Trip Reports - Alitalia Prima class Gva-Fco-Malta R/T




Bretteee
Jun 16, 02, 8:50 pm
I just returned from a roundrtrip on Alitalia in Prima/Business Class from Geneva to Malta via Rome. Prima is the European Business Class while Magnifica is the long haul Business Class.

I used a 30,000 Delta Airlines Altalia intra Europe award. The Y class is 25,000 miles. This is a great award because it allows you to fly from any European city to any other European city and is not restricted just to Italy.

You will notice for example that all European awards from other airlines like the BA awards on AA can only be used to or from the UK. LH on United only to or from Germany etc.

I was a bit nervous flying AZ because of all the strikes in Italy. In May there was a 1 day Controllers strike and Alitalia Express which flys GVA to Milan and short flights also went on strike 1 day. And a few days before we left FCO Airport was closed for 4 hours due to a Leaders Conference in Rome. In June again there was a 1 day Controllers strike but we lucked out! In addition I changed our dates 4 times with no problem.

We left Geneva at 7.10 am. The Alitalia check in Agent told us that we could use the Swiss Airlines Horizon Lounge. However when we got there the Swiss Airlines receptionist who was wearing a $20,000 diamond watch (maybe to promote Duty Free watches), in a rather snotty fashion told us that we could not use the lounge as we were not members of the Alitalia Ulyses Club. When I saw that the lounge had no windows and the snobby atmosphere I decided not to argue and preferred to have a cup of coffee at the departure gate which is much more pleasant.

The aircraft was an MD-80 DC-9 which showed its age. In the Y cabin they have 5 seats and in the Business 4 seats. The seats are in green which is quite different and interesting. We were very comfortable.

The crew were reserved at first but gradually became friendlier. I was impressed by the fact that the young steward helped my friend put her carry on bag in the stowaway bin. When my sister asked a British Airways steward in Business class to help her with her bag, he responded that it was "not his job to do this."

There were 108 passengers and 113 meals. They always carry 5 extra meals in reserve.
Business class was relatively empty.

The flight took 1 hour 30 minutes. For the first 20 minutes we flew over the alps which were still in early June covered with snow. The DC-9 is a very pleasant aircraft. It was very smooth in the air and on the ground with not too much noise.

Breakfast consisted of Proscutto and Provelone cheese, a sweet Croissant, delicious bread with excellent Cherry jam and a fresh fruit salad. I left the proscutto and cheese and was in heaven with the bread, butter and jam. However the coffee was not very good which is surprising for an Italian airline but they pride themselves that on the Airbus they offer real Expresso.

In Rome we had to take a bus to the main Terminal which is a pain in the neck but we immediately noticed the sea breeze as we disembarked as Rome airport is right by the beach.

The new airport is really beautiful. We had to take a train to the terminal which is also a pain. We headed to the Business lounge which Alitalia shares with Continental. All the other airlines share one larger lounge which is nicer than Alitalia's.

This time we were welcomed into the lounge unlike Swiss Airlines which threw us out. However the lack of windows and the fact that so many people were in the lounge bothered me and later we were to find out that the coffee shop with the large windows overlooking the tarmac and runway was a much more pleasant place to pass our time. The lounge offered sweet croissants, jam, bad coffee from a machine and juices.

Rome to Malta:

After 2 hours in Rome we boarded another DC-9 to Malta for a 1 hour 30 minute flight. The flight was full in Y and C. Again we had to take a train + a bus to the plane. A bit of a hassle.

Lunch consisted of a huge portion of sour Mozzarela Cheese (tasty) and proscutto again with fruit salad, delicious bread, good apricot jam and fresh fruit salad.

We flew across Sicily and saw Palermo, and the top of Mt. Etna. Flew over the islands of Gozo and Comino and passed Valetta the capital of Malta.

We were happy to see our suitcases made the connection.

Malta to Rome:

We left at 12.15 pm and before boarding we were allowed to stay in the lounge which is shared by all airlines. It was crowded also with no windows. They had 2 computers and I used 1. They offered juices and chocolate cake. AZ have a daily flight to Rome from Malta and a new daily flight to Milan.

Again the flight was 100% full. For lunch we had very good cold turkey cuts with provelone cheese, a large portion of smoked salmon, delicious bread and a custard pound cake.

They also had hot towels.

