Finnair Plus - AY matching MA status

http://www.oneworld.com/news-information/oneworldnews/details/?objectID=28487

How to take advantage of these offers

airberlin: Malév Duna Club cardholders registering as airberlin topbonus members before 31 May 2012 are being offered the same oneworld tier status in the German airline's programme. For full details, see airberlin.com/dunaclub

Finnair: To take advantage of the Finnair offer, Malév Duna Club members must:

Register with Finnair Plus (see http://www.finnair.com/INT/GB/join).
Fly at least once on a Finnair-marketed flight between 13 February 2012 and 31 May 2012 on an eligible fare (Business Class J/C/D or I, or Economy Class Y/B/H/V/L/N/S/Q/O/K/M/P/T/Z/R/A).
Send to plus.special@finnair.fi by 30 June 2012 a scan of your Malév Duna Club card to Finnair Plus with the boarding card stub or electronic ticket from your Finnair flight.

Japan Airlines: Malév Duna Club cardholders registering as JAL Mileage Bank (JMB) members before 31 December 2012 are being offered the same oneworld tier status in Japan Airlines' loyalty programme that they enjoyed within Duna Club. To take advantage of this offer, follow these steps:

Register with JAL's JMB programme, at https://www121.jal.co.jp/JmbWeb/JR/EnrollProposal_en.do
Fly at least once on a Japan Airlines-marketed flight between 1 March 2012 and 31 December 2012 on an eligible fare (see http://www.er.jal.com/world/en/jalmile/flight/jal.html)
Contact JMB Europe (see http://www.jal.co.jp/en/information/jmb/index_er.html) by 31 December 2012 and quote your Malév Duna Club card membership number and details of the JAL flight taken (as above).
The oneworld tier status granted will apply to 31 March 2013 and will then be subject to normal reactivation rules.

Hmm, I just gave up on AY+ and now it seems I'll get AY Gold. I'll just sacrifice a domestic flight to this :)

Nice linkage - LH SEN matched to FB Plat to MA Gold to AY Gold :D :D

Do you get the SH upgrade vouchers or just the status (if only status this is pretty useless to most pax anyway)?

Do you get the SH upgrade vouchers or just the status (if only status this is pretty useless to most pax anyway)?

No idea - if/when I go for it, I'll report back.

AY status is good, even if one has the same level at say BA. Change (or even cancellation?) of ticketed redemptions free of charge is one. I'm not sure about guest policy at HEL lounges.

No idea - if/when I go for it, I'll report back.

AY status is good, even if one has the same level at say BA. Change (or even cancellation?) of ticketed redemptions free of charge is one. I'm not sure about guest policy at HEL lounges.

Gold can bring one guest. Plus under-age kids. If they are your own, or you can can reasonably claim so.

Gold can bring one guest. Plus under-age kids. If they are your own, or you can can reasonably claim so.


And that's only for Finnair status holders? With for example BA card it's always only one guest (adult or child), is that what you're saying?

And that's only for Finnair status holders? With for example BA card it's always only one guest (adult or child), is that what you're saying?

I don't know what the policy is re: other OW elites.

Do you get the SH upgrade vouchers or just the status (if only status this is pretty useless to most pax anyway)?

I am also wondering the same. Depending on the answer I will decide whether I take some very odd routing for my trip to Switzerland or not. I e-mailed AY+ today and post the answer here as soon as I have it.

In any case, I would exchange those four SH upgrades for a single LH. Don't you think that a long-haul upgrade provides much more value than a SH, especially since lounge access and other perks are grated by the AY+ Gold status?

Don't you think that a long-haul upgrade provides much more value than a SH, especially since lounge access and other perks are grated by the AY+ Gold status?

Could well be true for many/most but it really depends on flying patterns more than anything else..

Could well be true for many/most but it really depends on flying patterns more than anything else..

I understand. BTW, can you still use an upgrade voucher if you want to credit the flight to another FFP?

I understand. BTW, can you still use an upgrade voucher if you want to credit the flight to another FFP?

Yes.

