American Express Membership Rewards - UK Plat -Virgin

No more Virgin Clubhouse access from 1st April according to my statement ;-(

Thanks for that Tony,

This is a great disapointment as I am only FC Silver and used the Amex Platinum card in December and February at the LHR and SFO clubhouses and they were terrific with great staff and services.

I think that I will be downgrading when my annual renewal is due. The clubhouse and car rental CDW were the only things I kept Plat on for and I can't justify it for CDW alone. I hope Hertz allow me to stay #1 Club Gold without it.

That's right no access for UK Platinum cardholders from 1st April. UK Centurion Cardholders are still able to access Clubhouses though.

Didn't someone say that this was going to happen late last year on this very board? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum69/HTML/000851.html



[This message has been edited by AX Lurker (edited 03-09-2002).]

and to add that the travel insurance has a new exclusion or two.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by TonySymons:
and to add that the travel insurance has a new exclusion or two. </font>

I haven't been home for about 10 days so I haven't seen details of the changes. Are the exclusions major or just "technical" that aren't likely to have an impact?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Gaza:
I haven't been home for about 10 days so I haven't seen details of the changes. Are the exclusions major or just "technical" that aren't likely to have an impact?

</font>

From memory the major change is further exclusions relating to terrorist activity. "Fatal or non fatal injury relating to toxic, poisonous, radioactive .. "

I'd always assumed that "act of war and/or terrorism" was already in the exclusions as most policies state these specific exclusions.

Just spoke to Amex and told then I was unhappy at the loss of the Virgin Clubhouse benefit. I asked what they were planning on doing to replace it and they said "nothing we are aware off". I then said that it no longer offered me any value and I would be cancelling the card. Surprisingly they made no attempt to persaude me to stay. I spent around £40K on the card last year so thought they might be interested in keeping my business. Obviously not! The only down side to cancelling is I'll then have to pay for my BA Card.

Gaza: What did you want Amex to offer you?? Didn't you say that you wanted to cancel the card?? Am I missing something?

I too may decide to cancel my amex plat card when it comes up for renewal in October.The travel insurance and Priority Pass is useful but one transatlantic filght will give me Bmi diamond club silver and lounge access.

When this disussion started a couple of month ago there were rumors that something with BA might emerge??

[This message has been edited by The _Banking_Scot (edited 03-14-2002).]

I must admit I also threatened to cancel my membership, but to no avail...

On balance I think I'll keep the card, since the travel insurance (for myself and additional card holder), Priority Pass membership and free BA Premium Plus card just about justify the cost.

I know there was some rumour that there would be a new lounge access benefit with BA, but I can't see it myself (it would basically be out of sync with BA's full fare passenger/elite-focused strategy). If anyone knows, it'll probably be RichardMannion - any news, Richard? (we've missed your contributions here)

As I have already stated above - in view of this major loss, I too will probably be downgrading my card to Gold at the end of this current year. However I have been loyal to Virgin since Maiden Voyager in 1984 and am loath to just sever the ties and jump to BMI as TBS has suggested.

I will be penning a suitable letter to my contacts at both VS and Amex expressing my views, but am not holding my breath.

It may be a naive view, but Amex need to know how many Plat members value the Clubhouse perk and how much potential custom they will lose by ditching it.

I will post any reactions I get on the board.

[This message has been edited by Nottingham Nick (edited 03-14-2002).]

Thanks for that Nottingham Nick,look forward to any replies.I willl get my Amex statement next week which will have the details on it, I assume.

I would much prefer Virgin Clubhouses and Virgin generally over British Midland but I took advantage of the Star Alliance offer of 200 free destination points after 3 one way flights (easter to Brussels from GLA via LHR) and therefore only 300 away from Silver ( I might even go with...AC!! to Canada for the summer holidays. I wish the Toronto service had not been suspended).Flying down from Scotland I find the bmi lounges useful to kill time and have refreshments http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif at EDI/LHR ( but they are not as good as the clubhouses)

Just like to say a few things before I answer any questions here:-

a) I have been watching your posts every day and answering directly to members where possible.

b) Thank you to everyone who posted the kind comments during my absence; in truth it was done for various reasons like buying and moving house and also to see if the FT member that took great pleasure in flaming me repeatedly was going to answer all the questions and/or change their attitude.

