Practical Travel Safety Issues - Uniformed Flight Attendant Arguing with EWR PremierAccess Queue Watcher

I saw something interesting at EWR last night...

A CO uniformed FA wanted to use the Premier line to get through security. The guy who checks the boarding passes would not let her through. He was saying that this is for customers only and she was saying that the FA line somewhere else was closed.

She would not relent. She escalated to the TSA - a guy in suit and rubbor gloves showed up (UA style dark gray suit but I don't think UA airport managers would wear rubber gloves - despite how some of us feel here :-) ).

They discussed (by the time I was away from them so I could not hear what they were saying) and then the guy escalated to his boss, it seems. Finally they let her cut through the Premier line and get to the front.

Strange...

Makes sense to me. If the employee line was closed and I was in that line, I would let her go through.

The employee should know better than to engage in a discussion with those queue watchers. The trick is to never even stop walking :)

Over-entitled employee! :p

Although, rather than arguing about it, shouldn't she should cut through the standard line instead if the employee line is closed?

In airports without a dedicated crew line I think it's common for crew to come up the side and be let in the front. I don't understand why the line monitor was arguing.

I don't think I understand your point in bringing up the thread.

Some crews annoy the heck out of me with their attitude in the security checkpoint. Not so much with the TSA employees, but when they have to share a line with the customers.

One time at LAX in T-5 [DL], I was in the regular SkyPriority lane with all of my stuff in the tray and I was the next person to push my stuff onto the x-ray conveyor belt. Oh wait, six different DL crew members, all FAs [not in a group, separately], cut me six times, while I had to stand and watch them put their suit case on the table, grab out the plastic bag, take off their shoes, and put whatever accessories into the tray. I ended up standing right in front of the X-Ray machine waiting for my turn to push my stuff through for about 8-10 minutes while I keep getting cut. I don't need to get into the apathetic remarks they made to me.

The TSA agent who stood on the other side of the table with his mouth open in shock with their attitudes. I was this close to just plop my butt on the table, pull out the nail file and start filing my nails :rolleyes:

Employees should be able to cut through in security, but only up to the point where you pick up your tray. At that point, wait in line. By having them cut everybody all the way up to the Xray machine only slows down the process as everyone has to stand and watch them unpack their stuff thinking they are more efficient at it than everybody around them.

I don't understand why the line monitor was arguing.

Power trip maybe? I've noticed the line monitors at IAH are contract and they seem to be overly strict with things like bag sizes even if UA is okay with it (like if you're flying international C/F and they fit just fine in the bins or in the closet of the 744.

Power trip maybe? I've noticed the line monitors at IAH are contract and they seem to be overly strict with things like bag sizes even if UA is okay with it (like if you're flying international C/F and they fit just fine in the bins or in the closet of the 744.

The EWR ones are the worst in the US. Hands down.

The EWR ones are the worst in the US. Hands down.

The ones at SFO are really full of themselves too.

This is a better fit for the Travel Safety/Security Forum; thanks.

FlyinHawaiian, Co-Moderator
United MileagePlus Forum

I really don't get the whole head-of-line privilege for crew anyway. On 99% of my travel I'm at work just as much as an FA or pilot; why is their time more valuable than ours?

I really don't get the whole head-of-line privilege for crew anyway. On 99% of my travel I'm at work just as much as an FA or pilot; why is their time more valuable than ours?



Well, the difference is that without the pilots/FAs, the flights won't be going!!!! (by contrast, if a passenger is delayed and arrives late at the gate, at least other passengers can begin to board) And trust me, you WANT crewmembers to arrive as early as possible at the aircraft. That way, they can start boarding on time, and departure will be on time!


That said, I have also been in the situation where I have been next to put my stuff on the belt when a half dozen FAs cut in front of me in a big rush, and I have to stand there for 8-10 minutes waiting for all of them to go through the checkpoint.

