China - Train ride during CNY, how bad?

We have to travel from Qingdao to Jinan on the weekend of CNY. I can't buy the tickets ahead of time. I was told that even if I get friends to buy them online, I still have to queue at the station to exchange for real tickets.

Is this true and if so, how bad is it? Are seats confirmed?

We have to travel from Qingdao to Jinan on the weekend of CNY. I can't buy the tickets ahead of time. I was told that even if I get friends to buy them online, I still have to queue at the station to exchange for real tickets.

Is this true and if so, how bad is it? Are seats confirmed?

While Jinan train tickets can be scarce, your friends are blowing things out of proportion. I suggest you either buy tickets online, or use an agent.

I just wouldn't show up at the station sans ticket and expect to get one.

You've got some issues but with a distance this short, also the backup of bus tickets, which should be available a day or two in advance. For the train:

1) Almost no agent will guarantee train tickets for the Chinese New Year period, so while throwing additional money at the problem (in the form of agent fees) is a usual winner, in this case it's likely to be a non-starter. You can try though.

2) For the fast trains (G and D), even if your have friends that can buy on your behalf, your ID is needed. I have a feeling that during this period, the train ticket offices aren't going to be satisfied by anything less than seeing the real passport. For the slower trains, which take hours longer but still run on this route, I have seen mixed reports about whether ID is needed, due to implementation (or not) of new regulations. In short, this method may also be less than fruitful. And remember to send any friend out into holiday ticket purchase situations requires a seriously nice gift or quid-pro-quo from you in return!

3) Online may be possible, if you have somebody at your end that is a reader of Chinese and can help you navigate the official website:
www.12306.cn (not .com) It is true that the confirmation you get still has to be exchanged at the station for the actual tickets but at most major stations there should be a special queue window set up for that especially at CNY time. I am not sure if there is a time limit before departure for exchange...after which the unclaimed ticket would presumably get tossed back into the availability pot. And payment requires a bank card issued by a Chinese bank, AFAIK. Either language or payment barrier may trip you up on this one.

4) If you can travel on the 24th or 25th, your chances of finding something on short notice go up. Possibly even the 23rd itself.

5) Train seats are assigned by the ticketing computer at time of purchase, so yes, if you get a ticket, your seat is confirmed. Exception: when seat tickets sell out, most trains during CNY will sell a specific number of Standing tickets for the 2nd Class (high speed) and Hard Seat (standard train) classes. These people will hang out in the space between the carriages, by the restrooms, etc. Not a great way to travel, but on the D or G fast trains, with a time of 2-3.5 hours, migh be doable. But I would think even standing tickets will sell out also. Personally, I'd go with a bus seat vs this option.

I just wouldn't show up at the station sans ticket and expect to get one.

Especially in Guanghzhou when a snow storm hits. (http://www.flickr.com/photos/12012852@N05/2265840910/sizes/l/in/photostream/)

Especially in Guanghzhou when a snow storm hits. (http://www.flickr.com/photos/12012852@N05/2265840910/sizes/l/in/photostream/)

LOL

Any idea how much a car /hiring driver will cost? This is not a vacation trip, so dates are relatively fixed, and we will be carrying more luggage than we normally will.

Any idea how much a car /hiring driver will cost? This is not a vacation trip, so dates are relatively fixed, and we will be carrying more luggage than we normally will.


A lot more than public transport. I have no idea about these guys (http://qingdaocarservice.com/rates.htm) but you can get the idea--see the section on Intercity Transfers. A bigger problem might be finding an available driver willing to do the trip over Chinese New Year weekend. And I'd expect the roads to be really busy with traffic all the way up to New Year's Eve. Will you be staying at a hotel in Qingdao? If so, you might contact them now, and see if they can scare up a car and driver and what the price would be. If they could luck into a Jinan native heading home anyway, might be able to offer something more reasonable than a commercial car service. Guaranteed point-to-point private travel without dealing with public transport and ticketing uncertainties--especially with a lot of luggage--would certainly be worth paying some sort of premium for over the train or bus tickets.