Right down to business:

Virgin Clubhouse benefit is going for all Platinum cardholders. By this I mean that Platinum supplementary cards on a Centurion accounts will not be able to use the clubhouses either.

Centurion accounts come with 1 A.C card for the primary cardholder, one supplementary Black Centurion card and a further 4 supp cards in a choice of Green/Gold or Platinum.

Only persons carrying a Black Centurion card will be able to use the Clubhouses. Now the interesting thing for myself and other Centurion members is how we deal with this, I am contemplating swapping every one of my supplementary cardholders to the supplementary Black Centurion card position so that they have a Centurion card with their name on it and a 3 year life; I can then swap another supplementary cardholder. This would pass the Clubhouse test as it is a UK issued Centurion card and the clubhouse take no reference of the account number, and even if they did, I don't think AmEx are going to call me up and tell me off!!

I am going to pitch this to my contact at Centurion and offer the following alternative as each Centurion card costs money due to it being chipped plastic (AmEx Uk have to get a 3rd party to make the cards and then they are sent back to Brighton to be embossed etc, all other non chipped cards are done onsite in Brighton. This is why it takes so long to get a proper replacement Centurion card). Alternatively I will ask if they are prepared to speak to the Clubhouse in question in advance each time and advise that they are prepared to pay Virgin the access fee. They have done this before for me, albeit it in slightly different circumstances.

Now that doesn't help you guys with Platinum but I will say that my contacts at AmEx said that it was most likely a Virgin decision but I would say that it is not. Looking at it logically, Virgin is not going to turn its nose up at the access fee it gets each time an AmEx cardholder use its lounges as they kind of need the money at the moment, it wasn't so long ago that they were looking at closing the LGW clubhouse. AmEx cardholders made up a substantial proportion of the people in the Clubhouses. I seem to recall the access fee being around £20-30 per person (I remember a couple of years ago, Honeymooners and members of the Virgin Holidays Frequent Virgin club could use the LGW and LHR clubhouses for £30 each). What I see has happened is that there are a lot of Platinum cardholders out there now and there are a number that don't spend that much on there card; the Virgin benefit could then cost AmEx money for these members, as when you weigh up the costs of the benefits to AmEx. Its only say 5 visits by the member and their other Platinum supplementary to Clubhouses in one year (working on a cost of £25 per visit) and AmEx have made a loss of £5 on that account. Then factor in the other benefit costs to AmEx, they could start to lose some serious money as the benefit is not capped like the Priority Pass benefit (AmEx pay priorty pass a set fee each year for each PP card regardless of number of uses).

On the questions regarding BA benefits, no news as yet; might warrant a call to Brighton tomorrow to find out.

Personally if I was still a Platinum member, I would have taken great pleasure in cancelling my account on 1st April as my annual fee was due April. I don't think AmEx are going to reinstate it as such, it may even go from Centurion too, who knows?

For you chaps with Platinum I would phone Platinum up and tell them that you are not happy, say that you wish to close your account; this should then get your call transferred to the customer retention team. Let them know why you are cancelling, you could also try grilling AmEx Executive Office too on 01273-576151. Just don't ask them to upgrade your account to Centurion, they can't, they have no control over Centurion. I did this in the summer last year when I was seriously unhappy with the state of the service on the Platinum card and had my annual fee refunded.

Any questions?

Thanks,
Richard

YEAH Richard is back!

Welcome back Richard ;-)

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Flyaway:
Gaza: What did you want Amex to offer you?? Didn't you say that you wanted to cancel the card?? Am I missing something?</font>

I know you have read Richards post so you may now understand what I was getting at. I have read here that people threatening to cancel have had the fee cut and/or been given Membership Reward points. Last year when I called to cancel my Diners Club card they waived the annual fee. Amex are in a competitive market and need to recognise that.

