United MileagePlus (Consolidated) - GA clears non rev ahead of regular pax. Compensation due?

I'm flying DEN to SEA tonight. I tried to standby for a earlier delayed flight as mine too was delayed several hours.

I made it on the cleared list and went to board but the agent said I was not cleared. A few minutes before, three women arrived at the gate and waited to be cleared. I heard the GA speaking with the pilot clearly say she just had to clear those three non revs (pointing to the three women) then the plane could depart.

The women boarded and I'm left waiting for my original flight to leave in 1:30 .

It was my understanding that non revs are only to be given seats one all revenue passengers, including standby, have been accommodated. Am I correct and what compensation should I ask for?

You have no idea who those 3 were, what their story was.. and you're asking for compensation. Don't you think that's a little presumptuous?

They are probably deadheading for work or home, if there are 3 of them.

Deadheading crew have higher priority than standbys.

You have no idea who those 3 were, what their story was.. and you're asking for compensation. Don't you think that's a little presumptuous?

Perhaps. I do know they were not the people ahead of me on the list (we were chatting in the gate area) and I am 100% positive I heard the gate agent refer to them as non revs.

They are probably deadheading for work or home, if there are 3 of them.

Deadheading crew have higher priority than standbys.

Possible. it was a mom with 2 teenage daughters.

This whole post is now moot, the flight I tried to standby on just cancelled.

I'm flying DEN to SEA tonight. I tried to standby for a earlier delayed flight as mine too was delayed several hours.

I made it on the cleared list and went to board but the agent said I was not cleared. A few minutes before, three women arrived at the gate and waited to be cleared. I heard the GA speaking with the pilot clearly say she just had to clear those three non revs (pointing to the three women) then the plane could depart.

The women boarded and I'm left waiting for my original flight to leave in 1:30 .

It was my understanding that non revs are only to be given seats one all revenue passengers, including standby, have been accommodated. Am I correct and what compensation should I ask for?

You are way short of any information in order to be pointing fingers and asking for compensation.

I know how it seems, you don't know the background story, I can bet if they were leisure non-revs no way would they take priority over you. Perhaps they were on your flight and very late to service another flight out of SEA. You just don't know.

So when the higher ups at UA call some elites over-entitled, the OP is a great example. Even if they were non revs and were cleared due to shenanigans, you're due jack. You're ticketed and confirmed on a flight other than that one. If you had been DB'd that's one thing, but you weren't. It's one thing to complain, although complaining without knowing the full story is always a very dangerous proposition, as a lot gets lost in translation, but IMHO you're way out of line asking for $$$.

So when the higher ups at UA call some elites over-entitled, the OP is a great example. Even if they were non revs and were cleared due to shenanigans, you're due jack. You're ticketed and confirmed on a flight other than that one. If you had been DB'd that's one thing, but you weren't. It's one thing to complain, although complaining without knowing the full story is always a very dangerous proposition, as a lot gets lost in translation, but IMHO you're way out of line asking for $$$.

+1

+1

+1. Knowing what you know, I'd have the same "this sucks" feeling, but I don't have all the information and I'm certainly not going to go pointing fingers.

So when the higher ups at UA call some elites over-entitled, the OP is a great example. Even if they were non revs and were cleared due to shenanigans, you're due jack. You're ticketed and confirmed on a flight other than that one. If you had been DB'd that's one thing, but you weren't. It's one thing to complain, although complaining without knowing the full story is always a very dangerous proposition, as a lot gets lost in translation, but IMHO you're way out of line asking for $$$.

Not so fast - OP did not mention his current status.

If that 3 non-rev does not have higher priority for them to be cleared (in other word, the OP should have been on the plane), then a complaint is proper.

Will UA provide compensation? I don't know. But I will not say OP is over-entitled.

Employees traveling on company business are also called 'non-revs' because they are not being charged for their travel; however, they are also 'positive space', just like a fare-paying customer. You, sir, are a 'revenue stand-by' for an earlier flight for your own convenience.

Employees traveling on company business are also called 'non-revs' because they are not being charged for their travel; however, they are also 'positive space', just like a fare-paying customer. ...would that include family members?

would that include family members?

Sometimes, though rarely.

Employees traveling on company business are also called 'non-revs' because they are not being charged for their travel; however, they are also 'positive space', just like a fare-paying customer. You, sir, are a 'revenue stand-by' for an earlier flight for your own convenience.

I can understand non-revs traveling on positive space getting cleared before revenue standbys...but, can someone provide a scenario/example of a non-rev AND TWO DAUGHTERS getting priority?

