JetBlue TrueBlue - jetBlue's Falling Reputation: Bans Passenger from PBI Terminal

Story here: http://www.wptv.com/News/022807_WomanSayJetBlue.cfm

When Martha Raimondi and her daughters Sarah 4,and Liora, 14 months arrived on a JetBlue flight from New York and they were told their luggage had been lost.

"I said to the lost luggage person, 'what do you want me to do with a baby with diapers?'

There has to be something that can be done." But instead of calling a supervisor, she called Sheriffs deputies" says the young mother.

On instructions from Jet Blue headquarters she came early to her return flight to New York Tuesday night to collect a "passengers bill of rights" reimbursement check.

But things went south quickly.

"It was a set up", she said by cell phone as she drove up I-95 in a rental car choosing to drive back to Long Island after the incident.

"As soon as they saw me enter through the glass window in the returned luggage office they called the sheriffs deputies again"

Martha says the Jet Blue manager on duty said," your complaint caused an investigation of our office"

So...it looks like B6 HQ came down on the PBI B6 station and they responded by calling the police on the customer. Really professional :rolleyes:

I hope this story goes national and further humiliates this airline - which seems to be spinning out of control

In the meantime, I plan on contacting PBI and demanding an answer as to why a tenant airline was able to banish a passenger from a public air terminal without permission from the airport manager. I will also find out if the PBSO had authority to remove the passenger from the terminal without the airport manager's consent and knowledge.

The customer could be removed rom B6 leased property - but not from the entire airport.

Wow. I mean, wow.

What can JB do to make it any worse?

Please post what PBI airport officials have to say. That should be interesting.

I wish airports would start getting cops with some common sense that don't act like the airline's or TSA's puppets. Observe the situation, listen to both sides, and tell the airline / TSA people to grow up.

and tell the airline / TSA people to grow up.
Or taser them. "Think about this next time you want to waste our time ..... BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZT"

While it's certainly possible this happened the way she says, I would like to hear the airline's perspective on what happened before making any judgment. One-sided stories (especially from the media) always make me suspicious.

While it's certainly possible this happened the way she says, I would like to hear the airline's perspective on what happened before making any judgment. One-sided stories (especially from the media) always make me suspicious.

My thoughts exactly.

I seen sooooo many parents of small children that seem to think the entire world should cater to them. I'll reserve judgement until I hear B6's side.

I seen sooooo many parents of small children that seem to think the entire world should cater to them. I'll reserve judgement until I hear B6's side.
Exactly. B6 gave them standard compensation for lost luggage. I have to ask, why didn't they pack any baby supplies in their carry on, just in case this happened?

Since this thread is solely related to JetBlue and is not technically a security or safety issue, I'm going to transfer it to the JetBlue Forum.
Please follow it at it's new home.
Thanks.

__________________
Cholula
Travel Safety/Security Forum Moderator

I think B6 corporate supported the passenger's claim - I'm sure the specifics of her complaint regarding the baby supplies was noted but not germane as she received the standard compensation.

The issue seems to be between the PBI B6 station and the customer and escalated after corporate called down to the station and dinged them for something that happened with this customer. The station didn't like it and decided to take some style of revenge on this customer. I can't imagine how they thought taking such an action could improve their position since it's now a news item and has further sullied their employer's reputation in this area. I'm sure they will get dinged alot worse from corporate once management finds out how they got in the news again.

Either way, the master issue is how and why B6 was able to get the passenger removed from the entire terminal - and in effect banned from entering the terminal again. They could have her removed from their leased space (baggage office, ticket counter, gate area, etc.), but they had no right to remove her and bar her from the entire terminal.

PBSO are still thugs in the same color as their other police counterparts in South Florida, so the passenger should consider herself lucky she wasn't thrown to the ground and beaten just for talking back to them.

So...this morning I called the airport manager's office and spoke with their media relations director. She said the first she heard of this entire episode was this morning on the news - they have no knowledge of what happened. I tried to get a commitment that the airport manager would investigate further - I think I got it, but the media person said the best people to talk to were at B6. She will contact the people she knows there to get a better understanding of what happened. I will give them a few days to figure things out, then check back early next week.

My concern with this incident is less about what happened between the customer and the B6 station staff, but under whose authority did B6 think it had to bar the customer from the terminal (if in fact that was the real result) and whether or not PBSO exceeded its authority in removing the woman from the terminal as opposed to asking her to leave B6' leased space.

My next call is to WPTV, the station that reported the incident. I will post their response shortly.

Obviously we don't have the whole story, we don't know exactly what the passenger did to provoke having security called. Either way, if jetBlue is in fault in any way I am sure they will perform a full investigation, fix the problem and emerge from it stronger. They are a young airline and mistakes happen and they are learning, so without a doubt this will make them ever better, which is already the best airline in the world.

And another thing, this is only a story because the ridiculous media made it into one.

:rolleyes:

..... the media person said the best people to talk to were at B6. She will contact the people she knows there to get a better understanding of what happened. I will give them a few days to figure things out, then check back early next week.

...................
My next call is to WPTV, the station that reported the incident. I will post their response shortly.

We'll follow your reports.

We'll follow your reports.

