MilesBuzz! - Frequent Flyer Program Award Redemption Satisfaction Survey [to 11 June 2012]

How satisfied or dissatisfied are you with award redemptions at your current frequent flyer program(s)? FlyerTalk and Frequent Business Traveler are conducting the Frequent Flyer Program Award Redemption Satisfaction Survey (http://www.frequentbusinesstraveler.com/2012/05/frequent-flyer-program-award-redemption-satisfaction-survey/), which will be active through June 11, 2012.

This is the second in a series of joint surveys by FlyerTalk and Frequent Business Traveler magazine. Frequent Business Traveler will provide the survey; FlyerTalk members will provide the opinions. Most FlyerTalk members redeem frequent flier loyalty program miles — but depending on personal preferences, the frequent flier loyalty programs of some airlines are significantly more satisfying and beneficial than others.

Results of this poll will be announced by both Frequent Business Traveler magazine and FlyerTalk.

So — with which airline frequent flier loyalty programs are you very satisfied, and with which airline frequent flier loyalty programs are you least satisfied? Please vote today (http://www.frequentbusinesstraveler.com/2012/05/frequent-flyer-program-award-redemption-satisfaction-survey/) and let everyone know!
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I will start...

I have been overall quite satisfied with the Delta Air Lines SkyMiles frequent flier loyalty program in terms of upgrade percentage, bonus miles, award ticket redemption, “rollover” Medallion Qualification Miles and other benefits — but the award calendar can be rather unpredictable and annoying, and the pricing of flights can sometimes be more expensive than I would prefer. However, I do like that they eliminated the fees for procuring an award ticket within two weeks of the flight, resulting in easing the use of my SkyMiles.

Even though I have no elite status in the United Airlines Mileage Plus frequent flier loyalty program, for some reason I seem to get upgraded to the Economy Plus seats for no charge on the day of the flight — a nice surprise perk that can brighten my day with a little extra legroom.

The American Airlines AAdvantage frequent flier loyalty program has been aggressive with offering enticing incentives to fly as a passenger, such as double elite qualification miles on certain routes, which helps its members attain elite status and the benefits associated with it sooner rather than later.

I do not like the idea of paying a fee just to use my US Airways Dividend Miles frequent flier loyalty program miles — even as a basic member without elite status. It is an irritating fee at best and devalues the miles, in my opinion. I avoid earning miles in the US Airways Dividend Miles frequent flier loyalty program — especially when I can bank them in the United Airlines Mileage Plus frequent flier loyalty program, as both are member airlines of Star Alliance. My 8,000 Dividend Miles are basically worthless to me at the moment.

I have others, but enough about me — what about you?

I do not like the idea of paying a fee just to use my US Airways Dividend Miles frequent flier loyalty program miles — even as a basic member without elite status. It is an irritating fee at best and devalues the miles, in my opinion. I avoid earning miles in the US Airways Dividend Miles frequent flier loyalty program — especially when I can bank them in the United Airlines Mileage Plus frequent flier loyalty program, as both are member airlines of Star Alliance. My 8,000 Dividend Miles are basically worthless to me at the moment.

I'd agree 1000% that redemption fees are annoying- but sounds like you're using your miles just as US wishes you would- you aren't. They love it even more when those miles come from partner promotions and cobrands, because the airline gets paid for the miles even if you never redeem them.

As this concerns frequent travel loyalty programs, it's apt for the MilesBuzz forum and it's been moved there for more discussion. Ocn Vw 1K, Moderator, TravelBuzz.

Recent cancellation of a trip using miles from three otherwise excellent programs (AAdvantage, United Mileage Plus, and Lufthansa Miles & More) caused me to confront various cancellation/redeposit fees. United's fees are the most obscene, at $150. AA is second, only slight less obscene, at $125. LH is a much more reasonable $60.

These are for seats that were cancelled more than 60 days before departure on routes where the seats will most likely be resold at a premium rather than returned to award inventory. Cancellation takes 5 minutes with an agent (and could be done online if the airlines were a bit more with it). The fees are outrageous and punitive and bear no relation whatsoever to any expense conceivably incurred by the airline/program. As you can see, UA and AA have successfully pissed me off.

so far AA has been my favorite despite being an lowly elite on AS. As soon as I get over the hurdle of ignoring the Economy Saver completely, the availability seems great, and I even got Business/First saver occasionally which is greater. ;)

as to AS, too bad it's not flying too many places from where I live.

UA is always more expensive than AA, and hence not accumulating a lot of flying miles on them.

DL redemption rate seems to be expensive in my book. So try to avoid them, unless the points come easy (like a CC).

Recent cancellation of a trip using miles from three otherwise excellent programs (AAdvantage, United Mileage Plus, and Lufthansa Miles & More) caused me to confront various cancellation/redeposit fees. United's fees are the most obscene, at $150. AA is second, only slight less obscene, at $125. LH is a much more reasonable $60.

These are for seats that were cancelled more than 60 days before departure on routes where the seats will most likely be resold at a premium rather than returned to award inventory. Cancellation takes 5 minutes with an agent (and could be done online if the airlines were a bit more with it). The fees are outrageous and punitive and bear no relation whatsoever to any expense conceivably incurred by the airline/program. As you can see, UA and AA have successfully pissed me off.

I agree that redeposit fees should be reasonable. The reason for the fees isn't related so much to their expense in handling a transaction; it is to make money, and also to make sure the limited award inventory gets booked by people really planning to use it. If there were no redeposit fees, I could certainly see lots of us tying up lots of seats speculatively, thus blocking inventory from others wanting it. So within reason redeposit fees are a necessity.

Interesting see that BA (British Airways) was flagged for a fairly significant improvement in reward availability. I've never had a problem in getting availability (OK, occasionally had to shift plans by one day) but then LHR-IAD is a fairly easy route.

However, there's a lot of discussion on the BA Forum about how hard things are now getting. Many complaints are clearly from those who expect everything for nothing, including those who picked up a huge pile of bonus Avios for signing up to a CC program ... all of whom seem to be looking at redemptions on the most popular routes at peak times, and usually with oneWorld partner carriers rather than BA. However, even the regular, hard-core, BA-flying community are feeling a bit 'nervous'. Is this a "London Olympic thing"? Is it a shift in BA's Revenue Management algorithms? We don't know!!

I wonder how things will look this time next year?

I agree that redeposit fees should be reasonable. The reason for the fees isn't related so much to their expense in handling a transaction; it is to make money, and also to make sure the limited award inventory gets booked by people really planning to use it. If there were no redeposit fees, I could certainly see lots of us tying up lots of seats speculatively, thus blocking inventory from others wanting it. So within reason redeposit fees are a necessity.

Never thought of redeposit fee from that point of view! Now, I am not completely against it :-)

I have tried Delta, UA and AA redemption and did not have much trouble getting dates / seats on Delta UA. I had to make some really convoluted itinerary to get booking on AA though. While trying to get seat on AA, I seriously felt that AA has only a single seat available for mileage redemption on each flight. All my bookings were made at least 2 months in advance.

I have to say I am annoyed at LH revenue managament for awards (among so many other things) as of late, and I think I am not the only one.

even with M&M as a SEN it's impossible to book 2 F seats 6 months out, on flights that are fully empty in F: F8A8, i have been on a waiting list for almost 2 months now.

Furthermore, since mid november 2011, they have blocked their F seats to *A partner to 2 weeks out prior to departure. Fine I can somewhat deal with that, but what really gets under my skin, is that recently they have blocked US DM from getting any awards at all. What's the point of *A if you block some of the members from getting the seats....

I'd agree 1000% that redemption fees are annoying- but sounds like you're using your miles just as US wishes you would- you aren't. They love it even more when those miles come from partner promotions and cobrands, because the airline gets paid for the miles even if you never redeem them.

There isn't much that can be done with 8,000 miles though.

