Online Travel Booking and Bidding Agencies - To moderator

Why does this forum continue to have harangues against biddingfortravel.com? :mad:

I use BFT several times a year to bid on PL for foreign hotels and I find the site to be invaluable. The site probably saves me a thousand dollars last year. :) I post my results on the site and to thank BFT I bid through Amazing-Bargains.com. :)

I also check betterbidding for PL, but find it to be virtually useless for foreign hotels. However if they have pertinant hotel info, I use it.

I don't understand why this forum continues to allow complaints about being banned by BFT, etc. :( Apparently the most recent complaint is that they can't post to the site if they have elsewhere posted negative comments about the site.

THIS DOES NOT AFFECT THE QUALITY OF INFORMATION ON THE SITE.

Lets move on and restrict discussions about BFT to the quality and usefulness of the information. :)

Everyone is free to use or not use the info on BFT.

Why does this forum continue to have harangues against biddingfortravel.com? :mad:

I use BFT several times a year to bid on PL for foreign hotels and I find the site to be invaluable. The site probably saves me a thousand dollars last year. :) I post my results on the site and to thank BFT I bid through Amazing-Bargains.com. :)

I also check betterbidding for PL, but find it to be virtually useless for foreign hotels. However if they have pertinant hotel info, I use it.

I don't understand why this forum continues to allow complaints about being banned by BFT, etc. :( Apparently the most recent complaint is that they can't post to the site if they have elsewhere posted negative comments about the site.

THIS DOES NOT AFFECT THE QUALITY OF INFORMATION ON THE SITE.

Lets move on and restrict discussions about BFT to the quality and usefulness of the information. :)

Everyone is free to use or not use the info on BFT.

Was there any need to start a new thread on this when there is an on-going thread on BFT?

Everyone is free to use or not use the info on BFT.

Judging by the weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth exhibited by some in this forum, you would think people were being forced to use BFT with guns at their backs.

Judging by the weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth exhibited by some in this forum, you would think people were being forced to post on FT with guns at their backs.

Don't like the thread? Skip it.

Think the thread doesn't belong on FT? Use the "report post" button.

Don't like the thread? Skip it.

Irony alert.

Irony alert.

Not really. Sheryl really does manage to screw up the user experience for the majority of people here who have tried BFT.

Not really. Sheryl really does manage to screw up the user experience for the majority of people here who have tried BFT.

You don't need to tell me. The fact that this forum is an online support group for those whose Internet lives have been ruined by her website and moderation is proof of her omnipotence. :rolleyes:

You don't need to tell me. The fact that this forum is an online support group for those whose Internet lives have been ruined by her website and moderation is proof of her omnipotence. :rolleyes:

I think you'll find it's little more than disbelief that someone would choose to cut off contributors because they failed to follow protocol to the absolute letter.

As to your comment :rolleyes:

One of the major differences in FT and BFT, is that it allows threads like this. Can you imagine a suggestion like this thread's title being posted at BFT?
rogodwin,I welcome your questions and opinions.
Let me attempt to respond:

Why does this forum continue to have harangues against biddingfortravel.com?
If you have read the many posts over a considerable amount of time, I think you will find the obvious answer. Last year you called Sharper Image a cheater, but your post was allowed to remain open. I assume that you felt like sharing how a company "let you down". Others here, feel like sharing the same feelings. You also felt like sharing it (at least I assume) so you could warn others. The same goes here.


I use BFT several times a year to bid on PL for foreign hotels and I find the site to be invaluable. The site probably saves me a thousand dollars last year. I post my results on the site and to thank BFT I bid through Amazing-Bargains.com.
"No one disputes that BFT is a valuable help in saving money. I might add ,if you forgot to I post my results on the site and to thank BFT I bid through Amazing-Bargains.com." you might be joining in with the "I've been banned" crowd.


"I also check betterbidding for PL, but find it to be virtually useless for foreign hotels. However if they have pertinent hotel info, I use it
I'm sure that you aren't implying that BetterBidding hasn't been a value to you. Last year you posted here I am a very happy user of BiddingForTravel.com. I have very successfully used their information many times to get great Priceline hotel prices. "
I think most agree that BB hasn't YET surpassed BFT as the leading Priceline aid, but it's definitely getting closer.


"I don't understand why this forum continues to allow complaints about being banned by BFT, etc. Apparently the most recent complaint is that they can't post to the site if they have elsewhere posted negative comments about the site."
If you really think that I should not "allow complaints" here, I think I understand why you have no problem with BFT. Don't you think that it's worth sharing that posting anything negative against BFT leads to a ban is important to know? What if AA suddenly took away your status because of public negative statements you made at FT? Would this be worth sharing?