Left a message for the reporter who did the story at WPTV. We'll see what I can dig up

The disturbing thing about this, and it's not just a JetBlue issue, is how some airline employees can't handle customer-service issues nowadays without calling in an LEO. These things happen, and it's Customer Relations 101 on how to deal with it. Or did they quit teaching that course?

There is standard policy that Jetblue follows when dealing with a customer. Any time the crew member feels that the situation is elevated they call a supervisor. Jetblue supervisors are trained by a third party company in crisis management and take recurrent training annually.

People forget that employees are entitled to rights as much as a customer and at no time should ANY employee be victim to screaming, cursing, or threats of any manner from anyone.

The airport police are there for safety of the terminal occupants.

There are some magic key points that are missing from this new story and I wouldnt expect anything less from the media these days.

What a black eye for JB.

I'm sure the cheerleaders will spin it in a positive way though.

There is standard policy that Jetblue follows when dealing with a customer. Any time the crew member feels that the situation is elevated they call a supervisor. Jetblue supervisors are trained by a third party company in crisis management and take recurrent training annually.

People forget that employees are entitled to rights as much as a customer and at no time should ANY employee be victim to screaming, cursing, or threats of any manner from anyone.

The airport police are there for safety of the terminal occupants.

There are some magic key points that are missing from this new story and I wouldnt expect anything less from the media these days.

1) This wasn't a crew member - it was a baggage office agent
2) there is no evidence anyone was screaming, yelling or intimidating anyone - you are only speculating otherwise
3) The customer had their issue resolved by B6 HQ and only went back to the airport to pick up their voucher - and was met on arrival by the PBSO, which they considered a 'setup'. If PBSO was waiting there for them in advance, without the customer demonstrating cause for removal after their arrival, then it's an indication of a serious issue, especially if this can be traced to the station being upset over a call it received from HQ regarding their treatment of this customer

As far as "magic key points", I will be talking to the reporter, and if necessary their editor, to determine if anything is missing. I will also be speaking to the airport directors office early next week to discover the results of their own investigation.

Obviously we don't have the whole story, we don't know exactly what the passenger did to provoke having security called. Either way, if jetBlue is in fault in any way I am sure they will perform a full investigation, fix the problem and emerge from it stronger. They are a young airline and mistakes happen and they are learning, so without a doubt this will make them ever better, which is already the best airline in the world.

And another thing, this is only a story because the ridiculous media made it into one.

:rolleyes:

Beautiful ^ ^ ^

Obviously we don't have the whole story, we don't know exactly what the passenger did to provoke having security called. Either way, if jetBlue is in fault in any way I am sure they will perform a full investigation, fix the problem and emerge from it stronger. They are a young airline and mistakes happen and they are learning, so without a doubt this will make them ever better, which is already the best airline in the world.

And another thing, this is only a story because the ridiculous media made it into one.



It is always the media, you know that group of ridiculous people who avoided listening to J6 customers (for the last five years) and only published J6 PR documents.

One-sided stories (especially from the media) always make me suspicious.

Sometimes it seems that many folks prefer to hear only one side of any given story as hearing from all sides is much too confusing. :confused:

1) This wasn't a crew member - it was a baggage office agent


B6 calls all their employees crew members.

And another thing, this is only a story because the ridiculous media made it into one.



Ah, yes, it was the "ridiculous media" that left all those passengers on the tarmac for hours, and at the airports for days. And then sparked the confrontation with the baggage agent.

Not.

Ah, yes, it was the "ridiculous media" that left all those passengers on the tarmac for hours, and at the airports for days. And then sparked the confrontation with the baggage agent.

Not.

Oh come on already.

We aren't even talking about what happened two weeks ago. Some people come on here just to stir the pot, and then are surprised when we react to these comments. The consistent people on this board don't go making inflammatory comments on other boards day after day, so why should this be any different.

Anyway, there are two sides to every story. The story that comes out first does not mean it is the story with the complete facts (See: Duke Lacrosse).

We aren't even talking about what happened two weeks ago.



That's when the "ridiculous media" thread got started.

I had a bad experience at PBI US Airways baggage in Oct. 2005. I was told at DCA that my bags would not make my flight. When I went to file a bag report, this agent who is always nasty, said I have to wait until all bags were off my plane. I told her what I was advised in DCA, and she said you are going to wait. I said I was supposed to be in 9 hours ago and if I have to wait, I am filing a complaint against her. Defensively against my threatened complaint, she calls the PBSO in. I am an attorney so I am real cool and nothing happens.

PBSO at times can be real bad at PBI. I deal with the individual officers often, like at the courthouse, and have respect for many, but some at PBI need more training in many ways.

...
PBSO at times can be real bad at PBI. I deal with the individual officers often, like at the courthouse, and have respect for many, but some at PBI need more training in many ways.

Although they don't often come into the terminal, I have to say the worst are the old geezers that get deputized to direct traffic...it's a dream come true for many of these wannabe condo commandos and dealing with them is real horror.

PBSO should be treated like any of the other police departments in Florida - potentially very violent, aggressive, and with little respect for the Constitution or the people they are hired to protect and serve. Use caution when dealing with any of them. In today's local news is yet another trial where the police down here are being sued for savagely beating an unarmed suspect.

