Help! I'm trying to create a last-minute itinerary for a relatively seasoned traveler going to Nottingham next week to move my things out of my old apartment. So, there are a few issues.
Baggage: On the way there, he doesn't want to check any bags -- at the most it would be one large almost-empty suitcase. On the way back, he'll have two large and heavy suitcases, so I want to make his return as easy and as painless as possible.
Return airport: We've found a few options from BHX and from MAN but they are either too early in the morning to get to the airport via public transportation or so late in the afternoon that he has a 23-hour layover in AMS. There is a slight possibility of getting a lift to the airport with a friend, but the friend happens to be unreachable at the moment. If we do end up finding a flight out of BHX or EMA but cannot get a lift from his friend, will he be able to make a 10-minute transfer on the coach or by rail?
Train to Nottingham: Should we bother buying a train ticket from here? Do we need a ticket AND a reservation? The last time I was on East Midlands Trains it was very hard to find an open and unreserved seat.
I almost feel like sending him back down through LCY outbound at this point but I know from horrible experience that it's no fun trying to schlep two huge suitcases on and off trains and tubes.
He has a place to stay in London and we assume he can stay with his so far unreachable friend in Nottingham, but if anyone knows of a decent place in Nottingham, and, say, some way to get to BHX or MAN at the crack of dawn, feel free to let me know.
Any suggestions are appreciated. I'm sure there's loads I've forgotten, so please be gentle.
alanR
May 4, 12, 12:24 am
If we do end up finding a flight out of BHX or EMA but cannot get a lift from his friend, will he be able to make a 10-minute transfer on the coach or by rail?Nottingham is at least an hour from BHX. I'd also look into flights from Manchester Airport as it has a train service from Nottingham into the airport or National Express coach service into Heathrow. You could also look at returning via Paris as KLM / AF are the same company. Or for Skyteam options. EMA tends to be low costs airlines so doesn't offer good connections for long haul. Is there a reason it *has* to be KLM? I would have thought one of the US airlines into London and either out of London or Manchester (AA has direct flights to both)
Train to Nottingham: Should we bother buying a train ticket from here? Do we need a ticket AND a reservation? The last time I was on East Midlands Trains it was very hard to find an open and unreserved seat. Look for the most expensive tickets. The more expensive the ticket, the more flexibility you'll get. Seat reservations when they are available are free so you should't be worried about them. But you don't have to have a seat reservation in order to board a train
Swiss Tony
May 4, 12, 1:09 am
There's a Novotel at Birmingham airport, right across from the terminal, and they sell rooms for just £50 or so (try top secret hotels on lastminute if the property direct is too expensive).
You can get a train from Nottingham to Birmingham New Street then a connection every 10 mins or so to Birmingham International (Airport).
mad_rich
May 4, 12, 1:25 am
Is he going to London because he wants to, or because that's the way the flights work out?
From EMA, there are triple-daily flights with BMI to BRU or FRA. These may well be disappearing or changing if the airline changes hands, but next week is safe! I think they're still offering connections on *A.
Certainly EMA is the closest airport for Nottingham, and I would treat your friend to a taxi if he can't get a lift to the airport. Failing that, there is a bus link to the city
In short, you might be able to get a single, inflexible ticket for London-Nottingham from around £10 - valid for one specific train & time only. A walk-up ticket is around £55 if your friend avoids peak trains or £75 if he goes during peak hours.
I very rarely bother with a seat reservation unless I know I'm travelling at a particularly busy time, though I don't know that route. Quite often reservations go unused, you can often take one of these seats if nobody's turned up to claim it.
big_mac
May 4, 12, 7:40 am
Look for the most expensive tickets. The more expensive the ticket, the more flexibility you'll get
This, in general, is not good advice.
It would be easy to end up with just an expensive but inflexible ticket - they DO sell inflexible tickets which cost more than the flexible tickets.
Megabus also sell cheap, inflexible, train tickets to Nottingham - but inflexible tickets are obviously of limited use if arriving on a flight.
If you don't know when you will travel, then there is no advantage to buying in advance. You could spend a lot of money on buying a ticket when a much cheaper ticket is suitable for you.
Getting to BHX or MAN by train will usually involve changing trains, and Birmingham New St isn't the easiest place to change with luggage.
There are direct coaches to MAN, but it takes a while.
Depending on the time of day/week, Gatwick may just be one change of train as well. You could then buy a return train ticket from London which would save some money, compared to two singles.
What is the '10-minute transfer' question about? From bus to train? train to airport?
Wally Bird
May 4, 12, 8:04 am
Birmingham New St isn't the easiest place to change with luggage.
There are direct coaches to MAN, but it takes a while.