Never thought of redeposit fee from that point of view! Now, I am not completely against it :-)

I have tried Delta, UA and AA redemption and did not have much trouble getting dates / seats on Delta UA. I had to make some really convoluted itinerary to get booking on AA though. While trying to get seat on AA, I seriously felt that AA has only a single seat available for mileage redemption on each flight. All my bookings were made at least 2 months in advance.

And I can't help but feel they intentionally come up with absolutely insane routings to make you give up that off-peak option altogether...

I was going to complete, but could not be bothered to click not applicable for all the programs I do not use. Not a very well designed survey.

How satisfied or dissatisfied are you with award redemptions at your current frequent flyer program(s)? FlyerTalk and Frequent Business Traveler are conducting the Frequent Flyer Program Award Redemption Satisfaction Survey (http://www.frequentbusinesstraveler.com/2012/05/frequent-flyer-program-award-redemption-satisfaction-survey/), which will be active through May 31, 2012.I just received word moments ago that the survey will now be active through June 11, 2012 — so please do not forget to vote!

I'm flying more than I have been recently, and have built up a fare amount of miles.

Whenever I book a flight (Europe mostly) I am looking at ba air miles before anything else.
There is never any availability, even 2-3 months in advance for the dates I want to fly.

This makes the scheme pointless in my eyes, with the only time I have managed to redeem any recently being for an internal Iberia flight!

I'm currently out in Dubai, and again the ba miles options totally failed me here on options - even given a large amount of flexibility.

G

LH is very good for intra-European flights (and, contrary to all the US programs, if you book close in and stay over a Saturday night, you get the award at 40% off). Less so for transatlantic.

AA & BA were pretty good for transatlantic. When I was looking in January for this summer (not for the Olympics but for mid June and mid-August), there was a lot of availability, especially on JFK-LHR. Some days had multiple flights with 5-7 award seats in biz! Now I know they have amazing capacity on that route (like 10+ flights a day), but I still think that is pretty darn good.

I've been delighted with availability on SW, especially since there's frequently an ultra-low mileage ticket available. Strictly short-haul, but for a trip with my teenager going around the US to different baseball parks, we just got 13 free flights from SW for a total of 85k miles. All on the right day and at the right time of day, too. Since virtually all my miles were from the SW/Chase Visa card and its 50k mile sign-up bonus, it's been a good deal. Had to pay for 5 flights, dang it. Hilton HHonors has taken care of all our hotels too.

How satisfied or dissatisfied are you with award redemptions at your current frequent flyer program(s)?

I have had no problems with redeeming BA miles when it was Executive Club ,at least pre-Avios.

As an Aeroplan member I have had nothing but problems when trying to book 2 tickets in Executive First long-haul,or in business with Star Alliance partners. It seems that there are only 2 seats per cabin in the front,and you need to book 355 days in advance to have any hope of these seats. The catch is that not all airlines will have their schedules worked out as far ahead as that.

Added to this is the circuitous routing that will be used for flying to some destinations. One example is using a variety of airlines to fly from Canada to Australia,even though AC have direct flights. A favourite was flying you to LAX with AC,then 8 hour stopover before NZ to SYD.

Delta is horrific at redemptions...

I use my BA credit card only occasionally now after being hit with large hidden charges on a trip from USA to India as described below in a letter to BA Execuktive Club which was ignored. I switched to United.

Unlike most if not all US based airlines, such as your partner, AA, you charge reward recipients a fuel surcharge fee.

The second disturbing fact is that if I had used cash to buy the tickets on the same day as they were purchased with miles, the taxes, fees and fuel surcharges would have been $605.09 per ticket. I was charged $829 per person, a difference of $895.64 for the four tickets. I have been unable to find any language in BA’s terms and conditions for Executive Club members that would put one on notice that there is a redemption fee of any kind, to say nothing of a substantial fee such as this, for using miles. However, a hidden redemption fee is the only explanation that I can conjure for this discrepancy in the way that BA treats loyal Executive Club members and the way it treats other customers. This strikes me as being short-sighted on the part of BA as well as unfair and deceptive.

