Thai Airways Royal Orchid Plus - Let's face is TG service on short international, full flights, in Y is rubbish

Not that one should expect too much....

But TG themselves rave about there own wonderful service. And on longer flights, even in Y, service is pretty good!

But this, today on a quite full BKK-KUL flight, (but still nearly 2 hours in the air) in Y class:

* No headphones offered - asked for and then recieved
* No newspaper offered - asked for and then received
* No help with luggage storage. Thai staff couldn't care less even though they, just seconds before my arrival, put someone else's carry-on in my seat's overhead locker. (embarrassment?)
* No drinks offered before dinner. I asked when dinner came for a G&T. 'We are full today, so we are not offering full service'. Like... err... what????
* When immigration papers were handed out, they ignored me - I had to (again) ask for them.

OK, so I had a bad-ish flight - but really, there was ample time to do it in the usual Thai way.

ps No cognac service either.

In fact: sub (Thai)standard service. Not on a cheapie ticket either.

Lets be realistic....on a chock- full economy class flight from Bangkok to Kuala Lumpur (about 2 hours total) there just isn't enough time or flight attendants to provide the kind of service you are talking about to about 250 econ passengers....cognac service on that flight in economy??

have you tried SQ in econ on that flight??

I flown that route many times in Business class on TG, LH, Malaysia and SQ (and also once or twice on a Scandinavian airline...forgot which) and just a few times in econ....

The service in business class on TG was always more than satisfactory and compared very favorably to the others, but in econ it was more like a mad rush commuter crowded bus trip on all airlines simply because of the numbers and logistics involved on such a short flight....I really think your protests are unfair....

I really think your protests are unfair....

Agreed, be glad you got any service at all. In Europe for lots more money, you would have 'enjoyed' far less service. Service in Y on any shorthaul in SE Asia is amazing - and the crew smile.

Agreed, be glad you got any service at all. In Europe for lots more money, you would have 'enjoyed' far less service. Service in Y on any shorthaul in SE Asia is amazing - and the crew smile.

Yes, absolutely....for comparison's sake, recently I took an (over 3 hour) LH flight in First class from Bangkok to Manila....and was very unpleasantly surprised (and left speechless) by an unfriendly elderly prison matron attendant (one in particular)... I think some of those attendants have tenure like senior university professors and can't be fired even if they spit on first class passengers.. :mad: ....:td: ...

on the same flight in Business class on TG, I've always had warm friendly receptions and service and my impressions are that the friendliness, smiles and eager service is genuine and sincere :cool: ...when TG finishes upgrading their seats on all existing craft (B747s, B777s, A3XXs and throws away their 4 MD11s) they will be one of the tops in my opinion....

You spoiled brat, what do you expect on a two hour full flight in econ ? Have you ever been on a flight in the US ? You'd be lucky to get a bag of peanuts and something to drink on some coast to coast 5-6 hours flight !!

have you tried SQ in econ on that flight?? I flown that route many times in Business class on TG, LH, Malaysia and SQ (and also once or twice on a Scandinavian airline...forgot which) and just a few times in econ...
I think you mean BKK-SIN? And yes, I have, many times including SQ and SAS.

In Europe for lots more money, you would have 'enjoyed' far less service. Service in Y on any short haul in SE Asia is amazing - and the crew smile.
Actually it was a quite expensive ticket (> EUR 340) and no smiles on this flight... I've had much nicer and more professional flights in Europe (and to be honest much, much worse too).

when TG finishes upgrading their seats on all existing craft (B747s, B777s, A3XXs and throws away their 4 MD11s) they will be one of the tops in my opinion....
Umm, err, right! A process that has been trumpeted by TG for years. Don't hold your breath waiting!

You spoiled brat, ...
So few posts and straight to a personal attack.

I've flown TG about 100 times and this was pretty substandard for TG.

The papers here (in S-E Asia) have lots of articles and ads about the new LCCs. And you see the planes here more and more at the airports. If TG want to compete and be a 'full' service airline, they just need to get the smaller things right and perhaps streamline the service on their shorter routes. I've never been a great fan of SQ, but the other week on SQ from BKK-SIN they showed how to do it on a full (in Y class) 747. No smiles either but professional, fast, well executed service. TG seems to concentrate a lot on the meal and spent about an hour of the two hour flight running around delivering all the special orders. The standard meal (mine) wasn't bad but any restaurant in BKK could beat it in terms of taste, quality and quantity for about THB 100. Why not save time, make it a snack and give a bit more attention to things such as papers, beverages and passenger comfort? Then perhaps the crew will have time to smile?

