Miles & More (Lufthansa, Austrian, Swiss, and other partners) - Is SEN now too common and easy to achieve?

Flying MUC-LHR last night, I proudly sat down in 1A, feeling a smug sense of self-important as a SEN, with the red tag obviously placed on my Rimowa. ;)

After the meal tray was served, the crew member disappeared to help in Y and, on my way back from the bathroom, took a look at the manifest. 18 SENs* and 3 HONs on board! :rolleyes: My status means nothing! It is practically worthless. The (very nice) lounge in MUC was also overcrowded.

Is SEN/*G just too easy to achieve these days? Personally I think the 2-year renew should be scrapped in favour of a yearly renewal to reduce numbers. Thoughts?

(* I assume that some of the 'SENs' on the manifest were actually *Gs from other cheapo programs but are displayed as SEN on the manifest? I doubt the HONs were anything but LH though).

SEN are displayed as SEN, *G as *G. 10 SENs to London on an aircraft with 120-180 pax is pretty normal...

I think the answer is, considering what you get for SEN, no it isn't too easy to achieve, it should be a lot easier. However, I predict a drop off in numbers with all the recent changes, I'm certainly not sure if I will bother requalifying or not.

However, I predict a drop off in numbers with all the recent changes,

How? The threshold for German SENs is now 100 instead of 130k and miles earned on lower fares has gone up, so the business travel crowd to LHR will make SEN easier.

Which kind of economy tickets earn more miles now??

For London it is a special story I assume, as there are many banking people who are allowed to fly business class and hence are able to really earn SEN more or less easily.
Strangely, LH seems to be complaining that there are to many status pax on some flights... Instead of being happy (also like FRA-MUC route) that people fly so often... I would even put some better seats into the first rows of C for status pax... It would enable them to keep these regular customers.

For many other pax I believe it is still quite a challenge to earn SEN.

Nevertheless, on the other hand LH was handing out masses of SEN cards through status matches etc. during the last 2 years, and there were many promotions (and still there are some around) allowing you to earn a lot of status miles.

So, on the one hand there are lots of people without deeper knowledge, so that it is still a challenge. And on the other hand there are many pax who have only flown 2 segments in the past and did a status match etc..

This in total makes SEN quite inconsistent. It would be better to produce some more consistency. But currently, they are on the one hand treating the "real" regular customer paying medium priced tickets worse, whilst on the other hand doing a lot of marketing, handing out of SEN cards, etc. to gain new customers, often only with low-price-tickets.

Flying MUC-LHR last night, I
he manifest? I doubt the HONs were anything but LH though).
MUC-LHR is the reason, two massive business centers will have tons of business traffic hence higher elites. There are lots of city pairings in the world where the whole flight will be elites. ORD-LGA was 3/4 AA EXPs, JFK-LAX is loaded with elites. I have seen flights HKG to London where the elite F, J boarding lines are longer than the ones for Y.
I do not know the ins and outs of M&M, but I thought it is really hard to earn status on cheap Y tickets, so these people are paying their keep. Also HON's that really takes some work or be some real executive at a company with a big travel contract with LH.

I remember a flight maybe 2 or 3 years ago, Monday morning to London City. I think it was on Avro.

There was no eco available, but with booking guarantee I was booked into Y. They opend up one single row of economy in the behind. Everything else was business class, and the flight was fully booked....

Which kind of economy tickets earn more miles now??


Inside Europe / domestic only ELK & LK respectively earn 125 miles, the rest 750/500 since a few months. That will improve/steady the number of businesskasper SENs who shuttle between LHR and FRA/MUC.

Flying MUC-LHR last night, I proudly sat down in 1A, feeling a smug sense of self-important as a SEN, with the red tag obviously placed on my Rimowa. ;)

18 SENs* and 3 HONs on board! :rolleyes: My status means nothing! It is practically worthless. The (very nice) lounge in MUC was also overcrowded.



I think 18 SENs on one aircraft is not *really* a large population of exlcusive and high-yield customers. Think of the route, the day and then this number will be comparatively low.

Just thinkthat GOLD customers are those who are very often in the air. So the 12 % or so SENs on board enable you to do the math:

They fly much more often than the average passenger or the once upon a year flyer: If they are flying only 6 times the average customer there would be a polulation of 2 % amongst M&M particpants who are Gold and more. ;)

So a really exclusive club. :D

And to agree: The route MUC-LHR is business-heavy and also the date/time you mentioned is an aircraft mainly used for the (returning) weekend tourists to (EDIT: from) Munich and the people flying to LHR to prepare for a meeting in the early morning hours of Monday.


So no public servants or EU bureaucrats on board. Convinced they are not working on Public holidays

So this aircraft was just a bunch of holiday/weekend travellers and hard working entrepreneurs and movers and shakers. ;)

Last week I was on a Swiss flight from JFK to ZRH and I was one of the 2 SENs in economy. Flight fully booked (I know because I got upgraded) and only 2 SENs in Y. I guess that on long-haul flights SENs tend to fly business.

Last week I was on a Swiss flight from JFK to ZRH and I was one of the 2 SENs in economy. Flight fully booked (I know because I got upgraded) and only 2 SENs in Y. I guess that on long-haul flights SENs tend to fly business.

Not me. Y by company policy. And last flight from PVG to ZRH I even had a HON behind me in 31A (I was in 30A).