Even the $605.09 charged to those paying cash looks suspicious given that American’s taxes, fees and surcharges came to only $105.40 for the same journey (except through Chicago rather than London). Could it be that BA is artificially raising the fuel surcharge at a time of relatively low oil prices in order to charge its Executive Club members higher fees?

I've never found a flight on Delta for the low award level, so their miles just aren't worth much to me.

I was going to complete, but could not be bothered to click not applicable for all the programs I do not use. Not a very well designed survey.

Be glad that you did not waste your time.

I provided my opinion for a small number of relevant airlines, and marked "not applicable" for the rest, and found that I was participating in a one-question survey... yes, no other questions.

Perhaps there is a threshold number of airlines that you must respond to in order to get the rest of the survey... or, alternatively, it's a pretty insignificant survey tool.

I've been with Delta for 25 years and 2 million miles and boy do I now regret it. I have 600,000 FF miles still left on them totally devaluated now that they canceled their old medalion program. What's left for award availability is now worthless compared to what I have gotten on US, AA and US in the last 5 years.

Ditto, that is about the number of miles I have on AAdvantage (8,000) which is as you say worthless to me. I find it almost impossible to find ways to earn miles on that program (other than flying), there are no incentives from AA to earn miles through other programs such as e-rewards (which btw is about as worthless) or MyPoints, this is a good one for MileagePlus and I can earn other rewards as well. Maybe we should all get together and buy each others miles??? Thanks, AHvolare

Ditto, that is about the number of miles I have on AAdvantage (8,000) which is as you say worthless to me. I find it almost impossible to find ways to earn miles on that program (other than flying), there are no incentives from AA to earn miles through other programs such as e-rewards (which btw is about as worthless) or MyPoints, this is a good one for MileagePlus and I can earn other rewards as well. Maybe we should all get together and buy each others miles??? Thanks, AHvolare

As a DL FF, you should be glad. The more miles out there and the more ways to earn them, the more they become devalued. AmEx has been giving out miles left and right, while AA miles are tougher to come by. But my 105K AA miles are way more valuable than my 300K DL miles. And I'd rather earn 1 AA for every 2 DL miles.

Recent cancellation of a trip using miles from three otherwise excellent programs (AAdvantage, United Mileage Plus, and Lufthansa Miles & More) caused me to confront various cancellation/redeposit fees. United's fees are the most obscene, at $150. AA is second, only slight less obscene, at $125. LH is a much more reasonable $60.

These are for seats that were cancelled more than 60 days before departure on routes where the seats will most likely be resold at a premium rather than returned to award inventory. Cancellation takes 5 minutes with an agent (and could be done online if the airlines were a bit more with it). The fees are outrageous and punitive and bear no relation whatsoever to any expense conceivably incurred by the airline/program. As you can see, UA and AA have successfully pissed me off.
I am a PREMIER 1K with United and I NEVER have to pay cancellation fees. I noticed you have status with American and surprised you had to pay any fees at all. I am very happy with UNITED as they do take care of their most frequent customers.

Most of my miles are on DL, AC, and US.

I find US redemption very challenging, and having to pay a fee to use the ticket at all is obnoxious.

I am especially peeved with AC. Taxes and fees on a short-haul ticket are $175, and I don't believe that most of these fees are legitimate cross-border fees. AFAIK, they have a $54 redemption fee, and they charge a "NAV" fee which appears to be a fee for use of the Canadian Air Traffic system.

But what is more annoying is availability. The flights I usually want to book are flight 7980 (9pm Fridays, YYZ-RDU) and 7979 (3PM or 7PM Sundays, RDU-YYZ). These flights usually have many empty seats, yet I am lucky to find availability on them as much as 10% of the time.

DL is also difficult to redeem. For domentic tickets, availability at low mileage levels is scarce, as everyone knows. For overseas tickets, the website is somewhere between difficult and useless.

