United MileagePlus (Consolidated) - UA Club Agent - a new one for me

While stuck at ORD waiting for a flight to LHR, stood in line for about 20 minutes to speak with a customer service agent, and when I got called up and was standing right on front of the agent, she got a phone call and passed the time...well...doing this. (and for the record, one of the flying pieces of nail flew up and hit me in the cheek)

I'm all about multitasking, but really?

picture removed

GROSS!

Love the picture

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_1_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9B206 Safari/7534.48.3)

Yuck! Totally unprofessional

Wow, that's terrible. :td:

Wow-- I don't think I've ever cut my nails in front of someone that wasn't family, let alone at work!

Did she even look up long enough to noticed she was having her picture taken?? Well, at least she isn't a bartender.

Did she even look up long enough to noticed she was having her picture taken?? Well, at least she isn't a bartender.

I was pretty stealth with the picture, but she was looking down the entire time and spoke about 3 words to me ("I don't know"). Had she looked up, she may have saved herself from being plastered on FT :)

Ay yi yi! According to a recent thread, if the nail hit you, it could be battery! ;)

Now THIS is first class at its best baby!

GROSS!

While stuck at ORD waiting for a flight to LHR, stood in line for about 20 minutes to speak with a customer service agent, and when I got called up and was standing right on front of the agent, she got a phone call and passed the time...well...doing this. (and for the record, one of the flying pieces of nail flew up and hit me in the cheek)

I'm all about multitasking, but really?

Now is official: the new United puts the "u" in underachiever. :td:

I am surprised that how can OP take this picture without being noticed...:D:D:D

lolz easy! *check mobile boarding pass* *open up multi tasking feature of iPhone* *picture snaps* done :p:D

Ay yi yi! According to a recent thread, if the nail hit you, it could be battery! ;)

+1. Or maybe the basis for class action litigation.

That photo is going to go viral in ways we can't begin to imagine.

Ok. I have to ask. Compensation?

just out of curiosity; why did you block out her face?

just out of curiosity; why did you block out her face?

Because its against Flyertalk policy to do otherwise?

Also against UA policy to take pics of employees. Just sayin' it before UA says it :p

This picture is the reason I avoid United at ORD whenever possible. I wish the photo was a isolated experience, but it actually represents the attitude and spirit of so many non flight employees at United at ORD.

Nevertheless, I suspect it would be pretty easy for UA ORD staff to figure out who this is.

It is one of those things that one would have a hard time believing without seeing it. Wow!

So, how do we blame this on SHARES? :D

Was she chewing gum and calling everyone "Honey" as well?

World's leading airline, indeed.

Did OP send this picture into UA. I would. Not for comp, that's ridiculous but just to let them see first hand why they get so many complaints.

It's a well known fact that fingernail clippings and boogers getting into the keyboard have a direct, major & lasting impact on the entire system wide program. Has anyone had any problems with UAL's Share system as of late? If so we may have just found the reason! ;)

Unfortunately I have witnessed the same situation, but it was 100 times worse. A 5* Hotel in Dubai, International chain, I had been hired for less than a week and was having breakfast with the HYGIENE MANAGER.
Well he decided to cut his nail in the staff dining room during breakfast, collect the pieces in his plate and back to work.
After being confronted because of that, he hated me with the passion.

So, how do we blame this on SHARES? :D

It's the cumbersome system and lengthy commands that require the lengthy calls to the Helpdesk, which gives the agent the downtime to do this sort of thing.

HAHAHAHAHA -- this definitely happens more often than people think (both UA and elsewhere).

So, how do we blame this on SHARES? :D

It's the cumbersome system and lengthy commands that require the lengthy calls to the Helpdesk, which gives the agent the downtime to do this sort of thing.

I think she may be going above and beyond the call of duty here....priming her fingers so she can type all those command lines without being slowed down by the weight of extra fingernail length...:rolleyes: :p

So, how do we blame this on SHARES? :D
==================
The three magic words she spoke....."I don't know".

It's a well known fact that fingernail clippings and boogers getting into the keyboard have a direct, major & lasting impact on the entire system wide program. Has anyone had any problems with UAL's Share system as of late? If so we may have just found the reason! ;)

I think UA owes you a debt of gratitude for uncovering the core reason that SHARES is problematic. @:-) Just think of all the consultant dollars they will save by just asking employees to improve their worksite hygiene! :cool:

Now is official: the new United puts the "u" in underachiever. :td:

It's in the code - UnderAchiever.

Dang! She gets a chair?!?! All I get is a mat that has been glued to the floor in a postition that is uncomfortable for me.

Someone in ORD UA Club: PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE print this out, make some copies, and stealthly distribute within the club.

I would LOVE to see this woman embarassed.

Beyond incredible.

I will bet that this person's CS manager will have a field day discussing this.

Also, i would LOVE to send it to Mr. Smisek.

GROSS!!!!!!!!!!

On sooooo many levels.


