New England - MBTA fare evaders

I've had this happen twice in the last two weeks and am curious about how others would handle it. Both times, this was at the Temple Place entrance of the Downtown Crossing subway station.

Situation one: I was walking down the stairs when I saw someone walking up see me and immediately turn around. Smelling a poacher, I slowed down, let her get in front of me, then she let me get in front of her, then at the fare gate, I said "After you," at which point she told me of her intention to follow me in. I said I wasn't interested in doing that, she tried to convince me it wasn't a big deal. Eventually what I tried to do was to tap my card, let the gate open, and the stop immediately in front of the gate so she would be stuck behind. Unfortunately, the only gates at that entrance are the wide ones, so she shoved her way around me.

Situation two: Same entrance. I saw a couple of people loading a fare on the vending machine and thought little of it. I tapped my card, and the guy who was theoretically adding value to his card ran to the gate and ran through before I had a chance to say or do anything.

In both cases, there was not an attendant anywhere near that entrance. This kind of thing causes the T to lose many $$ per year and, call me selfish, but it causes fares for honest people like me and the large majority of riders to go up.

So I'm curious what people would do when someone freeloads on their fare. Do you find an attendant? Try to stop them before they enter? Do nothing at all? I do wish the MBTA had installed turnstiles at the gates when they did the CharlieCard installation a couple of years ago.

It's happened to me a few times...I've tried stopping right after the gate but it doesn't seem to help. Haven't bothered reporting them to an attendant. Honestly turnstiles would slow things down so badly that I don't want to see them used.

You never know the mental state of the person who is jumping the fare or whatever it's called up there.

I would not consider it safe to try and stop them, even if they just spit in your face, you don't have any idea what problems that could cause.

Situation one: I was walking down the stairs when I saw someone walking up see me and immediately turn around. Smelling a poacher, I slowed down, let her get in front of me, then she let me get in front of her, then at the fare gate, I said "After you," at which point she told me of her intention to follow me in. I said I wasn't interested in doing that, she tried to convince me it wasn't a big deal. Eventually what I tried to do was to tap my card, let the gate open, and the stop immediately in front of the gate so she would be stuck behind. Unfortunately, the only gates at that entrance are the wide ones, so she shoved her way around me.This piece of scum could have had a knife or gun on her. I would NOT have let her follow me. If she wanted a free ride, let her get it from someone else. I would have stepped away entirely.

Situation two: Same entrance. I saw a couple of people loading a fare on the vending machine and thought little of it. I tapped my card, and the guy who was theoretically adding value to his card ran to the gate and ran through before I had a chance to say or do anything.Someone ran through your entrance to the subway from a vending machine before YOU had an opportunity to walk through after you tapped in front of the gate? I don't quite understand.

So I'm curious what people would do when someone freeloads on their fare. Do you find an attendant? Try to stop them before they enter? Do nothing at all? I do wish the MBTA had installed turnstiles at the gates when they did the CharlieCard installation a couple of years ago.Even with turnstiles, people try to cheat the system by kneeling under them. If it does not involve me, I mind my own business. You never know what kind of violence that person is capable of doing.

It annoys the crap out of me, too. It's happens a dozen times or so a year. There's really no way to stop it from happening.

This piece of scum could have had a knife or gun on her. I would NOT have let her follow me. If she wanted a free ride, let her get it from someone else. I would have stepped away entirely.

While I did not feel physically threatened, looking back, that's what I should have done. At that entrance, the only option is to go back out to the street and pick a different entrance; there's no "common lobby" area there.

Someone ran through your entrance to the subway from a vending machine before YOU had an opportunity to walk through after you tapped in front of the gate? I don't quite understand.

Sorry about the confusion. I tapped my card and went through the gate to the orange line platform; I got through just fine. Just before the gate closed, the guy came running from the fare vending machine through the gate, setting off the alarm that is ignored 100% of the time. While I still got through paying only one fare, I didn't appreciate him running through behind me, but I don't think there's anything I could have done.

While I did not feel physically threatened, looking back, that's what I should have done. At that entrance, the only option is to go back out to the street and pick a different entrance; there's no "common lobby" area there.I wasn't referring to a "lobby". I meant I would have stepped back and let that person go through ahead of me or just walked out if I really felt threatened. It's not worth it.

Sorry about the confusion. I tapped my card and went through the gate to the orange line platform; I got through just fine. Just before the gate closed, the guy came running from the fare vending machine through the gate, setting off the alarm that is ignored 100% of the time. While I still got through paying only one fare, I didn't appreciate him running through behind me, but I don't think there's anything I could have done.Ahhh, now I understand. There is nothing you could have done if someone ran behind you and you didn't see that person. I didn't think those glass/plastic gates were open that long for someone to get there that quickly but obviously they are.

My question is, what's the difference of just jumping the gate? Who do they think they're fooling running behind someone and setting off the alarm? If there's no one there to watch, there's no one there to watch.