I have recently been trying to accumulate miles on AA and UA, and I have browsed to their sites a few times to look at availability. When I see that they actually have tickets for where I want to go, on the dates I want to go, at the low mileage levels, I feel like it's Christmas. My intention is to burn all the DL and US miles I can, and try to accumulate AA and UA in the future.

Just completed - very brief survey. Missing TAM's frequent flyer programme.

Be glad that you did not waste your time.

I provided my opinion for a small number of relevant airlines, and marked "not applicable" for the rest, and found that I was participating in a one-question survey... yes, no other questions.

Perhaps there is a threshold number of airlines that you must respond to in order to get the rest of the survey... or, alternatively, it's a pretty insignificant survey tool.


I ended up with a one question survey as well.

Most of my miles are on DL, AC, and US.

I find US redemption very challenging, and having to pay a fee to use the ticket at all is obnoxious.

I am especially peeved with AC. Taxes and fees on a short-haul ticket are $175, and I don't believe that most of these fees are legitimate cross-border fees. AFAIK, they have a $54 redemption fee, and they charge a "NAV" fee which appears to be a fee for use of the Canadian Air Traffic system.

But what is more annoying is availability. The flights I usually want to book are flight 7980 (9pm Fridays, YYZ-RDU) and 7979 (3PM or 7PM Sundays, RDU-YYZ). These flights usually have many empty seats, yet I am lucky to find availability on them as much as 10% of the time.

DL is also difficult to redeem. For domentic tickets, availability at low mileage levels is scarce, as everyone knows. For overseas tickets, the website is somewhere between difficult and useless.

I have recently been trying to accumulate miles on AA and UA, and I have browsed to their sites a few times to look at availability. When I see that they actually have tickets for where I want to go, on the dates I want to go, at the low mileage levels, I feel like it's Christmas. My intention is to burn all the DL and US miles I can, and try to accumulate AA and UA in the future.

I hear you about AC.

My Story: 300,000+ miles and Elite status do not get me J class unless I book 15 - 24 months ahead, which is ridiculous. Recently tried to unload some points on a short haul domestic flight in Canada. The first insult was that I had to use the 30K redemption instead of the advertised 25K. The second insult was the fees and taxes for the 2 "free" tickets would be $403.84. Even the Aeroplan booking agent agreed this was out of line and cheerfully cancelled my request. I plan to get out, but what is the best thing to do with all those garbage miles?

Another annoyance is upgrades. Unless you are Super Elite it's like Russian roulette, and you can't go to the lounge because you have wait at the gate to see if you'll get the upgrade. AC manages to turn a privilege into a demeaning experience.

I recently booked using miles for a first class ticket to Germany using MileagePlus miles. I wanted to use the miles for my first class round trip ticket on Lufthansa but no matter when I requested, there were NO seats available. When I went to the Lufthansa website to look at first class seat availability, not ONE SEAT was booked on any flights I was interested in....and yet there is NO availability? I don't know who to blame here....is it UAL or Lufthansa? Anyone else have this happen to them?:td:

...MileagePlus miles. I wanted to use the miles for my first class round trip ticket on Lufthansa

Discussion here:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileageplus-consolidated/1285749-anyone-booked-lh-f-awards-recently.html

I would say United is not "fff" ....frequent flyer friendly when it comes to redeeming miles. I am finishing up a trip to Beijing and a month or so prior to this trip I tried to redeem my miles as a Premier Gold member for a first class ticket for my wife. I watched the award calendar every day for weeks and there was never any decent Saver awards and those that were available were outrageous itineraries of 30-40 hours, some even with over night stays in connecting cities. I would check one departure date and find a good flight but then couldn't get a return. I would try another departure date and not find anything desirable but low and behold, there is a return flight I like. Unfortunately and unexplainably, I the system won't offer me the two together. I call United and they can't explain and in fact, there system does not even show that the flights listed in the calendar even have inventory for award seats. After weeks of looking I finally found a Star alliance flight with Air China through Shanghai that worked and when all was said and one spent 140,000 miles for this First Class itinerary. Oh, one combination was with Lufthansa travelling across the Atlantic and the return flying east over the Pacific. The United agent said that was not allowed (i.e. flying completely around the globe was a no-no!?)