This is a customer service position ie to be of service to the customer. We all know that is an oxymoron in terms of UA culture but OMG to even do this in public is gross and to be PAID to sit and do this is disgusting.

She should be reprimanded and put in a position that does NOT have her in face to face contact with the customer.


UA Insider: Any comments!!

I figured the FT community would get a good kick out of this! I will likely send this to UA--not at all for any compensation (although thinking back to last night, getting hit with the nail clipping is kinda gross)--but really to help paint a picture around the lack of professionalism that many have been complaining about as of late.

In trying to think positively about it, I'm sure she was exhausted (it was near midnight after all and they kept the Club open to accommodate our super delayed ORD-LHR flight) and she perhaps had a momentary lapse in judgment? Or not.

While I got a great laugh from this (kinda sad huh?) I think sending the pic to UA is the wrong call. Perhaps writing about it, but as UA prohibits pictures like this, it won't add to your story, in fact, it may make work against it as how could UA justify using that as evidence...it would add to the defence of the agent that UA is not enforcing it's policy of customers not taking pictures of UA staff. If I were the agent and UA had such a picture of me, I would turn the case around on them and say that the lack of enforcement of policies deisgned to protect the agents is a bigger issue, and that since UA can't police it's rules protecting the agents, that this (although very wrong) should not be their primary concern.

Nothing prohibits you from taking notes of what occured and sending them in, but giving the agent a case against UA doesn't help your assertation that that the agent was rude, it only shows that the passengers are also breaking rules and are rude.

That aside, I think it's an awesome photo!

Thanks fastair for the insight! Like I said, I mainly took the pic for the enjoyment of my fellow FT'ers. It's one of those things that most people just wouldn't believe without the pic!

Thanks fastair for the insight! Like I said, I mainly took the pic for the enjoyment of my fellow FT'ers. It's one of those things that most people just wouldn't believe without the pic!

My human side (non-professional) will make sure as many of my coworkers see it as possible as it is hilaious, especially with the blacked out face. I'm pretty sure if a few thosand people have already seen it, that UA will see it too. Remain an anon "wikileaks"/"deapthroat" kinda guy and the fun stays with it. Put your name on it to paper and it loses some of it's fun.

Just to clarify....was she clipping her full set of nails? Or perhaps just one that suddenly broke?

Just to clarify....was she clipping her full set of nails? Or perhaps just one that suddenly broke?

Full set.

In trying to think positively about it, I'm sure she was exhausted (it was near midnight after all and they kept the Club open to accommodate our super delayed ORD-LHR flight) and she perhaps had a momentary lapse in judgment? Or not.

That she even brought nail clippers to work probably indicates this was not a momentary lapse in judgment.

Another change Jeff thinks we'll like. :p

I'll admit to clipping my nails at work. But I do so in the lav, with the stall door closed and locked.

Just to clarify....was she clipping her full set of nails? Or perhaps just one that suddenly broke?

Even if it was just a single nail, does that make it OK? I don't think so.

If she needed to clip those nails that bad, maybe try to do it under the desk and "try" to be discreet?

She might as well have been flossing her teeth....

She might as well have been flossing her teeth....

Must......resist.......mental......image.....

...it would add to the defence of the agent that UA is not enforcing it's policy of customers not taking pictures of UA staff. If I were the agent and UA had such a picture of me, I would turn the case around on them and say that the lack of enforcement of policies deisgned to protect the agents is a bigger issue, and that since UA can't police it's rules protecting the agents, that this (although very wrong) should not be their primary concern.


I'm truly not be argumentative here with this next question -- just genuinely curious. How in the world can the "policy" of a private company _prevent_ me from taking a photo of their employee? Does my contract of carriage with UA when I buy the ticket say that I agree not to photograph any employee? The airport itself is not private property, so I'm not even sure you could with legal justification ask me to leave if I took a photo (although perhaps having this occur within the RCC is a slightly murkier matter).

I can imagine company policy stating that a UA employee can tell a customer "please don't take pictures" and the employee will not be internally disciplined for that admonition -- that'a a matter between the employer and their _own_ employee. But I don't work for UA -- how can your "policy" bind me? Can I tell a UA employee that it's my policy that they are not permitted to blink in my presence, and this binds them not to blink?

Unfortunately, this doesn't surprise me - I recently wrote in concerning an incident at the ORD UC about two agents arguing publicly behind the desk and using cuss words and f-bombs in the direct presence of passengers, including a family with two young girls. It was the most unprofessional scene I think I've ever seen from ground employees, let alone in a club designed for premium passengers. I did not provide names nor pictures, and received a very concerned phone call from customer service as the incident had been reported by others.

Sad to say, but not surprised here. Welcome to the New United.

