US Airways Dividend Miles (Pre-FlightFund Merger) - Help with Award Travel in Business to Australia

We are planning to travel to OZ after months of armtwisting with Mrs. SAnger3494, but I told only in Business or First to the land down under. We have enough for United in Business, but she short about 10,000 for Qantus Business. This trip is only time we will go there, so I am thinking about going for QF.

1 Should we make an effort to get enough for QF?

2 In doing some probing UA only goes to MEL/SYD?

3 When I start calling to check dates on travel, does
anyone know when is the best time(travel dates) to score
award travel seats? We are able to go anytime from
April to September. We live in Florida and enjoy cool
weather as a nice change and possible fewer tourists.
I am sure I will have to work with 11 month rule as the
business class goes fast on QF

4. If we go QF, I am confused on the routing within OZ.
can we fly to places other than MEL/SYD and return
from other places? Do we have make travel plans
on QF within the country, which NOT included in the
award travel?

5. Last one and thanks for everyone's help. If we go for
12 or 14 nights, How many stops can we make and
enjoy?

SCA

There are many posts out there, so try your search function if you don't find the detail you need in future responses.

1. Yes QF is worth the extra miles, provided you want to fly to places in OZ other than SYD/MEL. I did this on QF.
2. Yes. The trip to MEL connects in SYD.
3. No idea about best time other than doing it at 330 days.
4. You can have one stopover and one open Jaw. This means that you can into MEL, stop for a couple of days...fly to SYD drive to Brisbane and fly back from Brisbane. My routing was PHL-LAX-SYD-CNS on the outbound, then CNS-SYD...stopped in SYD for a couple of days and then flew SYD-LAX-PHL. On UA, you would only be able to fly to SYD and back. You'd have to fly coach and pay for it for the inter-OZ flights.
5. One stopover. One open jaw.

I've flown both in biz and I preferred the QF product over the UA. No specifics and both were very nice. Also note that you have access to all of the QF lounges throughout OZ which are quite nice. Showers, food and free booze. This was especially nice in our domestic travels.

The increased mileage buys you many more destinations:

Australia: Adelaide, Alice Springs, Ayers Rock, Brisbane, Cairns, Canberra, Darwin, Goldcoast, Gove, Hobart, Mackay, Maroochydore, Melbourne, Perth, Proserpine, Rockhampton, Sydney, Townsville
New Zealand: Auckland, Christchurch, Wellington

Mrs. lt1GM and I went last year to SYD for a weekend, then to NZ. In April, the weather was very nice (60-70ies), very few tourists (especially in NZ). We flew in Business:

PHL-LAX-SYD, spent the weekend
SYD-CHC, spent two weeks touring
CHC-AKL-LAX-PHL

I highly recommend it, we're actually thinking of going back. Definitely one of the best ways to spend 105,000 Dividend Miles. Good luck!

After lots of research, we just scored two tickets in F on QF. I am convinced by many, many posts that QF is better in every class than UA. Once QF gets the skybeds installed QF J will probably be better than UA F.

Tickets are hard to come by unless you go for 330 days out, but you are looking at the off season, so you may have some luck looking closer. I tried for about 4 months to get the F tickets and only finally got two a week or so ago. There were J tix available several times.

I am also looking for some help from some experts. Here is my family situation.

1) Will have 270,000 miles/points between Dividend Miles and AMEX Membership Rewards by the end of this month.
2) 3 of us - wife, daughter and I looking to take a 3 week trip to New Zealand departing on May 16, 2005.
3) Looking for business class on any airline
4) We live in North Carolina and think CLT would be the best departure city, but we can leave out of any place on the east coast (esp JFK) to make the trip happen.
5) We can obviously do the three business class on UA for 90,000 each right now, but we still have to pay to get to NZ.
6) We have alot of time to travel and we would definitely like to get a stopover or open jaw in Hawaii (preferably) or Australia.

I need guidance on the best way to go about this. Currently, I am thinking that we go ahead and buy two business class on Qantas and accumulate enough miles in the next year to get the last business class seat down the road. How is risky is this in waiting to get another business class? I know that it depends on demand, but does anyone know the typical number of awards business seats kept aside?