"THIS DOES NOT AFFECT THE QUALITY OF INFORMATION ON THE SITE."
I don't want to SHOUT back, but I respectfully disagree. Just count how many people have said that they will not post at BFT again. That website is worthless without good people willing to voluntarily share their experiences. If you travel to other forums like Fodor's and even Cruise Critic, you'll read where people have said that they would never post at BFT because they were treated so rudely. All these people represent (IMHO) a larger group that never post on message boards. Together ,they equal much less information which DOES affect the quality and quantity of information.


"Lets move on and restrict discussions about BFT to the quality and usefulness of the information."
No, FT doesn't "restrict discussions" like BFT does. This is an open discussion board where all opinions are accepted. Even yours! :D

"Everyone is free to use or not use the info on BFT."
Not the many who have been banned by either not feeding money back to this "free service" by not using their links or by sharing information on how
they were negatively treated by BFT. Some just don't have the computer savvy to figure this out. It's a good thing that people have shared how to use BFT although banned, That is, people who shared it here at FT and then they got banned.

So, I hope I answered your questions/concerns. Please feel free to share any others that you have. Just don't share similar concerns at BFT or you'll learn quickly why I allow these posts to remain open.

You don't need to tell me. The fact that this forum is an online support group for those whose Internet lives have been ruined by her website and moderation is proof of her omnipotence. :rolleyes:

Not omnioptence, but more of a stunned disbelief at the bad manners in play there. It is a wonderful resource, a pioneer, a valuable site.

Its too bad the management has made it such a toxic environnment.

Thanks for responding. I would like to reply and expand my posting.

One of the major differences in FT and BFT, is that it allows threads like this. Can you imagine a suggestion like this thread's title being posted at BFT?. I do not think BFT claims to be an open forum such as FF.
They are free to run the site any way they wish.

Why does this forum continue to have harangues against biddingfortravel.com?
My issue is that these are the same thing over and over and over.

Last year you called Sharper Image a cheater, but your post was allowed to remain open. I assume that you felt like sharing how a company "let you down".
I posted the issue only one time and reported the resolution.

Others here, feel like sharing the same feelings. You also felt like sharing it (at least I assume) so you could warn others. The same goes here.
The postings are basically the same things over and over. They convey no new information and clearly will not change BFT.

No one disputes that BFT is a valuable help in saving money.
My point exactly, but this message gets lost in the harangues.

I'm sure that you aren't implying that BetterBidding hasn't been a value to you. Last year you posted here "I am a very happy user of BiddingForTravel.com. I have very successfully used their information many times to get great Priceline hotel prices."
I think you are confusing BFT and BB. I look at BB, but do not feel they have ever been useful for international hotels; however, I do credit BFT with a lot of savings tips.

I think most agree that BB hasn't YET surpassed BFT as the leading Priceline aid, but it's definitely getting closer.
It has a long way to go for hotels in Europe, Asia and the South Pacific. I hope it does become useful in those areas.

If you really think that I should not "allow complaints" here, I think I understand why you have no problem with BFT. Don't you think that it's worth sharing that posting anything negative against BFT leads to a ban is important to know? What if AA suddenly took away your status because of public negative statements you made at FT? Would this be worth sharing?
My objection is the same complaint repeated and repeated. Perhaps is a "sticky"? :rolleyes:

"THIS DOES NOT AFFECT THE QUALITY OF INFORMATION ON THE SITE." I don't want to SHOUT back, but I respectfully disagree. Just count how many people have said that they will not post at BFT again. That website is worthless without good people willing to voluntarily share their experiences. If you travel to other forums like Fodor's and even Cruise Critic, you'll read where people have said that they would never post at BFT because they were treated so rudely. All these people represent (IMHO) a larger group that never post on message boards. Together ,they equal much less information which DOES affect the quality and quantity of information.
If this group represents a significant number, it will reduce the amount of information available from BFT. The number on FF seems small; however, any reduction is unfortunate. I frequently use Cruise Critic and on the forums I use have never seen a negative comment concerning BFT. In fact I recently posted info on using BFT for a precruise hotel and there was another person that gave a positive comment.

No, FT doesn't "restrict discussions" like BFT does. This is an open discussion board where all opinions are accepted. Even yours!
I am not objecting to "discussions" or opinion. Just the constant repeating of the same thing. Again, I don't think BFT claims to "an open discussion board".