I'm still waiting to get some input from the TV station which reported the B6 story, although I might get better information from the airport manager's office next week. I'm sure none of this occurred in a vacuum....someone has to know what happened.

Although they don't often come into the terminal, I have to say the worst are the old geezers that get deputized to direct traffic...it's a dream come true for many of these wannabe condo commandos and dealing with them is real horror.

I was so tempted to discuss this. It seems like there is a total lack of common sense when dealing with traffic. They cause the congestion and confusion at the airport. I was once a public official responsible for a police department, and what a nightmare dealing with my bad ones.

I had a bad experience at PBI US Airways baggage in Oct. 2005. I was told at DCA that my bags would not make my flight. When I went to file a bag report, this agent who is always nasty, said I have to wait until all bags were off my plane. I told her what I was advised in DCA, and she said you are going to wait. I said I was supposed to be in 9 hours ago and if I have to wait, I am filing a complaint against her. Defensively against my threatened complaint, she calls the PBSO in. I am an attorney so I am real cool and nothing happens.

PBSO at times can be real bad at PBI. I deal with the individual officers often, like at the courthouse, and have respect for many, but some at PBI need more training in many ways.

Can you pm me a description of the agent? although it was 2005...most of the PBI baggage office employees haven't changed since 96' ;)

What a black eye for JB.

I'm sure the cheerleaders will spin it in a positive way though.

Nope, the cheerleaders have stayed away from this one (and rightfully so).

I'm not a B6 cheerleader, but quite honestly there has to be two sides to this story. Do you really think this passenger is going to say "I was a faving lunatic, frantic because I packed all my kids stuff instead of bringing it on board. I screamed and took it out on the baggage handlers...." Of course not. While she may not have been that irate, she surely is not going to paint herself in a bad light. There's just something not making sense that a week later they would call the police because she was a calm, rational, pleasant person. Sorry, doesn't add up.

...
.... There's just something not making sense that a week later they would call the police because she was a calm, rational, pleasant person. Sorry, doesn't add up.

Yeah right. I agree. Doesn't add up.

A mother of two and a 14 months old baby on her arm or in stroller - presenting a threat to the airport authorities, to the airport security officers, to B6 ground crew.
Nothing less than 2 sheriff deputies to maintain public order and safety. (And a squad car probably parked 50 yards away for contingency).

How about calling in two female security officers to assist in defusing the suspect's potential disorderly misconconduct?
How about treating customers with empathy and trying to be of service?
How about saying: "How may I help you?" And meaning it.
The entire airline industry needs to go back to basics - being of service and acting empathically.

Yeah right. I agree. Doesn't add up.

A mother of two and a 14 months old baby on her arm or in stroller - presenting a threat to the airport authorities, to the airport security officers, to B6 ground crew.
Nothing less than 2 sheriff deputies to maintain public order and safety. (And a squad car probably parked 50 yards away for contingency).

How about calling in two female security officers to assist in defusing the suspect's potential disorderly misconconduct?
How about treating customers with empathy and trying to be of service?
How about saying: "How may I help you?" And meaning it.
The entire airline industry needs to go back to basics - being of service and acting empathically.

I would have to disagree with your sterio type of the mother with two young kids are just innocent. I worked in a food store about ten years ago where a mom with a 1 y/o gave me a tongue lashing b/c we didn't have her brand of diapers instock for her child and she didn't want to go to another store or just buy another brand.

There are two sides this story. We know the mom's side, what's the agent's side? Tell me the that and I'll would be willing to offer my opion if it's wanted.

I would have to disagree with your sterio type of the mother with two young kids are just innocent. I worked in a food store about ten years ago where a mom with a 1 y/o gave me a tongue lashing b/c we didn't have her brand of diapers instock for her child and she didn't want to go to another store or just buy another brand.


I believe you.
:rolleyes:

Exactly. B6 gave them standard compensation for lost luggage. I have to ask, why didn't they pack any baby supplies in their carry on, just in case this happened?

Pretty stupid not to have the essentials with her for the baby. The airlines give you an extra carryon allowance for exactly that purpose.

Pretty stupid not to have the essentials with her for the baby. The airlines give you an extra carryon allowance for exactly that purpose.


Or maybe she just expected the airline to get her luggage there.

Us "road warriors" might know better than to check essentials. But how does that shift the blame from JetBlue, since the airline lost her luggage?

I have to think the "standard compensation" was probably inadequate. We can't forget how cheap "standard compensation" is these days.

For example, UA's "standard compensation" meal voucher is $5. I don't know where UA executives eat, but one would be hard pressed to get a "mealo" for $5. The last time I got one of these the employee appologized for the rediculousness of the "standard compensation." I could probably have gotten more but they were doing me a favor so I didn't ask.

I know that for example British Airways provides something called a "comp card" which I believe is some sort of pre-set Visa card that the pax can use to buy items.

I believe that if B6 provided this lady adequate compensation, which is probably more than "standard compensation" she would have left a happy ccustomer. They probably gave her some kind of chincy voucher for say $25, or maybe some song and dance about how they weren't liable for the first 24 hours.

Airlines should use this as a lesson again probably to stock diapers. Maybe airlines could form alliances in tterminals to stock some unusual items, etc.