Depending on the time of day/week, Gatwick may just be one change of train as well. You could then buy a return train ticket from London which would save some money, compared to two singles.New Street isn't that bad; it's a gloomy, depressing place but they do have lifts(elevators).
Anyway, assuming he's going via AMS then the least painful way is to fly to LGW and buy a return train ticket to Nottingham. Just one change at St. Pancras. LCY is awful to get to/from anywhere except the City.
Swiss Tony
May 4, 12, 8:40 am
New Street isn't that bad; it's a gloomy, depressing place but they do have lifts(elevators).
Anyway, assuming he's going via AMS then the least painful way is to fly to LGW and buy a return train ticket to Nottingham. Just one change at St. Pancras. LCY is awful to get to/from anywhere except the City.
But I don' think KLM fly from LGW to AMS any more.
New Street has a bad reputation but as noted there are lifts. Alternatively you can get a coach direct from Nottingham to Heathrow - takes just over 3hrs. Luggage policy is 2 cases up to 20kgs each, plus a smaller item. http://www.nationalexpress.com/coach/ourservice/luggage_policy.aspx
emidano
May 4, 12, 9:58 am
I'm replying to everyone in one giant post. Sorry.
Nottingham is at least an hour from BHX. I'd also look into flights from Manchester Airport as it has a train service from Nottingham into the airport or National Express coach service into Heathrow. You could also look at returning via Paris as KLM / AF are the same company. Or for Skyteam options. EMA tends to be low costs airlines so doesn't offer good connections for long haul. Is there a reason it *has* to be KLM? I would have thought one of the US airlines into London and either out of London or Manchester (AA has direct flights to both)
Look for the most expensive tickets. The more expensive the ticket, the more flexibility you'll get. Seat reservations when they are available are free so you should't be worried about them. But you don't have to have a seat reservation in order to board a train
Well, that explains why I've never been through EMA. The problem is that the flights I'm finding from MAN and BHX are at, say, 10:00 am at the latest and the first train or coach from Nottingham doesn't get to either airport until, say, 8:00 am. With the heavy bags it takes a little more time to get from the door to the gate, and the airport website says to be there three hours ahead of time. It doesn't *have* to be KLM but that is mostly what I'm finding now.
I know you don't need a seat reservation in order to *board* a train, and I know that they don't cost anything, but I do remember not being able to actually *sit down* on that train once for quite some time because everything was either taken or reserved, so it's something I've wondered about. It only happened that one time, but it was pretty awful.
There's a Novotel at Birmingham airport, right across from the terminal, and they sell rooms for just £50 or so (try top secret hotels on lastminute if the property direct is too expensive).
You can get a train from Nottingham to Birmingham New Street then a connection every 10 mins or so to Birmingham International (Airport).
Awesome and awesome. I did not know either of these things. Thank you. Even if the train doesn't make it early enough, it's good to know that he won't be arrested for vagrancy!
Is he going to London because he wants to, or because that's the way the flights work out?
From EMA, there are triple-daily flights with BMI to BRU or FRA. These may well be disappearing or changing if the airline changes hands, but next week is safe! I think they're still offering connections on *A.
Certainly EMA is the closest airport for Nottingham, and I would treat your friend to a taxi if he can't get a lift to the airport. Failing that, there is a bus link to the city
In short, you might be able to get a single, inflexible ticket for London-Nottingham from around £10 - valid for one specific train & time only. A walk-up ticket is around £55 if your friend avoids peak trains or £75 if he goes during peak hours.
I very rarely bother with a seat reservation unless I know I'm travelling at a particularly busy time, though I don't know that route. Quite often reservations go unused, you can often take one of these seats if nobody's turned up to claim it.
He is going to London to hang out with a couple of old friends who live there for a day or two before going up north.
I did find a train ticket St Pancras-Nottingham for £17, so we might do that. When I lived there I never paid less than £45 and only bothered to get a reservation once, I think.
This, in general, is not good advice.
It would be easy to end up with just an expensive but inflexible ticket - they DO sell inflexible tickets which cost more than the flexible tickets.
Megabus also sell cheap, inflexible, train tickets to Nottingham - but inflexible tickets are obviously of limited use if arriving on a flight.
If you don't know when you will travel, then there is no advantage to buying in advance. You could spend a lot of money on buying a ticket when a much cheaper ticket is suitable for you.
Getting to BHX or MAN by train will usually involve changing trains, and Birmingham New St isn't the easiest place to change with luggage.
There are direct coaches to MAN, but it takes a while.
Depending on the time of day/week, Gatwick may just be one change of train as well. You could then buy a return train ticket from London which would save some money, compared to two singles.
What is the '10-minute transfer' question about? From bus to train? train to airport?