In any case, I would exchange those four SH upgrades for a single LH. Don't you think that a long-haul upgrade provides much more value than a SH, especially since lounge access and other perks are grated by the AY+ Gold status?

For me it does.

I understand. BTW, can you still use an upgrade voucher if you want to credit the flight to another FFP?

But (rumour has it) AY status holders have higher priority in the confirmed upgrade process. If your upgrade is put on wait list you might have a better chance to get it through in the end if your AY status is on the BP.

Definitive info on upgrade certificates:

Hello and thank you for contacting Finnair Plus.

To take advantage of the Finnair offer, Malév Duna Club members must register with Finnair Plus, fly at least once on a Finnair-marketed flight between 13 February 2012 and 31 May 2012 on an eligible fare, send to plus.special@finnair.fi by 30 June 2012 a scan of your Malév Duna Club card to Finnair Plus with the boarding card stub or electronic ticket from your Finnair flight.

Your Gold level will be valid until the end of your tracking period. The tracking period will be 12 months and is determined by your date of joining. In other words if you join Finnair Plus on 2nd April your tracking period will become 1st April - 31st March. You will requalify by collecting 90 000 tier points or 54 one way oneworld flights.

You will get all the Finnair Plus Gold benefits that come with the tier. The vouchers are valid until the end of your tracking period.

Should you have any additional questions don't hesitate to ask as we are glad to help.

Best wishes

Finnair Plc
Finnair Customer Care Center

Excellent! Just sent in my scanned docs, will report back, how long it takes for the match to appear.

Excellent! Just sent in my scanned docs, will report back, how long it takes for the match to appear.

Hopefully it will take less than two weeks, the time to send me the quoted (mostly canned) response. AB did the match almost instantly even though I requested it during a weekend.

Happy to report that in just 2 working days my status was changed to AY Gold! ^

Even better - the status period is starting on the date of the match, not my oroginal status period - so its actual 12 months!

Happy to report that in just 2 working days my status was changed to AY Gold! ^

Even better - the status period is starting on the date of the match, not my oroginal status period - so its actual 12 months!

That sounds good.

BTW, did you actually credit the flight to AY+ or some other programme?

That sounds good.

BTW, did you actually credit the flight to AY+ or some other programme?

Credited to AY - otherwise I don't think it works. 740 points, no big deal. (BUD-HEL low eco)

I do not want to take anything away from anyone but personally I find all status matches to somewhat devalue the whole concept of FF programs and putting members in different positions etc. I fully understand why airlines do these and as well why people are so keen on taking up the opportunity. I might do it myself one day shall an opportunity arise.

It would be interesting to see some research how much additional biz these actually bring to these airlines who do these. Hopefully a lot..

Personally I prefer the way AA does this, they offer the challenges which need at least a bit more commitment other than just a flashy card elsewhere + a single low cost flight.

Just my 2 cents,

I understand your feelings and I still have some similar thoughts buried somewhere deep down, but, but...

Though I might secretly appreciate those shiny cards that I earned with BIS (yes, I have those :D - LH, SK, BD, BA) more, it doesn't stop me from taking what is offered. I might or might not bring that much extra business to these, but I do certainly enjoy the perks they offer.

I am also not much worried about status inflation - as long as the status related perks are there. Same goes with hotels - they are more prone to match status, so one can enjoy mid-level elite perks at hotel chains one stays occasionally.

As they say in Finland - it's not the one who asks, who is stupid...

also in the case of malev and spanair I do beleive its good business to status match to keep loyal customers IN the same alliance... other then that AY doesnt match much... not that ay+ gold is even worth much... my 1 cents worth

other then that AY doesnt match much... not that ay+ gold is even worth much... my 1 cents worth

I disagree on the worth of AY Gold - it is valuable, especially if you have no other OW status.

- Lounge access
- Priority security in HEL
- Luggage (either extra piece OR free up to 30 kg)
- Free special luggage (ski, golf, etc)
- Biz checkin
- Upgrade vouchers (I just noticed - the 4 s/h vouchers can be used also for 1 l/h upgrade ^ or for a 2-4-1 Classic Y redemption ^)
- 15% bonus on AY metal
- 10% discount at HEL tax-free ^

In my book these add up to quite a penny.

