MilesBuzz! - Carry-on baggage. Time to do SOMETHING???

This thread and my comment below, was inspired by one on the UA board, from a posting made by a UA flight attendant about the size and number of bags she needs to deal with daily on US domestic flights, and how RUDE the main offenders can be, at the same time as delaying the flight for everyone else. :
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum50/HTML/003764.html

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WHEN the CEO's from the 10 major US carriers sit down, work out a carry-on policy they ALL agree to live with, and ENFORCE, the better the entire system will be IMHO.

If they ALL do it starting April 1st or whatever date they agree on, no-one loses ANY customer patronage as the playing field is level. It worked with non-smoking and it will work with carry-ons, if the airlines have the WILL.

Try carting on some of this junk onto Qantas domestically and you are in for a BIG surprise. It simply does NOT get past the gate agents .... they MAKE you walk down and check it in. You miss your plane due to that - too bad. You'll only try that stupid trick once, and you'll CHECK it next time. Works like a charm.

The FA's I realise can only raise their eyebrows so much .... it is basically too late once these cretins have boarded late in many cases, as the Captain is screaming for all seated an push back. It needs to be signposted heavily at check-in and then further ENFORCED by gate agents as much of the problem is the business "supremo" who goes straight to gate for check-in. YES, there are carry-on "templates" all over US airports, but it seems to me there is no WILL from management and most staff to enforce the carry-on size they dictate is "legal". Does anyone reading this believe many of the pieces of bulky junk in the overheads has any chance of fitting into one of those templates?

The United "rules" for instance say TWO pieces is the maximum with certain size and weight parameters. (But Rudi states that Star Gold pax are permitted an extra piece on top of this.) The maximum weight is set at 50 pounds. That is an INSANELY high limit for carry-on as it is IMHO. Many here would have truble physically pushing something of that weight into an overhead. A bag weighing that and falling on someone in the aisle seat in flight or on takeoff/landing could easily kill you. Think about it. 50 pounds is exactly what 17 bottles of champagne weighs. Overhead bin doors DO regalarly fly open, (especially on a hard landing) and contents DO fall on passengers - ask any FA. 17 bottles of wine or equivalent weight of anything else can easily kill ... especially if it landed on a child or elderly passenger.

NO airline in the USA wants to be first to "get tough" as they will lose business customers. And I know about the CO/UA fracas and X-Ray machines etc. That is the root problem .. no consistency agreed by all majors. And yes, many here are business guys who do not have "time" to check bags or wait for them at the carousel and want to wheel/haul their 50-75 pounds of stuff plus suit pack on board to save them time, and delay the rest of the 150 passengers. Too bad in my view.

Nothing will stop weather delays, equipment hassles, and the inevitable labour disputes during each year - they are all facts of airline life that can't be predicted or really avoided. However, ensuring EACH pax boards with precisely the carry-on allowance they are entitled to by their seating (and QF has larger allowances for J and F) will do more to get a loaded 182 seat Boeing 757 taking off on-time than ANY other single factor.

What do others think?

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~ Glen ~

Instead of treating the symptom, let's consider the root cause.

Most travelers aren't carrying on excessive amounts because they enjoy hauling suitcases through airports, jostling with everyone else to get precious overhead space, and all the other fun stuff that goes with carry-ons. People carry on their luggage because check-in lines are intolerably slow, because luggage can take a half-hour or more to show up at the baggage carousel, or because the passenger went to Paris and the luggage to Perth.

Fix the problem, not the symptom. Make it easier to check luggage. Make the luggage show up at the destination faster -- much faster.

That will solve the carry-on problems, and there'll be no need for rules concocted by the anally-retentive.

[This message has been edited by wideman (edited 11-23-2000).]

Why stop at Qantas rules? Why not Iraqi Airways carry-on rules? Before the Gulf War, their carry-on limit was whatever you could carry in your pocket. It was suppose to make it harder for terrorist to bring aboard machine guns. An Iraqi 737 got hijacked over Saudi Arabia in the mid-80's anyway!

British carriers also are stringent in carry-on bags. The common roll-on bag is allowed, but weight limits are a very strict 11 (or is it 13) lbs. I once was just under the weight limit (with no checked bags). For a business day (or overnight trip), the trip is too short to be waiting for luggage or to have lost luggage.

