Travel Technology - So, which iPod (or PC) users are considering the $500 Mac?

So, are any iPod/PC users considering picking up the new mini Mac? With travellers so tied to their iPods (and their iPods tied to them), will this have an impact on your other purchases as you construct your distributed office?

http://ct.com.com/click?q=e5-9ZLOQgyylwD1gwBrKGFHoUartGaF

From Apple:

http://www.apple.com/macmini/

Timothy

Of course, you still need a monitor, mouse and keyboard, but you'll still have those after you throw out your Windows machine. ;)

The mac mini will (finally) replace my B&W G3 as my video editing station, though I expect to buy the cheapo and upgrade the memory and disk myself.

Quick query, I'm considering buy a Mac mini from the States while I'm over there next month as they're £75 cheaper.

Question is, would I be able to use it back here OK, and what would I need to do regarding power supply as I don't really what to just use a travel adapter permantly.

Quick query, I'm considering buy a Mac mini from the States while I'm over there next month as they're £75 cheaper.

Question is, would I be able to use it back here OK, and what would I need to do regarding power supply as I don't really what to just use a travel adapter permantly.

Definitely check before buying (in fact, I'll look now and see what I can find while still at work). Not every machine Apple makes handles 110 and 220 both by default.

stay tuned...

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update
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Electrical and environmental requirements
Meets ENERGY STAR requirements
Line voltage: 100-240V AC
Frequency: 50Hz to 60Hz, single phase
Maximum continuous power: 85W

From the photos being posted from the MacWorld people, the power brick and cables for this one look a bit unique. It's a shame that they couldn't just use the standard iBook/pBook bricks. Being a hopelessly ignorant American, I'm not sure what sorts of dongles you'd need for this to work based on the specs above, but perhaps you'll know.

Line voltage: 100-240V AC
Frequency: 50Hz to 60Hz, single phase
Maximum continuous power: 85WThe most you'll need is a US->UK plug adapter for the end of the cord. They're *really* cheap.

Let's see, $499 will get you (among other things): a 40GB hard drive, 256K RAM, integrated graphics with 32MB DDR SDRAM, a DVD-ROM/CD-RW drive, one firewire port and 2 USB ports. I think I'll pass! :p

I want one for the cute factor, but with the fact that upgrading the memory MUST be done by an apple tech, and the fact that if I want to put in the memory I want and a superdrive I might as well just buy an Ibook...not unless someone gives me one...*hint* Anyone wanna give me one? :-)

Let's see, $499 will get you (among other things): a 40GB hard drive, 256K RAM, integrated graphics with 32MB DDR SDRAM, a DVD-ROM/CD-RW drive, one firewire port and 2 USB ports. I think I'll pass! :p

After adding a mouse, keyboard, more ram and airport express I think I'd be better off getting a regular Mac. It's cute but it might be a tad underpowered for me.

Let's see, $499 will get you (among other things):

Other things:

iLife '05, which includes...
iPhoto, which now has greater photo editing capability and can accept RAW and MPEG 4 formats
iMovie, which now edits HD video
Garage Band, which now records 8 tracks of audio and writes sheet music as it is recorded
iDVD, with additional menu themes and, not sure, but I thought Steve said it'll burn HDVDs as soon as the burners are out
iTunes
All 5 apps work together, so you can pull media from one into the other seamlessly.

iWork, which includes...
Keynote 2, which is as good, and in some ways better, than Powerpoint. (can import and export powerpoint formatted docs also)
Pages, a brand new word processing app. Looks pretty decent for a first version. It should eliminate the need to purchase MS Office for many.

Mac OS X, including...
Mail
iChat
iCal
Safari
Address Book
All of which work together

Then you have the geek apps, like...
xCode
Just about anything out there for Unix
AppleScript

This is where the true value of a Mac lies. Yes, there are equivalent products available and even bundled with comparable Wintel boxes, but they suck. All of the above apps can be learned within 5 to 30 minutes with no rtfm necessary.

If you compare the Mac Mini to the cheapest machines at Dell or Gateway, they're about the same, maybe $50-$100 cheaper accounting for the fact that they include keyboard, mouse and display. Keep in mind, though, that Dell and Gateway both add a $99 charge for shipping to every desktop order, whereas shipping is always free at the Apple Store. It costs both companies nowhere near $99 to ship their computers, so this is really just a way to hide some of the cost.

So in the end, Apple has brought the Mac to, conservatively, within $50-$100 of a Wintel system.

Would you pay $100 to not have to worry about viruses and spyware? That alone would be worth it to most users, not to mention being able to actually use and, in fact, enjoy the bundled media apps that come loaded on their machine.

And all in a very tidy package: 6.5" on each side, 2.5" tall, 2.5 lbs. :)

I want one for the cute factor, but with the fact that upgrading the memory MUST be done by an apple tech, and the fact that if I want to put in the memory I want and a superdrive I might as well just buy an Ibook...not unless someone gives me one...*hint* Anyone wanna give me one? :-)

I can't give you one, but I can make it a little less painful on the bank account. ;) PM me if you want to take the plunge. :D

OUCH, the configuration I'd like:

512MB DDR333 SDRAM - 1 DIMM
• 80GB Ultra ATA drive
• SuperDrive
• Internal Bluetooth + AirPort Extreme Card
• Wireless Keyboard & Mouse Set
• 56K v.92 Modem
• Mac OS X - U.S. English
• 1.42GHz PowerPC G4

Estimated Ship:
Deliver by Jan 22nd
Free Shipping
Subtotal $1,002.00

That is insane.

For that you still don't even have a monitor.

I can't give you one, but I can make it a little less painful on the bank account. ;) PM me if you want to take the plunge. :D
Ugh, that was supposed to be a PM. :-) So consider this a music in thread...
*sings* STOP, IN THE NAME OF LOVE...
Ok, back to the thread. :-)

OUCH, the configuration I'd like:

512MB DDR333 SDRAM - 1 DIMM
• 80GB Ultra ATA drive
• SuperDrive
• Internal Bluetooth + AirPort Extreme Card
• Wireless Keyboard & Mouse Set
• 56K v.92 Modem
• Mac OS X - U.S. English
• 1.42GHz PowerPC G4

Estimated Ship:
Deliver by Jan 22nd
Free Shipping
Subtotal $1,002.00

That is insane.

For that you still don't even have a monitor.

:) yeah, it's not such a good deal if you're wanting to max it out...

It'd probably be better to go with the iMac to acquire these specs.

First, I'm not suggesting that this be anyone's primary machine for massive amounts of hardcore business (I mean, that's what we all carry Powerbooks for), but if my mother said she wanted to email her grandkids or someone without huge demands or skills on computers wanted to join the Internet age, the base machine--sans Superdrive, Bluetooth, Airport and any fun stuff--is completely functional at $499. Plus, few viruses, no spyware, fully functional email and home software, which means there's actually little to actually support.

Buy a cheap mouse, a cheap keyboard and a $100 monitor and you're done.

As for the factory installed stuff, there will be a human being that, within a day of the release, will have taken the entire thing apart step by step and will have shown you everything you can install. The only thing that usually comes with difficulty is the bluetooth enhancement, but until I see this stuff, who knows.

Sure, if you pimp your ride, it'll get to $1000. But, don't pimp it. Give it to your nieces, grandparents and (in my case) parents. Then buy them a digital camera and they'll have it up in iPhoto without even a telephone call.