The 10-minute transfer would be from coach to coach or train to train on the way to the airport, and I meant with the luggage. Anyone could make it with one small bag, but he's not going to be moving fast.
The £17 train ticket I mentioned above was on the Megabus site, I think. He will be in London for a day or two, so he can plan in advance.
New Street isn't that bad; it's a gloomy, depressing place but they do have lifts(elevators).
Anyway, assuming he's going via AMS then the least painful way is to fly to LGW and buy a return train ticket to Nottingham. Just one change at St. Pancras. LCY is awful to get to/from anywhere except the City.
He's meeting his friends in the City when he arrives. And here's something that surprised me: it turns out to be cheaper and quicker to fly into LCY than to fly into anywhere else and then try to get into the City.
But I don' think KLM fly from LGW to AMS any more.
New Street has a bad reputation but as noted there are lifts. Alternatively you can get a coach direct from Nottingham to Heathrow - takes just over 3hrs. Luggage policy is 2 cases up to 20kgs each, plus a smaller item. http://www.nationalexpress.com/coach/ourservice/luggage_policy.aspx
Everyone, thank you so very much for the kind advice. Keep it coming, and let me know if I can explain the situation any better. I apologize if I'm not making sense entirely, but I've been studying these badly-designed flight-finder sites and the rail sites which are almost as bad and on the phone with airlines and trying to connect with people in Nottingham for a couple of days now. I've read lots of information on lots of sites, but I needed real human beings to tell me the things you are telling me and it is a great help.
Wally Bird
May 4, 12, 10:18 am
I apologize if I'm not making sense entirely, but I've been studying these badly-designed flight-finder sites and the rail sites which are almost as badFor planning purposes http://www.eskyguide.com/ and http://ojp.nationalrail.co.uk/service/planjourney/search are accurate and intuitive. No good for fares though.
emidano
May 4, 12, 3:13 pm
For planning purposes http://www.eskyguide.com/ and http://ojp.nationalrail.co.uk/service/planjourney/search are accurate and intuitive. No good for fares though.
Thanks -- I've used the second one before but wasn't aware of the first one.
NewbieRunner
May 4, 12, 3:40 pm
The problem is that the flights I'm finding from MAN and BHX are at, say, 10:00 am at the latest and the first train or coach from Nottingham doesn't get to either airport until, say, 8:00 am. With the heavy bags it takes a little more time to get from the door to the gate, and the airport website says to be there three hours ahead of time.
I don't know where you saw you have to be at the airport three hours ahead of time. For European shorthaul flights the minimum check-in time at MAN is (for the airlines I regularly fly) 30 minutes. I usually try to check-in one hour before departure. Even for longhaul flights two hours should be more than enough.
stifle
May 4, 12, 3:46 pm
I don't know where you saw you have to be at the airport three hours ahead of time. For European shorthaul flights the minimum check-in time at MAN is (for the airlines I regularly fly) 30 minutes. I usually try to check-in one hour before departure. Even for longhaul flights two hours should be more than enough.
He already said it was the airport's website. It can safely be ignored.
NewbieRunner
May 4, 12, 3:51 pm
He already said it was the airport's website. It can safely be ignored.
I do visit Manchester Airport's website frequently but have never come across such a statement. Hence the question.
big_mac
May 4, 12, 4:25 pm
I find eastcoast.co.uk a lot easier to look up train times than National Rail's website.
10 minutes to change trains should be fine, although maybe a little tight at New St. But there will be another train along in 10 minutes anyway, so it doesn't really matter.
AFAIK you can't get a reservation with a megabus train ticket, but they only sell them on the quietest trains anyway.
http://www.manchesterairport.co.uk/manweb.nsf/Content/FAQs?OpenDocument&QUERY=Travel#FAQHowLongBeforeCheckIn
our general guide is:
Long-haul flights - check in 3 hours prior to departure
NewbieRunner
May 4, 12, 5:11 pm
our general guide is:
Long-haul flights - check in 3 hours prior to departure
Ah... that's why T1 is always full of people sitting around and looking bored having checked in 3 hours before departure. There's so much time one can spend in the shopping mall airport departure lounge without spending all their holiday money even before the holiday has started. :rolleyes:
emidano
May 4, 12, 5:24 pm
I find eastcoast.co.uk a lot easier to look up train times than National Rail's website.
10 minutes to change trains should be fine, although maybe a little tight at New St. But there will be another train along in 10 minutes anyway, so it doesn't really matter.
AFAIK you can't get a reservation with a megabus train ticket, but they only sell them on the quietest trains anyway.
Ah... that's why T1 is always full of people sitting around and looking bored having checked in 3 hours before departure. There's so much time one can spend in the shopping mall airport departure lounge without spending all their holiday money even before the holiday has started. :rolleyes: