United MileagePlus (Consolidated) - SHAREs protects me by cancelling "close call" flight

My flight into STR arrived late (hey had a 33% chance of that happening) anyway small airport, got to LH gate 13m before departure, LH tries to board me, but system says invalid coupon. She calls their helpdesk who tells her, sorry but United has cancelled this segment and rebooked you on Air Berlin (along w/ 4 other people that would have made the flight), they were none too happy.

I miss Apollo that protected us vs assuming we can't make a close connection.

I haven"t flown UA since May 1st and what a surprise another screw up.

Shares, The gift that keeps on sharing.

Unfortunately we will never go back to the flexibility, smart, it just works, system that was Apollo. :(

Had a similar experience yesterday, was on an CHS-EWR that got diverted to ABE due to weather, next flight was EWR-ZRH, was an extremely close connection after the divert, but after running through the course and some luck I arrived at the gate before the plane pushed back. At first the gate agent asked who I was because it didn't show any other passengers were expected. Apparently I was rebooked on a different flight later that evening, but I showed her the ticket and after a few minutes I was on the the original EWR-ZRH flight thank goodness.

IDB compensation for this type of stuff? If you have a boarding pass and are there prior to doors closing / stated cutoff time, why not? You were there according to the rules with boarding pass in-hand.

Also gets me thinking why not file a DOT every time SHARES munges something. I'm flying UAL for the first time since March 3rd in a week. As a 2P if my GM wife is split into a separate PNR and we are charged for her bag, that's exactly what I intend to do.

I just don't think UAL cares or gets it. Maybe if we all file enough DOT complaints when we get SHARE'd, they'll finally do something about it.

IDB compensation for this type of stuff? If you have a boarding pass and are there prior to doors closing / stated cutoff time, why not? You were there according to the rules with boarding pass in-hand.

Also gets me thinking why not file a DOT every time SHARES munges something. I'm flying UAL for the first time since March 3rd in a week. As a 2P if my GM wife is split into a separate PNR and we are charged for her bag, that's exactly what I intend to do.

I just don't think UAL cares or gets it. Maybe if we all file enough DOT complaints when we get SHARE'd, they'll finally do something about it.

Lets look at the other side , Shares didnt rebook you get to the gate late and no one is there any longer.You stand on a 10 mile long CS line only to be told the only other ways to get out tonight are all full now, you will have to wait till tomorrow and since it was due to ATC,WX you are on your own for a Hotel and most every hotel witha free shuttle are already full due to the # of CXs this evening

Yea it STINKS but I dont see DoT getting involved, everyone simply needs to forget how PMUA did things and look at how PMCO did things.I sure under PMCO people complained and maybe even to DoT but as you can see nothing was done about it and probably DoT will simply file any complaint in the circular file

I also learned this the hard way couple month ago when Shares offloaded me and I was at the gate 45 minutes before departure (international boarding had just started). At least there was a C seat left so they did get me back on.
After learning this when returning early July from HKG I called from the plane already and made sure I was protected the old way (not offloaded the first flight).
I did like the old Apollo way much better where you really got protected.

One simple needs to go to an OLCI kiosk where one is specifically asked if one wishes the alternative book or to keep the original. Of course, that may be a bit difficult overseas or while one is literally running.

Lets look at the other side , Shares didnt rebook you get to the gate late and no one is there any longer.You stand on a 10 mile long CS line only to be told the only other ways to get out tonight are all full now, you will have to wait till tomorrow and since it was due to ATC,WX you are on your own for a Hotel and most every hotel witha free shuttle are already full due to the # of CXs this evening

Yea it STINKS but I dont see DoT getting involved, everyone simply needs to forget how PMUA did things and look at how PMCO did things.I sure under PMCO people complained and maybe even to DoT but as you can see nothing was done about it and probably DoT will simply file any complaint in the circular file

Well, good to know that, thanks to UA management and SHARES we don't risk long lines, lousy customer service, being left on our own without a hotel if stranded overnight, etc., all for the relatively minor price of being canceled on a flight that we might make our connection to. :D

This is not an either/or situation. This is the worst of both worlds. If DoT complaints pile up, at the very least it reflects poorly on UA, as it should. If folks post their horrible experiences with this thoroughly dysfunctional airline, it lets them let off steam and reminds others of the risks they continue to run. As jaded as I've become about UA, and as much as I keep up with FT, I'd lost track of the kind of institutionalized incompetence that zabes64 was victimized by. Good to be forewarned of yet another scenario I need watch out for.