(48 hrs seat guarantee - never needed such)

(op-up - does it still happen?)

I do not want to take anything away from anyone but personally I find all status matches to somewhat devalue the whole concept of FF programs and putting members in different positions etc. I fully understand why airlines do these and as well why people are so keen on taking up the opportunity. I might do it myself one day shall an opportunity arise.

It would be interesting to see some research how much additional biz these actually bring to these airlines who do these. Hopefully a lot..

Personally I prefer the way AA does this, they offer the challenges which need at least a bit more commitment other than just a flashy card elsewhere + a single low cost flight.

Just my 2 cents,

It is an interesting line of thought. As my work in some way build on loyalty, I have been mulling the airline industry's practices on loyalty cards and status matches with myself.

My conclusion have so far been that the airline rarely will get additional business on the status matches. Surely, a status match will attract some high spenders that are about to switch main airline. Typical situations are when those persons move (new outbound hub) or change work (new destinations) and their old airline doesn't fit the schedule anymore. These will generate a lot of new revenue.

In the cases of dis-satisfied elites, they will probably generate some new revenue, but as all the loyalty programs are ever changing, these customers will probably soon be dis-satisfied by the new program and jump ship again.

But I think the majority of status matchers are people looking for the easy way to status on their second-choice airline/alliance. Elites are used to the perks of an loyalty program, and as they travel a lot, there will be occasions where they fly on other's metal. It is rarely enough to gain/sustain status, and therefor the match is the only way. After the match, I don't think it is likely this category will increase their flying on the new airline.

Last category is the card-collectors and the players-of-the-game, needless to say, they wouldn't create any extra revenue.


I think that the airline loyalty managing people are anticipating that most of matchers are in the first category, and therefore think matches are advantageous to the airline. I also think loyalty managers are not responsible for revenue generated by elites, so they will not actually measure and report on these matters.

So in conclusion, If I was airline loyalty manager, I would be very careful about setting up matching. Just my 2 cents!

So in conclusion, If I was airline loyalty manager, I would be very careful about setting up matching. Just my 2 cents!

I pretty much agree, and I guess that is why AY+ has been very stingy with status matches. Demise of Malév left some people without their former first/second airline, I guess it makes sense to try to convert some of them to AY. Although Malév seems to have been pretty easy with status matches itself, so I don't know how many of its elites flew so much on Malev metal...

Demise of Malév left some people without their former first/second airline, I guess it makes sense to try to convert some of them to AY. Although Malév seems to have been pretty easy with status matches itself, so I don't know how many of its elites flew so much on Malev metal...

I think that for most BUD based pax AY is simply not an option to replace MA as first or even second choice. Ex-BUD you have 2 (or 3?) OW destinations only - LHR, HEL and possibly MAD.

Most of the traffic ex-BUD is either regional or EU - who in their right mind would fly BUD-HEL-FRA/MUC/LON/PAR?? For half of Hungary VIE is more accessible than BUD, anyway. In my opinion the bankrupcy of MA is also a blow to OW in Europe, it is even more peripherial than before

For 2-3 years MA matched ANY (!) elites up to MA Gold - actually mine was matched against AY Gold now matched back :D

But I think the majority of status matchers are people looking for the easy way to status on their second-choice airline/alliance. Elites are used to the perks of an loyalty program, and as they travel a lot, there will be occasions where they fly on other's metal.

So in conclusion, If I was airline loyalty manager, I would be very careful about setting up matching. Just my 2 cents!

Fully agree with your second (or even third) choice idea - it's just nice to have elite perks when flying on KL or RO once in a while.

But truth be told - what is the REAL cost of a status match to the airline aside from the cost of the plastic? Either the pax won't fly them, so nothing. Or the pax will fly them, thus generating revenue (the reason of the excercise) and will enjoy a drink at the lounge. All other perks are practically 0 cost. And those few matched pax who bring large new revenue more than offset these costs.

