US Airways Dividend Miles (Pre-FlightFund Merger) - Let's Not Call It First Class Anymore--Domestic Business Class

I'm in the middle of a business trip to SLC. By the time I'm done I'll have been on 19 flights in the last three weeks--17 of them on US. I feel like I live in an airport anymore.

So far I've been upgraded 100% of the time to US First Class. I think we should stop calling it First Class though. Sure on short flights from PHL to RDU or PVD a snack basket is sufficient and is actually a nicer touch than just the hot cookies on UA. You at least have a choice to get XOXO bars, but my 8:45 AM flight yesterday from PIT to DEN was a disgrace. I actually was looking forward to a happy meal. I knew it would be edible and filling. I made the mistake of not getting breakfast before the 3 hour flight--so to my shock, no happy meal as reported here. It was only a muffin and some fresh fruit. Never saw the snack basket. No movie or short. Definitely not what I would even suggest a first class act! Get real, it was not first class by any description.

I connected on a code share to a UA flight. I ended up in E-Plus. For the one hour flight we got a can of soda and a mixed snack. Then 20 minutes later a walk through to see if anyone wanted coffee as well. They played free for all a NBC video. On my recent short flights to RDU or PVD we didn't even have music available.

It got me to thinking maybe US should stop calling it First Class since it isn't and can't even compare to a good E-Plus flight. Let's call it what it is-- Domestic Business. It's a bigger seat--on airbuses has seat power, and gives one more room to work. That's what I appreciate the most, although I guess a sucker was born everyday, since I still keep looking for something decent to eat. Maybe they could be the first to have wireless internet in the front cabin. It's a way to differentiate the product, but let's not even pretend and lie and call it First Class.

I have often said the same about NW FC. I think that is even more deserving of the title than US. If you look at NW FC, the seat pitch is often less than even UA E+, and many flights only have drink service, no food at all! There is absolutely no IFE on their smaller jets, and some of the seats feel older than me. The one thing I will say for them is they do have the friendliest cabin crews, but still, I think the trend towards domestic business class would be a good one for someone to start. Indeed, it could be a revenue booster for airlines, as many companies simply have a "no F" booking policy. This would make it easier for business travelers to justify to their companies to spring for the bigger seat. The only F services that are really worthy to be called F anymore are those offered on widebodies where the int'l business seats are left in place, imho. Good post, btw, I think this is a topic that really should be considered by flyers and airlines alike.

I think the trend towards domestic business class would be a good one for someone to start. Indeed, it could be a revenue booster for airlines, as many companies simply have a "no F" booking policy. This would make it easier for business travelers to justify to their companies to spring for the bigger seat.

I think you're on to something, Danny. AirTran already does this - they have a front Business Class cabin with seats very similar in size to US's domestic F, but serve drinks in plastic cups and don't provide meals even on longer flights. AirTran promotes its biz class as "business class any business can afford"; it's reasonably priced, fully refundable, and travelers at companies with a "no F" policy are allowed to expense it. In fact, the only way to get a refundable ticket on AirTran is to buy a business class seat, so passengers who need flexibility are more likely to spring for the bigger seats.

US might very well earn additional revenue by rebadging the front cabin Business Class and lowering the price for refundable F tickets to a level somewhere around what the cheapest refundable coach fares (usually B or M booking code) currently cost, and make all coach tickets non-refundable. Preferred members would still be able to upgrade the cheap coach fares at the 7/3/1 day window if space is available. It would give US Airways a huge competitive advantage to sell pseudo-F at the same price as other airlines' refundable coach tickets.

Preferred members can already book F for the same price as refundable Y thanks to the "P" class upgrades that confirm at time of booking for Y/B fares. But there are plenty of business travelers out there who have no status on any airline and have to book refundable tickets. I'd imagine most of these businesspeople would be a whole lot more likely to choose US Airways over a rival if given the chance to sit in a bigger Business Class seat with free drinks and snacks for the same price as airline X's coach.

If only we were working for US (and getting executive salaries ;) ) maybe they wouldn't be bankrupt.

I know large corporation travel departments can be stupid, but I don't think they're stupid enough to believe that a business class ticket (even if it is a crummy domestic business class) fulfills the "no F" policy.

