Flying Blue (Air France, KLM, and Other Partners) - Delta's Sky Miles, KLM's Flying Blue, or What?

Hi,

I make about four AMS-MEX-AMS flights a year; I tend to use KLM, and Continental indistinctly (I go for the lower price I can find) hence my frequent flyer (FF) miles account seems to be stuck and not growing very much.

Therefore, I was wondering which FF programme should I opt to consolidate my miles with. Not that the airline industry is eagerly giving away free flights/upgrades, but KLM seems to be particularly stringent with their miles.

Should I opt for KLM and their stingy Flying Blue programme (AMS has became a somewhat frequented airport by me and perhaps will become my home airport) or should I opt for Delta's Sky Miles (MEX is my home airport)? Should I even consider Aeromexico's (AM) Club Premier (75% miles when booking in V,L,W, and P) even though I almost never fly with them? Or should I stay within the Star Alliance's realms and stick to Continental's OnePass?

I hope that my question is not too :confused:.

Thank you in advance for your help.

Moderators: Is this the adequate forum to post this question? Feel free to move it to the appropriate one.

indistinctly...or indirectly?

This is a question which only you can decide. If, as you say, you will be flying from AMS a lot, then it would seem to indicate that Flying Blue may be a better option than SkyMiles.

Of course, there is no reason why you have to stick with one alliance - rather than "rushing" to collect enough miles to make a redemption, perhaps you should open an FFP in SkyTeam, and one in *A, and then choose your carrier ahead of each trip based on whoever is cheapest.

By the way, you used the word "consolidate" with regards to your miles, but you won't be able to "consolidate" or combine existing miles from different Frequent Flyer programmes into a single account.

You seem to feel that you're missing out on something by not quickly amassing miles, but I think you're better the way you are. As long as you have an account in each alliance (and one only, don't split the miles up any more than you really have to, by e.g. having 2 or more accounts on airlines within a single alliance - unless you end up booking a fare that earns nothing in your FFP in that alliance, when it might be no harm to open a new account where that flight would actually earn something), and as long as you are aware of the expiry rules governing each of those programs (Flying Blue miles expire 20 months after the last earning activity), then just continue as you are. Let the price on offer be what drives you to make your purchases - NOT your desire to swell your Frequent Flyer mileage balance.

(Each FFP has its own quirks and vagaries. I assume you know that there are no "free" flights - you will have to pay taxes and charges when you redeem, and in some instances (e.g. short haul economy on Flying Blue) it can even be cheaper to just buy a regular ticket than to make an award booking. Don't be too "starry-eyed" about the fantastic ability to redeem tickets for free - it's not that good. You may find availability can be patchy, too (this seems definitely to be the case for Delta, not so much an issue for Flying Blue))

It very much depends on the type of fares that you travel on. If you fly cheap Y fares then take FB off the list immediately. CO has a more solid and honest program; DL is all about AmEx and while you can accumulate more miles than FB they can be a real pain to actually use.

DL miles do not expire. FB miles do after 20 months of inactivity.

DL miles do not expire. FB miles do after 20 months of inactivity.

Unless you're elite and with 4 trips MEX-AMS-MEX I guess you'll reach elite level (depending on the fare and routing).

The fees associated with FB award bookings are the #1 reason why I put my miles to DL - status isn't such a concern for me since most of my travel is long-haul routes where I won't get any kind of upgrade. Everyone complains about their redemption policies though, because unless you really know what you're doing in terms of searching for availability, you will end up frustrated.....

Don't fall victim to elite status if you're not truly a frequent flyer...it may be nice to cut the security line, but unless you're consistently getting the best prices with one alliance, it might be most worthwhile to just buy the cheapest fare.

The fees associated with FB award bookings are the #1 reason why I put my miles to DL

If reward bookings Europe-North America are something desired by the OP, scheduling them to have a North American (not European) origin can save a lot of international origination surcharges (pseudo fuel surcharge) in Delta's program.

You can make GM w/ intl. lounge access w/ 4 rts AMS-MEX. FB is a joke and UAs new program is quite poor as well. We'll see what they do with ex-EU awards, but this might be the only reason to go with UA if you want EU-US-EU awards. We'll know tomorrow morning.

If you are living in Europe and signing up for Delta Skymiles, be aware that for award flights originating from most European countries Delta charges a hefty international origination fee which can be north of $300. And that next to their low availability of low mileage awards.

This they do as to not out compete KL/AFs Flying Blue program. With DL you always get full award and level (MQM) miles even for deep-discount tickets, while with KL/AF you only get 25% award and level miles for deep discounted economy. If DL wouldn't do this everyone in Europe would sign up for Skymiles instead of FB.

Try to make some fake Delta award ticket bookings from your home airport and see what fees they charge, if you are considering to sign up for Skymiles. A lot of people only discover this after they sign up and saving miles. Don't be one of them.

This is only a consideration for economy award tickets. If you want to use your miles for business class awards, then $350-400 in fees for a business award ticket is still a good deal. Also if status is your goal, then Skymiles is better than FB, and your Skymiles Silver / Gold etc. benefits are also valid on KL/AF.

Luckily I'm based in the US so I won't need to deal with these international origination fees.