How would we route (UA, Qantas, Star Allliance?) to get a US departure with a stopover in Hawaii arriving in New Zealand? Can we somehow do this on a Qantas/UA combination?

Could we do an open jaw on UA where we go into Maui and depart from HNL to New Zealand?

I know that these are varied and lots of questions. This will be our first major award trip and we are rookies. Please be gentle on the replies. There are obviously lots of carriers (US, UA, Qantas) involved and we can't seem to get a straight answer on the phone.

I figure we have a month to finalize the planning because I obviously want to be right on the 330 days for reserving and that is mid June.

Thanks alot everyone. I appreciate the help.

I know that these are varied and lots of questions. This will be our first major award trip and we are rookies. Please be gentle on the replies. There are obviously lots of carriers (US, UA, Qantas) involved and we can't seem to get a straight answer on the phone.



First of all, welcome to FT :D

I wonder why you felt threatened in posting this message. This board has always been about providing the best info and please be assured your query is perfectly within the spirit of these forums. You took a lot of effor to articulate your question very well, giving all the pertinent details.

That said, I would strongly recommend you use the services of awardplanner.com (banner at the top of this page) - yeah, it costs $40 but you would save that by not having to buy Tylenol when dealing with airline reps booking award travel :rolleyes:

A biz award on Air NZ (*A) is 120,000 miles so you would need another 90,000 miles (360,000 total) to use that. You may be better off with Qantas which needs only 105,000 miles per award. I think you already know that.

You can purchase up to 15,000 of these miles from US Airways for about $450 plus tax and a $25 fee. Also, I beleive Amex lets you buy membership reward points - look into that. This could reduce the actual number of miles you would need to accumulate. It is advisable you buy all 3 tickets at the same time, at the 330 day window. Getting 2 now and taking a chance on the third is, well, taking a chance and for a rare opportunity like this, it's not worth it.

If you live close to Philadelphia, fly 2 transcons on US from PHL to LAX and with their triple miles promotion, (must register, http://www.usairways.com/dividendmiles/9512.htm) you would get close to 30,000 miles (more if you are a preferred member) for less than $400.

I'm sure there will be more replies that will guide you better, but in the end, when you are ready, awardplanner is the way to go, IMO. ^

Once again, welcome to FT :D

I am also looking for some help from some experts. Here is my family situation.

1) Will have 270,000 miles/points between Dividend Miles and AMEX Membership Rewards by the end of this month.
2) 3 of us - wife, daughter and I looking to take a 3 week trip to New Zealand departing on May 16, 2005.


geo1005's solution: :D


Book the UA business class tickets now for all three of you to and from SYD and/or MEL. Any departure airport in NC should work for you but if CLT is an easy option, you can fly non-stop from there to LAX for your connection. Roundtrip from SYD to AKL is not that expensive AND you mention you have three weeks. Choose the front end of the trip or the back end and spend a couple of nights in SYD. If you book your flights to/from AKL (wherever) on Air NZ you will earn miles in your United or US Airways account. If you book on QF, then you can earn miles on US.

Besides, flying QF will cost you more points (that you do not even have right now) and the UA awards are easier to get in many cases than the QF awards.


:D

I am also looking for some help from some experts.

Just in case no experts show up, I'll take a stab at it.

I think that there is no way to do a stopever in Hawaii on any airline, unless you go to a Circle Pacific *A award, which would be a lot more points. I'd love to be corrected, but I did a bit of research on this question myself and it appears to be impossible. There is a quite a bit on this topic in the UA forum.

If you travel on UA, you'd have to buy the Oz-NZ ticket, as you correctly identified. If you travel on QF, you can do a stopover in Oz and return from NZ. For instance, you could fly out to Sydney, stop over for five days, continue on to Christchurch and motor around the South Island. You could finish up on the North Island and fly back from Auckland. This is a pretty good feature and in my opinion makes QF a much better award.