This issue largely will resolve itself when FAs are able to bypass the TSA passenger checkpoints, using the Known Crewmember Initiative (http://www.knowncrewmember.org) (KCM). A program is already in place for pilots at some stations who go through extensive background investigations and then can use exclusive expedited access to secure areas (like security officers, baggage handlers, and caterers use). Apparently, FAs soon will be eligible to join these programs as well.


http://overheadbin.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/07/24/12929502-flight-attendants-to-soon-get-speedy-security-screenings?lite

http://www.kcentv.com/story/19100536/flight-attendants-will-get-to-bypass-security-lines

http://www.latimes.com/business/money/la-fi-mo-flight-attendants-faster-security-line-20120723,0,1863500.story

The line checkers are a huge waste of time and money.

The trick is to never even stop walking :)
I did this one time at SNA. I was using the elite line and didn't have my electronic BP open yet and didn't want to stand there while my 3G connected. The lady followed me to the TSA ID checker and told the clerk I wouldn't show her my BP. He said I only needed to show it to him.


Employees should be able to cut through in security, but only up to the point where you pick up your tray. At that point, wait in line. By having them cut everybody all the way up to the Xray machine only slows down the process as everyone has to stand and watch them unpack their stuff thinking they are more efficient at it than everybody around them.
Most crew members I have encountered do this. If they're with the airline I'm flying that day I let them cut in front of me.


Well, the difference is that without the pilots/FAs, the flights won't be going!!!! (by contrast, if a passenger is delayed and arrives late at the gate, at least other passengers can begin to board) And trust me, you WANT crewmembers to arrive as early as possible at the aircraft. That way, they can start boarding on time, and departure will be on time!

+1

Wait, you are saying a line watcher at Newark in the United terminal actually stopped somebody from the Premier line?

That alone is worth a thread, not that it was a crew member.

:D

Well, the difference is that without the pilots/FAs, the flights won't be going!!!! (by contrast, if a passenger is delayed and arrives late at the gate, at least other passengers can begin to board) And trust me, you WANT crewmembers to arrive as early as possible at the aircraft. That way, they can start boarding on time, and departure will be on time!



Of course I want the crews to be there in time to do their jobs. So I think that they, just like everyone else, should show up in time to get through security in time to get where they need to be when they need to be there, without dancing to the front of the line like prima donnas. Not a hard concept.

Good info on the KCI program. Thanks.

Of course I want the crews to be there in time to do their jobs. So I think that they, just like everyone else, should show up in time to get through security in time to get where they need to be when they need to be there, without dancing to the front of the line like prima donnas. Not a hard concept.

Good info on the KCI program. Thanks.

There might have been excellent reasons why she hasn't been able to show up earlier. For instance, member of the original crew had to call in sick at last minute..

There might have been excellent reasons why she hasn't been able to show up earlier. For instance, member of the original crew had to call in sick at last minute..

Sure, but that's the exception, not the rule (or at least it should be).

This isn't a huge deal; just an irritant. The clear implication is that crewmembers' time is more valuable than the time of everyone else in line.

Of course I want the crews to be there in time to do their jobs. So I think that they, just like everyone else, should show up in time to get through security in time to get where they need to be when they need to be there, without dancing to the front of the line like prima donnas. Not a hard concept.

Good info on the KCI program. Thanks.


They might not have control over when they arrive at the airport. In many cases where a half dozen FAs show up together, they are coming from the crew van from the layover hotel. The FAs have no control over when the van picks them up, or any potential delays in transit.

They might not have control over when they arrive at the airport. In many cases where a half dozen FAs show up together, they are coming from the crew van from the layover hotel. The FAs have no control over when the van picks them up, or any potential delays in transit.

The crews I see at hotels ride the hotel shuttles just like the rest of us schlubs. I've seen this a couple of times a month for the past 4 years with mulitple airlines at the Doubltree and Marriott at Seatac and at JAX and at Reagan, and at...; it wasn't a one-off.

I'm sure there are an infinite number of reasons for them to need to cut the line. Just like everyone else (traffic, flat tire, meeting went long, bad hair day, hungover, dog ate homework, marmut got loose in the bathroom, etc.).