I can understand non-revs traveling on positive space getting cleared before revenue standbys...but, can someone provide a scenario/example of a non-rev AND TWO DAUGHTERS getting priority?

Easy, management personnel. They have higher positive space positions. They can bump paying passengers out of FC when they travel.

For the OP, when something like this happens, I recommend just asking the agent, they may be able to explain it to you versus just guessing and getting upset.

AD

Heck even non-revs aren't getting cleared now at some airports... life is rough for us all.

would that include family members?

Sure: Emergency travel. Death in the family...etc. One of the few benefits they have not yet taken away for us or reduced, is the ability to travel at an elevated priority to go to a family members funeral/hospital...etc.

Would be bad karma, if this is the case to be paid compensation for having to take the flight you paid for instead of preventng people from traveling for such an occasion.

Only way the OP could know the situation is to ask those involved, but of course, that would be rude.

They also could have been onloaed into a cabin for which the OP didn't have a ticket, in which case, they were at a priority (elligble) for those seats that the OP may not have been. Too many variables here that we as armchair quarterbacks do not know, and will never know, in order to know what the story was. Again, what happens to person A is of no business to any person other than that person and United. United doesn't explain your personal situations to other passengers, and they shouldn't here either. If you think UA needs to investigate it internally, that is your right to ask, but I would not expect an explanation from UA or the agent or the non-revs.

I think there should be a macro to automatically append "Compensation due?" to every thread title. :rolleyes:

On a scale of "who is due compensation" you lie somewhere between the guy who saw the United Club agent clipping her fingernails and the guy who missed out on an upgrade because the airline sold the F seat at full price. :p

Isn't it possible that they were confirmed for the flight (as positive space), the GA thought they would misconnect and had unloaded them to clear you for standby, but then they made it to the gate in time so GA cleared them back onto the flight?

There are too many legitimate possibilities to assume that there were shenanigans involved.

You should not only demand compensation, you should file multiple complaints with the DOT (one for each passenger) and start a lawsuit in Small Claims court.

You should not only demand compensation, you should file multiple complaints with the DOT (one for each passenger) and start a lawsuit in Small Claims court.

No! Legal means are not enough! We need to take to the streets!

There's a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious, makes you so sick at heart, that you can't take part! You can't even passively take part! And you've got to put your bodies upon the gears and upon the wheels…upon the levers, upon all the apparatus, and you've got to make it stop! And you've got to indicate to the people who run it, to the people who own it, that unless you're free, the machine will be prevented from working at all!

For the OP, when something like this happens, I recommend just asking the agent, they may be able to explain it to you versus just guessing and getting upset.
AD

That's not how it works ---

Prior to checking the facts or speaking to anyone, the first thing that disgruntled FTer's are supposed to do is post their suspicions on this board and DEMAND compensation. If a guy gets lucky he may get 10% back-up which is enough to take this to the next level --- A letter to Smisek!

You don't have any info to make an accurate assumption.

NRPS, perhaps.

You are way short of any information in order to be pointing fingers and asking for compensation.

Come on arisaa....don't let that stop a good heapin' helpin' of FlyerTalk crazy.

Why, they're FAMs, of course.

New TSA policy: Disguising FAMs as teenage daughters.

Easy, management personnel. They have higher positive space positions. They can bump paying passengers out of FC when they travel.

Even when the flight is overbooked by 10 and F is full of paid F customers with most of them being GSes and the rest are international passengers flying to IAD to connect to Europe/Middle East? And the VP decides 24 hours out that he wants to bring his family of 5 with him to DC to watch the fireworks on July 4th?

There has to be some line there and a reasonable advance notice/booking requirement?

I can imagine Smisek would not be pleased if a VP is that arrogant.

..There has to be some line there and a reasonable advance notice/booking requirement?..
Who knows.

But employee guesswork is held much dearer in the modern day's useless FT paradigm than passengers' experiences.

It's a happy Disneyland of fanboys, plane spotters, and fundamentalist apologist who try to defend that Stalingrad-like rubble of what once used to be United Airlines.

