Singapore Airlines KrisFlyer - Expected information from the airline?

Just got back from a trip to Thailand from Japan using Singapore Airlines, and had a minor nightmare getting to the departure lounge that I'm currently blaming on the airline. Just wondered what other people's thoughts were.

What happened was this - in Bangkok airport, departing foreigners have to pay tax by hand, but the first I knew about this was when I was asked just before immigration. This is a bit of a shock and annoyance at the best of times, but since I was travelling without credit or ATM cards (for fear of theft) and had just under the required amount in cash, I was stuck, potentially permanently, in Bangkok airport.

I checked with the check-in counter staff, who were fairly rude (uselessly stating it's the passengers responsibility to check if tax is in the ticket fare - legally probably true, but does anyone actually check?), and then unprofessional (waving their hands and saying "what do you want me to do about it?").

But even without the unhelpful check-in staff, I still blame Singapore for not providing enough information. Given that it's so rare to have to pay tax separately from the ticket, I think they should have announced this on the outgoing flight. They do give a lot of information about the airport, but missed this fact (I would say the most important one) out.

The flight back was pretty poor anyway - a glitchy entertainement system and stewards who, when asked for a drink, would say they're just going to get it and then never return. But what I'm interested in is what other people think about this - should the airline provide this information in advance, or the airport in arrivals, or do we all have to start checking for tax procedures for every airport we go to?

By the way, just to finish the story - I did eventually get through after a kind member of ground staff paid the difference for me (it was actually very little in real terms), although this did mean I spent 3 hours without money in departures, in an airport with no drinking fountains! Possible one of my worst flights in recent years - I think I'd even prefer KLM to Singapore in future ...

The onus is on you, the traveller, to check - there are many countries where the airport tax must be paid in cash at the airport. You couldn't prepay it even if you wanted to.

Whenever I travel, this is one of the first things I check after visa requirements. This is particularly true for countries where hard cash is valued. Vietnam even collects airport tax in USD.

You can 'expect' somebody else to tell you, but you are still responsible for it.

btw - the lovely Krisflyer magazine has a page in the back listing all this useful information.

Hi semprini,

but since I was travelling without credit or ATM cards (for fear of theft) and had just under the required amount in cash, I was stuck, potentially permanently, in Bangkok airport.
In my opinion, that is not the airline's fault. I couldn't imagine not travelling without a credit card - If someone steals your credit card, at least you can cancel it and stop someone from using it. With cash that's not possible. This is just paranoia.

I checked with the check-in counter staff, who were fairly rude (uselessly stating it's the passengers responsibility to check if tax is in the ticket fare
Agree with the check in staff. This is YOUR responsibility.

Given that it's so rare to have to pay tax separately from the ticket, I think they should have announced this on the outgoing flight.
Not true. In New Zealand the same applies and not so long ago Australia.

I think I'd even prefer KLM to Singapore in future ...
Given the type of passenger you appear to be, Singapore may even prefer you travel with KLM :p

Bottom Line: It's YOUR responsibility to check the requirements of each country's departure tax and it's YOUR responsibility to make sure you have sufficient funds (cash or credit card) at the airport, just in case things like this happen.

Regards
SQ744

I can't remember any airline telling me on a flight to a destination with a departure tax that I'd need to pay the tax when leaving - it's just something which I'm expected to sort out myself and to have sufficient funds to pay.

By the way, just to finish the story - I did eventually get through after a kind member of ground staff paid the difference for me (it was actually very little in real terms)


So a ground staff helped paid the airport tax for you and yet you have the audacity to even say that "it was very little in real terms"?

Talk about being ungrateful ! :td:

And I agree with the other posters, it is your responsibilty as a traveller to ensure you have the necessary funds and knowledge about airport tax and other quirks of the country you're visiting. And not expect the airline you're flying with to babysit you.


K

I have to say though that although it is the responsibility of the passenger, it's not very clear (though I haven't booked to BKK on Singaporeair.com yet).