At my company, one of the questions I am required to answer on an expense report is "Was the air fare upgraded at any cost to the company?" A $25 upgrade to UA E+ would be a "yes".

There is one problem with changing domestic First Class to Business Class, and that is the Star Alliance. If someone buys an overseas First Class ticket with a US domestic flight, they have to have First Class seat availability on the domestic flight if the flight is on a two-class plane (even if it is First Class in name only). International Business Class would also book into F on a two class plane.

US needs to improve the service, not change the name.

I know large corporation travel departments can be stupid, but I don't think they're stupid enough to believe that a business class ticket (even if it is a crummy domestic business class) fulfills the "no F" policy.

At my company, one of the questions I am required to answer on an expense report is "Was the air fare upgraded at any cost to the company?" A $25 upgrade to UA E+ would be a "yes".

There is one problem with changing domestic First Class to Business Class, and that is the Star Alliance. If someone buys an overseas First Class ticket with a US domestic flight, they have to have First Class seat availability on the domestic flight if the flight is on a two-class plane (even if it is First Class in name only). International Business Class would also book into F on a two class plane.

US needs to improve the service, not change the name.


Correct me if I am wrong, but I think there might be simple answers to both problems. First, as far as whether the upgrade was at cost to the company; if the business class tickets are the only refundable/changable tickets, then you would still probably be ok, because you needed that flexibility. Second, what about connections on RJs? Let's say you want to go MKE-LGW. You have to take an RJ (Y only) to CLT, and then fly to LGW. They book you in whatever the highest booking class available domestically is.

There is one problem with changing domestic First Class to Business Class, and that is the Star Alliance. If someone buys an overseas First Class ticket with a US domestic flight, they have to have First Class seat availability on the domestic flight if the flight is on a two-class plane (even if it is First Class in name only). International Business Class would also book into F on a two class plane.

What does Star Alliance have to do with this? They don't have to have first class on domestic flights. There are many cases on Star Alliance where you can't buy a connecting flight in first. For example if I buy an F ticket for New York to Berlin, I fly JFK-FRA in F and FRA-TXL in C.

How is this really any different?

I have often said the same about NW FC. I think that is even more deserving of the title than US. If you look at NW FC, the seat pitch is often less than even UA E+, and many flights only have drink service, no food at all! There is absolutely no IFE on their smaller jets, and some of the seats feel older than me. The one thing I will say for them is they do have the friendliest cabin crews, but still, I think the trend towards domestic business class would be a good one for someone to start. Indeed, it could be a revenue booster for airlines, as many companies simply have a "no F" booking policy. This would make it easier for business travelers to justify to their companies to spring for the bigger seat. The only F services that are really worthy to be called F anymore are those offered on widebodies where the int'l business seats are left in place, imho. Good post, btw, I think this is a topic that really should be considered by flyers and airlines alike.

NW's first class might have older seats, but I think they're kept a little cleaner than US planes. In addition, on flights over 3 hours in first class, there is always a good meal. NW has a smoother upgrade operation, too.

However, US's bonuses blow out any other award program.

If I wanted such a business class I would fly Air Tran. I keep my business with US for the benefits of a legacy carrier. They exsists, except with FC at the moment. We need improvement of the first class product - not another trend to the LCC movement. If I wanted an LCC there are enough to choose from.

I know large corporation travel departments can be stupid, but I don't think they're stupid enough to believe that a business class ticket (even if it is a crummy domestic business class) fulfills the "no F" policy.

At my company, one of the questions I am required to answer on an expense report is "Was the air fare upgraded at any cost to the company?" A $25 upgrade to UA E+ would be a "yes".

There is one problem with changing domestic First Class to Business Class, and that is the Star Alliance. If someone buys an overseas First Class ticket with a US domestic flight, they have to have First Class seat availability on the domestic flight if the flight is on a two-class plane (even if it is First Class in name only). International Business Class would also book into F on a two class plane.

US needs to improve the service, not change the name.


Hmmmmmmm... incorrect. If US Airways renamed its domestic First Class product to "Business Class", Star Alliance carriers would then use "I" booking code instead of "O" for free tickets. Most Asian carriers offer 2-class flights within Asia, on which the premium class is called Business Class.

