US Airways Dividend Miles (Pre-2005 America West merger) - GSO losing Mainline service at end of 2005

Terribly sad news out today from a pal of mine (former PI) who now works at the GSO ATO. He writes that the station manager informed them today that the company has announced that mainline is out in December. (Didn't give specific date, not sure if that's pending or I just don't have all the facts.)

In any case, what a sad day for this proud little station that for decades was a model station for ANY carrier. Many of us can well recall the GSO-DFW nonstops on 727s and GSO-LGA nonstops on 737s numerous times a day. When PI launched service to SFO and LAX, those flights continued from CLT to, where else, GSO!

I can remember seeing no fewer than 10 mainline jets on the ground for the morning bank back in the 1980s and the place ran like a perfectly oiled machine. Others will tell you this is/was(?) the best US club in the system.

I'm just sad to see it all continue to dismantle one more brick at a time. :(

I posted this on another web site, and it has been too long and trying a week to write something new here. US is making it very difficult for me to consider coming back and supporting them........

This confirms a fear I have had for a long time. GSO for years enjoyed service at a level that would not have existed had in not been so close to the HQ of PI. With each passing year, those ties grew more distant. Now that the move is about to take place to Tempe I was afraid that some one was going to pull the plug. This is where I have spent over twenty years flying out of. This is going to be like losing a very close friend.

One of my greatest concerns is for the employees of this station who have always been the best. Even with the EO, there are still several 20 year plus employees here. My guess is they now have to go express with express wages.

Second, the ladies in the Club were very good friends and always willing to help. And not just the frequent members. I've watched for years how they made newbies feel right at home. My guess while it lasts, is that this is the only station that will be all express to have a club.

Third, they have handed this market to DL on a platter. DL didn't even have to make an effort. They simply just handed to them. One of these days the Barbie jets will come back to bite all who have used them.

I am truly sorry to read of this and wish the best to all my friends who work there.

Well, now I have no reason to pick GSO over any other choice I have (BLF/BKW, CRW, ROA, TRI) for US. All give me Barbie Jets except BLF/BKW which have B1900s only.

Guess if I want mainline I have to drive to RDU or CLT.

Wonder what's going to happen to the club without mainline?

I simply cannot understand this decision. Did demand for GSO travel drop this much that it can't support mainline anymore, I mean, did one day people just stop booking flights and they decided they needed to reduce capacity? There can't be that much low-cost competition there, do any LCC's even fly there? What is the reasoning for this?

I simply cannot understand this decision. Did demand for GSO travel drop this much that it can't support mainline anymore, I mean, did one day people just stop booking flights and they decided they needed to reduce capacity? There can't be that much low-cost competition there, do any LCC's even fly there? What is the reasoning for this?
GC4

Ifly does have a limited presence. Airtran was there and pulled out when DL matched them. Then you have UA, CO and NW and a limited AA presence.

The BIG winner here is DL. There are almost hourly mainline flights to ATL and every other hour or so to CVG. In addition there are lots of Barbie Jets to other locations. My guess is DL has doubled the seats out of GSO in the last year, all while US was shrinking.

The only reason I can give you is they wanted to spank at least one cockroach. :D It is they only reason that can make any sense

GC4

Ifly does have a limited presence. Airtran was there and pulled out when DL matched them. Then you have UA, CO and NW and a limited AA presence.

The BIG winner here is DL. There are almost hourly mainline flights to ATL and every other hour or so to CVG. In addition there are lots of Barbie Jets to other locations. My guess is DL has doubled the seats out of GSO in the last year, all while US was shrinking.

The only reason I can give you is they wanted to spank at least one cockroach. :D It is they only reason that can make any sense


Thanks. It at least makes a little more sense to me now. If, as of now there is no other LCC there (flyI doesn't really count because they'll be gone in a month or so), then price competition shouldn't be that tremendous because it's all Legacy.

