Travel Technology - $7,000 iPhone = no thanks; good Android options on AT&T or Verizon network?

My wife currently has an android $50/month unlimited plan with Virgin Mobile. She likes the phone but gets lousy service (Sprint is the underlying network). Can anyone recommend a good no-contract, non-AT&T / non-Verizon branded service that offers Android phones yet uses either AT&T or Verizon's underlying network (to get more reliable service than Sprint's network).

Personally I have a cheapo pay-per-use TracFone that gets great service everywhere we've been. I believe it uses Verizon's network. I don't need a smart phone to be connected 24x7. Although I've gotta admit it's nice for one of us to have a smart phone. The Virgin Mobile android phone works out great for us when we travel, except again, the coverage is lousy in the areas we've tried it in.

At around $100 month including taxes, I find it hard to justify the cost of an iPhone. I don't look at monthly or annual costs. I look at 5 year total cost of ownership.

12 months X $100 = $1,200 annually.
$1,200 X 5 years = $6,000. Money that would come out of a paycheck, so I count the total cost to be around $7000+ for 5 years of having a "cool phone."

Considering I can probably find her a good $50/month no-contract on an android phone that uses the Verizon or AT&T network (again, her chief complaint is poor service), I'd even be willing to buy her $3,000 of Apple stock every five years. Or put the extra cash toward something we both enjoy--travel!

The only arguments I've heard in favor of the iPhone are convenience, coolness, and the ability to use it as a WiFi hot spot. But then I've seen personal pay-as-you-go WiFi devices from T-Mobil and others that could serve that purpose for her iPad (good purchase--lots of value from that device).

If I can't convince her to *not* to get an iPhone, are there ways we can make the bill as low as possible? She's semi-convinced she needs unlimited everything. But she probably texts less than 1500 per month, talks on her current phone less then 3 hours per month, and doesn't use a whole heck of a lot of data.

Hate throwing money down the toilet so I want to investigate options. I know many are passionate about their iPhones such that finances don't even come into the equation. On the other hand, it seems like one other bill that destroys, rather than builds, wealth.

You have an odd way to computing cost of ownership. Five years for consumer tech is awfully long - two years is more like it.

If it's not worth it to you, then it's not worth it to you. Buy something you think it worthwhile.

The only way to pay $50/month and get AT&T/Verizon service, as you've said, it a prepaid third party offering. That means you won't get an iPhone since AT&T/Verizon only sell them to be used directly and not through MVNOs (though I think Virgin is going to start selling them soon). There is a way around this on AT&T but who knows if they will catch you and cancel your service.

So, buy an Android phone on TracFone or SimpleTalk or any of the other MVNOs.

12 months X $100 = $1,200 annually.
$1,200 X 5 years = $6,000. Money that would come out of a paycheck, so I count the total cost to be around $7000+ for 5 years of having a "cool phone."

If $1,200 x 5 years is $6,000 then how do you get the total cost to be $7,000+ ?

In the uk my new iPhone 4s (my 4th iPhone). No purchase cost. 18 month contract @ £45 or approx 65 dollars. Will sell out of contract iPhone 4 for at least £150 which is 18 months old.

My wife currently has an android $50/month unlimited plan with Virgin Mobile. She likes the phone but gets lousy service (Sprint is the underlying network). Can anyone recommend a good no-contract, non-AT&T / non-Verizon branded service that offers Android phones yet uses either AT&T or Verizon's underlying network (to get more reliable service than Sprint's network).

The Sprint network gives priority to its own subscribers over customers of MVNO who use the Sprint network. In other words, a Sprint subscriber may get service at the same time that Virgin Mobile and Boost customers have trouble connecting.

I suspect that other mobile network operators similarly prioritize connections provided to customers of MVNO on their networks.

The only arguments I've heard in favor of the iPhone are convenience, coolness, and the ability to use it as a WiFi hot spot.

Besides being conveniently cool and kind of expensive, it also has a built in calculator, but you still have to put the correct numbers in yourself, unfortunately. No smart phone can compensate for that.

Yes, when you calculate the service costs over 24 months at even a reasonable rate of $70 - $80 or even your suggested $50 per month, it is expensive to own a smartphone. But there's cheaper ways to do it.

But i don't think that was your point.