OP, just be happy the employee used a nail clipper and was not biting through the full set...LOL

So, how do we blame this on SHARES? :D

The stress of having to deal with SHARES has caused this agent's stress level to increase, causing her to start biting her nails, hence the need to even them out with the clippers. ;)

While I got a great laugh from this (kinda sad huh?) I think sending the pic to UA is the wrong call. Perhaps writing about it, but as UA prohibits pictures like this, it won't add to your story, in fact, it may make work against it as how could UA justify using that as evidence...it would add to the defence of the agent that UA is not enforcing it's policy of customers not taking pictures of UA staff. If I were the agent and UA had such a picture of me, I would turn the case around on them and say that the lack of enforcement of policies deisgned to protect the agents is a bigger issue, and that since UA can't police it's rules protecting the agents, that this (although very wrong) should not be their primary concern.

Nothing prohibits you from taking notes of what occured and sending them in, but giving the agent a case against UA doesn't help your assertation that that the agent was rude, it only shows that the passengers are also breaking rules and are rude.

That aside, I think it's an awesome photo!

At least it makes me wonder whether employee "rights" or whatever have completely overtaken the notion of common sense. This picture, even if it does not result in some kind of employee sanction, should be shown to management to help illustrate how easily the image of an unhelpful employee can hurt their company.

It's not hard to figure out who this is even with the blacked out face. It's about time that this rude, unpleasant dragon gets her comeuppance.

At least it makes me wonder whether employee "rights" or whatever have completely overtaken the notion of common sense. This picture, even if it does not result in some kind of employee sanction, should be shown to management to help illustrate how easily the image of an unhelpful employee can hurt their company.

They. Don't. Care.

We're all over entitled anyway;)

I know the manager of the United Clubs at ORD. I'm sure fastair knows her too, as she's been with United for a long time.

I am going to print the picture out and give it to her the next time I am on a United flight. (Next four flights are on AA, so it won't be this month.)

I'd love to know her reaction to this and that this is making its way on the internet.

Nothing prohibits you from taking notes of what occured and sending them in, but giving the agent a case against UA doesn't help your assertation that that the agent was rude, it only shows that the passengers are also breaking rules and are rude.

That aside, I think it's an awesome photo!

FASTAIR - I have never seen anything that prohibits me from taking a picture of an employee. It might be UA's policy to let employees tell customers to stop taking pictures of them. However, this woman works in a public place where no signs are posted asking us not to take pictures. I can understand that a customer would be in the wrong for taking a SECOND picture if s(he) was asked to stop after the first one. But where is there a rule posted anywhere for customers telling us we are prohibited from photographing an employee?

I don't know if I should laugh, cry, or feel disgusted.

Not sure where it's posted( if it is) in the UA Club but for the plane & crew it's in Hemisphere Magazine.

Not sure where it's posted( if it is) in the UA Club but for the plane & crew it's in Hemisphere Magazine.

AT: Hemispheres tells me that I'm not allowed to take a picture of the aircraft itself?? If so, there's a rule that's broken hundreds of times per day....

It's in the code - UnderAchiever.

LOVE IT! :p

AT: Hemispheres tells me that I'm not allowed to take a picture of the aircraft itself?? If so, there's a rule that's broken hundreds of times per day....

There is a FAR against photography of active aircrew that has been enforced more regularly since 9/11 including UA-410 on 8/2 when a frustrated gentlemen was at fault and photographed purser leading the plane back to gate and his removal from plane by DEN PD.
(This gentlemen unlike the OP was MAJORLY at fault for many things)

At least somebody got an UDU since the removed passenger was removed from FC. :D

Not sure where it's posted( if it is) in the UA Club but for the plane & crew it's in Hemisphere Magazine.

That's funny, I've never noticed it. No wonder people are confused. All EK flights have a Polaroid onboard w printed Emirates frames so the F/A can take your picture (w travelling companion OR if you want you can have your picture taken wirh a F/A w her "genie" hat on :D. ( Yeah, yeah I know...indentured servants, sexist, blah blah blah)

That's funny, I've never noticed it. No wonder people are confused. All EK flights have a Polaroid onboard w printed Emirates frames so the F/A can take your picture (w travelling companion OR if you want you can have your picture taken wirh a F/A w her "genie" hat on :D. ( Yeah, yeah I know...indentured servants, sexist, blah blah blah)

And isn't UA running some sort of appreciation contest that requires a photo of the employee?

And isn't UA running some sort of appreciation contest that requires a photo of the employee?

No but might as well, they have to give you their full name, employee number & code for where they are based :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Next time I want to complain about a UA F/A, I'm going to just pull out my IPhone and tell her I want to enter her to win, then I've got her name and employee number. :)

And isn't UA running some sort of appreciation contest that requires a photo of the employee?photo - no, employee id - yes
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileageplus-consolidated/1351086-new-employee-customer-service-program.html

While I got a great laugh from this (kinda sad huh?) I think sending the pic to UA is the wrong call. Perhaps writing about it, but as UA prohibits pictures like this, it won't add to your story, in fact, it may make work against it as how could UA justify using that as evidence...it would add to the defence of the agent that UA is not enforcing it's policy of customers not taking pictures of UA staff. If I were the agent and UA had such a picture of me, I would turn the case around on them and say that the lack of enforcement of policies deisgned to protect the agents is a bigger issue, and that since UA can't police it's rules protecting the agents, that this (although very wrong) should not be their primary concern.