Incredible that in 2012 a major corporation can take such a great leap backward in the technology it employs.

One simple needs to go to an OLCI kiosk where one is specifically asked if one wishes the alternative book or to keep the original. Of course, that may be a bit difficult overseas or while one is literally running.
How can you do that if you sit on an inbound flight and shares did that to you automatically ? I had a boarding pass in hand and was checked in for the close call flight and it offloaded me anyway.

Lets look at the other side , Shares didnt rebook you get to the gate late and no one is there any longer.You stand on a 10 mile long CS line only to be told the only other ways to get out tonight are all full now, you will have to wait till tomorrow and since it was due to ATC,WX you are on your own for a Hotel and most every hotel witha free shuttle are already full due to the # of CXs this evening

The great thing pre-SHARES was that protection onto later flights worked fairly seamlessly; if I got there on time, I still had a seat and could go, but if I missed the connection, I already had a seat on the later flight (occasionally necessitating some work by the GA, but often without any more effort at all).

SHARES on the other hand seems to default to removing potentially-misconnecting pax from the flight once someone goes in to "protect" those pax as a group. Yes, I suppose this is great for people waiting on standby, but not so great for those of us who sprint and make the connection.

I believe a GA or phone agent can protect you in SHARES without removing you from your existing flight (a UC agent in PHX put me on two ORD-RIC flights, for example), though it isn't without issue or effort, either.

I've had one occasion post-3/3 where I was protected on a later flight without losing my original flight, so I guess it's still possible to do that on SHARES. A couple of things were different from OP's case though: I called UA to protect me when I realized the delay (not automatic), and they were UA flights (connecting in IAD).

I eventually missed the original flight so I can't tell for sure if I had my seat there, but I saw both flights in my reservation after the call.

had this happen on IAD-BOS, I almost lost it when I couldn't get on the plane. I needed to be in BOS. Thankfully a supervisor and three gate agents managed to sort it out. Obviously, that is not going to happen on another airline.

Incredible that in 2012 a major corporation can take such a great leap backward in the technology it employs.

:confused: what great leap backwards has COdbaUA taken, if I remember correctly this is how PMCO Always handled things

Everyone keeps reading United and expecting things to be the way it was under PMUA, well PMUA is Dead & Gone, its COdbaUA. You people still expect CO to do things as UA did , that is not gonna happen.Im not saying Im :D but I understand its only United in name Alone and dont expect what PMUA did to continue as such , and Unfortuantely I expect things to be as PMCO did things :mad: That said those who dont like how things are being runned , WALK away and dont look back but AA & DL are gonna get you :mad: in alot of other ways

IDB compensation for this type of stuff? If you have a boarding pass and are there prior to doors closing / stated cutoff time, why not? You were there according to the rules with boarding pass in-hand.

Also gets me thinking why not file a DOT every time SHARES munges something. I'm flying UAL for the first time since March 3rd in a week. As a 2P if my GM wife is split into a separate PNR and we are charged for her bag, that's exactly what I intend to do.

I just don't think UAL cares or gets it. Maybe if we all file enough DOT complaints when we get SHARE'd, they'll finally do something about it.

If you book a ticket for you and your wife on the same PNR then your wife gets your luggage benefits. If UA splits you into separate PNRs then you need to ask the GA to give her your luggage benefits. The agent can see that you booked on the same PNR originally and will then honor the benefits. If they won't, then get a supervisor. I've done this multiple times and never had any problem.

The great thing pre-SHARES was that protection onto later flights worked fairly seamlessly; if I got there on time, I still had a seat and could go, but if I missed the connection, I already had a seat on the later flight (occasionally necessitating some work by the GA, but often without any more effort at all).

SHARES on the other hand seems to default to removing potentially-misconnecting pax from the flight once someone goes in to "protect" those pax as a group. Yes, I suppose this is great for people waiting on standby, but not so great for those of us who sprint and make the connection.

I believe a GA or phone agent can protect you in SHARES without removing you from your existing flight (a UC agent in PHX put me on two ORD-RIC flights, for example), though it isn't without issue or effort, either.

This is indeed the key point. I've been protected many times on Apollo with PMUA and that's how it worked. They'd book me on the next flight, but they'd also keep my seat on the original itinerary. So, no matter what happened, I was protected. I actually felt protected. Now, I just feel smashed.