This one is a little tricky IMO...there have been instances where a GA bumped me up or gave a perk where I probably technically didnt deserve it...sometimes a smile and a little discretion gets the job done, depending on the circumstances.

that said...if the OP standby status was cleared *and boarding* then I too would be a little bit miffed...but then again...easy come easy go.

hard to really say w/o knowing why the three were let on...if i was the OP and i got hot about it, then found out they were on way to a funeral or something, i'd feel bad about getting upset, especially if i made my original later flight no problem.

i'm a type-A guy...(wife calls me Triple-A)...so with these things i've learned to ask myself...'will it matter in 10 years?'

it is important to know the rule for next time, but to ask for comp? naaa...

that said...if the OP standby status was cleared *and boarding* then I too would be a little bit miffed...but then again...easy come easy go.

hard to really say w/o knowing why the three were let on...if i was the OP and i got hot about it, then found out they were on way to a funeral or something, i'd feel bad about getting upset, especially if i made my original later flight no problem.

i'm a type-A guy...(wife calls me Triple-A)...so with these things i've learned to ask myself...'will it matter in 10 years?'

it is important to know the rule for next time, but to ask for comp? naaa...

You're right. My posting about asking for compensation was out of line. Regardless, there were a lot of unhappy people flying DEN-SEA last night and lots of forced overnights in DEN. I was one of the lucky ones who were booked on the flight which did not cancel (crew day).

I made it home at around 5:00 this morning, 3 hours late, but in the whole scheme of things not too bad.

Here's the pmUA boarding priorities. The fundamentals haven't changed.


BP1-A Full fare revenue pax; company officers
BP1-B Priority flight crew
BP1-C FAA inspectors

BP2 Other than full-fare revenue (meaning rev pax at discount fares)
BP3 UA business travel / UA emergency travel, outbound (going to the place of business or the place of emergency)
BP4 Other airline business travel; travel agent "POSITIVE SPACE"

BP5A Disserviced and full fare F and C pax
BP5B All other revenue standbys

All speculation. No facts. Time to follow-up, if at all, was with GA on the spot. OP didn't, so time to move on with life.

Here's the pmUA boarding priorities. The fundamentals haven't changed.


BP1-A Full fare revenue pax; company officers
BP1-B Priority flight crew
BP1-C FAA inspectors

BP2 Other than full-fare revenue (meaning rev pax at discount fares)
BP3 UA business travel / UA emergency travel, outbound (going to the place of business or the place of emergency)
BP4 Other airline business travel; travel agent "POSITIVE SPACE"

BP5A Disserviced and full fare F and C pax
BP5B All other revenue standbys

There also used to be "Mechanic Must Ride." Some years ago, I was on a oversold flight - vols already accepted - when two UA mechanics arrived at the gate with vouchers that read "Mechanic Must Ride." UA had a MX at the destination and a plane full of people there. The two were in uniform and arrived at the gate plane side with several boxes of Boeing parts. Put the boxes in the belly, came up the stairs, and presented their vouchers. They took two more vols. Is this now demoted to BP3?

There also used to be "Mechanic Must Ride." Some years ago, I was on a oversold flight - vols already accepted - when two UA mechanics arrived at the gate with vouchers that read "Mechanic Must Ride." UA had a MX at the destination and a plane full of people there. The two were in uniform and arrived at the gate plane side with several boxes of Boeing parts. Put the boxes in the belly, came up the stairs, and presented their vouchers. They took two more vols. Is this now demoted to BP3?

Positive Space BP1.

Here's the pmUA boarding priorities. The fundamentals haven't changed.


BP1-A Full fare revenue pax; company officers
BP1-B Priority flight crew
BP1-C FAA inspectors

BP2 Other than full-fare revenue (meaning rev pax at discount fares)
BP3 UA business travel / UA emergency travel, outbound (going to the place of business or the place of emergency)
BP4 Other airline business travel; travel agent "POSITIVE SPACE"

BP5A Disserviced and full fare F and C pax
BP5B All other revenue standbys

None of these have existed since 3/3. CO/Shares does not reconize any "BP code". It has it's own, undeciferable (to me) code. It doesn't organize the waitlist in a categorized way. It does order them and has it's own codes, but there is no break between different groups, just 1 after the other in 1 long list. As tuolumne says, these are pre merger UA codes, not current codes.

No wonder there are so many delayed flights as of late.

Investigating every complaint by passengers that don't get their upgrade surly must take up most of their time, especially when a guy is trying to jump on an earlier flight and he overhears the word "NON-REV"!

Working in a fish bowl isn't the best environment, me thinks, especially when every Tom, Dick, & Harry is waiting to find something to pounce on, even if they don't have all the facts, and even if they're wrong!

YOU decided that YOU want to stand by for an earlier flight. YOU didn't get on that flight, so now you're angry and want compensation.

There is a great article written by Jeff Opdyke call the United States of Entitlement. I suggest you read it. After you do, you might want to look in the mirror (-;

Working in a fish bowl isn't the best environment, me thinks, especially when every Tom, Dick, & Harry is waiting to find something to pounce on, even if they don't have all the facts, and even if they're wrong!