I vote with my feet. I am considering UA, not QF, because the carry on limit is too strict. I'd like to see a 1 bag, 20-25 lb. limit.

Recently on a flight from LAS to LAX, a pax tried to carry on a suitcase twice the size of DL's "size wise" thing. The FA stopped him (after some discussions), but I agree that one should not have to get past the gate agent with those huge carry-ons.

So I believe what we need is both ozstamps' and wideman's approach - do not allow too large or too heavy carry ons at all (and do not let them get past the gate), and try to get a system that does actually work.

But shouldn't airlines also increase their liability (especially on int'l flights though CDG http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif ) to actually make people check more items? If I travel, their maximum compensation does not even match what I check, so why should I check more?

ozstamps etc.
Good idea about not getting past gate agents but from my experience they are usually too busy to notice, especially processing people at the last minute - time constraints, etc.
I have yet to see a gate agent peak over the podium and look at people's carry-ons for size, and even if they did notice, they don't have time for dialogue and the objection that the passenger is going to give them at that moment. Sometimes there is only one gate agent with other people on line so it would be difficult if not impossible.
I say build a hatch inside the cabin with a chute down into a cargo pit and write your own bagtags to fill out the city of destination.
Many times people are not even wanting to relinquish the bag at the end of the jetway to be taken by a rampserviceman to be put in the cargo hold or they are well within the aircraft wasting more time moving back to the jetway to do that.

Wideman's idea is the reason I carry on.

Always.

Carrying on saved us on Latin Pass. Part of our group was held up for an hour in Caracas waiting for luggage while my wife and I were already resting up at the Intercontinental.

Djlawman

Got to agree with oz on this. I feel airlines' enforcememt of their own rules is much too lax.
When my wife and I travel, we always check in one large suitcase and bring our flightbag on board. When filled, my old reliable flightbag has the small and large pockets fully expanded, and has never failed the "sizer" test. If it's heavy, it goes under my seat, rather than endanger someone, should it fall out of the overhead. Many times, because of its apparent bulk, it has drawn glances from the gate agents and FAs, but its never had to be checked, as it fits within the sizer's parimeters. And we usually get a "cabin baggage" sticker from the gate agent, after its dimensions have and weight been verified.
But it never ceases to amaze us what we see being brought aboard the aircraft. Large softsided hockey equipment bags fully loaded,
those large rolling "flightbags" much too large to fit in the sizers let alone get into the overhead bins, yet being stuffed into the overheads, much to the squashing of other people belongings.
The airlines can make all the rules they care to. What it boils down to IMHO, is that these rules have to be enforced, and travelers should be made aware of that fact.

bj-21.

What they really need to do is make FAs adhere to the same rules..ever looked at the pile of bags THEY try to bring on the plane? Any how many only get them on because they pull up the template to get them through the x-ray machine..

I don't disagree with your comments, ozstamps. I always carry my luggage on board, and am very conscious of not exceeding the guidelines. I will admit, though, to once or twice dragging an extra small bag onto the plane with me. Not a big deal, or is it? If everyone brought along an extra small bag, there would never be enough room for all of it. But from my perspective, I'm going to do everything I can to prevent checking my luggage, for two reasons. First, the majors have shown a complete inability to efficiently deliver luggage in a timely manner. It's ridiculous to have to wait up to an hour in baggage claim to retrieve my bags, and this is common in many airports. Some of the worst that come to mind are JFK and MIA. Second, I'm tired of having to buy new luggage or pay for repairs every time the baggage handlers wreak their havoc on my luggage. I buy top-of-the-line luggage that should last for years, but the airlines can destroy a bag in just a few trips. Try making a claim for the damage and you get a littany of disclaimers - we're not responsible for wheels, we're not responsible for handles, we're not responsible for normal wear & tear (since when is an 8" gash in the material considered normal wear & tear?).

Bottom line is, when the airlines manage to improve their baggage operations, the carry-on wars will stop. Until then, passengers will continue to board with the kitchen sink and demand their rights to do so. The only other solution I can think of is to charge for cabin baggage - that would certainly be an incentive to some to check their luggage!

