Cathay Pacific Asia Miles - Typhoon mini-do

Greetings from the wing lounge lower floor. Any FTers also stranded in HKG want to meet up? Also, it's less crowded in The Wing than The Cabin. Earlier in the day, we had additional entertainment in the form of pax shouting at the door from time to time with police called.

I just checked on cx883, listed as canceled so far.

typhoon related?

I hope you get the most enjoyment out of the lounge. too bad the construction is not done on the first class area.

I honestly don't know what's there to shout about... planes can't leave .. cos there aren't any.

Off load the idiots. Better for everyone.

I honestly don't know what's there to shout about... planes can't leave .. cos there aren't any.

Off load the idiots. Better for everyone.

Some ppl did learn from Apple Daily stories and YouTube... They think the louder they shout the more likely they'll get compensation. Well it works for CX sometimes though. :-)

Some ppl did learn from Apple Daily stories and YouTube... They think the louder they shout the more likely they'll get compensation. Well it works for CX sometimes though. :-)

It works all the time. Thanks to *ahem* "Chee kor", I can now spot non-frequent flier try to do everything whenever something happened or something not even happened: Complaining no upgrade for "Honeymoon travel", Complaining the plane delayed for a mere 5 minutes on closing gate, etc.

This is the modern Hong Kong culture nowadays - people try to keep complaining for themselves until they are satisfied... even on the mean of sacrificing others' rights.

you gave me a new idea on what to pull out next time. as a MPC GR and a double *G i should be entitled an upgrade into F for every leg i fly!

Even if there are planes you need certified crew with the available flying hours.

It always amazes me how loud and rude these people are until they have to deal with non CX and non Canto speaking airline staff.

I count 8 flights cancelled already for today. What's the odds more flights get cancelled when operations wakes up this morning and start counting the planes and crew?

My flight to Bangalore - originally scheduled for 25 July was delayed 20 hours. I'm hapybtonhave made it here, but only wish my luggage would have made the flight!!

What has people angry is the approach of delaying in two hour increments so we have to stay at the airport and they deny a hotel room because it's only two hours from now.

We were at the Cabin the night of July 24 and our flight ended up getting canceled. It was really, really packed - I should have checked The Pier. Originally we went to the Wing but they were turning away customers.

InY, hopefully you made it out ok. We finally made it out to our final destination on the morning of July 25.

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Hi from the wing. From what I seeing now it largely returned to normal, except the wonton today is but salty.

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Hi from the wing. From what I seeing now it largely returned to normal, except the wonton today is but salty.

Salty broth is to be expected when it has been simmered for days, not hours. :D

I honestly don't know what's there to shout about... planes can't leave .. cos there aren't any.

Off load the idiots. Better for everyone.

Whilst I prefer if everyone was civilised and everyone lets CX do their thing, there is recurring anecdotal evidence that CX tends to serve the pax that whinges the loudest/misbehaves the most...leading to hypertensive agro on everyone's part.

It's like a KMB bus queue - people will queue if everyone else does. But if one C9 successfully cuts the line and pushes her way onto the bus, the queue will devolve into a mob.

http://the-sun.on.cc/cnt/news/20120726/00407_035.html

國泰被轟大細超
有旅客批評國泰安排失當，亦有旅客經投訴才獲供餐券或賠償，「見班細路一直無嘢食，全部瞓晒响地下，但國泰 大細超，識投訴就有，唔出聲就乜都無！」

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Well what can you assume if you have huge line waiting for answer, do you expect the staff can proactively come to you and say "here's you meal voucher?" People just inconsiderate nowadays and always think "I spent money hence I am king"

There's another round of complain that MTR doesn't help those people stuck on train to go home. They should think of those maintainence staff still out there fixing the overhead wire at t10.... Is kind of sad to see how people in Hong Kong being develop towards

There's another round of complain that MTR doesn't help those people stuck on train to go home. They should think of those maintainence staff still out there fixing the overhead wire at t10.... Is kind of sad to see how people in Hong Kong being develop towards

That one got me a bit worked up. What were they expecting in T10? Why were they even trying to travel anyway?