Any idea how much a car /hiring driver will cost? This is not a vacation trip, so dates are relatively fixed, and we will be carrying more luggage than we normally will.

apologies in advance if my question looks petty, but previous replies have made quite clear that traveling in periods just before CNY is quite difficult, if only for the extreme stress exerted to China transportation systems by hundreds of millions of people returning to their hometowns and families once per year. If your trip is essential one, and not a family emergency, a sensible planning should have adjusted it to avoid traveling, or at best having a rock-solid reservation, for the week before the CNY date (the 23rd. of January this year). Having said that if the travel distance is within 2-3 hours, getting by car is your best bet at the moment. I would not worry about the money in the sense that the driver, if available for such a trip, will tell you the fare and it will already be a more substantial amount than normally asked, it's up to you to agree his demand.

Ada:

In spite of the fact that I have an extremely high tolerance for (travel related) risk, now that I'm witnessing trains sell out across the board, I feel compelled to modify the advice I proffered upthread. (It's also worth noting that Jinan and Qingdao comprise 2 of the 3 cities in which I have been completely shut out of train tickets.)

As such, I urge you to be aggressive, and get tickets as soon as they go on sale. Assuming you're not set up to buy online, you might want to scan your passports, forward to your relatives, and implore them to get tickets for you. 10 days out, you shouldn't have many problems, but your relatives might require a bit of "extra motivation" to seriously go to bat for you.

apologies in advance if my question looks petty, but previous replies have made quite clear that traveling in periods just before CNY is quite difficult, if only for the extreme stress exerted to China transportation systems by hundreds of millions of people returning to their hometowns and families once per year. If your trip is essential one, and not a family emergency, a sensible planning should have adjusted it to avoid traveling, or at best having a rock-solid reservation, for the week before the CNY date (the 23rd. of January this year). Having said that if the travel distance is within 2-3 hours, getting by car is your best bet at the moment. I would not worry about the money in the sense that the driver, if available for such a trip, will tell you the fare and it will already be a more substantial amount than normally asked, it's up to you to agree his demand.

It's probably not any of our place to judge purpose of trip or timing. Since OP said it was not a vacation, and since business is essentially not being conducted on this weekend, I concluded that this is a poster that is heading out to Jinan on a New Year's Friends and Family visit...possibly an overseas or returning Chinese? The comment about "more luggage than usual" sort of helped my conclusion along....bringing gifts and stuff is normal this time of year both to and within China. If this is the case, the OP would be well aware of the travel issues at this time, yet has no real choice about travel period. 1.4 billion people are in the same boat. OP is looking for info and ideas, and we are providing that to best of our knowledge. There very well may be no ideal solution for this OP's situation that is also cost-effective.

And road travel time from Qingdao to Jinan would be more like 4 hours, no way is it just 2 or 3 hours. And in heavy holiday traffic, likely that could get up to 5 or 6 hours even on the expressway. However, for a guaranteed car and driver with pickup and drop points for me and all my luggage, I'd certainly be willing to consider something like RMB 1000-1200. This is a perfect situation where having a Chinese drivers license and being able to rent a car for self-drive could come in really, really useful. But likely that's not an option here. Although Ada, if you have any friends with a local license and you are willing to fund the car rental (and a car is available to prearrange for rent), maybe working a deal for them to do the driving while you do the riding along and the paying could be an option.

This is a perfect situation where having a Chinese drivers license and being able to rent a car for self-drive could come in really, really useful. .

I believe a foreigner can get a provisional license at PEK or in Beijing and rent a car with no Chinese DL, as long as their visa is 90 days or less.

That's a good idea!:p

I believe a foreigner can get a provisional license at PEK or in Beijing and rent a car with no Chinese DL, as long as their visa is 90 days or less.

That's a good idea!:p

No; it's not. We have trains that travel 300+ kph, and tickets are easy to snag 10 days out.

No; it's not. We have trains that travel 300+ kph, and tickets are easy to snag 10 days out.

Good idea for a movie.
National Lampoon Vacation The Great Wall

American family arrives in Shanghai and realizes all trains and planes are sold out forCNY so the father decides to rent a car and travel cross country to Beijing.

Thanks all for your advice. I'm actually travelling towards the end of CNY (28th or 29th). But I was told that it'll be as bad as CNY's eve, esp on the 29th.