-David

Amazon.com price of an Apple iPhone 4s 16GB Black= $450.00
Redpocket service=$60/month = $720/year
Redpocket Sim card on Amazon.com~$3.00

If you were to purchase a new phone every 2 years you'd spend less than $80/month for everything. You really shouldn't expect new tech to last more than 2 years. It's all made to be disposable.

. She likes the phone

Happy wife = happy life ;)

My T-Mobile smartphone, pretty much an iPhone clone in form factor and functionality, is $30/month prepaid (avoids the $10 in taxes and fees), plus about $5 in per-minute charges.

It's nice to pay $35/month, instead of $80 for the exact same service. :)

I have a Samsung Exhibit II and an iPhone 4s (unlocked). The Exhibit is a nice phone, but if the wife is using an iPad, she will quickly run into the Apps without equivalents, etc. While you can configure Android to feel similar to an iPhone, it will not be exactly the same. My opinion is that if the wife really wants an iPhone, get her the iPhone. You can activate an unlocked version with a number of different carriers.

What you need to understand is that hubby is not going to have an objective evaluation here. Whereever there is a dropped call, a missing app, etc., "it would have been different with an iPhone." You are comparing the reality of a good Android phone on a good (but not perfect network) with what she thinks she will get in Nervana. Nervana will always win until she gets there.

Stu

PS: If all she needs is a backup carrier, buy a Skyroam quadband dongle put a prepaid Truphone SIM in it. It will roam on both Tmobile and ATT and build into her Android phone. That will give her access to 3 out of 4 networks.

If $1,200 x 5 years is $6,000 then how do you get the total cost to be $7,000+ ?

Wish I could say my income was tax free. So to generate $6,000 in after tax money I have to earn more than $6,000. Also, five years come and go pretty fast. Does anyone think a good iPhone plan will cost less than USD $100/month after 2 years? Or will it likely cost even more?

My T-Mobile smartphone, pretty much an iPhone clone in form factor and functionality, is $30/month prepaid (avoids the $10 in taxes and fees), plus about $5 in per-minute charges.

It's nice to pay $35/month, instead of $80 for the exact same service. :)

Thanks Nerd and others. Will have to take a look at T-Mobile.

@Nerd, what particular model smartphone do you have through T-Mobile? And what underlying network does T-Mobile use? Is it a separate network? Or does it use AT&Ts, Verizon's, or Sprint's? Again, she's very unhappy with the service she gets through Virgin Mobile although the price is very easy on the wallet / purse.

@RoyalFlush--happy wife = happy life indeed. Quite happy life already. Wife loves to travel to cool places. If I can get around the Cult Factor of "must have" Apple devices--already gave in on buying her an iPad3 and very happy to do so--I think she'd be much happier when I tell her we'll be able to take an extra trip to, say, Hawaii, the South Pacific, spend another week in Paris, etc--versus having an iPhone. I just don't see an iPhone having the same value as a full-on tablet like the iPad.

@TWA - Not surprising that Sprint gives its own customers priority. But I tell you--I can't think of a single dropped call or poor service on my super cheap TracFone. Don't think TracFone yet offers Android phones, but I'll certainly be on the look out for one. Think I saw that Net 10 now offers Androids--don't recall, but Net 10 may also = TracFone (same parent company?) and thus use the same network.

Thanks again to all for the info and opinions.

Pagepluscellar.com is cheap and is on the Verizon network with great connectivity. Have used it for years with no problems, and I have found only rare spots where Verizon coverage doesn't reach. Pay as you go.

http://www.pagepluscellular.com/Plans.aspx


You can use any unlocked Verizon phone.

Straight Talk will get you an android device for like $500 a year for unlimited service for voice and data (or however they define unlimited)

They use AT&T, Verizon, and T-mobile depending on the phone and where you are.

You can buy the phones at Walmart.

The OP says that an iphone, by his calculations, will cost $7k over 5 years. But he has not discounted the cost of the smartphone he is already paying for, so that immediately halves the cost, over 5 years to $3.5k.

In addition, since he/his wife are interested in the 'cool' factor of the iPhone, there is no way said apple-fan wife is going to sit on an old iphone 4S for 5 years. The very most she will tolerate is a new phone every 2 years -- and apple knows this. So really, the additional cost is already down to $1.4k, over two years.

The rest depends on your wife.