Timothy

...then wait for them to start whining about how SLOW their broadband is. :)

Also, as one of my staff members pointed out today, this is kind of the perfect PORTABLE machine (i.e. not like in the laptop definition, but more the ACTUAL sense of being able to move a machine). Try bringing a $400 Wintel box in carryon. I'm wondering how well these machines will do in tradeshow kiosks, since you could theoretically fill a wheelie with a dozen of these things, including power supplies, and have them as carry-ons--I can't tell you how much it costs to ship (or rent on-site) PCs to just be dumb Powerpoint viewers and do the occasional VoIP soft client demo.

I think that the universal nature of the keyboard and mouse, plus the headless aspect, will make this an attractive X-Windows box and will cause Unix geeks to reconsider the $100 Red Hat subscription--just the patch management system alone is worth it. With a $120 external hard drive, this machine is also a reasonable SME server.

Timothy

Of course, you still need a monitor, mouse and keyboard, but you'll still have those after you throw out your Windows machine. ;)

I'll give up my Windows machine when someone pries my cold, dead fingers from it.

Even so, I'm seriously considering getting a mini mac to play around with. It will never replace my PC given the nature of my work, but it would be fun to have around as an additional machine.

I'll give up my Windows machine when someone pries my cold, dead fingers from it.

Is that a suggestion, a request or some form of begging?

Timothy

What do you do that requires a PC, anyway? Write spyware?

I'd pay $100 not to have to watch a bunch of Mac worshippers throw Jr. High insults at other platforms on a travel board...

Is that a suggestion, a request or some form of begging?

Timothy

What do you do that requires a PC, anyway? Write spyware?


GAMING.

Apple is a great product but for a gamer it is not going to happen.

Funny thing is, I build my own PC's but for 1 year now I have ben telling friends and relatives to buy Apples, to me the premium is well worth it when you look at the total package. If they insist on a PC then I tell them to buy a DELL.

For 1 year now the call volume for tech assisstance from family and friends has seriously dropped and i don't dread answereing my phone.

Sure, if you pimp your ride, it'll get to $1000.

I do not call adding some RAM and Wireless to be "pimping" it out.

Pimping it out would have me add a 500Gb drive, 2Gb of memory, Hardware MPEG board and a couple of other goodies.

What I did was simply bring it in line with what is common nowadays.

Write spyware?

That excuse is so lame, I hear it over and over again.

The kind of user that gets spyware on their PC is the same kind of user that will get spyware on their Mac. I've never caught spyware, and none of my friends with PC knowledge have either.

Any decently configured PC will never catch spyware. And of course there is less spyware for the Mac, spyware authors simply don't have the resources to write applications for what is just 5% of the market. Just like they don't invest their time in WindowsMobile, Symbian, Linux or any other flavour of OS.

Of course spyware does not exist on the Mac. So you might want to let this company know: http://macscan.securemac.com/ as they are making a spyware remover for nothing.

But before this ends in another mac bad, windows good thread, let us focus on the product in the title of this thread...

Also, as one of my staff members pointed out today, this is kind of the perfect PORTABLE machine (i.e. not like in the laptop definition, but more the ACTUAL sense of being able to move a machine).
Try bringing a $400 Wintel box in carryon.

I'm wondering how well these machines will do in tradeshow kiosks, since you could theoretically fill a wheelie with a dozen of these things, including power supplies, and have them as carry-ons--I can't tell you how much it costs to ship (or rent on-site) PCs to just be dumb Powerpoint viewers and do the occasional VoIP soft client demo.

I think that the universal nature of the keyboard and mouse, plus the headless aspect, will make this an attractive X-Windows box and will cause Unix geeks to reconsider the $100 Red Hat subscription--just the patch management system alone is worth it. With a $120 external hard drive, this machine is also a reasonable SME server.

Timothy

Wow, so many things to correct, where to begin...

Small format PC's have been around for ages, like the Shuttle series of XPC's. Heck, even Apple tried and failed a few years back.

If all you want is to show powerpoint slides then why bother with PC's at all, there are countless standalone powerpoint presentation devices out there.

Having a carryon full of these is great, but that still doesn't help you when you need to rent the displays for them. The price difference between renting a PC and renting just a display is pretty minimal.

Why on earth would anyone that wants a cheap X-win box subscribe to Redhat? There are countless free alternatives and all of them come with their own good patch management. I've honestly never heard of anyone using a Mac as a dedicated X-terminal. Besides that, if all you want is an Xterm box, then there are plenty of dedicated adapters for under $250, even the mini mac is over powered for just xterm.

Wow, so many things to correct, where to begin...

Small format PC's have been around for ages, like the Shuttle series of XPC's. Heck, even Apple tried and failed a few years back.

If all you want is to show powerpoint slides then why bother with PC's at all, there are countless standalone powerpoint presentation devices out there.

Having a carryon full of these is great, but that still doesn't help you when you need to rent the displays for them. The price difference between renting a PC and renting just a display is pretty minimal.

Why on earth would anyone that wants a cheap X-win box subscribe to Redhat? There are countless free alternatives and all of them come with their own good patch management. I've honestly never heard of anyone using a Mac as a dedicated X-terminal. Besides that, if all you want is an Xterm box, then there are plenty of dedicated adapters for under $250, even the mini mac is over powered for just xterm.

But...but...it's a Mac!

Please see also http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/images/iProduct.gif

Actually, my engineering team, which does a massive amount of Solaris work, uses Powerbooks for network design, system management and Office-based Exchange/Word/Excel, etc. The nice thing about using Macs in this role is that they can, out of the box with an Office 2004 install, balance between the two environments.

I still think these are ideal trade show machines, dedicated Powerpoint displayers and mini-Windows machines aside. For VoIP, which is my area of expertise, I could use these mini boxes and also embed soft clients in presentations, while controlling the entire exercise with Salling Clicker.

I'm not saying that this is an ideal terminal--yes, there are cheaper alternatives--but this is precisely what the linux world has been begging for. Cheap, easily maintained Unix box with Microsoft Office. Why wouldn't you adopt it? Unless you're not bored of chasing down the newest ATI driver.

Sure, I can't go down to Microcenter and buy the fastest, newest gaming video card, but, frankly, I'm not buying business machines for Quake 2. Other than upping the hard disk and memory of laptops and desktops from Dell, I'm rarely configuring anything in a Windows PC. But I know the cost of maintaining that PC after installation is higher than my Mac users. Is that because the Mac guys are senior engineers? Partly true, I'm sure. But it's also just a better OS.

I could care less about the hardware. If you want to run OS X on Intel, you can... buy OpenBSD. But you won't get Office and all the additional tools. If that's fine, good for you.

How many of you knocking OS X actually USE OS X today? Just kind of curious. I live in both worlds, was a Windows guy for years, but I've just made the drift over the past 18 months.

Timothy

Swise:

Are you sure the mini comes with iWork?

I had read it doesn't and the Apple site doesn't mention it (only OS X and iLife '05)

I do not call adding some RAM and Wireless to be "pimping" it out.

Pimping it out would have me add a 500Gb drive, 2Gb of memory, Hardware MPEG board and a couple of other goodies.

What I did was simply bring it in line with what is common nowadays.

Common for what? An entry level PC?

The strange thing about all of this is that the base configuration, though light for a Windows machine, is perfectly acceptable for an OS X running Macintosh, unlike previous versions of the iMac, which have shipped with 128M (or the original iBooks with 64M). I have a iMac G4/700 at home with only 256M of RAM and the thing is downright perky. It also helps to note that I've got OS X and Office 2004 installed on that machine in less than 10G of space, leaving quite a bit for Grandma to work with.