I agree with the comment that a frequent traveler would probably know better than to pack these items in checked luggage, but maybe not an infrequent flyer.

Airlines really create a lot of these problems by not having adequate ameneties for the customers, and by being cheap as in $5 meal vouchers.

I would be happy to work as a consultant to show airlines what items they should maybe stock, and show them how not to be cheap with their customers.

One simple idea for instance (I use UA b/c I know it best) the hub customer service centers at IAD/DEN/ORD/LAX/SFO they should stock cold bbotteld water, that alone might help refresh and calm people, and they should have adequate numbers of agents.

The more I read the better I think wwe might have been prederegulation when flying was an experience in and of itself and something special.

bocastephen, thank you for your thorough investigation and reports :).,

The more I read the better I think wwe might have been prederegulation when flying was an experience in and of itself and something special.

Its not the deregulation, its the people. Busses and trains used to be premier forms of transportation and look at those now. Flying isn't as special anymore because of everyone does it. We think nothing of flying cross country for a weekend; years ago that would never happen.

Right now the fractional jets are the 'place' to be. However once we get air taxis however many years/decades from now those too will be nothing but long distance subway systems. Its all a cycle.

Very interesting.

I read this post with what started out as a passing interest. As more posts came in I got more interested. I had to look up which airport this was and after seeing these posts I am glad I do not fly in and out of there.

What I noticed was a couple of interesting trends.

1) Authority must have been right (authority in this case meaning the AIrport and Police) because we are guily if the police are called.

2) The lady in question must be right, since she was travelling with children, she must be a saint.

3) The Airline is right, how dare you expect to be treated with dignity. You will do as I say, and if you even apprear to be rude I will call the police.

4) And of course my favorite blame the media, hell the children were probably WMD's in disguise. Otherwise why would she need diapers.

But in reallity probably bits and pieces of 1 through 3 are true. But, why would any compnay want to put themselves into a position such as this. The airline industry is a service industry, and the customers need to be treated with respect, even when they are not treating you this way. The police are called when danger is involved not when you want to have a person stop disagreeing with you and to have them go away.

If it truely turns out to be sting operation with them lying in wait for the women to come get her voucher this could get very interesting ( for the JB employees). If they did this without permission of their management chain I think they should become un-employeed. And the airport needs to protect the passengers from this type of behavior.

Just my 2 cents let the flames begin.

BTW: I am a very frequent flyer and I dislike the media coverage at airports since they always seem to ask questions of people who only travel once of twice a year.

BTW: I am a very frequent flyer and I dislike the media coverage at airports since they always seem to ask questions of people who only travel once of twice a year.

I have to agree with your train of thoughts on that one. They always find the people who don't fly much and generally over-react to any slight disruption in service.

Reporter: "Sir, I would like to interview you for the 6PM news. But first, how many miles have you flown this year?"
Passanger:"Well, it's about time some one heard us stranded passengers! This airline-"
Reporter:"Sir, how many miles?"
Passenger:"This is my first flight in two years. These gate agents are not doing-"
Reporter:"I'm sorry, I'm looking for someone who's flies atleast 10,000 miles per year. Thank you."... turning around to someone else..."Ma'am...!"

Then again, that doesn't make for too good of a story. I guess, calm passengers who take things instride 'cause they know bad weather happens doesn't make for too great of a news story.

Given the time that has passed since the incident and the lack of a jetBlewit press release tells me that someone at B6 is about to get the ax. If this was an out-of-control irate PAX, then there would have been plenty of back up for jetBlewit to make a statement.

But IMHO, it appears that David is tired of crying his eyes out on YouTube. :rolleyes:

I've been sick in bed all weekend with my 2nd bout of tonsilitis this year, so I didn't have a chance to call PBI and follow up today. The reporter never returned my call.

The airport did suggest I contact B6 for their side - so in the meantime, I went ahead and sent them an email. I will post the response when/if received.

I've been sick in bed all weekend with my 2nd bout of tonsilitis this year, so I didn't have a chance to call PBI and follow up today. The reporter never returned my call.

The airport did suggest I contact B6 for their side - so in the meantime, I went ahead and sent them an email. I will post the response when/if received.


LOL - I hope that you plan to charge jetBlewit for all of your time following up on an outragious PR disaster for them. One would think they would have learned a lesson a few weeks ago. As an old Army doctor once said, "The longer it festers, the more it stinks and the more likely it will kill you! Fix it fast and make it right as soon as the damage happens."

LOL - I hope that you plan to charge jetBlewit for all of your time following up on an outragious PR disaster for them. One would think they would have learned a lesson a few weeks ago. As an old Army doctor once said, "The longer it festers, the more it stinks and the more likely it will kill you! Fix it fast and make it right as soon as the damage happens."

Actually, I'm not doing it for jetBlue as much as trying to find out what details are true, and which of those details should be of interest to the PBI airport manager. jetBlue can bar whoever it wants from its leased space (ticket counter, baggage office, gates), but it can't tell a customer of the airport that they are not welcome to fly from that airport anymore - only the airport manager can do that.

Rest assured, the airport manager's office was plenty curious about this case too - but we both had the same information - the news story. If the jetBlue agent used the airport police to bar a customer from terminal property without the airport manager's knowledge or permission, someone is going to get booted from that terminal - and it won't be the woman with the kids and no diapers.

