updates for the last few hours.

I understand not wanting to strand me and my family at JFK (our original flight was via that lovely hub). I appreciate that gesture.

What would help a little would be to know where the aircraft that is supposed to service our route actually originates so that I might make alternate accomodations.

Not knocking you Analise, just saying that sort of work has to be approached carefully and cannot be rushed.I understand that. I'm just happy my father is all mellow about it. Oddly enough I'm the one who's furious. :D

I am trying to get BOS-MCO and was rebooked on the 345pm. I know that for some reason the 10am was cancelled (no snow or wind here yet). I have not been able to get on the website or through to automated updates for the last few hours.

I understand not wanting to strand me and my family at JFK (our original flight was via that lovely hub). I appreciate that gesture.

What would help a little would be to know where the aircraft that is supposed to service our route actually originates so that I might make alternate accomodations.

Currently Operating BOS-MCO flights:

0435 departs 1300 arrives 1612 On Time

The aircraft is coming in from MCO and is currently enroute and is scheduled to land at 1155

The others are cancelled. Should BOS not get as bad as JFK we may send an extra session.

Ironically the only flight operating this afternoon out of JFK are AUA, CUN, and NAS. Nothing in or out of JFK for the rest of the day it appears. BOS is running on a scaled back operation but many cancellations up there too.

Ironically the only flight operating this afternoon out of JFK are AUA, CUN, and NAS. Nothing in or out of JFK for the rest of the day it appears. BOS is running on a scaled back operation but many cancellations up there too.

Argh. Now I can't get phone or online flight status.

Are you saying the 1:10 JFK-TPA flight has now been cancelled? :(

BTW - I *love* that the phone says they can't take your call and to use the website. Goodbye. And then the website doesn't work.

This is going to be a mess too because of school vacation week. I would imagine that this weekend the loads are quite heavy to begin with, no?

Yes, according to our flight tracking software FLT 0053 JFK-TPA 1310 departure 1604 arrival has been cancelled. The computer may be wrong, it hasn't been known to, but I would still keep trying the 800 number for rebooking.

This is going to be a mess too because of school vacation week. I would imagine that this weekend the loads are quite heavy to begin with, no?

Well above 80% on the load factor.

That sucks. When I last checked online about 30 minutes ago all the JFK-TPA flights were cancelled except the 1:10 and the last flight of the day. I was just about to leave for the airport when I saw your post.

Calling JetBlue just has the same (now very annoying) woman telling me to check online (I can't) and that "this call ends now".

I don't know what to do with my hotel, etc since I can't reach anyone.

:td: :td: :td: :td:

It's posted online now that it is cancelled.

mobile.jetblue.com is up and working if you have a phone or internet

It's posted online now that it is cancelled.

Indeed. I see that and the last flight out which were both OK an hour ago are now cancelled.

Are any flights on any airlines going out?? Are those of us that were going for the weekend just screwed? I have no idea what to do when I do get someone on the phone as I'm scheduled to come back on Sunday - and not even on JetBlue.

Indeed. I see that and the last flight out which were both OK an hour ago are now cancelled.

Are any flights on any airlines going out?? Are those of us that were going for the weekend just screwed? I have no idea what to do when I do get someone on the phone as I'm scheduled to come back on Sunday - and not even on JetBlue.

Sorry Daveland

I believe due to Wx throughout the Northest Corridor AA, DL and CAL have all cancelled or precancelled a significant portion of their flights. Sorry but when it comes to freezing anything most carriers are prohibited due to our operating procedures.

CO has 1 or 2 scattered flights leaving for Florida this afternoon, not really sure whether or not those will operate as scheduled. As dietcoke said, the snow isn't that big of a deal, delays will happen while aircraft get deiced, but when it comes to freezing rain or anything that relates to major icing conditions, most, if not all, airlines will cancel.

It's pretty amazing that both the website AND the customer service phone number are down during the time they are most needed. What a joke of a company.

It is very unfortunate. However the 2/14 storm showed us that our phone system is very outdated as well as the website. 3 weeks is no where near the amount of time needed to do a major overhaul of the reservation and website functions. Had we rushed into it the whole thing could have crumbled and then we would have really been in a world of hurt. The type of winter that NYC is having (ice and snow) hasn't been seen on this magnitude in quite some time. Unfortunatly we where un prepared because we where lulled into a false sense of security because the winters have been extremely mild the past several years.

