Thai Airways Royal Orchid Plus - Ramsey murder suspect on board TG flights in Business Class

It appears that suspect is now flying in a comfy C seat on TG nonstop flight BKK-LAX. Maybe this is his first trip in business class. :rolleyes:

http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/08/20/ramsey.arrest/index.html

I wonder

(1) who pays the airfare (must be one-way fare costing few thousands of dollars)

(2) if there are any FTers on that flight sitting in the next row. :(

That's ridiculous! He should be sitting in the last row of coach next to the bathroom... :mad:

It's probably that the law enforcement people escorting him didn't want to sit in economy.

However, I remember in the movie Black Rain they were all sitting in Economy - on NW no less !!! So much for the movies... :D

Maybe it's so those who accompany him won't be worn out by a long flight in coach. Thus they'll be better prepared to drag his arse around the airports when they're on land.

I know what a trip from the east coast to Western Europe in BC does to me. I can't imagine what a trip from Asia to the US would do to a person. Let alone in coach.
Rita

That's ridiculous! He should be sitting in the last row of coach next to the bathroom... :mad:

well, he had nice meals on board...

a glass of champagne from a flight attendant and clinked glasses with Spray, who sipped orange juice. Dinner on board, served on a starched white tablecloth with silverware, starting with a pate, then a green salad with walnut dressing, then fried king prawn with steamed rice and broccoli. He also had a beer ..

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/J/JONBENET_RAMSEY?SITE=NCKIN&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

and not hand-cuffed :td:

He may not be handcuffed, but he would have to be restrained in some way.

I am assuming they put him in the upper deck to have better control of him, as well as being better for his travel "companions". But to serve him champagne and the whole meal, that is ridiculous!

He may not be handcuffed, but he would have to be restrained in some way.

I am assuming they put him in the upper deck to have better control of him, as well as being better for his travel "companions". But to serve him champagne and the whole meal, that is ridiculous!

yeah. agree. it's almost like he is returning from a nice vacation in Thai with an upgrade to UD biz class!

Tax-payers dollars hard at work again. :mad:

pays to be a criminal huh? heck.. i'm not eating that nice here in the states let alone being a suspect in a child's murder.... oh wait... "alleged" suspect....

part I loved was the # of reporters and other personnel on board that flight.. between homeland security, marshalls, reporters, etc....

Tax-payers dollars hard at work again. :mad:

exactly. heads are going to roll when they land.

Does the Airbus A345 that he is flying on to LAX have a second floor (Like the Boeing 747)? It would be easier to control the situation and the curious in such a set up. I looked in seat guru and there is no information on Thai Airways.

The whole thing is a million dollars in free press for Thai Airways. Especially all the stuff about the wine and great food. Also the 60 inches of leg room will be great for him to sleep. He will need to be well rested in advance of all the questions they will ask him in Los Angeles.

Does the Airbus A345 that he is flying on to LAX have a second floor (Like the Boeing 747)? It would be easier to control the situation and the curious in such a set up. I looked in seat guru and there is no information on Thai Airways.

The whole thing is a million dollars in free press for Thai Airways. Especially all the stuff about the wine and great food. Also the 60 inches of leg room will be great for him to sleep. He will need to be well rested in advance of all the questions they will ask him in Los Angeles.

No, the A345 does not have an upper deck. One passenger deck only.

Agree that TG is getting lots of good press today.

yeah. agree. it's almost like he is returning from a nice vacation in Thai with an upgrade to UD biz class!

Seeing as the flight's on an Airbus A340, I highly doubt it will be Upper Deck.

Still, I think it's ridiculous to put him in Business, though I could (possibly) understand it if Coach had been sold out. Lots of traffic on these routes right now.

Seeing as the flight's on an Airbus A340, I highly doubt it will be Upper Deck.

Still, I think it's ridiculous to put him in Business, though I could (possibly) understand it if Coach had been sold out. Lots of traffic on these routes right now.
pretty sure the double deck configuration on airbuses doesnt exist... of course they are coming out with the new a360 which will have this feature.

Perhaps it was TG who has op-upped the group as Y is probably already quite fully booked and they don't want to cause too much commotion for the other pax?