I usually don't mind the wait for my bags when I get home to ORD - it gives me a chance to freshen up, call for my taxi, etc. But on the trip out, especially on a business trip, I am completely unconvinced that my bag checked at the front desk will make it to the same destination as I do.

I'm often carrying 3-4 days of dress clothes, and I'm not the easiest size in the world to fit on short notice (54 XL jacket) if AA loses my suits. But, I know my garment bag is a little over the regs at that point.

I never have a problem, though, because
I understand the concept of gate-checking my garment bag before boarding even begins. I walk to the gate about 10 minutes before boarding starts, and ask the gate agent how full the flight is. If it's empty, I carry the bag on - there'll be enough space. If it's 2/3 full or more, I ask to gate check my bag right then and there. I always get a friendly response from the agent, becuase (s)he realizes that I'm trying to save everybody as much hassle as possible. I've never lost a gate-checked bag - where could it possibly go??

The key, though, is to ask for the gate-check before the agent starts boarding. Otherwise, I think that you are seriously inconveniencing the gate agent, the FAs, and your other passengers.

My "modest" proposal is as follows. Make every passenger (whether or not they have any checked luggage) wait in the terminal until the last piece of checked baggage has been delivered. The result of such a proposal? Airlines would need to find a way to deliver all checked luggage within 10 minutes of gate arrival.

Just to be clear: I am not actually suggesting this result. Rather, I am emphasizing that unless and until the airlines take responsibility for timely delivery (and accept substantial liability for computers, cameras, etc.) there is a "tension" between checked baggage and carry-on.

Originally posted by rcs85551:

But shouldn't airlines also increase their liability (especially on int'l flights though CDG http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif ) to actually make people check more items? If I travel, their maximum compensation does not even match what I check, so why should I check more?

This is the real issue for me, on international flights, $9 per pound, and what is it, $650 max?
On all flights, no coverage for anything that's worth anything, electronics etc.

I'm just thankful for the business world going to casual dress. I can now pack everything in a legal size roll-on.

As I said in the UA board I think, ozstamps, this doesn't bother me. It's what the flying public wants -- more carry on space, more carry ons, less checked baggage.

I hate checking baggage for all the reasons you all brought up -- poor baggage handling, delayed baggage, waiting interminably for the bags to appear, lost flexibility for last minute re-routes, etc. etc.

I think people are treated differently. If you check in as an elite member or in F, you board first and you bring more bags and there is room for them. People who board late have more problems finding room and that is when the airline uses an eagle eye to spot extra carry-ons and insist that they be checked. That is my experience anyway and I have no problem with it.

I do have a problem with people taking very large carry-ons, that is ridiculous, and carry-ons that they can't handle, where they need help in getting them into the overheads. I don't think that is right at all -- carry ons should be reasonable and the pax who carry them on should be able to handle them, lift them and stow them, or else the bags in question should be checked.

I don't like the baggage templates either.

I say, give the flying public what it wants, and that is obviously lots of carry-ons.

I'll stop carrying on now http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Why is there no much fuss about the whole thing in Europe, where airlines strictly enforce low weight limits on carry ons? I've travelled on BA (which is definitely business oriented) often and they do so consistently.
I think it's just a matter of habit, rather than convenience etc. All of those who are "spoiled" into carrying huge carryons on board, or into not waiting 5 more minutes for checked luggage, would adapt fast into more reasonable carryon regulations. Such is human nature.

when you plan to ski ONE day in Whistler (today!) and your checked-in ski-boots didn't make it, you/I will take them aboard next time for pretty sure. I hate renting ski/boots - my personal ones are made to measurement (foamed) and I just loose half a day of skiing.

For those of us who live and travel in a cold climate, the issue of carry on luggage takes on a new meaning in winter. Bulky winter coats and accountrements take up precious space in overhead bins. I for one check my garment bag during the winter season. I'm tired of fighting for space. I consider this the price of living in snow covered regions. Come on summer. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

I agree with stricter enforcement of carry-on rules. And (although this is no doubt unenforceable) I think that anyone who brings on more than one carry-on should have to put one bag under the seat in front of them. i.e. only one bag goes into the overhead.