Of course I want the crews to be there in time to do their jobs. So I think that they, just like everyone else, should show up in time to get through security in time to get where they need to be when they need to be there, without dancing to the front of the line like prima donnas. Not a hard concept.


There would be cases where crew is in the middle of several days of duty with limited layover time. There are FAA requirements for duty hours and scheduled time off between flights that could be skewed if the crew has to show up several hours in advance of a flight in order to get to the back of the line. I have NO problem letting the crew get through with a minimal of fuss. The crew has to inspect the aircraft before boarding is allowed. TSA also inspects the aircraft. The crew needs to make sure that TSA inspectors haven't damaged anything important to the safe operation of the aircraft. As bad as it is for a business traveler, imagine what it's like for the crew to have to deal with TSA every single day! Of course, I also believe that TSA is a total waste of everybody's time and money. TSA should have been dismantled immediately after the cockpit doors were reinforced and the notion of cooperating with hijackers went the way of the west.

There would be cases where crew is in the middle of several days of duty with limited layover time. There are FAA requirements for duty hours and scheduled time off between flights that could be skewed if the crew has to show up several hours in advance of a flight in order to get to the back of the line. I have NO problem letting the crew get through with a minimal of fuss. The crew has to inspect the aircraft before boarding is allowed. TSA also inspects the aircraft. The crew needs to make sure that TSA inspectors haven't damaged anything important to the safe operation of the aircraft. As bad as it is for a business traveler, imagine what it's like for the crew to have to deal with TSA every single day! Of course, I also believe that TSA is a total waste of everybody's time and money. TSA should have been dismantled immediately after the cockpit doors were reinforced and the notion of cooperating with hijackers went the way of the west.

Well aware that there are FAA rules, etc. I don't think 20 minutes in the security line will tke them over the duty day restrictions very often, if ever. If it does, they need better scheduling. I can't tell you how many times I've seen FAs cut the line and then see them 10 minutes later sitting at the gate waiting on an aircraft arrival.

Hours in the security line is a very rare exception (an hour, barring some highly unusual circumstances, is a very long wait). Deal with exceptions when they occur. Don't treat the normal situation as an exception just because it might come up occasionally.

Crews inspecting the aircraft is part of their workday; doesn't have anything to do with this discussion.

+1 on TSA.

They have a right to cut the line. As stated in the first post, the crew line was not functioning, so they should have not only used the premier line but moved to the front of it as they are at many other airports.

Nobody is saying anybody's time is more valuable than anybody elses, and nobody is saying they arrive at the airport late just to cut in line. They arrive in time to make their flight and it's not their fault the crew line was closed.

Would you have been happier if they took tsa staff from the line you were in to open a crew line instead?

FAs can cut whatever line they want to get the past the TDC after that they can cut the line to get to the bins/tables. After that they really should get in line with the rest of us. That said I understand they like to go directly to the scanner. However, I get rather annoyed when that is done and at this point if I am about to push my items through I ask that they get behind me.

They have a right to cut the line.
Why? I get that that's the policy but disagree with it.[I]

As stated in the first post, the crew line was not functioning, so they should have not only used the premier line but moved to the front of it as they are at many other airports.
[I]Many (most?) airports don't have dedicated crew lines. Your point may be valid in this specific case, but is not generally applicable.

Nobody is saying anybody's time is more valuable than anybody elses, and nobody is saying they arrive at the airport late just to cut in line. They arrive in time to make their flight and it's not their fault the crew line was closed.
You are most certainly implicitly saying the crews' time is more valuable than the customers'.

Again, you're addressing the specific case, not the general.

Also, your argument is a bit like saying that there were only three X-ray machines open instead of the usual 4. I counted on 4 being open when I planned my arrival and I should therefore get to cut the line because I'll otherwise be late. Think anyone's buying that?

Would you have been happier if they took tsa staff from the line you were in to open a crew line instead?
No, I'd be happier if the crews planned for contingencies just like the airlines expect the passengers to. I'm sure many, if not most, of them do.