However, if you want a 500G drive, 2G of memory and hardware MPEG, this machine isn't for you... you're probably looking at the full PowerMac. The configuration you're referring to is akin to putting a Porsche engine into a Fiat Bingo. But considering how much stuff you can jam into the tiny chassis--DVD-RW, Bluetooth, Firewire, USB, WiFi--and do so without massive heat syncs and fans, it is a rather impressive little feat.

Timothy

OK, Windows and linux guys... return to sniping.

Fron what I remember, iWork is priced at $79. I have only used Keynote (which I actually like now that I've gotten the hang of it), but I'll probably buy a copy just to see how it works.

Timothy

But...but...it's a Mac!

Please see also http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/images/iProduct.gif

I'm sure one person I know of in Paris has already placed his order! :D

Swise:

Are you sure the mini comes with iWork?

I had read it doesn't and the Apple site doesn't mention it (only OS X and iLife '05)

Opps, thanks for the catch, SE.

iWork is a $79 add-on ($49 at education discount price).

I use a Windows laptop, and am thinking of getting the mini Mac. I have a 42" plasma display, and the mini Mac would be an excellent way to use the plasma display as a monitor without having to mess around with connecting the laptop.

Opps, thanks for the catch, SE.

iWork is a $79 add-on ($49 at education discount price).

So, when you said that is where the true value is, it turns out that the mini isn't that much of a deal?

Out of the box it can't really do too much :(

Nevertheless, it might be a nice media center as I find XP MCE to be a POS.

Does Apple have a decent media center software package yet?

I have a iMac G4/700 at home with only 256M of RAM and the thing is downright perky.

Much in the same way, after using the Mac Mini a little yesterday, it seems to run the basic apps with as much snap as all but the dual G4s out there.

It's not for hardcore video editing, 3D modeling and all that. I believe it is positioned to gain new marketshare, not simply to satisfy the existing customer base. Think of all the PC deals that go on every day, with dell selling their lowest end at $350-$400 - this is what a lot of bargain hunters, students, i-just-need-to-check-e-mail people buy. Now the mac Mini at $500 is going to make them think twice. "Hey, for $500 I can have a unit that doesn't take up lots of space, does all that I need it to, and looks good to boot? I'll take it."

I personally am not gonna buy one, but I think i see where they're going with it. Had quite a buzz at Macworld yesterday anyway.

Does Apple have a decent media center software package yet?
Apple does not, but there are some good addons. EyeTV from Elgato will get you DVR functionality, and there is a freeware app from Apple that allows you to use a Mac as a virtual Firewire DVHS recorder (HiDef!). The Apple DVD player kind of sucks a bit, but the progressive scan issues should be worked out on the next OS release. In the mean time, VLC is great at playing back DVD's, Divxes, etc. Then you have the iApps - iTunes/iPhoto for music and photo viewing.

You would need to buy somthing like the M-Audio Transit to get Optical Audio out, since the Mini does not have it.

Tie all this together with Salling Clicker for remote control, and you have a pretty cool media center.

Hopefully, someone will write a nice U/I to wrap some of this functionality all up too.

I'm thinking about buying one for my new 50" NEC Plasma. Not so much for DVR functionality, as I'm very happy with my new Cox-Supplied Motorola HD DVR, but for the other functions (and some big-screen web browsing).

PS - All this talk about Spyware/Adware - Microsoft is at fault for a lot of this stuff for leaving holes open in their OS. I'll blame the end user for a bit of this, but it is Microsoft's fault. However, given enough time, I'm sure that people would find holes in Firefox, MacOS, Linux, etc. (although with a much lower probability of success).

I am intrigued by this machine, I have never used an Apple in my entire life but more and more I am getting curious. I figure this is a cheap (cheaper) way to check out Apple's way of doing things.
I would hate to plunk down thousands to find out Mac's aren't for me.
(of course to me 5 hunnie isn't exactly pocket change so I havent decided what I am gonna do).

I don't know if that's necessarily a fair assessment.

I went to Dell's site and specified a similar configuration on its low end machine--256M RAM, no software, no monitor, 1 year warranty, DVD/CD-RW drive and WordPerfect (like that's useful)--and it came out at $547.

Sure. Add $29.00 for Works or $149 for Office Basic. $50 for the screen (though it currently is a LCD). Take the free 256M upgrade. And add necessary virus and security protection (not as huge a worry on the Mac) for $69. Out the door at $815, sans shipping and tax.

MacMini at $499, without the memory upgrade (which I find unnecessary for OS X, but people will disagree... I would argue the Mac is usable at the memory level, an XP PC is not). Add decent USB mouse and keyboard for $50. Add iWork for $79. Get Quicken 2005 and iLife free. Add $205 for the 15" LCD from Princeton. Total of $833, sans shipping and tax. If you wanted Office 2004 for Mac, you have the "Home/Academic" version at $139 for an alternative total of $893, a spread of less than $100. With the memory, $75 more for $968 (a price that will drop quickly as the authorized resellers get involved).

Now envision all the help desk calls you get on weekends and weeknights gone. :)

Media stuff is great... it ships with iMovie, iTunes (so it can work with the Airport Express), iPhoto, so you've got a full suite of media editing tools.

As for DVR. With remote control, $159. Don't know much about it... I have my DirecTivos.

http://www.miglia.com/products/video/alchemytvdvr/index.html

I can't speak for its quality (that was just a paste from MacWorld), but then again... according to the Washington Post and New York Times technology editors, I think we're still waiting on a quality DVR for Windows. ;)

Timothy

Such a devil's advocate you are when it comes to these things. :)

So, when you said that is where the true value is, it turns out that the mini isn't that much of a deal?

Out of the box it can't really do too much :(

ok, ok, so I accidentally include 2 out of around 15 apps that you don't get out of the box, but that doesn't null out the value. Everyone will find something different that they appreciate and place the most value upon out of the iapps that are included. For me it's Mail, iPhoto, iTunes and especially iChat. I use my .mac homepage for positing all my pictures. To give you an idea of how simple it is, I actually imported my digital pics into iPhoto and created a web site from New Year's Eve while drunk off of my A** around 3 AM New Year's Morning. A few days later, I stumbled across the new page on my web site, unaware that I had created it! :D If that's not a ringing product endorsement, I don't know what is. :)

Others really get into the video editing and DVD burning in iMovie and iDVD. And then I know some folks who absolutely love Garage Band. Each to his or her own, sober or sloshed.


Nevertheless, it might be a nice media center as I find XP MCE to be a POS.

Does Apple have a decent media center software package yet?

What media center-type activities would you want it for? DVR? Jukebox for the stereo/a place for holding your music collection? Ripping DVDs?

People do it, and there are 3rd party apps out that'll make it work just fine. I think I read a post in the thread on Slashdot that mentioned how someone had an old G4 set up for this purpose. ..... ..... Found it. (http://apple.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=135660&cid=11325723)

For a PVR solution, I kinda like this one (http://www.formac.com/p_bin/?cid=solutions_converters).

I'm planning on holding out, as there will surely be more elegant, integrated options available at some point.

So to answer your question, Apple doesn't have an integrated package like that yet, but there are third party options available.

I don't know if that's necessarily a fair assessment.

I went to Dell's site and specified a similar configuration on its low end machine--256M RAM, no software, no monitor, 1 year warranty, DVD/CD-RW drive and WordPerfect (like that's useful)--and it came out at $547.

Sure. Add $29.00 for Works or $149 for Office Basic. $50 for the screen (though it currently is a LCD). Take the free 256M upgrade. And add necessary virus and security protection (not as huge a worry on the Mac) for $69. Out the door at $815, sans shipping and tax.