I recently watched one jerk go up and down the aisle, opening every bin, trying to find a place for his second carry-on. His larger one had already been stowed. The FA told him to put his second, smaller bag under the seat in front of him. He refused, and kept trying to force it into the already-full bins.

I could see that the space under the seat in front of him was empty; he was just being a jerk. Everyone else was ready to go. He was of average build, so had no obvious need for extra leg room.

It made me wish that the small, female FA was armed with a cattle prod to make El Jerko do what she told him to do. ARGH!!!

Well now I've had my little tantrum.

I agree with enforcing the carry-on limits, but think that DL needs to be careful and not cross the line from rule enforcement to attacking the customers. Here are two stories:L

(1) I have a small Tumi rolling case that I've used for years. It fits in the DL "Size Wise" case with no problem.

About 2 years or so ago, DL went through a brief period (at least in ATL) of super-strict observence to the Size Wise limits. I was running late for a DL flight in ATL, and boarded during general boarding, instead of FC (I had an upgrade). As I gave my boarding pass to the GA, she told me that I couldn't take my bag on board, as it was too large. I protested that I had travelled with it for many flights, but she insisted I gate check it. I did so, but was unhappy, and let it show in my facial expression. When I boarded, I noted several other rolling cases on board, one the same model as mine, and two larger, all fitting comfortably in the overhead bins.

I vowed that if this happened to me just one more time, I would sternly complain in writing. Ulimately, it seems that DL backed off on their search for oversize bags - I never had it happen again.

(2) I was on a DL MD-88 flight from ATL to YUL, seated in the right-hand bulkhead row. A late-boarding FC passenger did not have room for his roll-on bag in the overhead bins. One of the FAs went off on a tirade about how there would be plenty of room if FC passengers would stow one bag underneath the seat in front of them. She then grabbed a briefcase from a bin and asked "Who's is this?". It was mine, and I said so. She saw I was in a bulkhead seat, so put the bag back, but continued her tirade. At this point, the other FC passengers were alienated by her, and taunted her (one in particular was going on about how other airlines make the FAs stow their luggage elsewhere, and if DL did this there'd be room in the front). It was a surreal scene. The FA spent the duration of the flight hiding in the kitchen and griping about the FC passengers, most of whom could hear her.

Simply Good Service


http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

TW

[This message has been edited by Tolarian Wind (edited 11-26-2000).]

The US carry on situation has gotten ridiculous and needs to be controlled.

On the other hand European carriers have a retarded sence of baggage overall. Anal retentive carriers such as SR have tried to make me check in a carry on when I had a small carry on and a loptop bag arguing that I had "2 pieces" even on an empty flight.

Both SR and AF have tried to charge me overweight for having 22-24 kilos of checked baggage.

The most ridiculous was when SR tried to charge me for overweight between Zurich and Tokyo for having 35 kilos of check in luggage on a full $6000 J ticket! I had the person in charge disciplined for this!

Basically European airlines have had no concept of customer service or realities.

I think the current size standard is fine but I have a problem with the 5(?) kilo weight some carriers enforce.

BA made me check my "correct" size bag due to weight, destroyed it on the way to Istanbul and then didn't have any personnel to handle the complaint.

If it fits and I can carry it then allow it.

DR

If it fits and I can carry it then allow it.

Hope I am never on a flight full of weight lifters! There MUST be a weight rule, c'mon. Just because some cretin stuffs a carry on full on carpenter tools weighing 60-70 pounds above my head doesn't mean he should be allowed to surely?

If that tool bag fell on YOUR head due to turbulence, your view may change?! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/eek.gif

btw Qantas is pushing for TEN POUND weight limit for carry ons. (4 kg to be precise).

I feel that is the silly end of the scale, but United's 50 pound permissable is at the other silly end.

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~ Glen ~

I always try to carry my bag with me.. generally two smaller bags that meet size requirements. I do this because I'm tired of having handles and wheels broken off (It was happening about one out of three times). A year or so ago I had one bag- well within the requirements- and the FA grabbed it from me as I boarded, because "the plane is full." I objected that my medications were in that bag. "Then you'll have to standby for another flight," she replied. I gave up the bad... and did not see it again for three days. So although I try to avoid carrying a lot on, I have a great deal of understanding for the reasons people do so on US carriers.