Unless I was offered Centurion and the same cost as Platinum it would be of no interest to me. As I've said before I struggle to justify the fee for Platinum and could never jusfify to myself (or Mrs Gaza) the fee for Centurion. All my business travel has to be booked through our corporate TA and I book 90% of my personal travel on-line so I have little use for the Amex Travel Service. Mrs Gaza and I also get a very comprehensive annual travel policy that comes with my Royal Bank of Scotland Royalties Gold account that costs a lot less than the Amex fee.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by RichardMannion:
This would pass the Clubhouse test as it is a UK issued Centurion card and the clubhouse take no reference of the account number, and even if they did, I don't think AmEx are going to call me up and tell me off!!</font>

Careful here. When I used the Clubhouse at LHR and in JNB my card number was written down. What they do with it heavens knows, but if it did get to Amex.............

[This message has been edited by Gaza (edited 03-15-2002).]

Apparently it may be that this benifit may have been a victin of its own success. It appears that a lot of plats were using this benifit. In the end Amex wanted to lower the cost per visit, and VS wanted to find a way of limiting its use. As it was only affecting those flying eco and prem eco if was felt this was the best way forward. Now if you want to find an easy way to get a virgin Gold Gard and the benifits it affords than go to the VS forum.

Jon

I dont see why a compromise was not in order - maybe a reduced per-visit fee (say half) and only open to Prem. Economy pax.

This way Virgin win as they are getting higher fares and limiting the number of people accessing the club, Amex win as they are retaining the benefit at a lower cost and the cardmembers win as they are getting access!

I too cancelled my UK AMEX card and there was no attempt to keep me. No alternative was offered etc. The lady just said "fine - Is there anything else I can do to help you?"

Three weeks later, I got a letter inviting me back but it did have a reduced fee. ( mind you this was a regular UK Amex card and not a VS). The point is - the Brits work differently than the Yanks. The yanks reduce on the spot and offer alternatives - the Brits couldn't be bothered playing "service" games and send out a standard letter later.

Interesting approaches.

Dave, UK

Good ideas OzFlyer,

I personnally would not mind even if I had to pay a small amount for access (say £15-£20) directly at the entrance-with the Amex Plat as the benefits of the lounge would be at least that in my opinion.

I asked Plat Services last week whether there would be a reduction in the membership fee for the year since the level of benefits were being reduced. She didn't think that was very likely.

Then I asked her what lounge programme would be replacing the Clubhouse arrangement. She told me all airlines have lounges for business class passengers - duh! Yes, but what lounges will I be able to use with my expensive Platinum card? Oh, I don't know, none I guess.

Really have to wonder whether, with trained professionals like that, Travel Services is ever going to add up to anything.

I'm not sure if there are any real benefits left with a Platinium Amex but if you're based in the UK you may be interested to know that Capital One are now issuing the card - with no annual fee:

http://www.capitalone.co.uk/web/templates/product_temp_02_001.jsp?page_id=10301&context_id=2&pageId=10301&product_id=41

No mention of membership rewards though.

Richard

When will co-branded AMEX cards come to the US?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by rharrisuk:
I'm not sure if there are any real benefits left with a Platinium Amex but if you're based in the UK you may be interested to know that Capital One are now issuing the card - with no annual fee:</font>

Interesting indeed, as Amex UK follows the US trend and adds co-branded cards to grab market-share. However, just to be clear this is a Platinum Credit card (like the US Optima Platinum) and not the Platinum Charge Card.

It does not offer the same features ("benefits" if you prefer) as the platinum Charge and certainly never offered VS clubhouse access.

[This message has been edited by road_warrior (edited 06-07-2002).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by WhiteAMEX:
When will co-branded AMEX cards come to the US?</font>

Is this question for real, or am I dreaming ?