In terms of the timing, May is pretty much the easiest time to get tickets. It will be cold in NZ, but probably not really full-tilt ski season yet. I can still see at least two business award seats on the LAX-SYD QF route for selected dates in early March, which is 300 days or so out. I'd bet that the May seats will not be snapped up for at least a little while.

Also, by next year, QF will undoubtedly have the Skybed installed on this route and that will be a huge upgrade.

Also, I've noticed that the miles didn't get deducted until you book the return and you can hold the reservation for a month or so until you know if the return will be available. I don't know if they will let you book without the required miles until you book the return, but it is possible.

If you have the USAir VISA, you should be doing the Charter One giftcard thing to get 5,000 miles a month.

Also, by next year, QF will undoubtedly have the Skybed installed on this route and that will be a huge upgrade.


Given the choice and all things being equal I would agree that QF to/from Oz or NZ is the way to go. However, (and this is just my opinion so...) I don't think that the difference in service levels/comfort is all that great. I've done the current QF business class to Australia and I've done UA's trans-Pacific business class service as well. Both utilize the 747-400. The difference in the current QF/UA service is just not that significant IMO. QF feels more "interesting" than UA as it's got that Aussie feel to it (again, preferrable all things being equal) but it's not worth the extra miles (particularly since we are talking about multiple awards here - a 45,000 mile difference in cost).

The new QF spacebeds are very similar to the SQ (Singapore) spacebeds. I've flown those and I like them BUT they don't feel as roomy or as spacious as UA's business seats (particularly upstairs on a 744). Don't get me wrong, it's a nice seat and it is comfortable but I found it kind of confining. Once you are in it, it is great. However, these spacebed seats are very pod-like in that they are surrounded by an enclosure. When the spacebed in front of you reclines, it REALLY encloses you in your allotted space as the pod in front comes back and over where your feet are. As a matter of fact, a significant portion of your spacebed lowers and goes down under where the seat in front of you leans back. It's very hard to get from a window seat out to the aisle if the seats in front of you and your seatmate are reclined. I actually found the SQ spacebed not so great for enjoying the flight with a seatmate as the seat next to you is slightly cut off from you by virtue of the pod-like enclosure. YMMV but...

If I was going to Oz/NZ by myself I would opt for QF but if going with a companion, I'd honestly shoot for UA.

and now, this.

"Australia and the United States have agreed to put armed marshals on passenger flights between the two countries.

The sky marshals could begin flying as early as next week on services operated by Qantas and United Airlines"
Read the full story here:
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/asiapcf/05/08/australia.marshals/index.html

Less F seats available because these heroes must fly F :mad: :mad: :mad:

Less F seats available because these heroes must fly F :mad:


Well if they fly F they will have a very hard time protecting the cockpit which is upstairs on front of the business class cabin. Silly heroes. :rolleyes:

If you travel on QF, you can do a stopover in Oz and return from NZ. For instance, you could fly out to Sydney, stop over for five days, continue on to Christchurch and motor around the South Island.


JZ31171, Welcome!

(1) I believe there is an Air Canada flight between HNL and SYD, although someone else thought this was on NZ metal. If AC, look into CLT-(Canadian city, YVR maybe?)-HNL w/ stop over-SYD. This theoretically could be all AC metal, so you might not be forced into a *A award. However, I don't see on US's website rates for travel on AC. I don't believe AC flys its own metal into NZ, so this may only work with a OZ trip, not a NZ trip. The other bonus of this arrangement is that you don't have to connect in LA, a major bonus in my book.

(2) 2-3 years ago when I went to NZ using US miles on QF in C, I was told by several agents that LAX-SYD-New Zealand (CHC or AKL, I think)-LAX with stops in both SYD and NZ was not an allowed routing. I never was given a clear explantion why this didn't work. I don't think even LAX-CHC-LAX was allowed.

(3) As you can guess from the above, if you fly UA, I suggest you try to connect through SFO (HNL, or just about any other place) rather than LAX.