I did JFK MUC the other day and was the only SEN in economy... the other 7 had a better fare and were upgraded to C :p

And on the other hand there are many pax who have only flown 2 segments in the past and did a status match etc..


I believe the recent batch of status matchers from AF/KLM only got SEN for a year, not 2.

Ah yes - Air France matched by BA Gold card; then I matched my Air France for two years of SEN membership. Lufty actually made me fly two sectors on LH metal though. I say LH metal, I flew to CGN and it was operated by BD.

Still, whilst Air France haven't had had a single penny from me, Lufty have. In fact renewal may be feasible if I wanted to push for it.

...and hence are able to really earn SEN more or less easily.

to really earn SEN more easily or less easily?

18 SENs - that's nothing.
Book a Monday morning flight FRA-LHR and you'll easily have 18 HONs on board !

(Last year during the Easter break I had a flight with 14 HONs on BKK-FRA, usually it's 3-4)

I am surprised that people believe MUC and LHR to be "business heavy" route -- frankly I don't believe that it is the case. From what I see, the "big" employers with significant operations in both locations are BMW / Audi / Munich Re / Allianz / HVB

Who else ?

In addition, the LCY to MUC route was **so popular** that LH have decided to cancel it ....

As to the point regarding too many SENs -- who knows, all I can say is that mine was earned the hard way ........ down the back in Y

"Bankers and business class" -- ha, ha, ha !! At least it made me giggle ...... not a chance unless they are really on a "booked-last-minute-and-flight-completely-full" ticket. There are very, very, very, very few that have this luxury written into a travel policy ..........

Overcrowded lounges -- absolutely, its getting a bit ridiculous now. I rarely find the non-schengen lounges full, however the schengen lounges are absolutely bursting at peak times of late

I remember a flight maybe 2 or 3 years ago, Monday morning to London City. I think it was on Avro.

There was no eco available, but with booking guarantee I was booked into Y. They opend up one single row of economy in the behind. Everything else was business class, and the flight was fully booked....

ROFL.

I think the answer is, considering what you get for SEN, no it isn't too easy to achieve, it should be a lot easier. However, I predict a drop off in numbers with all the recent changes, I'm certainly not sure if I will bother requalifying or not.

One wonders how many of the post-September 1 "excess" HONs will merely drop to SEN, thereby further taxing the SEN system.

This in total makes SEN quite inconsistent. It would be better to produce some more consistency. But currently, they are on the one hand treating the "real" regular customer paying medium priced tickets worse, whilst on the other hand doing a lot of marketing, handing out of SEN cards, etc. to gain new customers, often only with low-price-tickets.

Kinda ironic though, that a lot of those who consider themselves the "real" customers are usually the ones that aren't paying for their tickets out of their own pockets. :rolleyes:

Kinda ironic though, that a lot of those who consider themselves the "real" customers are usually the ones that aren't paying for their tickets out of their own pockets. :rolleyes:

... that some people here seem to be convinced that money out of pax's "own pocket" has any extra value to any carrier.
:rolleyes:

... that some people here seem to be convinced that money out of pax's "own pocket" has any extra value to any carrier.:rolleyes:

And where, exactly, do you think that I said anything of that sort in my post? Try parsing it again.

...
"Bankers and business class" -- ha, ha, ha !! At least it made me giggle ...... not a chance unless they are really on a "booked-last-minute-and-flight-completely-full" ticket. There are very, very, very, very few that have this luxury written into a travel policy ..........
...

All the bankers I know (quite a few, most of them investment bankers) all fly at least Business Class. Doesn't seem to be too uncommon.

had 17 Hon's a few weeks back flying to HKG and about 30+ Sen's, manifest continued in page two which I could not see!!! So 17 Sen's is no big deal. Sen on a European flight even Hon means nothing to the crew. Most days from MUC, Hon lounge is packed as well, best is the small Sen cafe!

All the bankers I know (quite a few, most of them investment bankers) all fly at least Business Class. Doesn't seem to be too uncommon.

Allianz and Munich Re out of MUC are C on regional too.

Allianz and Munich Re out of MUC are C on regional too.

There is a subtle issue -- many banks now have few people who (by policy) are permitted to travel in business. However if it is a last minute booking on popular routes and only business is available, then you can end up in business.

The Allianz policy for UK people must be different as I see some people working for them that are most definitely not in C ...... as they are sat near me down the back !! Not sure about Munich Re though.

After the meal tray was served, the crew member disappeared to help in Y and, on my way back from the bathroom, took a look at the manifest. 18 SENs* and 3 HONs on board! :rolleyes: My status means nothing! It is practically worthless. The (very nice) lounge in MUC was also overcrowded.

If I may add a little note..
I have been SEN for 10 consecutive years and very happy as well, but lost it last year as I used to do the MUC-LCY/LHR every week for 8 years! and only manage 17 return flights last year!!!!

I can gladly say, the days you used to many FTL* seems over now and seem to have superseded to SEN*
I find it extremely hard to achieve SEN again just on that route as biz is far too expensive when you can fly for £140- ca. €200 each time! upon checking BA equally, is at least 50-70 euro more expensive and doesnt fly to LCY.
It is true that LH has stopped many flights to LCY, from Düsseldorf to Berlin, no more staff present @ LCY, even though landing fees are cheaper than LHR, tickets are still more expensive flying to LCY!!

bring on the 3x BMI flights MUC-Stansted again ( these flights were always busy!)...