But then, from what I heard, sometimes when people get deported (especially dangerous criminals) they sometimes get escorted in private jets. However in this case, it might have probably actually been cheaper to fly them in Business Class on TG.

Business Class tickets out of Thailand also tend to be cheaper.

Gee, I wonder what would happen if I get my travel agent to put "SSR DEPA or SSR DEPU" in my PNR .... :D

the explanation is much simpler, ie. a full fare ticket in Y, which is normally needed for fast extradictions, costs as much as BC

Interesting, I heard on Fox News earlier that he was on the upper deck, so I went to their story and could not find any mention of that. Perhaps they had incorrect information from their photographer.

I did, however, like this quote:
.

"It seems odd to me. If there is an arrest warrant issued, he ought to be under arrest," said former Adams County District Attorney Bob Grant, who was involved in the Ramsey investigation. "It is very strange. Whoever is in control of him ought to make sure he isn't doing things like drinking champagne."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,209481,00.html

A little more about why he might be in Business: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=2335749&page=2

Other experts called the royal treatment a brilliant strategy.

If Karr says something incriminating that is challenged in court, the investigator who was sitting next to him simply says he was never in my custody, said Denver attorney Larry Pozner, past president of the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

"There is always a reason when the unusual happens," Pozner said.

Also, is he actually under arrest? I believe he is being deported, not necessarially under arrest. There was no need for extradition as Thailand just deported him.

I believe airlines also have rules about prisoners being handcuffed - they may not allow it. I think I even read this in NWA's contract of carriage.

I've been on flights where prisoners were handcuffed; however it may vary from airline to airline.

hi,

you are all thinking that this guy is guilty.
but there were news that he might not be the murder.

until he is condemned, we cant say anything.
and a business class ticket is cheaper than fullfare Eco and even oneway it is around 1500USD which should be OK. and as the money was paid, even he might be a murder, why shouldnt he drink his last champagne.
why do you care?

if the court decides he is guiltyly than he will go to prison and wont have champagne for a long long time.

and even if he got the miles for this flight, he wont be able to use them as they might expire while he is in prison , so who cares

dp

Actually, I don't think he's guilty - at least of this crime; however I do question the privileged treatment he is receiving.

Yeah, what's up w/that? He should occupy the baggage compartment.

A full-fare economy one-way ticket BKK to LAX is 72,290 Thai Baht (1924 USD) if booked online with Thai Airways, but I couldn't find any direct flights showing seats available for the next month. Business class was available on many days but not economy. This is the end of the summer vacation period for many in the U.S. and so likely they had no choice. If he's flying business class, no reason to treat him any differently than the other business class passengers. Any passengers flying in business class should be served business class meals and drinks. It'll be a sad day when airline employees start trying to judge a person's character and refuse to serve them what was paid for because they think they might be guiilty of something.

[QUOTE=tev9999]A little more about why he might be in Business: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=2335749&page=2

Other experts called the royal treatment a brilliant strategy.

If Karr says something incriminating that is challenged in court, the investigator who was sitting next to him simply says he was never in my custody, said Denver attorney Larry Pozner, past president of the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

"There is always a reason when the unusual happens," Pozner said.

Pamper the guy and he is less likely to become aggitated during transit. Give him a few drinks and get him to open up and start talking. He may reveal information that confirms that he is or is not the killer.

About an hour ago, CNN aired a blurb about the flight. One of their reporters was on the flight and being interviewed by the anchorwoman via the satellite phone. The anchorwoman asked about the treatment of the suspect and mentioned the stories of him being wined and dined on the flight.

The reporter was also sitting in the same class and he disputed the story. From the tone of his voice, the meal was nothing to brag about. Prawns were served - two of them to be exact. And the reporter said that the suspect did not drink champagne on the flight.

Also, the reporter said that the suspect could not be handcuffed due to Thai Airways rules.

I'm not surprised at the inaccurate reporting of this event. It's something we've seen time and time again in this tragic story.

This is great exposure for TG, just watching live on CNN the plane waiting for a tow to the gate.