You spoiled brat, what do you expect on a two hour full flight in econ ?

Despite being a personal attack, you are probably right about the spoiled brat part.

But please excuse me when Thai on their website, in their literature, in their advertisements and even two times over the pa in the plane yesterday, trumpet their offers of exceptional service ...

If they were less boastful about it, it might be good for all. But it seems from all the Thai hoopla that spoiled brats are exactly the market they are pandering to.

Well, they got that wrong. :)

I fly TG Y BKK-SIN all the time and have rarely had cause for complaint. As *G I can get a free massage in the BKK lounge, there's a hot meal of decent quality with a glass of wine served and the crew stay out of my way. (Compare this to Y on most any carrier in the Europe or US, where the only food & entertainment provided is chewing on my knees thanks to the 20" pitch.) I bring my own noise-cancelling headphones, use my laptop as IFE, get the immigration forms at the gate, grab my newspaper from the lounge and drink my G&T there too. If I have sizable carryon I try to board early enough to get it stowed, but on the few occasions when I can't manage this (usually when I end up on the darn A300) the crew have managed to stuff my rollaboard somewhere.

I think you mean BKK-SIN? And yes, I have, many times including SQ and SAS.

even on the slightly longer BKK-SIN route you do not get "cognac service" in econ...newspapers are in very short supply especially in econ, etc..... I truly believe your expectations for econ on this short flight are unreasonable....if you have such particular tastes why dont you book business class? (about the price you quoted for econ)

Actually it was a quite expensive ticket (> EUR 340) and no smiles on this flight... I've had much nicer and more professional flights in Europe (and to be honest much, much worse too).

they have econ tickets for about USD273 on the website (and econ e-tickets until the end of March are USD169 on special promotion)...and probably even cheaper if you use a good travel agent. why would you play more for the route? and then complain

Umm, err, right! A process that has been trumpeted by TG for years. Don't hold your breath waiting!

Yes, waiting a long time, BUT its starting this year...four new A340s coming this year...(already bookable direct flights to New York starting in May using the new A340s) .....the first B747s being refurbished and rolled out this month (with ten flat seats in first class :cool: )...the first B777s being refurbished and rolled out next month (with the new Royal Silk Business class)....but it sounds like it would be very hard to please you in any situation....perhaps you should try another airline and please let us know which airline is better? now that would be useful

I fly TG Y BKK-SIN all the time and have rarely had cause for complaint. As *G I can get a free massage in the BKK lounge, there's a hot meal of decent quality with a glass of wine served and the crew stay out of my way. (Compare this to Y on most any carrier in the Europe or US, where the only food & entertainment provided is chewing on my knees thanks to the 20" pitch.) I bring my own noise-cancelling headphones, use my laptop as IFE, get the immigration forms at the gate, grab my newspaper from the lounge and drink my G&T there too. If I have sizable carryon I try to board early enough to get it stowed, but on the few occasions when I can't manage this (usually when I end up on the darn A300) the crew have managed to stuff my rollaboard somewhere.

jpatokal, you have it down to a science :p and are a smart traveler....I also really like those great back and shoulder massages (from Ms. Nit if she's available) on the 2nd floor of the TG *G lounge (near Gate 31) :cool: I fill up on my G&Ts (or Vodka Tonics) in the lounge and (even if Im flying in econ) Im totally relaxed on board with my mini Ipod and Bangkok Post and Nation from home...:cool: ...I never have anything more than a small rollable carry-on and small backpack (with mini Fujitsu laptop) so I dont need to bother the attendants with help on putting them overhead or elsewhere ;)

I fly TG Y BKK-SIN all the time and have rarely had cause for complaint. As *G I can get a free massage in the BKK lounge, there's a hot meal of decent quality with a glass of wine served and the crew stay out of my way. (Compare this to Y on most any carrier in the Europe or US, where the only food & entertainment provided is chewing on my knees thanks to the 20" pitch.) I bring my own noise-cancelling headphones, use my laptop as IFE, get the immigration forms at the gate, grab my newspaper from the lounge and drink my G&T there too. If I have sizable carryon I try to board early enough to get it stowed, but on the few occasions when I can't manage this (usually when I end up on the darn A300) the crew have managed to stuff my rollaboard somewhere.