Sometimes it goes like this (St. Petersburg, Gor'kovskaya metro station near the main mosque of the city, the day of Eid al-Adha):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLoFnu60lBY

I would never risk my life getting into a confrontation with someone over this.

Besides, what would you do on the Green Line? People evade the fare there with much greater frequency.

Besides, what would you do on the Green Line? People evade the fare there with much greater frequency.

Really? Are you talking about at the street-level stops or underground or both?

Really? Are you talking about at the street-level stops or underground or both?

On the street level it's wicked easy to get on without paying. Seen it a thousand times, I'd never confront anyone about it. Not worth a confrontation.

On the street level it's wicked easy to get on without paying. Seen it a thousand times, I'd never confront anyone about it. Not worth a confrontation.Exactly. What's even more annoying is most times the drivers don't even care.

Interesting - I could imagine on the outbound, a passenger going out the back door and someone else going in the same door, but on the inbound I'm not sure how they go in the front door and just walk by the driver unless they happen to catch a lucky break with somebody going inbound and disembarking through the back door at another street level stop.

Interesting - I could imagine on the outbound, a passenger going out the back door and someone else going in the same door, but on the inbound I'm not sure how they go in the front door and just walk by the driver unless they happen to catch a lucky break with somebody going inbound and disembarking through the back door at another street level stop.

Inbound green line trains open their back doors at the larger stops. D Line, it's most of them. C Line, it's Washington Square and Coolidge Corner for sure, sometimes more than that. I haven't taken the B or E line in awhile.

Nor the "A" line, to Watertown.

Very interesting conversation so far. I've seen fare evasion rise over the last few years. (Tied to economic downturn? Or perhaps evaders now know that many stations don't have attendants and there are no consequences?)

Now that I've been seeing all the local news coverage about the fare hikes and route closures, I think this is very topical. However, at the end of the day, my guess (completely unscientific and unfounded) is that evaders make up a very very very small portion of the T ridership.

This thread got me thinking though...what SHOULD I do if I see fare evasion? Certainly doesn't seem like a matter for MBTA police since fare evasion is a non-criminal offense. So I decided to call MBTA this morning. After being on hold for ~20 min, got through to a customer service rep. The rep confirmed that one should NOT call MBTA transit police nor should one try to confront the evader. Apparently the proper method of reporting fare evasion is to call customer service with the time/date/station. I also asked if evasion should be reported to a station attendant (if present) or to the train operator. The answer was "sure, I guess you could do that too..." :rolleyes:

Again, without really knowing how big the financial impact of fare evasion is, I can't pass judgment on the MBTA. I know that they, like any other company, have to prioritise how they resource and monetise their business. (Frankly, my bar is pretty low...I'm just glad that compared to most public transit systems I've taken in the US and the rest of the world, I've always felt very safe on MBTA trains and buses.)

A $15 fee is a weak deterrent to fare evaders. Should be like Germany with their 40 Euro fees.

Depending on the operator it can be as high as CHF 120 in Switzerland. That's $130. People would soon think twice if they were risking that.

Neil

Depending on the operator it can be as high as CHF 120 in Switzerland. That's $130. People would soon think twice if they were risking that.

Neil

Well, the fare they are evading in Switzerland is probably more than $1.70 haha

Well, apparently the MBTA is cracking down on fare evaders - on the commuter rail :rolleyes:. LINK (http://www.gloucestertimes.com/local/x1690518750/MBTA-cracking-down-on-fare-scofflaws)

Edit to add: And the green line too! ^ LINK (http://www.wickedlocal.com/brookline/news/x1907511351/MBTA-is-cracking-down-on-Brookline-fare-evaders#ixzz1pBmMrjG2)

What's funny is, the last couple times I've been on the commuter rail, they never made it to me to collect the cash. I was sitting in my seat, perfectly happy to hand the guy cash, but he would get halfway down the car and turn around to be at the door for another stop. Just lucky? Or have I discovered the magic seat of free travel?

That happened to me yesterday. I think the trick is to not buy a ticket for the commuter rail beforehand, and just pay on the train. If they miss you, that's their fault and not yours, since you fully intended to pay. They definitely profile people though. They made the dodgy looking fool that I was sitting next to me pay up, but never asked me ha.

That happened to me yesterday. I think the trick is to not buy a ticket for the commuter rail beforehand, and just pay on the train. If they miss you, that's their fault and not yours, since you fully intended to pay. They definitely profile people though. They made the dodgy looking fool that I was sitting next to me pay up, but never asked me ha.

If you don't mind the $2 surcharge for buying your ticket on board, you can do this and pray.

Or hide in the bathroom! :)

My husband takes the commuter rail daily, and he's seen them put a few people off at the next stop when they couldn't prove they had paid. I'm not sure what they would do if the person was willing to pay up after being caught, however.