This is great exposure for TG, just watching live on CNN the plane waiting for a tow to the gate.

Perhaps TG upgraded them just for the publicity?

What if it turns out that the guy had absolutely nothing to do with the murder? Does the DHS or the Boulder PD send him a bill for the business class ticket from Bangkok to LAX? :mad:

On the other hand, if the guy really did commit the murder, he's going to be really popular in prison. I'll bet other inmates will be fighting over him.(one way or another...)

I agree with the comments about serving him booze on the plane. Guilty or not guilty, he was in custody. Any person in custody should not be served alcohol. Period.

I haven't read yesterday or today's local papers but I was under the impression that he was being deported by the Thai government for visa violations, rather than extradited. AFAIK, he was not under arrest, at least until he cleared U.S. Immigration? I assume the Thai governement chose, and arranged (i.e paid for) the mode of transport (day/date/flight/class of service)? There were plenty of other options, UA or NW (talk about cruel and unusual punishment ;) ) but I again assume the Thai government officials chose to transport him on TG for any number of reasons.

Actually it was interesting... Was watching Fox News Sunday and at 12:59p they had a cameraman do an in-flight report with the SATCOM phone about the suspect one row in front of him.

Apparently he was laughing while watching AVOD (seeing MI:2), he had a few beers, was chatting with the ADA, air marshals, FA's, etc. All said, it seems he had a lovely time. Best part was when the cameraman was talking about the luxuries on this "Thai Airways Jet." Perhaps Thai upgraded the whole lot of them (reporters, felons, et al) to get a few good PR moves.

This will be like the Lindbergh baby trial all over again :rolleyes:

This will be like the Lindbergh baby trial all over again :rolleyes:

It struck me as quite a lot like the storyline of the Cole Porter musical "Anything Goes." A guy is mistakenly accused of being Public Enemy Number One while onboard an oceanliner going, I believe, from the UK to the US. The passengers and crew all think this is terribly grand and exciting, so they fete him all the way over. He winds up having to convince the woman he's after (the star of the show who sings the title song) that he's really not Public Enemy Number One.

It struck me as quite a lot like the storyline of the Cole Porter musical "Anything Goes." A guy is mistakenly accused of being Public Enemy Number One while onboard an oceanliner going, I believe, from the UK to the US. The passengers and crew all think this is terribly grand and exciting, so they fete him all the way over. He winds up having to convince the woman he's after (the star of the show who sings the title song) that he's really not Public Enemy Number One.

I actually made the same comment to friends yesterday at brunch.

Great minds (or SQ lovers?) think alike!

So how were we able to see the cell phone pix and/or get report from the satellite phone? Isn't that one of those electronic devices that aren't supposed to be used in flight?

So how were we able to see the cell phone pix and/or get report from the satellite phone? Isn't that one of those electronic devices that aren't supposed to be used in flight?

Not sure about the Pix (perhaps they were taken before takeoff) but the FNC reporter said he was using an in seat SATCOM phone. SATCOM refers to the plethora of options for satellite telephony (Iridium, Inmarsat, etc.)

The flight was delayed about an hour and was late in Los Angeles. Poor advertisement for Thai Airlines. You would think that with the world watching them Thai Airlines would see that the flight left on time.

Also I was surprised that the press would be given free rein and allowed to photograph and videotape other passengers on the flight. If I was paying for a Business Class Ticket on an overseas flight I would want and demand peace and quiet. They should compensate the other passengers.

I haven't read yesterday or today's local papers but I was under the impression that he was being deported by the Thai government for visa violations, rather than extradited. AFAIK, he was not under arrest, at least until he cleared U.S. Immigration? I assume the Thai governement chose, and arranged (i.e paid for) the mode of transport (day/date/flight/class of service)? There were plenty of other options, UA or NW (talk about cruel and unusual punishment ;) ) but I again assume the Thai government officials chose to transport him on TG for any number of reasons.