Well what can you assume if you have huge line waiting for answer, do you expect the staff can proactively come to you and say "here's you meal voucher?" People just inconsiderate nowadays and always think "I spent money hence I am king"

I'm not there, but maybe designate a check-in counter as voucher counter on both ends of each check-in row...staff stamp boarding basses for vouchers taken.

If staff only distribute to people who ask then you'd encourage everyone to ask...and some more than once.

That one got me a bit worked up. What were they expecting in T10? Why were they even trying to travel anyway?

They were trying to get home, and train service was disrupted befor midnight, when it was only Signal #9. Plenty of people still was working in the city during the evening, not everybody got to leave work early or have a car.

What MTR did extremely poorly was communication with the stranded. It seemed MTR had no clue what they could or could not do for them, and never cared to update to these passengers.

They were trying to get home, and train service was disrupted befor midnight, when it was only Signal #9. Plenty of people still was working in the city during the evening, not everybody got to leave work early or have a car.

What MTR did extremely poorly was communication with the stranded. It seemed MTR had no clue what they could or could not do for them, and never cared to update to these passengers.

That is quite some time to try to get home. Methinks employees should either be evacuated in the 2-hour warning period or be prepared to stay the night.

That is quite some time to try to get home. Methinks employees should either be evacuated in the 2-hour warning period or be prepared to stay the night.

But some grassroots employees may not have an option.
I think the problem is more the communication of MTR an their crisis mgmt plan.

That is quite some time to try to get home. Methinks employees should either be evacuated in the 2-hour warning period or be prepared to stay the night.

That's life for many employees in HK. After working in the US for a long time, I can't imagine working at many jobs in HK with very rigid work hours and unsympathetic employers.

Anyways, for others, it doesn't seem that bad trying to get home at say 11pm that night by East Rail when it was still Signal #8 when many started their journey home. Few thought the storm would get that strong even during mid-evening.

Honkies should be thankful they hv mtr, not tfl. they would get absolutely nothing from tfl.

Work with a us co in Ldn and hk and don't see any improvements in my hours. Don't think rigid hours is region specific.

I think the problem is more the communication of MTR an their crisis mgmt plan.

There's not a lot the MTR can feasibly do. MTR (esp ex-KCR lines which have large sections above ground) is not weather-proof.

Once the power lines get cut by falling trees, all MTR can do ask passengers to walk to stations. There's no feasible rescue - some vechicle insurance might not be valid for accidents in T8 or above, and in any case there are safety issues anyway. MTR passengers have to stay in the station until lines are restored or road transport becomes available, whichever is earlier.

There are allegations that MTR staff asked passengers to leave the station http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail.asp?we_cat=11&art_id=124678&sid=37131998&con_type=3&d_str=20120725&fc=4 . I don't know what moronic staff will make such a request and if so they should be summarily fired if allegations proven.

The Standard also suggested MTR can keep emergency supplies at stations like AAHK http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail.asp?we_cat=21&art_id=124717&sid=37143828&con_type=1&d_str=20120726&fc=7 . Whilst MTR can definitely consider it, the frequency this happens is a lot less than HKIA and MTR passengers are stranded for a lot shorter time than HKIA.

But other than that it's really life. What can MTR feasibly communicate? You either wait for the first train to show up or the first taxi to arrive back at the rank. It's not like you have to go back home to wait or reroute on another line.

There's not a lot the MTR can feasibly do. MTR (esp ex-KCR lines which have large sections above ground) is not weather-proof.

Once the power lines get cut by falling trees, all MTR can do ask passengers to walk to stations. There's no feasible rescue - some vechicle insurance might not be valid for accidents in T8 or above, and in any case there are safety issues anyway. MTR passengers have to stay in the station until lines are restored or road transport becomes available, whichever is earlier.

There are allegations that MTR staff asked passengers to leave the station http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail.asp?we_cat=11&art_id=124678&sid=37131998&con_type=3&d_str=20120725&fc=4 . I don't know what moronic staff will make such a request and if so they should be summarily fired if allegations proven.