(4) I would try to get CHC as your destination in NZ. To get there you probably have to fly through AKL or SYD or MEL, so you get your stopover airport into the routing automatically.

(5) I don't know where you are in NC, but your idea of driving to CLT and flying from there seems like a good one. That gives you one less baggage transfer where your luggage could be delayed or mishandled. On the return, if you get delayed in Customs and have to take a later flight out of SFO or LAX, you don't have to worry about a missed connection in CLT. Last I heard, parking was pretty cheap at CLT as well. If you can't get flights out of CLT, try IAD, since it is a UA hub.

(6) I was not thrilled with QF's C seats (I was upstairs on a 747), as when I am sitting, I prefer to sit fairly straight and when sleeping, I prefer to sleep on my side. The sitting position had a bit of a recline which I did not like. The seat does not go flat and, at my feet, was pretty close to the seat in front, so side sleeping did not work either. Just my quirks.

(7) You didn't ask and may already have a plan, but my recommendation would be to spend twice as much time on the South Island as the North Island. There was an excellent article in National Geographic Traveller in the last 2-3 years on things to do on the South Island. You will need rental cars for both islands; just remember, they drive on the other side of the road than what most people in NC drive on. ;)

(8) *A has an airpass for the South Pacific. If getting to both OZ and NZ proves difficult to impossible, look into flying to one and buying the airpass to use to get to the other (or Tahiti, Fiji, etc.)

(2) 2-3 years ago when I went to NZ using US miles on QF in C, I was told by several agents that LAX-SYD-New Zealand (CHC or AKL, I think)-LAX with stops in both SYD and NZ was not an allowed routing. I never was given a clear explantion why this didn't work. I don't think even LAX-CHC-LAX was allowed.

It doesn't work because it runs afoul of the rule that says you can only cross the Tasmanian Sea once on an award ticket. Hence you could do LAX-SYD-CHC outbound and AKL-LAX return, but not (for instance) LAX-SYD-CHC-SYD-LAX. I was told that if you book a route that has a direct flight, like AKL-LAX and they ticketed it as AKL-SYD-LAX, that would be allowed. YMMV.

I am currently holding LAX-SYD-CHC outbound with a MEL-LAX return. That was allowed.

Thanks for the tip on the National Geographic article. I'm going to check that out.

Thanks for the tip on the National Geographic article. I'm going to check that out.

National Geographic Traveller, I believe. Maybe July or August 2002 would be my best guess.

So, it sounds like I could go....

Outbound = CLT-LAX-AKL
(open jaw)
Return = Queenstown-BNE (stop over)-LAX-CLT

From what I understand this would work because I am allowed one stop over, an open jaw and I would be crossing the Tasman Sea only once. Correct?

And does anyone know if the above itinerary would fall under the 105,000 that Dividend Miles members can use to get a business class ticket on Qantas?

Thanks.

JZ31171, Welcome!

(1) I believe there is an Air Canada flight between HNL and SYD, although someone else thought this was on NZ metal. If AC, look into CLT-(Canadian city, YVR maybe?)-HNL w/ stop over-SYD. This theoretically could be all AC metal, so you might not be forced into a *A award. However, I don't see on US's website rates for travel on AC. I don't believe AC flys its own metal into NZ, so this may only work with a OZ trip, not a NZ trip. The other bonus of this arrangement is that you don't have to connect in LA, a major bonus in my book.


DO NOT do this. You may lose LAX but you gain a meeting with Canada Customs along the road and a transfer between terminals at YYZ which is really not a good choice and then to top it off a visit to US INS at YVR. You are also bound to find no space at all from YVR to HNL if you are looking to stop, unless there is a flight that terminates at HNL (usually in winter) and then you will get a domestic 767 - yuck!

So, it sounds like I could go....

Outbound = CLT-LAX-AKL
(open jaw)
Return = Queenstown-BNE (stop over)-LAX-CLT

From what I understand this would work because I am allowed one stop over, an open jaw and I would be crossing the Tasman Sea only once. Correct?

And does anyone know if the above itinerary would fall under the 105,000 that Dividend Miles members can use to get a business class ticket on Qantas?

