Independence Air iClub - It is all about sticking it to United

Each week Tom Moore records a message to DH employees. You can listen to it by calling 866-465-9309. In every message he talks about how great Fly I is doing operationally and he often talks about how badly United is doing in comparison. If this doesnt prove that they started an airline for spite I dont know what does.

A chip on the shoulder is a sign of wood above.

UA isn't doing badly and everyone knows DH is on the verge of liquidation. This guy reminds me of Baghdad Bob, his assertions are just as rediculous!

Mocking the Coalition's Attempt To Target Saddam Hussein:
"These villains, and in particular the villain Bush, said they had struck Iraq with 40 cruise missiles to assassinate President Saddam Hussein. Not only are they disappointed, I think they are hysterical."

Attempting to Acknowledge What Was Happening Militarily Beyond Baghdad:
March 22, 2003
"Maybe they will enter Umm Qasr and Basra, but how will they enter Baghdad? It will be a big oven for them. They can penetrate our borders but they cannot reach Baghdad. They will try to pull our army and troops out but we are well aware of their plans and they will fail."

March 23, 2003
"In Umm Qasr, the fighting is fierce and we have inflicted many damages. The stupid enemy, the Americans and British, failed completely. They're not making any penetration."

As Televised Reports of U.S. Forces Approaching the Outskirts of Western Baghdad Are Shown:
"They are not any place. They are on the move everywhere. They are a snake moving in the desert. They hold no place in Iraq. This is an illusion."

After U.S. Forces Seized Baghdad's Airport:
"We butchered the force present at the airport. We have retaken the airport! There are no Americans there!"

After U.S. Troops Penetrated Central Baghdad:
April 5, 2003
"Nobody came here. Those America losers, I think their repeated frequent lies are bringing them down very rapidly.... Baghdad is secure, is safe."

April 5, 2003
"They are not near Baghdad. Don't believe them.... They said they entered with... tanks in the middle of the capital. They claim that they - I tell you, I... that this speech is too far from the reality. It is a part of this sickness of their plan. There is no an... - no any existence to the American troops or for the troops in Baghdad at all."

April 6, 2003
"Whenever we attack, they retreat. When we pound them with missiles and heavy artillery, they retreat even deeper. But when we stopped pounding, they pushed to the airport for propaganda purposes."

April 7, 2003
"The Americans are not there. They're not in Baghdad. There are no troops there. Never. They're not at all."

April 7, 2003
"U.S. forces learned a lesson last night they will never forget. We slaughtered them and will continue to slaughter them."

April 7, 2003
"There is no presence of American infidels in the city of Baghdad."

Wasn't that last quote the one with the American tank going by in the background?

Each week Tom Moore records a message to DH employees. You can listen to it by calling 866-465-9309. In every message he talks about how great Fly I is doing operationally and he often talks about how badly United is doing in comparison. If this doesnt prove that they started an airline for spite I dont know what does.

Just a couple of things....First of all why are you giving out employee information on a public website. That's wrong. Second why wouldn't you tout the our operational numbers when the last time the numbers were release we ranked in the top five in all of the operational categories. (Must be doing something right, huh?)

Each week Tom Moore records a message to DH employees. You can listen to it by calling 866-465-9309. In every message he talks about how great Fly I is doing operationally and he often talks about how badly United is doing in comparison. If this doesnt prove that they started an airline for spite I dont know what does.

I listen to that same hotline every week and I have no idea what you are talking about. I haven't listened to this week's hotline, but most the time it is talking about operational performance and occassionally he mentions how we are out-performing our competitors (which UAL is one, and yes we are out performing UAL in LOTS of areas), but most weeks it is more of an goal setting operational pep-talk than a UAL bash-fest like you describe.

First of all, thank you very much for posting the phone#. I think one of the best things about boards like this is to get what you might call "insider information." If I just wanted the glossy information that big companies wanted me to know, why not just shut down the Flyertalk board, and put links to the airlines public web sites.

Again, I cannot underscore enough how this kind of information further empowers customers to understand corporate culture, etc., and it is neat to get information "they" may not want me to know. And by "they" I mean big companies.