Nothing prohibits you from taking notes of what occured and sending them in, but giving the agent a case against UA doesn't help your assertation that that the agent was rude, it only shows that the passengers are also breaking rules and are rude.

That aside, I think it's an awesome photo!

I'm curious, how does UA enforce its policy of customers not taking pictures of UA staff? Isn't it law that you can video or photo in public places?

And isn't UA running some sort of appreciation contest that requires a photo of the employee?

Photo is not required, but maybe a piece of fingernail clipping is? Collect the remnants and mail them in to Customer Appreciation for 10K RDM prize?

I'm curious, how does UA enforce its policy of customers not taking pictures of UA staff? Isn't it law that you can video or photo in public places?

I and about 4 other posters have asked this same question in this thread. While waiting for an attorney, I'll venture a guess at the possible answer. The contract of carriage, which is the completely undecipherable document that is actually a contract between you and UA every time you buy a ticket, just MIGHT say that UA can refuse to transport any person for any arbitrary reason of its choice (as long as it's not a legally protected issue, such as race or gender) if they refund your money. In that case, if they don't like the way you part your hair, they can refuse to carry you. And if you take a photo of their staff, even in a public place where photography is perfectly legal, their "enforcement" might be simply "you're not flying with us -- write Houston for your money back."

I'm curious, how does UA enforce its policy of customers not taking pictures of UA staff? Isn't it law that you can video or photo in public places?

I don't recall many laws that state what you can do, most laws restrict or state what you can't do. As to public, do you mean private (owned by city) property leased by a corporation? That isn't public property, the lease makes it private.

As to your question, how do they police it? They don't. As to where it is listed (not asked,) to be honst, I have no clue. It was easy to search under united.com, but since co.com has taken over, the search function doesn't give me any useable links, they just take me back tothe search page. It WAS on united.com, and was in the hemisphres, but as I don't kp a copy of them, I don't kno if it's still in there. There ae those who have seen it (on this board) but since it isn't against any law and it isn't part of the CoC, I don't really thik that UA really cares about it. If it was part of the CoC, it would ultimately be enforceable as aviolation of your contract. But it isn't, so I doubt there is much penalty or enforcability to maintain the rule.

As a sde note, I know who the agent is. SHe is a sweatheart. Salt of the earth type. I hope se doesn't get shown it, as I think it would really hurther feelings t see someone posting that picture. But it is a dog eat dog world, and people (including myself at times) do things for our own pleasure and don't factor in the impact our actions would have on others.

Edit: even using an advanced google search, I can't find it on united.com. Perhpas they removed it during the continentalization of united, or perhaps they removed it as they new the rule had no teeth.

ICK!

I paid to use the UC at ORD about a month ago and almost witnessed a fist fight between a group of very drunk, loud, belligerent, passengers and a few polite, but assertive customers who asked them to turn their club music down. The bartender said he was afraid to cut them off because the last bartender that did this was fired when he upset the "wrong person".

Ah, I don't think so Jeff!!!

It's a well known fact that fingernail clippings and boogers getting into the keyboard have a direct, major & lasting impact on the entire system wide program. Has anyone had any problems with UAL's Share system as of late? If so we may have just found the reason! ;)

Two boogers plus one clipping=SHARES working better.

I don't know if I should laugh, cry, or feel disgusted.All of the above....................

But it is a dog eat dog world, and people (including myself at times) do things for our own pleasure and don't factor in the impact our actions would have on others.

The stress of delayed/cancelled flights and having to deal with SHARES seems to have led this agent to experience a momentary lapse of judgement. Let's just agree that clipping your nails in public even on private property is unacceptable.

As a sde note, I know who the agent is. SHe is a sweatheart. Salt of the earth type. I hope se doesn't get shown it, as I think it would really hurther feelings t see someone posting that picture. But it is a dog eat dog world, and people (including myself at times) do things for our own pleasure and don't factor in the impact our actions would have on others.


If she's a sweetheart, then maybe you can try to hint at it that she shouldn't be doing that then (some people probably don't even know that it's inappropriate)? Atleast give her the courtesy before it happens again (or something worse happens).

As a sde note, I know who the agent is. SHe is a sweatheart. Salt of the earth type. I hope se doesn't get shown it, as I think it would really hurther feelings t see someone posting that picture. But it is a dog eat dog world, and people (including myself at times) do things for our own pleasure and don't factor in the impact our actions would have on others.


I have also encountered this agent before and while she may have been a sweetheart to you, I cannot say my experience was similar -- whether in attitude or competence.

I'm sure that is against the Code of Conduct:

Thou shalt not catapult nail clippings in a passenger's face.

There is a FAR against photography of active aircrew that has been enforced more regularly since 9/11

Post a link to the actual regulation, at a .gov domain, or I call BS.

Even if true, it's debatable whether a RCC employee is an "active aircrew."