Thanks.

From QF timetable, the BNE-LAX direct flight appears to be via a stop in AKL. I don't know if that impacts the Tasman Sea rule.

Also, if you have not done so, confirm with US that a stopover and an open jaw are both allowed on the same FF tix. Others that may be more up to date than I previously indicated that both were OK, but my general impression from redeeming some awards on US is in the past was that it was one or the other.

DO NOT do this. You may lose LAX but you gain a meeting with Canada Customs along the road and a transfer between terminals at YYZ which is really not a good choice and then to top it off a visit to US INS at YVR. You are also bound to find no space at all from YVR to HNL if you are looking to stop, unless there is a flight that terminates at HNL (usually in winter) and then you will get a domestic 767 - yuck!

These sound like good points to me.

TRRed, didn't mean to come across as harsh in these points but the hassle is likely not worth it and the terminal transfer issue at YYZ is new as Transborder is still in T2 while the rest is in T1New or infield.

In terms of the timing, May is pretty much the easiest time to get tickets. It will be cold in NZ, but probably not really full-tilt ski season yet.

Yes - normally ski season starts late May or even early June. However, so far it is looking to start earlier than normal this year. As for next year, who knows.

JZ31171, Welcome!

(1) I believe there is an Air Canada flight between HNL and SYD, although someone else thought this was on NZ metal. If AC, look into CLT-(Canadian city, YVR maybe?)-HNL w/ stop over-SYD. This theoretically could be all AC metal, so you might not be forced into a *A award. However, I don't see on US's website rates for travel on AC. I don't believe AC flys its own metal into NZ, so this may only work with a OZ trip, not a NZ trip. The other bonus of this arrangement is that you don't have to connect in LA, a major bonus in my book.

(2) 2-3 years ago when I went to NZ using US miles on QF in C, I was told by several agents that LAX-SYD-New Zealand (CHC or AKL, I think)-LAX with stops in both SYD and NZ was not an allowed routing. I never was given a clear explantion why this didn't work. I don't think even LAX-CHC-LAX was allowed.

(3) As you can guess from the above, if you fly UA, I suggest you try to connect through SFO (HNL, or just about any other place) rather than LAX.

(4) I would try to get CHC as your destination in NZ. To get there you probably have to fly through AKL or SYD or MEL, so you get your stopover airport into the routing automatically.

(5) I don't know where you are in NC, but your idea of driving to CLT and flying from there seems like a good one. That gives you one less baggage transfer where your luggage could be delayed or mishandled. On the return, if you get delayed in Customs and have to take a later flight out of SFO or LAX, you don't have to worry about a missed connection in CLT. Last I heard, parking was pretty cheap at CLT as well. If you can't get flights out of CLT, try IAD, since it is a UA hub.

(6) I was not thrilled with QF's C seats (I was upstairs on a 747), as when I am sitting, I prefer to sit fairly straight and when sleeping, I prefer to sleep on my side. The sitting position had a bit of a recline which I did not like. The seat does not go flat and, at my feet, was pretty close to the seat in front, so side sleeping did not work either. Just my quirks.

(7) You didn't ask and may already have a plan, but my recommendation would be to spend twice as much time on the South Island as the North Island. There was an excellent article in National Geographic Traveller in the last 2-3 years on things to do on the South Island. You will need rental cars for both islands; just remember, they drive on the other side of the road than what most people in NC drive on. ;)

(8) *A has an airpass for the South Pacific. If getting to both OZ and NZ proves difficult to impossible, look into flying to one and buying the airpass to use to get to the other (or Tahiti, Fiji, etc.)

A few comments

(1) HNL-AKL is indeed NZ operated not AC. NZ has great service, food and drink ... okay seats (comfy foam and roomy but quite old and definitely no spacebeds although due to be changed next year it probably wont be in time for you) and limited IFE.

(7) agree South Island has much more to offer than North Island, although the volcanic area is around Rotorua in the North Island.