Of course, you could just buy an unlocked iphone (~$600), and then use a payg sim card with it (another thread on this board details how), in which case, depending on individual use, the costs would be even less...especially if really, your wife just likes having a smartphone, but is mostly at home, so uses the wifi connection.

tb

My T-Mobile smartphone, pretty much an iPhone clone in form factor and functionality, is $30/month prepaid (avoids the $10 in taxes and fees), plus about $5 in per-minute charges.

It's nice to pay $35/month, instead of $80 for the exact same service. :)

Prepaid eliminates taxes/fees?

Prepaid eliminates taxes/fees?

Sales tax no, but it depends on your state and where you buy your refills, it's easy to avoid the sales tax if you want to.

There are none of the other fees, it's the biggest selling point of the prepaid services, that it's one price.

Sales tax no, but it depends on your state and where you buy your refills, it's easy to avoid the sales tax if you want to.

There are none of the other fees, it's the biggest selling point of the prepaid services, that it's one price.

Good to know - thanks.

The only arguments I've heard in favor of the iPhone are convenience, coolness, and the ability to use it as a WiFi hot spot.I'd argue that the actual device you select is a secondary consideration. Find the provider / plan that meets your economic / service requirements first, then find a phone that works on that network. And especially if you're going to keep the device for six years, the amortized cost of an unsubsidized iPhone, Galaxy S3, or any other smart phone is $10 / month or less, which is a fraction of the cost of the service.

T Mobile monthly pre paid plan and an unlocked iPhone. Plan is 50USD, 10$ more a month if you want to add international calling. iPhone's do well for 3yrs in my opinion, so 5yrs would be really pushing it.

The title of the post is kind of ridiculous. There's no reason to keep a phone or 5 years if you're going to use Verizon or AT&T. Part of the monthly cost goes into subsidizing your phone, so if you don't upgrade ASAP you are giving away money. At the very least, get a new free after subsidy phone every 20 months (or whatever the minimum is now) and sell it. Considering AT&T subsidizes $450 of the cost of each iPhone, that's about a thousand dollars in savings. And it's not limited to the iPhone, it's a function of using AT&T.

You can get any phone unlocked and use it on Virgin Mobile, T-Mobile, or Straight Talk for example and save some money. If you really plan on keeping the same phone for 5 years (I assume you are getting ready to replace your RAZR) the it's clearly better to buy one off contract. Whether you are willing to shell out $700 for an iPhone or only $49 for a cheap Nokia is up to you. You can use the iPhone or Android device on any of the aforementioned services, though some things may not work right out of the box (e.g. MMS) or at all (visual voicemail). The cost will be dramatically lower, let's say by $40 a month, though the service may not be as good. But over the course of 5 years, that's like Virgin Mobile paying you $2400 to use their service. Smart investing of that money might make it closer to $3000.

Thanks Doc and Cordelli.

The OP says that an iphone, by his calculations, will cost $7k over 5 years. But he has not discounted the cost of the smartphone he is already paying for, so that immediately halves the cost, over 5 years to $3.5k.


Not precisely, no, as far as discounting. I've factored that in. The 6K after tax dollars for an iPhone would halve to 3K after tax dollars. What I've said, and what I'm restating, is that I'd rather take the 3K in savings (because yes, we'd still spend ~$50/month--or hopefully less) put it toward Apple stock, a fantastic vacation, etc.

You've got me on the switch phones every 2 years. What I haven't factored in at all is the cost of the phone hardware itself. Calculated only the service changes. So the iPhone price is even higher than I'd originally calculated. If that's the point there, thanks for making my calcs more complete. :-)

I'd still maintain that the iPhone du jour will someone still cost around USD $100 monthly beyond any initial 2 year period. Possibly more with inflation.

Thanks again to all for the opinions and help. Discussions of favorite gadgets can easily degenerate into Holy Wars.

With some things, looking at total cost of ownership makes sense. But with phones, I think it makes more sense to compare the costs of the individual components of the TTO.

Calling plan is a calling plan. Whether you get an iPhone or an Android or a carpy old flip phone, you'll be talking on the phone the same amount over the two-year lifetime of the phone, so your calling plan will be the same.

Ditto for texting add-ons, with one caveat - if you have a dumb phone with no QWERTY keypad, you'd likely text a lot less than you would with a smart phone. Since you're talking exclusively about smart phones, however, that's a moot point; you're going to text the same on a pre-paid Android as you are on an iPhone 4s or 5, so your texting costs are identical.