If the jetBlue agent used the airport police to bar a customer from terminal property without the airport manager's knowledge or permission, someone is going to get booted from that terminal - and it won't be the woman with the kids and no diapers.


That's a problem, and I hope you'll keep asking questions there.

Actually, I'm not doing it for jetBlue as much as trying to find out what details are true, and which of those details should be of interest to the PBI airport manager. jetBlue can bar whoever it wants from its leased space (ticket counter, baggage office, gates), but it can't tell a customer of the airport that they are not welcome to fly from that airport anymore - only the airport manager can do that.

Rest assured, the airport manager's office was plenty curious about this case too - but we both had the same information - the news story. If the jetBlue agent used the airport police to bar a customer from terminal property without the airport manager's knowledge or permission, someone is going to get booted from that terminal - and it won't be the woman with the kids and no diapers.

Do you work for the airport or the airline? If not, leave it be. Let the people who need to be involved, investiagate it and go from there. The jobs of the PBI and JetBlue staff are hard enough without people who are not directly involved with what occurs, getting involved.

Nothing less than 2 sheriff deputies to maintain public order and safety. (And a squad car probably parked 50 yards away for contingency).

How about calling in two female security officers to assist in defusing the suspect's potential disorderly misconconduct?
How about treating customers with empathy and trying to be of service?
How about saying: "How may I help you?" And meaning it.
The entire airline industry needs to go back to basics - being of service and acting empathically.

In defense of our public safety professionals, having two sheriff deputies respond to a dispute is not uncalled for. They just know there's a dispute of some sort and any such situation where there's a dispute will generally have at least two deputies respond. In fact, having just one deputy respond would be irresponsible of the dispatcher involved; one never knows how the situation will turn and having two on the scene helps protect the safety of all parties. The first officer on the scene can cancel subsequent assistance if he/she wants to but having two respond is the proper thing to do.

As for getting female (or male) officers, they are trained in the same techniques, shouldn't matter whether they are male or female. Asking for a specific gender officer is nothing short of discrimination.

Do you work for the airport or the airline? If not, leave it be. Let the people who need to be involved, investiagate it and go from there. The jobs of the PBI and JetBlue staff are hard enough without people who are not directly involved with what occurs, getting involved.

I don't need to work for the airline or airport to step up and make sure things are being done correctly. I don't care how hard their jobs are - I care about things being done properly, according to the rules. If people don't step up to point out wrongdoing, then who will?

If jetBlue and the airport support the actions taken by the agents, then I am done with the issue. If either party feels their position was wronged by the employees' actions, and they give them the boot, then so be it. As of my first call to PBI, they didn't even know what happened and were very interested in finding out exactly what this agent did and under whose authority.

So your suggestion aside, I have no intention of letting it go until the airport tells me the issue is resolved on their end.

Do you work for the airport or the airline? If not, leave it be. Let the people who need to be involved, investiagate it and go from there. The jobs of the PBI and JetBlue staff are hard enough without people who are not directly involved with what occurs, getting involved.

Corporate change doesn't happen because the employees decide to. It happens because these things get taken to the media.

You think B6 would have responded the way it did over Valentine's Day if it wasn't on tv???

So your suggestion aside, I have no intention of letting it go until the airport tells me the issue is resolved on their end.

^ ^ good for you

Corporate change doesn't happen because the employees decide to. It happens because these things get taken to the media.

You think B6 would have responded the way it did over Valentine's Day if it wasn't on tv???

Where did this "media" remark fit in with the "debate" at hand?? Nobody is debating the involvement of the media. The debate is about somebody who is not directly involved with the situation nor employed by the involved parties, getting involved.

Where did this "media" remark fit in with the "debate" at hand?? Nobody is debating the involvement of the media. The debate is about somebody who is not directly involved with the situation nor employed by the involved parties, getting involved.

As I said, "Corporate change doesn't happen because the employees decide to."

I wish more people would get involved.

As I said, "Corporate change doesn't happen because the employees decide to."

I wish more people would get involved.

People need to spend more time getting involved with things that real matter in this world. Airline service while as poor as it is as a whole in the industry, is not something that is on the top 10 list of important things in this world that need to be addressed. The best way to get an airline to change is not to get involved with a situation in which one is in no way connected to, but by boycotting/not flying an airline. Thats how one can get involved to get change to occur. Money talks!!

People need to spend more time getting involved with things that real matter in this world. The best way to get an airline to change is not to get involved with a situation in which one is in no way connected to, but by boycotting/not flying an airline. Thats how one can get involved to get change to occur.

Yeaaah, me boycotting B6 is going to make them change their policies. Not gonna happen. You need to send a message. ^ ^ ^

Yeaaah, me boycotting B6 is going to make them change their policies. Not gonna happen. You need to send a message. ^ ^ ^

Of course, you alone boycotting B6 is not going to do it. Thats not what I was saying. It has to happen in masses. But if you wish to send a message, there are ways to do it. As I have already said, getting involved in a situation that one has no right to be involved in or is not even connected to, is not the way to do it.