The Standard also suggested MTR can keep emergency supplies at stations like AAHK http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail.asp?we_cat=21&art_id=124717&sid=37143828&con_type=1&d_str=20120726&fc=7 . Whilst MTR can definitely consider it, the frequency this happens is a lot less than HKIA and MTR passengers are stranded for a lot shorter time than HKIA.

But other than that it's really life. What can MTR feasibly communicate? You either wait for the first train to show up or the first taxi to arrive back at the rank. It's not like you have to go back home to wait or reroute on another line.

Problem was that they did give
Certain pax money to take taxis and did not do
Any definitive c

There's not a lot the MTR can feasibly do. MTR (esp ex-KCR lines which have large sections above ground) is not weather-proof.

Once the power lines get cut by falling trees, all MTR can do ask passengers to walk to stations. There's no feasible rescue - some vechicle insurance might not be valid for accidents in T8 or above, and in any case there are safety issues anyway. MTR passengers have to stay in the station until lines are restored or road transport becomes available, whichever is earlier.

There are allegations that MTR staff asked passengers to leave the station http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail.asp?we_cat=11&art_id=124678&sid=37131998&con_type=3&d_str=20120725&fc=4 . I don't know what moronic staff will make such a request and if so they should be summarily fired if allegations proven.

The Standard also suggested MTR can keep emergency supplies at stations like AAHK http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail.asp?we_cat=21&art_id=124717&sid=37143828&con_type=1&d_str=20120726&fc=7 . Whilst MTR can definitely consider it, the frequency this happens is a lot less than HKIA and MTR passengers are stranded for a lot shorter time than HKIA.

But other than that it's really life. What can MTR feasibly communicate? You either wait for the first train to show up or the first taxi to arrive back at the rank. It's not like you have to go back home to wait or reroute on another line.

Problem was that they did give
Certain pax money to take taxis and did not do
Any definitive communication whther there will be replacement bus. Also the staff at the station r not trained to deal with this
Crisis.

They had no emergency response plan at all to deal with this and the staff had no idea how to deal with the situation

We were at the Cabin the night of July 24 and our flight ended up getting canceled. It was really, really packed - I should have checked The Pier. Originally we went to the Wing but they were turning away customers.

InY, hopefully you made it out ok. We finally made it out to our final destination on the morning of July 25.

I visited all three. The Pier was definitely the least packed. People were using entire couches as beds. People in the Cabin were sitting on the window sill for lack of seats. Ventured outside to visit gates of competing airlines going to the same place; Korean Air and Asiana said they were full or would refuse to sell Cathay a ticket becuase the flight "closed". To keep my seat in the Wing, I made a deal with some guy. He gave be a blanket when I returned as "rent."

Made it to Seoul on the 7 am 25th flight 412 (my rebooking from 416). Bag arrived today. First time I slept through a safety briefing. Had a view of the A330 video tape deck. Very retro with VHS tapes and a floppy drive.

Let's get all the facts in 1 post...
In the late afternoon, HKO gave the 2 hours notice that T8 would be hoisted in the early evening, with it eventually being hoisted at around 6pm.
I believe most employees head home at or around this time.

T9 was hoisted at around 11:30pm. While there may be a few workers who are stuck in their office, given the time of the night and that it has been 5.5 hours since T8, I am quite surprised that there are still people out and about.

T10 then followed at around 12:45am. At this time, there really wouldn't be many people about, even for a non-typhoon week night. It has also been almost 7 hours since T8, so it is beyond believe that there are people still trying to get home on the MTR.

Funny enough, in most countries, when a typhoon is coming, people would head home and bunker up. In Hong Kong, during T8, people happily get out of work, and celebrate the no-work-day in style - going yum cha, watching movies, singing karaoke, etc. Guess who's to blame when there's no transport home at the end of the day.

I guess one way or another it was a WET night!

Problem was that they did give
Certain pax money to take taxis and did not do
Any definitive communication whther there will be replacement bus. Also the staff at the station r not trained to deal with this
Crisis.