MacMini at $499, without the memory upgrade (which I find unnecessary for OS X, but people will disagree... I would argue the Mac is usable at the memory level, an XP PC is not). Add decent USB mouse and keyboard for $50. Add iWork for $79. Get Quicken 2005 and iLife free. Add $205 for the 15" LCD from Princeton. Total of $833, sans shipping and tax. If you wanted Office 2004 for Mac, you have the "Home/Academic" version at $139 for an alternative total of $893, a spread of less than $100. With the memory, $75 more for $968 (a price that will drop quickly as the authorized resellers get involved).

Now envision all the help desk calls you get on weekends and weeknights gone. :)

Media stuff is great... it ships with iMovie, iTunes (so it can work with the Airport Express), iPhoto, so you've got a full suite of media editing tools.

As for DVR. With remote control, $159. Don't know much about it... I have my DirecTivos.

http://www.miglia.com/products/video/alchemytvdvr/index.html

I can't speak for its quality (that was just a paste from MacWorld), but then again... according to the Washington Post and New York Times technology editors, I think we're still waiting on a quality DVR for Windows. ;)

Timothy

Huh. I am typing this on a new Dell Celeron 2.6 which I got a little over a month ago. It cost 289€, including shipping, with a combo drive and a "free" upgrade to 512MB. Came with a keyboard and mouse, too. I added 20 bucks for a bluetooth adapter. Maybe the American peso is a lot further in the ****ter than I thought, or maybe you aren't trying very hard.

Granted, it doesn't look like Barbie's toaster, but that's OK.

Such a devil's advocate you are when it comes to these things.




I absolutely adore having the Mac<>Win debate. It's always a lot of fun.

Granted, it doesn't look like Barbie's toaster, but that's OK.

ok, now this is just not a fair statement. Everyone knows that Barbie's toaster is pink, and this box is brushed aluminum. There's not even any pink fake fur trim anywhere on it.



;)

ok, ok, so I accidentally include 2 out of around 15 apps that you don't get out of the box, but that doesn't null out the value.

...

People do it, and there are 3rd party apps out that'll make it work just fine. I think I read a post in the thread on Slashdot that mentioned how someone had an old G4 set up for this purpose. ..... ..... Found it. (http://apple.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=135660&cid=11325723)

For a PVR solution, I kinda like this one (http://www.formac.com/p_bin/?cid=solutions_converters).

I'm planning on holding out, as there will surely be more elegant, integrated options available at some point.

So to answer your question, Apple doesn't have an integrated package like that yet, but there are third party options available.

Puh-leese. :rolleyes: My PC came with over 150 apps! Wordpad, Messenger (which actually has other people on it), Movie Maker, even Control Panel!

Let's not be disengenuous here...this Mac thing is a cheap computer that comes bundled with the same bog-standard crap Windows and Linux machines come bundled with in the OS. Do you get paid to write ad copy for Apple, by any chance?

BTW, recording a TV show != media center. See Meedio, XP Media Center Edition, MyHTPC, Freevo, MythTV, etc. PC-based, 10-foot interface, integrated remote control, no need for mouse, keyboard, or a half-dozen contraptions hanging out of every USB port. This new Apple box might make a good platform for such a thing, but there is no software even close to doing it (and a Google search turns up absolutely nothing likely in development).

OK, Mac talk has drawn me out of lurking :D

...To give you an idea of how simple it is, I actually imported my digital pics into iPhoto and created a web site from New Year's Eve while drunk off of my A** around 3 AM New Year's Morning. A few days later, I stumbled across the new page on my web site, unaware that I had created it! :D If that's not a ringing product endorsement, I don't know what is. :)

Others really get into the video editing and DVD burning in iMovie and iDVD. And then I know some folks who absolutely love Garage Band. Each to his or her own, sober or sloshed.

I think the "digital hub" stuff is really where OS X shines. A buddy of mine is a great example, he's a new parent, and picked up an iMac and a FireWire video camera. With iMovie and iDVD he's able to really quickly make some really slick looking movies (which he can push up to his .mac page or burn to DVD).

iPhoto is also, by far, the best solution I've ever seen (not to say I have seen everything) for dealing with photos. Organizing, putting up on the web, ordering prints and books, making cool little slideshows, it all just works.

My mom always had a hell of a time dealing with her photos on a PC, and after I got my dad switched over to a Mac for his business, he's got to kick her off of it because that's the only place she'll connect her camera now.

To the price poo-poo'ers, this may not be the system for you. If you're the build-your-own-PC-and-put-neon-tubes in it, great, but for a vast majority of computer users (and what I think might become more important, the current non-computer users), this box does all of the functions people want to do today: music, pictures, video, web, e-mail, and does it all well, and for a fair price. And it looks cool as hell :D

But anyway, I'll get off my soap box.

Oh, and Swise, if you want to wave any magic wands and push my order to the head of the stack, I wouldn't complain or anything ;) I'm picking one of these babies up to replace a little Linux web server I've got at home... no more dealing with Linux patches for me!

ok, now this is just not a fair statement. Everyone knows that Barbie's toaster is pink, and this box is brushed aluminum. There's not even any pink fake fur trim anywhere on it.



;)

I'll bet there are Hello Kitty cozies for it within two weeks in Ahkibara! :P

Edited to add: I am going to buy one (the iMini or whatever it's called, not the Hello Kitty thing). I'm guessing that Apple will pull their usual stunt and sell it for $899 over here, available sometime in October. I guess I'll have to hit an Apple store in the US when there is a supply.

I think the "digital hub" stuff is really where OS X shines. A buddy of mine is a great example, he's a new parent, and picked up an iMac and a FireWire video camera. With iMovie and iDVD he's able to really quickly make some really slick looking movies (which he can push up to his .mac page or burn to DVD).



AKA Movie Maker, something that was in XP before the Mac had it.


iPhoto is also, by far, the best solution I've ever seen (not to say I have seen everything) for dealing with photos. Organizing, putting up on the web, ordering prints and books, making cool little slideshows, it all just works.


XP has excellent built in photo support, or there is always Google's Picasa.

I'm always amazed how Apple makes it sound like the have the patent on "easy", but most of the things they manage can all be done just as easy on a PC.

As for iLife, if Microsoft tried to pull that stunt they'd be sued for taking advantage of their monopoly. The only reason iLife and all the other iWhatever products are so "good" is because there wasn't much of an alternative for beginner users.

Puh-leese. :rolleyes: My PC came with over 150 apps! Wordpad, Messenger (which actually has other people on it), Movie Maker, even Control Panel!

um... the Mac comes with a lot more that I didn't mention. But mentioning every Gnu app, for example, would exceed the space limitations here. The Macintosh OS is BSD Unix. Every Unix app works on a Mac completely natively. Must people don't really use many Unix apps day-to-day, though, so I didn't mention them. I have no idea how many apps total actually come bundled in the box. I would guess a couple of hundred, not including what you can access through Terminal.

Let's not be disengenuous here...this Mac thing is a cheap computer that comes bundled with the same bog-standard crap Windows and Linux machines come bundled with in the OS.

That's just it: the standard apps that come with every Mac are not the same bog-standard crap you get with Windows and Linux machines. These apps are actually widely considered the best in their class. Sure, you can edit a video on any machines, but you can do it easily, enjoyably, more efficiently, more intuitively using iMovie than any of the bog-standards out there. Apple spends as much as Dell on R&D, but Dell is 10 times Apple's size. The end result is that the products offered are actually good and often the best. Watch the most recent keynote (http://stream.apple.akadns.net/) to see some of the demos of the iApps.

Do you get paid to write ad copy for Apple, by any chance?

Not to write ad copy, no.