Of course, you alone boycotting B6 is not going to do it. Thats not what I was saying. It has to happen in masses. But if you wish to send a message, there are ways to do it. As I have already said, getting involved in a situation that one has no right to be involved in or is not even connected to, is not the way to do it.

What is this "getting involved in a situation no one has the right to be involved in" meme you keep spinning? What are we supposed to do, just wait till an airline screws with us individually and *then* get involved? That doesn't seem very efficient to me. Does it to you?

What is this "getting involved in a situation no one has the right to be involved in" meme you keep spinning? What are we supposed to do, just wait till an airline screws with us individually and *then* get involved? That doesn't seem very efficient to me. Does it to you?

I've said it once, but I guess i'll say it again. Unless you are personally involved with a situation, stay out of it. This woman feels she was wronged, let it be her fight.

I've said it once, but I guess i'll say it again. Unless you are personally involved with a situation, stay out of it. This woman feels she was wronged, let it be her fight.

And I think this is an asinine philosophy, but YMMV. Good night, sir!

The bigger principle here is, if it can happen to "them," it can happen to you.

As a flier and concerned resident of that area, I see no problem with bocastephen's inquiries.

I've said it once, but I guess i'll say it again. Unless you are personally involved with a situation, stay out of it.
One wonders what is your connection to bocastephen's investigation? If you aren't personally involved or connected to his inquiries (and it sounds as if you are not), then stay out of it!

(In other words: Pot, meet kettle! :D)

Well, the trail ran cold with the Airport Director's office. They investigated the incident with jetBlue and found out that no one at the airport knew anything about this situation outside of what they saw on the newscast.

Obviously, both the airport and jetBlue are concerned about being painted with a black mark if nothing ever happened, or the story was not accurate. The Airport Director's office was particularly concerned about this, as they worked very hard to make PBI airport an award winning facility for customers.

My own inquiries to jetBlue remain unanswered. We decided that the only path to the bottom of this lays with the news station which reported it - and I now contacted them in writing to get these questions answered.

If it looks like none of the events can be verified and the story was run without adequate fact checking or follow-up with the affected parties, I will request the station post a public retraction on their newscast as well as the website. Fair is fair.

Thanks for the update.

There should be dispatch logs/incident reports which are public record if the Sheriff's Department did, indeed, respond to a call, right? That might be worth checking.

Well, the trail ran cold with the Airport Director's office. They investigated the incident with jetBlue and found out that no one at the airport knew anything about this situation outside of what they saw on the newscast.

Obviously, both the airport and jetBlue are concerned about being painted with a black mark if nothing ever happened, or the story was not accurate. The Airport Director's office was particularly concerned about this, as they worked very hard to make PBI airport an award winning facility for customers.

My own inquiries to jetBlue remain unanswered. We decided that the only path to the bottom of this lays with the news station which reported it - and I now contacted them in writing to get these questions answered.

If it looks like none of the events can be verified and the story was run without adequate fact checking or follow-up with the affected parties, I will request the station post a public retraction on their newscast as well as the website. Fair is fair.

Are you operating on behalf of either the airport or B6?

Are you operating on behalf of either the airport or B6?

I am operating a concerned citizen of the local community to make sure no wrongdoing was committed by a police force which is known for wrongdoing. As someone connected well with the industry, I am also acting to ensure that the Airport Director's authority was not ignored by the airline employees or the police.

I have no official capacity, other than to get to the bottom of what happened and ensure the events were reported to public accurately, and if wrongdoing was committed, request those individuals be punished.

Given the billons of public tax dollars that go into building and maintaining airports, any member of the public has a right to ask questions about what goes on.

Or did the TSA take ownership while I wasn't looking?

I spoke to the reporter this afternoon. He confirmed with jetBlue and the PBSO that an incident did take place. No attempt was made to contact the airport.

I have the name and location of the person who was involved in the incident, but I am not sure I want to call them and get involved any further, since that would only give me one side of the story and it's not even germane to what I'm trying to figure out - I am only focused on one singular issue: did the airline employee(s) and/or the police exceed their authority, and did they in fact instruct the customer to leave the airport (not just jetBlue's leased property) and not use it again.

I could make a request for the incident report - I am going to debate doing that. Since the reporter did speak with jetBlue and they confirmed the incident occurred, the airline's lack of a response to my inquiry appears deliberate.

I could make a request for the incident report - I am going to debate doing that. Since the reporter did speak with jetBlue and they confirmed the incident occurred, the airline's lack of a response to my inquiry appears deliberate.



Something funny may be going on if the airport manager says no one there knows anything about it.

The incident report and dispatch logs could be very enlightening.

I hope this story goes national and further humiliates this airline - which seems to be spinning out of control


If it looks like none of the events can be verified and the story was run without adequate fact checking or follow-up with the affected parties, I will request the station post a public retraction on their newscast as well as the website. Fair is fair.

I spoke to the reporter this afternoon. He confirmed with jetBlue and the PBSO that an incident did take place. No attempt was made to contact the airport ... I could make a request for the incident report - I am going to debate doing that.


So what is the point? JetBlue was guilty, not guilty, and guilty. And then it ends with you having a debate with yourself. We're back where we started, having learned nothing.

So what is the point? JetBlue was guilty, not guilty, and guilty. And then it ends with you having a debate with yourself. We're back where we started, having learned nothing.