So I see no real risks of the occasional status match. Doing it all the time with low or no threshold is another matter, it lowers the percieved value of the elite status.

I think that for most BUD based pax AY is simply not an option to replace MA as first or even second choice. Ex-BUD you have 2 (or 3?) OW destinations only - LHR, HEL and possibly MAD.

The situation is not that bad: we have BER as direct destination as well and connections from there are moderately good. TATL from BUD is still the best on AA and BA for most US destinations, so OW status has still some value for pax based in Hungary.

Most of the traffic ex-BUD is either regional or EU - who in their right mind would fly BUD-HEL-FRA/MUC/LON/PAR??

Some FTer, maybe? :p
Anyway, I think that the majority of intra-EU traffic ex-BUD is now using LCCs and this will be the situation for the coming years. The LH/LX/OS combo offers the best non-LCC alternatives mostly, but it is still not good compared to the network of MA.

For half of Hungary VIE is more accessible than BUD, anyway.

That half is rather like a quarter. The situation for Eastern Hungary (where I do indeed live) is considerably worse. From here the only other airport I can access is CLJ, but that's presently not a real alternative. W6 will introduce a direct DEB-LTN service this summer, but without connectivity I think it will not be really useful (and will be doomed, like former attempts to MUC and BUD).

For 2-3 years MA matched ANY (!) elites up to MA Gold - actually mine was matched against AY Gold now matched back :D

Well, as someone who earned MA Gold with BIS segments, that was really annoying. I think they shouldn't have done those status matches. Anyway, I did not see a lot of elite pax on most of MA flights, so these people did not really use the perks on MA at least (the situation might have been different with usage other OW carriers).

I do not want to take anything away from anyone but personally I find all status matches to somewhat devalue the whole concept of FF programs and putting members in different positions etc. I fully understand why airlines do these and as well why people are so keen on taking up the opportunity. I might do it myself one day shall an opportunity arise.

It would be interesting to see some research how much additional biz these actually bring to these airlines who do these. Hopefully a lot..

Personally I prefer the way AA does this, they offer the challenges which need at least a bit more commitment other than just a flashy card elsewhere + a single low cost flight.

Just my 2 cents,

I admit that I do this AY match as a hit-and-run: I have no chance (and no intentions, either) to requalify since I earned my MA Gold status with BIS segments (60% on MA, rest on other OW carriers, mainly AY to Finland and AA/BA to the US) on deep discount Y fares that earn close to nothing on AY and my flying pattern will be similar in the future (with a shift towards TATL flights, but still deep discount eco). That's why it is a shame that only the three least usable OW carriers for this type of former MA elites offered status match. The most usable FFP within OW would certainly be AA, with whom I actually did a challenge (but only to Ruby, since I booked my AA flights when I still aimed for MA status, so my booking class gave me only 0.5 EQP/mile) and will likely maintain my Ruby status there in the coming years.

So I will take the AY match, generate some revenue for AY while doing so and some more after (to use my upgrade voucher). I wouldn't do this, however if OW offered a real solution for ex-MA customers, like *A did with ex-Spanair elites (they could match to a lot of FFPs, including the big ones). But, all in all, AY will have a positive bottom line by offering me the match.

The situation is not that bad: we have BER as direct destination as well and connections from there are moderately good. TATL from BUD is still the best on AA and BA for most US destinations, so OW status has still some value for pax based in Hungary.

Quite correct - I forgot that AB is now in the OW fold, which is a VERY good thing! ^

That half is rather like a quarter. The situation for Eastern Hungary (where I do indeed live) is considerably worse.

I was thinking west of the Danube, which is true, not half of the country

W6 will introduce a direct DEB-LTN service this summer, but without connectivity I think it will not be really useful

Point-to-point connection to LON, that's all it'll be.

Well, as someone who earned MA Gold with BIS segments, that was really annoying. I think they shouldn't have done those status matches.