If someone uses a Business Class 80,000 miles award ticket to Europe on a Star Alliance carrier, and let's say that the routing was LAX - ORD - LHR, the flight from LAX to ORD, most likely a 2-class aircraft would put the passenger in "O" class since it is the code for domestic First Class on an award ticket on 2-class aircraft, yet "O" is also the booking code for an international First Class award ticket on flights featuring 3 classes of service. In essence, since most domestic flights only offer two classes of service, all US Airways would have to do is change its premium class award booking code on domestic flights from "O" to "I"... something that many other Star Alliance airlines already do. In fact, some airlines like bmi do not have First Class at all, since the British carriers refers to its premium class on both domestic and international markets as "the Business Class."

Yeah, i know what your getting at, US F Class isn't as good as what it used to be, but it is by no means the equivalent of the European intra-Europe business class. Same seats as the rest of coach, just a better meal. They also don't always block the center seat for their "premium" business passengers anymore.

US has comfy F seats, power ports at every airbus seat and a great snackbasket. If you want gourmet food, buy yourself a picnic basket. The more I fly the more seat comfort becomes the #1 issue for me. Yes, UA has great catering, but I hate feeling like a sardine in their narrowbody F Class cabin.

Hey folks since we know US Airways Management reads this board why don't we stack rank in order of importance what we want the F/C product to be?

For me it is:

The larger seat
Priority Security lines
CP Desk
Priority Boarding
Amenities - Drinks & Snack basket
Discounted Club Membership
In Flight Meal

Here is my order of importance:

The larger seat
T/A upgrades {need more}
Free alcohol
CP Desk
Priority Security lines
Disc. Club Membership
Snack Basket
In Flight meal

Hey folks since we know US Airways Management reads this board why don't we stack rank in order of importance what we want the F/C product to be?

For me it is:

The larger seat
Priority Security lines
CP Desk
Priority Boarding
Amenities - Drinks & Snack basket
Discounted Club Membership
In Flight Meal

Piney I would agree 100% with your order with some modifications to the seat. Also can't say about the CP Desk--Don't know about that. I wouldn't even care if no In-Flight Meal if I knew what to expect and when and could buy an In-Flight Cafe meal on longer flights when I'm running and connecting and don't have time to grab a meal.

I would add when we're talking about seats--all should have power port and internet hookup--wireless or lan port.

It would be nice to have music to listen to while I work on all flights-- that would come after the snack basket.

1. Seat size and comfort
2. Priority check-in/security
3. Free booze*
4. Free upgrades from any paid economy fair
5. Availability of some food
6. Quality of that food*



*US should have an inverse relationship between these two, the more of one available, the less of the other will be needed ;)

I know large corporation travel departments can be stupid, but I don't think they're stupid enough to believe that a business class ticket (even if it is a crummy domestic business class) fulfills the "no F" policy.

At my company, one of the questions I am required to answer on an expense report is "Was the air fare upgraded at any cost to the company?" A $25 upgrade to UA E+ would be a "yes".



The way to get around this rule, in some cases, is for US to make all coach tickets non-refundable. Many business travelers require refundable tickets, and for the same price as a Y/B/M refundable coach ticket on another airline, they can get a US Airways "business class" ticket.

If the US business class ticket isn't any higher in price than another airline's refundable coach ticket, then the air fare would NOT be "upgraded at any cost to the company" if the company allows or mandates a refundable ticket.

Knowing the benefits of access to the CP desk, I believe that paid FC/Envoy pax should also be given this benefit too, perhaps under a new 800 telephone # with a new name like "Concierge Service" or "At Your Service", but still hooking up with the ultra-helpful and efficient CP desk folks.

OK, before the regular CPs howl in protest :) , we know that the CP desk currently takes calls 24/7 from the gen resv # in between helping CPs, and there is slack time. Why not think about extending this to paid FC/Envoy pax and calling it an extra perk? You can get another 800 # and make it public, but limit it to the targeted clientele, and have it passed through to the CP desk (or have a section of the CP desk section reserved for this).

Those who pay full fare to fly FC/Envoy deserve this, and I know the CP desk is superbly equipped to take care of them as they do with CPs

It's not like there would be more than 2 or 3 extra phone calls...