Travel Technology - MS Anti-Virus? Beta Version?

Microsoft Offers Free Virus-Removal, Anti-Spyware Programs


WASHINGTON (AP) - Microsoft Corp., whose popular Windows software is a frequent target for Internet viruses, is offering a free security program to remove the most dangerous infections from computers.
The program, with monthly updates, is a step toward plans by Microsoft to sell full-blown antivirus software later this year.

Microsoft said Thursday that consumers can download the new security program from the company's Web site - www.microsoft.com - and that updated versions will be offered automatically and free each month. It will be available starting Tuesday.

Also, Microsoft offered Thursday a free program to remove "spyware," a category of irritating programs that secretly monitor the activities of Internet users and can cause sluggish computer performance or popup ads.

Link to full article (http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGBKE8H4N3E.html)

Anyone heard of this or tried it? With the "success" of SP2 (which I still haven't loaded), I'm skeptical.

1) SP2 IS successful.

2) The Spyware package is a product from a company Microsoft bought last month, and it was considered one of the best out there

3) The direct download to the new anti-spyware beta is here:

http://download.microsoft.com/download/8/1/5/815d2d60-49b5-44dc-ae35-fca2f2c6f0cc/MicrosoftAntiSpywareInstall.exe

The free program they are currently giving away is only an anti-spyware program. After using another program for some months, I downloaded and installed Microsoft's beta version. Their version (MS's) found stuff the other (SpySweeper by WebRoot) missed. It's rather nice and I wonder what the final price would be. I'm guessing not too much but a yearly subscription because we all know, residual income is where it's at.

On a side note, none of my four PCs have had any problems with SP2. But that's just me. :)

The company MS bought was named Giant Company (http://www.giantcompany.com/), and their claim to fame was an antispyware program, "Giant Antispyware", that, in several well-regarded tests, compared very favorably with the leaders, Ad Aware, SpyBot S&D and Spy Sweeper (Webroot). The link to the MS beta download is on that Giant Company webpage.

The one notable downside was the product showed more false positives that is thought to be normal, and so it typically flagged more items that the others did not. Also, it is considered a good practice to use several of these for the reason that they don't all identify the exact same thiongs (A identifies what B does not, C picks up what A and B do not id).

I'm liking the Microsoft one so far, it's finding things the other scans didn't when I ran them back to back.

I downloaded it and tried it (from the link posted above).

I use spybot s&d on this system, but with no run time protection. I have a firewall and A/V on this system, I usually don't get any spyware here.

MS A/S found 2 registry keys for something called searchsquire. It removed them. It also complained about TightVNC which I have installed on this notebook. At least the default action for it was "ignore". I changed it to "always ignore".

I then did a deep scan (selecting all the options), and it didn't find anything else.

I didn't enable any of the run time protections.

It does add a 'run' key to HKLM ... (even with all the run time protection turned off.) It leaves something running in the system tray also. (you can right click to exit it.)

I'm probably removing it.

-David

I'm liking the Microsoft one so far, it's finding things the other scans didn't when I ran them back to back.

I'm liking it too, they did a good thing when they just puchased a good company instead of inventing it themselves...

I don't like programs that leave themselves running in the system tray when you haven't enabled any run-time protection, and in this case, start themselves via the 'run' registry key when you haven't enabled it to do so. I don't see any options to turn that stuff off.

So .. I removed it.

-David

I don't like programs that leave themselves running in the system tray when you haven't enabled any run-time protection, and in this case, start themselves via the 'run' registry key when you haven't enabled it to do so. I don't see any options to turn that stuff off.

So .. I removed it.

-David

I seem to recall being prompted for this in the intial install dialogue (run-time protection).

I don't like programs that leave themselves running in the system tray when you haven't enabled any run-time protection, and in this case, start themselves via the 'run' registry key when you haven't enabled it to do so. I don't see any options to turn that stuff off.

So .. I removed it.

-David

Having auto protection was an option during installation.

I don't like programs that leave themselves running in the system tray when you haven't enabled any run-time protection, and in this case, start themselves via the 'run' registry key when you haven't enabled it to do so. I don't see any options to turn that stuff off.

So .. I removed it.

-David


yeah, the enable on startup option, should have prompted on install, but it doesn't . One only needs to INTO options, and disable it. It won't startup again.

Program technically, is still called GIANT, only the install program and download link is MSFT yet. All of services, Reg entries are still giant.

Funny bug is that it targets MSFT antispyware as a potential UNKNOWN application hook, possibly targeted for removal.!! Silly Bill

I answered "no" to all the run-time and the so called "join the community" (send data to a central site) options when I installed the program.

When I started the program, the system tray program stayed up even after I closed the main program. I had to right-click on the system tray icon to exit completely, even though no run time protection was enabled.

The key was added to HKCU/.../run at install time even though I answered "no".

I didn't see any dialogue in the tools/options to turn any of that off.

-David

I tried to make my point clear, but have failed.

all the run time options, whether or not a user wants them or not, are not presented upon install.

So, if you go into options, there are about five ADDITIONAL options that will be enabled even though upon install they were not presented or requested.

I had the same trouble, actually with Giant about two months ago. I had to go in and turn them all off.

Thanks for the clarification. I'll try it again. (but I thought I looked at all the options. Maybe I missed some.)

-David

I went through every option there is, made sure all the run time protections were turned off and it still leaves the system tray program running and still left a run key in HKLM/...

I tried varying some of the options that may have been unclear, with the same result each time.

In windows 98 it was easy for programs to add bits to the startup folder. With XP, it's easy for programs to add services and startup programs via the run keys which in many cases serve no useful purpose when you aren't specifically using those programs other than to waste system resources. If you don't stay on top of this, all that crap can bog down your system performance. Hiding this stuff the way windows does just makes it harder to turn off and clean up from crap like this. (You may want to keep a particular application for occaisional use, without having it think it's the center of the universe and can start whatever it wants when the system is booted, because it can't possibly imagine that you aren't interested in running/using it all the time.)

At least spybot s&d lets me do what I want when I want it.

itunes, ipod, tivo desktop 2.0, quicken online backup, norton ghost all suffer from this same syndrome, so I'm not just picking on this one. quicken online backup and norton ghost are defeatable and the programs still work. (Change the service to manual start rather than automatic, it will only start them when you need them. In ghost you have to click 'reconnect' and it starts the service it needs. Of course, they both leave the services running, but at least you have the ability to go in and stop the service manually when you don't need them running. Still a bug in my book though, but defeatable.)

-David

services query and run tomorrow,

Folks, we all seem to be forgetting that this is a BETA.

I'm very impressed, and I sense the end of all other third party spyware packages.

Folks, we all seem to be forgetting that this is a BETA.

I'm very impressed, and I sense the end of all other third party spyware packages.

Until the Mozilla foundation writes one :p.

Hmmm. It flagged VNC as spyware, which it isn't. It also loaded itself as a startup, without asking, even though I set the preferences so that it wouldn't.

It certainly seems to have the Microsoft "we know better than you how you should use our software" philosophy.

nmemaker .. it's in HKLM/software/microsoft/windows/currentversion/run.
IIRC, the key is named gcasServ, the string value is "C:\Program Files\Microsoft AntiSpyware\gcasServ.exe"

It's not running any services since I had all the run-time protection turned off.

-Davd

Folks, we all seem to be forgetting that this is a BETA.

I'm very impressed, and I sense the end of all other third party spyware packages.

Sure, it's Beta, but it's based on a working commercial product. You should be able to install the product and run it the way you want to. Not the way they tell you to run it.

Let's say, for example, I want to use spybot s&d and use spybot's run time protection, but I want to keep this product installed on my machine, so I can use it to do an occaisional deep scan. Should there be anything left running or started at boot time if I haven't enabled it? Or, I want it on my notebook, but I want to be able to turn it off when I don't want it running for whatever reason I have for that.

Remember, I'm not just picking on this program. There are lots of other products that suffer from the same "I'm the center of the universe and I'm the only software program that matters on your system" problem.

-David

There's a forum for this thing ... I posted my issues there. Maybe something will come of it, maybe not. Not sure how else to send beta issues back to the developers.

-David

Folks, we all seem to be forgetting that this is a BETA.

I'm very impressed, and I sense the end of all other third party spyware packages.

I agree ... actually I have to ... I am not such a guru, and don't have the "problems" like LIH Prem...
It runs fine since I installed it. And I trust your "advise". BTW, this is a great forum for people like me. I learn a lot from Scott ... LIH Prem ... nmenaker and others..

I agree ... actually I have to ... I am not such a guru, and don't have the "problems" like LIH Prem...
It runs fine since I installed it. And I trust your "advise". BTW, this is a great forum for people like me. I learn a lot from Scott ... LIH Prem ... nmenaker and others..

As already pointed out, it is a beta, but of a product that I had been using for months now just fine. The problem posted above is new to this install only. I actually had this software on Monday, but when I got it it said "if you are already running Giant, don't uninstall that to install this" Well, I did it anyway on a machine or two.

post your problems here, i'll putem up on MSDN. I've already sent "bill" about five comments this week as it is.


OT: Anyone see the yellow Kill Bill billboards up on 101? That's FUNNY!

As already pointed out, it is a beta, but of a product that I had been using for months now just fine. The problem posted above is new to this install only. I actually had this software on Monday, but when I got it it said "if you are already running Giant, don't uninstall that to install this" Well, I did it anyway on a machine or two.

post your problems here, i'll putem up on MSDN. I've already sent "bill" about five comments this week as it is.


OT: Anyone see the yellow Kill Bill billboards up on 101? That's FUNNY!

Don't forget that the installer was made completely to spec by Microsoft, and it's perfectly possible that they decided they didn't WANT that option to work, so everone would get the resident scanner as part of the beta.

Frankly I'm pretty happy getting a daily scan for spyware on my desktop.

So, as a funny aside, I uninstalled the MSFT version of this antispyware from one computer, flushed everything out of reg as well,

then did a reinstall of MY version of Giant from a couple weeks ago. I got my latest copy in advance of the pre-release for MSDN. So, with the old/virgin copy I did a reinstall.

Funny thing was, it found three things the MSFT version had not. A clickability cookie, passport of course, the cookie for passport and the windowsmedia cookie.

maybe MSFT bought them, just so Giant wouldn't be reporting the MSFT cookies as spyware anymore.

anyway, I'll go back to running this one a while.

post your problems here, i'll putem up on MSDN. I've already sent "bill" about five comments this week as it is.


Thanks!

No, I haven't seen those billboards, but I'll be driving down 101 from Burlingame to Menlo Park on Wed. (then back up on Friday). Where are they?

-David

On 101 north, bout menlo just past the Porsche dealer on the right side, east side of the highway.

Big yellow BB's it's a play on KILL BILL the Tarentino film, so they are that fly yellow orange colour.

The website is a site that supposedly "larry" is suppossed to head to, in order to kill bill. Some sort of whacked oracle promotion me thinks.

I think someone will get them pulled pdq.

I'm very impressed, and I sense the end of all other third party spyware packages.

I'd have to say no to that last idea. If anything, it will reinvigorate the others, for ex. to research anything MSFT purposely ignores.

Depends on the pricing.

If Microsoft stays free, or about the same, then the rest of them will go away unless they do bundled rebate deals with TurboTax or something.

I haven't had a case when I run another scan after a microsoft one where the other one finds something. I have had cases in the last few days where Microsoft has found something, I ignored it, ran another scan, and it didn't find it, then went back in and removed it with Mocrosoft's product. It's finding more stuff, which is about all I care about.

If they are forced to market against the others, it won't be hard for them to win people over.

I've only used it a few days, and I'll gladly pay for it when the time comes.

Depends on the pricing.

If Microsoft stays free, or about the same, then the rest of them will go away unless they do bundled rebate deals with TurboTax or something.


personally, I think that if microsoft prices it "similarly" there will be quite a market for competitors, since even the lay person is a bit suspect of MSFT and would appreciate an unbiased third party to do the spyware scanning.

For years now, a multiple tool approach has proved to be the best solution, and I think that that will continue to be the way we do antispam, spyware or antivirus for several years. I really don't think we will have ONE acceptable product in those three areas that is better than the multiple procuct approach.

I think this is an opportunity for an integrator, who can create a front end for those applications. Check for updates, run the scan, present a summary across all three application types. It is sort of like DNA, within the family mixing is NOT a good idea.


;)

I'm very pleased. I also like the option to "fix up" IE.

Jan

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For years now, a multiple tool approach has proved to be the best solution, and I think that that will continue to be the way we do antispam, spyware or antivirus for several years. I really don't think we will have ONE acceptable product in those three areas that is better than the multiple procuct approach.
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The comment on the multiple tool approach is right on target and says it all.

And one more important point to consider. MSFT's track record is that when they buy a solution (rather than develop it themselves), they rarely, if ever, advance the state-of-the-art, they're more known for dumbing down these things.

I've got to say that I'm pretty impressed, especially since I'm pretty jaded with M$ these days (then again, it wasn't developed by them). I'm glad they are starting to take seriously the issues and open holes they have in the OS. This is a great step in the right direction for them.

Actually, it's an ad from intralinks offering larry some M&A and consulting services.



On 101 north, bout menlo just past the Porsche dealer on the right side, east side of the highway.

Big yellow BB's it's a play on KILL BILL the Tarentino film, so they are that fly yellow orange colour.

The website is a site that supposedly "larry" is suppossed to head to, in order to kill bill. Some sort of whacked oracle promotion me thinks.

I think someone will get them pulled pdq.

And we wonder what will happen if M$ starts charging for this at the end of the beta:

http://news.com.com/Microsofts+anti-spyware+pickle/2061-1009_3-5520009.html?

And we wonder what will happen if M$ starts charging for this at the end of the beta:

http://news.com.com/Microsofts+anti-spyware+pickle/2061-1009_3-5520009.html?

oh, make no mistake. this is going to be a saleable product

oh, make no mistake. this is going to be a saleable product

I certainly wouldn't bet your cookies on that.

I certainly wouldn't bet your cookies on that.


I don't mean quality, like "you could SELL that" just, that I think there intention is to make it a rev stream.

Well it's not for sale. It just showed up on my PC through MS Update. I guess the beta was a short one.

Then again, after I installed it I don't see it anywhere? Is in invisible or did MS rush it out too fast?

Well it's not for sale. It just showed up on my PC through MS Update. I guess the beta was a short one.

Then again, after I installed it I don't see it anywhere? Is in invisible or did MS rush it out too fast?

well, it IS a beta and most betas are naturally free. Whether or not they chose to charge for it, is up to bill. I think they should do a better job on AV, and give THAT away.

The thing that got downloaded last night was not the new (Giant) MS A/S app.

It's something else. (At least as far as I can tell .. there's no new programs on my system and I did download and install it last night). It must be a one-time run application. The kb article says there will be an update each month. I think it just removes a few key apps. It's hard to tell from the kb article. Not much info there. There was also a security update.

http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=39987

Thanks. I was pretty sure MS wouldn't send a beta over windows update.

Here's my prediction for the MS A/S application.

They will eventually bundle it in and make it part of the security center. Maybe in SP3? They won't charge extra for it. Until then, you'll be download it for free, they might even make it an optional component downloadable via windows update.

This is all a pure guess. I don't have any inside information. JMHO.

-David

And one more important point to consider. MSFT's track record is that when they buy a solution (rather than develop it themselves), they rarely, if ever, advance the state-of-the-art, they're more known for dumbing down these things.
I guess you have never used Front Page or SQL Server then. ^

Thanks. I was pretty sure MS wouldn't send a beta over windows update.


yeah, if this was somehting over WU, then no it was not hte beta of the MSFT / giant antispyware.

There IS a section in WU, that will allow one to turn on beta downloads, but it is a few levels deep.

There is an option to "hide" it and it appears to me to actually remove it, not just hide it, from the system tray, since I don't see the icon when I look at the system tray properties.

So to remove the icon from the system tray: From within the Beta Anti Spyware program; Go into Options, Settings, General, then at the bottom there is an option you can enable to "hide" the program in the system tray, which as mentioned above, will keep it from loading in the system tray.

I tried that option to hide it and it didn't work for me.

-David

I guess you have never used Front Page or SQL Server then. ^

Alongside MIIS (formely MMS, formerly Zoomit), or MOM 2005 (once other versions of MOM, prior to which was NetIQ).

I tried that option to hide it and it didn't work for me.

-David
That's weird. It is working for me so far. Perhaps uninstalling and reinstalling the program and trying it again might work.

I did that too. (as described earlier in this thread).

Thanks,
David