Are we are starting to agree?

Thai is pretty good in short haul international Y if:

* You are lucky enough to get access to the lounge prior to the flight for drinks and massage.

* Steal a newspaper from the lounge.

* You make sure you board early.

* You bring your own headphones.

* You bring your own entertainment.

* You are happy with a thimble of wine.

* You are happy with no service on board. (quote: the staff leave you alone?)


Look I like TG, I really do. And they are mostly great. I'm having bit of a go at them because I think they really have to streamline this product.

I did go to the lounge near gate 31. And upstairs and saw the massage etc.

But on boad all I'd like is a G&T, a glass of wine, a read and to listen to some music. Is that really too much to ask for? I couldn't give a stuff about the food.

The Thai business class lounges at BKK do not have wine. I don't know if they ever have. The lounge near gate 31 had run out (I kid you not) of English language newspapers (perhaps stolen by others here ?). There were NO immigration forms at the gate. I left for boarding as soon as the flight was announced.

Most of the special meals were, I noticed, Muslim meals. On a flight to KL surely this can be anticipated so why not have the main choice a Muslim meal? That would be fine by me! And hopefully cut down all the running around? Why not serve the main meal with a sealed cup of water and cut down on more running around with cups of water too?

As for the fleet upgrades. Well let's see. Even if some improvements are made remember that TG have been talking about it for years. I have announcements in their own press from 3 years ago saying the changes would start the next month. Never happened. And even if it does there will be some reason not to do the whole fleet and they end up with the 747 and 777 configuration disasters. I did find out why they ordered the 777-200s with 2-4-2 business and 3-4-3 economy seating.

Finally, why even compare Europe, the USA etc in this matter. Why look towards worse examples of service? Are they the models for Thai's future success as a full service airline?

Good points Austman, I'm with you on this one.

TG really does have to offer something extra (and no I don't mean lounge access for *G passengers) to compete with LCCs.

Good points Austman, I'm with you on this one.

TG really does have to offer something extra (and no I don't mean lounge access for *G passengers) to compete with LCCs.

well I've always been nicely taken care of on TG (even in econ class, but I seldom fly econ now especially if the route in question tends to be heavily booked in econ---addicted to biz class or higher sometimes :rolleyes: ) but I have always kept in mind that I dont expect the same level of service in econ (especially if crowded, that would I get in Biz class.. and if flying econ, I always make sure to plan alittle more ahead of time...and ask attendants early on if I need anything in particular (and TG attendants have always cheerfully provided extras if possible :) )...I always see them hustling and rushing on full flights (in stark constrast to the elderly lifer attendants on some airlines like LH or AF in premium classes who often make you feel like they are doing you a favor flying on their line)....

also I believe that TG is finally taking significant steps to improve the interiors and seats on their planes (although it has taken alot of time up until now) and their in-flight entertainment systems are finally being upgraded....and they are steamlining the number of seats (econ included) (and flight attendant-passenger ratios are improving)

TG has already recognized the rise of budget carriers (they have branched off some domestic no-frills flights to their subsidiary "Nok (Bird) Air" and are re-positioning themselves to concentrate more on the premium market, streamlining and improving their premium and econ product and providing heavy promotional fares. The LCCs (like "One2Go", "ThaiAirAsia", "OrientThai", "JetStar", "Valuair", "Tiger Air" and even "Lion Air" frrom Indonesia) are concentrating on mass cattle runs for the lowest possible prices. The LCCs are also not so healthy financially because of the great number of recent entrants and the extremely fierce competition on airfares. I would expect a shake-out in the not too distant future. I believe that TG will compete favorably with the LCCs given their current strategy.....

by the way, even on business class on SQ or CX (which currently have much better on demand entertainment systems) I still take my own sources of diversion such as 1000 songs on mini iPod, mini O2 Pocket PC and mags and newspapers (sometimes) because I might have already seen everything of interest on their AVOD system...and on board newspapers and mags (on ANY airlines) are usually not enough for me....I dont think this is burden, just a bit of planning....