That being said, I listened to the recorded message that was available today. I found the gentlemen to be more of a down to earth guy than some other big six airline CEO's that I have also had an opportunity to listen too.

The gentlemen spoke about how FlyI has made a difference in the fare landscape in the northern Virginia area, and other communities that FlyI serves. He mentions how big six airlines match Flyi's fares, and when FlyI leaves a market the big six airlines dramatically raise fares. If you call the line, examples are presented having to do both with NW and UA matching and then dramatically (3X or more) raising walk up fares when FlyI leaves a market.

Personally I would like to thank this gentlemen and FlyI for its impact on my travel which I have to pay for out of my own pocket rather than out of some expense account. I fly in the BOS to WAS market about 30 times a year. There is no doubt absolutely that FlyI has dramatically lowered fares in this market. This summer I purchassed several fares at about $96 all inclusive of tax roundtrip. I really appreciate that FlyI and now JetBlue are entering the BOS to W
AS market.

I am a little ashamed to say that while I am fully cognizant that FlyI is the main driving force in lowering the fares in this makret that I tavel in so often, I have bought nearly all my tickets on UA. The reasons for this are the worldwide mileage plus program, UA's channel 9 which lets you listen to ATC communications, and because with the UA program you can obtain first class upgrades. But I realize if it were not for FlyI I would not be able to travel as much, or I might have had to pay 2X the cost for my 2005 travel, again out of my own pocket and not some easy flowing expense account. Again I am greatful that FlyI is in this market, and I am sorry that I have still bought the tickets on UA for my own personal gain despite UA probably having little to no interest in lowering fares. For anyone who travel less than 5-8 times a year, I would point them to FlyI, as they may not value as much a global frequent flyer program.

Also I am pleased that now JetBlue has a $25 fare in BOS to IAD, which will keep pressure on the others to keep fares down.

Sorry for the long rant :), and happy Thanksgiving.

I am a little ashamed to say that while I am fully cognizant that FlyI is the main driving force in lowering the fares in this makret that I tavel in so often, I have bought nearly all my tickets on UA.

I think what pisses me off most about america is there lack of understanding intrest rates.... By getting you united miles now your paying 2x fares later. But people don't focus on the 2x fares later just the miles now. Sigh. I hate america.

yes we are out performing UAL in LOTS of areas

Just about any business could outperform its competition if it spent more on its product than it took in. UA or just about any other airline could boast about near-100% loads if it sold all its seats for $49, and people might be tempted to marvel at that feat. UA or just about any other airline could provide undisputed best-in-class service if it doubled the number of flight attendants on each plane or gate agents at each station.

Just a couple of things....First of all why are you giving out employee information on a public website.

I'm certain that the people at FlyI or any other airline are quite aware when they record their messages to employees that members of the public, airline junkies, or even executives at competing carriers are dialing in regularly. It's not that big a deal to have the number floating around.

Just a couple of things....First of all why are you giving out employee information on a public website. That's wrong. Second why wouldn't you tout the our operational numbers when the last time the numbers were release we ranked in the top five in all of the operational categories. (Must be doing something right, huh?)

Better question, wny not? I agree with SealBeach below. If they really wanted this information to remain propietary, they would post it on the employee section of the website, or put in an authentication system. Have you ever tried calling the UA NRSA number back when ACA was a UA partner? Depending on "who" you are, the system gives you various details. If you're in the UA family, it will give you exact booking numbers (okay, with a max of 25 seats per class) but if you are not, it will only tell you "good, fair, poor" for availability.

sold all its seats for $49

All of its seats at $49? :td:

Sorry - but they do have capacity controls on many of their fares --- and most of the really cheap ones are restricted to specific days.... My only issue with them is that it is usually easier to book UA than DH..... My heart is with DH, but my wallet sometimes (not always) talks louder.....

Sigh. I hate america.

While everyone is entitled to their opinion (which is one reason why I think the US is great), I simply don't agree. This is what happens in a free market economy and I wouldn't have it any other way.

United is doing very well operationally, coming in at or near the top in on-time arrivals, etc. Don't know where this is all coming from.

A chip on the shoulder is a sign of wood above.

UA isn't doing badly and everyone knows DH is on the verge of liquidation. This guy reminds me of Baghdad Bob, his assertions are just as rediculous!

Mocking the Coalition's Attempt To Target Saddam Hussein:
"These villains, and in particular the villain Bush, said they had struck Iraq with 40 cruise missiles to assassinate President Saddam Hussein. Not only are they disappointed, I think they are hysterical."

Attempting to Acknowledge What Was Happening Militarily Beyond Baghdad:
March 22, 2003
"Maybe they will enter Umm Qasr and Basra, but how will they enter Baghdad? It will be a big oven for them. They can penetrate our borders but they cannot reach Baghdad. They will try to pull our army and troops out but we are well aware of their plans and they will fail."

March 23, 2003
"In Umm Qasr, the fighting is fierce and we have inflicted many damages. The stupid enemy, the Americans and British, failed completely. They're not making any penetration."

As Televised Reports of U.S. Forces Approaching the Outskirts of Western Baghdad Are Shown:
"They are not any place. They are on the move everywhere. They are a snake moving in the desert. They hold no place in Iraq. This is an illusion."

After U.S. Forces Seized Baghdad's Airport:
"We butchered the force present at the airport. We have retaken the airport! There are no Americans there!"

After U.S. Troops Penetrated Central Baghdad:
April 5, 2003
"Nobody came here. Those America losers, I think their repeated frequent lies are bringing them down very rapidly.... Baghdad is secure, is safe."

April 5, 2003
"They are not near Baghdad. Don't believe them.... They said they entered with... tanks in the middle of the capital. They claim that they - I tell you, I... that this speech is too far from the reality. It is a part of this sickness of their plan. There is no an... - no any existence to the American troops or for the troops in Baghdad at all."

April 6, 2003
"Whenever we attack, they retreat. When we pound them with missiles and heavy artillery, they retreat even deeper. But when we stopped pounding, they pushed to the airport for propaganda purposes."

April 7, 2003
"The Americans are not there. They're not in Baghdad. There are no troops there. Never. They're not at all."

April 7, 2003
"U.S. forces learned a lesson last night they will never forget. We slaughtered them and will continue to slaughter them."

April 7, 2003
"There is no presence of American infidels in the city of Baghdad."

What does this have to do with Independence Air? Keep your foolish politics to yourself! :mad: :td: :td:

I hate america.

... an equally foolish statement! :td:

I find flying Independence Air up to BDL a refreshing alternative to UA.

I am a little ashamed to say that while I am fully cognizant that FlyI is the main driving force in lowering the fares in this makret that I tavel in so often, I have bought nearly all my tickets on UA. The reasons for this are the worldwide mileage plus program, UA's channel 9 which lets you listen to ATC communications, and because with the UA program you can obtain first class upgrades.

And ultimately, this is what matters most - while Indy captivated the hearts of many DC-area travelers, United won the wallet wars through a superior network, a full-service product, and the formidable Mileage Plus program.

Basically UAL is moving up and doing better now. DH is almost out of biz, baghdad bob is like dh. By telling its customers (and staff) everything is doing well and that they are sticking it to ual (aka the USA).



What does this have to do with Independence Air? Keep your foolish politics to yourself! :mad: :td: :td:

Basically UAL is moving up and doing better now. DH is almost out of biz, baghdad bob is like dh. By telling its customers (and staff) everything is doing well and that they are sticking it to ual (aka the USA).

Well it's a stupid analogy... If you're trying to mock the President about the war or economy, the facts don't justify these bogus comments!

'bogus comments!' are just it thats the comparison. 'bogus comments!' from indy and 'bogus comments!' from dh.


Well it's a stupid analogy... If you're trying to mock the President about the war or economy, the facts don't justify these bogus comments!

Well it's a stupid analogy... If you're trying to mock the President about the war or economy, the facts don't justify these bogus comments!