(8) I dont think SP Airpass is a good value here. As others have mentioned it is cheap to add oz-nz return if required, and if you want to visit other pacific islands then you can do this on a us-nz ticket on NZ (with nz-oz then being the side trip), with NZ flights from LAX via Tahiti, Fiji, Tonga, and Cook Islands.

So, it sounds like I could go....

Outbound = CLT-LAX-AKL
(open jaw)
Return = Queenstown-BNE (stop over)-LAX-CLT

From what I understand this would work because I am allowed one stop over, an open jaw and I would be crossing the Tasman Sea only once. Correct?

And does anyone know if the above itinerary would fall under the 105,000 that Dividend Miles members can use to get a business class ticket on Qantas?

Thanks.

Im not sure there is a Queenstown (ZQN) to BNE flight. There definitely is ZQN-SYD.

PS If you can fly into ZQN rather than driving from CHC I'd recommend it. Stunning flight over the mountains with a spectacular approach to the airport nestled in the valley.

Air NZ flies ZQN-BNE at least once a day (1330-1430. I think you'd have to change twice on QF. Not sure about anyone else.

Remember this old post? It took me a while to find it!
I want to use the 135k F award on Qantas and book a trip to Aus in 2006.
My major intention is a trip to SYD departing BOS around March 2 for about 10 days. QF flies from LAX-MEL or LAX-SYD.

Here's my plan:
Start calling on April 6 (330 days from March 2). Book the outbound. Be willing to be routed either BOS-LAX-SYD or BOS-LAX-MEL-SYD. Another thread said I don't have to book the return yet. I can hold the reservation til the 330 day window appears for my return, then call and book my return.

Do I have this right? Do they book the domestic segments on US? Also, I'm also trying to consider the time change. Is it 330 days from the Australian date (thus April 5 here) or the US date?

Thanks in advance.

Just a suggestion, try to get on the QF flights from JFK and figure out how to get yourself down there.. I assume the Jet Blue shuttle will be running by then. This way you MIGHT still have a chance if US is not around AND will get the same plane from JFK to SYD.

Noah's idea to get your trip from JFK-SYD (stopover in LAX) is good, but....that particular flight is apparently impossible to get award seats on. But maybe.....

Otherwise, yes, US will fly you to LAX to pick up your Qantas flight. If you book QF Biz or First, then you'll fly US domestic First to the gateway.

Not sure about the time change, but, since US is querying QFs inventory, it's probably based on the time in Oz at the time you are requesting, so I guess you could start checking 330 days and 14 hours in advance. But that's just my guess.

Thank you. I guess my sub-question is properly phrased as follows:
Can I fly a different domestic carrier (ie AA) to LAX to make my connection?

You could get UA or AC (or really any *A carrier), but not AA/NW/CO/DL.

If you're booked with a connection in LAX and worse comes to worse, you can always get a WN flight to LAX at the last minute if something horrible happens.

If you live close to Philadelphia, fly 2 transcons on US from PHL to LAX and with their triple miles promotion, (must register, http://www.usairways.com/dividendmiles/9512.htm) you would get close to 30,000 miles (more if you are a preferred member) for less than $400.

:D
Just curious - I could not locate the triple miles promotion anywhere on usairways.com. The link you attached is no longer working - was that an invitation only promotion and how can I get signed up? Thanks

That was an old promo - way past expiration now.

That was an old promo - way past expiration now.
Thanks! Looks like I missed out - Hopefully, next time.

They need something of the likes to keep the mob at bey.

-JC

Noah's idea to get your trip from JFK-SYD (stopover in LAX) is good, but....that particular flight is apparently impossible to get award seats on. But maybe.....

I think it depends where your miles are coming from. My parents had no trouble getting seats using BA miles on this flight. Using US miles, from what people on this forum have reported, is much more difficult.

they should consider themselves lucky then, I guess.

I have over 300K points in my Qantas account (transferred back when the SPG ratio was 2 QF points for 1 SPG point). I specifically did it so I would be able to use them for any OneWorld flight. I have often checked availability with the Qantas tool for that flight and come up blank every time.