Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate - What Makes a Screener Pick You? Anyone Notice a Pattern?

I took a number of plane trips in 2010 fall and 2011. Every single time, they picked me for the scanner. 100%. I'm female, young, thin and normal looking. So, I pretty much stopped flying and haven't for a long time and probably will not. Has anyone noticed a pattern in who gets picked? It seems like if you are young and female (college aged), you will get picked. Other people I've talked to notice that girls under 30 get picked a lot. Also, random business guys like the ones here in FT. Also, elderly ladies, physically disabled people, and sometimes children.

Random question - are flight attendants exempt from the scanners?

It's pretty discouraging to always be picked, esp. when hardly anyone else around you gets picked. I feel like one of the tributes chosen for the Hunger Games.

Sorry you've been repeatedly singled out. Hope it doesn't keep happening and I did get a chuckle out of the reference to feeling like a Hunger Games tribute. My teen daughter plowed through all of the books first and I enjoyed them too.

Sorry you've been repeatedly singled out. Hope it doesn't keep happening and I did get a chuckle out of the reference to feeling like a Hunger Games tribute. My teen daughter plowed through all of the books first and I enjoyed them too.

Even when I was using the elite/premium line, it didn't matter. I don't think it's the flyer status, it's me.

I'm female, young, thin and normal looking.

...

Other people I've talked to notice that girls under 30 get picked a lot. Also, random business guys like the ones here in FT. Also, elderly ladies, physically disabled people, and sometimes children.

I think you've answered your own question.

i.e., "People who won't argue with them, and will meekly follow the directions of a complete stranger merely because that person is wearing something that resembles a uniform that represents authority."

You identified Woman under 30, businessmen of indeterminate age, elderly people, handicapped people, and children.

Isn't that just about everyone?

Random question - are flight attendants exempt from the scanners?

I can't remember whether they are officially exempted, but in practice, just about every airport I've been in screeners will open up the WTMD for them instead.

As of late, it seems that the only people to go through WTMDs are crew and airport staff, families with small children, and those lucky enough to walk up to the AIT machine when there's a line three or four deep already.

As of late, it seems that the only people to go through WTMDs are crew and airport staff, families with small children, and those lucky enough to walk up to the AIT machine when there's a line three or four deep already.

That's disappearing fast. At most airports, the lines are out the door, and the WTMD's are blocked off.

You identified Woman under 30, businessmen of indeterminate age, elderly people, handicapped people, and children.

Isn't that just about everyone?

I don't fall into any of those categories. (I'm not male)

That's disappearing fast. At most airports, the lines are out the door, and the WTMD's are blocked off.

Exactly. What OP seems to fail to understand is that the scanners are PRIMARY in many US airports now, not secondary, and hence there is no picking and choosing of passengers.

I don't fall into any of those categories. (I'm not male)



Exactly. What OP seems to fail to understand is that the scanners are PRIMARY in many US airports now, not secondary, and hence there is no picking and choosing of passengers.

The question had been reversed: Who is selected for the WTMD?

In a few airports, some are asked if they have surgical implants and are directed to the scanner allowing others in line to use the WTMD. As said above, this is becoming more rare.

I found it a little ironic that a few hours ago OP was saying that Americans wouldn't fly to the UK because of the scanner use there. Yet it is in America where the scanners are primary, and the chances of being selected for a scanner at the few terminals in the UK which have them are very, very low, and they can be generally avoided.

That's disappearing fast. At most airports, the lines are out the door, and the WTMD's are blocked off.

Yup, ABQ for one doesn't care how long the line into the NoS is (I've seen them 10+ deep at every machine) or whether they are even working correctly as one screener was telling another screener last Sunday, but they were still putting people thru them :td:

I don't fall into any of those categories. (I'm not male)



Exactly. What OP seems to fail to understand is that the scanners are PRIMARY in many US airports now, not secondary, and hence there is no picking and choosing of passengers.


I was just curious how it worked now, that's all. It sounds like everyone is going through them now.

I found it a little ironic that a few hours ago OP was saying that Americans wouldn't fly to the UK because of the scanner use there. Yet it is in America where the scanners are primary, and the chances of being selected for a scanner at the few terminals in the UK which have them are very, very low, and they can be generally avoided.

I didn't mean to say that lots of Americans wouldn't fly to the UK because of scanner use. I've heard that some people have chosen to not fly to the UK because of the no opt-out rule. I guess it's good that you can still opt out in the states.

I didn't mean to say that lots of Americans wouldn't fly to the UK because of scanner use. I've heard that some people have chosen to not fly to the UK because of the no opt-out rule. I guess it's good that you can still opt out in the states.

Opt outs in the USA are reportedly down to close to nil and, anecdotally, that's certainly true.

I'm sure there's somebody who didn't fly to/through the UK, but w. overbooked flights most of the summer, it's not meaningful.

Opt outs in the USA are reportedly down to close to nil and, anecdotally, that's certainly true.

I'm sure there's somebody who didn't fly to/through the UK, but w. overbooked flights most of the summer, it's not meaningful.