The same applies to data plans, but here is where carrier choice comes into play, since there are many carriers with unlimited data and several with only tiered data plans. But again, whether you're using a pre-paid Android, an iPhone on AT&T, or something else, your usage of data will still be the same, so your data plan choice should be the primary factor in choosing a carrier. What is your monthly data use on your current smartphone? Your data use on the new one will be the same, so base your choice on that.

Which brings you to the cost of the device itself, which is where you'll find the greatest disparity. New iPhones are pretty consistently priced across providers, if you get a "subsidized" one (which is BS, there's no way carriers are eating 60% of their cost of a device; they're making a profit even on the subsidized phones). Refurbished iPhone 4s or older models like the 4 or 3gs are available from AT&T at significant discounts, but the new ones will cost you the same no matter where you go. New Androids, on the other hand, vary wildly in price, configuration, and capabilities, according to carrier, so if you can convince Wifey to try a sparkling new Android, you can get a top-knotch device that rivals the iPhone for the same or less money than a new iPhone 4s.

And, really, if you look at it objectively, since your calling plan, texting, and data are the same no matter what device you choose, then the difference in TTO is really just the difference in the cost of the devices.

Unlocked, unbranded Galaxy Nexus straight from Google Play = $400. Awesome phone, and no carrier crapware installed. It is also pentaband, so will work on AT&T or T-Mobile.

Not sure if they are still offering it, but I am on a pre-paid t-mobile plan. $30/month for 500 minutes, $10 unlimited text, and $10 unlimited "dumb phone" internet. With tax my bill ends up being $55. There might be better out there now, but I have been too lazy to research it.

Downside of T-mobile is that their coverage outside of major cities drops to EDGE or GSM pretty quickly. The Galaxy Nexus can roam on AT&T 3/4G, but only if there is not a T-mobile slow tower available.

@TWA - Not surprising that Sprint gives its own customers priority. But I tell you--I can't think of a single dropped call or poor service on my super cheap TracFone. Don't think TracFone yet offers Android phones, but I'll certainly be on the look out for one. Think I saw that Net 10 now offers Androids--don't recall, but Net 10 may also = TracFone (same parent company?) and thus use the same network.

Two points.

TracFone uses at&t, T-Mobile, Verizon and regional networks. Each TracFone phone is tied to a home network and will favor that network and not roam in areas where the home network supposedly has coverage. (source (http://www.prepaidphonenews.com/2011/12/how-to-get-tracfone-net10-or-straight.html))

Tracfone, Net10, Straight Talk and Safelink all have the same corporate parent, América Móvil (http://www.americamovil.com/amx/en/), a Mexico City based multinational telecommunication company. (source 1 (http://www.compare-prepaid-cell-phones.com/tracfone-vs-net10-vs-straight-talk.html), source 2 (http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php/1585181-The-Noob-guide-to-Tracfone-Net10-Straight-Talk-America-Movil))

Edited to add:

NET10 and Straight Talk Android phones connect only to the Sprint network and do not roam. (source (http://www.prepaidphonenews.com/2011/12/how-to-get-tracfone-net10-or-straight.html))

The only arguments I've heard in favor of the iPhone are convenience, coolness, and the ability to use it as a WiFi hot spot.

Well, since Android phones were WiFi hotspots even before Apple "invented" it, that last one doesn't really offer any differentiation.

Edited to add:

NET10 and Straight Talk Android phones connect only to the Sprint network and do not roam. (source (http://www.prepaidphonenews.com/2011/12/how-to-get-tracfone-net10-or-straight.html))

With either StraightTalk or NET10, you can buy an unlocked phone or even a locked phone on TMobile or AT&T and use it with their prepaid SIM. StraightTalk works out to something like $42/mo if you purchase 3 months at a time, including a reasonable data allowance and unlimited talk / text / mms. It is a totally different service than their natively branded phones.

Which brings you to the cost of the device itself, which is where you'll find the greatest disparity. New iPhones are pretty consistently priced across providers, if you get a "subsidized" one (which is BS, there's no way carriers are eating 60% of their cost of a device; they're making a profit even on the subsidized phones).

That actually isn't true. It is subsidized, and they make their money back only over time. That's why Sprint's profit tanked as they sold more and more iPhones. They hope to make it up the initial loss with years of data plans to sell. Smartphones are a very expensive loss leader, in a way.

