Thailand - Prime Minster Orders All Budget Carriers to Fly Out of Don Meuang / Don Muang (DMK)

Too early to tell what this means in full...other than to say it looks like an ill-advised reaction to the immigration delays?

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/business/Budget-air-to-fly-from-Don-Mueang-30178092.html

AIR TRAFFIC
Budget air to fly from Don Mueang
Watcharapong Thongrung
Bamrung Amnartchareonrit
The Nation March 16, 2012 1:00 am

Govt decision prompted by mounting chaos and congestion at Suvarnabhumi

Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra has ordered that all low-cost airlines move to Don Mueang Airport to improve air and runway traffic at Suvarnabhumi, but the plan is unlikely to ease the current turmoil frustrating countless travellers.

The shift of low-cost carriers to Don Mueang was announced by Deputy Prime Minister and Tourism and Sports Minister Chumpol Silapa-archa yesterday in response to a growing outcry from departing Suvarnabhumi passengers, many of whom have missed flights or suffered close calls.

People familiar with the problem doubt whether the long-planned move of low-cost services to Don Mueang will ease the current crisis at Suvarnabhumi, where renovation work has cut the capacity of immigration checkpoints by two-thirds.

Officials contacted by The Nation yesterday could not say for certain when the renovation work would be completed.

Chumpol admitted that the current problem of passenger congestion stemmed from the fact that only one of Suvarnabhumi's three immigration gates was operating. International passengers are now being advised to arrive at the airport at least three hours before their flight leaves, rather than the standard two hours.

Chumpol said news of the passenger bottleneck only reached him on Wednesday. He said he could not get involved with the problem but gave assurances that the transfer of low-cost airlines to Don Mueang Airport would help reduce the congestion.

My better half alerted me to this yesterday but the Bangkok Post gave me the impression that the gov would find ways to entice the LCCs over to DMK.

I love this:

Chumpol said news of the passenger bottleneck only reached him on Wednesday. He said he could not get involved with the problem but gave assurances that the transfer of low-cost airlines to Don Mueang Airport would help reduce the congestion.

So he's blind initially. He can't get involved but then he's the one given the task to announce the move. Finally this will fix the problem with no time frame associated.

I wonder how soon. Not exactly easy to get from one to the other. It should encourage stopovers in Bangkok and increase biz for TG. The move will funnel 17-18 million away from Swampy. LINK:http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/transport/284556/single-airport-policy-ends

MCT between the two is 180 min. Hopefully the powers that be will add bus/shuttle service between the two.

There's a thread about this in the Thailand forum http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/thailand/1325379-prime-minster-orders-all-budget-carriers-fly-out-don-meuang-dmk.html which might be a better place to continue the conversation.

I wonder how they will decide who is a LCC.

So I was reading the thread over on ThaiVisa about this, but you know how those threads always turn out.

This is what I understand:
OK so apparently there is a big problem recently with long queues / wait times for immigration at Suvarnabhumi (BKK). I think I've read somewhere that part of the airport is actually shut down forcing everybody to go through a certain area? (not sure about that). Anyways, I don't think they have any more international arrivals/departures than normal, right? So to me it sounds like a staffing issue. I've read somewhere that they are having problems keeping the immigration booths staffed. So they bring in 70 female riot police to help keep order. Now to help ease congestion they are going to move whole airlines over to the newly re-opened (because it was flooded) DMK.

This is what I don't understand:
They are going to run into the same problem, staffing. If they can't fully staff BKK then how can they move workers over to DMK? It was my understanding that DMK was fully domestic before this announcement, so there wouldn't be any immigration workers at DMK currently (well maybe 1 or 2 just in case).

Please somebody correct me if I am wrong!!!

If I was planning to visit Thailand in the near future, I think I would just fly in/out of Chiang Mai or Phuket. That's what I did when Suvarnabhumi first opened.

DMK handled international flights previously so there is an int terminal and dom terminal. How they would potentially handle it now is a good question.