On the return we had to spend 6 hours in Rome waiting for our connection. We did not get bored 1 minute. First we visited the rail station where they have an Express train to Rome 2x hour. The trip lasts 32 minutes. Then we went to the Rome Airport Hilton for bad coffee. Strange bad coffee in Italy! Then we visited all the duty free stores: Valentino, Gucci, Versace etc etc and I actually bought 2 belts. First time I have ever bought anything in a duty free store. Except for Versace, the sales people were not very cooperative and seemed annoyed to serve you.

Then we went to the coffee shop and had more bad coffee!! But it was pleasant to look at the runway/tarmac and all the people. It is really a beautiful airport.

The airport is nicely spread out into Terminals A, B and C. A for domestic flights, B for all except Alitalia and C for Alitalia and code share International flights.

Then we went to the Business Class lounge. It was nice and quiet at 6pm. They had delicious English tea sandwiches (salmon, tuna) and Peach, Pear and Apricot nectars.

Suddenly it was time to board. This time no need to take a bus or train. The flight was full. We had the exact identical meal as from Malta to Rome.

We flew up the Italian coast which reminded me of a flight I took from San Diego to Los Angeles. Very similar scenery at night. Though it was already dark by 10 pm, it was beautiful flying over the white snow covered alps.

We were 30 minutes late but we were happy to see our bags.

Ratings: Comfort 10/10, crew 7/10 and food 7/10. I rarely fly Business class but a few years ago on Swissair to Zurich from Berlin which only takes about 1 hour we got a Fillet Mignon. So compared to that AZ was not a match but we plebs who usually fly in the back were contented.

Lastly Malta is a great place to vacation. It's fascinating with lots of history and one cannot get bored there. We also went to Gozo nearby. Hotels are inexpensive. $100 a night for 2 with breakfast in 5 star hotels.Not many places in Europe offer such low rates for such beautiful resorts. We stayed in Malta at the Westin which has a nice beach club. However the Hilton is the nicest hotel.

In Gozo we stayed at the Kempinsky San Lawrenz which is beautiful. No beach but they have a shuttle bus to Ramla Bay, a gorgeous beach. I highly recommend Malta and Gozo.


Bretteee
Jun 16, 02, 8:51 pm
Posted twice! Something went wrong.

R&R
Jun 16, 02, 11:26 pm
I don't understand why anyone would continue to drink BAD coffee, when teas are so much better for you, if you know what to order for taste. Even carrying your own favorite Green Tea is better for you!

There are so many healthy teas available everywhere now!

Try them. get unaddicted to coffee and live longer.


Bretteee
Jun 17, 02, 6:12 am
R&R I mostly drink tea but in Italy I drink at least 1 cup of coffee. They are famous for their coffee. Like in Vienna.

monahos
Jun 17, 02, 6:54 am
Bretteee, thanks for your trip report, with your usual and appreciated emphasis on food http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif .

I was unaware of this DL 30K award for intra-European C, which sounds like an excellent award, especially given the difficulty of redeeming Skymiles for DL non-elites on DL flights. I have quite a few 'old' DL miles leftover from pre-Qualiflyer Swissair flights.

A few questions:
- what is the procedure for redeeming a DL partner award in Switzerland? Should one call DL in the US and wait to have a ticket mailed?
- I flew AZ MD-80's a few years ago and some of them do have a 2-2 C section; would you per chance know if their A320's also have wider seats (e.g. 2-2 or 2-3), or convertible seats like most European A320 operators?


[This message has been edited by monahos (edited 06-17-2002).]

mauld
Jun 17, 02, 2:08 pm
With 6 hours to kill between flights, couldn't you have gone into Rome, at least for a good cup of coffee???-- Even factoring in one hour for traveling to/from Rome & 1 1/2 hours before your flight, you would still have had over hours--enough for a nice lunch at least http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

PresRDC
Jun 17, 02, 4:50 pm
I'll second Malta as a great destination. I spent a long weekend there last May and it was one of my favorate weekend trips from when I was studying in London. Good food, good people and, although I never thought I would say it, great busses (both in terms of looks and service). Didn't make it to Gozo, but will on my next trip.

Glad to hear about the DL award as I have 65,000 Skymiles and, as I am Platinum on AA, I rarely fly DL anymore. Since I often look for upgrade awards on AA to Europe (and they are usually most plenitful to LHR), this is good to know if I want to go beyond London in Business Class.