Also if status is your goal, then Skymiles is better than FB, and your Skymiles Silver / Gold etc. benefits are also valid on KL/AF.

From what I can gather of SkyMiles, for those who expect to qualify on number of segments, FB is a far better program.

If you are living in Europe and signing up for Delta Skymiles, be aware that for award flights originating from most European countries Delta charges a hefty international origination fee which can be north of $300. And that next to their low availability of low mileage awards.

This they do as to not out compete KL/AFs Flying Blue program. With DL you always get full award and level (MQM) miles even for deep-discount tickets, while with KL/AF you only get 25% award and level miles for deep discounted economy. If DL wouldn't do this everyone in Europe would sign up for Skymiles instead of FB.

Try to make some fake Delta award ticket bookings from your home airport and see what fees they charge, if you are considering to sign up for Skymiles. A lot of people only discover this after they sign up and saving miles. Don't be one of them.

This is only a consideration for economy award tickets. If you want to use your miles for business class awards, then $350-400 in fees for a business award ticket is still a good deal. Also if status is your goal, then Skymiles is better than FB, and your Skymiles Silver / Gold etc. benefits are also valid on KL/AF.

Luckily I'm based in the US so I won't need to deal with these international origination fees.

I actually checked this for 2 different trips:
AMS-SFO
AMS-LHR

For both trips the amount of miles needed at Delta was slightly more compared to FB (approx 5k difference). The amount of taxes the trip would cost at Delta was equal for the LHR trip and actually less for the SFO trip.

Delta is much, much more generous with miles (25% with KLM against 100% at Delta) on deeply discounted fares, however I have no information on actual upgrades and other program benefits just yet. The booking of award trips seems to be ok, at least for me :)
With a few trips from AMS-SFO I get much more benefits with SM than with FB.
I actually moved from FB to SM because of this. I fly 2-3 times to the US and get soo little miles with FB. I'll give SM a couple of years to prove itself :)

Hope this helps

I actually checked this for 2 different trips:
AMS-SFO
AMS-LHR

For both trips the amount of miles needed at Delta was slightly more compared to FB (approx 5k difference).

That is a very small data set. You would have to compare all the mileage award charts. FB has "zones" in Europe whereas DL considers the whole thing one zone. So a short trip like AMS-LHR may be cheaper with FB, but LHR-ATH is more expensive.

Some other considerations:
- the FB promos (non-existent in the DL world) allow you to book J for half the miles
- the really bad availability at DL and known problems with the award booking engine, often resulting in tips costing several times more (someone was once quoted 585k miles, if I recall correctly, for a RT US-Europe in Y!)
- DL is indeed more generous with miles if you travel in Y, because pretty much all fares yield 100% miles, but you can do less with those miles

Personally, between FB and SM, I prefer SM. But I would take a very close look at UA/CO; they do present an interesting choice.@:-)

From what I expect, it'll become even more easy to get ST Elite. Just 10 segments are necessary with soon-to-be-Skyteam-member Garuda.
Mileage earning and redeeming, I've no high hopes for but just for status, this can be a very good program and I certainly hope to be able to make advantage of it.

Remember that SkyTeamElite doesn't carry many benefits. You need ElitePlus for lounge access on international trips, or to be flying in business class.

Well with plain ST Elite, I can get a lot on AFKL. They are very generous IMHO. Only FB Elite perk vs other ST Elite is priority luggage delivery, which does not work either.

Well with plain ST Elite, I can get a lot on AFKL. They are very generous IMHO. Only FB Elite perk vs other ST Elite is priority luggage delivery, which does not work either.
ST Elite Plus gives you SkyPriority and lounge access, which are not available to ST Elites. Some airports (e.g. in the US, and I think CDG as well) have expedited security lines for SkyPriority (ST Elite+) which are not available to Silvers.

Yeah ofcourse, Elite+ is better than Elite. What I'm trying to say, if one would want to qualify on segments, GA can be very easy. Especially for people who can't even make 15 flights (if you're based at AMS or CDG). Additionally, I wanted to make clear that when flying AFKL, is doesn't matter much if your AFKL's own Elite or other ST Airline Elite.

I moved to Delta from KLM this year.

My advice:

* Use KLM if you plan to do 8+ return trips in one calendar year and don't care about the miles. You'll hit Silver that way. Delta is a lot harder to get status but a lot easier to get miles.

* KLM Promo Award tickets offer good value, but it is near impossible to get 100% miles earned on flights (max 50% unless you really start paying), so it can take a long time. You'll need some sort of tied-in credit card to boost your balance.

Miles count mostly to me, so Delta has already proven itself worthy with my total greater than KLM and it's only March!

Miles count mostly to me, so Delta has already proven itself worthy with my total greater than KLM and it's only March!


Exactly! That is my point. I only care about getting "free" flights AMS-MEX-AMS. I don't care about status unless it is conducive to "free" flights.

I always fly in the cheapest available ticket; therefore, I am afraid I will barely get any miles in KLM's Flying Blue programme :(. However, United seems to be a tad more fair when it comes to miles allocation. When I was living in London I did get one "free" ticket LHR-MEX-LHR on First –or, Business– Class using my miles. That was a nice experience that I would like to repeat. As far I can tell, KLM won't be the way to do it.