Post a link to the actual regulation, at a .gov domain, or I call BS.

Even if true, it's debatable whether a RCC employee is an "active aircrew."

If that's an actual regulation, all the people taping those various "rapping flight attendants" are in violation.

On the airplane it's fine to take a pic of jr's first time in Bis /First or if the Flight Deck invites them to take a pic in the Capt seat w/ the hat on. Or your food (most of us find that odd) are all ok.

But a pic of the crew at work or what the pax thinks is not at work : ) (yes reading People magazine is not working) is against United policy and is still in the Hemisphere magazine. It's in small box around the same place it tells pax that they can't drink their own booze.

On the airplane it's fine to take a pic of jr's first time in Bis /First or if the Flight Deck invites them to take a pic in the Capt seat w/ the hat on. Or your food (most of us find that odd) are all ok.

But a pic of the crew at work or what the pax thinks is not at work : ) (yes reading People magazine is not working) is against United policy and is still in the Hemisphere magazine. It's in small box around the same place it tells pax that they can't drink their own boos.

Is that booze or boo-urns? ;)

Ay yi yi! According to a recent thread, if the nail hit you, it could be battery! ;)

And post a pic without consent is against the law.. I hope you have a good lawyer. if this person pursue a law suit against you, they just ask a court order from a judge and get the video. Are you prepare to loose everything you have??? if you thought that by doing this you are going to damage United image ? in your evil way of thinking a person who does not have nothing to do with your flight been cancel or delay. She is going to pay for... good job done!!! you should be proud of yourself. You are so giving and special human being!!! i hope you can sleep well every night when you get the letter in the mail....

It's a well known fact that fingernail clippings and boogers getting into the keyboard have a direct, major & lasting impact on the entire system wide program. Has anyone had any problems with UAL's Share system as of late? If so we may have just found the reason! ;)

Human and a program from last decade is two separate issue my friend... don't mix oranges and apples....

ain't no cure for stoooopid

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_1_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9B206 Safari/7534.48.3)

UA can make all of the "policies" they want regarding photographing employees at the airport. Just because UA creates a policy against taking such pictures doesn't mean it is against the law. Reasonable people are aware that when they are in public, they may be photographed, it isn't against the law to do so.

AT: Hemispheres tells me that I'm not allowed to take a picture of the aircraft itself?? If so, there's a rule that's broken hundreds of times per day....

Funny... US Airways has a twitter game to post photos of US Air planes.

No but might as well, they have to give you their full name, employee number & code for where they are based :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Next time I want to complain about a UA F/A, I'm going to just pull out my IPhone and tell her I want to enter her to win, then I've got her name and employee number. :)

People are smarter than that...

And post a pic without consent is against the law.. I hope you have a good lawyer. if this person pursue a law suit against you, they just ask a court order from a judge and get the video. Are you prepare to loose everything you have??? if you thought that by doing this you are going to damage United image ? in your evil way of thinking a person who does not have nothing to do with your flight been cancel or delay. She is going to pay for... good job done!!! you should be proud of yourself. You are so giving and special human being!!! i hope you can sleep well every night when you get the letter in the mail....



Human and a program from last decade is two separate issue my friend... don't mix oranges and apples....

wow, where did you go to law school? :rolleyes:

Come people really!! explain to me how you relate what she is doing versus a program that doesn't work? even a seven year old can reason better.... a program that is not up to today standard to run a airline??? I guess I have to consider that there are people in USA who never finished high school and it is understandable to accept that their brain doesn't go any farther...

You really thought the poster was serious:rolleyes:

If she's a sweetheart, then maybe you can try to hint at it that she shouldn't be doing that then (some people probably don't even know that it's inappropriate)? Atleast give her the courtesy before it happens again (or something worse happens).

I don't think she will get the chance. Most likely she is going to be out of a job.. If a person really feel offended in anyway, the human and intelligent way to do it was to ask for a supervisor but no. He/she took the pic with the most evil intentions against her since she can display his/her anger and frustration... He/She react like a 10 year old grammar school... I agree she shouldn't done it in public view but is not an excuse to support his/her anger...

Most likely she is going to be out of a job..

Or not. If that was the first complaint about the employee that hardly warrants termination. If there is a laundry list of complaints or discipline and this is the nail in that person's coffin, than so be it.

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_1_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9B206 Safari/7534.48.3)

UA can make all of the "policies" they want regarding photographing employees at the airport. Just because UA creates a policy against taking such pictures doesn't mean it is against the law. Reasonable people are aware that when they are in public, they may be photographed, it isn't against the law to do so.

You right but to post a pic without the person consent, it is against the law....

You right but to post a pic without the person consent, it is against the law....

which law?

You right but to post a pic without the person consent, it is against the law....

If that is the case (which I highly doubt) the OP could just say that he/she was taking a picture of the "Aspen 30" box in the background and the woman in the photo happened to be in the frame, after all, it is a public place.