I wonder if he entered his MP number on this TG flight and earned any miles? :confused:

The flight was delayed about an hour and was late in Los Angeles. Poor advertisement for Thai Airlines. You would think that with the world watching them Thai Airlines would see that the flight left on time.
Something tells me that there's a good chance that the delay was attributable at least in the part to the press ballyhoo surrounding Karr. I truly doubt that anyone following the story would think "Oh, my! The 15-hour Thai Air flight carrying the alleged murderer left an hour late! No way am I ever going to fly Thai Air!" And if some nimrod actually does, I sez the hell with 'em. ;)

yeah. agree. it's almost like he is returning from a nice vacation in Thai with an upgrade to UD biz class!

All these posts asserting that it is inappropriate for him to fly business class and that "heads will roll" when he returns are utterly ridiculous. From a security perspective, it is much more difficult to keep a suspect isolated from others in coach (which tends to me more crowded than business) than in the last row of business. The business class cabin has far fewer seats and fewer passengers surrounding him, staring at him, etc. Other passengers could prove to be a security hazard if they try to dispense some vigilante justice. Also, the last row of business on the 345 has no traffic because there are no lavs behind it and no pax crossing up from coach.

If he had been in coach, there would have been pax walking by constantly, creating more work for his security team on the 15 hour flight. He needed to be monitored with the door open while using the lav - if in coach, they would have had to seal off a lav at times when there probably was a line to use the lavs in the first place. Never mind the fact that the security team should have been allowed in business class anyway to remain somewhat fit and alert during the flight.

In addition, according to several law enforcement officials interviewed on various news networks, it is common practice for extradited criminals to be escorted to their destination in first or business class. So he got to eat the business class meal - big deal. I have no sympathy for this individual but should they have starved him the whole flight or given him a coach meal?

exactly. heads are going to roll when they land.

I doubt anyone's head will roll for allowing him to fly business class. US government personnel (i.e., his escorts) are allowed to fly business class for flights over 12 hours, so why shouldn't they be permitted to escort him in business class. Also see my other post above re security considerations.

I agree with the comments about serving him booze on the plane. Guilty or not guilty, he was in custody. Any person in custody should not be served alcohol. Period.

Actually, he wasn't technically in custody. He was in the custody of Thai officials while in Thailand but he was not under arrest for the alleged US crimes at the time he boarded the aircraft and during the flight.

I doubt anyone's head will roll for allowing him to fly business class. US government personnel (i.e., his escorts) are allowed to fly business class for flights over 12 hours, so why shouldn't they be permitted to escort him in business class. Also see my other post above re security considerations.

AFAIK - very few US governmetn officials are actually allowed to fly business under any circumstances - no matter the flight length. There's a few exceptions (e.g. department of defence top brass).

As to this case - as a co-passenger I would be as far removed from this guy as possible - for that reason I'd prefer if they put him in C - even if I were flying Y.

I still can't figure out if the guy was under arrest during the flight. The media don't seem to know and the police aren't saying anything. If so, he should have been in handcuffs for the duration of the flight. (and any person under police custody should not have been given alcohol)

Someone suggested that the alcohol was to relax him so he would speak more freely about the case. Yeah, right... I just hope his public defender lawyers don't use this during the trial.

AFAIK - very few US governmetn officials are actually allowed to fly business under any circumstances - no matter the flight length. There's a few exceptions (e.g. department of defence top brass).

This is incorrect. Employees of certain government agencies are permitted to fly business class on a Contract Carrier if the total non-stop flight time from the US to their post of duty is 12 hours or more irrespective of whether a nonstop flight exists, i.e., you can't route Washington to London via five different cities in order to qualify for business class. But you can (IIRC) depart from any US city. For example, if a State Department official needed to report for duty at the embassy in Tokyo and was on duty in Los Angeles for some reason, they would not be able to fly business class, as the non-stop flying time is under 12 hours. But if they left from New York or Washington, they would be permitted to fly business class, as the non-stop flying time exceeds 12 hours. Another general example is if an employee was based in Washington and had to report for duty in Athens. There are no Washington to Athens non-stops, but if there were, the flight time would be under 12 hours. Because the employee would have to connect somewhere in Europe, the trip would probably take 16-18 hours, but because the non-stop flight duration would be under 12 hours, the employee could not fly business class.