Umm no. I was simply updating the thread as new information became available for those who were interested in following the saga.

I have the name and location of the person who was involved in the incident, but I am not sure I want to call them and get involved any further, since that would only give me one side of the story

I'd be pretty pissed if someone totally unconnected to the situation contacts me based on information contained in a police report.

and it's not even germane to what I'm trying to figure out - I am only focused on one singular issue: did the airline employee(s) and/or the police exceed their authority, and did they in fact instruct the customer to leave the airport (not just jetBlue's leased property) and not use it again.

For the Sheriff, maybe the following link would help: http://www.pbso.org/index.cfm?fa=IAB

I could make a request for the incident report - I am going to debate doing that. Since the reporter did speak with jetBlue and they confirmed the incident occurred, the airline's lack of a response to my inquiry appears deliberate.

Getting reports available to the public seems to be fine, but investigating allegations of a crime on your own seems wrong and possibly even criminal depending on how you go about it.

I'd be pretty pissed if someone totally unconnected to the situation contacts me based on information contained in a police report. To the contrary, the reporter told me the person is very interested in talking about the incident - I am choosing not to get involved from that side of things, because it's going too far and also not relevant to what I'm trying to learn about the incident.

Getting reports available to the public seems to be fine, but investigating allegations of a crime on your own seems wrong and possibly even criminal depending on how you go about it. There is no investigating of a crime here as there is no known crime; however I am perfectly within my rights to investigate, report on and demand remedy for police misconduct as a private citizen, and I am within my expertise to discuss the issue of tenant airline authority with the Airport Director's office - who is also quite interested in what I find out, especially given that jetBlue has refused to either respond to our inquiries and denied to the airport the event even took place.

There is no investigating of a crime here as there is no known crime; however I am perfectly within my rights to investigate, report on and demand remedy for police misconduct as a private citizen, and I am within my expertise to discuss the issue of tenant airline authority with the Airport Director's office - who is also quite interested in what I find out, especially given that jetBlue has refused to either respond to our inquiries and denied to the airport the event even took place.

If the airport is so concerned about this then why don't they push JetBlue on this issue? You can 'investigate' whatever you want but without any official authority in the matter it seems very fishy to me. Also, if you have a concern that the police did not follow proper procedures then why not file a complaint with that department?

Again, your involvement seems very suspect and its reasonable that B6 may be thinking the same thing. Basically if you're not in a position to officially affect change, then why not get people involved that can officially affect change?

Getting reports available to the public seems to be fine, but investigating allegations of a crime on your own seems wrong and possibly even criminal depending on how you go about it.


I agree, it is wrong to investigate impropriety in Palm Beach County. Why should any citizen be interested in having justice carried out? Serious wrongdoing goes on here in Palm Beach County every day. It’s the norm. It is certainly illegal to insist that the laws be enforced and justice be carried out. The laws are only a façade and it is illegal to attack that facade.

(I once operated under the same delusion as bocastephen does. After 7 years/ 20 hours a day of beating my head against the wall in politics and half way through a 4 year term of an elected city council seat that I won with a 2-1 margin in Pennsylvania and served as council president with the backing of 8 of 9 council members, I realized that wrongdoing was the norm, and in 1981 at the age of 28, I retired from politics and resigned my seat and moved to Florida when I accepted the fact that I was a misfit because I could not become corrupt and be a good successful public official. Nobody took the rule of law and justice seriously and I just could not grasp that.)



Also, if you have a concern that the police did not follow proper procedures then why not file a complaint with that department?

Again, your involvement seems very suspect and its reasonable that B6 may be thinking the same thing. Basically if you're not in a position to officially affect change, then why not get people involved that can officially affect change?

File all the complaints you want, they go in the trash. Maybe if more people not in a position to affect change, in fact stood up, we would see some change for the better. Bocastephen may be beating a dead horse, but he is beating it in the name of justice. I have been there, done that, have seen it all.

If the airport is so concerned about this then why don't they push JetBlue on this issue? They are curious, not concerned. It's not a major issue for them - they have an airport to run.

You can 'investigate' whatever you want but without any official authority in the matter it seems very fishy to me. Also, if you have a concern that the police did not follow proper procedures then why not file a complaint with that department? I don't need "official authority" to investigate anything. Does the press have "official authority"? It would be great if more people got off their behinds and investigated wrongdoing instead of waiting for those with "official authority" to get to it.

Also, I have no complaint to file against the police without someone confirming they worked with these B6 agents to banish the customer from the airport.

Again, your involvement seems very suspect and its reasonable that B6 may be thinking the same thing. What exactly is so suspect about my interest? There are plenty of threads on different forums where people have gotten involved to help other FTers or looked into various issues on their own.

I am not posting on this thread to seek approval - I am posting the information I find for the interest of those who are curious about what happened. If you think it's inappropriate, you can click the ignore button ;)

I am not posting on this thread to seek approval - I am posting the information I find for the interest of those who are curious about what happened. If you think it's inappropriate, you can click the ignore button ;)

I don't see anything inappropriate about trying to find out more about something that may have happened in a public, taxpayer-funded facility, and the response by public (Sheriff's Department) employees. Especially since it might have implications for other travelers.