I'm also curious where they'll find immi agents when they don't seem to have sufficient ones now. Will they take agents from the BKK and move them to DMK?

DMK handled international flights previously so there is an int terminal and dom terminal. How they would potentially handle it now is a good question.

I'm also curious where they'll find immi agents when they don't seem to have sufficient ones now. Will they take agents from the BKK and move them to DMK?

Yes, DMK has the facilities for international flights, but I believe it was fully domestic flights for the last 4 years or so.

Personally this seems like a HUGE cluster funk, or some sort of power play to move airlines around. Also, personally, I don't mind having flights moved to DMK. To me the only downside is that you have to pay for a taxi ride. I have only ever transited through Bangkok once (before Suvarnabhumi was open), since there are so many other flight options in Asia.


If they are truly moving low cost carriers, I would assume Air Asia is getting the boot to DMK. I could see some people in remote areas getting upset because they would have to fly into DMK, take a bus to BKK and then fly to Europe/N.America. However, this happens all over the world currently, so the only reason to complain is because it used to not be like this.
Air Asia Examples: Penang to Chicago, Udon to Amsterdam, Chiang Rai to Tokyo, Yangon to Los Angeles.

I wonder how they will decide who is a LCC.

The article mentions Bangkok Airways along with Air Asia and Orient Thai as LCC's. I would hate to see Bangkok Airways moved out of BKK...there are not a LCC.

However, I would love to see Air Asia, Orient Thai, Nok Air and others moved to DMK.

So I was reading the thread over on ThaiVisa about this, but you know how those threads always turn out.

This is what I understand:
OK so apparently there is a big problem recently with long queues / wait times for immigration at Suvarnabhumi (BKK). I think I've read somewhere that part of the airport is actually shut down forcing everybody to go through a certain area? (not sure about that). Anyways, I don't think they have any more international arrivals/departures than normal, right? So to me it sounds like a staffing issue. I've read somewhere that they are having problems keeping the immigration booths staffed. So they bring in 70 female riot police to help keep order. Now to help ease congestion they are going to move whole airlines over to the newly re-opened (because it was flooded) DMK.

This is what I don't understand:
They are going to run into the same problem, staffing. If they can't fully staff BKK then how can they move workers over to DMK? It was my understanding that DMK was fully domestic before this announcement, so there wouldn't be any immigration workers at DMK currently (well maybe 1 or 2 just in case).

Please somebody correct me if I am wrong!!!

If I was planning to visit Thailand in the near future, I think I would just fly in/out of Chiang Mai or Phuket. That's what I did when Suvarnabhumi first opened.
As usual in Thailand were hearing different things from different Gov officials. You hear under staffing is the problem and they throw untrained police at it. You hear BKK is overcrowded so they want to move LCCs to DMK. Here's a typical unclear quote from the Transportation Minister - ""I don't want to say we are adopting a dual-airport policy. But for the long term, we must put Don Mueang to use". No 2 airport policy but we have to use DMK long term. Huh ? Then the real problem starts coming to light, I read that 2/3 of the immigration checkpoints are closed for renovation (during what is still High Season) - "People familiar with the problem doubt whether the long-planned move of low-cost services to Don Mueang will ease the current crisis at Suvarnabhumi, where renovation work has cut the capacity of immigration checkpoints by two-thirds" "Officials contacted by The Nation yesterday could not say for certain when the renovation work would be completed."
The idiots closed 67% of immigration capacity during a busy time of the year.
"Chumpol admitted that the current problem of passenger congestion stemmed from the fact that only one of Suvarnabhumi's three immigration gates was operating"- the Nation. This is a quote from the CEO of Thai Air Asia - "The congestion at Suvarnabhumi was due to mismanagement of the airport. Despite its great size, it can handle fewer passengers than Singapore's Changi or Hong Kong's Chek Lap Kok, which are smaller".
"Also, the airport has 10 inactive hours a day that could accommodate takeoffs and landings." - the Nation.
So, just like most f*ck ups in Thailand, IMHO the problem stems from inept government management. wj

Mods, delete please.

