San Francisco - Homeless situation in San Francisco

I am finishing a one week trip to San Francisco. I stayed at the W Hotel on 3rd and Howard. I am appalled at the amount of Homeless and beggars there are on the streets. I have traveled to San Francisco many times in the past and it seems there are more than ever.

I am a big beliver in not giving these individuals and pocket money. You are not helping them and they do not get off the street by giving them money. The City spends millions of dollars in Services. I remember last year they passed the Sit and Lie ordinance but it appears they are not enforcing it.

I mentioned this to the Hotel and they know it is a on going problem and issue. All I can say is, please do not give these individuals and pocket change whether you are in San Francisco, Miami or Beijing.

I am finishing a one week trip to San Francisco. I stayed at the W Hotel on 3rd and Howard. I am appalled at the amount of Homeless and beggars there are on the streets. I have traveled to San Francisco many times in the past and it seems there are more than ever.

I am a big beliver in not giving these individuals and pocket money. You are not helping them and they do not get off the street by giving them money. The City spends millions of dollars in Services. I remember last year they passed the Sit and Lie ordinance but it appears they are not enforcing it.

I mentioned this to the Hotel and they know it is a on going problem and issue. All I can say is, please do not give these individuals and pocket change whether you are in San Francisco, Miami or Beijing.

:rolleyes:

In general, I do NOT give money to panhandlers.

However, I really think that this is a matter of individual conscience, and I find your post very offensive for trying to DICTATE what others should or should not do. :td:

I live around Fisherman's Wharf and never gave them anything, except for one old man who literally lives on Taylor Street between North Point and Beach, I always feel sad for him and give him something other than cash like food or drinks.

As a tourist I'm sure it's frustrating. As a local it has stymied every mayor/board of supervisors since forever. Give money or don't, individual choices don't contribute to or solve the problem so feel free to choose whatever makes you happy.

My general rule as a local is that I will give $$ to the few homeless people I know int he neighborhoods, those who are pretty damaged from mental illness not drugs or alcohol. But those folks know me a little, and are happy when I buy them food or coffee rather than $$

However, I really think that this is a matter of individual conscience, and I find your post very offensive for trying to DICTATE what others should or should not do. :td:

FWIW, I do not interpret the OP as trying to dictate anything, nor do I find his or her post offensive. I read it just as a polite request, if anything. I agree that it is a personal decision. Just my $0.02.

:rolleyes:

In general, I do NOT give money to panhandlers.

However, I really think that this is a matter of individual conscience, and I find your post very offensive for trying to DICTATE what others should or should not do. :td:

This is my opinion and I did not express it in any other way. I assume your an adult and know how to make your own decisions. Just like it is your opinion that it is offensive and it is your opinion that I am DICTATING.

I travel quite frequently around the World and whether it is London, Dubai or Shangahi, there are goning to be I dividuals who request money. But, when I take a walk from my Hotel and come across no less than a dozen individuals, I see an issue. When the concierge at my Hotel politely tells me that there are various programs in the City and it would not benefit any individual by giving them money, I take it to heart.

End result, I will most likely stay outside the City on my next visit. I know a few might say, " good, we don't need you", but I am living in a City of 19 million people and I have a lot of friends and business contatcts. I am sure a few might ask how my trip to San Francisco was. It all ads up.

The homeless situation here is worse than other places. I've lived here for over 30 years and it's not pleasant. However thousands of people stay here on vacation and enjoy themselves in spite of these issues.

Part of the increase (and I don't want to go OMNI here) has to do with the economy in general. Folks who were living marginally in SRO's or cheap Tenderloin apartments are getting squeezed out. So when you add all those folks to the "stable" homeless who've always been here, it adds up.

I live in the bay area. In the past, my family frequent the city (SF) to go to restaurants, the symphony etc.. Most times stayed over for the weekends. Also stayed at the W & St Regis. In the past 3 years, we cut that way back. Reason stated in the OP.

I don't sense the OP DICTATES anything. Instead he/she said "please ...."

The begging situation is getting worse in Palo Alto too, although it's not nearly as bad as SF. In Palo Alto, the sit/lie restriction is sometimes enforced. The interesting thing is that these folks are not found in every upscale shopping district -- I've never seen them in Los Altos or on California Avenue in Palo Alto, for example -- so there must be differences due to local law enforcement practices.

keeping the discussion to homeless issues in SF/Bay area..thx

squeakr

mod SFO

deleted quote of deleted post
Our weather keeps them here, too. Neither the winter nor the summer is likely to kill anyone.

I was in SFO last week and found the number of visible homeless people there to be the highest of all the places I visited (+ NYC/Chicago/Boston/Philadelphia/ Las Vegas and Seattle).

They were also the most aggressive. I accidentally ventured into the Tenderloin area after dark and once realising that it was not an area I should be in walked out briskly.