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_1_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9B206 Safari/7534.48.3)



You right but to post a pic without the person consent, it is against the law....

That is not correct.

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_1_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9B206 Safari/7534.48.3)



That is not correct.

really? explain....

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_1_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9B206 Safari/7534.48.3)

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_1_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9B206 Safari/7534.48.3)



That is not correct.

really? explain....

There's not a lot to explain. If you are in a public place, you have very little expectation of privacy insofar as other people can observe you (contrast this with when you are at home, where you have a very high expectation of privacy). When you are in a public place, you are generally subject to being photographed, filmed, drawn by a sketch artist, etc. Any of these photographs, films, sketch artist drawings, etc. can then be posted to an Internet forum, YouTube, Facebook, wherever.

The above is only a discussion of the state of the law in the United States - other jurisdictions may (and some do) differ significantly.

really? explain....

I think there's confusion with what is proper and what is illegal -- you can take pictures of people without their consent in a public setting. Whether it is public or not is debatable as well -- IMO I don't think it's in a public setting as certain beaches, malls, etc have specific photography rules and not considered public areas. Regardless, taking pics in PUBLIC without a written or verbal consent this is viewed as a no-no in photography (esp. when involving children).

However, if you make money off from the pictures, then it is illegal (put it in promo brochures, commercials, etc). If you put it in a blog or something, it is legal but not necessarily right.

Just posted on twitter...let's take this viral! :rolleyes:

eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeew. :p

I am mostly a lurker here and there, but I did want to chime in to say PLEASE don' t make this go viral beyond FT!? Yes, what she did is GROSS and disgusting, but she is bad mannered and poorly educated, rather than malicious. I chuckled along with the rest of you for the last 6 pages, but a simple reprimand from her manager or FastAir would solve the problem for everyone, and not result in world wide humiliation. I feel badly that the OP got a fingernail clipping in the face (personally, I would have swatted the clippers out of her hand), but she could lose her job, her benefits. I'm just sayin' think about what could happen if this went out on twitter and have some mercy on this unfortunate and stupid woman!

Yes, what she did is GROSS and disgusting, but she is bad mannered and poorly educated...

Years ago I was sitting in a proceeding in U.S. District Court. The courtroom was very quiet. (Federal courts are so quiet because so little happens, but that's another story.) The judge was taking his time reading something to himself. The U.S. marshal for the district was sitting in the courtroom. At her level these are patronage jobs more than G-man civil service jobs. Think Tommy Lee Jones's boss's boss.

This particular marshal had her M.A. and Ph.D. and came from a higher ed law enforcement background. Her education did not stop her from taking out her fingernail clippers and meticulously clipping her nails in an otherwise dead quiet courtroom. Bad manners, yes. Poorly educated, no.

The OP is on solid legal ground. In America, you don't need someone's permission to publish their photograph. Invasion of privacy can come into play if the photographer intruded upon his subject's seclusion - climbing atop a ladder and photographing an obese woman in an unflattering position as she sunbathed in her fenced back yard, for example.

But a receptionist in the lobby of an airport lounge in Chicago, Illinois is absolutely in a public place for the purposes of the law.

United could revoke the photographer's UC membership (or UA flying privileges altogether) for violating the airline's policies. But that's a private matter between the photographer and the airline. And also seems quite unlikely. Legally, the photographer is fine.

FASTAIR - I have never seen anything that prohibits me from taking a picture of an employee. It might be UA's policy to let employees tell customers to stop taking pictures of them. However, this woman works in a public place where no signs are posted asking us not to take pictures. I can understand that a customer would be in the wrong for taking a SECOND picture if s(he) was asked to stop after the first one. But where is there a rule posted anywhere for customers telling us we are prohibited from photographing an employee?

Here is a contrarian thought: perhaps if these people did their jobs in a normal way, then pax wouldn't even want to take pictures of them.

[QUOTE=devil2012advocate;19078741]And post a pic without consent is against the law..QUOTE]

Absolutely untrue -- at least with respect to airline employees. It is not against the law to take their pictures. Some may argue that this is private property and UA is within its right to prohibit photography. However, the UA Club is private property acting as a public place, so that argument probably doesn't hold water. A public place is defined in common law as a place to which the general public has access. It is NOT limited to public property.

As far as the legality of posting pictures online, the law is very much in favor the photographer. Exceptions come into play when there is an expectation of privacy, such as public bathroom stalls, changing rooms, tanning salons, and doctor’s offices that may require you to be partially or completely undressed.

There is an urban legend that the Patriot Act gave the government the authority to prohibit photographs of airliners and airline employees -- whether in the air or on the ground -- but that is not true. There are certain protections in place to prohibit photography of TSA personnel, but these do not apply to our manicurist at the ORD United Club.

UA's Contract of Carriage is very specific about the reasons it will refuse to transport someone. Taking photos of employees is not one of the enumerated reasons, although I'm sure UA's counsel would try to make that case.

At best, if UA takes adverse action against the employee, she could file a tort claim against the photographer, alleging that his/her action harmed her. I think that is a stretch, but there is nothing to stop her from making such a claim.