After AY's downgrading it's FFP in 2010 I was more or less boycotting them - this meant flying mainly *A and building up status at LH, BD and SK. Still the OW status was useful for the many HEL-BUD legs on MA (and occasionally on AY) - waived luggage fees + lounge mainly.

I did not see a lot of elite pax on most of MA flights, so these people did not really use the perks on MA at least

How do you distinguish elites from non-elites on-board? Secret handshake? :)

Amúgy szia!

...

For 2-3 years MA matched ANY (!) elites up to MA Gold - actually mine was matched against AY Gold now matched back :D

Hehe:D I held a MA platinum for close to 2 years, matched from my AY plat... Was softlanded down to a MA gold, days before the cease of operations.

But in revenue terms, I took maybe 4 or 6 legs on MA, discounted Y. Didn't even bother to use upgrade vouchers. I guess I belong to the card-collector category!:p

Fully agree with your second (or even third) choice idea - it's just nice to have elite perks when flying on KL or RO once in a while.

But truth be told - what is the REAL cost of a status match to the airline aside from the cost of the plastic? Either the pax won't fly them, so nothing. Or the pax will fly them, thus generating revenue (the reason of the excercise) and will enjoy a drink at the lounge. All other perks are practically 0 cost. And those few matched pax who bring large new revenue more than offset these costs.

So I see no real risks of the occasional status match. Doing it all the time with low or no threshold is another matter, it lowers the percieved value of the elite status.

Yes from the frequent traveller's point of view, matches are perfect. I do love them and take what is given to me!
And it is true, most of the status perks doesn't cost that much and only occur when new revenue is raised. (Though, upgrade vouchers do cost a bit in lost revenue.) So making occasional matches, based on a specific situation (like this one) is probably very limited risk, both in real cost and in devaluation.

But the loyalty program is to build loyalty (and not revenue, at least not primarily) so the matches pose some risk. I think a lot of the loyalty comes from the actual "hard work" building up status, not from the actual benefits. You stay loyal to airline X because it took you some effort to get the status, and while getting it, you got used to that airline (and the perks). Without that "hard work", there is no psychological build up and therefore less loyalty created in the matched customer.
And seeing others being able to bypass the effort, may also affect your own loyalty to some extent.

And even the zero-cost perks can be destroyed by extensive matching or other devaluation. There is a big discussion in CX forum about diamond status that is given for free to some creditcard holders. On some routes there are now so many "elites" that majority of the pax are doing priority boarding... What was used to be a first class service is now the norm.

...
How do you distinguish elites from non-elites on-board? Secret handshake? :)

Amúgy szia!

Yes. But you need to be platinum to know about it :D

But the loyalty program is to build loyalty (and not revenue, at least not primarily) so the matches pose some risk. I think a lot of the loyalty comes from the actual "hard work" building up status, not from the actual benefits. You stay loyal to airline X because it took you some effort to get the status, and while getting it, you got used to that airline (and the perks). Without that "hard work", there is no psychological build up and therefore less loyalty created in the matched customer.


I agree with you very much. I miss MA not only because of objective aspects (like lost direct destinations or bad timetables with LCC), but because I got used to their services during all those legs that I took with them. I knew what to expect, what not to expect, which are the best seats etc. That meant almost as much as the perks that my status gave to me. (Which were sometimes rather inconsistent: before my final flight the check-in agent did not want to acceppt my second piece of luggage; I had to educate him about Gold benefits...)

Quite correct - I forgot that AB is now in the OW fold, which is a VERY good thing!

I would be much better if they offered at least two or three daily non-stops to Budapest. With the current one (sometimes two) daily flight it is not that easy to connect.

Point-to-point connection to LON, that's all it'll be.

That's why I fear that it will not be viable. But I really hope that the route will be successful and new routes will be operated ex-DEB. Then, someday it might be possibble that my home airport is not 125 miles away from where I live.