I also count the pre-flight *Gold lounge perks and comforts as part and parcel of the entire flying experience and product and if you do not qualify for same (and therefore are not a frequent flyer) and only fly ocassionally (but still demand a premium product) then you should purchase a biz class or first class ticket (discounts are available too) which provide access to the lounges.

although the econ tickets on mainline carriers such as TG are not as cheap as the LCCs they compete favorably if you take alittle time to get promotional fares (or have a dedicated TA) and for what you get in return is worth it in my opinion (having already flown on some of those LCCs on a dare :eek: ...) I also notice that econ sections on TG flights are very often CHOCK FULL (even now prior to their upgrades etc.) despite the advent of many many LCCs in the region...I think this also speaks volumes...

in sum, although there is always room for improvement on ANY airline (and possibly some particular crews), I think the OP's headlining comments that TG's Y service being "rubbish" were too harsh and unfair and needed comment...

... I think the OP's headlining comments that TG's Y service being "rubbish" were too harsh and unfair and needed comment...

I'm having a go at Thai but only after they had a few gos at me! I mean the rubbish that they say on the plane over the PA! And when you actually ask for some of the things promised a few minutes earlier on the PA, they complain that you asked! It's that sort of rubbish. Walk the talk Thai !

I'm not a great fan of LCCs either. But I've so far found the onboard service on LCCs to be pretty darn good. It's about the only thing that IS good about LCCs apart from the fares! It makes a difference when you have to pay for food and drinks: then nothing is too much trouble.

LCC: G&T and wine sir, no problem, that will be $...
Thai: Ohhh OK, but we are so busy.

As for fares: Jet*Asia round trip BKK-SIN in April for THB 2,600 is pretty good. SQ for THB 7,800 and TG for THB 10,000 (all including taxes). They are all website fares. I know the TG fare is too high but that's also a problem for them - it's hard to get decent fares on their website.

OK, on board service is not the only thing that will help TG in the LCC war. I did notice also that almost none of the pax around me the other day on the BKK-KUL flight actually originated in BKK (including myself, I might add).

I'm having a go at Thai but only after they had a few gos at me! I mean the rubbish that they say on the plane over the PA! And when you actually ask for some of the things promised a few minutes earlier on the PA, they complain that you asked! It's that sort of rubbish. Walk the talk Thai !

I really find it hard to believe that a TG attendant complained to you that you asked...I've asked for drinks in econ and while they are sometimes genuinely too busy to get it for you right away (pre-food serving) on a full flight in econ section they get it to you soon enough...

I'm not a great fan of LCCs either. But I've so far found the onboard service on LCCs to be pretty darn good. It's about the only thing that IS good about LCCs apart from the fares! It makes a difference when you have to pay for food and drinks: then nothing is too much trouble.

LCC: G&T and wine sir, no problem, that will be $...
Thai: Ohhh OK, but we are so busy.

On board service on an LCC pretty darn good...? I didnt even have a chance to speak to an attendant (let alone ask prices or purchase anything)...its very much like a free-for-all very loud cattle car with what appeared to be first time tourists or even first time flyers :confused: .....LCCs also almost always never have the right times/dates I need and this is very important if its a time sensitive flight/meeting

As for fares: Jet*Asia round trip BKK-SIN in April for THB 2,600 is pretty good. SQ for THB 7,800 and TG for THB 10,000 (all including taxes). They are all website fares. I know the TG fare is too high but that's also a problem for them - it's hard to get decent fares on their website.

um what? on the website TG promotional fares for this route in econ are Baht 5,200 round trip...just a few more mouse clicks...
<http://www.thaiairways.com/Promotions/Thailand_Promotions/aftershock_en.htm> I think that is competitive

OK, on board service is not the only thing that will help TG in the LCC war. I did notice also that almost none of the pax around me the other day on the BKK-KUL flight actually originated in BKK (including myself, I might add).

not sure what your point is....lounge access is available for *G or biz class/first class passengers in transit too....

I really find it hard to believe that a TG attendant complained to you that you asked...I've asked for drinks in econ and while they are sometimes genuinely too busy to get it for you right away (pre-food serving) on a full flight in econ section they get it to you soon enough...
Oh she complained alright. After asking me what I would like to drink. I HAD waited to be asked. No waving down, no call button. Certainly no smiles on this flight!