I don't think she will get the chance. Most likely she is going to be out of a job.. If a person really feel offended in anyway, the human and intelligent way to do it was to ask for a supervisor but no. He/she took the pic with the most evil intentions against her since she can display his/her anger and frustration... He/She react like a 10 year old grammar school... I agree she shouldn't done it in public view but is not an excuse to support his/her anger...

No evil intentions whatsoever and I wasn't at all angry--until I saw your post(s). If I wanted to be evil (or un-human, or unintelligent), I would've sent this to corporate with the desire to get her fired or held accountable for her disgusting behavior. On the contrary, I think I've been quite reasonable and even tried to give her the benefit of the doubt by saying that she must've been tired from such a long day and not been in the best state of mind.

I can't help but get the feeling that you have another FT account and created this devil's advocate account to just troll (which is against FT TOS). Maybe I'm wrong and perhaps you're a perturbed UA employee who realizes that your one of your (anonymous) co-workers has done a terrible job of being a brand ambassador, and the visual representation of that has now been seen and you can't help but come here and throw around false legalese.

Either way, I think I've been VERY clear that I'm not here to tarnish anyone's reputation, to destroy anyone's career, or to poorly reflect on UA's brand. I'm a loyal UA traveler who goes out of my way to support the airline; if that were to change based on one or two bad apples, I would've changed airlines long ago.

[edit: picture has been removed]

No evil intentions whatsoever and I wasn't at all angry--until I saw your post(s). If I wanted to be evil (or un-human, or unintelligent), I would've sent this to corporate with the desire to get her fired or held accountable for her disgusting behavior. On the contrary, I think I've been quite reasonable and even tried to give her the benefit of the doubt by saying that she must've been tired from such a long day and not been in the best state of mind.

I can't help but get the feeling that you have another FT account and created this devil's advocate account to just troll (which is against FT TOS). Maybe I'm wrong and perhaps you're a perturbed UA employee who realizes that your one of your (anonymous) co-workers has done a terrible job of being a brand ambassador, and the visual representation of that has now been seen and you can't help but come here and throw around false legalese.

Either way, I think I've been VERY clear that I'm not here to tarnish anyone's reputation, to destroy anyone's career, or to poorly reflect on UA's brand. I'm a loyal UA traveler who goes out of my way to support the airline; if that were to change based on one or two bad apples, I would've changed airlines long ago.

[edit: picture has been removed]

What do you think is posting her picture on the website? is it your way to tell someone what you are doing is wrong?? so let me understand you.. so if you go to a Bank and the agent is doing something totally disgusted, by your way of thinking, you would take a picture and posted in the web so that way you are telling the agent that what he/she did was wrong? Am I understanding you right? I fly a lot. I have seen disgusted thing from another airlines but I have never done nothing as low as what you did. A normal mature person will contacted a Supervisor ASAP. Since your flight was delay or cancel, you would have the time to wait for one. Now you are saying quote... "I think I've been quite reasonable and even tried to give her the benefit of the doubt by saying that she must've been tired from such a long day and not been in the best state of mind." Really by you posting on the web you were "QUITE REASONABLE" Can someone tell it is reasonable to post a picture of a person instead of confronting the moment? How old are you Lady? I leave it at that you sleep with your conscience and I sleep with mind... I think I got my answer and to know why the picture was taken... I hope you take this as an experience that quote "GIVING HER THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT" you have a funny way to give a benefit of the doubt.... if your job is to make decisions and so forth, I would it fired you long time ago as your Boss..... WOW!!! There are still in existent people like this.... I feel sorry for it....

What do you think is posting her picture on the website? is it your way to tell someone what you are doing is wrong?? so let me understand you.. so if you go to a Bank and the agent is doing something totally disgusted, by your way of thinking, you would take a picture and posted in the web so that way you are telling the agent that what he/she did was wrong? Am I understanding you right? I fly a lot. I have seen disgusted thing from another airlines but I have never done nothing as low as what you did. A normal mature person will contacted a Supervisor ASAP. Since your flight was delay or cancel, you would have the time to wait for one. Now you are saying quote... "I think I've been quite reasonable and even tried to give her the benefit of the doubt by saying that she must've been tired from such a long day and not been in the best state of mind." Really by you posting on the web you were "QUITE REASONABLE" Can someone tell it is reasonable to post a picture of a person instead of confronting the moment? How old are you Lady? I leave it at that you sleep with your conscience and I sleep with mind... I think I got my answer and to know why the picture was taken... I hope you take this as an experience that quote "GIVING HER THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT" you have a funny way to give a benefit of the doubt.... if your job is to make decisions and so forth, I would it fired you long time ago as your Boss..... WOW!!! There are still in existent people like this.... I feel sorry for it....

Talking about trying too hard... Calling the person "low" just for taking the photo? This reeks of ulterior motive.