It is very unfortunate. However the 2/14 storm showed us that our phone system is very outdated as well as the website. 3 weeks is no where near the amount of time needed to do a major overhaul of the reservation and website functions. Had we rushed into it the whole thing could have crumbled and then we would have really been in a world of hurt. The type of winter that NYC is having (ice and snow) hasn't been seen on this magnitude in quite some time. Unfortunatly we where un prepared because we where lulled into a false sense of security because the winters have been extremely mild the past several years.

actually, to the contrary, i think we all know the winter has been very mild. this is only the second major storm. and, frankly, the last storm wasn't even that *huge*, it was 2-3 inches, if i recall correctly. please just stop making excuses that are ludicrous. it's worse than saying nothing at all. this st. patty's day meltdown comes at an awful, awful time because customers who were screwed during last month's valentine day's massacre may just not end up using the voucher when they see the company still has not recovered.

OK, so I now just learned the hard way that JetBlue will not even try to put one on another airline even if there are seats. So all I get is a refund or a flight down tomorrow night just in time to go to sleep, wake up, and fly home. If I find another airline still flying, I can feel free to pay full walk-up fare. Great. Additionally, JetBlue HAS seats tomorrow morning but won't put me on them as the flights are "capped".

What excuses would I be making that are so ludicrous? All I said is that NYC hasn't been hit with 3 consecutive winter storms in quite some time. That's not an excuse, just a statement of fact.

I guess precancelling flights because of the storm, which is big as predicted, is a meltdown. Sorry we cancelled our flights but we weren't going to load them and send them out to sit, not again. This is the right thing to do.

OK, so I now just learned the hard way that JetBlue will not even try to put one on another airline even if there are seats. So all I get is a refund or a flight down tomorrow night just in time to go to sleep, wake up, and fly home. If I find another airline still flying, I can feel free to pay full walk-up fare. Great. Additionally, JetBlue HAS seats tomorrow morning but won't put me on them as the flights are "capped".

Ok I can understand the not putting you on another airline because we don't interline, very unfortunate we don't and I hope that changes, but what I don't agree with is not putting you on if there are seats. I'm not in planning so I don't have a full picture of what they are doing but that doesn't seem right.

I understand being proactive. But WHY are they cancelling 7pm flights at 11am?? The ice isn't expected to last all day. Anything can happen with weather. Couldn't they cancel on a rolling basis rather then whacking them all at once? And why can't we be rebooked on flights that are not full? What is with this "capping"? Better safe than sorry may seem like the right thing to do after February, but I'm MORE frustrated that the next option I'm being given is to go out late Saturday night for my weekend getaway.

Hello all, I've never flown on a plane before so natuurally the first time I am going to my flight was cancelled on me.

First off I want to say thanks to JetBlueFA for hitting me up with that link for mobile.jetblue.com. It confirmed that my Flight 1016 From JFK to BOS at 6:45 was cancelled tonight when the phones and website were down.

Second, what do I do now? I was supposed to meet some friends in Boston for St. Patty's but because of the weather I'm staying at home in NY. Do I have to cancel my return flight on Sunday or does is happen automtically? And do I get refunded for a cancelled flight because of weather? Thank you in adavance for the responses.

CD

It is very unfortunate. However the 2/14 storm showed us that our phone system is very outdated as well as the website. 3 weeks is no where near the amount of time needed to do a major overhaul of the reservation and website functions. Had we rushed into it the whole thing could have crumbled and then we would have really been in a world of hurt. The type of winter that NYC is having (ice and snow) hasn't been seen on this magnitude in quite some time. Unfortunatly we where un prepared because we where lulled into a false sense of security because the winters have been extremely mild the past several years.The type of winter we're having? What magnitude? The no-major-snowstorm magnitude? We have yet to get significant snowfall. This has been incredibly tame. Where is New York's blizzard of 2007?

Calling your airline only to hear "we're hanging up on you now so please go on to our website" is obnoxious and infuriating. I do give you credit for logging on. Nobody is blaming you or any other FA.

My father just called me from a taxi. Flight 505 was let off the plane about 20 minutes ago and the pax were given instructions to stay nearby in case there is an opening to leave.

I'm glad my father's luggage was carry-on. ^

The type of winter we're having? What magnitude? The no-major-snowstorm magnitude? We have yet to get significant snowfall. This has been incredibly tame. Where is New York's blizzard of 2007?