I didn't say anything about the number of people opting out in the US. I'm just thankful that you can still do that here. If I were to fly, I'd opt out even if I was the only person doing it. I don't follow the crowd. :)

As for the UK, I'm sure their airport security workers are nicer and friendlier than in the US. Maybe that could be the reason people don't mind flying there? :)

Opt outs in the USA are reportedly down to close to nil ...

I don't believe it.

... and, anecdotally, that's certainly true.

I disagree.

As of late, it seems that the only people to go through WTMDs are crew and airport staff, families with small children, and those lucky enough to walk up to the AIT machine when there's a line three or four deep already.

Add to it anyone carrying a pet.

I disagree.

I find it probable that opt-opts are doing so farther from the checkpoint, and being counted as "lower ticket sales" rather than "opt outs at the checkpoint."

I didn't say anything about the number of people opting out in the US. I'm just thankful that you can still do that here. If I were to fly, I'd opt out even if I was the only person doing it. I don't follow the crowd. :)

As for the UK, I'm sure their airport security workers are nicer and friendlier than in the US. Maybe that could be the reason people don't mind flying there? :)

I opt out when I fly...

I opt out when I fly...

I opt out. And, I fly on a weekly basis.

The answer to the original question is: people who are unlikely to cause trouble.

Single woman traveler, being friendly or smiling? I've been singled out for that.
Businessman, knows the drill, needs to get to work? Pick them.

Children, elderly, families? Higher chance of an incident ending up on YouTube.
Middle aged passenger on a obviously once-per-year leisure trip? Wildcard, why bother if there is an easier target?

I don't blame TSOs for selecting passengers that make their jobs easier. I think the true fault lies with a system that allows choices like this to be made. :mad:

The answer to the original question is: people who are unlikely to cause trouble.

Single woman traveler, being friendly or smiling? I've been singled out for that.
Businessman, knows the drill, needs to get to work? Pick them.

Children, elderly, families? Higher chance of an incident ending up on YouTube.
Middle aged passenger on a obviously once-per-year leisure trip? Wildcard, why bother if there is an easier target?

I don't blame TSOs for selecting passengers that make their jobs easier. I think the true fault lies with a system that allows choices like this to be made. :mad:

I think the true fault lies in a population that is so paranoid, so afwaid of the big bwown tewwowist bogie man, that it allows such invasive and abusive searches without warrant, probable cause, or articulable suspicion, to be carried out by non-LEO minimum-wage clerks with near-zero accountability and near-limitless power.

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. And today, the good people are not only doing nothing about these evils, they're applauding them and actually asking for more of them, out of sheer paranoia.

And today, the good people are not only doing nothing about these evils, they're applauding them and actually asking for more of them, out of sheer paranoia.

Worse, the average traveler is willing to accept an almost infinitely higher probability that their "security" will cost them their dignity and/or belongings in order to provide the illusion that they're "safer" than the original infinitesimally tiny chance of an actual "tewowwist" incident at the checkpoint or in-flight.

I want to fly out of airports you all are flying out of. Even families with children go through the scanners at my airport. NO ONE is picked for WTMD except crew (and sometimes not even them). And backups? Scanner can be stacked 20 deep, and nope, everyone's waiting for it.

I think the true fault lies in a population that is so paranoid, so afwaid of the big bwown tewwowist bogie man, that it allows such invasive and abusive searches without warrant, probable cause, or articulable suspicion, to be carried out by non-LEO minimum-wage clerks with near-zero accountability and near-limitless power.

Want to know the really sad part? TSOs are comped well-above minimum wage to, essentially, stand around doing nothing, and occasionally go on a power trip.

I want to fly out of airports you all are flying out of. Even families with children go through the scanners at my airport. NO ONE is picked for WTMD except crew (and sometimes not even them). And backups? Scanner can be stacked 20 deep, and nope, everyone's waiting for it.

My hunch is that the TSA is conditioning people to expect to be scanned, so that when they roll out of graduated trusted traveler program, with 9/10 security for the top level, 2010 security for the mid-level (undress, liquids out, your laptop can stay in your bag, scanners are for secondary/random use only), and 7/1/2012 security for the untrusted travelers (scanner and/or patdown for everyone in line). My guess on percentages would be 15% PreCheck-style, 60% mid-level, 25% untrusted. If TSA conditions us to expect such a hassle at security now, odds are in their favor of a strongly positive reaction if/when this change is rolled out.

My hunch is that the TSA is conditioning people to expect to be scanned, so that when they roll out of graduated trusted traveler program, with 9/10 security for the top level, 2010 security for the mid-level (undress, liquids out, your laptop can stay in your bag, scanners are for secondary/random use only), and 7/1/2012 security for the untrusted travelers (scanner and/or patdown for everyone in line). My guess on percentages would be 15% PreCheck-style, 60% mid-level, 25% untrusted. If TSA conditions us to expect such a hassle at security now, odds are in their favor of a strongly positive reaction if/when this change is rolled out.

Reminds me of certain other political regimes in which one could avoid much of the harassment by carrying one's "Party Member" card on their person at all times.