It is not his fault she was exhibiting poor manners. If she is fired for it, then so be it. Life is tough, and there are many who would love to have her job, especially in today's employment market.

What do you think is posting her picture on the website? is it your way to tell someone what you are doing is wrong?? so let me understand you.. so if you go to a Bank and the agent is doing something totally disgusted, by your way of thinking, you would take a picture and posted in the web so that way you are telling the agent that what he/she did was wrong? Am I understanding you right? I fly a lot. I have seen disgusted thing from another airlines but I have never done nothing as low as what you did. A normal mature person will contacted a Supervisor ASAP. Since your flight was delay or cancel, you would have the time to wait for one. Now you are saying quote... "I think I've been quite reasonable and even tried to give her the benefit of the doubt by saying that she must've been tired from such a long day and not been in the best state of mind." Really by you posting on the web you were "QUITE REASONABLE" Can someone tell it is reasonable to post a picture of a person instead of confronting the moment? How old are you Lady? I leave it at that you sleep with your conscience and I sleep with mind... I think I got my answer and to know why the picture was taken... I hope you take this as an experience that quote "GIVING HER THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT" you have a funny way to give a benefit of the doubt.... if your job is to make decisions and so forth, I would it fired you long time ago as your Boss..... WOW!!! There are still in existent people like this.... I feel sorry for it....

First thing - I don't know what country you live in but in the US it is not illegal or "evil" to take a picture in a public place (and it's not illegal in many other countries either). She is not going to lose her job over this either. Perhaps you should learn a little something about the laws in the US before making such strong statements of fact like you have in your previous posts. While it might not have been the most polite thing for the OP to do (posting her picture). It is far from Evil. Hilter was Evil. OP was just off color. Big difference.

What do you think is posting her picture on the website? is it your way to tell someone what you are doing is wrong?? so let me understand you.. so if you go to a Bank and the agent is doing something totally disgusted, by your way of thinking, you would take a picture and posted in the web so that way you are telling the agent that what he/she did was wrong? Am I understanding you right? I fly a lot. I have seen disgusted thing from another airlines but I have never done nothing as low as what you did. A normal mature person will contacted a Supervisor ASAP. Since your flight was delay or cancel, you would have the time to wait for one. Now you are saying quote... "I think I've been quite reasonable and even tried to give her the benefit of the doubt by saying that she must've been tired from such a long day and not been in the best state of mind." Really by you posting on the web you were "QUITE REASONABLE" Can someone tell it is reasonable to post a picture of a person instead of confronting the moment? How old are you Lady? I leave it at that you sleep with your conscience and I sleep with mind... I think I got my answer and to know why the picture was taken... I hope you take this as an experience that quote "GIVING HER THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT" you have a funny way to give a benefit of the doubt.... if your job is to make decisions and so forth, I would it fired you long time ago as your Boss..... WOW!!! There are still in existent people like this.... I feel sorry for it....

Presumably with the logic you are demonstrating you don't have many people to fire. If you do, god help them. Utmost evil indeed.

Post a link to the actual regulation, at a .gov domain, or I call BS.

Even if true, it's debatable whether a RCC employee is an "active aircrew."

FlavorFlav,

I agree that RCC is not active crew the discussion had turned to UA policy and overlap with cabin, but there are several FARs that are interpreted through several court cases and increased concern since 9/11 to include photography of crew and aircraft, or for that manner any action that can be perceived as threatening or interfere with performing duties as stated below.

Title 14: Aeronautics and Space
PART 121—OPERATING REQUIREMENTS: DOMESTIC, FLAG, AND SUPPLEMENTAL OPERATIONS
Subpart T—Flight Operations

§ 121.580 Prohibition on interference with crewmembers.

No person may assault, threaten, intimidate, or interfere with a crewmember in the performance of the crewmember's duties aboard an aircraft being operated under this part.

Even better one hands over security from stated 121 rules to TSA and Homeland security rules and policies, including non-public circulars and directives. Think photography rules are ambiguous try secure flight policies.

Title 14: Aeronautics and Space
PART 121—OPERATING REQUIREMENTS: DOMESTIC, FLAG, AND SUPPLEMENTAL OPERATIONS § 121.538 Aircraft security.

Certificate holders conducting operations under this part must comply with the applicable security requirements in 49 CFR chapter XII.

Title 49: Transportation
An example of one section of Title 49:
PART 1544—AIRCRAFT OPERATOR SECURITY: AIR CARRIERS AND COMMERCIAL OPERATORS [This includes secure flight and many other enforceable directives]
Subpart D—Threat and Threat Response
§ 1544.305 Security Directives and Information Circulars.

(a) TSA may issue an Information Circular to notify aircraft operators of security concerns. When TSA determines that additional security measures are necessary to respond to a threat assessment or to a specific threat against civil aviation, TSA issues a Security Directive setting forth mandatory measures.

(b) Each aircraft operator required to have an approved aircraft operator security program must comply with each Security Directive issued to the aircraft operator by TSA, within the time prescribed in the Security Directive for compliance...