:confused: what great leap backwards has COdbaUA taken, if I remember correctly this is how PMCO Always handled things

Everyone keeps reading United and expecting things to be the way it was under PMUA, well PMUA is Dead & Gone, its COdbaUA. You people still expect CO to do things as UA did , that is not gonna happen.Im not saying Im :D but I understand its only United in name Alone and dont expect what PMUA did to continue as such , and Unfortuantely I expect things to be as PMCO did things :mad: That said those who dont like how things are being runned , WALK away and dont look back but AA & DL are gonna get you :mad: in alot of other ways

Compared with what they experienced until a several months ago, a majority of customers are dealing with a significantly inferior, antiquated IT system, to the detriment of many. That's a great leap backward.

I've had one occasion post-3/3 where I was protected on a later flight without losing my original flight, so I guess it's still possible to do that on SHARES. A couple of things were different from OP's case though: I called UA to protect me when I realized the delay (not automatic), and they were UA flights (connecting in IAD).

I think the difference is that an individual agent can protect you onto a later flight (though it may/will require clean-up of the record later, too), whereas the bulk process undertaken for reaccommodating a group of pax removes them from the original before putting them onto the new flight. I'm sure a UA GA can correct my mangled interpretation. :)

Lets look at the other side , Shares didnt rebook you get to the gate late and no one is there any longer.You stand on a 10 mile long CS line only to be told the only other ways to get out tonight are all full now, you will have to wait till tomorrow and since it was due to ATC,WX you are on your own for a Hotel and most every hotel witha free shuttle are already full due to the # of CXs this evening

Yea it STINKS but I dont see DoT getting involved, everyone simply needs to forget how PMUA did things and look at how PMCO did things.I sure under PMCO people complained and maybe even to DoT but as you can see nothing was done about it and probably DoT will simply file any complaint in the circular file

What used to happen was that we would get "protected" on a later flight while keeping our original flight in case we made it. If we didn't make it we would get offloaded just like any other passenger who didn't arrive in time. Just another "change we'll like".

See this is one feature i miss from EZRebook... the functionality of it being run for a delayed flight with re-protection for passengers while still keeping them on their original flights in case of instances of these vs C.A.R.S. unconfirming original segment and re-protecting on some other flight maybe days later and then resyncing the ticket to the new flight so the GA doesn't know if you're supposed to be there or not...

a little back fill- EZRebook and C.A.R.S. are the two system's reaccomodation programs that are supposed to help with rebooking misconnecting or cancelled passenger and to help with service center/gate/ticket counter lines by allowing the passenger to use a kiosk instead of seeing an actual agent to procure a new boarding pass... EZRebook would kick in automatically for a flight once it realizes the first connecting passenger would misconnect under any MCT rule and try to find the next and best possible way to get to the final destination even if it was another airline... C.A.R.S. is human initiated by either a service recovery desk in a hub or a call to HDQ or hub by a line station. C.A.R.S. follows fare rules first looking for first available which may not be for a few days (but i think talking to an IT guy the other day they're trying to work on something new so i'm not too sure anymore...) Working the CSC in CLE a lot, i notice some very horrible repro in reservations from C.A.R.S. and i'm still baffled by it's reliability...

maybe that clears up some cloudiness on rebookings?
-CLE-

What used to happen was that we would get "protected" on a later flight while keeping our original flight in case we made it. If we didn't make it we would get offloaded just like any other passenger who didn't arrive in time. Just another "change we'll like".

YES!
It was really really nice how it used to work.
Living at a "spoke" airport it was very handy.
Whenever there was a delay, or a cancel or an IRROPS, the system would put me on the next available flight, and then call me to tell me what it did.
90% of the time I was happy with the rebooking, and I could confirm the new leg online and choose a seat.

Whenever I'd not need a certain leg, the leg would stay in my itinerary until the VERY LAST segment was completed.
Nothing was ever deleted until everything was complete in my res. It was very nice, very smooth and very customer friendly.

There is too much DRAMA with Shares and the new United.
Tonight is my first AA (Eagle) flight and I can't wait to taste how a system should work.

I understand that the nice features of Apollo are long gone, but isn't is as simple as just programming the functions (e.g. Flight protection) into Shares? I'm not a technology person, but this seems like a relatively easy thing to do. Obviously, there are business reasons for not doing this, which is probably why the new United is hesitating to do it.