I am very satisfied with redeeming awards travel on United Airlines. I don't need to call up to book. I have NO status in any airlines so no need for any upgrades.

Worse is Delta. I am looking for a RT non stop From LAX to pretty much anywhere in Asia, Africa or Europe to "get rid" of my 153k miles.

I would check one departure date and find a good flight but then couldn't get a return. I would try another departure date and not find anything desirable but low and behold, there is a return flight I like. Unfortunately and unexplainably, I the system won't offer me the two together.

Why not book two one-way tickets at your desired dates? That is a distinct advantage of UA (and AA) miles redemption.

I am very satisfied with redeeming awards travel on United Airlines. I don't need to call up to book. I have NO status in any airlines so no need for any upgrades.

Worse is Delta. I am looking for a RT non stop From LAX to pretty much anywhere in Asia, Africa or Europe to "get rid" of my 153k miles.

Are you looking at partner availability?

Asia? Fly Korean, or another Asian partner if blackout dates are there.

Europe? Fly Air France. I see availability ex-LAX, even after they've supposedly reduced availability.

Africa? No airline flies non-stop to Africa from LAX. But fly AF through Europe.

153K is also just enough to do J on VA to Australia.

I agree, Skymiles suck, but that has more to do with the aspects of the program (only round-trips, 3-day cancellation rule, poor award calendar/online functionality). Partner availability is not one of them.

Thanks Amolkold!!!

Are you looking at partner availability?

Asia? Fly Korean, or another Asian partner if blackout dates are there.

Europe? Fly Air France. I see availability ex-LAX, even after they've supposedly reduced availability.

Africa? No airline flies non-stop to Africa from LAX. But fly AF through Europe.

153K is also just enough to do J on VA to Australia.

I agree, Skymiles suck, but that has more to do with the aspects of the program (only round-trips, 3-day cancellation rule, poor award calendar/online functionality). Partner availability is not one of them.

I agree. DL miles take some efforts to make efficient use of them but the availability on AF is not bad, even KE to Asia is quite good if one is willing to spend time and effort to learn how to unearth them.

There are reasons why a very helpful STICKY on how to book partner award is in DL forum. Make good use of it and learn the How To.

The "Definitive" thread on the How To redeem low level DL business class award is a must-read to those who complain DL miles are useless.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta-skymiles/1029634-definitive-how-search-low-tier-business-awards.html

There is also a dedicated thread in DL forum on which people reported their successful redemption of low level awards - some of them are amazing awards and they totally change my bias on DL miles.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta-skymiles/483860-award-ticket-success-post-here.html

You can always PM the posters whose posted awards interest you and most of them are very helpful to offer you the pointers on how to look for such.

I agree the program sucks in many other ways such as those you listed, but with efforts people still be able to redeem some very good awards.

Someone just posted in one of the threads on this Miles Buzz forum that DL has business class availability to SYD right in June.

Finally, although many folks dont like the latest scheme DL has on the award redemption (in $ value at 0.01 per mile) - this can become handy when you have to go somewhere but absolutely could not find low award availability yet you can buy down a coach ticket that is at a reasonable fare. I recently bumped at a couple on a cruise - they had use the cash value method to buy down their FCO to PBI in May, and then PBI to VCE in Nov. As we all know, award ticket originates from Europe costs extra several hundreds with DL program, but the coach ticket they bought was only $900 and they used the 1 penny per mile value to reduce it down to $400. Not a bad way to use their miles, especially they are willing to fly coach.

Booked a RT AGS-BUF last fall for Dec. travel on DL. It took 40,000 miles which I thought was way too much. No 25,000 were available. I had no problem booking it online though. I know most on here really don't like WN, but with my son going to school in Baltimore we use it a lot and have absolutely no problem booking, cancelling or changing flights-never ever.

Please continue discussion here:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/milesbuzz/1361246-results-frequent-flyer-program-award-redemption-satisfaction-survey.html