Haha, no I don't mean this is the Day After Tomorrow scenario. Would make it a little easier to cancel flight though if it was ^ I mean that NYC has had 3 pretty significant winter events that brought ice with them. If it was snow it would make life a little easier as we could operate. Ice is a whole different animal. 2/14 was hit with some significant ice, the following week and a little ice, nothing to really shake a stick at, but we went overboard, but this week seems to be rearing it's ugly head. Unfortunatly it is during a hefty travel period. I know how angry our customers are going to be because we cancelled flights, I would be too, but we really don't want, or can't have another meltdown like 2/14, it would spell the end of the company in my eyes. I fell we did the right thing here by cancelling, my own personal opinion. This will allow us to quickly recover the operation and get back on track once the system moves out.

I know the website is not functioning and the phones are tied up and it is very unfortunate. That's why I'm trying to provide some type of flight information for those who are waiting for loved ones or trying to leave themselves.

Haha, no I don't mean this is the Day After Tomorrow scenario. Would make it a little easier to cancel flight though if it was ^ I mean that NYC has had 3 pretty significant winter events that brought ice with them. If it was snow it would make life a little easier as we could operate. Ice is a whole different animal. 2/14 was hit with some significant ice, the following week and a little ice, nothing to really shake a stick at, but we went overboard, but this week seems to be rearing it's ugly head.Do you really think that what you've described above is a significant winter for New York? It's not.

I know how angry our customers are going to be because we cancelled flights, I would be too, but we really don't want, or can't have another meltdown like 2/14, it would spell the end of the company in my eyes. I fell we did the right thing here by cancelling, my own personal opinion.If you think the anger is solely about the cancelling flights, then that too is as wrong as the fantasy that NYC is suffering from a terrible winter. I am angry that there is NO COMMUNICATION. What a farce that the CEO went on Letterman; what a farce about "Bill of Rights". And the recording on JETBLUE's 800# is infuriating. They tell us to go online for help and then say they're hanging up on us now? This my anger. And I'm not alone.

I'm with Analise on this one. The problem isn't the canceling of flights. The problem is that the down communication channels is completely unacceptable.

Yes, and it also feels too much like CYA - trying to avoid winding up paying out on the new bill of rights. I mean, cancelling the whole day so early just seems wrong. This whole experience is very very frustrating. And the lack of interline and basically being told that I'm on my own is not making me feel warm and fuzzy about a future JetBlue flight....

Ok I got ya guys now, sorry I'm posting this while I am still half asleep. I apologize for the misunderstanding on my end. Your right though, there is no excuse for an airline of our size to have such an antiquated website and phone service. There is no excuse that can make up for that.

Yes, and it also feels too much like CYA - trying to avoid winding up paying out on the new bill of rights. I mean, cancelling the whole day so early just seems wrong. This whole experience is very very frustrating. And the lack of interline and basically being told that I'm on my own is not making me feel warm and fuzzy about a future JetBlue flight....

Keep the Neeleman promise in mind; basically no one stuck on planes for hours on end again. If that means cancelling flights till Tuesday, that's whats gonna happen.

Ok I got ya guys now, sorry I'm posting this while I am still half asleep. I apologize for the misunderstanding on my end. Your right though, there is no excuse for an airline of our size to have such an antiquated website and phone service. There is no excuse that can make up for that.

Considering the huge growth plans in place, there really is no excuse for a communications infrastructure that is too small. The phone lines and website servers should already be more than enough to handle today's huge passenger volume. After all, with 20% to 30% year over year growth the last few years, it's not like the company expects fewer passengers next year. All the company has to do is keep the communications systems a step or two ahead of the next year's passenger volume (or the expected volume in two or three years). And unfortunately, B6 has failed to do that.

On the other hand, if B6 were an old-style shrinking legacy airline, I could almost understand if their phones and websites were unable to handle a situation like this one.

We're growing so fast we can't keep up

Sorta like what happend to that EWR-based LCC 20 years ago.

As I've posted before, growth for growth's sake without the ability to competently handle the increased volume is a huge problem for jetBlue.

Yes, and it also feels too much like CYA - trying to avoid winding up paying out on the new bill of rights. I mean, cancelling the whole day so early just seems wrong. This whole experience is very very frustrating. And the lack of interline and basically being told that I'm on my own is not making me feel warm and fuzzy about a future JetBlue flight....


It sounds like the law of unintended consequences -- if we're going to force airlines to make all these promises about not trapping people on airplanes, then the airline will just go ahead and cancel everything when there's the slightest hint of a weather problem.

In fairness to jetBlue, I notice on the ATL departure board that Airtran, Delta, American Eagle, et. al. have cancelled a slew of flights into and out of the Northeast. Also, I think freezing rain is a bigger problem than a regular snow storm. I'm sure it wreaks havoc on the deicing operation and trying to get the ice off of the wings.