They had no emergency response plan at all to deal with this and the staff had no idea how to deal with the situation

The money bit as a Chee-gor style bad mistake I reckon. I don't think MTR was obliged to give anything, except to refund fare difference for uncompleted journey.

What's the point of communicating when a replacement bus will come? It comes whenever the drivers think its feasible to drive. Passengers are free to take the first taxi, KMB or MTR replacement bus - whichever comes first.

There are plenty of people who live betwee Sha Tin and Sheung Shui and works in Kowloon or HK Island. Why can't someone imagine a few hundred would still be enroute home before midnight on the East Rail, when that was the only transportation running?

That's EXACTLY the reason why MTR was running all service all night. They were basically THE transportation a good number of HK workers can rely on. Otherwise, they would have stopped running before the lines got cut.

But some grassroots employees may not have an option.
I think the problem is more the communication of MTR an their crisis mgmt plan.

Well - remember the days while KCR and MTR are two separate companies?

KCR shut down the train services within 1 hour while the number 8 typhoon signal is hoisted. While MTR tried to sustain the East-rail (Ex-KCR) service after number 9 or number 10 typhoon singal is hoisted. While large portion of KCR rails are outdoor, there are certain issues to run train services in adverse weather conditions. Passengers just framed MTR everything after the service breakdown... If complains keep coming in and if I was in the management, I would simply suspend the service in bad conditions like KCR did. Unlike other public transport (Taxi/Minibuses) which runs in adverse weather, MTR does not charge you extra ridiculous fees. In Hong Kong, CSR does not matter. So why the heck do I need to run the services and get all the blames?

This is one of the best solutions that can come out with.

The money bit as a Chee-gor style bad mistake I reckon. I don't think MTR was obliged to give anything, except to refund fare difference for uncompleted journey.

What's the point of communicating when a replacement bus will come? It comes whenever the drivers think its feasible to drive. Passengers are free to take the first taxi, KMB or MTR replacement bus - whichever comes first.

Problem was that they did nOt tell people the train get suspended until quite late and people were just waiting there without any info and thought the service would assume until no other alternatives. In the past trains still operated at t8 so people did assume it will resume service.

Find problem here is that it is fine when you all have an office
Job and get to go home, there r many people with no such option

Let's get all the facts in 1 post...
In the late afternoon, HKO gave the 2 hours notice that T8 would be hoisted in the early evening, with it eventually being hoisted at around 6pm.
I believe most employees head home at or around this time.

T9 was hoisted at around 11:30pm. While there may be a few workers who are stuck in their office, given the time of the night and that it has been 5.5 hours since T8, I am quite surprised that there are still people out and about.

T10 then followed at around 12:45am. At this time, there really wouldn't be many people about, even for a non-typhoon week night. It has also been almost 7 hours since T8, so it is beyond believe that there are people still trying to get home on the MTR.

Funny enough, in most countries, when a typhoon is coming, people would head home and bunker up. In Hong Kong, during T8, people happily get out of work, and celebrate the no-work-day in style - going yum cha, watching movies, singing karaoke, etc. Guess who's to blame when there's no transport home at the end of the day.

really? Well, I'm a design engineer and we weren't allowed to leave until T8 was hoisted. I wouldn't be surprised if some other jobs they arent allowed to leave earlier (FWIW, I've been to Maxim's at T8 before. and there are also medical staff(not just doctors or nurses, but the lower grade jobs too) and many jobs that require to stay until end of shift. Yes, some ppl were being silly and stay around in the evening, but many ppl don't actually have the benefit of leaving at 4pm (2 hours before hoisting T8). and there are ppl who were landed at T8 and ought to go home(at rare times you'd really hope there's a diversion).

TBH, I would first point my fingers at HKO, because their forecast was totally off whilst Macau had forecasted it much better. then it would be the total lack of crisis management at MTR. Telling passengers to leave the station is just laughable -whoever that made such decision.

Problem was that they did nOt tell people the train get suspended until quite late and people were just waiting there without any info and thought the service would assume until no other alternatives. In the past trains still operated at t8 so people did assume it will resume service.