Swiss told me nothing about this, I assumed it was included in the fare. Luckily I went through the old Don Muang without paying any airport tax.

most experienced flyers such as Fters would know. I have to admit that if it wasn't for Ft, i wouldn't have known abt the 500 or so so baht when i first travelled to BKK a year ago and that the taxes is sometimes only included in some business and F tickets only. def not Y class tickets.

as for SQ steward forgetting the drink, sometimes have to remind them. Just be thankful, its not UA. from hkg-SIN, on UA, one of the girls, sin based only remembered when she saw my call button turn on. :D :D :D ....

oh well, the trials and tribulations of travels. back to exams now.

has anyone gone to see the A380 in SIN.??

Oh dear not a very friendly welcome to Flyertalk!

I'm sure even the most frequent of flyers have sometimes messed up over departure tax. I did the same at BKK once. I normally just change flights there, but this time went through immigration to hand over a package to someone (!) and then got panicked about the departure tax. No baht... forgot my PIN etc etc. Ended up changing some cash - almost missed my flight because of a long queue - and almost lost my rag at some monk who kept "touching" me hoping for a donation out of the money I had been forced to obtain just to leave his country when I had only just arrived. (Someone later told me that you don't need to pay if you're in Thailand for less than 12 hours or something.... not sure if that's true.)

The whole thing is annoying - you buy stuff and expect the price quoted at the point of sale to include everything. Then you find out somebody is knocking on your door for more - be it a service charge, VAT, airport tax or whatever. I dislike tipping cultures for the same reason - especially where its practically expected/demanded.

I do agree with what has already been written - it is your responsibility to know about this. Just one of those things. At least for you its now a "known unknown" (so you know to check next time) rather than an "unknown unknown" as it was when you arrived at the airport.

I hope you stick around Flyertalk. Its a great place to find out about things you should know before you travel. Also, it seems, find out that you should have known in the first place!

Just got back from a trip to Thailand from Japan using Singapore Airlines, and had a minor nightmare getting to the departure lounge that I'm currently blaming on the airline. Just wondered what other people's thoughts were.

What happened was this - in Bangkok airport, departing foreigners have to pay tax by hand, but the first I knew about this was when I was asked just before immigration. This is a bit of a shock and annoyance at the best of times, but since I was travelling without credit or ATM cards (for fear of theft) and had just under the required amount in cash, I was stuck, potentially permanently, in Bangkok airport.

I checked with the check-in counter staff, who were fairly rude (uselessly stating it's the passengers responsibility to check if tax is in the ticket fare - legally probably true, but does anyone actually check?), and then unprofessional (waving their hands and saying "what do you want me to do about it?").

But even without the unhelpful check-in staff, I still blame Singapore for not providing enough information. Given that it's so rare to have to pay tax separately from the ticket, I think they should have announced this on the outgoing flight. They do give a lot of information about the airport, but missed this fact (I would say the most important one) out.

The flight back was pretty poor anyway - a glitchy entertainement system and stewards who, when asked for a drink, would say they're just going to get it and then never return. But what I'm interested in is what other people think about this - should the airline provide this information in advance, or the airport in arrivals, or do we all have to start checking for tax procedures for every airport we go to?

By the way, just to finish the story - I did eventually get through after a kind member of ground staff paid the difference for me (it was actually very little in real terms), although this did mean I spent 3 hours without money in departures, in an airport with no drinking fountains! Possible one of my worst flights in recent years - I think I'd even prefer KLM to Singapore in future ...

You are unreasonable.

Swiss told me nothing about this, I assumed it was included in the fare. Luckily I went through the old Don Muang without paying any airport tax.
How did you manage that? :confused: They've been collecting the same tax for years.

Anyway, scuttlebutt says that Thailand is finally going to get with the program and start putting the airport tax in the ticket itself sometime next year -- more probably than not at the same time as they hike it up from 500 to 700 baht. :mad:

You are unreasonable.

And so was your act of duplicating the OP's entire post just to say that!

...What happened was this - in Bangkok airport, departing foreigners have to pay tax by hand, but the first I knew about this was when I was asked just before immigration...

Welcome to FT!