Beefing up an airline website involves a great deal of development and testing. There is a lot of complex programming behind a website... I can tell you that the consequences of a failed software update can be catastrophic. We're not talking about any functionality or database modifications, we're talking about handling demand spikes. It's no big trick to lash more servers into the system. The airline KNEW the site couldn't handle the traffic last month. It's had more than enough time to fix it. Apparently they're still holding planning meetings to prepare for today.

Don't know anything about call handling systems for their phones, but I suspect that can't be revamped in a couple of weeks either. The world is full of call centers for hire. You can bring them online in less than 24 hours. They exist to help companies cope with precisely these kinds of situations. Most callers just want information. You soup up server capacity, plunk 500 phone jockeys in front of it, and have 'em read flight status and booking options to customers. Not rocket science.

I'm sorry, I've lost all sympathy for this airline and for Neeleman. But if every snow event generates a virtual 72-hour grounding and a total communications blackout, they won't last much longer anyway.

Sorta like what happend to that EWR-based LCC 20 years ago... The parallels are brutally apparent. All we need now is for B6 to merge with Frontier and the picture is complete. :td:

The weather is expected to continue over night and not stop with the snow and ice until early morning Saturday. This is a Nor'Easter and the forecast for it has changed significantly since Wednesday. It seems pretty unpredictable. B6 canceled fewer flights than other operations at JFK and EWR, believe it or not. B6 canceled 235 in their system, I think DL canceled over 250. The Weather Channel is currently showing 80-100% chance of precipitation through 3 AM and 40-50% chance of it continuing through noon tomorrow.

That might all be true, but they could have hired a few more folks to answer the phones, no?

I don't know anything about JetBlue's system but I used to know about AA/AE. It took longer than the month that has passed since the February incident to train a new agent so any new agents brought on as a result of that situation are probably still in training. I'm also skeptical that the telephone infrastructure could be upgraded this quickly as you have to first determine what you need, order the hardware then get it installed, tested and online. Same for the web servers.

Even with all of the upgrades, JetBlue's single large JFK hub is a problem since a storm effecting JFK is going to effect nearly every single scheduled flight. That means that in such a situation the call volume and web site loads will increase several hundred percent from normal. A more geographically diverse airline would have a big increase but no where near this big.

OK, so I now just learned the hard way that JetBlue will not even try to put one on another airline even if there are seats. So all I get is a refund or a flight down tomorrow night

That's where change is needed instead of the stupid bill of rights idea that people keep talking about. We need rule that says that a displaced passenger must be given a confirmed seat on any available carrier if the original airline can not give them a confirmed seat on their own flights within XX hours. This way, if one airline is hit harder than the others the passengers will have a way to get onto the other operating airlines without a huge cost.

Of course, there will be situations where nobody has any seats but there's not much you can do about that.

I guess precancelling flights because of the storm, which is big as predicted, is a meltdown. Sorry we cancelled our flights but we weren't going to load them and send them out to sit, not again. This is the right thing to do.

I was booked BNA-MDW-BOI on SWA back in January. As an airline pilot myself I watched the weather as a winter storm approached Chicago. The forecast was calling for freezing rain at MDW during the time that I was supposed to go through so I had my airline's travel department re-route me BNA-SLC-BOI on Delta.

My best judgment, as a pilot of nearly 26 years, was that the SWA flights would not be able to operate through MDW.

When I arrived in BOI I checked on www.flightaware.com and found that my originally scheduled SWA flights all operated on-time. The freezing-line stayed North of Chicago.

The airline business sure would be a lot easier if we could reliably predict the future.

Keep the Neeleman promise in mind; basically no one stuck on planes for hours on end again. If that means cancelling flights till Tuesday, that's whats gonna happen.

Falls into the "Be careful what you wish for because you just might get it" department...

Weather is weather and at least jetBlue has their act together after the 2/14 meltdown. Best of luck to all those traveling this weekend...

B6 could hire the folks from ELAT (http://www.elat.com.mx/) or Russian aviation specialists (http://english.pravda.ru/science/tech/23-06-2005/8463-weather-0) to prevent the snow storm from happening in the first place... ;)

That's where change is needed instead of the stupid bill of rights idea that people keep talking about. We need rule that says that a displaced passenger must be given a confirmed seat on any available carrier if the original airline can not give them a confirmed seat on their own flights within XX hours. This way, if one airline is hit harder than the others the passengers will have a way to get onto the other operating airlines without a huge cost.