My relatives who live in China said they maybe able to help me buy train tickets 10 days out. But it's still no gurantee + big favor. Some friend there quoted me 2000 RMB (!) for a driver. I'm waiting for Le Meridien QD to get back with another quote.

I am now leaning towards getting a driver. Peace of mind.

My relatives who live in China said they maybe able to help me buy train tickets 10 days out. But it's still no gurantee + big favor.

Please! It's not like you're asking for a kidney. You just need to make the process as hassle free as possible for them:

-as previously noted, scan your passports or IDs and email them (or transfer via QQ/msn; it's amazing to me how many Chinese people simply don't use email)
-make a list of your preferred ~3 trains, and seating preferences (I always request seats on the D/F side of the aisle in 2nd class because there isn't a middle seat)
-you can even check availability online
-if you want them to buy online, create an account, and provide instructions on how to use it
-if you want them to buy at a kiosk or through an agent, use google/baidu to find the closest options to them

Please! It's not like you're asking for a kidney. You just need to make the process as hassle free as possible for them:

-as previously noted, scan your passports or IDs and email them (or transfer via QQ/msn; it's amazing to me how many Chinese people simply don't use email)
-make a list of your preferred ~3 trains, and seating preferences (I always request seats on the D/F side of the aisle in 2nd class because there isn't a middle seat)
-you can even check availability online
-if you want them to buy online, create an account, and provide instructions on how to use it
-if you want them to buy at a kiosk or through an agent, use google/baidu to find the closest options to them

What's the probability of ID checking of ticket during CNY migration?

What's the probability of ID checking of ticket during CNY migration?

Pretty low. I was thinking of the ticket purchase process. Most channels, including the website, want numbers only (which you can make up on the spot, if need be), but scanning is the way to go if you're invoking a third party's assistance.

If its an ordeal to get tickets in 3rd party actual name. Could just
get 1st party tickets, anywhere - easiest, with little or no risk, unless its
a sleeper train.

If its an ordeal to get tickets in 3rd party actual name. Could just
get 1st party tickets, anywhere - easiest, with little or no risk, unless its
a sleeper train.

The trains in question are likely to sell out at the ~6 day mark, so involving a 3rd party might be necessary. Have you ever tried buying a train ticket in Shandong?

I am now leaning towards getting a driver. Peace of mind.

Not always. What if they don't show, what if they price changes, they get lost etc.

If you can get a ticket, do that first. In China you can ALWAYS find a driver last minute.

The trains in question are likely to sell out at the ~6 day mark, so involving a 3rd party might be necessary. Have you ever tried buying a train ticket in Shandong?

What I meant was, possibly just having contact in China get ticket with their
Chinese ID in their name. If they don't check ID then its essentially transferable to anyone.

What I meant was, possibly just having contact in China get ticket with their
Chinese ID in their name. If they don't check ID then its essentially transferable to anyone.

I agree with this. I think in real-time on the crush on these trains, the train staff will do the usual going through the aisles checking that people have valid tickets, but doubt they will be asking for ID's to check against what's on the ticket. As this OP seems to be ethnic Chinese, if a ticket taker cares to look at the name printed on the ticket (unlikely), they'll see a Chinese person with a Chinese name on the ticket. Very low risk.

This assumes the relative/friend in China will be willing to buy tickets in their own name for the OP. And we aren't privy to that relationship.

I agree with this. I think in real-time on the crush on these trains, the train staff will do the usual going through the aisles checking that people have valid tickets, but doubt they will be asking for ID's to check against what's on the ticket. As this OP seems to be ethnic Chinese, if a ticket taker cares to look at the name printed on the ticket (unlikely), they'll see a Chinese person with a Chinese name on the ticket. Very low risk.

This assumes the relative/friend in China will be willing to buy tickets in their own name for the OP. And we aren't privy to that relationship.

Okay, we're all on the same page now. Anacapa's suggestion of having the relatives buy the tickets using their own IDs did, in fact, fly over my head. I suppose this is due to the fact that I buy tickets for other people (vice versa also) all the time, and only ran into a snag on one occasion (shortly after this real ID business took effect). Simply put, it is no more difficult for the ticket seller person to input the info from your ID than any other ID (caveat: passport numbers can be a little tricky for them, but this isn't a big deal).