The majority of government officials who take advantage of this program are State Department officials of all levels, including DSS, not just high-level employees - low-level diplomats, DSS agents, etc., are the most frequent beneficiaries of this policy. A few months ago, my colleague flew in UA C FRA-IAD next to a mid-level State Department official on her way back to DC from Iraq on a paid government C fare.

And, for those of you worrying about wasting taxpayer dollars, the Contract Carrier rates on international routes are far less than what a non-government employee would pay for a full Y fare.

I still can't figure out if the guy was under arrest during the flight. The media don't seem to know and the police aren't saying anything. If so, he should have been in handcuffs for the duration of the flight.

As mentioned elsewhere in this thread, it is against Thai Airways policy to have handcuffed passengers.

I still can't figure out if the guy was under arrest during the flight. The media don't seem to know and the police aren't saying anything. If so, he should have been in handcuffs for the duration of the flight. (and any person under police custody should not have been given alcohol)

Someone suggested that the alcohol was to relax him so he would speak more freely about the case. Yeah, right... I just hope his public defender lawyers don't use this during the trial.

He was not under arrest during the flight. He was in the process of being deported from Thailand because his passport was cancelled by the US.

This is incorrect. Employees of certain government agencies are permitted to fly business class on a Contract Carrier if the total non-stop flight time from the US to their post of duty is 12 hours or more irrespective of whether a nonstop flight exists, i.e., you can't route Washington to London via five different cities in order to qualify for business class. But you can (IIRC) depart from any US city. For example, if a State Department official needed to report for duty at the embassy in Tokyo and was on duty in Los Angeles for some reason, they would not be able to fly business class, as the non-stop flying time is under 12 hours. But if they left from New York or Washington, they would be permitted to fly business class, as the non-stop flying time exceeds 12 hours. Another general example is if an employee was based in Washington and had to report for duty in Athens. There are no Washington to Athens non-stops, but if there were, the flight time would be under 12 hours. Because the employee would have to connect somewhere in Europe, the trip would probably take 16-18 hours, but because the non-stop flight duration would be under 12 hours, the employee could not fly business class.

The majority of government officials who take advantage of this program are State Department officials of all levels, including DSS, not just high-level employees - low-level diplomats, DSS agents, etc., are the most frequent beneficiaries of this policy. A few months ago, my colleague flew in UA C FRA-IAD next to a mid-level State Department official on her way back to DC from Iraq on a paid government C fare.

And, for those of you worrying about wasting taxpayer dollars, the Contract Carrier rates on international routes are far less than what a non-government employee would pay for a full Y fare.

This is the US Government regulation. In short, they force rest stops to ensure that almost everyone travels in economy. Exceptions are made for medical reasons. Besides, I've seen assistant secretaries forced to fly 14 hours plus in economy on government business.

...Travel in excess of 14 hours. Premium-class other than first-class airline accommodations may be authorized when travel is direct between authorized origin and destination points, and either the origin or destination point is outside the continental United States (CONUS), and the scheduled flight time (not including domestic layover time) is in excess of 14 hours. When this authority is exercised, an employee shall not be eligible for a rest stop en route or a rest period upon arrival at the duty site.

NOTE: A statement must be included on the NIH Form at Appendix 8 explaining the urgency of the mission that precludes the traveler from using coach class accommodations and taking a rest stop at an intermediate point. ("urgency" refers to the agency assignment and not personal reasons).

This is the US Government regulation. In short, they force rest stops to ensure that almost everyone travels in economy. Exceptions are made for medical reasons. Besides, I've seen assistant secretaries forced to fly 14 hours plus in economy on government business.

...Travel in excess of 14 hours. Premium-class other than first-class airline accommodations may be authorized when travel is direct between authorized origin and destination points, and either the origin or destination point is outside the continental United States (CONUS), and the scheduled flight time (not including domestic layover time) is in excess of 14 hours. When this authority is exercised, an employee shall not be eligible for a rest stop en route or a rest period upon arrival at the duty site.

NOTE: A statement must be included on the NIH Form at Appendix 8 explaining the urgency of the mission that precludes the traveler from using coach class accommodations and taking a rest stop at an intermediate point. ("urgency" refers to the agency assignment and not personal reasons).