Bretteee
Jun 17, 02, 5:26 pm
Monahos all Delta awards on AZ, OK (Czech) and AF are from "any" European city to "any" other European city. The Europe awards are 5,000 miles more than those of other airlines but in some cases like in my case it was worth it as LX stopped flying to Malta and Cyprus where I also would like to visit.

Residents of Switzerland can call Delta in London at 0800552036 to enquire about awards.

The Alitalia Airbus in C has 5 seats vs. 6 in Y.

Yes I am a bit greedy and look at the food with a microscope.

Mould: The problem is that the railway station in Rome is not in such a nice area. We would have had to also take a taxi to go to a nice area like the Spanish steps, where the nice stores are (forgot the name of the street) or Via Veneto, Piaza Navona etc.

Mauld there is a very interesting AA award from the USA to Europe which a friend of mine took. You can visit "any" 2 European cities AA or BA fly to, on 1 award. My friend flew AA/BA from New York to Geneva with 1 stopover and the 2nd stopover was Malaga routed GVA to LGW on BA connecting on BA to Malaga. Then Malaga to New York with BA to Heathrow connecting to AA.

Pres yes we also loved Malta and Gozo. As you say lots to see and "good food". Gozo is worth it and a day trip to Comino but the best day cruises are from Malta, not Gozo. From Gozo its better to go independently and not on a tour.

Bretteee
Jun 17, 02, 5:32 pm
Prez oh yes we loved the busses and the stupid hotels do not tell you about them nor about the the ferries. Very cheap. Our bus driver kept the doors and windows openned and had good music on. We had him both ways. I saw the main bus terminal outside the Phoenicia Hotel. I have never seen so many busses.

kanebear
Jun 17, 02, 7:00 pm
It sounds like the Alitalia Airbus are configured with 'euro' C which is nominally coach seating with greater pitch than Y. I was rather surprised to find that Prima class on the MD-80s was a lot more like US F class in that the seating is 2x2 and is wider/larger than Y class seating! That said, you couldn't pay me to fly through FCO if I didn't have to. Talk about schizophrenic ground ops!! We were on our honeymoon and had a nightmare one morning when FCO was socked in by fog. AF cancelled all their morning flights and AZ kept saying theirs were going to leave but they never did. We were to be on a 9 AM flight and ended up not getting out until 2 after missing one flight thanks to the lounge agent forgetting to put us on it, the next thanks to the lounge agent forgetting to make a boarding announcement (and the monitor not being updated at all) and almost missed the third thanks to four people giving us four different gates! We finally made it 5 minutes to door-close.

Guava
Jun 17, 02, 11:29 pm
Bretteee, thank you for your interesting trip report. It is very useful and excellent reference. Before I read your report, I just noticed there are new award on Delta with Alitalia, something very recent and I just noitced it. Before, it used to be with Continental only, not with Delta. Now the Continental OnePass look unbelievably empty in terms of redeeming partners, it's pathetic.

As I was looking at the Alitalia award for 30,000 miles in Business within Europe, I was just thinking about how to travel to Greece and Venice.Italy + Cagliari.Italy (Costa Smerlada where some Starwood category 6 resorts are located) on one ticket. It turns out, there was only 2 possibilities within reasonable limits: Swiss or Alitalia. Swiss with AAdvantage program allow one stopover and one openjaw and Swiss also fly to Venice and the Island of Sardagna (Italy). AA is very flexible of what a stopover can be, so I can play around with that and travel from end to end between Venice and Costa Smerlada on train and visit everything in between. Cost: Only 25,000 miles for Swiss in Business Class

Alitalia offers similar itineary, but appearantly doesn't allow one open jaw in addition to the stopover http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif That's what Delta told me anyway. I haven't decided yet as I don't plan to travel anytime soon - maybe will reserve that for someday, honeymoon maybe, as you can't really get more romantic than visiting both Greek islands and Venezia, Asolo, Firenze, Roma and Costa Smerlada all in one trip.

Thanks again for the good reference.

Bretteee
Jun 18, 02, 5:52 pm
Kanabaer yes I agree FCO/AZ are risky due to many reasons. This month AZ pilots will strike for 2 days for 4 hours.

I forgot to mention the cockpit door was wide open between Malta and Rome and interestingly one of the pilots was a woman. The pilots on AZ make no announcements.

Bretteee
Jun 18, 02, 6:05 pm
Guava you mention travelling to Greece and Venice. Can 1 on an AZ award on Delta from Canada/USA which is 50000 miles allow you to go to Athens with 1 stop in Milan or Rome?