There would be cases where crew is in the middle of several days of duty with limited layover time. There are FAA requirements for duty hours and scheduled time off between flights that could be skewed if the crew has to show up several hours in advance of a flight in order to get to the back of the line. I have NO problem letting the crew get through with a minimal of fuss. The crew has to inspect the aircraft before boarding is allowed. TSA also inspects the aircraft. The crew needs to make sure that TSA inspectors haven't damaged anything important to the safe operation of the aircraft. As bad as it is for a business traveler, imagine what it's like for the crew to have to deal with TSA every single day! Of course, I also believe that TSA is a total waste of everybody's time and money. TSA should have been dismantled immediately after the cockpit doors were reinforced and the notion of cooperating with hijackers went the way of the west.

Well aware that there are FAA rules, etc. I don't think 20 minutes in the security line will tke them over the duty day restrictions very often, if ever. If it does, they need better scheduling. I can't tell you how many times I've seen FAs cut the line and then see them 10 minutes later sitting at the gate waiting on an aircraft arrival.

Hours in the security line is a very rare exception (an hour, barring some highly unusual circumstances, is a very long wait). Deal with exceptions when they occur. Don't treat the normal situation as an exception just because it might come up occasionally.

Crews inspecting the aircraft is part of their workday; doesn't have anything to do with this discussion.

+1 on TSA.

That's one of those things that isn't going to look good no matter whether we have the right or not.

Likely reason for not taking an earlier van from the hotel might be that in order to get FAA minimum rest on a layover they needed to take the ride they did.

Some airports don't have dedicated crew lines and the TSA allows us to bypass.

Personally, I don't do it unless I absolutely need to, and then I try to be humble about it. If a pilot cuts in front of you but apologizes and promises not to take your seat in the plane too, it might be me.

There are more and more Known Crewmember security checkpoints opening all the time. Right now, it's just for pilots but I think FAs will be included. We can thank ALPA and the TSA for this, if nothing else.

FAB

[QUOTE=golfingboy;19147309]

........The TSA agent stood on the other side of the table with his mouth open in shock with their attitudes........QUOTE]

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While on duty, I recently had to go to a gate through a new TSA checkpoint and though somewhat in a hurry, I didn't want to cut in front of anyone. When the TSA guy saw me patiently waiting, he actually "barked" (seemingly annoyed) at me to "just come up here, what are you standing there for ?" I quickly apologized to passengers around me and went forth. If if was the other way around and I made demands, he probably would have gotten annoyed with me all the same. Can't win.

Sometime in the last 2 weeks, a crew from an airline (don't remember which one, but not AA) got in line for the checkpoint @ ABQ. Moat dragon saw them in the back of the line, which didn't go much beyond the end of the table, & started trying to wave them forward. To their credit, they kept declining. After a couple of minutes of this back & forth between them, w/no one going thru the WTMD during this, the FA @ the very back finally yelled 'If you'd just keep the line moving we'll all be fine' ^ ^ ^

That's one of those things that isn't going to look good no matter whether we have the right or not.

Likely reason for not taking an earlier van from the hotel might be that in order to get FAA minimum rest on a layover they needed to take the ride they did.

Some airports don't have dedicated crew lines and the TSA allows us to bypass.

Personally, I don't do it unless I absolutely need to, and then I try to be humble about it. If a pilot cuts in front of you but apologizes and promises not to take your seat in the plane too, it might be me.

There are more and more Known Crewmember security checkpoints opening all the time. Right now, it's just for pilots but I think FAs will be included. We can thank ALPA and the TSA for this, if nothing else.

FAB

Most crew are like you, I think. At least a little uncomfortable about breezing to the front of the line. The quiet apology is usually enough to get me off my high horse.

Well aware that there are FAA rules, etc. I don't think 20 minutes in the security line will tke them over the duty day restrictions very often, if ever. If it does, they need better scheduling. I can't tell you how many times I've seen FAs cut the line and then see them 10 minutes later sitting at the gate waiting on an aircraft arrival.

Hours in the security line is a very rare exception (an hour, barring some highly unusual circumstances, is a very long wait). Deal with exceptions when they occur. Don't treat the normal situation as an exception just because it might come up occasionally.