Ok, it's 14 hours, not 12 hours, as I said earlier. I know several foreign service and DSS types who regularly fly paid C to duty posts in Asia, Africa, and the Gulf and I've never heard of them having a forced rest in order to fly coach. YMMV.

I still can't figure out if the guy was under arrest during the flight. The media don't seem to know and the police aren't saying anything. If so, he should have been in handcuffs for the duration of the flight. (and any person under police custody should not have been given alcohol)

Someone suggested that the alcohol was to relax him so he would speak more freely about the case. Yeah, right... I just hope his public defender lawyers don't use this during the trial.

I'm not a lawyer or judge, but...

He was not under arrest until arrival in LAX. He was arrested in LAX based on a warrant out of Colorado. They will now have to have an extradition hearing to be able to move him from CA to CO.

Think if you arrived in another country and were denied entry - lost passport, invalid visa, whatever. You would be deported, not necessarially arrested, and possibly escorted back to your home country.

As he was not under arrest or in custody, anything he said to anyone should be admissible. If he talked to a regular passenger, cell mate while detained, etc. they would be witnesses. Same for his "escorts". If I'm sitting on a plane tomorrow and tell the person next to me I robbed a bank, they can turn me in and I am pretty sure that would be admissible in court.

I'm guessing that if he had acted up, they could have quickly placed him in custody (including handcuffs) by any one of the government officials on board without much difficulty.

How many young U.S. soldiers have died in Iraq?
They all flew home in boxes. No business class seats.
No champange. No AVOD. No nothing.

Mr. Karr, guilty or not, came home in luxury. It was no
Singapore Airlines, but it was still nice.

Doesn't the US Air Force have regular military transport
flights out of Thailand? Why couldn't they arrange to
transport Mr. Karr on one of those flights?

I wonder what people will say if business and coach class
were both sold out and Mr. Karr and his 3 escorts have to
flying first class.(!)

Not as good as Singapore Airlines? The Thai class is "business-first". Singapore doesn't offer that transpacific, right? So what are you comparing it to? Thai Airways is as good or better than Singapore, and is a lot more generous in upgrades. I wonder if Mr. Karr will get frequent flyer miles for the flight. As far as I can tell, he should get them. And to those who earlier suggested he not receive such nice treatment inflight, have you thought about the alternatives? Like chartering a prison flight for maybe $200,000 charged to the taxpayers? Or putting him in irons and handcuffs, making other paying passengers feel uncomfortable? From what I could tell, his behavior on the flight, and in Thai custody was well within reason. And remember, he wasn't charged with anything, and is supposedly innocent, until proven guilty, right? He may be delusional and he may be a nut-case, but he's not been proven to be any of those things... yet.

Regardless, I feel Thai Airways got a lot of good free publicity for their nonstop transpacific services, which are first rate. I'm quite certain a lot of travelers/potential travelers reaction to the airline aspect of this story is, "gee, I didn't know you could fly nonstop to Thailand from L.A., and now maybe I'll go..." Publicity like that is worth millions.

And i'm not sure if someone earlier addressed this, but I think he was put in the last row of business-first, because there is a wall directly behind him, and putting him in the corner window seat isolates him a bit from others, like if someone wanted to attack him from behind. Looking at Thai's seating chart, that was clearly the safest seat to transport the guy in.

I hope the guy gets a fair trial, and I hope the family can get some peace from this.

Ok, it's 14 hours, not 12 hours, as I said earlier. I know several foreign service and DSS types who regularly fly paid C to duty posts in Asia, Africa, and the Gulf and I've never heard of them having a forced rest in order to fly coach. YMMV.

It liekly depends on who you are and where you work on how far they take this policy. It's the US government after all!