It's a good thing that people have shared how to use BFT although banned, That is, people who shared it here at FT and then they got banned.
I don't understand your comment. You cannot be "banned" from connecting to BFT and reading the information. The only "ban" can be if you want to log on and post.

I think you've made your point. I won't bother to correct some of the errors in your response, but you are still welcomed here. Or, as you might say "you are free to accept this forum or not".
The answer to your open note to me is "no,things will stay as they are".

I don't understand your comment. You cannot be "banned" from connecting to BFT and reading the information. The only "ban" can be if you want to log on and post.[/QUOTE]


You are very wrong about that. Every single terminal at my company was unable to access the website when I was banned - you can't even look at it, the ezboard page loads with a notice that you have been banned.

Don't you think that it's worth sharing that posting anything negative against BFT leads to a ban is important to know?

You don't even have to mention the site by name. Just refer to the "unfriendly bidding board" or "that ******* **********" and they will recognize themselves.

Don't you think that it's worth sharing that posting anything negative against BFT leads to a ban is important to know?

This was shared nearly four years ago. It is no longer interesting or shocking, but you should make it a sticky if you feel it is that important. Perhaps it would head off the future hysterical "I've been banned from BFT!!!#$#$!!$$###@@!!!" posts.

This was shared nearly four years ago. It is no longer interesting or shocking, but you should make it a sticky if you feel it is that important. Perhaps it would head off the future hysterical "I've been banned from BFT!!!#$#$!!$$###@@!!!" posts.

It is interesting to know that the behavior continues.

It is interesting to know that the behavior continues.

Yes, it is very interesting to know that after nearly four years some people
still do not understand that it is her site and rules, and that they must follow those rules if they choose to participate.

As has been stated: Commentary on BFT's management style (or lack thereof) is fair game here. What happened to the 'healthy dose of "get over it."' ?

I don't understand your comment. You cannot be "banned" from connecting to BFT and reading the information. The only "ban" can be if you want to log on and post.

You are very wrong about that. Every single terminal at my company was unable to access the website when I was banned - you can't even look at it, the ezboard page loads with a notice that you have been banned.
Assuming your company has a NAT router (which they should), the way the site knows your computer is via a cookie that is on your computer. (I have a router and use internet software that automatically clears all but a few selected cookies when ever I switch to a new site.)

If you have MS Windows, from their web site, to clear all cookies:

1. Quit Internet Explorer and quit any instances of Windows Explorer.
2. In Control Panel , double-click Internet Options.
3. On the General tab, click Delete Cookies under Temporary Internet Files, and then click OK.
4. Click OK.

If your companies computer can be identified without the cookies, they may have major computer security problems.

As has been stated: Commentary on BFT's management style (or lack thereof) is fair game here.

You mean "the only game here, going on four years."

What happened to the 'healthy dose of "get over it."' ?

I don't know. Have you gotten over it? Obviously not. :rolleyes:

You mean "the only game here, going on four years."

I don't know. Have you gotten over it? Obviously not. :rolleyes:

Sorry to disappoint you. Perhaps when you get banned, you'll understand?

Sorry to disappoint you. Perhaps when you get banned, you'll understand?

I don't expect I'll be banned. Unlike others, I understand that continued participation on the site hinges on the ability to comply with its rules. If I'm wrong and do end up banned, then I'll simply "get over it." Unlike others, my life doesn't revolve around BFT or its owner/moderators.

I don't expect I'll be banned. Unlike others, I understand that continued participation on the site hinges on the ability to comply with its rules. If I'm wrong and do end up banned, then I'll simply "get over it." Unlike others, my life doesn't revolve around BFT or its owner/moderators.

Nor does mine, 7000+ posts with nothing to do with BFT. But you've made my point nicely. I was banned for posting here. I followed the rules there. That's why I (and others) like to complain about the unfairness of it all....:D

Assuming your company has a NAT router (which they should), the way the site knows your computer is via a cookie that is on your computer. (I have a router and use internet software that automatically clears all but a few selected cookies when ever I switch to a new site.)

If you have MS Windows, from their web site, to clear all cookies:

1. Quit Internet Explorer and quit any instances of Windows Explorer.
2. In Control Panel , double-click Internet Options.
3. On the General tab, click Delete Cookies under Temporary Internet Files, and then click OK.
4. Click OK.

If your companies computer can be identified without the cookies, they may have major computer security problems.

Actually you are only partly correct. In my experience being banned, BFT can ban base on username (cookie) or IP address. If you are accessing the internet from the office, you are most likely behind NAT. But the external IP address could be the same for hundreds if not thousands of computers. As such the whole network could be banned.
Also a home user on a cable modem will often keep the same IP address for weeks or months. To work around the IP ban from home you can change the MAC address on your router and you will then be given a different IP address. If anyone needs help avoiding a BFT ban, please PM me for help.