Thanks wj. So 2/3 of immigration booths are closed for renovation. Okay fine. From passenger accounts that I have read online the remaining booths are not fully staffed. What happened to all the immigration workers? Every single immigration booth should be staffed if 2/3 of them are closed.

What am I missing here? Just because part of a work area closes doesn't mean all the workers get to go home, right?


BTW, the pictures of the queues that I have seen are mind boggling!!!

The article mentions Bangkok Airways along with Air Asia and Orient Thai as LCC's. I would hate to see Bangkok Airways moved out of BKK...there are not a LCC.

However, I would love to see Air Asia, Orient Thai, Nok Air and others moved to DMK.

I'm with you 100%. If PG is kicked to over to DMK it's going to complicate my travel tremendously.

As usual in Thailand were hearing different things from different Gov officials. You hear under staffing is the problem and they throw untrained police at it. You hear BKK is overcrowded so they want to move LCCs to DMK. Here's a typical unclear quote from the Transportation Minister - ""I don't want to say we are adopting a dual-airport policy. But for the long term, we must put Don Mueang to use". No 2 airport policy but we have to use DMK long term. Huh ? Then the real problem starts coming to light, I read that 2/3 of the immigration checkpoints are closed for renovation (during what is still High Season) - "People familiar with the problem doubt whether the long-planned move of low-cost services to Don Mueang will ease the current crisis at Suvarnabhumi, where renovation work has cut the capacity of immigration checkpoints by two-thirds" "Officials contacted by The Nation yesterday could not say for certain when the renovation work would be completed."
The idiots closed 67% of immigration capacity during a busy time of the year.
"Chumpol admitted that the current problem of passenger congestion stemmed from the fact that only one of Suvarnabhumi's three immigration gates was operating"- the Nation. This is a quote from the CEO of Thai Air Asia - "The congestion at Suvarnabhumi was due to mismanagement of the airport. Despite its great size, it can handle fewer passengers than Singapore's Changi or Hong Kong's Chek Lap Kok, which are smaller".
"Also, the airport has 10 inactive hours a day that could accommodate takeoffs and landings." - the Nation.
So, just like most f*ck ups in Thailand, IMHO the problem stems from inept government management. wj

I first noticed the construction in May and posted in this thread. It's not like they just started to work on the area in November. Even with the early start, and aware of the troubles they had last year, work wasn't completely quickly. No doubt the longer this drags on the more money going in someone's pocket.

I'm aghast this is being considered now when it will do nothing to ameliorate the situation. how quickly can these airlines move over to DMK? No way it can be done before May/June... which is after tourist season.

In my opinion the construction between the pre-existing east and west immigration halls is not the root cause of the delays, as total number of desks in each hall look the same to me, and the construction is occurring between the halls.

Reading between the lines it looks like there are staffing issues, perhaps for a variety of reasons, which may be best left unsaid in a public forum. This has happened before, and is somewhat 'seasonal'.

Vested interests have a continuing desire to generate rents from the DMK property, and are constantly lobbying the government(s) for traffic, 'nuff said on that one too. I don't know why they don't just develop the property as they'd make a lot more money.

It seems like only yesterday DMK was completely flooded with well over 1 M of water; hopefully that won't happen again.

As queues grow, airport debate rages
Watcharapong Thongrung
The Nation March 19, 2012 1:00 am

Congestion at Suvarnabhumi airport is due to overload passengers surpassing its capacity and temporary closure of an immigration gate.
Bangkok's "single" airport controversy has returned to haunt all participants in the travel sector, especially air passengers who are most likely to suffer from rising congestion at Suvarnabhumi Airport.

Should the government opt for a single or dual international airports (with a second at Don Mueang), and who would benefit the most from each of these approaches? These are now the big questions facing the government.