Crews inspecting the aircraft is part of their workday; doesn't have anything to do with this discussion.

+1 on TSA.
Would you still want them there early so they don't cut in line if it means they time out for duty for your flight home later that day? Agreed on the better scheduling! Often the day comes down to a matter of minutes to violating FAA rules - and those same schedulers could be the first ones to turn them in :roll eyes:

Would you still want them there early so they don't cut in line if it means they time out for duty for your flight home later that day? Agreed on the better scheduling! Often the day comes down to a matter of minutes to violating FAA rules - and those same schedulers could be the first ones to turn them in :roll eyes:

Asked and answered (in the first line of the post you quoted).

Some crews annoy the heck out of me with their attitude in the security checkpoint. Not so much with the TSA employees, but when they have to share a line with the customers.

One time at LAX in T-5 [DL], I was in the regular SkyPriority lane with all of my stuff in the tray and I was the next person to push my stuff onto the x-ray conveyor belt. Oh wait, six different DL crew members, all FAs [not in a group, separately], cut me six times, while I had to stand and watch them put their suit case on the table, grab out the plastic bag, take off their shoes, and put whatever accessories into the tray. I ended up standing right in front of the X-Ray machine waiting for my turn to push my stuff through for about 8-10 minutes while I keep getting cut. I don't need to get into the apathetic remarks they made to me.

The TSA agent who stood on the other side of the table with his mouth open in shock with their attitudes. I was this close to just plop my butt on the table, pull out the nail file and start filing my nails :rolleyes:

Employees should be able to cut through in security, but only up to the point where you pick up your tray. At that point, wait in line. By having them cut everybody all the way up to the Xray machine only slows down the process as everyone has to stand and watch them unpack their stuff thinking they are more efficient at it than everybody around them.

At BGM crew can cut to the front of the TDC line but then they have to wait with everybody else... This seems more than fair.

As others have said the contract line watchers at EWR are the worst!! I fly with the same carry-on luggage every week (roller-board and backpack). Was flying US (Chairman's Preferred & First Class) and the line watcher told me I couldn't enter the security line because my suitcase was too big. She told me I had to fit it in the sizer there which was for an AA RJ. I explained I was flying US and not in a regional jet. She would not budge so I went up to the US counter and explained what was happening. An agent (possibly supervisor) told me my bag was absolutely fine for them and walked me to the line and told the agent to stop hassling their passengers.

I don't blame the crew member for pushing the issue if the crew line was closed.

As others have said the contract line watchers at EWR are the worst!! I fly with the same carry-on luggage every week (roller-board and backpack). Was flying US (Chairman's Preferred & First Class) and the line watcher told me I couldn't enter the security line because my suitcase was too big. She told me I had to fit it in the sizer there which was for an AA RJ. I explained I was flying US and not in a regional jet. She would not budge so I went up to the US counter and explained what was happening. An agent (possibly supervisor) told me my bag was absolutely fine for them and walked me to the line and told the agent to stop hassling their passengers.

I don't blame the crew member for pushing the issue if the crew line was closed.
I had a similar experience at EWR C a couple of months back. Flying UA to BUR with my roll-aboard, my laptop bag and my CPAP. The CPAP has a separate luggage tag hanging from the strap with "MEDICAL EQUIPMENT" in large, bolded red lettering. The CPAP has never been an issue in any other airport, or with any flight crew or checkpoint.

Of course, there are other airports & checkpoints, and then there's EWR. I flash my MBP (on my iPhone) at the burgundy-jacketed goon at the foot of the Premier Access line - initially everything was fine, but he flags me down as I make my way around the scansions, physically blocking my path. It takes three tries for me to understand what he's saying - that I have 'too many bags', and that I need to go back and check one. I then have to explain multiple times that the small shoulder bag contains medical equipment, and that it's exempted from the carry-on rules. Finally he let me pass, but not without a dirty look. Unsurprisingly, TSA and UA had no issues with the CPAP as a carry-on.