I followed the rules there.

Obviously not, or you wouldn't have been banned.

Obviously not, or you wouldn't have been banned.

I haven't posted on BFT since 2002. I was banned last week for disagreeing with you-know-who on this thread (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=524784). Look me up on BFT (I'm assuming you aren't banned), my userids are the same...

Obviously not, or you wouldn't have been banned.

Point 1: I wasn't banned for anything I did wrong at BFT either. The esteemed moderator of that board apparently noticed a post of mine here that suggested a change of style in the operation of BFT would be beneficial. I'm not exaggerating when I state it that way. I think it's a poor business decision to manage BFT in the way it is managed, and I think the evidence supporting that is clear both here and in the fact that Better Bidding was created at all (and more recently has seen traffic gains). Your contention that people don't get banned from BFT for personal reasons that are not related to conduct on BFT is false.

Point 2: Plenty of different topics have been discussed here over the last few weeks. Even today other topics have been created or updated. Over the past few years people at FT have helped one another tremendously here on the Travel Bidding board. Commentary on BFT is far from the only topic.

Making statements that are not true does not support your position well.

to curbcrusher:
please allow me to express myself regarding your posts.
you stated that you can only be banned from posting and not from simply viewing the site. this is wrong. i was banned completely. you also stated that if you follow the rules, you will not be banned. this is incorrect as well. i was banned by an oversite by the moderator, to which i responded by email. i took a while for her to do her research to see that i was not in the wrong, but my ban was eventually lifted hours later. however, there was no apology from her, not even an email stating that my ban was lifted. i found that very unprofessional.

now, you may ask why i even posted to the site at all. it's because i found it through a search and would compare it to my own pl bids even though i have been quite successful in the past on my on bidding on pl. i was trying to be nice and posted a review and even bid through a-b.com for the heck of it, even though i received no assistance from the site. my bid post and review were my first 2 posts. my third post was a request for assistance. not that i needed it - i just thought i'd use it to see what could happen. the info that was given didn't help really, because i wound up biddng much less than suggested and won. i was sent an email to open the a-b site twice to pl to bid, which i did. i posted the results of my bid. subsequently, i was banned because the moderator thought i did not use a-b.com. i was appalled.

so, i started seeking more options about bidding and found this site. i, at first, wanted info on a hotel program relative to the hotel i won via pl. however, i found this particular section and was amazed at how many people experienced what i did. albiet late my discover, it was comforting to know that i was not as crazy as the moderator led me to believe.

so, here i am a living and breathing testament to the unfairness of bft. i have nothing to gain and nothing to lose, so you can comment all you like and support that site, but i know better, and obviously others do, too.

being an advocate for fair treatment is a good thing.
i will continue to uplift betterbidding and flyertalk.

one more thing:
i do not for the life of me understand why you would want to censor some else's experience. no matter how many times they say they were treated unfairly, it happened and how they react - as long as it's not over the top - should be the least of your worries. how about realizing that if this many people are complaining, something is very, very wrong? how about providing us with a solution? or how about just respecting our views and look elsewhere?

with much respect,
tastemaker

Actually you are only partly correct. In my experience being banned, BFT can ban base on username (cookie) or IP address. If you are accessing the internet from the office, you are most likely behind NAT. But the external IP address could be the same for hundreds if not thousands of computers. As such the whole network could be banned.
Also a home user on a cable modem will often keep the same IP address for weeks or months. To work around the IP ban from home you can change the MAC address on your router and you will then be given a different IP address. If anyone needs help avoiding a BFT ban, please PM me for help.

I don't know about companies, but my NAT router with my cable internet provider changes my external IP address ever time I connect to the internet. Thus without "cookies", I cannot be banned from accessing the site.

However a free registration could be required to access the site, but any made up information would satisfy.

My final response on this thread is this:

My point is that the BFT complaints have overrun this forum as evidenced by the links in my reply to ScottC in the most recent "Banned from BFT" thread. I understand why many here do not care for BFT or its moderation, but don't agree that it is productive to rehash those complaints. It should be obvious after nearly four years that Sheryl is going to continue to run BFT as she sees fit, so people should either learn to play along or ignore the site.

With that, I apologize, especially to skofarrell, for my sharp tone in this and the other thread.

My final response on this thread is this:

With that, I apologize, especially to skofarrell, for my sharp tone in this and the other thread.

No apology necessary. I can see your point of view. I'm still POed at BFT tho :D