On board service on an LCC pretty darn good...? I didnt even have a chance to speak to an attendant (let alone ask prices or purchase anything)...its very much like a free-for-all very loud cattle car with what appeared to be first time tourists or even first time flyers .....LCCs also almost always never have the right times/dates I need and this is very important if its a time sensitive flight/meeting

Well Virgin Blue in Australia has a schedule nearly as big as Qantas the full service airline (between major cities). Lots of their customers are business travellers. Don't think it can't be done! (And my colleagues, going to their business meetings, seem to like the service they have to pay for on Virgin ...). I've been on Jetstar (8 times) and Ryan Air (2 times) - staff were fine on all flights and service was always very prompt but, of course, not free! But as I said, IMHO up to now, the in-flight service is the only good thing about LCCs.


um what? on the website TG promotional fares for this route in econ are Baht 5,200 round trip...just a few more mouse clicks...
<http://www.thaiairways.com/Promotions/Thailand_Promotions/aftershock_en.htm> I think that is competitive
What part of April didn't you understand? :)


not sure what your point is....lounge access is available for *G or biz class/first class passengers in transit too....
That LCCs are point-to-point carriers and that full service airlines can offer through connection services - not just in-flight service. Do you have a fixation with lounge access? :)

Oh she complained alright. After asking me what I would like to drink. I HAD waited to be asked. No waving down, no call button. Certainly no smiles on this flight!



Well Virgin Blue in Australia has a schedule nearly as big as Qantas the full service airline (between major cities). Lots of their customers are business travellers. Don't think it can't be done! (And my colleagues, goiing to their business meetings, seem to like the service they have to pay for ...). I've been on Jetstar and Ryan Air.



What part of April didn't you understand? :)



That LCCs are point-to-point carriers and that full service airlines can offer through connection services - not just in-flight service. Do you have a fixation with lounge access? :)

I am through discussing this point with you because it is clear that you would not be satisfied under any circumstances....I can just imagine what that poor attendant had to go through.... :td:

I am through discussing this point with you because it is clear that you would not be satisfied under any circumstances....I can just imagine what that poor attendant had to go through.... :td:

She really could not have cared less. I made no complaint at all to her. I accepted what she said.

Jet*Asia only commences flying BKK-SIN in a few weeks. Look at the prices. If the schedule suits why would you pay THB 2,500 + more? For what? Service on TG? FF points? Maybe :) And they will be next to go if TG has to reduces the prices to the LCC level. But that's another matter...

Jet*Asia only commences flying BKK-SIN in a few weeks. Look at the prices. If the schedule suits why would you pay THB 2,500 + more? For what? Service on TG? FF points? Maybe :) And they will be next to go if TG has to reduces the prices to the LCC level. But that's another matter...

And they are going, as mentioned in another thread (a big mistake if you ask me - where is the incentive then, for all but business class or *G (Lounge access) passengers?)

Perhaps one model that Thai could consider for these shorter routes is the Qantas Citiflyer model. Qantas competes directly with the LCC Virgin Blue on these routes.

The QF Citiflyer domestic service, in Y, is a weekday service and offers newspapers, headphones, in-flight entertainment, always a snack - sometimes a meal, drinks at all times as well as wine (in quarter bottles) or beer after 4 pm. All that on flights that are sometimes 1 hour or less in the air, on aircraft as big as 767s and A330s. Nothing stellar but pretty good. If QF can do it, so can Thai (better).

What a difference a flight can make.

Did the reverse KUL-BKK. Expected to be able to roast Thai a bit more! But... it was like flying a different airline!

This time: Genuine smiles and pleasant service all round. Smiling check-in staff, smiling lounge staff, warm greetings getting onto the plane. Headphones, newspapers, immigration forms all there. Great cheerful, pleasant crew. Near full 777-200 (the dreaded 10 across in Y, 8 across in J version :( ). Dinner served and cleared incredibly within 45 mins, not the 1 hour of running around beforehand this time. Even got 2.5 thimbles of wine! And even the meal presentation was better - this time all metal cutlery, not all plastic.

I still think the crew has to work too hard. And if there are lots of special meals or passenger requests they just can't do it all in time and then it goes wrong.

ps saw more AirAsia take-offs than any other airline at KLIA.