These airports with the separate tax that they want in cash are extremely annoying, and although I agree that it is my responsibility as the traveler to know about this stuff, thinking about whether or not I have to hold onto 500 Baht at the end of my meeting in BKK is very low on my priority list.

Airlines that remind you up front about this are very helpful, although this service is inconsistent. I used to fly UA to PEK, and I remember getting email reminders from them. CX gave some nice reminders for certain airports (BKK, MNL?) but not others (YVR?). AA would send generic reminders that became useless because I began to ignore them. I don't think SQ gives any email reminders about this sort of thing.

Anyway, I feel your pain about these ridiculous cash-payment taxes, and I hope you thanked the angel who paid your way.

I won't add anymore insult to injury. All I will say is, it always pays to have some cash on hand for unexpected payments. Hope that with research and planning, your future travels will be smoother.

Actually, the inflight mag Silver Kris would've mentioned it, wouldn't it? The page that describes the airports, because I remember reading about AKL and CHC having taxes that were described as "collected at time of check-in" or something to that effect.

How did you manage that? :confused: They've been collecting the same tax for years.

I checked in at LX's J counter (which took an age because the bloody flight was delayed inbound to BKK).

Proceeded straight to immigration where the woman checked my passport and departure card. I asked her "Is there any airport tax?". She said, "Wait!". She stamped the passport and I walked through airside.

Strange but saved me THB 500 or whatever it was. :D :confused:

Troll alert? How can anyone be in an airport without his credit card or cash? Is he expected to be whisked upon arrival in Japan by his limo driver?

Btw departure tax is payable upon departure in some Asian cities such as Manila, Jakarta, Christchurch and Micronesia.

I had wonderful flights on SQ 68 SIN-BKK, SQ 67 BKK-SIN, SQ 996 SIN-BKK-NRT and SQ 631 NRT-BKK-SIN. Wonderful service in every way possible.

The onus is on you, the traveller, to check - there are many countries where the airport tax must be paid in cash at the airport. You couldn't prepay it even if you wanted to.

Whenever I travel, this is one of the first things I check after visa requirements. This is particularly true for countries where hard cash is valued. Vietnam even collects airport tax in USD.

You can 'expect' somebody else to tell you, but you are still responsible for it.

btw - the lovely Krisflyer magazine has a page in the back listing all this useful information.
You are completely right, fimo. Even when I was so naive in travel, I did my own research in each airport I would stop, to see whether there is a certain matters like the airport tax. YVR used to have that CADxx for Airport Improvement. So kind of strange to find that first time I flew out from YVR.

And for the OP, sorry to hear about your bad experience. But again, why would you end with KLM is better than SQ? And BTW, I checked in at BKK last Friday, and I did not see that the check-in agents were SQ Staff. Looking at their name tags, they are all shows the BKK Airport staff. So, your comment about them being rude, does not entirely reflect the SQ staff attitude.

No drinking fountain at BKK is not SQ fault. It's the problem at new BKK airport. The same thing with the infamous not enough toilet available at the new BKK.

What happened was this - in Bangkok airport, departing foreigners have to pay tax by hand, but the first I knew about this was when I was asked just before immigration. This is a bit of a shock and annoyance at the best of times, but since I was travelling without credit or ATM cards (for fear of theft) and had just under the required amount in cash, I was stuck, potentially permanently, in Bangkok airport.

How on earth did you survive in Japan WITHOUT credit or ATM cards? and very little $$$ ??? From what I know Japan is a very expensive country.


By the way, just to finish the story - I did eventually get through after a kind member of ground staff paid the difference for me (it was actually very little in real terms), although this did mean I spent 3 hours without money in departures, in an airport with no drinking fountains! Possible one of my worst flights in recent years - I think I'd even prefer KLM to Singapore in future ...

I hope that the KIND MEMBER of ground staff is not a Thai Local. I do have friends from that country, thus i know that the locals (especially lower ranking jobs...such as airport ground staff) do not earn very much.

To YOU, the amount may be VERY LITTLE IN REAL TERMS...to them???

I checked in at LX's J counter (which took an age because the bloody flight was delayed inbound to BKK).

Proceeded straight to immigration where the woman checked my passport and departure card. I asked her "Is there any airport tax?". She said, "Wait!". She stamped the passport and I walked through airside.
You shouldn't have been able to get from check-in to immigration without passing past the clicky-clicky dragons, who are usually quite diligent about punching little holes in the little airport tax slips. But if you do get past them, immigration couldn't care less.

To the OP: I join with my fellow FTers who found it awfully strange for someone in this day and age to turn up in a country without credit or ATM cards. I too wonder how you were going to get to your home once you got back to Japan--and how you did ultimately accomplish that with no money at all, having spent all your cash (along with someone else's) on the airport tax. Apart from a possible milage run with a BKK-turnaround (in which event you would have had no reason to go landside and could have avoided the tax by staying airside), I can't fathom why you were in Thailand (or elsewhere) without any ability to pay for anything. And I'm really unclear on how much shopping you planned to do in three hours in the departures area with less than 500 baht and no plastic. In any case, for the record, it's not just foreigners who have to pay when leaving-- everyone pays.

I'll also agree with those who noted that "very little in real terms" to you is probably a lot to someone working as groundstaff at Suvarnabhumi.

Oh dear not a very friendly welcome to Flyertalk!

... (Someone later told me that you don't need to pay if you're in Thailand for less than 12 hours or something.... not sure if that's true.)

I asked about the short transit time too last year at Don Muang. AoT insisted that I had to pay regardless of how long I'd been in the Kingdom. On that trip, it was all of 10 minutes in transit from SQ 995 to a CX flight to HKG. To avoid the tax, my Thai friend stayed airside, but I wanted the passport stamps, so had to cough up 500 baht to AoT.

Not a particularly warm welcome to FlyerTalk, but, giving you the benefit of the doubt that you're not a troll starting senseless discussions just to be provocative, I will also encourage you to stick around and share some more of your experiences and questions.

How can anyone be in an airport without his credit card or cash? Is he expected to be whisked upon arrival in Japan by his limo driver?

Believe it or not but I have flown before with no cash or credit cards (although I did have atm card). I had literally used every last peso on the final night out plus the ride to the airport, and was being picked up when I got home.

Yes it was pretty stupid, as I'm guessing the OP felt when told needed to pay tax.

I had literally used every last peso on the final night out

It must have been quite a night! ;)

it was - barely had enough time to shower & change before checking out and take the train to the airport

To the OP: I join with my fellow FTers who found it awfully strange for someone in this day and age to turn up in a country without credit or ATM cards. I too wonder how you were going to get to your home once you got back to Japan--and how you did ultimately accomplish that with no money at all, having spent all your cash (along with someone else's) on the airport tax. Apart from a possible milage run with a BKK-turnaround (in which event you would have had no reason to go landside and could have avoided the tax by staying airside), I can't fathom why you were in Thailand (or elsewhere) without any ability to pay for anything. And I'm really unclear on how much shopping you planned to do in three hours in the departures area with less than 500 baht and no plastic. In any case, for the record, it's not just foreigners who have to pay when leaving-- everyone pays.

I'll also agree with those who noted that "very little in real terms" to you is probably a lot to someone working as groundstaff at Suvarnabhumi.



I asked about the short transit time too last year at Don Muang. AoT insisted that I had to pay regardless of how long I'd been in the Kingdom. On that trip, it was all of 10 minutes in transit from SQ 995 to a CX flight to HKG. To avoid the tax, my Thai friend stayed airside, but I wanted the passport stamps, so had to cough up 500 baht to AoT.

Not a particularly warm welcome to FlyerTalk, but, giving you the benefit of the doubt that you're not a troll starting senseless discussions just to be provocative, I will also encourage you to stick around and share some more of your experiences and questions.

The OP could have had money stored in their "Cell Phone" and then just touched a pad on the train turnstiles or even bought some food at a convenience store the same way.....
You even get NH miles for doing it.... :D

Anyway, I feel your pain about these ridiculous cash-payment taxes, and I hope you thanked the angel who paid your way.

I hope that you noted the name of the employee and wrote a nice, complementary letter about said employee to Singapore Airlines. I doubt that their staff is well-paid (like the US airlines) and any amount of money was probably a sacrifice for them.