How do you distinguish elites from non-elites on-board? Secret handshake? :)

It is certainly not easy once we're on board. :-) But I often travel alone I pass time by observing others. I looked for people who were using the C check-in counter or entered the lounge and were eventually seated in Y. If - let say - 40 percent of elites on average use the lounge then I was never on-board any MA flight with more then 10 Golds or Plats since the highest number of Y pax who turned up in the lounge before was 3 (on a LGW-BUD flight). Otherwise I met on-board only 0, 1 or 2 people from the lounge. That's only a rough estimate of course, but think that there were lot less MA elites on MA flights than there are AA elites on AA flights (let alone CX/KA).

Amúgy szia!
Szia! :-)

Hehe:D I held a MA platinum for close to 2 years, matched from my AY plat... Was softlanded down to a MA gold, days before the cease of operations.

You were lucky - after I while they stopped giving out Plat. You may try to match your old MA Plat to AY Plat...

But the loyalty program is to build loyalty (and not revenue, at least not primarily) so the matches pose some risk.

And what is loyalty good for? For raising revenue, isn't it?


Without that "hard work", there is no psychological build up and therefore less loyalty created in the matched customer.
And seeing others being able to bypass the effort, may also affect your own loyalty to some extent.

Agreed - that's why I wrote, that I hold my BIS earned cards more dear

And even the zero-cost perks can be destroyed by extensive matching or other devaluation. ... What was used to be a first class service is now the norm.

Again, agreed - that what I meant when I mentioned status inflation. When every Tom, Dick and Harry has top status the glamour fades and perks stop being perks

That's why I fear that it will not be viable. But I really hope that the route will be successful and new routes will be operated ex-DEB. Then, someday it might be possibble that my home airport is not 125 miles away from where I live.


Quite OT, sorry guys!

I find it quite strange that while most (all?) neighbours have domestic flights and international flights to provincial towns, Hungary has only one real airport (BUD) + one or two others on/off (Sármellék, Debrecen, Pécs) and no domestic traffic for the last 60 years

Sorry again, back to AY status match :)

Quite OT, sorry guys!

I find it quite strange that while most (all?) neighbours have domestic flights and international flights to provincial towns, Hungary has only one real airport (BUD) + one or two others on/off (Sármellék, Debrecen, Pécs) and no domestic traffic for the last 60 years

Sorry again, back to AY status match :)

OT, but I have to correct you: there were domestic fligths between BUD and DEB two or three times a day back in 2006. They were sold by MA, but operated by a small German company on 33-seat Saabs. Actually the planes were there to fly BUD-LJU, but they though it would be better to fly them to DEB instead of paying the parking fee at BUD. I once flew a single BUD-DEB segment after a MID-MEX-CDG-BUD itin. I was the only pax, while there were two pilots, two FAs and a pilot for the moring DEB-BUD flight on-board. I had my strictest ever handbag search before that flight, since all security personnel were occupied by checking me. It's not hard to guess while this route (and the LJU wet lease also) was soon discontinued.

Hehe:D I held a MA platinum for close to 2 years, matched from my AY plat... Was softlanded down to a MA gold, days before the cease of operations.

You were lucky - after I while they stopped giving out Plat. You may try to match your old MA Plat to AY Plat...


Hehe, do you think they will make me a super-duper-plat then? (AY plat + MA plat = AY presidential golden platinum extra card) :D Maybe I will try to match just to see their reply...



And what is loyalty good for? For raising revenue, isn't it?

Oh yes, that is true. I just think, maybe a bit cynical, that most companies do not take a very scientific approach to this relation. It is just an understanding that loyalty equals revenue, and that's that.
So loyalty management acts accordingly. They work to raise loyalty and track things around this (numbers of members, utilization of perks, members travel behaviour, targeted flight offers, ...) but I don't think they look into things like "revenue raised by elites that would not have been raised without loyalty scheme". It takes very skilled analysts to track such figures, and I guess most companies doesn't even have the two databases connected ( flight revenue and loyalty scheme).

Or to put it simply: Loyalty-management falls under marketing, an area that is seldom tracked for revenue.

Also proven by the fact that loyalty programs are changed for the worse in bad economic times; They are only tracked on costs.

Or to put it simply: Loyalty-management falls under marketing, an area that is seldom tracked for revenue.


Well said and right to the core!