Of course, there will be situations where nobody has any seats but there's not much you can do about that.


Well, I'd still be a JetBlue fan if they did this. I have found myself a flight tonight on CO, however the cost is 3X what I paid on JetBlue for the last minute departure and I'm n a war with myself as to whether or not all that extra money is worth it for a 2 day trip.

So what gets me is that I paid for a flight well in advance. The carrier can not operate but another one can. Yet JetBlue has no interest in helping me on to it. Just offering me a "here's your money back - have fun". They are being polite, but that won't get me to Florida!

Every winter I just love to pull these up. There's a reason I don't go east of the Mississippi any more..... :D

From jetBlue's web site:

Current weather
New York City, NY
Feels like 17 F :td: :td:
Wind:
26 mph
Humidity:
96 percent

Current weather
Phoenix, AZ
Feels like 83 F^ ^
Wind:
3 mph
Humidity:
10 percent

I've been playing around with the flight tracker on the website for the past 30 minutes and it seems to be working again.

Every winter I just love to pull these up. There's a reason I don't go east of the Mississippi any more..... :D

From jetBlue's web site:

Current weather
New York City, NY
Feels like 17 F :td: :td:
Wind:
26 mph
Humidity:
96 percent

Current weather
Phoenix, AZ
Feels like 83 F^ ^
Wind:
3 mph
Humidity:
10 percent


And I'm scheduled to do the BOS-LAS run tomorrow, to bad I didn't do it yesterday otherwise I would have had a nice layover! :D

I agree with those that have said jetBlue does not have a very robust telecom/IT infrastructure. You have to plan to grow those "cost centers" equal to volume and revenue, hence they've having all these communications(phone & web) today. Someone really dropped the ball on that one.

I however disagree with those that expect them to have just gone out and bought a pile of more servers, turned up more bandwidth and got everything running in less than 1 month. Systems take time to install, data lines takes time to install. So even if they wanted to order up another pipe, getting it done in less than 30 days is almost outright impossible.

A word about the # of flights being cancelled, as of 1:32PM according to CNN it looks to be:
jetBlue 215
USAir 414 (LGA + PHL)
American 120
Delta 250ish (USA Today)

Can't find figures on Continental
I left off UA because they don't have much left at JFK :-(

Everybody is cancelling. Best of luck to the east coast travelers today.

I however disagree with those that expect them to have just gone out and bought a pile of more servers, turned up more bandwidth and got everything running in less than 1 month. Systems take time to install, data lines takes time to install. So even if they wanted to order up another pipe, getting it done in less than 30 days is almost outright impossible

It depends on how they were setup to start. If you are running good database software and have a robust load balancing setup then yes you can have the software and hardware running in less then 30 days. Actually if you have it setup for expansion, I can get the hardware in on Monday and have you running by the weekend. Hell, with MySQL I can have it running by Monday evening at least for the database power side of the problem. The web server side would depend on what you are running. Lets see:

Initiating server query ...
Looking up IP address for domain: www.jetblue.com
The IP address for the domain is: 64.25.16.21
Connecting to the server on standard HTTP port: 80
[Connected] Requesting the server's default page.
The server returned the following response headers:
HTTP/1.1 200 OK
Connection: close
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2007 22:25:26 GMT
Server: Microsoft-IIS/6.0
Cache-Control: post-check=1800,pre-check=43200
X-Powered-By: ASP.NET
Content-Length: 28935
Content-Type: text/html
Set-Cookie: ASPSESSIONIDCCQACTAQ=AOCGCLHBBANHEGCGAHHOPPBC; path=/
Cache-control: private
Query complete.

IIS, on windows 2003 can scale very quickly and easily. So no excuse there.

As for the bandwidth. if they are in one of the major data centers in NY then you can have the bandwidth in a day or so. If they have it inhouse then it could take them 20 to 45 days if they do not have more fiber available. I have 20mbs now with 1 fiber pair in my rack. It can go to 45mbs in 24 hrs. I have 11 more dark pairs I can have online in less then 14 days if I need it.

All the above being said, in a corporate environment like B6, unless somebody steps up and says just do it. It's going to take time, proposals being sent out, bids gotten, budgets setup, time tables projected, etc. As a small business working with other small businesses I am in a different world. I can just do it.

-Dave

It depends on how they were setup to start. If you are running good database software and have a robust load balancing setup then yes you can have the software and hardware running in less then 30 days...