The heavy passenger congestion at Suvarnabhumi was the talk of the town last week as passengers took more than three hours to get through the departure procedure. Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra said the government would move all low-cost flight services from Suvarnabhumi to Don Mueang, citing Deputy Prime Minister and Tourism and Sports Minister Chumpol Silapa-archa.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/business/As-queues-grow-airport-debate-rages-30178235.html

A new week, a new conflicting news article. "Bangkok's "single" airport controversy." I see they forgot about the floods already.

Actually I think the next paragraph is the most important.

"Yingluck and Transport Minister Chatchart Sithipan both want to move all low-cost flight services to Don Mueang in a bid to ease the load at Suvarnabhumi, which now handles 47 million or 48 million passengers a year, surpassing its capacity of 45 million. To achieve the goal, the government will offer tax incentives on landing, parking bay and other fees."

Doesn't that basically say it all? The new airport is already full to capacity.

The article mentions Bangkok Airways along with Air Asia and Orient Thai as LCC's. I would hate to see Bangkok Airways moved out of BKK...there are not a LCC.

However, I would love to see Air Asia, Orient Thai, Nok Air and others moved to DMK.

There's no way I would define Bangkok Airways as "low cost". Just look at their prices to Koh Samui!

I don't really care too much about the other airlines but I'd hate to see Air Asia move out.

I can't imagine they would force PG to move, since that would leave BKK with insufficient connections to Samui, and no connections to Male, Luang Prabang, etc...

And furthermore, PG is not a LCC, it's fares are competitive with TG.

I can't imagine they would force PG to move, since that would leave BKK with insufficient connections to Samui, and no connections to Male, Luang Prabang, etc...

And furthermore, PG is not a LCC, it's fares are competitive with TG.

I don't imagine they're going to 'force' anyone to move. There might be incentives for a handful of airlines to transition over to DMK but my guess is at some point the cost to the gov will overcome the money that can be pocketed and this entire idea will flounder.

Many of you already know the simple and relatively cheap solution to this mess: Hire more immi staff.

Actually I think the next paragraph is the most important.

"Yingluck and Transport Minister Chatchart Sithipan both want to move all low-cost flight services to Don Mueang in a bid to ease the load at Suvarnabhumi, which now handles 47 million or 48 million passengers a year, surpassing its capacity of 45 million. To achieve the goal, the government will offer tax incentives on landing, parking bay and other fees."

Doesn't that basically say it all? The new airport is already full to capacity.

OK, don't have access to figures that would support or refute that, but BKK is not a busy airport by aircraft (though I concede that they probably handle more big birds due to tourist coming on long flights).

There's no way I would define Bangkok Airways as "low cost". Just look at their prices to Koh Samui!

I don't really care too much about the other airlines but I'd hate to see Air Asia move out.

Bangkok Airways is "boutique airline" to quote their web site. I don't think it should be referred to as LCC.

Many of you already know the simple and relatively cheap solution to this mess: Hire more immi staff.

DING, DING, DING, we have a winner (though others have posted same on previous page).

But TiT :rolleyes:

EmailKid

There's no way I would define Bangkok Airways as "low cost". Just look at their prices to Koh Samui!

I don't really care too much about the other airlines but I'd hate to see Air Asia move out.

I assumed the Bangkok airways decision was politically motivated. I have no idea who owns it though.

Does it really matter where Air Asia ends up? I would only see this being an issue if you lived in Bang Na, Samut Prakan, near the Airport Link or somewhere else close to Suvarnabhumi. I believe that if Air Asia ended up at DMK that there would be better service since it would be less crowded.

I assumed the Bangkok airways decision was politically motivated. I have no idea who owns it though.

Does it really matter where Air Asia ends up? I would only see this being an issue if you lived in Bang Na, Samut Prakan, near the Airport Link or somewhere else close to Suvarnabhumi. I believe that if Air Asia ended up at DMK that there would be better service since it would be less crowded.