Edited to add:

NET10 and Straight Talk Android phones connect only to the Sprint network and do not roam. (source (http://www.prepaidphonenews.com/2011/12/how-to-get-tracfone-net10-or-straight.html))

That's no longer true, as of a few weeks ago

Straight Talk and Net10 have introduced yet another new Android phone, and this one adds another little wrinkle to the mix. The ZTE Merit 990g phone is the first Straight Talk- and Net10-branded phone to use the AT&T network. The “bring your own phone” plans from both carriers already offered customers the option of using AT&T’s network, but this is the first AT&T-based phone that is officially branded as Straight Talk or Net10.

Thanks Doc and Cordelli.



Not precisely, no, as far as discounting. I've factored that in. The 6K after tax dollars for an iPhone would halve to 3K after tax dollars. What I've said, and what I'm restating, is that I'd rather take the 3K in savings (because yes, we'd still spend ~$50/month--or hopefully less) put it toward Apple stock, a fantastic vacation, etc.

You've got me on the switch phones every 2 years. What I haven't factored in at all is the cost of the phone hardware itself. Calculated only the service changes. So the iPhone price is even higher than I'd originally calculated. If that's the point there, thanks for making my calcs more complete. :-)

I'd still maintain that the iPhone du jour will someone still cost around USD $100 monthly beyond any initial 2 year period. Possibly more with inflation.

Thanks again to all for the opinions and help. Discussions of favorite gadgets can easily degenerate into Holy Wars.

Except I've sold my first four iPhones on Craigslist for the same as (or more than) the subsidized price. So it's probably about $300 in for the last five years. That money outlay is virtually nil.

The cheapest iPhone (contracted) plan would be about $80/month, I think. $49 phone plan with $25 data plan, plus taxes, etc.

According to this, you can get a bare bones plan for $55 all in: http://www.moneytalksnews.com/2011/11/01/whos-got-the-cheapest-iphone-plan/

Straight talk has an excellent plan: $45/month unlimited everything sim card. You can get a unlocked/locked iPhone for $500-600 and buy the sim card, then choose AT&T or T-mobile(iPhone only works with AT&T 3G though). That's simply it, no contract whatsoever. Here's the link: http://www.straighttalk.com/ShopSims

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the iPhone 4S to be released on Virgin Mobile (June 29, 2012) thread (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-technology/1354270-iphone-4s-released-virgin-mobile-june-29-2012-a.html).

$30-$55 a month plus $550 for the iPhone. Sprint MVNO

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the iPhone 4S to be released on Virgin Mobile (June 29, 2012) thread (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-technology/1354270-iphone-4s-released-virgin-mobile-june-29-2012-a.html).

$30-$55 a month plus $550 for the iPhone. Sprint MVNO

That wont work in this case as the OP has made it clear they dont want anything on Sprint.

The title of the post is kind of ridiculous. There's no reason to keep a phone or 5 years if you're going to use Verizon or AT&T. Part of the monthly cost goes into subsidizing your phone, so if you don't upgrade ASAP you are giving away money. At the very least, get a new free after subsidy phone every 20 months (or whatever the minimum is now) and sell it. Considering AT&T subsidizes $450 of the cost of each iPhone, that's about a thousand dollars in savings. And it's not limited to the iPhone, it's a function of using AT&T.

You can get any phone unlocked and use it on Virgin Mobile, T-Mobile, or Straight Talk for example and save some money. If you really plan on keeping the same phone for 5 years (I assume you are getting ready to replace your RAZR) the it's clearly better to buy one off contract. Whether you are willing to shell out $700 for an iPhone or only $49 for a cheap Nokia is up to you. You can use the iPhone or Android device on any of the aforementioned services, though some things may not work right out of the box (e.g. MMS) or at all (visual voicemail). The cost will be dramatically lower, let's say by $40 a month, though the service may not be as good. But over the course of 5 years, that's like Virgin Mobile paying you $2400 to use their service. Smart investing of that money might make it closer to $3000.

Sorry, you cannot BYOD (bring your own device) on pretty much all the CDMA providers (Sprint or any of its MVNOs such as Virgin Mobile or Verizon or any of their MVNO's.) GSM operators you can byod.

Sorry, you cannot BYOD (bring your own device) on pretty much all the CDMA providers (Sprint or any of its MVNOs such as Virgin Mobile or Verizon or any of their MVNO's.) GSM operators you can byod.

Not true, pagepluscellular is Verizon network and is bring your own device, though they will sell you a reasonably priced phone if you wish.