Don't forget that domestic airfares in Italy are cheap.Lot's of new competition against AZ.

Note that AZ do not fly to Olbia where you also want to go. Only Meridiana is allowed to go there as the same company whop own Meridiana also own the Olbia airport. They do not allow others to go there.

In the past 10 years they have many new Italian airlines like Air One (with LH) and Volare.

I do not know whether Swiss now offers 2 cities with AA like BA allows. The problem with Swiss is that their flights to Olbia are from Lugano and Basle. Look at the Meridiana web site for flights to Olbia.

Those Starwood resorts charge $500 per person for 1 night with 3 meals but still are in my opinion expensive. Friends went to the Rommazino and they did not like it. They said the pool was not heated and was freezing. Also said the ocean was cold and that peddlars bother you on the beach all day.

Nearby you have Baia Sardinia only a few kilometeres away and its much chheaper and they have nice resorts.

In the South near Cagliari you have the new Sofitel where friends stayed and they really liked it in Villaissmus. Other friends stayed at the Forte Village Meridian and liked it.

Guava
Jun 18, 02, 11:41 pm
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Guava you mention travelling to Greece and Venice. Can 1 on an AZ award on Delta from Canada/USA which is 50000 miles allow you to go to Athens with 1 stop in Milan or Rome?</font>

Yes, you can do one stopover in Milan or Rome. Sounds like a great deal isn't it? I know some carriers are/used to allow that for 40,000 miles which is better still. For Business Class, it will only cost you 80,000 miles on Alitalia through Delta Skymiles.



<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Don't forget that domestic airfares in Italy are cheap.Lot's of new competition against AZ.</font>

Wouldn't it be greater if all can be done on one ticket without extra charge? That's one of the best advantage of frequent flyer rewards - flexiblity + creativity. Within Italy, unless it's absolutely necessary say fly to Sardagna, then yes, I will probably fly or take a ferry. Other than that, it's train all the way for me.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Note that AZ do not fly to Olbia where you also want to go. Only Meridiana is allowed to go there as the same company whop own Meridiana also own the Olbia airport. They do not allow others to go there.</font>

You are quite right, thanks for the information about Olbia airport. I was thinking of flying into Cagliari on AZ from Rome. It's in the south of the island I know, but I guess once you are there, it's easy to get around on the ground. Now that Swiss flies out of Olbia, that's greater still because I can use the open jaw to fly out of Olbia on the return portion to my original city, which is likely to be London. So a sample itineary would be this:

Outbound: LHR-GVA/x-ATH (Destinaion)

Return: ATH-ZRH/x-VCE (Stopover + Open Jaw) Olbia - Lugano or Basel/x -ZRH/x-LHR

Everyting on Swiss (LX) in Business Class where available for 25,000 AA miles. You are not limited in the number of connections you need within the same zone. One stopover and one open jaw is allowed. /x indicates it's a connection.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Those Starwood resorts charge $500 per person for 1 night with 3 meals but still are in my opinion expensive. Friends went to the Rommazino and they did not like it. They said the pool was not heated and was freezing. Also said the ocean was cold and that peddlars bother you on the beach all day.

Nearby you have Baia Sardinia only a few kilometeres away and its much chheaper and they have nice resorts. In the South near Cagliari you have the new Sofitel where friends stayed and they really liked it in Villaissmus. Other friends stayed at the Forte Village Meridian and liked it.</font>

There are 4 Starwood resorts there. Some of them receive pretty good reviews on the Starwood-Flyertalk forum. I agree it's very expensive but chances are my room nights there will be free as I have plenty of Starpoints, so hotel cost is a minor concern to me from this point of view. Thank you for sharing the experience however, any comments are well appreciated and will taken into account in my decision process. I guess if I do go, my time will be pretty squeezed. As a loyal customer of Starwood, I imagine I would give priority to Starwood properties. However, your information has certainly opened my eyes to other possibilities to keep in mind. Maybe the other half will have different opinion so that would need to be take care off as well.

Finally, I would like to share a tip with the people reading this very informative thread, special thanks to Bretteee.

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We were talking about stopovers, open jaws and how to maximize the utility of one single award ticket. It seems if multi-stopovers is possible, then people would perceive the award with greater value. For what it is worth, there is one award that will allow you to visit many European or North American cities for the regular cost of one normal transatlantic reward ticket.