The solution? I really don't know and suggest it would probably need to be a national program to avoid shifting the 'problem' elsewhere.

I saw this story on the net the other day. Property owners are getting creative with the way they wish to keep homeless people off their property.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/02/bill-graham-civic-homeless_n_1472755.html?ref=san-francisco


On a side note, it amazes me that San Francisco has a general budget of almost 7 billion US dollars per year. The City is not that big and I would think with that type of money, more can be done to house the homeless population. I am probably missing something and there is a good explanation.

End result, I will most likely stay outside the City on my next visit. I know a few might say, " good, we don't need you", but I am living in a City of 19 million people and I have a lot of friends and business contatcts. I am sure a few might ask how my trip to San Francisco was. It all ads up.

Yes, we have a homeless problem in the city ... and are trying to fix it.

Tourism is doing just fine and we're expecting (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2012/04/30/MN0A1OB523.DTL) a great summer, btw.

Hotel reservations have been coming in at a rapid pace. Tee times at golf courses are selling out, and San Francisco bay cruises are booking up.

Yes, we have a homeless problem in the city ... and are trying to fix it.

Tourism is doing just fine and we're expecting (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2012/04/30/MN0A1OB523.DTL) a great summer, btw.

Thanks for the link, did you pick up on one of the responses at the bottom of the article.

I have no doubt the tourism industry is flourishing in San Francisco. I paid $350 a night at the W Hotel and that was the cheapest in the area. SFO is projected to have its best year since 2000. San Francisco is a great City architecturally and culturally.

My point is, what percentage of those people visiting the City will return in the future after experiencing the homeless situation? A friend of mine, whom I have not talked to in a while, reads the posts on flyer talk and called me the other day. He said that he heard I was in San Francisco recently and read a post about " homelessness" in SF. He read with intereest the replies and was concerned about brining his family to the City for a holiday. My only response was, my business trip went well and San Francisco is not the only City in the World with a homeless problem. But, after the conversation finished, I gotnthe feeling he would not be bringing his family to SF.

I am sure I will be getting a phone call shortly after he reads this. :p

Today in the food court at the Westfield mall on Market St, there was a woman begging from the diners at the tables. Sigh, a first for me.

The other contributor is the teardown of the transbay terminal (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/02/11/MNO81HL3B3.DTL&ao=all) and subsequent construction - there was hundreds that lived there and around/under the overpass.

My SOMA workplace has a semi-permanent group from the overpass that now camps out at our back door so it smells like urine. Our facilities blast the doorway with soap every morning but it's still nasty as they haven't be as through lately as I'm sure they're sick of doing it.

And there was a push to kick the homeless out of Golden Gate Park which put a ton into residential areas. Oh and almost forgot, the Occupy movement - that attracted a bunch of homeless to the Embaracdero/FiDi area.

The homeless problem is also compounded by the reputation of being a homeless haven because law enforcement can be lax on non violent offences, other cities even gave greyhound tickets to their homeless to come to SF. The fact it is a tourist destination gives the homeless another reason to stay as it can be quite lucractive (one story I read a while back was some college kids doing it and there are retired folks who also beg for money to supplememnt their income). And yes, the mild weather doesn't do anthing to push them away like NY with its winters.

The SF Chronicle many feature articles about the issue (Estimated in 2003 (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2003/12/04/MNG2S3FJ6M1.DTL&ao=5)- just under $500 million to fix the housing problem so tourists won't see them all the time but not including costs for fixing the underlying mental, drug and alcohol problems): http://www.sfgate.com/homeless/

As a New Yorker, it takes a lot, and I mean a LOT to make me feel uncomfortable and sadly SF has gotten that way on multiple occasions. The constant panhandling along Powell, in BART and MUNI stations is one thing, and horrible in it's own right, but to have to step over 4 bodies to use an ATM on Market at 11 PM is insane. All of my coworkers have said they love SF, but they won't be back due to the homeless situation. The city needs a Giuliani, one who will crack down on quality of life issues and deal with the homeless population. I have no idea what he did with them in New York, but since he was in office, I've had no issues.

I found it interesting that Channel 4 ran a piece that found homeless living IN concrete overpasses of 280, etc.

As a New Yorker, it takes a lot, and I mean a LOT to make me feel uncomfortable and sadly SF has gotten that way on multiple occasions. The constant panhandling along Powell, in BART and MUNI stations is one thing, and horrible in it's own right, but to have to step over 4 bodies to use an ATM on Market at 11 PM is insane. All of my coworkers have said they love SF, but they won't be back due to the homeless situation. The city needs a Giuliani, one who will crack down on quality of life issues and deal with the homeless population. I have no idea what he did with them in New York, but since he was in office, I've had no issues.