BTW, recording a TV show != media center. See Meedio, XP Media Center Edition, MyHTPC, Freevo, MythTV, etc. PC-based, 10-foot interface, integrated remote control, no need for mouse, keyboard, or a half-dozen contraptions hanging out of every USB port. This new Apple box might make a good platform for such a thing, but there is no software even close to doing it (and a Google search turns up absolutely nothing likely in development).

Apple does not discuss products in development. You will not find anything official related to future products in a google search. If you do, you can be sure that a team of lawyers has already descended upon whoever hosts the site, whoever publishes the site and whoever leaked the information. There are three such cases now.

Apple's famous for its secrecy. 99% of the employees have no idea what's being announced until the public does. 5% may have a bit of information here, another bit there, but nowhere near enough to have any significant knowledge.

AKA Movie Maker, something that was in XP before the Mac had it.

I didn't say Apple was the first person to come out with it... I was just implying that they did it the best :)


XP has excellent built in photo support, or there is always Google's Picasa.

I'm always amazed how Apple makes it sound like the have the patent on "easy", but most of the things they manage can all be done just as easy on a PC.

As for iLife, if Microsoft tried to pull that stunt they'd be sued for taking advantage of their monopoly. The only reason iLife and all the other iWhatever products are so "good" is because there wasn't much of an alternative for beginner users.

While I admit I haven't used XP's photo support lately, the last time I used it, it had nowhere near as many features as iPhoto, lacked the organization tools, the ability to make a web page (either export actual jpg's and html, or publish to something .mac-like), do slideshows, make printed and bound books, etc.

I'm certainly not claiming these things can't be done on Windows, I just think (and this is totally subjective) that the Mac makes it easier and more intuitive, and is more pleasant to use.

Here's my 2 cents on Mac vs Dell: It's not the price, nor the apps, nor the add-ons. It's simply this:
Mac... Cool!
Dell... Yech!

Here's my 2 cents on Mac vs Dell: It's not the price, nor the apps, nor the add-ons. It's simply this:
Mac... Cool!
Dell... Yech!

And that pretty sums up what the Mac has going for it.

It is "cool".

Who cares about price, software, installed base. It's COOL.

And that pretty sums up what the Mac has going for it.

It is "cool".

Who cares about price, software, installed base. It's COOL.

Clearly, you've never been to a MacWorld... :D

It's not about "cool".


Now maybe in the grand scheme, one could argue that everything is relative...

mac:wintel/linux::Millhouse:Comic Book Guy

Clearly, you've never been to a MacWorld... :D

It's not about "cool".


Now maybe in the grand scheme, one could argue that everything is relative...

mac:wintel/linux::Millhouse:Comic Book Guy

I have been to many of them, including International versions.

All I ever saw was hyped geeks looking like they were expecting some kind of miracle.

Of course it's about cool, why else would people RUN from the Macworld yesterday to the closest Apple store and buy 10 shuffles? It's about being seen with the product, it's got sex appeal, and people want it.

Apple:Computers :: Bose:Audio equipment

"Better sound through Marketing"

Just looked at the Apple website, the cheapest display they have is $999... Why couldn't they bring back a decent 15" LCD for this machine, they could have pu together a package with the mini, an LCD and a keyboard/mouse for under $800. What a missed chance :(

You are now forced to buy some off-the-shelf monitor to match your lovely brushed aluminum toaster...

Just looked at the Apple website, the cheapest display they have is $999... Why couldn't they bring back a decent 15" LCD for this machine, they could have pu together a package with the mini, an LCD and a keyboard/mouse for under $800. What a missed chance :(

You are now forced to buy some off-the-shelf monitor to match your lovely brushed aluminum toaster...

Apple sticks to high-end displays.

mini + display +kb and mouse = emac, which sells for $799.

They just released the product yesterday. I'm sure they plan on testing the waters first before getting too creative.

Throw some pink fake fur fringe around your toaster and a couple of strips around your after market, cheapo LCD, and they'll match beautifully.

Throw some pink fake fur fringe around your toaster and a couple of strips around your after market, cheapo LCD, and they'll match beautifully.

I wonder how long it'll be before the accessory market for these really takes off... I mean if there are iPod socks, there's bound to be a whole line of Mac Mini Cozies! :D

AKA Movie Maker, something that was in XP before the Mac had it.
Actually, iMovie was around (2000) long before XP (and Moviemaker) was.

You know, it IS possible to discuss the positives and negatives of various operating systems or hardware without it becoming a p*ssing match. Of course, I can't say I've seen it happen that often.... :rolleyes:

One comment I wanted to make was regarding using this Mac mini as a "media center" sort of unit. The main drawback I see in this use is the storage space. This tiny box uses a 2.5" (laptop size) hard drive, so the max capacity of the internal is 100GB right now I think (maybe 120GB now or soon?) and Apple will only sell up to 80GB anyway. Essentially infinite storage can be added by plugging in FireWire external boxes, but too much of that would destroy the advantage of the nice small box. You could still keep things pretty small if you keep it to one external HD.

Apart from the limitation of the internals, there really isn't anything it couldn't do in this regard, at least nothing that I can think of. It would take a lot of optional software and probably a couple of hardware dongly things to do all the media center-type stuff, but then it isn't billed out of the box as such a thing. I'm not entirely familiar with all the features that Microsoft's Media Center solution provides, but I'm pretty confident there isn't anything that can't be done in Mac capable software and hardware that would work with this box. Will it be done for less money? Don't know. More elegantly? Maybe sometimes, but it's really subjective from what I see around here. One person's "easier" is another's "clunky" it seems, and who am I to argue that they're "wrong"? The experience is in the eye of the beholder. Yes, some of it may be simple unfamiliarity, but that doesn't mean there is no valid criticism. This holds true from either side. Both are equally prone to standing on ridiculous bias.

BTW, the RAM on the mini is likely to be user upgradable, even though the official line is you shouldn't do it. When you open the unit, apparently the RAM is easy to get to, and this process won't void the warranty. The HD, however, is behind too many things, and this will be against the warranty.

Disclaimer: My bias is that I prefer Macs, and I have one as my desk computer at work in addition to the ones I have for personal use. I try not to jump on anyone for choosing or not choosing a given OS. :D

What do you do that requires a PC, anyway? Write spyware?

:rolleyes: Yeah, Spyware. Care to add Hacking, Identity Theft, and Terrorism to the list, too? :rolleyes:

Fortunately, Macs are immune to this sort of thing - http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=61798

:) yeah, it's not such a good deal if you're wanting to max it out...

It'd probably be better to go with the iMac to acquire these specs.

I'll do my own max'ing and risk my 90 day warranty, but I'll wait until the die-hard techie mod'ers get their hands on them and see what they can do (like how big a disk it can handle, for instance).

:rolleyes: Yeah, Spyware. Care to add Hacking, Identity Theft, and Terrorism to the list, too? :rolleyes:

Oh, so it's YOUR fault I'm felt up by the TSA on one-way last minute tickets with no luggage! I thought it was iPod envy.

Timothy

What I love about this argument, having started it, is that it reenforces the belief that Apple people are zealots and resolves that Windows people still are working on their new reason to hate Macs.

Oh, so it's YOUR fault I'm felt up by the TSA on one-way last minute tickets with no luggage! I thought it was iPod envy.


Hey! Look at that: This thread is now travel related!

Good job!

Good job!

*Takes Bow*

Oh, so it's YOUR fault I'm felt up by the TSA on one-way last minute tickets with no luggage! I thought it was iPod envy.

Timothy

What I love about this argument, having started it, is that it reenforces the belief that Apple people are zealots and resolves that Windows people still are working on their new reason to hate Macs.