Regardless, I feel Thai Airways got a lot of good free publicity for their nonstop transpacific services, which are first rate. I'm quite certain a lot of travelers/potential travelers reaction to the airline aspect of this story is, "gee, I didn't know you could fly nonstop to Thailand from L.A., and now maybe I'll go..." Publicity like that is worth millions.Indeed. The comments I was hearing yesterday from my acquaintances was not, "Gee, the flight arrived an hour late. I would never fly Thai Air." It was the reverse - most were quite impressed with their first glimpse of Royal Silk. The news media going on and on about champagne and opulent meals didn't hurt either. ;)

Not as good as Singapore Airlines? The Thai class is "business-first". Singapore doesn't offer that transpacific, right? So what are you comparing it to? Thai Airways is as good or better than Singapore, and is a lot more generous in upgrades. I wonder if Mr. Karr will get frequent flyer miles for the flight. As far as I can tell, he should get them. And to those who earlier suggested he not receive such nice treatment inflight, have you thought about the alternatives? Like chartering a prison flight for maybe $200,000 charged to the taxpayers? Or putting him in irons and handcuffs, making other paying passengers feel uncomfortable? From what I could tell, his behavior on the flight, and in Thai custody was well within reason. And remember, he wasn't charged with anything, and is supposedly innocent, until proven guilty, right? He may be delusional and he may be a nut-case, but he's not been proven to be any of those things... yet.

Regardless, I feel Thai Airways got a lot of good free publicity for their nonstop transpacific services, which are first rate. I'm quite certain a lot of travelers/potential travelers reaction to the airline aspect of this story is, "gee, I didn't know you could fly nonstop to Thailand from L.A., and now maybe I'll go..." Publicity like that is worth millions.

And i'm not sure if someone earlier addressed this, but I think he was put in the last row of business-first, because there is a wall directly behind him, and putting him in the corner window seat isolates him a bit from others, like if someone wanted to attack him from behind. Looking at Thai's seating chart, that was clearly the safest seat to transport the guy in.

I hope the guy gets a fair trial, and I hope the family can get some peace from this.

I almost never paid any attention to TG.

Now it seems that it's nice to fly LAX to BKK nonstop. Besides, TG miles earned seem count towards UA EQM.

What's the normal or promotional TG business class fare on LAX-BKK (not the other way around)? :confused:

$2,500? :confused:

On www.thaiairwaysusa.com the current promotion is $3,535 for each passenger. This is a promotion fare and 2 passengers must fly together.

http://www.thaiairwaysusa.com/EN/SuperDeals/SuperDeals3.aspx

The Thai class is "business-first". Singapore doesn't offer that transpacific, right?

:confused:

I'm just surprised they didn't fly him on a US carrier....

Just curious, with all of the media attention on the food served on the flight, could someone post a recent menu for the BKK-LAX flight on TG.

I'm just surprised they didn't fly him on a US carrier....

I'm not positive about this, but I think that because he was being deported by Thailand, Thailand may have been picking up part or all of the tab. Also, I'm sure they wanted to avoid the security issues and media circus involved with connecting at other airports that would have been required had he taken NW or UA.

Those seats looked really narrow and uncomfortable to me. Has anyone had experience on a Thai Airbus like the one Karr flew on? I asked this question in OMNI, but didn't get an answer.

sushibear, you would love the seats!!
Your TV needs adjusting or updating to one of those flat screen models which I also must get one day. There is plenty of room, the cabin is 2/2/2 and unless your travelling companion is attractive, there is no reason nor obligation to acknowledge their existence. I sleep from MEL to BKK with no problem at all, so what's that, leave 0015am, decline dinner, asleep by 0100 and they wake me at 0830 (0530bkk time). On a longer flight, I could easily sleep longer and enjoy the beautiful food and wine that TG spoil us with, regards if you want to see the menus just search TG menus and there are page after page of them.

Moderator. This thread is kinda ambling away from a reasonable discussion on the merits of TG direct flight to US, with a number of posts on US Govt travel policy and the case surrounding the return of the individual for charges.

I suggest that this is not particularly relevant as a FT topic on the merits of TG ROP.

Perhaps its time to close this thread. Those wishing to talk abou the case or US Govt travel policy have plenty of more relevant locations (within FT or elsewhere). Just MHO.....

sushibear - to respond, the seats are great. have a search on www.airliners.net for Airbus A340-600, Thai Aiways and Cabin Views.