I understand that the nice features of Apollo are long gone, but isn't is as simple as just programming the functions (e.g. Flight protection) into Shares? I'm not a technology person, but this seems like a relatively easy thing to do. Obviously, there are business reasons for not doing this, which is probably why the new United is hesitating to do it.

CO supporters would say it worked fine for a smaller airline, and they didn't know how much better it was elsewhere in these types of situations ;)

This is indeed the key point. I've been protected many times on Apollo with PMUA and that's how it worked. They'd book me on the next flight, but they'd also keep my seat on the original itinerary. So, no matter what happened, I was protected. I actually felt protected. Now, I just feel smashed.

I feel like that too! Though that may just be the effect of the required amount of alcohol to ease the pain. :D

EZRebook would kick in automatically for a flight once it realizes the first connecting passenger would misconnect under any MCT rule and try to find the next and best possible way to get to the final destination even if it was another airline...

Automatic protection when a misconnect is predicted under MCT makes sense.

However, automatic termination of existing reservation under these connections is a mistake and should be stopped.

Is this how it always worked under CO?

I can think of at least 3 flights I've taken this year alone that didn't qualify for MCT due to delay, but I made the flight and so did my baggage.

On PMCO and now on UA when I am protected on a later flight my first flight is NOT canceled (though the record later needs cleaning up). Perhaps that's because someone is manually doing it for upper elites?

United has cancelled this segment and rebooked you on Air Berlin (along w/ 4 other people that would have made the flight), they were none too happy.


How do other airlines handle this? Have other airlines followed?

On PMCO and now on UA when I am protected on a later flight my first flight is NOT canceled (though the record later needs cleaning up). Perhaps that's because someone is manually doing it for upper elites?

When I did this a couple weeks ago w/rolling WX delays at LGA, they had to keep my ticket "out of sync" (just love that phrase) otherwise re-syncing would delete my delayed flight and would just roll me over to my protected flight the next AM.

I bought a ticket on DL instead.

The great thing pre-SHARES was that protection onto later flights worked fairly seamlessly; if I got there on time, I still had a seat and could go, but if I missed the connection, I already had a seat on the later flight.

This is exactly how Delta's automated system works. I've been kept on the iffy connection, and duplicate booked on the next flight.

I feel like that too! Though that may just be the effect of the required amount of alcohol to ease the pain. :D

I learn so much on FT.

In fact, I drink less under CO than I did under UA because I don't trust them, and I need all of my wits about me to deal with the endless "glitches."

Maybe that's the wrong approach. Instead of cutting back on alcohol, perhaps it's better to double down. If I'm no longer aware of what's going on, there won't be much to complain about.

This isn't just a SHAREs thing, I've had it happen with Amadeus too. I guess it really depends on the airline and this must have been a PMCO thing but I don't know. A certain other *A airline using Amadeus not only cancelled my close call, but also refused to put me on any flight other than their own (there were multiple outside *A and one *A that could have worked with 1 extra connection 2 hours later), 24 hours later.

As much as you were frustrated to be on AB, far better than this situation IMO.

I had a similar issue last month. Due to my first flight from Toronto to EWR getting delayed United thought I would not make my connection from EWR to LAX. I was protected by them holding a seat on a later flight from EWR to LAX. However when I got to EWR for my original flight was also delayed. When I tried boarding the plane and they swipped my boarding pass it beeped. They took me to the side. Apparently they had given my seat in first class to somebody else as they had cancelled my seat on this flight. The only options I had were to wait 4 hours for the next flight where there was a seat in first class or go now in coach. As it was a Friday afternoon I decided to go in coach. It is difficult enough to get an upgrade these days so I was really mad when they gave my upgraded seat to somebody else. I guess if I wrote to United I would get nothing. I am still waiting for compensation on other issues going back months. I am done with this airline. I have booked the next 10 flights on American as I took the status much.

IDB compensation for this type of stuff? If you have a boarding pass and are there prior to doors closing / stated cutoff time, why not? You were there according to the rules with boarding pass in-hand.

Also gets me thinking why not file a DOT every time SHARES munges something. I'm flying UAL for the first time since March 3rd in a week. As a 2P if my GM wife is split into a separate PNR and we are charged for her bag, that's exactly what I intend to do.