Oh, Please.

If you check back to the start of the thread, I was one of the people who said I was serious considering picking one up to play around with.

But apparently I'm just getting one so that I'll have a first hand experience to allow me to better nit-pick all of the problems w/ Macs.

Common for what? An entry level PC?

The strange thing about all of this is that the base configuration, though light for a Windows machine, is perfectly acceptable for an OS X running Macintosh, unlike previous versions of the iMac, which have shipped with 128M (or the original iBooks with 64M). I have a iMac G4/700 at home with only 256M of RAM and the thing is downright perky. It also helps to note that I've got OS X and Office 2004 installed on that machine in less than 10G of space, leaving quite a bit for Grandma to work with.

However, if you want a 500G drive, 2G of memory and hardware MPEG, this machine isn't for you... you're probably looking at the full PowerMac. The configuration you're referring to is akin to putting a Porsche engine into a Fiat Bingo. But considering how much stuff you can jam into the tiny chassis--DVD-RW, Bluetooth, Firewire, USB, WiFi--and do so without massive heat syncs and fans, it is a rather impressive little feat.

Timothy

OK, Windows and linux guys... return to sniping.

Apple's own web site says 128Mb required for OSX and 256MB for iLife. As minimums are just that, I'm betting that running iLife on the $499 box will be like driving a Fiat Bingo with a Fiat Bingo engine.

Also, the jury is out on this "fanless" device. Remember the cube?

I still want one though. :)

AKA Movie Maker, something that was in XP before the Mac had it.



iDVD perhaps, but not iMovie. I was using iMovie in early 2000.

But apparently I'm just getting one so that I'll have a first hand experience to allow me to better nit-pick all of the problems w/ Macs.

SEA... we adore you. It's a little brighter than "Sea, I AM YOUR FATHER! Join the dark side!"

But this has turned into an Apple-Windows wizzing war, thus we will have collateral damage. And, I must admit, you are the only person who actually answered the question in the topic, though we haven't resolved whether you actually HAVE an iPod. ;)

Timothy

PM me if you need any help with the switching thing. It is, after all, a little late to save Christmas. However, I'm sure someone will help you acquire a .WAV of the stoner girl's Windows error beep.

I don't have an iPod - I've got a 4GB Creative MuVo2. I've got 6500+ songs in WMA format - so getting an iPod has never made much sense for me.

To answer the original question is

NO

Wife has an ipod, that's about it.

Until Apple has the equivalent of a multimedia computer with remote control and has the look of a component unit for my stereo, doesn't cost an arm and a leg, then I will be interested ;)

No I-pod here, but I'm considering buying the mini Mac anyway. I've always loved the sleek look and feel of OS X.

Functionally, it has the basics in a nice, compact, cool-looking case.

Also, the jury is out on this "fanless" device. Remember the cube?

I, too, thought it was fanless, but heard today at the expo that there is one fan, and it "expedites" air up through the "bottom" (though it can be used on its side) and "blows" out the vents that look more like radiant heat vents.

Didn't hear a fan going at the show, but then again, it isn't exactly quiet at Moscone.

And yes, remember the cube. Still my mom's #1 machine, alive and running with daily use. Couldn't switch her over to windows. Looks like she'll be "upgrading" to this one instead on Jan 22nd.

=========1/30/05========
looking at the service manual now, I'm not so sure there is a fan. There is a funny "thermal pad", but I don't see an actual fan. hmm.

OUCH, the configuration I'd like:

512MB DDR333 SDRAM - 1 DIMM
• 80GB Ultra ATA drive
• SuperDrive
• Internal Bluetooth + AirPort Extreme Card
• Wireless Keyboard & Mouse Set
• 56K v.92 Modem
• Mac OS X - U.S. English
• 1.42GHz PowerPC G4

Estimated Ship:
Deliver by Jan 22nd
Free Shipping
Subtotal $1,002.00

That is insane.

For that you still don't even have a monitor.

Unless you order that configuration from Dell. ;)

Actually some of those parts are yesteryear - I'm shocked a new rig from Apple is sporting Vic-20 esque componentry! :eek:

I'd pay $100 not to have to watch a bunch of Mac worshippers throw Jr. High insults at other platforms on a travel board...

^ :D

I don't have an iPod - I've got a 4GB Creative MuVo2. I've got 6500+ songs in WMA format - so getting an iPod has never made much sense for me.

I don't understand why it wouldn't make sense? iTunes can convert unprotected WMA files.

I don't understand why it wouldn't make sense? iTunes can convert unprotected WMA files.

Who says he has unprotected files?

Besides that, converting 6500 WMA's doesn't really make sense, it's better to just pick a player that can play your own music as each conversion will degrade the quality of the file, especially if it's VBR WMA.

I'm betting that running iLife on the $499 box will be like driving a Fiat Bingo with a Fiat Bingo engine.


What is this famous Fiat Bingo everyone is talking about? :confused:

My main gripe about this new Mac is the poky 2.5" laptop drive, which moreover adds an unneeded ~$25 to the machine's cost.

What is this famous Fiat Bingo everyone is talking about? :confused:

My main gripe about this new Mac is the poky 2.5" laptop drive, which moreover adds an unneeded ~$25 to the machine's cost.

Two reasons:

- more compact
- cooler

Two reasons:

- more compact
- cooler

Obviously. I would also add:
- will help making sure the Mini won't cannibalize iMac sales, due to its slow and capacity-limited HD.

The ~3W difference in power consumption, and additional ~300cm3 of a regular desktop drive aren't factors which couldn't have been addressed in a newly designed machine. Sure, the toaster would be a little thicker...

BTW, recording a TV show != media center. See Meedio, XP Media Center Edition, MyHTPC, Freevo, MythTV, etc. PC-based, 10-foot interface, integrated remote control, no need for mouse, keyboard, or a half-dozen contraptions hanging out of every USB port.

MyHTPC, which is now known as Meedio (the commercial version of MyHTPC) is not a media center in the sense that it has no built-in functionality -- it uses external applications to play DVDs, etc. Freevo and MythTV are, OTOH, media centers but they do _not_ run under Windows, only Linux.

As you probably know, the XP Media Center was orginally a hardware/software product that sold for what? $1,300+ or more, IIRC.

I am not sure what, other than possibly MCE, you are referring to with the "integrated remote control, no need for mouse..."

This new Apple box might make a good platform for such a thing, but there is no software even close to doing it (and a Google search turns up absolutely nothing likely in development).

Using a Mac (including the Mini) for a media center is actually not that bad an idea. Assuming you get the Airport card with the machine, you can then buy an AirPort Express Base Station with AirTunes ($129) which gives you: 1. a wireless router (up to 10 machines plus a printer port) and 2. provides a optical output to connect to an audio amplifier. The audio for a DVD is sent wirelessly to the amp via the base station.

There is also the Keyspan Express Remote ($59) which gives the Mac remote control.

You can read about both products here:
http://tinyurl.com/3pexv

For software, there is Apple's DVD Player, plus there are Videolan (VLC) and MPlayer. Just like with Windows, as the hardware becomes more popular, the software will come.

There's also Salling Clicker. For $19.99, you can use any Sony Ericsson, Palm and some Nokia phones to control a Mac via Bluetooth.

Great for iTunes in hotel rooms.

Timothy

Who says he has unprotected files?

Besides that, converting 6500 WMA's doesn't really make sense, it's better to just pick a player that can play your own music as each conversion will degrade the quality of the file, especially if it's VBR WMA.

Exactly right. I don't want to convert my music because going from one lossy format (unfortunately, my music isn't in lossless WMA, as that didn't exist at the time I ripped it) to another would lower the audio quality.