Here is a sample itineary: JFK-CDG-BCN-FCO-AMS-DUB-YUL

JFK: New York City
CDG: Paris
BCN: Barcelona
FCO: Rome
AMS: Amsterdam
DUB: Dublin
YUL: Montreal

You can visit all these cities on one ticket with stopover in each of them for only 60,000 miles in economy or 80,000 mile in Business Class. This can be done through a AA-Oneworld award ticket for any combinations of distance less than 9,000 miles. The trick is, the distance are calculated from city to city, using the Great Circle Map. So a flight from FCO to AMS via LHR is counted as the direct distance between FCO and AMS.

This is very powerful. Basically, if you you want to travel between North America and Europe, just make sure you keep your distance count less than 9,000 miles. 9,000 miles might not seem a lot but in fact, 9,000 is big enough to get you from East Coast of North America to virtually everywhere in Europe. Given that it costs you basically the same amount of mileage than other awards to Europe, this award is so much more flexible and convenient as it permits you to use all Oneworld carriers. If Swiss can manage to join, it would make this award even more useful as Switzerland occupies the center of Europe and would greatly facilitates the connection between other Oneworld carriers in Europe which kind of sit on the extremity of three different corners.
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Talking about Alitalia, I just want to share with all of you my only experience of flying Alitalia. It was from Toronto (YYZ) to Milan (MXP) on Alitalia Magnifica class on a paid ticket. Magnifica is AZ's Intercontinental Business Class. To make it short, I wouldn't recommend flying Alitalia unless it's the only option or just convenient for you - like to go to both Greece and Italy. It was a sub-standard flight, food was surprisingly bad considering they are an Italian carrier with Italy pride itself on great cuisine. There were two main plates, First Plate and Second Plate as they call it, and that was preceded with somekind of appetizer I think, can't remember. But the catering as I recall was not served on plate but like a heated rectangular 'box' - almost like Air Canada serve on domestic routes. Anyway, it was bad. I don't recall if there was any entertainment system on-board, I believe there was a video watchman that you could ask the flight attendants for but it has been a while and I don't remeber all the details. For the price they are charging the tickets for: about $3,000 USD return, it's not wortth it.

Bretteee
Jun 21, 02, 7:37 am
&lt;&lt;I know some carriers are/used to allow that for 40,000 miles which is better still.&gt;&gt;

Guava it's 40,000 miles on AA/LX only between October 15th and April 15th.

&gt;&gt;Return: ATH-ZRH/x-VCE (Stopover + Open Jaw) Olbia - Lugano or Basel/x -ZRH/x-LHR&gt;.

OK I see so you can mix LX with AA like AA and BA.

&gt;&gt;Everyting on Swiss (LX) in Business Class where available for 25,000 AA miles. &lt;&lt;

You mean you need a separate 25000 LX Business award? I thought you could do this on a regular award. By the way I do not think it's worth flying on Swiss Business to Olbia (extra 5000 miles) as the plane is a small Saab and the seats in Business are the same as in Y.

&gt;&gt;I agree it's very expensive but chances are my room nights there will be free as I have plenty of Starpoints, so hotel cost is a minor concern to me &gt;&gt;

OK wonderful. However I think these resorts are very popular so you have to book early. The Cala di Volpe is the more famous one.

&gt;&gt;One world Atlantic reward ticket.&gt;&gt;

Yes I completely forgot the One World awards are better in some cases. 80000 miles in C vs. 90000 and 100000 in F vs 125000 on a regular award. However I think BA does not want LX in the Alliance.

&gt;&gt;So a flight from FCO to AMS via LHR is counted as the direct distance between FCO and AMS.&gt;&gt;

Interesting. I had no idea.

&gt;&gt; For the price they are charging the tickets for: about $3,000 USD return, it's not wortth it.&gt;&gt;

Yes I know people who do not like AZ but I have 2 friends who fly only with AZ. Anyway no C or F is really worth it if you compare Y vs. C/F prices/money comparison.


A C class ticket between GVA and Malta is $1300. On Air Malta nonstop in Y its $400. Not worth paying 3 x more.

aw
Jun 21, 02, 3:22 pm
The street in Rome where the nice stores are located is called "Via Condotti". It starts right underneath the "Spanish Steps"

Bretteee
Jun 22, 02, 2:26 pm
aw thank you for the info.

guava you can fly 1 way on Eaglesalpi from Venice to Olbia on an air pass for $99.

See Europebyair. SN Brussels is also now a member.



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