Now I can see why some pilots refuse to put on Channel 9.

How did this thread get 3 pages??? OP did not get upgraded on a flight he was not even confirmed on? He hears "non revs" and assumes the worst so w no facts wants COMPENSATION.??? COmpensation for what? He's lucky he got on the flight. These are lots of catagories of non revs, some of them even fly positive space (but they are still non revs)

This is why UA used the word "over entitled". I'd be embarrassed to write a letter to UA and use the word "compensation"

This is why UA used the word "over entitled". I'd be embarrassed to write a letter to UA and use the word "compensation"

The thing is, I don't think UA was wrong when they called some elites "over-entitled." They're right.

Compensation because the light bulb is dim;
Compensation because the video monitor is tinted red;
Compensation because someone walked on the wrong carpet;
Compensation because someone sneezed.

it IS absurd. There are some folks here at FT who really have nothing better to do than whine and complain about silly nonsense that doesn't mean a danged thing.

I know I'm just a lowly Gold, but seriously, if the worst thing that happens in someone's day is that the warm nuts are in a plastic instead of ceramic ramekin, I have a REALLY hard time feeling sympathy... Furthermore, if that's the kind of thing that makes someone write a letter to your airline and ask to be compensated, I wish my life were that boring.

It's funny, a lot of people now see what some have been complaining about and think "over entitled" might be an accurate description of a small segment of the MP members. I wouldn't say exclusively 1Ks, or any particular tier, but just the segment that likes to complain and thinks they're "owed" something. If those of us that see this had spoken up during the initial thread, we would have been lambasted.

UA's CFO was harsh but accurate. Carriers made their own bed by handing out status like candy during the recession. Now, they're stuck with people who've made 1K with tiny $ spends and the light has gone on that handing out UG's simply dilutes the brand.

This thread is a great argument for thinning the elite herd, making it $ spend based, and limiting the freebies.

The thing is, I don't think UA was wrong when they called some elites "over-entitled." They're right.

Compensation because the light bulb is dim;
Compensation because the video monitor is tinted red;
Compensation because someone walked on the wrong carpet;
Compensation because someone sneezed.

it IS absurd. There are some folks here at FT who really have nothing better to do than whine and complain about silly nonsense that doesn't mean a danged thing.

I know I'm just a lowly Gold, but seriously, if the worst thing that happens in someone's day is that the warm nuts are in a plastic instead of ceramic ramekin, I have a REALLY hard time feeling sympathy... Furthermore, if that's the kind of thing that makes someone write a letter to your airline and ask to be compensated, I wish my life were that boring.

Right on target.

Back when I was in the business, on my company's flights at least, if there was space in F but none in Y, a non-rev leisure traveler with upgrade/privileges for F would be cleared into F but a revenue passenger with no upgrade/privileges would not be cleared at all. Of course, an agent would not likely get in trouble for bending the rules in favor of the revenue passenger and it is unlikely that a high-level elite passenger wouldn't get the same but the above was the "by the book" procedure. That is one possible explanation of what happened to the OP.

It's funny, a lot of people now see what some have been complaining about and think "over entitled" might be an accurate description of a small segment of the MP members. I wouldn't say exclusively 1Ks, or any particular tier, but just the segment that likes to complain and thinks they're "owed" something. If those of us that see this had spoken up during the initial thread, we would have been lambasted.

+1

I can only hope for UA's sake that the portion of those FF who act "over entitled" overall is less than the portion of "over entitled" winners compaliners among those who post on FT. Indeed, I hope it for each passenger and for those of us on FT who have a bit of humility.

The only compensation I've ever expected from UA is when the flight oversells and I am lucky enough to be selected not to go or if they dammage by bag (on those very rare occasions that I check).

Easy, management personnel. They have higher positive space positions. They can bump paying passengers out of FC when they travel.

For the OP, when something like this happens, I recommend just asking the agent, they may be able to explain it to you versus just guessing and getting upset.

AD

It's their company and they make the rules.......we aren't owed anything--upgrades, red carpet, brass band fanfare---- except a seat on the flight we booked.

UA's CFO was harsh but accurate. Carriers made their own bed by handing out status like candy during the recession. Now, they're stuck...
Your definition of 'accurate' is at the very best enigmatic not to say outright silly.

Someone who messes up to that degree deserves nominations to titles such as "incapable", "short sighted", or "mislead".

Praising such a person for one snarky comment is hardly appropriate.

Lol. For all we know, it could've been SMI/J's wife and kids!