Almost all of my songs are unprotected, but I do have about 20 or so unprotected.

Re-ripping my CDs, isn't really an option given that it would take a lot of time, and even if I had the time, all my CDs are sitting in a storage locker 4800 miles away.

Even if I could over come all of those other factors, I'd still be wary of the iPod given that I'm a Windows user. Having had the misfortune of using numerous versions of QuickTime on Windows for years, I'm fairly convinced that Apple doesn't know how to write good software for Windows. I haven't used Apple's software for the iPod on Windows, so I can't comment first hand on it - perhaps it is better.

Funny how all these formats kind of worked. ;) I thought about doing all my music in AAC loss-less, then decided I'd take the size penalty and just do good old 128K VBR MP3. I am sure I suffer some loss of battery life for it, but hey... all my old Creative Jukebox stuff went easily into the iPod.

iTunes (and Quicktime, for that matter) works like a charm on my staff's Windoze laptops. The only thing I don't like about it is that I constantly have to whack them off my Powerbook's library when I'm listening to stuff at work--the sharing stuff works TOO well! :)

Timothy

Definitely check before buying (in fact, I'll look now and see what I can find while still at work). Not every machine Apple makes handles 110 and 220 both by default.

stay tuned...

-------
update
------

Electrical and environmental requirements
Meets ENERGY STAR requirements
Line voltage: 100-240V AC
Frequency: 50Hz to 60Hz, single phase
Maximum continuous power: 85W

From the photos being posted from the MacWorld people, the power brick and cables for this one look a bit unique. It's a shame that they couldn't just use the standard iBook/pBook bricks. Being a hopelessly ignorant American, I'm not sure what sorts of dongles you'd need for this to work based on the specs above, but perhaps you'll know.


yeah, check that out. The new iMac don't have international power supplies, silly apple

yeah, check that out. The new iMac don't have international power supplies, silly apple

Huh?? These things are being sold internationally... do you really thing if you bought one in Holland it would come with a US power plug? I don't think so.

And they're Mac mini's, not an iMac :)

Huh?? These things are being sold internationally... do you really thing if you bought one in Holland it would come with a US power plug? I don't think so.

And they're Mac mini's, not an iMac :)

No, I just mean that most older apples would come with a 110/240 voltage internal powersupply, powerbooks and desktops alike. but the latest iMac, doesn't have that internal voltage range built in, meaning one cannot buy it in the states and then travel abroad, and just change the plug. One has to use a volatage convertor which is never fun with a computer. Not getting the right Hz, messes with the CPU performance and memory.

I don't know why apple would move away from that, other than to reduce the exportation of products which are historically MUCH more expensive abroad.

Heck, that is how I orignally put myself through business school.

I'm unclear what you're talking about here. From Apple's own web site:

iMac G5:

Electrical and environmental requirements

* Meets ENERGY STAR requirements
* Line voltage: 100-120V AC or 100-240V AC, depending on country of purchase
* Frequency: 47Hz to 63Hz, single phase
* Maximum continuous power: 180W
* Operating temperature: 50° to 95° F (10° to 35° C)
* Storage temperature: -40° to 185° F (-40° to 85° C)
* Relative humidity: 5% to 95% noncondensing
* Maximum altitude: 10,000 feet

They do make a dual voltage version of the iMac G5 and, as listed above, the iMac Mini. I can't say for sure whether the US version is the 100-120V or the 100-240V version, but you have the option of purchasing either. Whether you do it in the States or in Europe is a matter of preference and currency.

Timothy

I will check in the next US Apple store I visit, though. Just to solve the mystery.

I'm unclear what you're talking about here. From Apple's own web site:

iMac G5:

Electrical and environmental requirements

* Meets ENERGY STAR requirements
* Line voltage: 100-120V AC or 100-240V AC, depending on country of purchase
* Frequency: 47Hz to 63Hz, single phase
* Maximum continuous power: 180W
* Operating temperature: 50° to 95° F (10° to 35° C)
* Storage temperature: -40° to 185° F (-40° to 85° C)
* Relative humidity: 5% to 95% noncondensing
* Maximum altitude: 10,000 feet

They do make a dual voltage version of the iMac G5 and, as listed above, the iMac Mini. I can't say for sure whether the US version is the 100-120V or the 100-240V version, but you have the option of purchasing either. Whether you do it in the States or in Europe is a matter of preference and currency.

Timothy

I will check in the next US Apple store I visit, though. Just to solve the mystery.


wow, usually don't have this much communicating.

iMac bought in the US, will only work in the US or with a voltage convertor, if used OUTSIDE the us.

Historically, the machines came with universal PS, meaning they could be used everywhere, regardless.

Personally, I like having the 100-240 voltage, since I take my machines abroad often.

Quick query, I'm considering buy a Mac mini from the States while I'm over there next month as they're £75 cheaper.

Question is, would I be able to use it back here OK, and what would I need to do regarding power supply as I don't really what to just use a travel adapter permantly.


So basically, the answer to my question all those pages ago, is NO

So basically, the answer to my question all those pages ago, is NO

Sorry, I didn't see your question. The answer is Yes. AFAIK all Macs should be useable here by substituting the power cord that goes between the computer power supply and the household current. At least, that is how it works on the continent and I see no reasons it wouldn't work the same in the UK.

On the Apple site, the electrical specs for the Mini are:

# Line voltage: 100-240V AC
# Frequency: 50Hz to 60Hz, single phase

As long as your falls somewhere in there, you'll just need a new cord.

No, I just mean that most older apples would come with a 110/240 voltage internal powersupply, powerbooks and desktops alike. but the latest iMac, doesn't have that internal voltage range built in, meaning one cannot buy it in the states and then travel abroad, and just change the plug. One has to use a volatage convertor which is never fun with a computer. Not getting the right Hz, messes with the CPU performance and memory.

I don't know why apple would move away from that, other than to reduce the exportation of products which are historically MUCH more expensive abroad.

Heck, that is how I orignally put myself through business school.

I don't believe you are correct. All of the external-power-adapter-based Apple products I own (PowerBook, Airport Extreme base station, and Cinema Displays) all have 110-240v power supplies. My mini should ship "on or before" 1/21, so I'll report back when I get it :D

I don't believe you are correct. All of the external-power-adapter-based Apple products I own (PowerBook, Airport Extreme base station, and Cinema Displays) all have 110-240v power supplies. My mini should ship "on or before" 1/21, so I'll report back when I get it :D


notice here, "the latest iMac" where I said, this ONE machine seems to be a change in what gets supplied?

please do report back though

Let's see, $499 will get you (among other things): a 40GB hard drive, 256K RAM

Ummm, I think you're off by an order of magnitude here. It's 256MB RAM.
Where did you get K from?

Feorlen and I are going to be first in line for one of these.
We're just waiting for it to hit the ADC schedule.

I own multiple macs from B&W to Titanium Powerbooks and g5 towers. I am a little bit worried about this mac mini. I'm afraid it is not a long lasting product kind of the like the cube. I still think the emac at under 800 is a great deal. If you need more step up to the g5 tower. I think after you start adding up the stuff you need it will start adding up. I mean a monitor is going to cost you at least 200. :td:

To be correct Movie Maker came with Windows ME (a long time before XP). In my eyes that's a moot point though. If I find a decently priced matching display I'm switching.

Since I probably will get a refund for my faulty Ibead 256MB I will throw in a Ipod shuffle as well.

From today's wsj.com (Sorry... no free rides, here). Thought it was helpful for the conversation.