Slightly off the subject, but the real unsafe situation is when someone puts their laptop or other heavy small item on top of a roller case or other item in the overhead. If the bin opens in turbulence or on landing, the laptop will come flying out like a missle. Can't these small items be stored under the seat in front? Do they take that much legroom?

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

i actually saw a boom box came flying down the overhead cabin, dropped onto a passenger's head, and he bled... that was scary, what if it were a baby it dropped onto? (whose liability would that be?)

joe_s, Don't take any grief from the FA with their 3 pieces of luggage plus a purse,plus a coat...all in our bins. Even when they deadhead home, do they check THEIR BAGS? Yeah right. Stand your ground and tell them the airlines rule. If they want to discuss it...fantastic. I need a supervisor and more free stuff from the airline. I realize that this obviously is not always practical, or advised. However, I get so frustrated with the personel NOT KNOWING THEIR OWN RULES. Like I don't care about the "one carryon bag" sign. As an elite I get 2. AND in FC and Elite I can have 3 if I'm in the mood.
As for safety, and bins popping open. Safety is an illusion on airlines. It's all about feeling good. Here are some thoughts on safety... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif
1)do you think the terrorist is going to admit he didn't pack his own bag?
2)How about if the bomb has been with him the whole time?
3) What do you think the average IQ of the, minimum wage, rent a cops at the metal detectors is?
4)If airlines cared...would they allow lap babies? People bounce off the celing several times a year. In that case baby's going flying. You don't have the physical strength to hold them.
5)Would they apply for permission to make the exit rows NARROWER?
6)Would they get an exception for a model of planes so it could have LESS exits?
7)Would they fly with illegal items in the cargo hold? again...and again...and again.
8)If the tuberlance is strong enough to bounce open the bin... Wouldn't the GLASSES in FC be dangerous projectiles???? What about those metal knives?? I find flying shapened bits of metal ofensive... What about the drink cart. Those suckers gotta hurt when they fly on you. And scalding hot coffee from the bozo next to you. That's it,lets serve a dangerous beverage... AND well i'm sure that stuff in the bins too.
9)where are the parachutes? Only the military gets them?
10)Why aren't there enough life rafts for every passanger? Havent you seen Titanic?
11)My seat cushion is a floatation device? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif AND ketchup is a vegetable!
12)Airbags? NO. AIRSICKNESS BAGS, YES
13)Shoulder belt seatbelts...
14)Inert gas in the fuel tanks instead of Oxygen?
15)Flight attendants with REAL SAFETY TRAINING...yeah right. How about liscensed paramedics?
16)Pilots not working 14 hours a day? A tired pilot is a safe pilot...yeah right. They fall asleep in the cockpit.
17)Serving alchol to crazy people... good move. That won't cause air rage.
18) 300 pound pigs in the FC cabin...
19) Labour wares with the guy fixing the plane...
20) Changing the minimun number of engines for flights over the ocean to 2, instead of three.
21) Using 30 year old computer technology for the FAA.
22) Using 30 year old planes to transport me! The 8 track tape player is newer than a 727!!!
23) Flying too many flights into overcrowed airports.
AND number 24...
SERVING TRI COLOUR PASTA (okay I couldn't resist).

My the Cohibas WERE good'uns today! Funny post. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

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~ Glen ~

Glen -

Wouldn't a 60 pound bag of tools have less of a chance sliding/falling out the overhead as compared to a 20 pound bag of duty free alcohol? A friction thing you know. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

DR

I know that the newer planes have increased overhead bin storage space but the older planes, especially the old MD-80/DC-9's have very small bins. It would be a good idea for the Airlines to re-fit the older planes with newer and larger bins. And as has been posted before, enforce the carry on rules.

What really gets me are the pax who feel that they are entitled to put two carry-ons above and not use the seat space in front of them. I see this all the time with biz pax who put their roll-ons and laptop in the overhead even as the flight attendant is telling them to please be considerate of other pax and utilize the seat space.



[This message has been edited by toadman (edited 11-27-2000).]

drtravels .. I have never boarded a plane with Duty Free booze weighing THAT little. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif Yes, that logic is good as long as that heavy, (and it might be quite small in volume bag), is not dumped on top of blankets, another bag etc, thus allowing it to slide off readily in a bumpy landing. On OUR heads.

Cigarmans points all generally have merit, but almost none relate to the danger and nuisance of people trying to stuff far too much into overheads. All the other factors he raises like drink carts, wine glasses, terrorists, lap babies, poor security checks etc are real issues, but NOT pertinent for this thread mostly. NONE can really be changed in real practice, and NONE of them hold up ALL OUR PLANES for 15 minutes on a fully laden 180 pax 757 while these cretins try and find overhead space for their 4 pieces of big, heavy, carry-on junk, much of which SHOULD have been checked. IMHO.

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~ Glen ~

[This message has been edited by ozstamps (edited 11-27-2000).]

<< 13)Shoulder belt seatbelts >>

In a crash, the plane doesn't stop suddenly (like an automobile). It's going too fast, and it usually crashes along the ground, not into a wall. Also, you have to lean over your knees to keep your head from being hit by pieces of plane during a crash landing, which the shoulder belt would prevent.

Anyway, my take on this carry-on mess is this: allow exactly one carry-on to be placed in the overhead compartment (subject to size and weight limits). If you want to carry on two items, you must put one underneath the seat in front of you (bulkheads excepted).

Glen, shouldn't the bottles of wine & champagne given out on the flight be exempted from the carry on rules http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif I must say the six bottles I had to carry home last weekend were heavy http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

OZstamps said,"NONE of them hold up ALL OUR PLANES for 15 minutes on a fully laden 180 pax 757 while these cretins try and find overhead space for their 4 pieces of big, heavy, carry-on junk, much of which SHOULD have been checked. IMHO."

OZ, I'm more worried about getting OUT of the plane (if something goes wrong). http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

Cigarman .. on those antiquated 727s CO flies, I'd have the same concerns. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

MileTex... I will not embarrass anyone here by mentioning how many bottles of schmoozed French booze you deplaned with on one International flight we took together recently.

Oh hang it, yes, I will spill the beans .... and I counted MORE than 6 if I recall. Plus a very large box of Godiva chocolates. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

So only 6 - you are losing your touch!

This thread may also make you smile:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum50/HTML/003790.html

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~ Glen ~

Originally posted by ozstamps:
Cigarman .. on those antiquated 727s CO flies, I'd have the same concerns. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif


As I presume you know, the 727s are out of CO's fleet. CO's "old" planes are the DC-10s (being replaced in 2001-2 by 762s and 764s) and MD-80s (being replaced thru 2004 by 737NGs). Or did you mean to say "antiquated 727s UA flies"... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

UA flies more OLD run down 727's than any other domestic airline. None at CO. None even at TWA. Plus NW loses theirs in Jan.
POOR OLD UA HAS THEIR 727's until at least 2003. Guess they have to pay all those employee/owners those big bucks they extorted...
OZ, stay away from CO stats. They aren't your strength.

Whomever said CO flyers had no sense of humour was a terrible liar. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/eek.gif

Oh well, I must be wrong then. The last CO timetable I have (admittedly expiring Sept 2000) has dozens of 727s buzzing right around the Continental Micronesia route services.

I'll just stick to my upstairs exit row seat 15B on a 747-400 thanks guys. CO never ever heard about that silly old plane type of course, but some other airlines did buy them. Trust me. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

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~ Glen ~

Other things being equal, the largest airline would have the most 727s (and the most of any other class of large plane).

I would adopt a flight safety rule that perhaps (dare I hope) both Ozstamps and Cigarman could agree on: no plane may be older than the oldest wine served in the front cabin. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

Goodness no!!! Co only serves wine "aged on the truck!" They couldn't fly at all! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

They are serving WINE now??? Last time I flew CO it was some syrupy, sweet awful muck called Zinfandel, bottled (naturally) in CA, and boy you'll need to try hard to convince me that was WINE! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

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~ Glen ~

[This message has been edited by ozstamps (edited 11-27-2000).]

I try my best to abide by the carry-on rules of the airlines I fly. That being said I get frustrated with some F/A's who are extremely picky. For example, one time my Father was hospitizled for immediate surgery in Beijing. I flew over immediately, SR was kind enough to give me a cheap ticket for C class. After he had recovered we flew back to the states on AF. We each were in C, and both had 2 standard Carryon bags, except he had a medium sized additional bag in which to keep the medicine that he needed to take and various other health items pertaining to his procedures. The French F/A was snippy about this, and I explained the sicuation and she huffed off to the galley. 3 Minutes later she came back to our seats(last row of C class) and placed her luggage behind our seats saying " I have extra baggage too". This inhibited our seats from reclining fully and I was quite distrot. Into the flight, my father and I cracked open some fruit that he had gotten in Bejing. After the F/As had gone into the galley, we placed the peels in her bags. Upon deplaning we thanked her for the nice flight and moved on... Not nice behavior, nor something I would do again, but it happened and why not share...

Originally posted by CTANK:
I try my best to abide by the carry-on rules of the airlines I fly...

Then why didn't you just check one of your bags so your father could have 3 carry-ons? It doesn't sound like it was an emergency situation at that point (your father had recovered) so I guess my sympathies are with the FA. She may not have handled the situation especially well, but you could have avoided the problem completely by not bringing so much on board with you.

That said, I hope and pray that your father continues to do well.

Make tougher rules. Enforce them, then planes MIGHT leave on time.

Just try getting on a plane flying out of HKG or SIN with any of those large US style roll ons. There is NO way there will allow it. Very tough policing, and it works well.

I had Qantas tell me today a medium size carry on, like a fat briefcase on a quiick daytrip was too large and needed to be checked. No suit bag. But checked it needed to be. Wait until the Aust/Europe rules hit the USA!

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~ Glen ~

Check out http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum94/HTML/002100.html. I started this thread after a "funny" experience in July, 2000.

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Bob
Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves for they shall never cease to be amused.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum94/HTML/002100.html

Great link Doc and AZ-Mizman (- you added a period to the original link, so it did not work btw!).

With his permission I hope, posted below is one amusing anecodote posted there by Mister Internet:

My favorites are the passengers who insist on hauling on board all manner of odd-shaped baggage and try to cram (and I mean CRAM... you've all seen these people) them into an overhead bin while 200 other pax are waiting to get to their aisle behind them...

I was once on a UA Sh*ttle ("different class of service, lower class of people") flight, and a guy kept repeatedly trying to pull someone else's laptop out to make room for his bag and then try to reposition it FACE-OUT and cram the door shut! Well, the FA watching warned him that that would not be allowed, since the laptop would surely fall out onto whoever opened the door after him. H said OK, and sat down with his bag... after the FA left, he got up again and proceeded with the aforementioned attempt... well, passengers were still trying to board and now people were getting testy with him... the FA heard the rumbling and came back and demanded that the guy sit down and wait for everyone to board... well, he said something smart to her and sat down. About 30 seconds after the plane was boarded, he gets up again (before the plane started pushing back) and repeats the same procedure... a FA came storming down the aisle to inform him that if he didn't take his seat immediately, he would be thrown off the plane for disobeying crewmember instructions... he then shot back with "I have a right to put my bag up here, I paid $500 for this ticket!" Immediately someone about five rows behind him said, "I thought you were just ACTING like an ignorant a**hole, but if you paid $500 for a Shuttle ticket, you really ARE an ignorant a**hole" Everybody on the plane laughed, and we didn't hear another word out of him the rest of the flight... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

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"Welcome to Mister Internet's Neighborhood..."



[This message has been edited by ozstamps (edited 11-30-2000).]

The December issue of Flying (page 75) describes a low-tech Russian solution to the checked and carry-on baggage problem. On the Ilyushin-86, which could carry up to 350 pax, the pax entered through airstair doors on the lower level of the plane, put their baggage on the shelves on that level, then walked up interior stairs to get to their seats. On their way out they reclaimed their baggage from the shelves. SO everything was carry-on, but if you wanted it in the cabin then you had to lug it across the ramp and up two flights of stairs.