Well, thanks to (most of) for your considered replies - I'm surprised how common last-minute payments is, I'm a semi-frequent flyer and this is the first time, although I still think Singapore Airlines should have included this their airport information guide. (I hope you appreciate I not talking about their legal obligation, just good service). Ah well, you live and learn.

As for the not-so considered replies - do some people join forums just to vent their anger about failures in their real life? Some of the comments given above required willful misunderstanding of what I'd said (as if I wasn't greatful to the member of ground staff who saved my life .. yeah, right). I won't even waste my time with some of the others. Anyway, this is the last you'll be hearing from me ...

Think this thread gets my vote for FlyerTalk at its worst.

Semprini's point-of-view was different to that of most frequent travellers - but at the same time he was asking for opinions in a measured way. And "measured" was the manner of his departure.

FlyerTalk is about flying. Poor old Semprini didn't quite fit into the frequent flying clique and got a bashing for having, what seems to most FFs as, a naive standpoint.

All the personal stuff, "troll alerts" , "me too"s and doubting his bit about not carrying credit cards seems unnecessary. Better not to post than post nothing other than an emotional or insulting post.

I enjoy reading posts for newcomers (especially newcomers to flying) if they are sensibly written. FFs get used to the way things are and the POV of a someone new can bring people back to earth and re-calibrate the senses.

I don't blame him for moving on.

although I still think Singapore Airlines should have included this their airport information guide. (I hope you appreciate I not talking about their legal obligation, just good service)


Actually, it was on their old website...I'm not sure whether it is on the new website, but if it is, its certainly not obvious.

All the personal stuff, "troll alerts" , "me too"s and doubting his bit about not carrying credit cards seems unnecessary. Better not to post than post nothing other than an emotional or insulting post.

I enjoy reading posts for newcomers (especially newcomers to flying) if they are sensibly written. FFs get used to the way things are and the POV of a someone new can bring people back to earth and re-calibrate the senses.
I too enjoy hearing newbies' perspective, but in this case, there was a tone of negativity that I think rubbed other people the wrong way. IMO, blaming an airline, rather than taking some responsibility for not finding out about the requirements of specific airports (every guidebook I've read mentions it) is too easy a way out.
Think this thread gets my vote for FlyerTalk at its worst.
I've seen much worse. ;) But I agree with you, though perhaps for different reasons: yes, some of the responses seemed too hasty to ascribe motivations to the OP, but I'm troubled as well by the spirit of the original post (to paraphrase in my own words, "It's SQ's fault that my lack of preparation for contingencies caused a serious inconvenience to me").
Semprini's point-of-view was different to that of most frequent travellers - but at the same time he was asking for opinions in a measured way. And "measured" was the manner of his departure.

FlyerTalk is about flying. Poor old Semprini didn't quite fit into the frequent flying clique and got a bashing for having, what seems to most FFs as, a naive standpoint.
Coming to a frequent flyer forum with such a complaint and expecting not to receive a strong response is, IMO, somewhat naive in itself. My brother (based in SIN) isn't a frequent flyer by any account, but even he knew about departure taxes and the variation across airports in Asia.
I don't blame him for moving on.
Neither do I. But I can't fault others for being incredulous or flabbergasted by the desire to blame an airline, rather than assuming some of the responsibility himself. He was interested in hearing what other (frequent) flyers had to say, so he knows about their opinions (and now, about mine as well, in case he decides to check back).

I've seen much worse. ;)

In the CX forum, perhaps? ;)

jjpb3 summed up the reaction to the OP pretty well. Most FTers thought the circumstances he found himself in were pretty strange, and that blaming the airline for not giving enough information--when, in fact, SQ discloses precisely the information at issue in the back of Silver Kris magazine right in every seat pocket--was a case of misdirected ire.

The stored-value-on-his-mobile-phone suggestion was an interesting one that would explain how the OP wound up in Thailand devoid of funds. And while I find the whole story dubious, I will not assume the worst about the OP. What does bear noting, however, is that FT has quite a number of trolls who have been banned for violating the ToS yet do show up every now and again in an effort to "start something." I don't think the OP was one on those, but regular FTers can't be blamed for being doubtful of the OP's unusual story.