Timothy

Kinda makes me wish I had seen the fizzle. Sounds really cool. I have to blame the user, though--I ALWAYS read the machine's power configuration.

Electronics With Borders: Some Work Only in the U.S.

By DAVID PRINGLE and STEVE STECKLOW
Staff Reporters of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
January 17, 2005; Page B1

To save money, Chris Caine, a resident of Fiji, always orders computers made by Apple Computer Inc. from the U.S., where they are significantly cheaper. Recently, he purchased Apple's newest desktop, the iMac G5.

Soon after the computer arrived from the U.S. he plugged it in. There was "a big bang, like an explosion, and white smoke out of the speaker grilles," he says. The machine then died.

Mr. Caine didn't have a defective unit. It turns out that, unlike the 17 other Apple computers that he had purchased in recent years for his DVD-rental business, the new iMac G5s sold in the U.S. are designed to work only with the electric power systems in the U.S. and Japan, which pump out a lower number of volts than in most other countries.

Mr. Caine fell foul of a little-noticed trend: Some consumer-electronics companies are designing products so they will work only in the U.S. For example, some of the latest printers from Hewlett-Packard Co. refuse to print if they aren't fed ink cartridges bought in the same region of the world as the printer. Nintendo Co.'s latest hand-held game machines are sold in the U.S. with power adaptors that don't work in Europe.

I have always found it a disgrace that appliance connectors (like on the back of most PC's and laptop power bricks) are the same, no matter what input voltage they are made for.

Plus around the world are all different, a US plug isn't made for 220, and a European plug isn't made for 110, but on the back of the box they are all the same, it's just asking for trouble.

It would be no more than $4 in parts to built some kind of protection into them to prevent stuff from blowing up, and Apple is absolutely not alone in this.

From today's wsj.com (Sorry... no free rides, here). Thought it was helpful for the conversation.

Timothy

Kinda makes me wish I had seen the fizzle. Sounds really cool. I have to blame the user, though--I ALWAYS read the machine's power configuration.

Electronics With Borders: Some Work Only in the U.S.

By DAVID PRINGLE and STEVE STECKLOW
Staff Reporters of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
January 17, 2005; Page B1

To save money, Chris Caine, a resident of Fiji, always orders computers made by Apple Computer Inc. from the U.S., where they are significantly cheaper. Recently, he purchased Apple's newest desktop, the iMac G5.

Soon after the computer arrived from the U.S. he plugged it in. There was "a big bang, like an explosion, and white smoke out of the speaker grilles," he says. The machine then died.

Mr. Caine didn't have a defective unit. It turns out that, unlike the 17 other Apple computers that he had purchased in recent years for his DVD-rental business, the new iMac G5s sold in the U.S. are designed to work only with the electric power systems in the U.S. and Japan, which pump out a lower number of volts than in most other countries.

Mr. Caine fell foul of a little-noticed trend: Some consumer-electronics companies are designing products so they will work only in the U.S. For example, some of the latest printers from Hewlett-Packard Co. refuse to print if they aren't fed ink cartridges bought in the same region of the world as the printer. Nintendo Co.'s latest hand-held game machines are sold in the U.S. with power adaptors that don't work in Europe.



gee, I wonder where I heard that warning.

:rolleyes:

Pictures of the mini along with packaging and size comparison.

http://www.uneasysilence.com/mini/

notice here, "the latest iMac" where I said, this ONE machine seems to be a change in what gets supplied?

please do report back though

My Mini just arrived (hooray!), and it did come with a 110-240v power supply. The brick is a bit bigger than the ones for my Cinema Displays, but it's not obese, and it'll be hidden away, anyway.

Chris

I am considering the mini! My current environment at home is:

1. Win98 - not really used much - mostly sits there occupying desk space. It is probably 4 years old (Tiger Direct). 1x 80 gb hard drive, CDRW

2. WinXP 3 years old (?) Tiger Direct AMD - my primary computer - 2x80 gb hard drives DVD

3. Red Hat 9.0 Linux Tiger Direct AMD - 2x80 gb hard drives, php, apache, mysql, perl.

4. Panasonic Toughbook CF51 - just switched to this laptop since it has Centrino and the battery lasts 4+ hours versus the HP 17" laptop I had when the battery would last 1.5 hrs (usually it would die before my flight requires laptop to be turned off).
(http://catalog2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ModelDetail?displayTab=O&storeId=11201&catalogId=13051&itemId=71095&catGroupId=12871&modelNo=Toughbook-51&surfModel=Toughbook-51)

5. Apple 2e - 80 column card, 2400 baud modem, external floppy drive, purchased December 1983.


Considering the mini just to mess around with a Apple again. Its been a long time.

...it did come with a 110-240v power supply.

So this means that I could buy one in the US, and use it in the UK? If so, what else would I need to purchase?

Also, could I avoid the costs of the wireless and bluetooth by purchasing usb adapters separately?

So this means that I could buy one in the US, and use it in the UK? If so, what else would I need to purchase?
an appropriate cable or adapter for the wall outlet.

Also, could I avoid the costs of the wireless and bluetooth by purchasing usb adapters separately?
you may be able to save a few bucks by doing that but is it really worth it to have two external usb devices and a hub along with necessary drivers, instead of the internal which 'just works' ?

you may be able to save a few bucks by doing that but is it really worth it to have two external usb devices and a hub along with necessary drivers, instead of the internal which 'just works' ?

just splitting a hair here...

Like nearly any peripheral plugged into a Mac, USB bluetooth adapters won't require installing any drivers. I've had about three, and all have worked out of the box.

I'm guessing you can pick up USB Bluetooth adapters new/retail for about $30-$40 now. To have a Mini configured with one is $50. If it were me, and I didn't have three lying around, along with a USB adapter, I'd probably go for configuring the mini with BT built-in.

Then again, you could probably find a USB hub for around $5 and a used BT dongle on ebay for $25...

I'm guessing you can pick up USB Bluetooth adapters new/retail for about $30-$40 now. To have a Mini configured with one is $50. If it were me, and I didn't have three lying around, along with a USB adapter, I'd probably go for configuring the mini with BT built-in.

... my point exactly! I've got them already, so there's no real point of having it built in and paying extra.

One other thing. Will my wifi dongle work with the airport express thingy that apple do?

The Airport Express should work with it, as the streaming technology is a proprietary protocol that runs over standard TCP/IP, which allows iTunes to stream from both PCs and Macs.

Timothy

My Airport Express arrives later this week. I'm still pondering the Mac Mini.

just splitting a hair here...

Like nearly any peripheral plugged into a Mac, USB bluetooth adapters won't require installing any drivers. I've had about three, and all have worked out of the box.

splitting hairs again, only peripherals that comply with industry standards do not need special drivers. the internal bluetooth adapter connects via usb, it shows up as a standard human interface device (hid), there are drivers already built into osx, and the apple adapter is really a d-link in drag anyway. that is why the external ones work fine.

the 802.11 usb adapters do require additional drivers, and most do not have mac support.

if one is set on using an external 802.11b/g add-on, then the best choice is a wireless ethernet bridge, such as the linksys wet-11. it will work on anything with an ethernet port. however, they are generally more expensive than the internal apple airport card.

airport is just apple's name for 802.11, so whether you get the internal airport card or an external solution, it will connect with any 802.11b/g base station, either apple's or third party. there may be a slight issue with using passphrases (i.e. wep key conversions vary across different vendors), but that is about the extent of it.

http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/pulpit20050120.html

Thought this was relevant to the material. What I'd love to have is something likea Mac Mini that could take in external input, like the video rentals, and burn to DVD with rights management for my travels. Kind of an iTunes for movies.

Timothy