Travel Technology - 3G and Japan Mobile

I've been hearing conflicting stories so just wanted to ask the gurus here...

salesperson from a store here in HK says that with a 3G phone (Nokia 6280 I think) I can use it to make calls in Japan. Now I've asked 3 others and 2 say yes and 2 no.

what's the real scoop.

I'm actually looking for a quad band with 3G.

I've been hearing conflicting stories so just wanted to ask the gurus here...

salesperson from a store here in HK says that with a 3G phone (Nokia 6280 I think) I can use it to make calls in Japan. Now I've asked 3 others and 2 say yes and 2 no.

what's the real scoop.

I'm actually looking for a quad band with 3G.

Well you've got a few points that you need to consider. The Nokia 6280 is sold in two ways, either network locked - or not network locked. Personally, I work for a 3G network that locks the 6280, and I know that our customers are able to use the handset while Internationally Roaming in Japan. They can't go out and buy a DoCoMo USIM and stick it in the handset, because it's locked, but using the handset in Japan is no problems.

The 6280 works on GSM 900/1800/1900 and WCDMA 2100 networks. I don't know which network you want to use when in Japan, but we let our customers either connect to Vodafone KK (a 2100MHz network) or DoCoMo (a 2100MHz network).

So basically, if you're roaming you won't have a problem. If your handset is locked, contact your provider for information on Internatioanl Roaming. I don't know how you'll go with getting a BYO SIM in Japan, but if your handset is unlocked your handset does operate at the required frequencies therefore there should be no problems.

I think the salesman means you can roam on Japan's WCDMA networks with a UMTS handset. The three largest carriers in HK -- CSL (http://1010.hkcsl.com/jsp/per_globalroaming/per_globalroaming_japan_korea_americas.jsp?lang=en g&nodeid=1&childnodeid=14), SmarTone (http://smartone.com.hk/jsp/mobile/going_abroad/roaming/english/3g.jsp) and 3-3G (http://www.three.com.hk/website/template?pageid=36200&lang=eng) -- all have 3G roaming agreements with DoCoMo and Vodafone. As far as I know, Japanese carriers don't sell U-SIM to use in your foreign handsets.

On an unrelated note, I don't put much stock in HK salespeople/promoters' words. Don't rely on them to inform you of the goods and services, or you may be taken for a ride. Just my personal experience.

I've roamed using an unlocked CSL Ericsson K600i and SIM. I had no trouble using it in Tokyo, can't vouch for other areas but doubt it'd be a problem so long as UMTS coverage exists. The 6280 will work just fine so long as your SIM allows international roaming. Unlike Japan's other mobile networks, their UMTS is standard.

thanks for the info. Roaming is fine for my needs. Now if a quad band 3G phone can be released... I really need the 850 frequency but want to pick up a phone while I'm here in HK.

Anyone know when the US will have 3G and what WCDMA frequency will it use?

Anyone know when the US will have 3G and what WCDMA frequency will it use?
That is the $64K question. I am waiting, too. It seems 3G is something that the US Carriers only marginally consider (as of now, of course). I have been hoping that the HTC manufacturer would realease their MDA PRO to Tmobile which has 3G capability, but sadly they (Tmobile, that is) went with the HTC's MDA Vario (i.e. no 3g). As a result, I am hanging onto my current cell phone with bated breath.....

Just to loop back to my original post, I was able to pick up a Nokia N80. Couldn't wait for the HTC Tytn but was trying to decide between the N80 slider or N73 candy bar....

anyone know if/when Sony Ericsson will release a quad GSM + UMTS phone?

I've been hearing conflicting stories so just wanted to ask the gurus here...

salesperson from a store here in HK says that with a 3G phone (Nokia 6280 I think) I can use it to make calls in Japan. Now I've asked 3 others and 2 say yes and 2 no.

what's the real scoop.

I'm actually looking for a quad band with 3G.
A quad-band what protocol with 3G???

Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong, but based on everything I've read:

Japan uses only CDMA.

US uses both CDMA (Verizon and Sprint) and GSM (Cingular and T-Mobile).