I'm passing on this link without recourse. The viewer comments on the site feel puffed, but that is just a gut thing:

http://www.beigephone.com/activate-iphone-4-iphone-4s-with-page-plus/

I'm passing on this link without recourse. The viewer comments on the site feel puffed, but that is just a gut thing:

http://www.beigephone.com/activate-iphone-4-iphone-4s-with-page-plus/

Not sure if the price on that site is iPhone specific. Activation of other phones on page plus is free or just a few dollars from other websites. YMMV


Edit: for example. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Page-Plus-Cellular-IPhone-4-Iphone-4s-Activation-Port-in-ESN-Change-/260963410467?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cc2a1a223

Does anyone know a prepaid plan that allows tethering? For example, you have your phone and use it as a mobile hotspot for your laptop?

As someone rightly pointed out, and as I confirmed with my wife, the iPhone as device has turned out to be secondary. What's most important to her is having a smartphone with great coverage where we need it (and we know that TracFone has it--along with its sister brands).

My focal point is also coverage; but of course price. Not paying double for service with a device that, for her, won't provide double the value. A good (but preferably great) Android phone is sufficient. Although am I right in suspecting the Android models offered from Net 10 and its sister brands are "nobody loves me" models than those offered by the Big Name Brands like AT&T and Verizon? Is that in part how their prices can be lower?

Went to Best Buy yesterday and saw that Net 10 has (at least) two Android phones with $50/month unlimited everything no contract plans. They are LG Optimus' models if I remember correctly. Wrote down the SKUs to look them up later on BB's web site to read reviews. One was ~$100 to purchase. The other was ~$150. $200 would be a max price we'd want to pay. Relative from one Android phone to another, I'd rather pay a bit extra for the device for better "user satisfaction". Especially considering the absolutely enormous price savings on a $50 unlimited talk / text / data no contract plan versus ~$100/month iPhone plans.

Can anyone who's using Net 10 and/or Straight Talk (the latter is Walmart only?) comment on currently available Android phones?

Not a huge fan of jailbreaking devices and trying to get them to work elsewhere. Not passing judgment. Just isn't right for us personally.

I'm also interested in another poster's question about which phones also offer tethering / a wifi hot spot feature, if any. In this specific case, Android phones currently offered by either Net 10 or Straight Talk.

Very close to making a decision now thanks to FT. Thanks again for all the info, comments, and opinions. Super helpful and a real time-saver.

Not a huge fan of jailbreaking devices and trying to get them to work elsewhere. Not passing judgment. Just isn't right for us personally.

I'm not very savvy on this particular issue, but it's my understanding that some carriers will allow you to purchase unlocked phones elsewhere, and activate them on their network. So long as they're compatible technologies, many carriers will activate the phone on their network without any grousing. I suppose this may be a byproduct of the whole, "we lose money on a subsidized phone" issue.

My one experience with this was on Verizon; I bought a substantially discounted Verizon phone from a vendor on eBay (discontinued model and the vendor was trying to clear out their stock). Verizon activated for me on my existing line, with no extra fees and no contract extension required.

I've also met people who bought unlocked international versions of some devices that were not available in the US yet, and had them activated on US carriers. It's not illegal, it's not against most carriers' terms of service, and there's nothing shady about it, so long as the carrier allows it.

So check with the carriers you're considering to see what their policies are toward unlocked or third-party-supplied devices. They may allow it, in which case it opens up more device options for you.

On the tethering issue, check out the FoxFi program for Android. It turns your phone into a virtual hotspot. I have never tested it on a contract plan that I care about keeping, but have used it with prepaid SIMs in multiple countries without a problem. The big difference is that if it is ever detected, I'm out $20 full stop. On a contract plan with a number which has good will, it could be a bigger issue.

On the tethering issue, check out the FoxFi program for Android. It turns your phone into a virtual hotspot. I have never tested it on a contract plan that I care about keeping, but have used it with prepaid SIMs in multiple countries without a problem. The big difference is that if it is ever detected, I'm out $20 full stop. On a contract plan with a number which has good will, it could be a bigger issue.

In addition, some MVNO's unlimited plans are not unlimited.

Be careful with MVNO plans, their unlimited plans are limited too (http://www.zdnet.com/blog/cell-phones/be-careful-with-mvno-plans-their-unlimited-plans-are-limited-too/7513)

Unlimited with your first 100 megs at full 3g speed with the remainder at full GPRS speeds.