I just don't think UAL cares or gets it. Maybe if we all file enough DOT complaints when we get SHARE'd, they'll finally do something about it.

They get it but what do they Care? They have other higher priority to deal with (e.g., correcting MP account entry, ...)!

Had a similar experience yesterday, was on an CHS-EWR that got diverted to ABE due to weather, next flight was EWR-ZRH, was an extremely close connection after the divert, but after running through the course and some luck I arrived at the gate before the plane pushed back. At first the gate agent asked who I was because it didn't show any other passengers were expected. Apparently I was rebooked on a different flight later that evening, but I showed her the ticket and after a few minutes I was on the the original EWR-ZRH flight thank goodness.

I had a similar experience going LIM-IAH-SFO. My flight arrived at IAH 4 minutes late. When I got to the gate for my SFO flight 15 minutes before the flight, they had given someone my paid 1st Class seat, and booked me into Economy on a later flight.

There were at least 17 other people who also got bumped at the gate.

I believe a GA or phone agent can protect you in SHARES without removing you from your existing flight (a UC agent in PHX put me on two ORD-RIC flights, for example), though it isn't without issue or effort, either.

I've done this several times, the most recent last Tuesday, both over the phone and at customer service at the airport. Never had any issues, and it's always been quick and easy.

IDB compensation for this type of stuff? If you have a boarding pass and are there prior to doors closing / stated cutoff time, why not? You were there according to the rules with boarding pass in-hand.

United rules are that you must be at the gate 20 minutes before departure. OP was there 13 minutes before, so if this had been UA they would have been justified in removing him from the flight - even if it wasn't the right thing to actually do! Given this was LH the situation could be a little different...

I had 2 protections done this week correctly and in each case managed to catch my original flight. (Sidebar: 4 segments and every one was significantly delays for operational reasons - not weather or MX. Ugh!) The outbound was done by the UC angel since I chatted with her after I got to the club (when she assured me that she had correctly ARUNK'd the record. The return connection was done behind the scenes - perhaps GS folks have someone scan for these. But again the original flight was left in the record and the protection added.

I had a similar experience going LIM-IAH-SFO. My flight arrived at IAH 4 minutes late. When I got to the gate for my SFO flight 15 minutes before the flight, they had given someone my paid 1st Class seat, and booked me into Economy on a later flight.

There were at least 17 other people who also got bumped at the gate.

to those who say "don't report it", if you have a boarding pass, and you are there when they are still boarding people, it is an IDB. PERIOD. Ask for the IDB compensation, and if there is a downgrade you should also get back - BY LAW VIA A CHECK or REFUND - the difference in ticket price.

If IDB compensation is denied, then report that, its the one thing the DOT will take action on. Rest go into the complaint tallies.

United can set up their system to screw folks over any way they want but (1) they have to provide the IDB compensation and (2) they should expect to have people complain and those complaints don't get tossed away, they get added to the airline totals. IDBs are tallied and are closely tacked by the DOT.

BTB the IDB rules (copied from boarding area) are:

Domestic flights within the United States: No compensation is due if your airline finds alternate transportation that will get you to your next stopover point or final destination within one hour after the scheduled arrival time of your original flight. For flights getting you to your next point or destination more than one hour but less than two hours, cash compensation equivalent to 200% of the one-way fare on the flight you were bumped off to a maximum of $650. Flights getting you to your next point or destination more than two hours from the original time will net you cash compensation of 400% of the one-way fare to a maximum of $1,300.

U.S. originating flights to foreign points: No compensation is due if your airline finds alternate transportation that will get you to your next stopover point or final destination within one hour after the scheduled arrival time of your original flight. For flights getting you to your next point or destination more than one hour but less than four hours, cash compensation equivalent to 200% of the one-way fare on the flight you were bumped off to a maximum of $650. Flights getting you to your next point or destination more than four hours from the original time will net you cash compensation of 400% of the one-way fare to a maximum of $1,300.

United rules are that you must be at the gate 20 minutes before departure. OP was there 13 minutes before, so if this had been UA they would have been justified in removing him from the flight - even if it wasn't the right thing to actually do! Given this was LH the situation could be a little different...

UA is 15, 30, or 60 minutes, depending on where you're going from/to.

http://www.united.com/web/en-US/content/travel/airport/process/default.aspx

And of course, any reasonable gate agent would check on the inbound flight's status before canceling a connecting passenger's seat at the cutoff.