I am operating a concerned citizen of the local community to make sure no wrongdoing was committed by a police force which is known for wrongdoing. As someone connected well with the industry, I am also acting to ensure that the Airport Director's authority was not ignored by the airline employees or the police.

I have no official capacity, other than to get to the bottom of what happened and ensure the events were reported to public accurately, and if wrongdoing was committed, request those individuals be punished.

I wonder if the ACLU has opened up shop in Boca Raton?

Boy, this sure reminds me of the bleeding liberals on the Upper West Side of Manhattan - - prepared to advocate for any person and cause - - ranging from saving whales to penguins.

I wonder, do they settle in Boca Raton?

I am forever amazed by people who fabricate opinions and conclusions based on conjecture, sketchy information, details reported by any media outlet, fact or partial fact, and folklore.

I wonder if the ACLU has opened up shop in Boca Raton?

Boy, this sure reminds me of the bleeding liberals on the Upper West Side of Manhattan - - prepared to advocate for any person and cause - - ranging from saving whales to penguins.

I wonder, do they settle in Boca Raton?

I am forever amazed by people who fabricate opinions and conclusions based on conjecture, sketchy information, details reported by any media outlet, fact or partial fact, and folklore.


I am forever amazed by people who throw around the "bleeding liberals" tag based on conjecture, sketchy information, etc.

I wonder if the ACLU has opened up shop in Boca Raton?

Boy, this sure reminds me of the bleeding liberals on the Upper West Side of Manhattan - - prepared to advocate for any person and cause - - ranging from saving whales to penguins.

I wonder, do they settle in Boca Raton?

I am forever amazed by people who fabricate opinions and conclusions based on conjecture, sketchy information, details reported by any media outlet, fact or partial fact, and folklore.

You're way off base :) Anyway, care to elaborate what opinions, conclusions and details have been fabricated so far?

If you bothered to read the thread, you would note where I said I am not "advocating" for anyone - I am only interested in whether or not B6 employees committed an act which should result in their termination and PBSO conducted themselves in a manner that deserves an official complaint on their records or possibly other measures.

I am only concerned with the absolute power and authority of the Airport Director being undermined by people who have no business telling an airport customer they are not permitted to use our taxpayer funded airport facilities. The other details around this woman's diaper caper are of no interest to me.

What exactly is so suspect about my interest? ... I am posting the information I find

You haven't added any useful information after the OP. You spoke to people who either had nothing relevant to say or who denied that the events took place. You told us that the reporter corroborated his own story but have not offered a shred of independent corroboration.

You bumped the thread back to the top after it scrolled off the front page. It might as well be a sticky thread, so we all see it on top every time we come to this forum.

So we have the original story from the original post with nothing added. That's bumping. Sorry. Thread should be locked or moved to OMNI, IMHO.

You're way off base :) Anyway, care to elaborate what opinions, conclusions and details have been fabricated so far?

If you bothered to read the thread, you would note where I said I am not "advocating" for anyone - I am only interested in whether or not B6 employees committed an act which should result in their termination and PBSO conducted themselves in a manner that deserves an official complaint on their records or possibly other measures.

I am only concerned with the absolute power and authority of the Airport Director being undermined by people who have no business telling an airport customer they are not permitted to use our taxpayer funded airport facilities. The other details around this woman's diaper caper are of no interest to me.

In actuality, (1) I read the complete thread - - several times over, intruiged by and paying attention to your writings, and (2) I am a Forensic Psychiatrist, and I feel quite comfortable forming an opinion of your actions and writings.

I provided updates for those few people who were interested in learning what happened - the updates were based on what I found out. There was nothing further to add, and I didn't plan on adding anything until I had a chance to read the incident report.

The only reason the thread keeps getting bumped is due to the never ending complaining about the thread's existence or my so-called 'motives'.

Don't like it...hit the ignore button. By complaining, you're just continuing to bump the thread.

Although coming in at the tail end of this matter, I do have a few comments to add.If a jetBlue employee did use PBSO officers, by alleging that the passenger was hostile/out of control, then this is a problem with jetBlue and should be dealt with by jetBlue, although I doubt anything will happen.PBSO officers if as stated, only responded to a call by jetBlue.I disagree with the characterization of all south Florida officers as posted,in the interest of full disclosure I have immediate family members who are LEO's with area Sheriff's agencies, not PBSO though.There have been,I fully agree , improper actions by some police in south Florida, but you will find this anywhere, unfortunately.Anyone familiar with the operations of any law enforcement agency knows that if you get a call, you respond to it, and at least attempt to resolve the problem. That's your job.
I do feel that PBI airport of course wants the issue to go away NOW, they don't want to deal with it.But also, bocastephen has the right to question the actions of jetBlue and PBSO as well as the PBI airport authority, and as far as I know there is no restriction on any private citizen as to asking for information on a specific incident. If any improper actions were made by PBSO or the airport I hope he makes an official complaint and shares info here also.

Given there's strong suspicion that something went wrong, would it be reasonable to ask the airport authority to issue a memorandum to all tenants and the sheriff's office on the proper procedure for who can be kicked out and from what areas? I believe that is the issue here?

That would seem to lay down the law, so to speak, to make sure nothing happens in the future. Seems like it would be a start.