In general, I have found the SQ forum one of the nicer corners of FT. The response to the OP in this thread doesn't change that significantly in my eyes.

One last thought...although the response to the OP may not have been the friendliest, it is beyond my comprehension that someone could be travelling internationally with no credit card or ATM card and have less than $20.00US cash available to him. That's just plain stupid.

One last thought...although the response to the OP may not have been the friendliest, it is beyond my comprehension that someone could be travelling internationally with no credit card or ATM card and have less than $20.00US cash available to him. That's just plain stupid.

I suppose it happens... you're on your homebound journey.... maybe you're expecting someone to collect you at the other end or whatever.

Right now I have a group of friends over in the UK on business from Vietnam. 7 of them - none of them have credit cards. A couple have cash cards which they thought might work in the UK but don't seem to. Credit cards are available in VN, but difficult to get. Domestically its only touristy places that tend to take them, and overseas they get hit with big fees. Also many Vietnamese worry about fraud - consumer protection is poor and the state-run banks are less likely to take your side in the event of a problem. So they just carry cash..... I can imagine that they could run low before returning and also qualify as "plain stupid". But they are architects and they design some pretty nice buildings!

To the OP: I join with my fellow FTers who found it awfully strange for someone in this day and age to turn up in a country without credit or ATM cards.

Some travelers still rely upon traveler's cheques, not credit cards or ATMs, during their journeys.

Well done SQ ground staff.
They should be commended for helping such an unprepared passenger.

Well done SQ ground staff.
They should be commended for helping such an unprepared passenger.

We don't know who the ground staff worked for.

Some travelers still rely upon traveler's cheques, not credit cards or ATMs, during their journeys.

To me, it doesn't matter what form of money you travel with, I think it is important to always have some hard currency on hand. I always have an emergency cash stash in USD - it doesn't get touched, it is there for a situation where I need money, whether it's a taxi, medical treatment, getting a mechanic or whatever.

In this case, I'm not feeling particularly sympathetic because this is a case of poor planning, and knocking on SQ or any airline for not being proactive about informing passengers doesn't really fly with me at this day and age when information is at everyone's fingertips.

As for the not-so considered replies - do some people join forums just to vent their anger about failures in their real life? Some of the comments given above required willful misunderstanding of what I'd said (as if I wasn't greatful to the member of ground staff who saved my life .. yeah, right). I won't even waste my time with some of the others. Anyway, this is the last you'll be hearing from me ...

Your post rubbed some people the wrong way because you blamed SQ for what people viewed as your mistakes. I really don't think it is any airlines job to have to remind you of an airport tax. If you were greatful to ground staff then say it!

Anyway, welcome to FT, thanks for your short visit and goodbye! :D

Well done SQ ground staff.
They should be commended for helping such an unprepared passenger.

Problem is the OP thought that SQ's staff should have at least have done that much.. he didn't even THANK the poor staff member...

Can you imagine this situation in North America for example...

But in all fairness, if it came to me, I wouldn't even dare post such a post. It was after all, the fault of the OP for not checking on taxes and such..

I have been in a situation when I was almost flat broke in CDG enroute to SIN. I managed to scrape by paying the reissue fee that LH imposed on me because I missed the original check-in time by 5 minutes.. and I honestly maxed out on my cc, and couldn't get my Singapore-issued ATM card to work properly at the CDG ATM machines! (Yes I forgot my PIN) !

So it can happen.. but in such circumstances.. LH was not going to reissue the ticket for me even if I was short 5 euros! Thank goodness it worked out.

he didn't even THANK the poor staff member...


With respect, I think that's not the case....

As he wrote in his second post: "Some of the comments given above required willful misunderstanding of what I'd said (as if I wasn't greatful to the member of ground staff who saved my life .. yeah, right)"

There doesn't seem to be any value rehashing the same comments, and since nothing productive has been added lately I'll close this thread.


Kiwi Flyer
SQ moderator