Went to Best Buy yesterday and saw that Net 10 has (at least) two Android phones with $50/month unlimited everything no contract plans. They are LG Optimus' models if I remember correctly.

Both of which I believe will be on the Sprint network, which you clearly started this thread saying you wanted no part of.

I'm also interested in another poster's question about which phones also offer tethering / a wifi hot spot feature, if any. In this specific case, Android phones currently offered by either Net 10 or Straight Talk.

Clearly against the terms of service.

NET10 UNLIMITED PLAN FEATURES CANNOT BE USED FOR: (http://www.net10.com/content/terms_conditions.jsp) (1) access to the Internet, intranets, or other data networks except as the device’s native applications and capabilities permit (excluding all Hotspot applications), (2) any applications that tether your NET10 Phone to a laptop or personal computer other than for the use of Wireless Sync, or (3) any applications that allow your NET10 Phone to act as an internet access point or Wi-Fi for other devices and computers.

STRAIGHT TALK UNLIMITED PLANS CANNOT BE USED FOR: (http://www.straighttalk.com/terms) (1) access to the Internet, intranets, or other data networks except as the device’s native applications and capabilities permit, or (2) any applications that tether your device to a laptop or personal computer other than for the use of Wireless Sync. IN ADDITION TO THE DISCLAIMERS SET FORTH IN THE AGREEMENT, YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THE USE OF THE STRAIGHT TALK MOBILE WEB SERVICES IS AT YOUR SOLE RISK. THE SERVICE IS PROVIDED ON AN "AS IS" AND "AS AVAILABLE" BASIS WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND. STRAIGHT TALK MAKES NO WARRANTY THAT THE STRAIGHT TALK MOBILE WEB SERVICES WILL (i) MEET YOUR REQUIREMENTS, (ii) ALLOW ACCESS TO ALL THIRD PARTY SITES, OR (iii) BE UNINTERRUPTED, TIMELY, SECURE OR ERROR FREE. NO ADVICE OR INFORMATION OBTAINED FROM ANY OTHER SOURCE SHALL CREATE ANY WARRANTY NOT EXPRESSLY STATED IN THE AGREEMENT OR THE STRAIGHT TALK MOBILE WEB SERVICES TERMS OF USE. You are responsible for all activities undertaken by you using the Straight Talk Mobile Web Services, including without limitation, the use of email. You shall not use, nor permit others to use, the Straight Talk Mobile Web Services in a manner or for a purpose contrary to this Agreement.

Both of which I believe will be on the Sprint network, which you clearly started this thread saying you wanted no part of.

Correct that Sprint doesn't provide the coverage areas I personally need. I will have to re-read through the posts here more carefully. Because I thought having Net 10, Straight Talk or TracFone meant having service on the same network, or combination of networks, regardless of whatever officially offered device one purchases.

The lack of ability to run a personal wifi hotspot on a $50/month service like Net 10, Straight Talk, TracFone, and others doesn't bother me. In the few cases where public wifi is non-existent, I can always purchase a special purpose pay-per-use device for that. But it's news to me that the same provider would sell phones that operate on completely different networks. Thanks for correcting me on that one. So for each Android phone I might be interested in, I'd need to go to each provider's web site and read the network fine print?

I'm not very savvy on this particular issue, but it's my understanding that some carriers will allow you to purchase unlocked phones elsewhere, and activate them on their network. So long as they're compatible technologies, many carriers will activate the phone on their network without any grousing. I suppose this may be a byproduct of the whole, "we lose money on a subsidized phone" issue.

My one experience with this was on Verizon; I bought a substantially discounted Verizon phone from a vendor on eBay (discontinued model and the vendor was trying to clear out their stock). Verizon activated for me on my existing line, with no extra fees and no contract extension required.

I've also met people who bought unlocked international versions of some devices that were not available in the US yet, and had them activated on US carriers. It's not illegal, it's not against most carriers' terms of service, and there's nothing shady about it, so long as the carrier allows it.

So check with the carriers you're considering to see what their policies are toward unlocked or third-party-supplied devices. They may allow it, in which case it opens up more device options for you.

GSM operators (basically either AT&T or T-Mobile for national carriers in the US) do not care what GSM devices are on their network and is part of the GSM interoperability. On the other hand CDMA operators (Verizon, Sprint and others) generally do not allow BYOD (bring your own device.) On CDMA operators unless the MEID is one that they have sold they will not allow them on their network even though Sprint and Verizon sold units should be able to be used on the other's network.