I found it interesting that Channel 4 ran a piece that found homeless living IN concrete overpasses of 280, etc.

They don't need "a" Guiliani, they need "the" Guiliani to move to SF and fix it.

I'm on the fence....clearly it's an issue people feel strongly about, but it's moving into more political territory than just posters relating their experiences. Once the posts start moving into political solutions I think it's not going to be so appropriate for the SFO forum.

But I'm not convinced. Let's see how it goes and it it continues w/ respectful disagreement I'm fine w/ that.

Keep in mind - I have lived here 30 years and have seen every type of solution proposed. Wat we can't get around here is that the weather is almost balmy year round. NY, Boston, Chicago all have the "luxury" that homeless people HAVE to be indoors during the winter, so they leave or use the shelters.
Here in SF it's not so easy. Homeless people don't get $$ anymore, but it's way easier to maintain here year round. So there are no easy answers like "find a Giuliani."

I'm curious, though, it's constantly foggy/misty. I'd think it is miserable to be wet/damp on the streets day in and day out. I'd think LA and SD would be far more hospitable weather wise. Makes me feel like there's something extra there.

I'm curious, though, it's constantly foggy/misty. I'd think it is miserable to be wet/damp on the streets day in and day out. I'd think LA and SD would be far more hospitable weather wise. Makes me feel like there's something extra there.

The difference is that San Francisco pays the homeless to be there.

Take a look at http://www.sfhsa.org/171.htm

Just posting a link to what's available is very misleading. To actually get CASH, you have to either register for work and be EMPLOYABLE or work sweeping the streets. The homeless you see begging do neither and do not get cash FROM THE CITY.

If a person once worked and is now disabled, or never worked and is permanently disabled, they are eligible for FEDERAL benefits through SSI or Soc Sec. THAT's the income many homeless people receive, and because of our weather, recipients can stretch that $$$ further than a place like Chicago or NY.

If you REALLY want to complain, complain to the Feds who made drug and alcohol addiction a disability.

END of OMNI rant.

I have lived in SF for 2 years now, and I find the situation to be frustrating, because it feels like there is no one trying to fix the problem -- I feel that the city just looks the other way, or is too cowardly to come up with policies that do something.

In my mind (and would love if someone explained any misunderstanding I have), there are two types of homeless:

1) "Legitimately" homeless who are families, workers who have fallen on unemployment, etc, who can be helped with assistance, and fully deserve to be. These are the ones you don't see -- who need and benefit from help.

2) And then there are the homeless who are nothing but a drain on society. The kind at Polk and O'Farrell -- pissing on street corners, dealing drugs, making these areas no-go for anyone else. Even on Market Street, right outside major Bart stations -- sleeping it off right at the stairs. And the flophouse owners / rent policies that make it impossible to clean out these areas by gentrification.

Am I wrong in my understanding here? Is the problem because SF is so concerned and ineffective in designing policies to help population #1 that they have to help #2 as well?

Can we not separate somehow the effect of policies so that SF doesn't actively attract homeless of type #2?

Anyway, it's frustrating to walk home every day and see this...

We went over spring break and were very uncomfortable with our 10/13 year old girls walking down Market a few blocks just after dusk to see a show at the Orpheum. And when the show exited at 11 pm- I wanted to get the heck out of there ASAP. Overall we had a pleasant trip but it makes me think about going back again with the girls anytime soon and we take them all over the place, so we aren't super-over-protective parents.

the topic is the homeless situation in SF. We all have perspectives on it, but don't bait each other, OK>

thx

squeakr

Mod SFO

The difference is that San Francisco pays the homeless to be there.

Take a look at http://www.sfhsa.org/171.htm

Yup.

When Mayor Newsome was in Office, he rolled out the Care not Cash program. This basically cut in half the amount of money given to the destitute. A couple of years ago, The City had a program where they would buy a bus (?) ticket,for someone who was not from San Francisco, to a relative as long as the relative agrees to take them in. The City spends millions on various programs and the public hospitals are filled with indigents who take up space in the emergency rooms.

San Francisco has always been know to be a carrying and liberal City but as a visitor, I just shake my head at the lack of progress in dealing with the homeless problem. Just like it is difficult to find a San Franciscan who was born and raised in the city and still lives there, I wonder what percentage of the people who live on the streets are from San Francisco? I would say it is quite low.

I would say that the weather is a very small percentage. The summers can be quite cool. But, as stated, it is better than a winter on the East Coast. I would also say that the main reason most people come to San Francisco is because they know they can get away with it. San francisco's main industry is tourism and they know the tourists will give them money.

the thread has moved form personal experiences to half-truths and a political discussion that the more I read, the more I'm convinced it has no place here. For those who are OMNI-enabled feel free to begin a discussion in OMNI-PR. However I'm closing this thread as it's veering far off people 's experiences with the homeless here