Once again, someone else moves in and US just gives in and lets them eat away at their market share :rolleyes:

I simply cannot understand this decision. Did demand for GSO travel drop this much that it can't support mainline anymore, I mean, did one day people just stop booking flights and they decided they needed to reduce capacity? There can't be that much low-cost competition there, do any LCC's even fly there? What is the reasoning for this?

several dozen ex-US planes are being retired over the next 15 months. there's no way to do that without significantly chopping US's mainline network. converting stations to Express keeps them in the system and allows Express wages for ground handling. Mesa is already in the process of moving lots of Express jets east to do the deed.

several dozen ex-US planes are being retired over the next 15 months. there's no way to do that without significantly chopping US's mainline network. converting stations to Express keeps them in the system and allows Express wages for ground handling. Mesa is already in the process of moving lots of Express jets east to do the deed.
huh, that is not the case here. The demand out of GSO is actually quite high. All those MD-80's flying to ATL on the hour are filled with ex US pax. The demand for seats has not dropped at GSO. As a matter of fact I believe I remember seeing that demand was up around 10% each of the last two years.

So you do the math. Demand is up 20% and US is off by 50% or more. What does that tell you?

Well in case you don't know, people simply don't care for Barbie Jets. As far as I'm concerned you can keep em out west.

Well, this is probably the last nail in the coffin...I had been thinking about switching over to US at GSO, even as recently as about 4 hours ago. No mainline service though means I'll end up just sticking with Delta though. I wasn't pleased when PHL mainline service was pulled last year, but I was holding out hope that it would be coming back...now, with CLT even being pulled, I guess that means no chance even for PHL...I think that I'll just stick with Delta through ATL (since rumour has it CVG goes all RJ in December).

It's a little disappointing that only ATL, DTW, ORD and DFW will have mainline service out of GSO in January. Even when I moved down here last September, there was EWR, CLT, PHL, CVG all on mainline (although DFW was all RJ).

Wow, AA is bringing at least 1 mainline jet back to GSO. With all the development around there, I'm very surprised to hear this. Sad.

Would not be surprised if GSO becomes an Southwest city and probably definitely a Jet Blue city when their new planes go into service.

I was through GSO last weekend on a segment run, and I have two thoughts:

The staff there really is terrific. On my return trip, I was flying GSO-CLT, and the incoming plane got held up, after the staff had recheduled everyone but me (I had a late flight CLT-CHA anyway), they came and checked in with me every 10 minutes or so just to keep me updated on how close I'd be cutting it.

They all expressed... let's call it muted optimism about the merger. But all were enthusiastic and ready to do what it takes to get things stable again. As a worried pax, it was encouraging.

The other ironic note: I was on a 6 segment run, and the ONLY segment i flew on mainline was CLT-GSO on the way out. I keep thinking: what good is my new found Gold (and CP to come) if I'm never going to be on a flight with an F cabin again?

The other ironic note: I was on a 6 segment run, and the ONLY segment i flew on mainline was CLT-GSO on the way out. I keep thinking: what good is my new found Gold (and CP to come) if I'm never going to be on a flight with an F cabin again?

Precisely what I've been thinking... I'm 3800 short of requalifying for GP in '06. Is it really worth it? I have (at this point) no reason to fly for travel in the fourth quarter, so it would have to be on a MR. If all is going to be on RJs, we get the exit row as a preferred anyway. Why bother being anything higher than SP if you aren't going to be flying on mainline?

.. I'm 3800 short of requalifying for GP in '06. Is it really worth it?..... Why bother being anything higher than SP if you aren't going to be flying on mainline?

To each his own, but I would think 100% Gold bonus vs. 50% Silver bonus would be an incentive for me if I were so close to re-qualifying.......

To each his own, but I would think 100% Gold bonus vs. 50% Silver bonus would be an incentive for me if I were so close to re-qualifying.......

:rolleyes: Thanks, kudzu... forgot about that perk. MR/mini day vacation here we come. ;)

Has anyone thought that this might actually be a forward looking move? If the new US is going to rationalize fares, what will that do to GSO demand? how much of it is folks driving from CLT to avoid BloFares?

Well, now I have no reason to pick GSO over any other choice I have (BLF/BKW, CRW, ROA, TRI) for US. All give me Barbie Jets except BLF/BKW which have B1900s only.

Guess if I want mainline I have to drive to RDU or CLT.

Wonder what's going to happen to the club without mainline?

whats a barbie jet? erj 145? if you dont like those, you can get a crj , or on a saturday even a dash-300 :D what a treat :D

seriously, have you had some bad experiences on express aircraft?

whats a barbie jet? erj 145? if you dont like those, you can get a crj , or on a saturday even a dash-300 :D what a treat :D

seriously, have you had some bad experiences on express aircraft?

Definition: Barbie Jet (origin: longing4piedmont) - Any non-mainline aircraft with non-turbo prop engines. Also called "Regional Jet", "RJ" or "BJ".

On US, Barbie Jets are EMB-145, CRJ (all varieties). Some include the EMB-170, others see it as a mainline aircraft (and this disagreement includes passengers and US employees alike). On UA, Barbie jets include FC and some contain E+ sections. On US, pray you can get the exit row.

Also CCY brass promised US FF that the E-170 would have a FC section, then changed their minds and made it an all Y aircraft. :td:

Seriously, I've not had bad experiences on RJ's... however, a longer than 1 hr or 1:15 min flight is a pain for most... no FC is a pain for all of us. :td: I think my max on an RJ has been about 1:30. Don't get me started about Mesa however. :rolleyes:

Definition: Barbie Jet (origin:
Also CCY brass promised US FF that the E-170 would have a FC section, then changed their minds and made it an all Y aircraft. :td:


Actually, they put out press releases to that effect, which (in true US form) are still on the website in a very public place (and if CCY is reading this, PR newswire still has them, archive.org has them, and I've saved a backup copy to keep posting every time this comes up).

http://www.usairways.com/about/press_2003/nw_03_0512.htm

To wit:

The CRJ Series 700 aircraft and the Embraer 170s will offer both First and Coach-Class service. Every seat is either an aisle or window seat. These regional jets also provide comfortable leg space with plenty of overhead and under-the-seat baggage storage room and stand-up headroom. They have a cruising speed of around 500 miles per hour and can cruise at altitudes above 30,000 feet. GE engines will power each of these regional jets.

This is very sad news . . .

I no longer live in or fly to GSO. As a former PI employee I fondly remember my days in Greensboro as well as Winston-Salem / High Point. The mini-hub status of GSO had nearly 70 flights a day to such places as LGA, BWI, DCA, ORF, CLT, RDU, ILM, BOS, ORD, MCO, TPA, EWR and DAY. It was so highly regarded that LGW, SFO and the morning LAX flight originated in GSO at one time or another.

I have also found it very odd that US seems to scratch their heads and wonder why they are losing money while they decide to terminate the networks of the profitable companies they acquire. A succesful US would have abandoned their network and adopted the Piedmont and PSA networks.

This makes total sense at least for the GSO to CLT routes. It is purely a fare reducing route anyway so why not bring in the RJ's and call it good. I wil still use GSO as a strategy if warranted regardless of what type of equipment I sit on for the 25 minutes.

Just out of curiosity, l4p: why do you fly out of GSO if you're in Hickory?

Just out of curiosity, l4p: why do you fly out of GSO if you're in Hickory?
I haven't flown out of GSO since April, save last week when there was a $600 fare difference to BNA and this week because I'm already here for Pre-Market. Having decided to move my business to DL it just makes more sense to fly HKY as you a deduced.

With that said, I still have many friends in GSO and I hate to see them take a hit in income after working for US for 20+ years.

This makes total sense at least for the GSO to CLT routes. It is purely a fare reducing route anyway so why not bring in the RJ's and call it good. I wil still use GSO as a strategy if warranted regardless of what type of equipment I sit on for the 25 minutes.
Dingo,

If the loads are the same, which is cheaper, two to three Barbie jets making the trip or one 737. I haven't flown out of GSO in six months to speak of, but the flights on the 737 were always 70% to 90% full.

Hint: BJ's are not cheaper to fly per seat mile than a mainline flight. (By almost a three to one margin)

I made a connection in GSO about a year ago on a pseudo-MR using mainline in and out. Except for one flight to MSP that was $200 cheaper than RDU, it was the only other time I've been to the GSO airport. Seemed quite busy both times I was there, so this is really surprising to me, but I'm sure they have a reason. Or maybe not.

I remember the days (about 10 years ago) when CO Lite operated a mini-hub from GSO. US was battling back with a lot of flights and good fares. I remember having to book a 1-day advance to a client near BUF for like $200 the day before flying.

Since I've been in southern WV, I've used GSO as my #3 airport, behind CRW and ROA (I don't use ROA anymore as I can never get competitive fares there, so GSO is now my #1 or #2). I don't remember when I've flown through it when I'd say it was quiet. As it's been noted before, the 6-7AM flights seem to always have good loads, esp. to CLT. In the old days, there were always mainline to CLT, PIT, LGA, BOS and express to BWI and DCA amongst other places. It's sad to see it now going to an RJ/Express station.

I'm relatively knew to posting on flyertalk, but I've been reading these boards for ages. I literally "grew up" with US through college and then a financial consulting job involving lots of Europe travel. Over the years, I learned to cherish my pref. membership (although now just Gold again after I went back to grad school).

The best thing about GSO was their employees. Everyone knew the regulars and treated them like family. I don't even know where to begin re. the ladies in that club--the best in the system imo.

From what I've heard so far, the GSO club will remain due to the extremely high # of US prefs. and club members at GSO, but I am worried about service and more importantly what will happen to all those great employees that watched me grow up. I know that sounds snobby, but those folks saw me through 4 years of commuting to university in DC, then coming home to visit my family, and they're still there to welcome me back when I come back to visit. They were angels--all of them---and I will miss them if they decide (which I fear many of them might) to leave.

We all know the drill about the decrease in fleet size, but I really did think that a FEW mainline flights would remain at GSO even post merger, given to the large # of Chairmans and other prefs. out of that city. I guess I was only dreaming.

Well as a HP'er out west, I'm glad to see those RJ's head back east. HP has been using them on PHX-SAN/LAS/LAX routes. Hopefully, this means less RJ's to cities that shouldn't have them.

Damn, this really sucks. Just 4 years ago US had mainline to CLT, LGA, PHL, PIT, and DCA.

With air traffic at PTI growing, why has the airline cut service so much?

DL is expanding here like crazy.

Well as a HP'er out west, I'm glad to see those RJ's head back east. HP has been using them on PHX-SAN/LAS/LAX routes. Hopefully, this means less RJ's to cities that shouldn't have them.
And I was just begiining to like you.....



:D

This is very sad news . . .

I no longer live in or fly to GSO. As a former PI employee I fondly remember my days in Greensboro as well as Winston-Salem / High Point. The mini-hub status of GSO had nearly 70 flights a day to such places as LGA, BWI, DCA, ORF, CLT, RDU, ILM, BOS, ORD, MCO, TPA, EWR and DAY. It was so highly regarded that LGW, SFO and the morning LAX flight originated in GSO at one time or another.

I have also found it very odd that US seems to scratch their heads and wonder why they are losing money while they decide to terminate the networks of the profitable companies they acquire. A succesful US would have abandoned their network and adopted the Piedmont and PSA networks.

Actually, how soon we forget that PSA was losing money when US bought them! So, the strategy should have been focused on serving the underserved markets -- as Piedmont was very successfully doing. That being said, Southwest would have posed a significant challenge even to Piedmont's strategy.

I guess this also answers the question that LAS or PHX would never be considered here. Unless completely RJ...I wonder if loads stay high on the RJs if they would consider bringing mainline back in the future...Will the RJs theyre planning on using have FC?

Mainline isnt pulled yet from schedules for next year...is that a hopeful sign?

To update this thread: I heard from the ladies in the club that mainline hasn´t been cut just yet. They were looking at it, but the station manager made a presentation to demonstrate the demand at GSO and hopefully keep mainline. No decision has been made. They actually were saying he was hoping to increase service, and was also working to get either LAS or PHX. So, things still seem up in the air, but he is definately trying.

To update this thread: I heard from the ladies in the club that mainline hasn´t been cut just yet. They were looking at it, but the station manager made a presentation to demonstrate the demand at GSO and hopefully keep mainline. No decision has been made. They actually were saying he was hoping to increase service, and was also working to get either LAS or PHX. So, things still seem up in the air, but he is definately trying.

Things are very up in the air right now. One idea that has been running through the rumor mill is that the company may axe mainline but keep the mainline employees at current rates of pay because they need to keep them open due to the proximity of CLT.
I know the station manager very very well and trust me, if US is going to turn the station to mainline express, it won't happen w/o him putting up a gigantic flight.

Did he give you any details about his presentation or on possible LAS or PHX service, please keep us posted as to what happens...

And I was just begiining to like you.....



:D

LOL!

I read on another forum that the plan is that by pulling mainline for a few months, station employees drop to a lower payscale. Then, they can bring back mainline aircraft for increased capacity, but employees are still paid at the lower scale. Seems sneaky to me and a shame to the great employees at GSO. But, it answers the question as to why mainline still appears on spring and summer schedules.