TK

I'm glad to know they are more comfortable than they looked on the newscasts. I couldn't find an Airbus A340-500, but then I never have much luck searching Airliners.net. On the news they looked like they might be only 18-19" wide. It even looked narrow for John Karr. I have a friend who is trying to talk me into going to Thailand and Singapore in March, but I'm only going if I can find a decent J seat at a price I can afford.

I'm glad to know they are more comfortable than they looked on the newscasts. I couldn't find an Airbus A340-500, but then I never have much luck searching Airliners.net. On the news they looked like they might be only 18-19" wide. It even looked narrow for John Karr. I have a friend who is trying to talk me into going to Thailand and Singapore in March, but I'm only going if I can find a decent J seat at a price I can afford.
I would have to agree with you that the Business class seats appeared to be less than spacious, even for the somewhat thin guy you referred to.

Regards
LH

here is the link - it took me 42 seconds to search and get the result... :cool:

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/0931932/M/

I'm just surprised they didn't fly him on a US carrier....

There are no US carriers that fly non-stop between Thailand and the US.

here is the link - it took me 42 seconds to search and get the result... :cool:

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/0931932/M/

Thanks. I could have looked for 42 minutes and still not found it. I play the piano pretty well, though. :)

Just a reference point - three bankers from the UK were extradited to the US last month as part of the Enron collapse. They all got to experience the benefits of Continental's Economy class. Centre seats right at the back, each flanked by a pair of air marshals.

Those seats looked really narrow and uncomfortable to me.
Here is a link (http://www.thaiair.com/Travel_Destination_Information/announce/thai_to_nyc.htm?GXHC_GX_jst=6954516b62456164&GXHC_JSESSIONID=b727b0963067d191&) specifically showing the Royal Silk seating on the A340-500.

The seat is about 22 inches wide IIRC. The side armrest also flush down in recline mode so the "bed" width is not a problem at all.

The seat is about 22 inches wide IIRC. The side armrest also flush down in recline mode so the "bed" width is not a problem at all.

Plus, the seats appear to be separated a bit by a wide armrest.

Here is a link (http://www.thaiair.com/Travel_Destination_Information/announce/thai_to_nyc.htm?GXHC_GX_jst=6954516b62456164&GXHC_JSESSIONID=b727b0963067d191&) specifically showing the Royal Silk seating on the A340-500.

Great link. It's the only pic I've seen whose cabin looks/is the same as the one on the news. The other info on the Royal Silk class was interesting as well.

Apparently business class isn't good enough for Mr. Karr.... :)

Now the State of Colorado is flying him back in a private turbo-prop plane. (in handcuffs) :D

Apparently business class isn't good enough for Mr. Karr.... :)

Now the State of Colorado is flying him back in a private turbo-prop plane. (in handcuffs) :D

hmm how much would that cost? :confused: :confused:

This is the US Government regulation. In short, they force rest stops to ensure that almost everyone travels in economy. Exceptions are made for medical reasons. Besides, I've seen assistant secretaries forced to fly 14 hours plus in economy on government business.

...Travel in excess of 14 hours. Premium-class other than first-class airline accommodations may be authorized when travel is direct between authorized origin and destination points, and either the origin or destination point is outside the continental United States (CONUS), and the scheduled flight time (not including domestic layover time) is in excess of 14 hours. When this authority is exercised, an employee shall not be eligible for a rest stop en route or a rest period upon arrival at the duty site.

NOTE: A statement must be included on the NIH Form at Appendix 8 explaining the urgency of the mission that precludes the traveler from using coach class accommodations and taking a rest stop at an intermediate point. ("urgency" refers to the agency assignment and not personal reasons).

And there are various federal govt. agencies exempted from this rule.

Alas... the guy's DNA doesn't match. :cool:

Case dismissed. He got a free biz class flight and tons of attention. :mad: :mad:

Alas... the guy's DNA doesn't match. :cool:

Case dismissed. He got a free biz class flight and tons of attention. :mad: :mad:

I just hope the guy doesn't come to this forum and
start a post like "How I Flew Business Class for Nothing"............................................. :(

So now he'll be able to use his miles from the flight ...

The lengths some people go to become a Gold card holder - perhaps he's an FT member