Most of the rest of the world (including all of Europe) uses GSM only.

A GSM phone, no matter how many zillions of bands it has, no matter how many SIM cards you get, will not work on a CDMA network. (Nor vice versa.)

If it's correct that Japan only has CDMA networks, then a GSM phone, no matter how many zillions of bands it has, no matter how many SIM cards you get, will not work in Japan, not because the band is wrong, but because the basic transmission protocol is wrong.

(The difference betewen GSM and CDMA is as important as, in broadcast, the difference between AM and FM. You can't pick up AM stations on an FM-only radio not just because the can't tune the frequency but because the signal is sent in a way they can't decode. Same for GSM and CDMA: they may or may not overlap on bands, but they can't decode each others' signals.)

Japan uses 3G, otherwise known as W-CDMA or UMTS. It's the same technology used for 3G in the GSM world (GSM itself is a 2G TDMA system). A 3G phone can generally fall back to GSM (which bands depend on the phone). With most GSM service providers, you can stick your SIM in a (unlocked) 3G phone and roam in Japan. No service provider in the US uses 3G (though some have high speed data services, which are the main claimed benefit of 3G).

Japan uses 3G, otherwise known as W-CDMA or UMTS. It's the same technology used for 3G in the GSM world (GSM itself is a 2G TDMA system). A 3G phone can generally fall back to GSM (which bands depend on the phone). With most GSM service providers, you can stick your SIM in a (unlocked) 3G phone and roam in Japan. No service provider in the US uses 3G (though some have high speed data services, which are the main claimed benefit of 3G).Now I'm very confused. What exactly do you mean by 3G? Sprint claimed a couple years ago that their first phones that had video features were 3G! (Their critics countered that it was 2.5G at best!) Everyone and their brother is using the term "3G" in a different way! So how do you tell which phones mean 3G in the way you mean and which mean 3G in the "abused" way (to mean nothing more than higher data speed)? (The fact that you say there's no 3G in the US but thousands of aritcles in the US press claimed there was a year or more ago implies that there's no one controlling the use of that term.)

And also, so you're saying that once/if US goes "true 3G" (but iwll they be able to use the term 3G in the US if it's already been abused to mean something else before?) then Cingular and Verizon will be compatible??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3G

and

http://asia.cnet.com/reviews/handphones/0,39001719,39242481,00.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3GIf I read that correctly, what you need for the world is a combination 3G/GSM phone, not just a 3G phone, right?

Since Japan didn't use GSM, presumably there might be phones in Japan which are combination 3G/2G but don't support GSM.

That's what was confusing me. People in this thread were talking about 3G as if it automatically includes GSM, whereas I'm not sure why that would universally be the case.

Second, I'm still confused about the relationship between "true 3G" and the "3Gish" ("2.5G"/"2.75G" per that wiki site!) stuff in the US. Are there phones that do both "true 3G" when you're in a country such as Japan and also do the "non true 3G" higher-speed data on a network such as Cingular in the US? Or only phones that do "true 3G" and drop back to regular 2G GSM elsewhere?

If I read that correctly, what you need for the world is a combination 3G/GSM phone, not just a 3G phone, right?

Since Japan didn't use GSM, presumably there might be phones in Japan which are combination 3G/2G but don't support GSM.

That's what was confusing me. People in this thread were talking about 3G as if it automatically includes GSM, whereas I'm not sure why that would universally be the case.

Second, I'm still confused about the relationship between "true 3G" and the "3Gish" ("2.5G"/"2.75G" per that wiki site!) stuff in the US. Are there phones that do both "true 3G" when you're in a country such as Japan and also do the "non true 3G" higher-speed data on a network such as Cingular in the US? Or only phones that do "true 3G" and drop back to regular 2G GSM elsewhere?


Sure my Nokia N80 will do 3G (UMTS) on 2100MHz in Japan, Asia, etc... and I use the quadband GSM on 850/1900 and access data with an 'EDGE' connection in the US. I'm on Cingular Blue in the US.

Of course 3G will be 1900 in the US :-/ Why do we always have to be different.