GSM operators (basically either AT&T or T-Mobile for national carriers in the US) do not care what GSM devices are on their network and is part of the GSM interoperability. On the other hand CDMA operators (Verizon, Sprint and others) generally do not allow BYOD (bring your own device.) On CDMA operators unless the MEID is one that they have sold they will not allow them on their network even though Sprint and Verizon sold units should be able to be used on the other's network.

Thanks Weekilter.

So how precisely does one know what network a given model of phone uses? Initially, I thought all TracFones, for example, would have the same great coverage I get on my el cheapo Samsung phone. And that the same was the case for Net10. My wife would like an Android phone on an affordable service like Net10. But as someone mentioned, the Optimus models evidently use the same old Sprint network she dislikes (with her Virgin Mobile android phone) for the areas of coverage required. While I almost always have 5 bars with my TracFone--which I believe is either Verizon or some combination of Verizon / AT&T and T-Mobile networks as someone suggested.

Was in Walmart the other day (which I increasingly try to avoid) and some phones are displayed with a nice little coverage map. So the concept is evidently sound, e.g. don't expect the same coverage for all phones offered by the same provider. But didn't see any for the Net10 Optimus phones.

Anyone know if any StraightTalk android phones use a non-Sprint network (e.g. better for our particular coverage needs?).

Anyone know if any StraightTalk android phones use a non-Sprint network (e.g. better for our particular coverage needs?).

cordelli answered that question weeks ago:

Straight Talk and Net10 have introduced yet another new Android phone, and this one adds another little wrinkle to the mix. The ZTE Merit 990g phone is the first Straight Talk- and Net10-branded phone to use the AT&T network. The “bring your own phone” plans from both carriers already offered customers the option of using AT&T’s network, but this is the first AT&T-based phone that is officially branded as Straight Talk or Net10.

Google (https://www.google.com/search?sugexp=chrome,mod=2&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=ZTE+Merit+990g&qscrl=1#hl=en&sugexp=cqn%2Crate_low%3D0.025%2Crate_high%3D0.025% 2Cmin_length%3D2%2Ccconf%3D1.0%2Csecond_pass%3Dfal se%2Cnum_suggestions%3D1%2Cignore_bad_origquery%3D true&gs_nf=1&gs_mss=straight%20talk%20at%26t%20zte%20merit%2099 0g&tok=SuopHJUHxOZya2SpweAfSw&pq=straight%20talk%20zte%20merit%20990g&cp=19&gs_id=8o&xhr=t&q=straight+talk+at%26t++zte+merit+990g&pf=p&safe=off&qscrl=1&sclient=psy-ab&oq=straight+talk+at%26t++zte+merit+990g&gs_l=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=51a6e4b639342c8a&biw=1280&bih=905) is your friend. It took about 15 seconds to find this and other articles:

ZTE Merit - Straight Talk's First Android Phone on AT&T Now Available for $129.99 (http://www.prepaidphonenews.com/2012/05/zte-merit-straight-talks-first-android.html)

cordelli answered that question weeks ago:



Google (https://www.google.com/search?sugexp=chrome,mod=2&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=ZTE+Merit+990g&qscrl=1#hl=en&sugexp=cqn%2Crate_low%3D0.025%2Crate_high%3D0.025% 2Cmin_length%3D2%2Ccconf%3D1.0%2Csecond_pass%3Dfal se%2Cnum_suggestions%3D1%2Cignore_bad_origquery%3D true&gs_nf=1&gs_mss=straight%20talk%20at%26t%20zte%20merit%2099 0g&tok=SuopHJUHxOZya2SpweAfSw&pq=straight%20talk%20zte%20merit%20990g&cp=19&gs_id=8o&xhr=t&q=straight+talk+at%26t++zte+merit+990g&pf=p&safe=off&qscrl=1&sclient=psy-ab&oq=straight+talk+at%26t++zte+merit+990g&gs_l=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=51a6e4b639342c8a&biw=1280&bih=905) is your friend. It took about 15 seconds to find this and other articles:

ZTE Merit - Straight Talk's First Android Phone on AT&T Now Available for $129.99 (http://www.prepaidphonenews.com/2012/05/zte-merit-straight-talks-first-android.html)

Thanks TWA. I missed that.