MilesBuzz! - What's the big deal with...

Airline employees sitting in first class? This has been mentioned as a "problem" in almost every airline board. Personally, I don't see much of a problem with it. After all, they do WORK for the company, It is just like someone who works at a restaurant getting free food.

Granted, it MAY take some seats away from the upgrade pile. But I think that the employees DO have a right to sit up there, so long as some seats are left aside for customers.

You hit the nail right on the head, it's the lack of available seats. If they get to ride up front after gate upgrades are allocated, I have no problem.

They also have way too many bags, and they put them _all_ in the overhead bins, not under the seats. In February, YYZ-YOW, I was the first paying passenger on board; there were already 6 AC uniforms in Business Class and _14_!!!! bags in the overheads. One of my bags, and one other guy's, were all that fit. The cabin crew were scrambling to find spaces for everyone else. Yes I should have written a letter but never got around to it. [Shame on me!]

Re: restaurant: no, it's like a staff member taking the last steak (free) and then telling you only bread and water is available for purchase. And the staff member takes the only decent non-smoking table remaining while you sit in a narrow hallway between the kitchen and the washroom, at a smoking table.

andrew


[This message has been edited by Andrew Webber (edited 09-11-1999).]

I saw an amazing sight this past Tuesday night on a US redeye from SEA > PHL. The flight was about 95% full with no available in FC and one US pilot taking a FC seat. About 1 minute before closing the doors a passanger arrived. He was an upgraded standard preffered elite status.

The pilot moved to the back of the plane to make room for the upgraded customer. What a concept.

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Two wrongs may not make a right, but three lefts do.

I saw something similar happen on a Southwest flight, although it obviously didn't involve upgrading.

A deadheading Southwest captain moved to one of those fold-down flight attendant seats in the very back to make room for a passenger. He could have bumped a Reno Air pilot getting a free ride from the jumpseat, but he didn't.

Once the fasten-seat-belt sign was off, he got up and actually started helping the FAs serve the passengers drinks and peanuts - now find a UA pilot who'd do that!

Say what you will about Southwest, but I think you'd be hard pressed to find kinder, more thoughtful employees.

I had a similar experience with Southwest yesterday afternoon. The flight out of Love Field was completely full, including two pilots as passengers who were flying home. Just before the doors were to close a late passenger came running up. The FA asked for one the pilots to take a jump seat in the cockpit. The only argument was an astonishingly polite exchange between the two pilots about which would volunteer. I would have never imagined that happening anywhere but Southwest. This isn't an advertisement for SW, because I promise I grumble as much as anybody about "cattle calls."

That is USAirways policy and on all the flights I've been on they've been very good about it. Often first class is full with regular passengers (I know, you can't always tell who's an F/A, but normally the other F/A's on duty do recognize them and chat it up) and the few times it hasn't, I've only seen pilots sit down in first class after the doors have closed.

The last flight I was on had several seats open in first class and about a dozen flight attendants on it. None of them sat in the empty seats in first.

In fact, so far I've never for sure seen an F/A in first class on US. Just a few pilots. Of course pilots are easier to spot http://talk.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

I'm sure that if you wanted to use an upgrade coupon, pay the FC fare one would be in FC before one employee. However to think that sitting in FC is a right just because they are a revenue passenger and they have given their miles and upgrade coupons to their family, friends, and business partners, I think a little civility should to be expressed here. I would really prefer to keep that pilot, mechanic, bag handler, FA, happy by allowing the practice to continue. It will make for a better experience for us all! Now let's talk about how we can earn more miles! Thanks

I wouldn't be too sure of that. I believe UA's policy is still that the employees get the seat, not the customers!

For standby upgrades at the gate, deadheading crew in uniform has priority over upgrading passengers, according to several UA employees I have asked.

Twice I've upgraded on Continental and had a *stunning* off-duty F/A sit beside me (2 different F/As I should say), so I have no problem with this policy. :-)

There's no problem at all when they sit beside me. They are delightful companions. The problem comes when they sit in front of me. http://talk.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

UA employees fly on a space available basis; they are not guaranteed seats in first or coach. Once all confirmed passengers are provided seats they will then assign seats to the UA employees or family members. Typically on full flights this happens approx 10 mins before departure. If seats are available in first they will get those seats but not ahead of passengers who have requested upgrades. In fact, abuse of this policy is grounds for termination.

The exception to this rule (my understanding) is for crew who are heading to work an active flight. Again, I do not believe they are guranteed a FC seat.