Find problem here is that it is fine when you all have an office
Job and get to go home, there r many people with no such option

I don't think there were many alternatives by the time the trains did get suspended.

My +1 did stay behind in the office quite late. She only agreed to do so when I assured her I'm able and willing to swing the car around and pick her up. Otherwise she would take the MTR.

Both our cos have staff who are not allowed to go home - guards, emergency repair crews and the like. They have to stay at work even if their shift has ended - just like black rainstorm.

Assuming the MTR (esp externally-exposed lines like East Rail) will still run no matter what the weather is like is unrealistic.

Nobody is blaming MTR for service interruption. It is great they tried to run the trains as late as they could. What we are saying is that they are horrible in communicating to those stranded and helping them. That is a widespread issue in HK. Employees won't take charge to do 'the right thing' unless they are instructed to, lest they got blamed.

Hence, no one would tell the passengers the tracks were blocked, and service would unlikely to be resumed until the morning. Nobody at the Sha Tin station would decide it's the best thing to just tell the stranded that they would just keep the A/C on the trains and let people rest and stayed until storm is over. Or that they would gather as much supplies as possible to pass out to those stranded, until hours later, and so on...

As for the HKO, it's been a joke for a while. Its sole purpose now is to tell people if they can get off work and need to go to work. Their guy still goes on the TV with horrible English using a telescopic pointer. Only thing that has changed is now he uses a monitor - I wouldn't be surprised if he uses a hand drawn chart.

Now, people actually find out when he storm will hit by checking if the container port will suspend operations. This time, they announced ceasing of operation at around 4 or 5pm, which was at least 2 hours before Signal 8. That says it's going to be pretty serious.

A medium market TV station in Kansas or Oklahoma has meteorologists who can tell their viewers much better what's going on with the weather.

Nobody is blaming MTR for service interruption. It is great they tried to run the trains as late as they could. What we are saying is that they are horrible in communicating to those stranded and helping them. That is a widespread issue in HK. Employees won't take charge to do 'the right thing' unless they are instructed to, lest they got blamed.

Hence, no one would tell the passengers the tracks were blocked, and service would unlikely to be resumed until the morning. Nobody at the Sha Tin station would decide it's the best thing to just tell the stranded that they would just keep the A/C on the trains and let people rest and stayed until storm is over. Or that they would gather as much supplies as possible to pass out to those stranded, until hours later, and so on...

As for the HKO, it's been a joke for a while. Its sole purpose now is to tell people if they can get off work and need to go to work. Their guy still goes on the TV with horrible English using a telescopic pointer. Only thing that has changed is now he uses a monitor - I wouldn't be surprised if he uses a hand drawn chart.

Now, people actually find out when he storm will hit by checking if the container port will suspend operations. This time, they announced ceasing of operation at around 4 or 5pm, which was at least 2 hours before Signal 8. That says it's going to be pretty serious.

A medium market TV station in Kansas or Oklahoma has meteorologists who can tell their viewers much better what's going on with the weather.

Hko is a joke? Really? I think they are alright. they rarely underestimate cyclone, which to me it's a good prudent approach.

If the meterologists in the states are so good like you said. Shouldn't there been zero lives loss from the natural disasters hitting the states?

U been berating the mtr through this thread. U mind to enlighten us how much better are the rail/ underground are run elsewhere especially when there's a hit of such scale and at a short space of time? Especially in the states? ( a country that has very good met, I supposed train service too? )

Hko is a joke? Really? I think they are alright. they rarely underestimate cyclone, which to me it's a good prudent approach.

If the meterologists in the states are so good like you said. Shouldn't there been zero lives loss from the natural disasters hitting the states?

U been berating the mtr through this thread. U mind to enlighten us how much better are the rail/ underground are run elsewhere especially when there's a hit of such scale and at a short space of time? Especially in the states? ( a country that has very good met, I supposed train service too? )

The problem is the the rail service HK have been operated so efficiently over the past 2-3 decades that the expectation of people are quite high.

Sure when comapre to overseas I think MTR is definitely the best. However you also have to consider the complexity and geographical spread of the network.