Yup, totally agree. Since most of us agree that it doesn't appear that they've setup their infrastructure with simple fast expandbility in place, they can't pull it off.


As for the bandwidth. if they are in one of the major data centers in NY then you can have the bandwidth in a day or so. If they have it inhouse then it could take them 20 to 45 days if they do not have more fiber available. I have 20mbs now with 1 fiber pair in my rack. It can go to 45mbs in 24 hrs. I have 11 more dark pairs I can have online in less then 14 days if I need it.


Agree with you here too. If they don't have rapid growth planned for servers, I doubt they've left it easy to grow bandwidth either...

A word about the # of flights being cancelled, as of 1:32PM according to CNN it looks to be:
jetBlue 215
USAir 414 (LGA + PHL)
American 120
Delta 250ish (USA Today)

Can't find figures on Continental
I left off UA because they don't have much left at JFK :-(

Everybody is cancelling. Best of luck to the east coast travelers today.


FYI - the JetBlue rep I spoke to most recently said his screen showed over 300 cancelled today. Don't know if that's accurate or not.

He suspects more AM cancellations as well based on the forecast. And admits they are probably over-cancelling this time around. Pendulum needs to swing both ways I guess.

Also, every CO flight I was watching EWR-TPA eventually cancelled as well.

If you are running good database software and have a robust load balancing setup then yes you can have the software and hardware running in less then 30 days. Actually if you have it setup for expansion, I can get the hardware in on Monday and have you running by the weekend. Hell, with MySQL I can have it running by Monday evening at least for the database power side of the problem.... As for the bandwidth. if they are in one of the major data centers in NY then you can have the bandwidth in a day or so... Thank you, Mr. Dave, that's what I was alluding to, but you speak with more expertise.

It just goes to show the failures of leadership at JetBlue. After Valentine's Day, shouldn't expanding the comm infrastructure be a top priority?

It just goes to show the failures of leadership at JetBlue. After Valentine's Day, shouldn't expanding the comm infrastructure be a top priority?

Yes, but also as I said in MOST large business things take a bit more time. I can relate 2 stories about similar issues.

1) A friend of mine worked in IT for a casino company. Over 2 to 3 months certain database processes started to slow down due to growth. It took a while to get there but once it hit you could see that it was not going to be pretty in another few weeks. The IT director *STOPPED* all other things in the department till that issue was fixed. No website work, no reservation system updates nothing till it was done. 12 days and a lot of coffee later a 6 week project was done in less then 1/3 the time.

2) A security consultant I deal with from time to time made some recommendations for a fortune 100 company. Simple, basic stuff. would take about 200 to 300 man hours to complete. Or, as he recommended a 5 person staff for a week and 2 people for the following week. It took them 9 months to get the paperwork signed off for the people to adjust their schedules to work on this security issue.

I have no idea how the internal politics and departments of B6 integrate with each other.

-Dave

Has jetBlue migrated from Open Skies to New Skies? I'm guessing that is a major problem with all of this. Neeleman should know better than anyone what Open Skies' limitations are; he was CEO of Open Skies before selling it to Hewlett Packard. From what I can find they were planning to migrate this quarter, but I doubt they have. I wonder how much that is to blame for the res system difficulties.

I agree with those that have said jetBlue does not have a very robust telecom/IT infrastructure. You have to plan to grow those "cost centers" equal to volume and revenue, hence they've having all these communications(phone & web) today. Someone really dropped the ball on that one.

Given Neeleman's frequent expressed desire to be the cool, hip airline that specializes in attracting 20-something business travelers (I'll post some links later in case anyone takes issue), these communication systems should have been expanded much faster than the fleet growth. Had they been, B6 would have a much larger system in place. It might still hang up on really busy days - but if it's large enough, perhaps most could just be placed in a que instead.

I however disagree with those that expect them to have just gone out and bought a pile of more servers, turned up more bandwidth and got everything running in less than 1 month. Systems take time to install, data lines takes time to install. So even if they wanted to order up another pipe, getting it done in less than 30 days is almost outright impossible.

I agree completely. The horrendous failure with which I charge David Neeleman (failing to install an IT/telecom system worthy of such a fast growing enterprise) took place over the last seven years, not the past four weeks. I'm willng to cut B6 some slack on this one - Mother Nature is kicking B6 when it's down.

But if B6 repeats today's performance or the Valentine's Day meltdown again this summer when violent thunderstorms ground everything at JFK over the Fourth of July holiday - well, then THAT will be evidence that someone at B6 just doesn't get the message.