PG is privately owned, along with the airports in Trat, Samui and Sukhothai, and has been in the same hands since it's inception 40 years ago hauling cargo. One can only guess they have very good contacts within the gov, though through which party would be interesting to know.

Air Asia will do fine regardless of which airport they fly in/out of. Their level of service won't change either way. In what ways would you expect them to give better service?

Air Asia will do fine regardless of which airport they fly in/out of. Their level of service won't change either way. In what ways would you expect them to give better service?

I would hope (actually I would expect) that they would have the ability to board planes at specified times and depart on time.

I'm one of those people that love Air Asia. I've never had a bad experience with the airline or it's staff. However I have noticed that they are given horrible gate locations on the domestic flights that I have been on (same when I flew Nok years ago). They are late to board and late to depart. I am assuming those are problems with the airport and I am assuming that domestic Air Asia flights are given low priority for the airport's daily operations.

I am totally assuming that those things are the fault of Suvarnabhumi airport.

Actually they have the potential to make a huge positive difference. Look at what Southwest has done at certain US terminals. They have charging tables with power outlets. They have USB outlets to charge ipods, phones and what not. Nice leather chairs to sit around in. ^

However if Air Asia is being forced to DMK, then there is zero incentive for them to try and improve the gate surroundings since they could be forced to move back to BKK in the future.


EDIT: I meandered over to the TeakDoor forums to read their thread on this subject. They had an additional article from the Bangkok post that said:
Tassapon Bijleveld, chief executive of Thai AirAsia, said the airline operates flights, many to international destinations, out of Suvarnabhumi. He wanted to see what incentives the government could offer for the airline to relocate to Don Mueang. "The government's proposals and conditions will be considered carefully. They must make clear that after the relocation there will not be a reversal of policies again."
So yeah, Air Asia is worried they could get forced back to BKK airport in the future.


But no matter what, the Transportation Ministry (or whoever) still need to hire more immigration agents to handle the record amounts of passengers.

Actually they have the potential to make a huge positive difference. Look at what Southwest has done at certain US terminals. They have charging tables with power outlets. They have USB outlets to charge ipods, phones and what not. Nice leather chairs to sit around in. ^



What does this have to do with Air Asia? Does Southwest charge for water and snacks? Do they charge for bags? Do they charge to pay for your ticket? You're dealing with two entirely different animals and any kind of comparison is really misplaced.

I'd be happy having FD move to DMK just to get rid of them.

What does this have to do with Air Asia? Does Southwest charge for water and snacks? Do they charge for bags? Do they charge to pay for your ticket? You're dealing with two entirely different animals and any kind of comparison is really misplaced.
I guess you haven't been back to the states in a long time. No point in debating this point with you if you're not familiar with Southwest airlines. It's basically the same thing as AirAsia except based in the United States.

Air Asia nitpicks you to death with extra charges and they push the line right to the point of dishonesty. I get the rabid hated of them out there. But they're still way way cheaper than anybody else just about everywhere I go in SE Asia. I've learned to avoid or at least mitigate their little scams. I''d love to see them at DMK. At least you would deplane out to the terminal instead of to the ****ing jam packed bus. wj

I guess you haven't been back to the states in a long time. No point in debating this point with you if you're not familiar with Southwest airlines. It's basically the same thing as AirAsia except based in the United States.

I do get back quite often but don't pay attention to WN. If my beliefs of them are different than their current policies then what I wrote might not be accurate.

Air Asia nitpicks you to death with extra charges and they push the line right to the point of dishonesty. I get the rabid hated of them out there. But they're still way way cheaper than anybody else just about everywhere I go in SE Asia. I've learned to avoid or at least mitigate their little scams. I''d love to see them at DMK. At least you would deplane out to the terminal instead of to the ****ing jam packed bus. wj

To each their own. For many of the routes I fly in Asia, barring purchasing a ticket many months in advance during a sale, they are definitely not cheap, often being as expensive as PG.