:confused: Stupid analogy? Mock the President? Please, lay off the crack pipe for the sake of everyone around you. I was comparing the denial of the fall of Baghdad to the denial of the fall of DH (not stupid at all) and I have no clue why you thought I was mocking the President. Next time, just say no to drugs. :p

your analogy made sense to me

:confused: Stupid analogy? Mock the President? Please, lay off the crack pipe for the sake of everyone around you. I was comparing the denial of the fall of Baghdad to the denial of the fall of DH (not stupid at all) and I have no clue why you thought I was mocking the President. Next time, just say no to drugs. :p

HeathrowGuy,
While I was influenced by the frequent flyer program, I figure I am in the minority among the larger population. Haven't the airlines found that price alone drives purchassing decisions for the most part? Whiel it might be commonplace for people on FT to think about building up miles, I don't think the mileage programs are that important to either the average Joe or average business traveler.

As an example of this I attended a focus group put on by the US Shuttle a couple of years ago. I imagine most of the people in the group were nuts and bolts business travelers, and none of them were mileage runners, etc. Anyway a question was asked about what kind of bonus, promotion, incentive, or other perk US could offer to make these "average Joe's" always fly the US Shuttle instead of flip flopping between US and DL, and basically the Average Joe's said nothing. The Average Joe's said they totally based what shuttle they fly on what time they arrived in to the airport, and would go up to the terminal of the next leaving shuttle and had no loyalty.

I would also bet you there are a lot of people with airline status who don't understand they have the status, or really know what it means. These Average Joe business travelers have their assistants book their flights, and no little to nothing about the mechanics of it.

Given this I am just surprised that more people did not go with DH, since most people outside FT don't have this geeky travel/frequent flyer program interest :)?

To close out this theme some years ago I remember a CO VP as being quoated as saying that most people are really bad players of the frequent flyer game. I too was a bad player of sorts when I started as I used my miles for cheap shuttle flights when I was 18-19.

DOW JONES NEWSWIRES
December 8, 2005 5:30 p.m.

WASHINGTON -- A bankruptcy judge on Thursday slashed by 60% the amount of money FLYi Inc. can collect from United Airlines' parent company as damages for terminating a relationship with a regional carrier affiliated with FLYi, a United spokeswoman said.

The spokeswoman, Jean Medina, told Dow Jones Newswires the judge reduced the amount of damages to about $500 million and ruled that the amount will be treated as an unsecured claim against the bankruptcy estate of UAL Corp., United's parent. Under UAL's Chapter 11 bankruptcy-reorganization plan, unsecured creditors can expect to recover no more than 8% of their claims.

A spokesman for FLYi, Rick DeLisi, declined to comment Thursday. The damage claim against UAL is considered the biggest financial asset of FLYi, which itself began Chapter 11 bankruptcy reorganization on Nov. 7.

The claim stemmed from a broken relationship between United Airlines and Atlantic Coast Airlines, which until 2003 was a regional carrier for United. Atlantic Coast contended the breakup cost it $1.3 billion in damages. After the breakup, precipitated by United's bankruptcy filing in December 2002, Atlantic Coast's parent company renamed itself FLYi and launched a standalone airline called Independence Air.

Medina, the UAL spokeswoman, said the damage claim won't be paid as cash but as a stake in UAL once the company emerges from bankruptcy-court protection.

Medina, the UAL spokeswoman, said the damage claim won't be paid as cash but as a stake in UAL once the company emerges from bankruptcy-court protection.[/QUOTE]


So soon FLYI will own part of UAL. I guess then that FLYI creditors will be reimbursed with UAL stock for their investments in FLYI. Irony!

Keep in mind UAL will hold off on paying out damages as long as possible. Most likely they wont pay out until the airline lands its last flight.


Medina, the UAL spokeswoman, said the damage claim won't be paid as cash but as a stake in UAL once the company emerges from bankruptcy-court protection.


So soon FLYI will own part of UAL. I guess then that FLYI creditors will be reimbursed with UAL stock for their investments in FLYI. Irony![/QUOTE]

your analogy made sense to me


Thanks ClimbGuy, seems as though the other poster realized his/her foolish ways and decided to vacate the thread.

Just called the number - he's a great liar - but at least he's offering extra work over the holidays!

Check the number today! Kerry Skeen is on talking about how the airline was doomed by high fuel prices and competition. What did they expect? They started a high cost low fare operation. Wow. This must be the biggest blunder in airline history!

While everyone is entitled to their opinion (which is one reason why I think the US is great), I simply don't agree. This is what happens in a free market economy and I wouldn't have it any other way.

kryshakm, has your head been in the sand lately? It would seem your free market buddies in the formerly White (now Red) House are not so sure they like the idea of allowing their own people to have their own opinions... after all, we might all get together and boot the lot of them out (all crooks and liars and thieves and plunderers and worse - Kerry was dead on about that).

I bet you bought into Reaganomics, too, didn't you?

Americans are, for the most part, hopelessly stupid sheeple. It won't end until Bush has destroyed the rest of the world, not just Iraq. I'm with HepperSchlepper all the way.

"These Colors Don't Run ... the world."

That's not an appropriate response and not warranted for the topic at hand. If you want to debate that, go to OMNI.

I found it an interesting irony today that the reports are out about UA's approval of their emergence from bankruptcy just as we're seeing DH go into Ch7.

kryshakm, has your head been in the sand lately? It would seem your free market buddies in the formerly White (now Red) House....

ALL: Further OMNI/political posts should go in OMNI. They will be deleted on this thread. As will personal attacks and insults. Posters considering such may want to review the FlyerTalk TOS.

Thanks.

cblaisd
Senior Moderator

I found it an interesting irony today that the reports are out about UA's approval of their emergence from bankruptcy just as we're seeing DH go into Ch7.

i agree, it is ironic.

"If this doesnt prove that they started an airline for spite I dont know what does"
Your absolutly right. The media, anyway, made the airline out to be the greatest thing that has ever happened to industry, claiming it was such a great, simple, low fare alternative to the Star Alliance "big boys". The truth is all DH set out to do was stab United in the back. Now look who's flying!

looking back at it, it was a kamikaze mission. By forcing ual to match their prices they lost thousands if not millions.

"If this doesnt prove that they started an airline for spite I dont know what does"
Your absolutly right. The media, anyway, made the airline out to be the greatest thing that has ever happened to industry, claiming it was such a great, simple, low fare alternative to the Star Alliance "big boys". The truth is all DH set out to do was stab United in the back. Now look who's flying!

The media, anyway, made the airline out to be the greatest thing that has ever happened to industry, claiming it was such a great, simple, low fare alternative to the Star Alliance "big boys".

I'm not sure what media you are talking about, the Washington Post was generally very negative from day one about DH until the very last minute and then they started being sympathetic.

This is true, your a real [profane expletive deleted by the senior moderator] if you kick them while they are down. But for DC the fairs droped, the media is people too and they enjoyed their 29$ tickets to FL. I mean everyone's credit card will have a biger charger now that they are gone.


I'm not sure what media you are talking about, the Washington Post was generally very negative from day one about DH until the very last minute and then they started being sympathetic.

looking back at it, it was a kamikaze mission. By forcing ual to match their prices they lost thousands if not millions.

Amen.....and it wasn't just United- it was to hurt everyone who competed on their routes-the irony is rich here. And while $29 fares looked great on everyone's credit card- no airline that is not subsidized by its government could ever exist on that. Period.

I listen to that same hotline every week and I have no idea what you are talking about. I haven't listened to this week's hotline, but most the time it is talking about operational performance and occassionally he mentions how we are out-performing our competitors (which UAL is one, and yes we are out performing UAL in LOTS of areas), but most weeks it is more of an goal setting operational pep-talk than a UAL bash-fest like you describe.

This was like making comments about the other team in the newspaper - it just gets posted in the locker room!

Each week Tom Moore records a message to DH employees. You can listen to it by calling 866-465-9309. In every message he talks about how great Fly I is doing operationally and he often talks about how badly United is doing in comparison. If this doesnt prove that they started an airline for spite I dont know what does.

Hey, there's no recording anymore...