I am not blaming MTR not offering connection bus etc...

I think the problem is the the management there is not good at handling the communication and PR front.

Even when there were no alternatives to the passengers they need to let them know instead of just keep on dragging it out and running around like headless chicken.

I think the problem is the the management there is not good at handling the communication and PR front.

Even when there were no alternatives to the passengers they need to let them know instead of just keep on dragging it out and running around like headless chicken.

Commercial Radio actually carried the downed power cable news article at 12:36am with MTR's explanations:

http://www.881903.com/Page/ZH-TW/newsdetail.aspx?ItemId=541006&csid=261_341

Along with updates at 2:12, 3:18, 3:22, 3:58, 4:54, 5:26, 7:24, 7:26 and 7:36

http://www.881903.com/Page/ZH-TW/News.aspx?sdate=24.07.2012&csid=261_341&page=12

Sure the MTR staff at various stations could have made a better job propagating the company line, but the updates were there for all to see (if passengers had an iPhone) and/or hear (radio).

Commercial Radio actually carried the downed power cable news article at 12:36am with MTR's explanations:

http://www.881903.com/Page/ZH-TW/newsdetail.aspx?ItemId=541006&csid=261_341

Along with updates at 2:12, 3:18, 3:22, 3:58, 4:54, 5:26, 7:24, 7:26 and 7:36

http://www.881903.com/Page/ZH-TW/News.aspx?sdate=24.07.2012&csid=261_341&page=12

Sure the MTR staff at various stations could have made a better job propagating the company line, but the updates were there for all to see (if passengers had an iPhone) and/or hear (radio).

its not the passenger's duty to find out why the train is broken down, is it?
in airline terms, is it our duty to find whether CX delayed a flight due to tech, weather, or ATC, then go hunt for compensation?

it cost MTRC hardly anything to give such notice.

in airline terms, is it our duty to find whether CX delayed a flight due to tech, weather, or ATC, then go hunt for compensation?


kaka - if you're not DM on CX (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cathay-pacific-asia-miles/1370768-dm-experience-typhoon-vicente-diamond-worth-after-all.html), you do (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cathay-pacific-asia-miles/1370543-cx-807-ord-hkg-7-25-cancelled.html)

kaka - if you're not DM on CX (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cathay-pacific-asia-miles/1370768-dm-experience-typhoon-vicente-diamond-worth-after-all.html), you do (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cathay-pacific-asia-miles/1370543-cx-807-ord-hkg-7-25-cancelled.html)

dang... what a terrible company CX is. gotta fly someone else.

kaka - if you're not DM on CX (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cathay-pacific-asia-miles/1370768-dm-experience-typhoon-vicente-diamond-worth-after-all.html), you do (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cathay-pacific-asia-miles/1370543-cx-807-ord-hkg-7-25-cancelled.html)

As I said before, go and get yourself an AMEX Centurion card or fly F or J enough to get DM so that you won't be disappointed.

As I said before, go and get yourself an AMEX Centurion card or fly F or J enough to get DM so that you won't be disappointed.

If Centurion membership is condition precedent to a pleasant CX experience, any CX co-branded Centurion card :D:D:D?

If Centurion membership is condition precedent to a pleasant CX experience, any CX co-branded Centurion card :D:D:D?

Well get yourself one and find out:cool:

If Centurion membership is condition precedent to a pleasant CX experience, any CX co-branded Centurion card :D:D:D?

If you are one of their big customers, I bet AMEX is very happy to make one card just for you.

Like I have said on HK Card Forum, they gave almost no service to small potatoes and they can kiss your shoes (a Hong Kong slang yay) if you pay them enough.

If you are one of their big customers, I bet AMEX is very happy to make one card just for you.

Like I have said on HK Card Forum, they gave almost no service to small potatoes and they can kiss your shoes (a Hong Kong slang yay) if you pay them enough.

I believe the slang is shine(polish) your shoes?

As I said before, go and get yourself an AMEX Centurion card or fly F or J enough to get DM so that you won't be disappointed.

just dont get the HK or US based membership:o