JeffS- Not to make a big issue of this, but I have (more than two years ago) seen and read of UA's written policy which WAS in sharp contrast to what you describe above. I've also noted that UA employees APPEARED to be upgraded ahead of other revenue pax.

I noted before on FT one time when the annoucement was made for nonrev's in first to please deplane, my companion and I were the only ones remaining in FC.

One can argue for or against the policy but may I ask where you obtained this information? If it can be confirmed as true, it's an interesting development.

JeffS is completly correct. Anyone may confirm this policy by writing United or asking a gate supervisor or Customer Service Manager. Now that's not to say that someone might have told you something different to justify something wrong they were doing. http://talk.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif

JeffS is also correct that there is a policy that allows FAs over paying passengers (vacant Coach or First) and even allows for the bumping of paying passengers in Coach if the airline needs to get that FA to a work location for another flight. All airlines do this as if they don't get their crews to the flight where they are needed, a entire flight could be cancelled. Most crews have advance reservations in seats that are assigned to them ahead of time, but when there are cancelations or delays due to weather and such, they are sometimes put on otherwise full flights and someone gets bumped to make room for them. Perhaps this is the "policy" you may have read.

But generally, United employees do not have priority over paying customers on the waitlist. I can't imagine any airline allowing it either, especially with the ramifications. Just ask yourself...wouldn't you demand an explanation if you saw a FA admitted into First when you did not clear the waitlist. I would. In all my hundreds of flights since this policy went into effect (1988, I think) I have never seen this abused. In fact just the opposite. I usually watch what's happening at the gate podium and almost always see United employees called to be informed they would have to take their Coach seat. I also review the manifest for UA employees and rarely find any unless there are empty seats. And if you talk with FAs aboard flights and ask them how often they get upgraded, you'll hear that they find this an increasingly rare occurance due to the high numbers of FFers filling the cabins.

We keep talking about this in so many threads. It's really very simple. Do what I did and write or call United and ask yourself what the policy is. United isn't stupid. They aren't going to have a policy that alienates their best customers in favor of employess! The policy is clear. If you see what you feel is somebody violating this policy, take a note of the flight number, date, and employee's seat numbers and report it. It will (and has for me) been investigated and if abuse is found, action will be taken.

But just keep in mind there are some legit reasons for FA's to be sitting up there. The very least, as we have found out, are that some actually pay for the priviledge. AuH2o actually met a FA that was a 1K! Again, if you feel you are witness to a violation, don't just stand there! Check it out! Be nice but firm. Let them know you suspect you may have been passed over in favor of an employee, and then address their response accordingly with appropriate questions. If you get the cold shoulder or a gate agent that looks down their nose at you, a violation has more than likely occurred and they may just be attemting to give you the brush-off. Get names and ask for a Supervisor or Manager. If you have to board without a satisfactory explaination, let the Gate Agent or supervisor know that you will be following it up when you get home. At the very least, this action may make them think twice about violating policy again. You owe it to your fellow Frequent Flyer to do something!


[This message has been edited by PremEx (edited 09-16-1999).]

Thanks very much for the detailed, informed response PremEx. 1988? Wow! I might have guessed 1998!

I was rather surprised that UA at one time did have a policy that was so much more liberal w/ upgrades for their employees than other airlines were- for the reasons you mention- primarily not wanting to alienate there best customers.

Again, as others have said, it is a courtesy sometimes extended- not a God-given right. Thanks again.

Right on Premex!

Remember: The only thing worse than poor service or breaking the rules is knowing about it and failing to report it...

I was on a full USAirways flight yesterday with about six pilots and several F/A's travelling, most in work clothes (last flight PHL-PIT). All except one sat in coach even though there was an empty seat in first class. The one in first told another guy that he was sitting there only because he'd already worked the max 15 hours and then they allow him to sit in first class to get home.

Sounds like a good policy to me.

BTW: He was a consumate professional as every other pilot or USAirways employee I've seen in first class.

[This message has been edited by dg1 (edited 09-16-1999).]

Just another note. My understanding is that people have been terminated when these policies were violated.

Yes, dg1: I have seen US Airways policy in action as well. I've witnessed non-working pilots move from First to coach when a standby passenger upgraded to the seat and I've sat next to many employees in First and coach who were all very professional. US Airways faults not withstanding, their policies for employee flying seems to be very well thought out and implemented.

[This message has been edited by geo1004 (edited 09-17-1999).]