Based on the OP's Hunger Games reference, those privileges would be limited to residents of the "Capitol." ;)

Based on the OP's Hunger Games reference, those privileges would be limited to residents of the "Capitol." ;)

My reference wasn't fictional. :mad:

I want to fly out of airports you all are flying out of. Even families with children go through the scanners at my airport. NO ONE is picked for WTMD except crew (and sometimes not even them). And backups? Scanner can be stacked 20 deep, and nope, everyone's waiting for it.I'm based out of DFW, too. :confused: Do you use terminal E primarily? That's the only one I never use.

I'm based out of DFW, too. :confused: Do you use terminal E primarily? That's the only one I never use.

Oops, now your PM makes more sense.

I split my time half and half between DFW and another city - it's the other city that has one checkpoint and always the scanner in use.

The comment about the screeners sending people through the body scanners at ABQ when they are malfunctioning is scary. Do you know what the malfunction was and what specifically was said during the discussion? Also, whey do they have this practice at ABQ but still send people through the WTMD at other airports?

The comment about the screeners sending people through the body scanners at ABQ when they are malfunctioning is scary. Do you know what the malfunction was and what specifically was said during the discussion? Also, whey do they have this practice at ABQ but still send people through the WTMD at other airports?

Not sure about ABQ, but I have definitely seen people sent through a malfunctioning WTMD in the priority lane at DEN. I was actually sent though it--it was randomly alarming to everyone and everything, including air at times. Rather than unplugging it and sending everyone to the MMW lanes, the screeners would turn it off and on between passengers, then send people through as many as five times to get a walk-through with no alarm. A three-striper came over when I was near the front of the line, and when advised of the situation, her response was that people should be instructed to run through because the machine won't alert as often if you do that.

I lol'ed. Luckily, the screeners were laughing about the situation at that point as well, and by the time I got to the front of the line, they were having people run through three times. If they still alarmed after the third run, they were told to go ahead and enter the sterile area anyway. :rolleyes:

Wearing a "The TSA Wants to See Me Naked" T-shirt is a good way to get picked out for a retaliatory random selection to go thru the scanner. :rolleyes:

Opt outs in the USA are reportedly down to close to nil and, anecdotally, that's certainly true.


I don't think that's true. I have seen 3 opt outs in the last week, besides myself.

I think the reason they are going down is because of Pre-Check.

I don't think that's true. I have seen 3 opt outs in the last week, besides myself.

I think the reason they are going down is because of Pre-Check.

Yes. Plus a lot of people will not travel any more cause of TSA and their groping.

Wearing a "The TSA Wants to See Me Naked" T-shirt is a good way to get picked out for a retaliatory random selection to go thru the scanner. :rolleyes:

If not have a three-striper tell you that you can either take off your shirt, turn it inside-out, then wait in line again or be removed for interfering with the screening process.

If not have a three-striper tell you that you can either take off your shirt, turn it inside-out, then wait in line again or be removed for interfering with the screening process.

I believe that particular sentence in American English should be seen as "protected speech."

Yes. Plus a lot of people will not travel any more cause of TSA and their groping.

There may be a few, but I wouldn't call it "a lot". My guess is probably less than a thousand or so nationwide. Infrequent travelers are not even aware of the TSA's tactics and generally fall into the anything-for-security camp, and frequent business travelers are not in a position to stop flying and therefore are more likely to fight back.

There may be a few, but I wouldn't call it "a lot". My guess is probably less than a thousand or so nationwide. Infrequent travelers are not even aware of the TSA's tactics and generally fall into the anything-for-security camp, and frequent business travelers are not in a position to stop flying and therefore are more likely to fight back.

Citation please. Anything within an order of magnitude or two would be fine.

Citation please. Anything within an order of magnitude or two would be fine.

Qualifier of their "guess" was already made...

The 'random' screenings in Australia (ETD, 'random' pat down) are quota based. They are always being done and the screener simply grabs the next person coming away from the baggage xray belt.
During busy periods at the checkpoint, it is possible to avoid the additional checks by timing your passage through the WTMD and xray. During slow periods, you will get checked.
Once, on a CBR-SYD-LAX flight, got the random ETD going through CBR, then 90 minutes later, got the same thing again in SYD, then 20 minutes later, got the random US bound additional screening. In the space of 2 hours, I went through 2 WTMD, had my carryons xrayed twice and hand checked twice, was patted down twice and had 3 sets of ETD.

There may be a few, but I wouldn't call it "a lot". My guess is probably less than a thousand or so nationwide

4 of us checking in here, 996 to go.

4 of us checking in here, 996 to go.

Did you already count me?

Qualifier of their "guess" was already made...

Even a guess should be made based on some reasonable approximation of fact.

Wow - interesting new clues! My husband always gets picked for random selection. Now it makes sense to me. He is very passive looking. I, on the other hand, am a tall blonde who is usually dressed in something like sand colored pants and a nice shirt and being a a general manager for a company, I am sure I may look like I have an agenda. I have always been waved through. I couldn't wait to share this with my husband!