But, yes, I agree that it is possible to travel on any random ticket. Tickets don't have names on them, just ID numbers. And, human interaction with train staff is seldom required.

But, yes, I agree that it is possible to travel on any random ticket. Tickets don't have names on them, just ID numbers. And, human interaction with train staff is seldom required.

Looks like they do include name..now.
Not sure if they can input only hanzi?

http://english.cntv.cn/program/newsupdate/20120102/108704.shtml

A big change for 2012.is.significant.in the history of China Railway..The scope of real-name train ticket policy is extended to.all trains from January 1, 2012..Every purchase of a train ticket should be with the presentation of a valid ID certificate..The passenger's.name and the number of the ID certificate will be printed on the ticket. When taking trains, passengers should hold their own tickets with ID information of themselves..

This news video says website crashed with 1.4 billion visits 10 days oit from cny.
Looks like a real nightmare to get tickets...but could be jaded.

http://m.youtube.com/#/profile?user=ChinaForbiddenNews&v=tgPX7-vRSao&view=videos

Train tickets mostly sold out.

http://english.cntv.cn/program/china24/20120113/122401.shtml

The online system is not working well (or by now, at all). Most people have not been able to get on and the crash is pretty much what I expected. Kind of reminds me of the Olympic ticketing website debacle. :D So in fact, most people are doing the tried-and-true method of hand-to-hand combat in the ticket queues at the train stations and satellite sales offices.

It will be interesting to see how this real name ticketing plays out over the next 6 months.

In a related travel note on road travel, apparently the highways around Beijing are pretty jammed. A friend was heading over by car to a Hebei orphanage to deliver some things, and had to give up and turn back to Beijing since traffic was so horrendous, and she couldn't deal with the extra hours it was going to take to get there.

Did three CRH trips so far this week, fortunately only short hops on the Shanghai - Nanjing commuter highspeed line. Purchased tickets both at a ticket shop and the worn down Shanghai Main Station ticket hall and actually had to queue longer in the former location. No serious waiting though, 5-10 minutes at most.

Maybe the real name procedure is only for Chinese ID card holders? Chinese passengers where checked at a special well manned checkpoint in front of Shanghai Station and their ID and ticket names compared but alas no interest in my passport as long as the ticket had a number on it.

However, no special checks in the Yangtze Delta so this might depend on station specific policies. I'd imagine Beijing, Shanghai, Guangzhou and a few other major migrant worker destinations are taking a hard line on scalping at least towards the media.

Tickets were checked in the (G) trains every time but it did not seem that troughout, just to tick and stamp them.

Okay, we're all on the same page now. Anacapa's suggestion of having the relatives buy the tickets using their own IDs did, in fact, fly over my head. I suppose this is due to the fact that I buy tickets for other people (vice versa also) all the time, and only ran into a snag on one occasion (shortly after this real ID business took effect). Simply put, it is no more difficult for the ticket seller person to input the info from your ID than any other ID (caveat: passport numbers can be a little tricky for them, but this isn't a big deal).

But, yes, I agree that it is possible to travel on any random ticket. Tickets don't have names on them, just ID numbers. And, human interaction with train staff is seldom required.

Now we know who the real 黄牛 is... :p

Maybe the real name procedure is only for Chinese ID card holders? Chinese passengers where checked at a special well manned checkpoint in front of Shanghai Station and their ID and ticket names compared but alas no interest in my passport as long as the ticket had a number on it.

.

Probably only input method is hanzi, for obvious reasons...
can't read english.

Now we know who the real 黄牛 is... :p

Good to have a resident FT Yellow Bull.:p

Good to have a resident FT Yellow Bull.:p

So long as he isn't the one that's keeps buying out my train tickets, I'm ok with that! :D

So long as he isn't the one that's keeps buying out my train tickets, I'm ok with that! :D

Need to cover the train windows.

Wouldn't be a pretty site for passengers in sold out ticket lines seeing
half empty trains going out and scalpers selling ticket at 10 times face value.

Flash Back 08 Olympics:p