On their dom Thailand flights I find DD to be equal in cost before bags are factored in. For short int segments I find PG to be $20-30 more than FD before bags are factored in. I've said previously that the only times I'd consider FD are for a o/w short Int ticket where PG/TG etal bump up the lowest fare class available.

As both of these airlines offer what i need my time spent in an FD a/c are, thankfully, kept to a minimum.

I use Kayak to book all these flights and they show you the REAL fare. If anybody is reasonably close to FD, I book 'em (because of FD's detestable business practices) Here's some examples from my upcoming trip: Our flight BKK to PNH during Songkran was more than 2X as much on PG both ways (ai). Our flights BKK-RGN the next week are once again more than 2X as much on PG. BKK-SGN Qatar Airlines was only 20% more than FD so we booked them. I fly Nok more often than not domestically as they're just as cheap as FD and I prefer walking off the plane into the terminal at DMK and I prefer taking cabs from the airport (I'm not a big fan of the BKK Rail Link). FD likes to charge extra for anything bigger than a wallet, so I use Bangkok as a base, store a bag at my hotel, and only take small bags with me elsewhere. Is FD slimy and deceptive - yes. Is FD late a lot - yes. Does FD save me a lot of $$ - yes. wj

Passed through today and 2 out of 3 passport check areas open with 2 separate premium lanes.

Did you guys see the latest news story? I bolded the parts that I thought were important

Measures Set in Place to Ease Congestion at Suvarnabhumi Airport

The Trasport Ministry has applied many measures to tackle congestion at the Suvarnabhumi International Airport.

Deputy Transport Minister Chatchart Sittiphan unveiled the progress in easing congestion at Suvarnabhumi International Airport, insisting that the problem has now been lessened.

He said that the airlines have been asked for cooperation in opening check-in counters for passengers one hour earlier. In addition, more immigration staff are stationed at the port of entry to shorten the passport check processing time.

Moreover, automatic gates will be resume their operation from April 11 to ease congestion. Regarding a policy to relocate domestic flights of low-cost airlines to Don Muang Airport, he said that there are no more airlines willing to relocate.

In the meantime, Suvarnabhumi Airport Director Somchai Sawasdipol, reported that the Airport is handling an increasing number of passengers. The number of passengers has increased averagely by 150,000 people a day.

International passengers are accounted for 70 percent or 115,000 people. There are around 56,000 International outbound passengers daily, while international inbound passengers were recorded at 55,000 people a day, a 5.14 percent increase on a yearly basis.

Moreover, the Airport in cooperation with the Royal Thai Police and the Immigration Bureau to bring 80 to 90 percent more staff to man the immigration booth.

I think they mean the number of passengers has increased to 150k per day.
Meanwhile my city (OMA) averages less than 12k per day :)

Did you guys see the latest news story? I bolded the parts that I thought were important



here's the important take away:

Regarding a policy to relocate domestic flights of low-cost airlines to Don Muang Airport, he said that there are no more airlines willing to relocate.

The gov had nothing to offer these airlines who would incur all the costs associated with the move. They balked and then the gov, who had no desire to force the issue, gave up meekly.

There was no need to announce a move to begin with. The whole situation was in need of more immy officers as the one and only fix.

100% agreed

I dragged up this old chestnut because I had the good sense to fly in and out of DMK for the 1st time in awhile. The old girl still looks pretty good. I wish they'd move all the LCCs there. Everything was so easy. Got back to Suk right quick during rush hour too. Seems to be about 10% utilized. wj

I wonder how they will decide who is a LCC.

The sensible definition might be carriers not integrated with the wider air transport network, not facilitating tranfers.

This would leave BKK as the hub airport, DMK as the point-to-point airport.

does anyone know if tiger airways is moving to don mueang airport?

i see on the wiki that its proposed oct 2012 that tiger airways will fly to singapore out of here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Mueang_International_Airport