I really don't know what to make of my recent experience over Thanksgiving here WRT my carryons. I checked one rolley-cart and was
carrying on an essentail empty satchel and
camera bag containing laptop and accessories
(It's a small laptop) onto a GRE Embraer.
I had not problems getting onto my outbound
puddlejump ORD->LAN, but on the way back the
FA at the foot of the stairs insisted that I could only carry one piece on.
I thought for a second, put the laptop bag in the satchel and then walked up the stairs.
She looked confused for half a second and
then shrugged her shoulders.

It was all just as much stuff, but I was at least hewing to the letter of the law in her eyes I suppose.

JD

I see both sides of this issue, but I cannot help commenting on the overwhelming arguement that I truly support:

I agree, overhead space is not for oversized bags...or for that matter, heavy bags that would seriously do damage to a fellow passenger or FA. HOWEVER...I do have some serious reservations about checking my valuables and my notebook computer just happens to be one of those valuables.

If I had to abide by a 4lb rule as Qantas is thinking about instituting, I would boycott their airline! My notebook computer weighs 7 pounds and I bring it on board every flight. I could not imagine having to check my computer through to my destination.

Personally, I have been the victim of several crimes over the past ten years. All of them were committed by ground personnel of a major airline. My bags have been plundered through and I have lost electronic equipment, a brand new suit, expensive shoes and several thousand dollars of my personal belongings.

My compensation was very poor by the offending airlines and to further my humiliation, I was forced to feel like a victim many times over when I had to experience the poor claim process. Furthermore, I received very little in compensation even after saving and recording my receipts.

People, say and believe what you may, but you might change your mind about this issue once you become a victim and lose your expensive clothes or equipment.

Would you want to check a $4500 computer today? Would you do it after you watched the 60 Minutes or ABC 20/20 episodes which have exposed these crimes over and over again?

Like all of you, I have very little tolerance for people who disrupt flights and make it difficult for those of us who consider that cramped Super 80 our second office.

Another fact in this matter is that it is not good to continue to keep saying "no" to your customers. I know that many of you do not really care for AA. Personally, I think they are on the right track. They are reversing the "no" attitude of the industry by giving us some additional leg room and with their new announcement of roomier overhead bins, I am truly impressed with their positive steps of customer service (now if they can only work on the food a little bit).

I apologize for this long letter, but this issue certainly has hit a sensitive spot with me.

I am still packing as lightly as possible, but my computer and electronic equipment is my job and my financial life. I cannot trust my valuable equipment to any stranger, any more. I have learned my lesson and one more very important thing:

If I lost my vehicle to make an income, I could not afford to fly anymore...Remember, we are still spending our hard earned money for a product and a service when we travel, the least the companies could do is treat us like the customers we are. They are in business because of us...Lord help them if the economy turns downward again, they will need us worse than ever! Now is the time to give us the service and the attention that we are paying those big bucks for!

Bob Linderman

P.S. My problems were not with American Airlines...in fact, a few years ago, after my belongings were stolen at ORD, I switched to AA and have been a Platinum since.

My experience recently:

I had a large checked bag - and was travelling First Class on Singapore. Checking in at Sydney - even though my luggage limit was 40kg, the Qantas (Handling Agent) rep would not allow a 31kg bag as they cannot accept bags over 30kg.

This is not on my ticket, nor in the SQ timetable but - again - Qantas is making up the rules for itself - and other airlines it appears.

I removed a book and then she accepted it.

Of course, when checking in at SIN for the way home, the book was back in bag and there was no problem! It even came off the belt at LHR about second!

Hi all,

Great Message Board. I just signed up for my Frequenta miles and will be starting my AA Gold Challenge on the 16th. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif.

My question is what is considered "legal"
carry-on size around the world? I've just bought a new roller + tote. The roller is 22" x 14" x 9" and the tote is 16" x 10" x 7".

-Andrew

"The Law Is An ..."

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum50/HTML/004441.html

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~ Glen ~

If the airlines did not misdirect, damage, fold, spindle, mutilate and/or lose luggage, people would be more inclined to check it. Period.

In fairness, a lot of luggage arrives ontime and sometimes even undamaged.